We are now all the proud sponsors of the mining tax

Overflow says:

05:48pm | 28/05/10

Don’t forget Nosthow the money Rudd will spend is the taxpayers’ money NOT Labor’s.  If you want a party politcal ad campaign donate your own money.

Steve says:

05:50pm | 28/05/10

Howard spent 2 billion on advertising and broke more non-core promises before breakfast than Rudd ever will. Abbott - who knows what is or is not an election commitment.

Eye4anEye says:

05:51pm | 28/05/10

Going to call shenanigans on this one - pklease profide back up for your claim “the huge Mining Companies are said to be funding the Coalition advertising - alls fair in love and war” Mining companies do not fund Liberal advertising in fact that historically sit neutral in terms of political funding, ie. they fund both parties to a similar degree (probably because they know governments change and want to keep both parties onside or at least not offside).

Advertising done by Miners now is not for the Liberals but for themselves since the government tried to knock them over the head and rape them silly (and I do support a mining tax but one done properly after consultation and in line with the petroleum resource tax ie. starting at 11% profit and not on existing projects).

Aside from that the Labor party just stole $40 million from taxpayers pockets to fund their propoganda - I fail to see how this helps to make Australia a more equitable place to live. Oh and did I mention them promising not to do this and breaking that promise (again)?

Andy says:

06:04pm | 28/05/10

There is a massive difference between the Coalition spending money donated to them on party political advertising and the Government spending taxpayers money on party political advertising. If you think that is “fair” then perhaps you should join the NSW Labor party, they seem to have the same tenuous grip on ethics and morality that you do.

Matt says:

06:12pm | 28/05/10

“Right now the economy is cruising along with a very strong tailwind called the mining boom…

The mining boom, driven entirely by factors beyond Australia’s control, has pumped hundreds of billions of dollars into our national economy.”

Rudd- 2007 budget reply, but yeah- crazy that the miners think they chipped in during the global downturn.

nosthow says:

06:30pm | 28/05/10

@Eye4anEye says - much already in the print media such as the story linked - exerpt :“The West Australian Liberal Party advertising campaign would be expanded from it’s initial $50,000 budget if the party received financial support to run it. Last week the Liberal Party sent out 450 letters to mining company executives in Western Australia to a “direct financial contribution” for the marginal-seats campaign in the state.”
http://www.dynamicbusiness.com.au/articles/articles-export/liberals-campaign-super-profits-tax-1529.html

TC says:

06:34pm | 28/05/10

Dont you just love the Rudd school of ethics nosthow?

TC says:

06:37pm | 28/05/10

Steve why do you excuse Rudd by saying what Howard did? Not saying that Howard didnt do shady things but he’s history and seriously mate how does that excuse Rudd?

Cam says:

06:47pm | 28/05/10

Big difference between using tax payers’ money to run a politcal campaign and a business’s money nosthow, especially after the Prime Minister promised he wouldn’t!
You’ll probably find that the Minerals Council’s campaign is far better funded than the Liberal’s.
This policy probably wouldn’t have been announced by Labor if it wasn’t an election year. Labor is banking that the politics of envy will keep their head about water… the Australian people are a bit smarter than that I would hope!

Rob r Charteris says:

07:00pm | 28/05/10

Andy says:06:04pm; if that is the case then, make the liberal party give back the $2 billion the tax payer donated to the liberals during the Howards years. $40 million is crumbs

Wayne Fehlhaber says:

07:01pm | 28/05/10

The tax on mining profits has already caused the cancellation of exploration and expansion in Queensland . Job creation in mining and allied industries was snuffed out like a candle. With this dilemma comes the loss of future royalties to Queensland. Now we have ” Krazy Kev ”  spending another $40 million of taxpayers funds in an attempt to justify his political lunacy. This comes from the Prime Minister who stated prior to the last election , when questioned on government funded advertising ,  :  ”  I think it stinks ”  We all agree. !

There comes a time when the electorate takes a stand against the hypocrisy being practised by the P.M. . Does this shyster seriously believe the electorate will stand by and cop this blatant fraud being perpetrated on them by an alleged leader , who so recently condemned
the previous government   for the same actions .

So be it !  Let the battle begin in earnest. The Labor government will not have a legitimate grizzle when the mining industries carries out it’s own campaign against them. There is a a strong feeling in the electorate that this government is destined for one term only. I agree wholeheartedly.

JAZ says:

08:38pm | 28/05/10

Nosthow…mate your an idiot…go pick a fight with your own money,,,fool.

Super D says:

08:58pm | 28/05/10

If the government wants to correct the “misinformation” it should release the econtech modelling upon which their statements are based for public scrutiny.

At the same time it’s nice to see the ALP getting ready for another decade in opposition.

Christian Real says:

04:28am | 29/05/10

Wayne Fehlhaber,
It is good to see that the Ghost writer for a well known Fraser Coast Regional Councillor has risen once more to go into bat for Tony Abbott (the bugie smuggler wearer,and self confessed liar) on ABC interview programmes and the mining companies.The mining companies will not go broke as they falsely claim,and how much is the advertisements costing these mining companies to run Wayne?,it would be a lot more than the 40% tax that they are claiming will harm their mining operations.
How much money are these same mining companies also pumping into Liberal and National party coffers to bankroll them during elections?
It would appear Wayne, that if these mining companies can bankroll these advertisements and also give the Liberal and National parties huge donations,then they have more then enough funds and profits and are quite able to pay the 40% tax ,and still be able to fund all their projects that they are falsely claiming that they will have to abandon.

Christian Real says:

04:44am | 29/05/10

Steve
It is amazing how two faced these radical Liberal supporters really are,where were they complaining when John Howard spent $2 billion of taxpayers money on advertising?,and Rudd is spending,how much?, $40 million.

Christian Real says:

08:36am | 29/05/10

Eye 4 an Eye,
If that is the case, and you blatantly claim that the Labor party stole $40 million of taxpayers money, how come you and the other one-sided liberal imbeciles remained silent when John Howard used $2billion in taxpayer money to fund political advertisements.
It shows by your comments and other liberal comments in here and other blogs what type of calibre people you are, and that you only complain and whinge when it suits you all to do so, otherwise you all would have also been bagging Howard when he used $2 billion of taxpayers money.
Typical one-eyed, one-side Liberal/National party supporters that supported a Liberal party under Howard that brought in workchoices and anti-terrorism law that were akin to laws from Hitler’s “enabling Act” of March 23rd, 1933.

Christian Real says:

09:03am | 29/05/10

Overflow
Why didn’t you all tell John Howard to ‘use his own money’, when he used $2billion of taxpayer’s money to fund political advertisements?
It seems and appears that you and others that comment in these blogs show just how one-sided, one-eyed you all are(Howard was leader of the Liberal party that you all supported, so you all turned a blind eye and remained silent,even though he had used $2 billion of taxpayer’s money to fund advertisements.
It is different though when your beloved Liberal party is in Opposition, how much you all crow and whinge and carry on like the narrow-minded, tunnel visioned people that you all are.

Christian Real says:

09:17am | 29/05/10

Wayne Fehlhaber
Wayne, “the Ghost Writer” for a well known Fraser Coast Regional Councillor, it is good to see that you have time away from your ‘official duties’, to enable you to write the Liberal party instilled diatribe about how the mines will suffer if a 40% tax is imposed upon them.
The mines, have found the money to launch their advertisement campaign again the Government, and the mines have also found the money to donate to the Liberal party coffers, so really they are attempting to pull the wool over everyones eyes claiming that they will be hard done by, and that they will have to scrap mining projects.
If this is the case, as they blatantly claim, how come they can still give generous donations to the Liberal party and fund these anti tax advertisements as well, and giving the mining managers generous salaries.
These mining companies are full of bull, along with Tony Abbott and the Liberal/National party Opposition and all of their supporters and cheer squads.

Byro says:

10:07am | 29/05/10

Hey Leo, I seem to remember that wacky conspiracy theorist Howard, with his Bush- faith -based Weapons of Mass Destruction , with parrot Abbott in support,  committing us to spending a $1 Billion a year on his fanciful war on terror and Halliburtons and the resulting military industries record super profits…. The only people that benefited were Haliburtons and Al quaeda (through extra recruitment)

Then there are the across the board – record - petrol company super-profits from outstanding price gouging during Howards/Rudd era that Abbott is too happy to continue…! Hypocrisy built on hypocrisy eh Leo?

Who is going to stand up for ordinary Aussies? Not you Leo, huh? Be a good puppet and run along!

Russ says:

10:35am | 29/05/10

Given that I own shares in several mining companies, I am also helping to fund their advertising.  Noone from those companies asked me if they could spend money on something like that.  Having looked carefully at the tax, I feel it is actually quite fair, and I am happy for the companies to pay it - I just wish the CEOs and Chairmen would get back to running the show and stay out of the politics.  So I am funding both sides, and not happy with either of them.

Swinging Voter & Former snag says:

11:09am | 29/05/10

@ Wayne Fehlhaber, Agreed mate, but can i offer some constructive criticism of the LNP?

In your zeal to bitch about Malcolm Fraser’s resignation from the LNP, you all, on the conservative side, forgot about his performance on Q&A, Monday night.

As usual their was only one “token” conservative on the panel, him. Probably the only conservative in the audience asked him if the current incarnation of the red/green/getup/labour coalition was worse than Whitlam.

Answer yes, to no disagreement from anybody on the panel or in the audience.

Back to the hypocrisy. Sorry Communist, Anarchist, Socialists but 2 wrongs don’t make a right. Yes it was wrong the way “Howard” abused taxpayers with government advertising, but the red/green/getup/labour coalition are even worse, both now with this one & the “health” system which also has not changed yet, also the states have been at it for at least a decade.

This tax is another example of the Communist, Anarchist, Socialists, Anti Jobs, Anti Industry policy, to have us all living in a red/greenie commune on a vegetarian diet after all the naughty Capitalists who provide work have been taxed out of the country.

Of course it also could not have come at a worse time, on the eve of GFC#2. One wonders if it was designed to bring it on, or make it worse, so they can introduce the NWO, “the Fourth Reich”?

Surely nobody is capable of being stupid enough to believe this tax would not cause Economic Chaos, at this “market jitters” moment in time?

Ex Labour voters if you can’t bring yourself to vote #1, for the LNP, vote for real minor parties & independents, then preference the LNP.

We must at this election number the red/greens last, getup/labour second last, liberals third last, nationals fourth last & put every minor party & independent ahead of them, our children will never be safe until you do.

http://www.democrats.org.au/

http://www.australiafirstparty.com.au/cms/

http://www.ldp.org.au/

These loony, left fools could not organise an evening’s entertainment in a gentleman’s retreat with a $200 note, 2010 never again.

matilda the drovers dog says:

11:59am | 29/05/10

Full of it mate - Commsec has shown data (ATO) that indicates that in the when all of 2009 is taken into account the mining sector did help keep Aust out of recession. Your unelected Labor MP Ken Henry said it did not in the Senate hearings this week - but then he only used data from the Mar &Jun; quarters of last year - now why would Henry use data selectively? Furthermore dummy there is a little thing called the Australian Constitution that states that minerals belong to the states not the Feds - this is a grab by the Feds to prop up some monetary holes - but then I am sure you applaud the last Budget don’t you? (the Budget that failed to mention that what it should have focused on FY10/11 has a $40billion+ deficit.

Alice says:

06:43pm | 29/05/10

How interesting! Rudd attacked the magnitude of the Howard spend. Conservative estimates put it around the $2 bill. I think Costello put it a lot higher than that.
No, I repeat, No government would promise “NO” advertising.
Of course the comments have been taken out of context again & distorted.
Funny thing!  This campaigne will be in defence of our democracy against multi-national corporations. With Abbott promising no reform impost on the corporations but promising reform who do you think is going to pay for it? The most likely is that Aust. will stay static, with the status quo. Totally laughable. You lot quibble about some poor refugees attacking your way of life & you are too stupid to see the corporate assault on our government & democracy.

Greg says:

11:59pm | 29/05/10

So its ok if Rudd does it but not if Howard did it? Or is it ok for Rudd to do what Howard did?. This argument falls in the ... if your friend jumped of a skyscraper would you? ... catagory.  Rudd promised he would not do it. We are talking about Rudd.

Greg says:

12:10am | 30/05/10

Christian, we know Rudds a liar, we know all politicians lie. If what Abbot said came as a shock to you then you must live a small life indeed. The gauling part is that Rudd has been caught lying many times but treats us as fools by trying to tell us he’s honest.

Wayne Fehlhaber says:

07:53am | 30/05/10

Christian Real :  The A.L.P. had no qualms in accepting donations from mining magnate , Clive Palmer , in Western Australia .
A dollar from mining is a dollar from mining whichever way you look at it so it’s not a good idea to throw stones in that glass house Christian.

steve says:

02:31pm | 30/05/10

Alice
I fully agree with you. This is about big corporations threatening a democratically elected government with a campaign of misinformation to terrorise the serfs.
In this instance I think it is highly justified. I’m sure if this country was ‘that’ way inclined it would not be past these organizations to organize a ‘coupe’ against the government. Who do you think scuttled Turnbull’s leadership over the ETS?
Abbott has set himself up as the CEO of Multinational Investments.

steve says:

07:30pm | 30/05/10

Andy says
“There is a massive difference between the Coalition spending money donated to them on party political advertising and the Government spending taxpayers money on party political advertising.”
Isn’t that the point? This is an information campaigne about the RSPT.
Not a party political ad.

Eye4anEye says:

03:10pm | 31/05/10

wow Christian Real your really going to town there mate 5 replies in a row. As a matter of a fact I did slag of Howard for his political advertising I find the business or politics in general somewhat repugnant - and yes I do lean towards Liberal mostly because I think they do a better job (not great but better) and I personally find Rudd to be one of the slimiest most hypocritical liars to ever grace our nations parliament which is saying something given his profession.

In summay get of your one eyed all left footed horse comrade or at least back your statements up with facts.

Cec says:

03:49pm | 01/06/10

Check ABS industry employment data and you’ll find that mining employment in Queensland increased by 9000 at the bottom of the GFC (Aug08-May09).  To be fair, Kev should have told us more about the economic stimulus package targeting the advertising and media industries.

Just Askin' says:

05:32pm | 28/05/10

Did Howard, Abbott and Hockey invoke the emergency powers act to do so?

Nigel Catchlove says:

05:33pm | 28/05/10

Because Kevin07 said it wasn’t good enough and he’d be different, that’s why.

Maria says:

05:39pm | 28/05/10

The difference is Rudd said he wouldn’t do it! That was obviously a lie! again!
“That is an absolute commitment when it comes to the quantum of ... the abuse of public funding which has occurred with taxpayer-funded advertising of late.

“This actually is a long-term cancer on our democracy.”

“I’m serious about this stuff, I think it stinks,” he said.

Eye4anEye says:

05:44pm | 28/05/10

Maybe because they said they wouldn’t do it? You can’t call something a cancer and promise not to do it and then change your mind - well you can and Labor have and should rightfully be outed as hypocrits and liars.

All politicians are hypocrits and liars to some degree however Rudd seems to take it to an artform.

Overflow says:

05:52pm | 28/05/10

“This actually is a long-term cancer on our democracy.”

Mr Rudd said a Labor government would put processes in place to prevent the wrongful use of taxpayer funds to pay for government propaganda.

“I’m serious about this stuff, I think it stinks,” he said.

“For all advertising campaigns in excess of $250,000, either the auditor-general or the auditor-general’s designate would be required to vet those advertisements before public funding went to them…”

By the way T, the industrial legislation you refer to was actual law, the mining tax is a thought bubble the govt is still negotiating over.

Phil says:

08:42pm | 28/05/10

TC When they did the advertising which was effectively party political to gloat over the health reforms, did you see the liberals winging.
I certainly did not.
Rudd is desperate. He knows he is on the nose, he knows that the miners have far more money for putting forward there message than his government does, and he knows that this tax is unpopular, socialist and class warfare.
You watch the misinformation that comes out in these ads.
It is a disgrace.
As for a fare price for the minerals. Do they not lease/sell tenaments. If they fail to charge an amount, is that hardly the miners problem. Its like saying I sold you my home for $100,000 and now its worth $1,000,000, so I want some more money.

Super D says:

09:04pm | 28/05/10

There is a key difference between this governments helath reform and now mining ads and the previous governments advertising regarding workchoices.

The previous government had all the required legislation in place to implement the changes it was advertising.  The present government does not.

Indeed should there be a change of government neither the health reforms nor the mining tax will ever be implemented.  Again the key difference here is that workchoices, terrible policy that it was, was implemented and was the law of the land.

The objective test is the existence of passed enabling legislation.  Without legislation in place the advertising is party political. 

It would be a very clever move for the Coalition to announce this as policy.

Tails says:

10:09pm | 28/05/10

You really are a complete and utter thicko aren’t you Mr Chong? There’s no point debating you as the facts are already out there - you’re just choosing to ignore them. WAKE UP!

Steve Putnam says:

10:20pm | 28/05/10

The Howard Govt spent more on one publicly funded ad campaign (GST- break downnn the walls etc- everyone remembers that mindless drone ad infinitum) than the previous government did in its whole 13 years in office. This campaign did zilch to educate anyone about what the new tax meant for buisness and consumer alike. I’m opposed to political to political advertising under the guise of public service announcements, State or Federal, Liberal or Labour and we all have to let pollies know we don’t want them spending our money to tell us how much they’re going to do for us!

G.David says:

10:38pm | 29/05/10

and how is that different from the unions spending their member’s money on a multi-million $ scare campaign against workchoices?

Howard was forced to respond with a campaign to set the record straight and try and get that important reform accepted.

Secondly, I’d hardly class the extensive GST advertising as political - it was a reform that affected every Australian and we all needed to be informed how it would work and what we had to do. That is very different from typical Labor advertising which is of the “look at us, how wonderful we are” variety.

Thirdly, did anybody notice how much blatant self-promoting political advertising the Labor State governments were doing?

Funny all the Lefties only remember Liberal advertising!

watchingwithinterest says:

09:15am | 30/05/10

If the Rudd government had used its opportunities to provide the facts about the tax mining companies actually pay by using data collected from the ATO or another credible government source instead of a graduate working paper then they might not have found themselves in the position that they are in where everybody is not listening to what they say.  I will be interested to see the ads.  I hope that they are based on facts, the information that the modelling was done on would be good, and not some paper that they found on a google search of the internet.

steve says:

02:25pm | 30/05/10

“Did Howard, Abbott and Hockey invoke the emergency powers act to do so?”
Was the Howard government under attack from multi-national corporations? NO!
The Howard government had the backing of these guys.
Third world countries are so attractive that these mining giants prefer to mine here. Because they get a better deal from us than third world countries. As George Megalogenis pointed out. In the US these big corporations own congress. Do we really want a corporation for our government who always act in their own best interests first & foremost?

Greg says:

12:58am | 30/05/10

Except that Dickensean England was one of the very few countries in the world to be beggining industrialism. There was no world economy. There was Empire and English industry generaly failed over time as it didnt go to the cheapest production areas. We have learnt that lesson. The miners will go to where they can make the greatest profit, they have no alligance to country. They are a business, they do it to make money. No matter what the advertising campaign does, it is in our interest to keep business here.  Yes it was tough down the coal mines but the option was starving, illegal activities leading to prison,deportation or death. No centerlink for them. Lucky we get tax from business to pay that.
This tax is cutting of our nose to spite our face and I do not want my tax dollars spent on advertising this idiocy on the whim of an inept government.

Ryan says:

10:55am | 29/05/10

proof please!

harriet says:

09:35pm | 29/05/10

futureproof it is called buying the opposition for future benefits. eg reintroduction of work choices

Ryan says:

12:09pm | 31/05/10

@Futureproof : well I guess the fact that you refuse to provide any evidence to your slanderous statement means you have no credibility whatsoever.

Joan says:

08:03pm | 28/05/10

And who gave the green light ? None other than Special Minister of State Joe Ludwig the son of Bill Ludwig the National President and Queensland state secretary of the Australian Workers Union (AWU). Rudd, Swann, the unions are running scared- dead scared and there is nothing worse than a cornered panicked rat it will do anything to survive.

JenfromNanaGlen says:

11:32am | 29/05/10

Agree 150% Vote Labor out before we have a country that is a league of nations and you know what happened to that!  This government is slowly bleeding this country dry!  KRudd said on an i/v with Kerry O’brien that he would raise standards and that taxpayer funded political ads would not happen under his watch & he would resign if it did.  Please Kevin for the sake of this country do just that. Those who voted for this idiot and his bunch of policy freaks - just hope you are more affected by their incompetence than those of us who didn’t.

Harriet says:

09:43pm | 29/05/10

then why are the company directors talking down the share price? they sure are looking after you as an investor. as BHP the big polluter looked after papua new guinea. remember stern hu, Rio really looked after that employee.
yeah these directors sure are crazy!

Angry God says:

08:08am | 30/05/10

Harriet, they are looking at this disaster and managing the situation to their best advantage. The short term losses will be compenstated by the gains made when this incompetant government are finally removed and this stupid tax consigned to the Kevin Rudd memorial garbage bin of history.

The best thing that this government has done is to ensure that sane sensible Australians will not give the keys to the cookie jar to the ALP in a bloody long time.

Super D says:

09:11pm | 28/05/10

I think you’ll find that Quentin is Kevin’s girl.  We are more likely to end up with a dictatorship than a dismissal.

Tekko says:

09:30am | 29/05/10

Seems like a lot of posters agree with you here egnima. Myself included. But I have one main concern. On the ballot form there will be a choice of Rudd, Abbott, and Donkey. Really not much difference in any of them is there?

Grumbles says:

05:57pm | 31/05/10

Only the entirely illiterate see a choice of Rudd, Abbott, and Donkey. There are several independants, as well as independant parties run by the grassroots from Australians that want to break the 2 party system, and they have no chance because the collective intelligence of Australia can only see the Choice between Two D***Heads or throwing their vote away. If you really hate government, vote LDP they are promising to shrink the government.

Nitzpicker says:

05:56pm | 28/05/10

Da! comrade, dis is how tings are done in mother Ruddia.

Adam Diver says:

12:31pm | 29/05/10

I sent an email, which is pretty good as I am usually fairly passive on these subjects. Personally I think this type of advertising is an attack on democracy and the health reform ads are no better.

TC says:

06:45pm | 28/05/10

Ah. Thanks Evan. I knew this was Howards fault the minute I heard Rudd and emergency.

Wayne Fehlhaber says:

08:01pm | 28/05/10

Yes Evan , we know , Kevin really told us about it at the time
Remember ?  He also said ”  This actually is a long-term cancer on our democracy .  I’m serious about this stuff.  I think it stinks. “
It certainly does Evan. !  This Labor government is on the nose as well.

Evan Findlay says:

11:48am | 29/05/10

TC, I’m not blaming Howard. What I was pointing out is that if it’s good enough for one political party, the incumbent government, to spend $150 million dollars trying to influence the electorate to vote for their policies then how come other governments can’t? It reeks. Compare the coalition spending on workchoices, $150 million, and $38.5 million on the Rent Resources Tax.

Eighteen months out from the election in 2007, Liberal Party polling told them they had no chance of workchoices ever flying but they continued to waste taxpayers money. At least with the Rent Resources Tax it is more evenly poised. And if the government can dispell the mistruths and misinformation the Mining council is bombarding us with, sell the positives for the economy and the electorate, then it’s money well spent.

marley says:

04:34pm | 29/05/10

Evan - it was despicable of Howard to use public money that way, and it’s no less despicable for Rudd. In fact, it’s worse, since he allegedly regards it as a cancer on democracy and said he’d never do it, whereas I doubt Howard thought or said anything of the kind.

A plague on both their houses.

Christian Real says:

07:42pm | 29/05/10

Wayne Fehlaber
In comparrission, unless you are really bad at maths, the $150 million that Howard spent on Workchoices really stands out above the $38.5 million Rudd is spending on the Mining advertisements.
It appears that Howard and cronies were in actual fact much more wasteful with the taxpayer’s money than Rudd is.
Tell me Wayne, why didn’t you and the other imbecile Liberals commenting in here whinge and whine about Howard spending that massive amount of taxpayers money on ‘WorkChoices’, or was it because that you and other Liberals condoned Howard’s actions because he was Leader of   the party you all supported.

Wayne Fehlhaber says:

08:02am | 30/05/10

Christian Real :  The focus is on the Rudd dud govt. and the devastation they are leaving in their wake , broken promises , bungled programs , lives lost and homes burnt to the ground through lack of program administration . Where were you and the other Labor imbeciles when the maladministration was destroying people’s lives. ?

TC says:

11:31am | 30/05/10

And Evan Im not saying what Howard did was acceptable but I do find it absurd that we’re having a discussion about Howard because Kev’s inventing super powers for himself.

TC says:

11:42am | 30/05/10

Christian, Youre aware that Howard is out of government?  The Beatles have broken up?

Im not seeing anyone here try to excuse Howard’s actions nor do I see anyone even half as rabid as you. Youre the only imbecile here mate.

I really would love to hear you frame an arguement without referring to Howard, “snivelling liberal voters”, “your people” or any other historic irrelevancies.
Just try to live in the present mate and understand that it is Rudd who is making the decisions right now.

Evan Findlay says:

05:39pm | 30/05/10

TC, your rewritng history. Your saying that it’s o.k for Howard to waste $150 million dollars because it was in the past. The word is hypocrisy. When Tony Abbott was pressed yesterday to make comment about the same point he ignored the question. When pressed further about the coalitions use of taxpayer’s money to push the Liberal party’s policy on workchoices he said “Thanks very much” and retreated from the press conference, a press conference he called. “People in glass houses should not throw stones” “If you can’t handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen”. Just a couple of phrases Abbott should familiarize himself with.

The Howard government spent over $250 million dollars in it’s final year of government pushing it’s agenda through advertisement. So TC and Wayne Fehlhaber are you prepared to help the coalition pay back taxpayers money? I didn’t think so! Rudd might be on the nose but as the polls clearly demonstrate he is still hugely more popular than Abbott, a politician that has more often than not demonstrated he can not keep his word. “Rock solid, iron clad guarantee” Ring any bells? Lies about stripping a billion dollars from health and when the evidence is thrown at him by budget papers in parliament he changes the topic. Openly admits on national television that he lies to further his argument. Lied about his meeting with Cardinal Pell. Lied about his dealings with Pauline Hanson. Lies after lies after more lies, it seems to be a prerequisite trait for conservative politicians, whether they be the Prime Minister or the opposition leader.

By all means tear Rudd apart for his failings but don’t think for one minute that the policy inert and compulsive liar that is Tony Abbott is a better alternative. Tony is a policy vacuous and intellectually challenged servant of Howardnism, and Howard was ceremoniously dumped at the last election.

Bruce says:

10:18pm | 28/05/10

You see,  all politician LIE.  Unless its signed in “blood” do not believe anything politicians say.

Just Sayin' says:

04:37am | 29/05/10

And if it is signed in blood, check that the politician doesn’t have a needle in your arm.

Adam Diver says:

12:35pm | 29/05/10

Well you contributed to when you bought that CD, socks and groceries and god help us if you drove a car as well.

Shelley says:

08:46pm | 28/05/10

Robbing Rudd and Tricky Swan steal taxpayers funds to run ALP propaganda election adverts.

The ALP. They could all walk under the belly of a snake with room to spare.

Ben81 says:

06:57pm | 28/05/10

but…but…Howard!

How was that?

Adam Diver says:

12:41pm | 29/05/10

Damn Ben you learn quickly.

But, but we are doing better than other countries

or

But, but times have changed

or

We will do everything it takes to remain (get in) in power

Freeman says:

10:14am | 29/05/10

Rob,
you know what the problem here is, the problem is that Kevin got up on his soap box and vowed to put a stop to this sort of activity. Now this goes onto his list of broken promises. he’s such a hypocrite. Guess Ruddy thought the unions would fund and fight all of his battles. hehehe.

Adam Diver says:

12:44pm | 29/05/10

Your vote and your money. And if you are part of a union more of your money. How about you pay my share as well because I am not really keen on funding these ads.

Cna’t say I agree to any party using public funds for propaganda but to decry it then abuse it is so much worse again.

luke09 says:

01:12pm | 29/05/10

Rob, people are complaining because this 38 million dollar taxpayer ad campaign goes against a 100% guaranteed commitment from Rudd which he said we could hold him to.

The sad reality is, anything Rudd says from now on should not be taken seriously and is an almost certain lie. Rudd is a man with no convictions, no credibility and just a hollow insincere man who will be remembered as Australia’s worst PM in history.

The next election will be a hard choice between someone who has told us he can lie and someone(Australia’s worst PM in history) who makes us believe he does not lie.(100% guarantee)

Rob r Charteris says:

08:36am | 30/05/10

Yes I see that, but they didn’t when greater than thou Howard and his band of lib’s made a similar claim then ramped up the spending on Work Choices. Yes they are as bad as each other. Also an interesting story here about the fraudulent claims being made by the mining industry. When you have to counter that as a government, then I’m ok with them spending some money educating us. Like the claim that it was mining industry that got us through the GFC.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/major-miners-generally-selfish-20100528-wle9.html

TC says:

11:55am | 30/05/10

Right up there with Christian Real for rabidity Rob. You really make a strong case for yourself by describing anyone who doesnt agree with you that way. “snivelling”, “dictator mobs”, ‘capitalist fat cats”, “gutless balls” (what is that?) “raping you up”. You managed to fit all this abuse into just 6 lines.

Kev the man? Surely he’s Superman now he’s got emergency power?

Im pretty sure everyone is aware he has your vote Rob. He’s going to need unquestioning fools like you.

Matt Stewart says:

04:42am | 29/05/10

Three points:
- Just because a guy who has left politics used to do, doesn;t make it okay
- Rudd condemned Howard for it, and now does it himself - he’s a hypocrit
- Howard never abused emergency powers to do it.  It’s not so much the money that makes this intolerable, it’s the gross abuse of power.

Rob r Charteris says:

08:46am | 30/05/10

Matt Stewart says:04:42am; lol the big claim coming from liberal sound bites is that Kev the man is using emergency powers to use these funds. Ok tell us thr actual emergency powers Kev the man is using??? and what legislation they belong to???

TC says:

11:58am | 30/05/10

Ah yes the Howard defence. Brilliant, well thought out and relevant

steve says:

04:05pm | 30/05/10

It’s like this. The Howard defence is valid because the turkey leading the Coalition was a senior minister in that government. That’s the hypocrisy.  As someone has already mentioned, that this government never said they would never advertise. That’s a distortion from the rabid right.
As for the jibe about the union. The unions are representatives of workers. Who do these mining magnates represent? You? The Aussie citizen. The comparison makes me laugh.

Adam Diver says:

12:49pm | 29/05/10

If you are basing your votes on the rants of the supporters than I hope you decide not to vote at all.

The sooner you realise that the majority are bigoted, stupid morons the sooner you realise to

a) ignore the stupid
b) why governments and oppositions constantly appeal to the lowest common denominator i.e terms like “boat people” and “super profits”

Rocket Surgeon says:

06:06pm | 29/05/10

Adam, I don’t accept the majority are bigoted and stupid, quite the opposite. I think its a minority of the fringe dwellers that carry on like pork chops. And that applies to both sides.

I also think the supporters are a reflection of the party, especially on a blog like this where half of them are the party!

BTW, super profits is an economic term.

TC says:

01:58pm | 30/05/10

Rocket “superprofits” is not an economic term, it’s Marxist invention

Freeman says:

10:37am | 29/05/10

serious,
so you’re claiming Miners are paying 15% tax? not true. they’re paying 38% + royalties
Ken Henry proprosed changes to taxing the mining sector including reduction or abolishment of royalties as well as this tax. but all Kev and swanny want to impose is the tax grab part of it.

Adam Diver says:

12:58pm | 29/05/10

Thanks for the statistics but I feel some background information would be helpful.

1. How much tax is paid to state governments from mining industry.

2. How much of the discrepency does the international prices of commodities contribute to this?

3. How does this compare to other industries?

4. How has the growth of employment and employee taxes contributed during this time frame.

I am all for taxing other people than myself, with little economic impact but any taxes that are just stand and deliver without any gradual impose to reduce impact worry me and in this case is also accompanied by a large debt and a looming election which causes me great concern.

Adam Diver says:

01:04pm | 29/05/10

This constant argument of once only, non-renewable assets makes me laugh.

It reminds me of the guy who buys an expensive car but is so afraid to drive it and damage it that he never ends up using it.

If you can find an acceptable price for our assets let me know because if you want more bang for your buck all mining should be stopped and not recommenced for another 100 years where prices will be ever higher.

But if you want a simple logical way to get more proceeds for a resources state royalties should be increased to match whatever figure you think is sufficient. That is the only true equitable way for these taxes to be imposed. Anything lse simply rewards mediocrity.

Rob r Charteris says:

07:32am | 29/05/10

Ben in Canberra says:09:49pm; Do you have a better argument than that?? one with substance??? probably not as your the one that in inept and morrally bankrupt. Actually I bet you the type of bloke that would rather mining companies come into Australia rape the country side and leave us with nothing but big holes in the ground as they roll back out of the country with their bags of money. Nice one Champ!!!!

John A Neve says:

08:26am | 29/05/10

Ben,

Don’t you care what the rest of the “democratic world” think?
Or, in your view, is the “western democratic world” more democratic?
Don’t you like people from the eastern part of our world?

TC says:

12:08pm | 30/05/10

Rob Chatartist. Are you sleeping well? Im worried about you. Did you read what nasty immoral Ben said ? You appear to be upset

Rob r Charteris says:

01:19pm | 30/05/10

TC says:12:08pm; I sleep fine Top Cat

Adam Diver says:

01:05pm | 29/05/10

Union party i’d assume.

Christian Real says:

04:29pm | 29/05/10

Sirro
The only disgrace is all you liberal imbeciles, who think that the mining companies should be exempt from paying for mining our minerals.
These mining companies can rack off out of our Country and take all you liberal imbeciles with you.
It is about time our Aboriginal ancestors country was given back to our people,the Traditional owners, instead of having you white fellas bitch and whinge about everything.
It appears that it is time, our Aboriginal people reclaimed their rights and their lands.

John A Neve says:

07:48am | 30/05/10

Antiperspirant,

I don’t claim to have seen all this governments adds/information papers. But these mining adds/information papers are not party political. I repeat, in my view governments should do more of it. The people lack information on which to vote. Much of the media has a bias amd many people vote uninformed, that is one of the reasons we are in a mess.

TC says:

01:15pm | 30/05/10

Christian. Do you think the government will want more mining if we impose huge new taxes or less?

Are you enjoying Kev’s apology? How are your people doing these days? Are you happy with Rudd’s immigration plans? How will that extra 15Million feel about your apparent right to free land? Do you enjoy the sales of land to foreigners?

Eye4anEye says:

03:21pm | 31/05/10

@ Christian

Didn’t see anywhere in Sirro’s post that hes a Liberal supporter, could be a greens, pinks yellows supporter - your Labor handler needs to muzzle you your starting to bite anyone without a Labor badge…bad attack dog bad!

John A Neve says:

07:32am | 29/05/10

Antiperspirant,

Just what is wrong with any government puting it’s case?
One of the main problems I have with our political system is that, in my view, not enough information is put into the public arena.

As to the quality of the information, in this case I feel, the government, opposition and mining industry are all bending the truth to suite their own aims. Sadly where money and power are involved the truth always suffers. It is up to the public to take in the information provided by all three parties to this debate/war and form their own opinion.

antiperspirant says:

05:38pm | 29/05/10

John read the article.

The man is desperate…just in case you missed it

““That is an absolute commitment when it comes to the quantum of ... the abuse of public funding which has occurred with taxpayer-funded advertising of late.

“This actually is a long-term cancer on our democracy.

“I’m serious about this stuff, I think it stinks,” he said.”

From the op.

Another backflip. But more seriously this is party political advertising just like the disgusting medical one. Have a look at them. Offers no information just a advert we paid for.

if you want info you can find it. To be so open and hypocritical is a disgrace. Just like Howard found out people don’t like being taken for idiots.

national emergency. What a joke. The only emergency is the upcoming elections and the slide in the polls

Ben81 says:

04:14pm | 29/05/10

“former Prime Minister John Howard used $2 billion to fund Liberal party political advertisements.”
Lie, history, but but howard etc…

Anyway, on topic, are you ok with Rudd backing away from his promise not to spend money like this or not?  I think that’s what you’ll find is the problem here, Christian, that it’s exposed more of Rudd’s rhetoric from before the election as empty garbage.  As a one eyed Labor supporter, doesn’t it worry you just a bit that yet another promise has been broken, this time on something he even called a “cancer on our democracy” when it was convenient to him, but it’s fine now that he’s doing it?

marley says:

04:53pm | 29/05/10

Well, I’m not a liberal hack - haven’t been in the country long enough to be a rusted on anything.  So, looking at the situation objectively, I ask myself,  how does the ALP decision to copy the bad behaviour of the Coalition count as an improvement in our political life?  It’s the same pile of excrement from both parties.  And ALP excrement does not smell any sweeter than Lib excrement.

Freeman says:

06:04pm | 29/05/10

Christian Real,

There you go again making assumptions. assumptions that Lib supporters are/were comfortable with political parties both in government & in opposition spending the publics millions spreading lies or the unions wasting their members money on getting their labor pals elected.
The point is not the 40 Million being spent. it is the massive hyporacy displayed by Rudd. he was going to put a stop to these public funded . now he declares an emergency so he can raid the funds for himself? hilarious, the man has no shame. If he hadn’t declared his own kind of activity as a “long term cancer on democracy ” then no one would have batt an eyelid. If you can’t see the hypocracy in Rudds actions even now then I guess your always going to look at him with starry eyes, Christian

Eye4anEye says:

03:24pm | 31/05/10

@ Christian

“One-sided, one-eyed, bias ”  LOL you get em tiger because this could never apply to you could it.

Best thing about you mate is that you don’t need batteries a little bit of winding up and you go off for hours - if we could reverse engineer you we’d have the secret to cheap renewable power.

Ben81 says:

04:32pm | 29/05/10

And here I was thinking that this argument was about Rudd backing away from another election promise and showing that his rhetoric from 2007 was nothing but crap, where’s the funny part?  You probably could have condensed all that into one short sentence by the way, you’re pretty good at saying a lot without really saying much at all.

I’ll make it simple for you, even though I’m most likely wasting my time.

Rudd of 2007 - “Government advertising will be vetted by the Auditor General, an absolute commitment, cancer on our democracy etc blah blah blah” (Strong words don’t you think?)
Rudd of 2010, paraphrased for clarity - “uh, about that, I’m really really desperate to run some ads, so forget I mentioned all those things a few years ago to win the election”

Why are you getting so worked up in defence of this?

Freeman says:

06:39pm | 29/05/10

gee, the labor huggers really are getting nasty on this one, and anyone who doesn’t see it their way is of course,an idiot. must be a sore point?

nice attempt to change the subject too, what us libs supports are crowing about is Rudds massively hypocritical move to raid public funds after he declared such publically funded campaigns as a cancer on democracy and vowed to end it. oh well, perhaps you’re just a bit slow and that thought hasn’t occurred to you yet.

marley says:

06:50pm | 29/05/10

Ok.  Tell me why it was wrong for Howard to use taxpayer money to fund political ads, but it’s okay for Rudd to do so.?

It’s ALL political crap.  Don’t you get that?  I don’t give a ratshit about which party is taking my money for illicit purposes - they’re all equally wrong.  And whether they’re campaigning against unions or big business, it’s still political campaigning on my and your dollar.  That’s what pisses a lot of people off - a lot of people who voted against Howard and now see Rudd doing the same bloody things.

antiperspirant says:

07:22pm | 29/05/10

Now kids listen closely.

The above post is a warning to you not to lick the lead based paint at Granpa’s farmhouse.

What follows is a loss of mental capacity leading to dangerously lopsided views and heightened blodd pressure.

If you leave the paint alone you will be able to see cases of hypocrisy and futile efforts at justification clearly.

Just remember don’t do drugs kids.

TC says:

01:54pm | 30/05/10

Rob.Sheep go Baaaaaaa! mate.

It would really be an funny old world where sheep and fat cats lie down together howling and crowing. I can see why you would be giggling.

Glad to see youre not stooping tto abuse though like all the pathetic scared, uneducated, unintelligent, fat cat, imbecile liberal didums.

Can you not even remotely consider that imposing a sudden massive tax upon already existing and costed projects could (just maybe) impact adversely on the industry? Superannuation? Prices? Asset values?

The emergency is that Rudd cant communicate a substantive arguement that floats with educated and intellingent people as to how this helps.

Im not saying Liberal are better or that what previous governments did were’nt wrong and shameful. We’ll even call Tony Abbott names if you like but Rudd has painted himself into a corner and it’s an emergency by his own admission.

Rob r Charteris says:

08:21am | 31/05/10

Ben81 says:04:32pm; Boy I really feel sorry for you, you really do have a simpeton view of the world. Dont worry Top Cat will be your friend

Eye4anEye says:

04:01pm | 31/05/10

Rob between you and Christian Reals well thought out mature arguments your doing more to damage Labor than anyone else on the forums I think - Rabid fanatics like yourselves of any political leaning do more damage than good.

But feel free to keep on keeping on it provides a bit of a laugh.

Rocket Surgeon says:

08:46pm | 29/05/10

Keith, you are right, the $40 million is a disgrace. Unfortunately your economic illiteracy and the identical bleatings from the opposition are why I can’t vote for them. If you want to govern you need to demonstrate you are fit to do so and so far the coalition has only demonstrated an ability to belligerently oppose. This advertising campaign is morally bankrupt, but so is demonising refugees for political gain and I’d rather a government that wastes money instead of lives.

antiperspirant says:

03:34pm | 30/05/10

Good one rocket. How many lives were lost by refugees trying to come across in boats after the successful Pacific Solution. You know the one where people were put behind wire fences like now? The one which stopped boats coming. Hmmm?

What is that none I hear you say. that is right genius none. Now we have a government that has opened the floodgates and people are losing their lives by the dozen.

Real compassionate that policy eh. People on Xmas island and in incarceration for years.

Your hypocrisy is only matched by your singlemindedness in being a Labor fanboi.

Learn to think and get back to us.

Rocket Surgeon says:

07:59pm | 30/05/10

Ah vitriol. I’d use it too I my argument was as thin as yours. Read my post. I called Labor’s actions a disgrace and morally bankrupt!
This is not a football game where you blindly support one team. It’s a political debate where it’s possible to discuss the policies and tactics of all parties. Dismissing me as a Labor fan boi is both wrong and indicative of your level of thinking.
To descend to your level, you need some antiperspirant, you stink!

antiperspirant says:

09:07pm | 31/05/10

This is funny.

John A Neve says:

05:06pm | 30/05/10

Susan Q,

I am very upset that you see me as “unthinking and ill-bred” added to which, so would my mother. But I tell you what Susan Q, I’d rather mix with the people I know than a snob like you.

DocBud says:

12:52am | 31/05/10

The thing about us modern snobs, John, is that our snobbery is based on hard work, intellect and achievement, so we do have the right to look down upon those who believe in an egalitarianism that is based on the notion that “I’m entitled to a share of other people’s investment and hard work even though I’ve done nothing to contribute myself”.

Shane From Melbourne says:

01:03am | 31/05/10

You can thank John Howard for the middle class welfare indoctrination…....

Eye4anEye says:

01:04pm | 01/06/10

Play the man not the ball Susan - and please don’t insult all Labor voters your statement is both incredibly insulting and pointless. My father is a Labor voter and probably always will be and I find your comment offensive as he is neither brain dead nor ill-bred.

If you want to have any form of real impact please debate using a logical argument most people will respond better to that than such insults as you spouted which just get most people (regardless off political affiliation offside).

John A Neve says:

07:37pm | 30/05/10

Steve,
You seem to be an authority on “mud”, sadly based on you post you are an authority on little else.  Little wonder you are a born to rule supporter.

gerri says:

11:30pm | 30/05/10

I agree Steve. Add to your list the continual push to dumb down the already apathetic population and the school curriculum and we have an “Australia’ more interested in the latest celebrity cooking show.

Further, Rudd is from the same Blair/ Brown Labor mold - the question is will the Liberals put on the brake to Australia’s open door immigration or will be become another UK?