The other day I was watching ABC’s The Drum where Peter Singer was talking about the importance of giving to charitable causes to help alleviate global poverty. Good stuff from Singer, but out of nowhere comes a reference to Catholic Archbishop of Sydney Cardinal George Pell from one of the panelists.

And where did these hats end up?

Apparently Pell, at some point, had said that there is no genuine altruism, people only do good because it makes them feel good (well duh, I’ve heard that before). Anyway, next thing I know the inference is being made that Pell would rather have us walk around flagellating ourselves than giving to charitable causes.

There I am, watching the show, and I’m just baffled as to how went from generous giving to medieval self-mutilation at the behest of George Pell. Then it finally dawns on me, “Of course, this is the The Drum, the final credits can’t roll without at least one Catholic being bashed.” I should have known better.

The Drum is not an isolated instance. I’ve noticed that nearly every time I see a Catholic priest on TV he is either a child molester or else a religious nut job who thinks that he’s in a personal wrestling match with the devil.

I swear that after watching three CSI episodes and a season of Q&A that all Catholics do is spend their time trying to lure children into their gingerbread houses. This explains why I have an unconscious impulse to burn down every Catholic Church that I walk passed.

I’m not Catholic. The chances of me converting to Catholicism are about the same as Green Senator Sarah Hanson-Young attending an ANZAC Day memorial service – buckley’s and none. However, I am concerned that a religious minority, any religious minority, can be portrayed with such resolute and unflinching prejudice in pop drama and news commentary.

Don’t get me wrong. I’m not defending for a moment the evil things that have been done in Catholic institutions. Let the beast be named and shamed. The Catholic hierarchy’s efforts at reform, genuine as they are, are too late for many victims.

Still, I want to point out that the majority of priests are not paedophiles. Furthermore, the Catholic Church does not have some kind of monopoly on abuse. Any institution that has children, be it religious or secular, will attract predatory figures who use the institution to prey on the vulnerable.

May I point out that child abuse also transpires in Buddhist monasteries throughout the world. Yet I’ve never heard the Greens demanding a boycott of the Dalai Lama. I’ve never heard anyone calling for a citizen’s arrest of the Dalai Lama. I mean, seriously, what has the Dalai Lama done to stop the abuse of children in Buddhist monasteries in Tibet and beyond?

Still, the media and entertainment industry have an anti-Catholic fixation. A fixation fed by the last three decades that have spotlighted abuse and its cover-up. But is it fair that every Catholic priest on a crime show in a child molester? Is it fair that every Catholic family on a sitcom be portrayed as a bunch of fanatical whackos? I hope not, because if you did this against Muslims, immigrants, gays, or women, there would be outrage, and rightly so!

My problem is that I’ve read accounts of the persecution of Catholics in Ottoman Turkey, during the Spanish civil war, and in communist China. I do not fear that happening in twenty-first century Australia.

But I think we should fear any minority being depicted in stereotypical fashion in the media or entertainment industry for the purpose of gaining political currency by appealing to widespread prejudices.

If I appear to have more fruit-loops in my head than a Kellogs factory let me point out that I’m not alone in my observations. First, back in 2010, Paul Collins wrote an article in Eureka Street called “The Rise of Catholicophia” where he briefly documented the history of anti-Catholicism in the UK. Second, Philip Jenkins’s book The New Anti-Catholicism: The Last Acceptable Prejudice published in 2004 exposed anti-Catholic rhetoric in the movies, media, and academy in the USA. Both identified a concerted effort to portray the Catholic Church as the stereotyped public villain in public and political discourse.

I grew up watching the brightly Sally Field in The Flying Nun and was hypnotized by The Father Dowling Mysteries where I secretly wanted to marry Sister Stephanie! Where have all the good TV Catholics gone? They’ve been replaced with one dimensional stock characters, conducive to spreading the myth that Catholics are the greatest threat to a safe and inclusive society.

Yet there are many fine Catholic men and women of exemplary humanity, not despite their Catholicism, but precisely because of it. Intellectuals like Malcolm Muggeridge. Modern day saints like Oscar Romero. Catholic Priests like Father Kasimir Vilnis who helped many Jews escape the Holocaust. Does the name Mother Theresa ring any bells?

The Catholic Church has had the capacity to inspire people with hope and compassion. I’m reminded of the account of Alec Guinness’ conversion to Catholicism in his biography Blessings in Disguise.

While filming Father Brown in France, Guinness recollects how walking down the street one evening in his priestly costume, he was mistaken for a real priest by a small child. Guinness did not speak French, and the child did not notice that Guinness did not understand him, but the boy took his hand and chattered away as the two strolled down the street.

After a while the child waved and walked off. The confidence and affection that the clerical attire had upon that child left a deep impression on Guinness. For many, the Catholic Church is a light on the hill in a world that is cold, brutal, and dark.

Despising Catholics is the last acceptable bastion of prejudice in this country. You could not say things about any other group which get said about Catholics. Even worse, denigrating Catholics is a key item on the CV of any would-be journalist and talk-show host, like some kind of rite of passage.

I’m not calling for a moratorium on criticism of the Catholic Church. Rather, I’m calling for some self-critical reflection on the motivation, amount, and mode of criticism of Catholics in the media, less we be found guilty of calling Catholics for a speck of prejudice in their eye only to discover a plank of prejudice in our own eye.

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    • Dan says:

      05:36am | 16/05/12

      It is interesting that most of the posts are bashing the catholic church. The article stated that people within the church have done things totally unacceptable and worthy of condemnation and rightly so. However, the real point in this I believe is that no other group or institution in Australia is constantly and consistently ridiculed. Nor would they just take it. As a society we should be able to distinguish between an individual, or individuals and the institution itself. Credit where credit is due. Let’s also highlight when the catholic church does something good. You may think that you’d be hard pressed but that is was media wants us to think. About the only news items that aren’t doom and gloom are sports stories when we win - thankfully for Australia that’s most of the time. I congratulate the author of this article on demanding that we become more positive in our outlook of humanity. Well done. Keep shining that small but significant light!

    • Bern says:

      01:54pm | 17/05/12

      Totally agree, the Catholic Church started schools for the poor, hospitals, shelters for the homeless, St Vincent de Paul Charity Stores, Universities, University colleges and many many positive social programmes in society.

    • Shiralee says:

      07:28pm | 15/05/12

      There are more children molested and abused by men that a childs mother knows than by relgious leaders.so does that mean we should hate all fathers, Grandfathers, uncles, and brothers. I think not. So why hate the catholic Church because of the minority.

    • RC says:

      04:27pm | 15/05/12

      Having just browsed at the religious vilification contained in these comments I can only wonder if this blog sight would next allow a similar venting to take place filled with hatred and prejudice towards say Muslims or aboriginal traditional dreamtime. . That there appears to be no moderation of comments, no matter how derogatory, defamatory or hateful proves the author’ s position that it is open season on Catholics and Catholicism.  Let it be made known that the group most represented in child abuse cases is not Catholic clery - a small actual percentage - but is in fact defacto male partners living with children they are not biologically related to. How about a hard hitting investigation into that fact?! If people were genuinely concerned about child abuse - not just bagging out the church - this fact would have been widely reported.  Australia is diminished as a society when bigotry and vilification are unbridled as in this blog spot.

    • A Spade's a spade says:

      05:33pm | 15/05/12

      @RC

      ‘...there appears to be no moderation of comments, no matter how derogatory, defamatory or hateful proves the author’ s position that it is open season on Catholics and Catholicism’.

      By ‘moderation’ you do mean censorship right? By derogatory you do mean critiical right?  Let us not forget that within living memory in this country and others people have been violated, threatened with, and subjected to violence for expressing their opinion and right to free speech against the egregious policies, practices and perfidy of the catholic church and its priests. Catholics have had open season on gays, divorcees, heretics, unfortunate pregnant rape victims and apostates for centuries and squeal when the looking glass turns to them..oh how the papacy and its automatons yearn for ‘simpler’ times…

    • Simone says:

      12:52pm | 15/05/12

      Father Ted. Best Catholic TV Show ever.
      “It’s not as if everyone’s going to go off and join some mad religious cult just because we go off for a picnic for a couple of hours.”
      “God, Ted, I heard about those cults. Everyone dressing in black and saying our Lord’s gonna come back and judge us all!”
      “No… No, Dougal, that’s us. That’s Catholicism”

    • Anna C says:

      12:38pm | 15/05/12

      The reason people are having a go at the Catholic Church is because they know they can take it and won’t suffer the consequences.  However, the same cannot be said for other religions like Islam.  Heaven forbid anyone actually criticises Islam, especially on the ABC of all places.  We are supposed to believe that all the violence committed in the name of Islam is just an aberration and that Islam is really a religion of Peace.  Yeah right.

    • M says:

      04:08pm | 15/05/12

      Christianity is a soft target. No news company/site would criticize islam for fear of being labeled racists.

      And yes, I know racist is the incorrect term.

    • Anna C says:

      02:26pm | 15/05/12

      Chris L, I’m not saying we should give Christianity/Catholics a free pass.  As an atheist I reserve the right to criticise all religions but I do take exception to the PC brigade treating Islam like some sacred cow that cannot be criticised.  All I’m saying is that all religions should be open to the same level of scrutiny.

    • Chris L says:

      01:28pm | 15/05/12

      Here we go again with the “why don’t you just pick on Islam?” response.

      The three most famous critics of religion (Christopher Hitchens RIP, Sam Harris and Professor Dawkins) all save their harshest condemnation for Islam. Punchers never seem to have a problem criticising the niqab or suicide bombings or female circumcision.

      Yet despite all this, and the fact that it’s Christianity that has the largest influence on our culture and laws (often in what many of us consider a negative fashion) you still cry that we should only be critical of Islam and give Christianity a free pass on everything.

      ... and this article was specifically about Catholics. Why would you even bring Islam into the debate?

    • egg says:

      12:31pm | 15/05/12

      “Despising Catholics is the last acceptable bastion of prejudice in this country.”

      Wait, I thought that was white men… or smokers… or fat people… or the right wing… or lefties… or f*cking anyone who likes to whinge about how persecuted their particular group is.

      So sick of this argument. It’s not true (everyone is prejudiced against someone - and most get equal airtime, depending on what you watch), and playing the victim to get what you want is a tactic I gave up when I was about 12. for good reason.

    • Dan says:

      11:26am | 15/05/12

      First of all, I’m a Catholic. An occasionally lapsed Catholic, but I did darken the door of the local Church with Mum last Sunday.

      Having had a strong Catholic upbringing, with 13 years of Catholic schooling, I feel I can comment pretty comfortably on the matter.

      Not once, ever, ever, ever, have I felt persecuted in public, or in the media. Not once.

      But there does seem to be this tiny collection of Catholics who feel besieged from all sides. They feel the media is after them, the Left is after them, the Right is after them, and it’s all over. And they take every single attack on a Catholic, as an attack on the Church too.

      It’s not the case. Catholics make up an enormous portion of the total Christian population within Australia - more than any other denomination, I believe. As many as one in 5 Australians are Catholic, and they occupy many of the most powerful offices in the land.

      Catholic priests are also among our most respected and revered figures. Fr Chris Riley SJ and Fr Bob Maguire among them.

      The sex abuse issue is often raised, and rightly so. It needs to be talked about. The response from the Church has been uncomfortable and at times defensive, but it’s a difficult matter to handle well. They’re an organisation that claims to actually be the moral authority on most issues - it’s hard facing the reality that in many instances, that’s not the case.

      They’ve been criticised heavily on their handling of the matter, both here and abroad. And so they should be - like any other organisation, they’re actions should be scrutinised. Unfortunately some seem to believe the Church should be above such criticism - an attitude that only invites more.

      Similarly, as mentioned before, an attack on a Catholic individual is not an attack on the Church itself. Tony Abbott is a very high-profile Catholic, and one who wears his religion proudly. He’s often criticised by many in the community, mostly for his political views. Those attacks are (by and large) not made primarily because he’s a Catholic, as some (notably Gerard Henderson) would have you believe. It’s because people disagree with his politics, the same as many others disagree with Julia Gillard’s.

      This small, whinging group of Catholics need to pull it together. The Church isn’t under siege. In many regards, it’s stronger than ever - look back to the Papal visit a few years ago for all the evidence you need.

      The Church is a high-profile organisation with hundreds of millions of members. It invites a certain level of scrutiny, and it won’t always be positive. But it’s big enough and ugly enough to handle it.

    • Austin 3:16 says:

      03:13pm | 15/05/12

      Meh - let’s face it if I said I believed in a magic invisible man that lives in the sky I’d be asking for ridicule.

      That’s the thing about the ridiculous it gets ridiculed.

    • Inky says:

      01:48pm | 15/05/12

      “And not all Collingwood fans are bogans. “

      Now that’s just crazy talk.

    • Dan says:

      01:30pm | 15/05/12

      @ozpuck,

      A fair point. But as you point out, that’s more sympotamatic of general intolerance and rudeness across all of society. It has little to do with a specific criticism of one particular religion, and more to do with lazy stereotyping.

      Some of our best and brightest are religious. Great leaders come from all sides of politics. And not all Collingwood fans are bogans.

    • ozpuck says:

      01:11pm | 15/05/12

      I agree with you except for one point.

      I don’t feel “persecuted” by being a Catholic, nor do I necessarily identify that an attack on the Church or the Church hierarchy is an attack on me.  But what I don’t like is the accusation that’s levelled against me by some that because I identify as a Catholic I must be an absolute moron incapable of rational thought because I believe in an “invisible sky fairy”.

      OK I have faith; you don’t.  There’s no need to belittle me. 

      Mind you, if I substituted a particular football team or political party instead of a religion, I’ll get the same response from some idiots.

    • Inky says:

      12:33pm | 15/05/12

      I could say something mocking or condescending here by way of joke, but I think instead, I’ll just say “Thank you”.

    • renold says:

      11:22am | 15/05/12

      Being an atheist, I truly wonder what all this religion bashing is about. Be consistant and have a go at Islam as well then or any other religion.

      Have a go about how the Catholic Church handles child abuse, fine but be consistant and do the same with the South Australian ALP Government.

    • KimL says:

      11:11am | 15/05/12

      The answer as I see it..Is all the good Catholics have left the church, mortified at all the child abuse that happens. It is not the religion that is flawed any more than any other religion, it the people who are in charge.

    • Doh says:

      10:49am | 15/05/12

      It is not quite TV, but check out Fr Robert Barron’s youtube videos and website:

      http://wordonfire.org/

      Lots of great commentry on all sorts of things from a distinctly Catholic perspective.

    • Chris L says:

      10:06am | 15/05/12

      Many of the movies I’ve enjoyed over the last decade or so have shown Catholics as the heroes (Exorcism of Emily Rose, Stigmata,The Rite). I can’t say how Catholics are shown on television (although I did watch the last season of Dexter and that seemed to have a balance of good and bad). I do think you’re just remembering the negative portrayals and forgetting all the positive ones.

      I recommend not putting Mother Theresa forward as an example of a good Catholic. She denied medical treatment to sick people who may well have survived their ailments without her. Her main interest was in witnessing suffering.

      So many groups claim to be the last minority that is allowed to be hated. Catholics, white men, atheists, etc. It’s an emotive claim, but can’t be true if all of them feel persecuted.

      By the way, religious people I read from online seem to claim persecution when people level criticism against their belief system and institutions. How do they class their opposition to allowing gay people to marry and the many wildly inaccurate claims they often make about atheists?

    • Jason Todd says:

      11:20pm | 15/05/12

      ChrisL - I suspect henry is referring to Hitchens’ book - The missionary position, in which he addressess some of the criticisms that were levelled against Mother Teresa during her time.

      Henry, Teresa didn’t offer medical treatment either. In fact, there were many cases in which she specifically refused to provide treatment. She had reportedly recieved several thousands (if not millions) of dollars of charitable contributions which never found their way to the people they were meant to be helping. Hitchens was not the only person critical of her actions, several members of her order left after witnessing the level of treatment that Teresa offerred to the poor as compared to what many outsiders thought she was offerring.

    • Chris L says:

      03:19pm | 15/05/12

      They had hospitals in Calcutta at the time Henry.

      You’re correct that nobody was rushing to their side to save their life, including Mother Theresa. What has Christopher Hitchens got to do with it?

    • Austin 3:16 says:

      03:09pm | 15/05/12

      Henry,

      Nobody promotes Hitch as a paragon of virtue either.

    • henry says:

      01:57pm | 15/05/12

      “She denied medical treatment to sick people who may well have survived their ailments without her. “

      What medical treatment was so readily available in a Calcutta slum for those she found dying on the streets ? I don’t remember anyone at all rushing to their side with an offer of medical treatment. Just what did Christopher Hitchens do for them ? Oh that’s right, nothing.

    • subotic says:

      09:59am | 15/05/12

      why does the Head of the Christian Church have to keep apologising to the Jews for the Holocaust…?

      Why doesn’t the Head of the Catholic Church come out and apologise about the stone jars full of aborted Nun foetuses in the Catacombs under Vienna is what I wanna know.

      OOPS, I don’t think we’re supposed to know about that….

    • Hanzel says:

      09:49am | 15/05/12

      There are two schools of thought about how our culture got so terribly screwed up. One, is that the Leftists aggressively took over TV, movies, and news, the other is that conservatives got fat, lazy and backed away from the commanding heights of Australian culture leaving a vacuum that the left filled with little resistance.

      I agree with the second, if religious people don’t like the way that the mass media lies about them, might be time to make some culture of their own - can’t be good complaining all the time.

    • P. Darvio says:

      09:44am | 15/05/12

      Quote: Yet there are many fine Catholic men and women of exemplary humanity, not despite their Catholicism, but precisely because of it. Intellectuals like Malcolm Muggeridge. Modern day saints like Oscar Romero. Catholic Priests like Father Kasimir Vilnis who helped many Jews escape the Holocaust. Does the name Mother Theresa ring any bells?

      Where do I start….

      Mother Theresa !!! That crook…who accepted millions of dollars of stolen money from a crooked US Real Estate Developer and when asked by the US Courts to hand the money back didn’t even acknowledge the US Courts letter – what a disgrace and what’s even worse is that Christians hold this deceitful women as a shinning example of ethics and morals….

      Christians at their Sunday Schools should be forced to watch “Hells Angel” by the late great Christopher Hitchens.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSvFCwGmGow

      I just love Malcolm Muggeridge’s “its divine light !” segment in this video – 3 cheers for GOD not Kodak…..no – it’s a TV Miracle….!! A star is born….

      Didn’t the Catholic Church sign a Concordant deal with that Christian Adolf Hitler in 1933…m’mm and wasn’t the Holocaust a result of decades of Christian Anti-Semitism – 6 millions Jews dead because of Christianity – why does the Head of the Christian Church have to keep apologising to the Jews for the Holocaust…?

    • Shane* says:

      09:55am | 15/05/12

      I love you Darvio. You’re always good for a laugh.

    • P. Darvio says:

      09:15am | 15/05/12

      Where have all the good TV Catholics gone?

      I think they are all in Ireland at the moment……

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ma9ALRpEVw

      Just don’t mention Cardinal Sean Brady……another coverup by the Christian Church….

    • Troy Flynn says:

      10:11am | 15/05/12

      I might have more time for catholicism if it was being presented by a Father Crilly or McDougall type. But most of them carry on like bishop Brennan.

    • Tommy says:

      08:59am | 15/05/12

      “Still, I want to point out that the majority of priests are not paedophiles. “

      Understatement of the century - almost all priests aren’t paedophiles. In fact, the abuse rate among priests is lower than it is among teachers.

    • Ozpuck says:

      12:57pm | 15/05/12

      Anecdotal only but the two teachers at the (Catholic) schools I attended who have since been jailed for being paedophiles were lay male teachers. 

      Doesn’t matter whether they are in a religious order or not - they should be tried and if found guilty, punished in accordance with the law and the responsible authority (it’s not only Catholic religious who abuse kids) should make proper restitution to the victims.

    • subotic says:

      11:04am | 15/05/12

      The majority?

      Just one would do it for me….

    • Brendan says:

      11:02am | 15/05/12

      @P. Darvio. Pure atheist anti-religion crap.

    • P. Darvio says:

      10:10am | 15/05/12

      Pure Christian Delusion Crap - and a slur on teachers.

    • Tedd says:

      09:21am | 15/05/12

      Prove it - it is appropriate that You provide evidence & statistics for your accusation, Tommy.

    • Kebabpete says:

      08:58am | 15/05/12

      Where have all the good TV Catholics gone?

      Who cares. The less religion on TV the better.

    • Gee Sus says:

      04:43pm | 15/05/12

      It seems to me that a goodly number of them have gone to leadership roles in the conservative parties around our nation!!

    • Inky says:

      08:54am | 15/05/12

      “But is it fair that every Catholic priest on a crime show in a child molester? Is it fair that every Catholic family on a sitcom be portrayed as a bunch of fanatical whackos?”

      Damnit, I’m tired of all these criminals being portrayed as criminals in this crime show! I mean, on the one hand, I can see your point; but on the other hand, crime shows tend to have three types of focuses beyond the mainc ast: criminals, victims and witnesses. And a corrupt priest makes for a better story.

      As far as sitcoms, they’ve portrayed outrageous stereotypes for a long time. Look at some of the characters that come up in Seinfeld. Look at Fraiser. Heck, look at Will and Grace.

      Now, I’m a little out of touch with what’s on television thesedays, but I’m just not convinced there actually is much of a problem here.

    • ronny jonny says:

      08:29am | 15/05/12

      Father Mulchahy is still on TV, a classic good catholic priest. With the awesome improvement in TV since the introduction of digital we can always catch up with our old favourites like Mash.

    • Tim the Toolman says:

      03:11pm | 15/05/12

      Don’t forget Father Jack Hackett.

    • marley says:

      02:22pm | 15/05/12

      @Troy Flynn - no, he was a priest who happened also to be an army chaplain.

    • Troy Flynn says:

      09:55am | 15/05/12

      He was a Chaplin not a priest. Not that I know or care what the difference is.

    • Shane* says:

      08:14am | 15/05/12

      One Catholic who’s managed to buck the trend - Father Bob Maguire.

      Ohhhhh DAAAARVVVVIIOOOOOOO!? WHERE ARRRRE YOUUUUUU?

    • wearestardust says:

      08:07am | 15/05/12

      You can’t be serious.  People don’t hate the Catholic Church on the account of Jesus (to the extent that it is “hated” as opposed to “laughed at” or “ridiculed”).  People oppose the Church because of what it does. 

      Unless, of course, you are suggesting that Jesus would have been more interested in climate change than the poor, or would have preferred to hide injustice than bring it to light?

    • henry says:

      01:49pm | 15/05/12

      “People oppose the Church because of what it does.”

      Let me correct that for you: People oppose the Church because of what THEY THINK it does. ( after watching Q&A, the ABC, reading the Drum, The Age, the Guardian, the NY Times - all impeccable and unbiased and full of journos with a training in theology and a detailed knowledge of Catholic teaching.)

    • Tommy says:

      07:44am | 15/05/12

      The mainstream media hate Catholics. But this merely fulfills what Jesus said: they shall hate you on my account. The theological term is a “sign of contradiction.”

    • Austin 3:16 says:

      01:43pm | 15/05/12

      I though Dawkins expertise was in biology, not history.

    • Blind Freddy says:

      01:03pm | 15/05/12

      @Tommy

      It was not Dawkin’s to admit. Its not like a confession - You know- “oh, alright I admit it- Jesus existed”. LOL

    • acotrel says:

      09:51am | 15/05/12

      @Tommy
      If you live your life ethically, by some God driven coincidence you comply with Jesus’s desires as stated in the New Testament..

    • MrMac says:

      09:18am | 15/05/12

      Tommy,
      Whether Richard Dawkins admits he believes Jesus existed is a separate issue to the real lack of extra-biblical evidence for Jesus [the] Christ - even Josephus refers to 4 other Jesus’s, and there is an emerging view some of their narratives were incorporated in the bible.  The passage in Josephus that refers to James refers to Jesus, son of Damneus.

    • Tommy says:

      08:53am | 15/05/12

      @acotrel but Jesus did exist - even Richard Dawkins admits it!

      Please do some research before, and preferably instead of, making such ignorant statements.

    • MrMac says:

      08:32am | 15/05/12

      Whether Jesus really said much of what is attributed to him, or even whether the biblical Jesus was based on a single person, is unknown.

    • acotrel says:

      08:27am | 15/05/12

      I suggest the catholics have a conundrum on their hands. If Jesus never really existed, he must have been an invention of the lefties in Roman times to justify their socialist bent.

    • gobsmack says:

      07:28am | 15/05/12

      I liked the art show on TV where a bucked-toothed old nun (I forget her name) toured museums and explained what she loved about various paintings.

    • Joan says:

      07:20am | 15/05/12

      You don’t watch Drum if you want to hear sensible commentary or discussion.  Panel shows such as this and Q&A are only good at exposing how bereft we are of real thinkers, debaters, and visionaries. The majority of panelists have the concentration span of gnat, unable to grasp/understand the question/topic firstly , then diverge to some extreme hate rant or some extreme pro rant. about someone or something else. With respect to religion don’t expect a sensible deal from any panle if you are a Christian.

    • acotrel says:

      06:57am | 15/05/12

      Tony Abbott won’t allow a ‘conscience vote’  on gay marriage within the LNP.  What is that, if not religous control ?

    • Hank says:

      06:55am | 15/05/12

      Although not religious, I admire someone who sticks their neck out for an organisation against all popular opinion but I’m afraid sir you are about to get hammered.  Good luck.

    • Bev says:

      06:51am | 15/05/12

      The politics of hate.  Not only in the field of religion are the new zealots at work but everywhere.  Express missgivings against same sex marriage and you are called a homophobe and their will be calls for your head on a platter.  Express concerns about were some aspects of feminism well then you are mysogonistic caveman knuckle dragger.  Climate change?  Denier, flat earther whatever.  Want orderly migration? Zenophobe, racist. Choice in schools? Thats brainwashing children. It seems to me that some are intent on tearing down everthing but are replacing it with what exactly.  The same crowd is all for free speach so long as you agree with them.  Live and let live so long as you conform to their ideals.  Only they know how we should live, what to believe in.  In the name of some sort of freedom they seek to impose a straitjacket on all. That’s not freedom thats 1984 and animal farm rolled into one.

    • egg says:

      12:07pm | 15/05/12

      @Bev, so this is different to: “the vocal minority loudly screaming for same-sex marriage”, feminazi, climate change alarmist, “open-border socialists”, or any of the other names that are applied to the other side of the coin. Stop feeling like a victim and argue your case properly, don’t just point to the lowest acts of the other side and claim victory.

      Also, just so you know: “Summers resigned as Harvard’s president in the wake of a no-confidence vote by Harvard faculty that resulted in large part from Summers’s conflict with Cornel West, and financial conflict of interest questions regarding his relationship with Andrei Shleifer.”

    • James1 says:

      10:43am | 15/05/12

      Bev, they were free to say what they liked.  They were also free to accept the consequences.  And the organisations for which they worked were free to sack them for saying those things.  Everyone is free in this situation.

      Are you saying the state should curtail the ability of organisations to sack people for saying things said organisations don’t like?

    • Bev says:

      10:30am | 15/05/12

      @LOL freedom of speech isn’t freedom from criticism

      Tell that to the doctor who came out against homosexual marriage recently or Geff Kennett both of whom were pressured to resign because they gave their opinion.  Larry Summers who after showed that male and female brains were different (via brain scans) was forced to resign because feminist mantra said nuture not nature caused differences in male and female behaviour and he proved their pet theory was wrong.

    • LOL says:

      09:12am | 15/05/12

      Bev, freedom of speech isn’t freedom from criticism.  No one has arrested you for your views, and while I don’t agree with you on many things - I’d fight to the death for your right to say them. 

      Given that you’re complaining about a lack of ‘freedom of speech’ at the end of an article about a church that has happily ex-communicated members for holding opinions counter to current church orthodoxy is pretty damn funny

    • Nathan says:

      06:51am | 15/05/12

      “Yet I’ve never heard the Greens demanding a boycott of the Dalai Lama” Are you serious, that does not excuse it. What about them?  The paedophilia issues are in our face in Australia…very weak

      “The Catholic hierarchy’s efforts at reform, genuine as they are, are too late for many victims” What are they really doing? They are only providing information when asked and are not forthcoming in outing the sexual predators in their ranks past or present.

    • subotic says:

      02:10pm | 15/05/12

      @Alice, sorry, but you are totally wrong. I’ve never met a politician I didn’t despise….

    • Bruno says:

      01:12pm | 15/05/12

      i’m not religious and my earliest memories of the Church were having to sleep in the rat infested attic during Sunday School. But i call myself a catholic because of opinions like these. I’ve been overseas and seen the historical disparity between the wealth of the Church and its faithful However as long as there is hate directed at the Church there wil always be those willing to defend it. For the founder of our Church, the one true and apostolic Church, was the Son of God and upon this rock he built his Church and the gates of Hell shall never overcome.

    • Alice says:

      12:46pm | 15/05/12

      But that doesnt mean that all Catholics are bad people and deserving of the open hatred thrust upon them by society.
      It’s the same as saying “Julia Gillard/Tony Abbott is useless therefore we can judge every single member of the ALP/LNP past and present on her/his behaviour”

    • Onlooker says:

      11:06am | 15/05/12

      subotic I agree with you, I had a similar situation myself, I was in a Catholic Girls Boarding School. It is something I have never forgotten and will carry the burden for the rest of my life.. The abuse myself and other suffered was horrendous. It made me realize at a very young age, that there was no God.. How could any God allow these things to happen to children in his house? This happened to me over 45 years ago and it is still happening to children today. If any other organization had this amount of child abuse it would be shut down. Why is this allowed to continue?

    • acotrel says:

      09:58am | 15/05/12

      I like catholics who are tr ue to their faith.  They usually have a social conscience and vote accordingly, except when manipulated by the Chief.
      Because George Pell professes to be a Christian, does that mean he really IS one ? Or is he just ‘a bad Christian’ ?

    • Troy Flynn says:

      08:55am | 15/05/12

      Subotic. I hate catholicism too. I rejected it at 10 despite my father continuing to send me to catholic schools, but I have to say, your description of the conference made me think that the boys in South Park got it right. Maybe they really had Galgameks and a queen spider there for real. I fully support your anger at what went on at the conference.
      Yes it would be nice for religion to go away, but unfortunately for many people they need the bullshit and if (and hopefully when) catholicism dies, it’s just going to get supplanted by another kooky belief system. Scientology anyone?

    • Troy Flynn says:

      08:35am | 15/05/12

      Agreed. There still seems to be trying desperately to shield offenders and sweep it under the carpet and have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the light.

    • subotic says:

      08:20am | 15/05/12

      I went through Catholic education, and I have zero tolerance for Catholicism anymore, and I will never forgive the Catholic Church for the way it handles paedophilia.

      They held a conference in Rome to discuss how they were going to handle the paedophilia scandals and these were like week long conferences. A whole damn week. What were they talking about? What’s there to talk about?

      Cardinal: Let’s stop sodomizing little children guys, what do ya say? Alrite, pretty much. All set then. See you next year just to remind ourselves? No more kiddie sex, right? Good.

      Somebody there at this conference actually proposed a “1 Strike You’re Out” policy and it got voted down. They voted it down.

      Basically, someone came out and said “We can’t kick someone out for molesting & sodomizing just one kid. That’s just not cool, everybody commits and act of sodomy against a child every once in a while. And it’s gunna happen, so maybe we’ll just move them to a Parish where there’s less hot looking kids or something. It’s just not fair to kick the guy out”.

      And the Pope agreed.

      The sooner organised religion gets outlawed and removed from society, the better.

    • acotrel says:

      06:41am | 15/05/12

      Both Doc Mannix and Mr B.A.SAntamaria are now dead, and the DLP is defunct except for the one true believer still in Australian politics:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvYzLIywCiA
      DLP commiephobia cost us 584 lives of our young men in Vietnam.
      Best we forget ?
      George Pell is not the best loved catholic priest that we’ve ever had.  He is intent on taking all of us back to the fifties !
      His most notable comment : ‘Islam is the communism of the 21st century’ ! !

    • Liz says:

      01:41pm | 17/05/12

      DLP also have a member of parliament in the Victorian Upper House so that makes 2 members of parliament and countless others are in public life because of the words of BA Santamaria and Cardinal Pell

    • S.L says:

      06:11am | 15/05/12

      Sally Field was a single mum of two when she made the Flying Nun! Yep a good catholic!

    • ffs says:

      12:03pm | 15/05/12

      The point was he characted was a good Catholic, there was no point being made about her personal life.

 

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