Transparency deserves a better spokesperson

Anubis says:

12:41pm | 08/10/12

Statement of amateur opinion on a legal matter??????

Isn’t Gillard supposed to be a hotshot Lawyer? Where then does amateur come in to it. She knew what she was saying, she has the legal background. Far from amateur opinion on a legal matter. Incompetent opinion maybe but not amateur

FlyOnTheWall says:

12:47pm | 08/10/12

Any wonder he has a messiah complex… after watching 5 minutes of that hagiography last night, one can’t blame him I guess.

Draconian says:

12:49pm | 08/10/12

Mere statement of amateur opinion?  From the PM?  Similiar to her “There will be no carbon tax under my government” statement?

Go for it Assange.  Hope you take her for millions.

AdamC says:

01:05pm | 08/10/12

FlyOnTheWall, I made a point of avoiding ‘The Julian Assange Story’. I got lots of ironing done as a result. I suspected the film would be a fanboy exercise.

Anubis and Draconian, I find myself in unfamiliar territory defending the prime minister! However, while Gillard is a trained lawyer, she is clearly no expert in the relevant areas of American law, nor did she claim any such expertise. In my view, a reasonable listener would have taken her comments as merely statements of educated, amateur opinion on a legal matter yet to be settled.

That latter point is important. Until Assange is extradited to the US to face charges, assuming there ever are any charges and that any US extradition attempt is successful, the question of the legality of WikiLeaks’ actions is far from clearly established. Julia Gillard’s comments may, at some stage, be proven correct.

FINK says:

01:16pm | 08/10/12

“” vis a vis the legality of Assange’s leaks”“
Well, you see, they managed to have trumped up charges put on an Australian named David Hicks and had to serve the remainder of his time in an Australian gaol. Just because there are NO current law infringements doesn’t mean tomorrow there will not be some retro respective charges. Julian has shown that like David Hicks has witnessed the governments cannot be trusted.

Al says:

02:04pm | 08/10/12

@Anubis Pretty amateurish lawyer, clearly. As we’ve seen in other areas…

Mick says:

02:12pm | 08/10/12

Opening up a can of worms there Al. Or should I say a file…

JP says:

02:56pm | 08/10/12

Watch out now guys, or Stevie Conroy might come and shut you down. Can’t be talking about that topic!

Admiral Ackbar says:

03:53pm | 08/10/12

The worst PM we’ve ever had must have made one hell of a lawyer. *cough*

Robert S McCormick says:

05:06pm | 08/10/12

The big problem for us is that in the event Assange does sue Prime Minister Gillard the tens of millions of dollars she will incur in Legal Bills will, in all probability, be billed to Australia’s hapless Taxpayers!
After all they squandered $730,000+ on legal fees, plus the $50,000 compensation on the Ashby case against the Commonwealth so a few millions more on the Credit Card will be meaningless to this profligate, inept, dishonest Federal Government.

Reschs Monkey says:

01:04pm | 08/10/12

If you’ve had ‘more than enough from the real Assange’, may I suggest that you join Tony Abbott in watching his 21st century TV pulp fiction pot-boiler ‘Downton Abbey’.

You can then pretend that Wiki-leaks’ expose of scandals, war crimes, assassinations, and the machinations and manipulations by our leaders, will simply disappear like magic.

TI says:

02:08pm | 08/10/12

Speaking of Downton, Matthew’s hair is slicked back a lot like Julian Assange’s…

Rose says:

02:16pm | 08/10/12

Good Lord, i find myself agreeing with Joan,  this just will not do!!

Fran says:

02:24pm | 08/10/12

@TI Except Matthew is much better looking. Positively dashing!

Draconian says:

02:50pm | 08/10/12

Joan, and of course everyone believes what the press says.  Talk about brain washing…

Joan says:

03:08pm | 08/10/12

Draconian: Asssange has more than enough to say for himself in the media I don’t need journo commentary or fact fiction to form an opinion of Assange - his sob story doesn’t work for me.
Reschs Monkey: `expose of scandals, war crimes, assassinations, and the machinations and manipulations by our leaders` and now that we all know, how has it change world politics?? - you probably want Obama to win election and probably vote for Gillard - 2010 coup leader in Australia.

Draconian says:

04:07pm | 08/10/12

Actually Joan, I couldn’t give a toss about American politics.  As for Gillard pfffft.  Have no voted labor and never will.

As for what you have seen Assange sprout off about - was that on TV - did it cover everything, or just bits and pieces that the news thought you should see. 
As for him changing the world, bit hard to do that when governments (even his own) want to hand him over to the americans so he can never be seen or heard from again.

If they have nothing to hide, then why the man hunt?

Nerdy McNerdnerd says:

01:19pm | 08/10/12

Not quite: Donkey Kong is owned by Nintendo (created by Miyamoto), but numerous non-NES ports were developed for a variety of platforms… including the Commodore.

As for me, I just can’t stand smug arseholes. Being a nerd doesn’t enter into it.

Marek says:

01:35pm | 08/10/12

I played Donkey Kong on PC around 1988, there was definitely a port available.

I have a soft spot for smug nerd genius types…

Ed says:

01:47pm | 08/10/12

Oh damn. You wouldn’t like me much then Amy.

PsychoHyena says:

03:05pm | 08/10/12

@Nerdy, the difference being that a smug nerdy a-hole has the advantage of not only knowing they know a lot but actually do know a lot.

amy says:

03:34pm | 08/10/12

@Nerdy McNerdnerd

@Marek

I orginally thourght of the SNES games (donkey kong country)...but then I remember the original arcade game which (for whatever reason) seemed like it could have had some kind of PC port….so yes my mistake

Elphaba says:

12:56pm | 08/10/12

I’m so glad I’m not the only one that thinks this.  I’m always afraid to comment on the Assange articles because of the people’s almost fanatical defense of him.

I watched the special last night.  All I saw was a self-absorbed twat cyber-criminal with an entitlement complex.  I don’t think the show portrayed him in a good light at all.  It was refreshing.

FINK says:

01:36pm | 08/10/12

@TheRealDave,
I personally don’t care for the person himself and if it was Tony Abbott, I would hold him up in the same austere that I hold in the symbolism of Assange even if he is an idiotic twat.
He has disclosed more than just the leaked cables of Manning for example
extrajudicial killings in Kenya
A report of toxic waste dumping on the coast of Côte d’Ivoire
Church of Scientology manuals (Tom is still ropable about this) Guantanamo Bay detention camp procedures
The 12 July 2007 Baghdad airstrike video
And material involving large banks such as Kaupthing and Julius Baer
Zimbabwe / Chinese weapons shipment documentation
as well as many other documents.
While he may not be the ideal poster boy for a messiah he has at least for us few who don’t wish to be ignorant to the governments and who don’t want to live with their heads in the sand a brief glimpse of the idiotic and corruptible heads of our society.
The only problem with Thomas Paine’s quote
“We have it in our power to begin the world over again.”
Is the governments are afraid to give power back to the people and the people are too ignorant and scared to ever accept it.

Jay says:

02:40pm | 08/10/12

Everything Dave said. Assange is taking all the fame and glory while Manning rots in a cell. It aint right.

Knemon says:

02:42pm | 08/10/12

Personally, I can’t think of another Australian (dead or alive) that fascinates me more than Assange does, the odd thing is, I don’t know why or what it is about him that I find fascinating. If that makes me stupid then fair enough. Curiously, the only other Australian that had a similar effect on me was Paul Keating…yeah, I must be stupid

Tubesteak says:

02:50pm | 08/10/12

The more people there are exposing the lies and corruption of government the better.

I only wish he was able to publish the truths about Area 51 and aliens. That would be cool.

TheRealDave says:

02:55pm | 08/10/12

@Fink you mean the doctored Apache helicopter strike?

Watch the full 23 minutes instead of the cut down wikileaks/MS Paint version.

TheRealDave says:

02:57pm | 08/10/12

@Tubesteak - everyone who knows ‘stuff’ will tell you that Area 51 is just a MaGuffin. Its Area 54 you want to look into…

*taps nose thrice*

Hmm….I can hear a helicopter coming overhead…..

Mick says:

03:03pm | 08/10/12

@Tubesteak Then he’d DEFS be extradited. To area 51. For experiments.

Student says:

03:09pm | 08/10/12

OMG Those bloody Che shirts. Every time I see one I want to tear it off with my bare hands.

PsychoHyena says:

03:11pm | 08/10/12

You realise that most people who defend Assange hate the guy, they just support his ideal of a free and open government and looking at many posts on The Punch, this is supported by nearly everyone.

The other side of it is that Assange is being taken seriously rather than a conspiracy theorist, this means he has gathered a lot of support from the disenfranchised masses.

Another Chris says:

03:20pm | 08/10/12

Did you actually watch the movie Dave/Elphaba? Doesn’t seem like it.

So- let’s just say for a moment he did actually attempt to reveal the truth about US War atrocities… how is that a bad thing? Trying to get the word out there that this was going on… to me was and is a noble thing. It appeared that he valued his anonymity initially..  he wasn’t trumpeting his name to the heavens. He was trying to get word out to the media with out disclosing or outing himself.  Yes.. it appears he was addicted to hacking. He’s most likely an information junkie, overly curious about the world around him and obviously nosey…
I’m no Assange fan boy but I have paid close attention to both sides of the argument and I for one can tell you the Swedish/American/British Arguments dont seem to hold much water.

TheRealDave says:

03:35pm | 08/10/12

I’m sorry…what ‘War Atrocities’ did he ‘fight’ or ‘risk his life’ to reveal??

Abu Ghraib, Haditha and other actual crimes etc got out through the Military members themselves…the only thing Wikileaks had was a heavily doctored MS Paint clip they tried to pass off as a ‘War Crime’ which was anything but.

marley says:

04:06pm | 08/10/12

@anotherChris - the Americans haven’t filed charges against Assange, so I’m not sure how you can be so sure they don’t hold water.  The British haven’t filed charges against Assange either (except maybe for jumping bail).  They have simply ruled that there is a valid arrest warrant and he has to go back to Sweden.  I’m not sure what part of the ruling of the original judge, the High Court Bench, or the Supreme Court bench, you think doesn’t hold water.  I for one think the British courts know more than we do about the ins and outs of extradition law.

As for the Swedish charges, I’ve got no idea and neither do. On the face of it, the charges seem tenuous, but surely that’s for the Swedish courts to decide.  After all, Assange isn’t the only alleged victim in this mess and the Swedish ladies deserve a hearing too.

Another Chris says:

04:18pm | 08/10/12

David,

If my research is anything to go off (other than the show)- then Julian Assange knew about the bombing of civillian targets and the casualty count before the US Government officially admitted to it. Not only that- he forecast a conflict coming in the gulf before the US officially declared War. I would call the bombing of Civilian targets atrocities, not just “co-lateral damage”

Sam says:

01:39pm | 08/10/12

I agree that the Prime Minister did the wrong thing. I’m certainly not defending her. But you have to admit, Assange is a very flawed character. And he is the public face of Wikileaks. It isn’t helpful.

Yves says:

02:38pm | 08/10/12

Was waiting for a little anti-US thread to pop up. Frankly, there are many more oppressive and closed regimes around the world. Wikileaks should be focusing more on them, not America.

TheRealDave says:

03:10pm | 08/10/12

*yawn*

The good old ‘but Senators in American were saying…..yadda yadda…’

For gods sake - have you SEEN their Senators?? They make Bob Katter look like he’s a bloody social visionary and an economic genius! Not to mention SANE!

Prod enough American Senators and you will get your Pauline Hanson-esque quote to justify just about anything. Doesn’t make it true or about to happen. No matter how much Assanges defence team would like you to beleive.

Best interview ever - SBS Morning programlast year sometime when the SBS news bloke made that shiela lawyer of his look absolutely stupid everytime she opened her mouth with one wild claim of death penalties and what not after another.  He kept asking her to back up with facts what she was saying - and she couldn’t. Highly entertaining. And I usually despise SBS.

willie says:

03:56pm | 08/10/12

I hope your trolling with your know/no shit.

paul says:

04:23pm | 08/10/12

@yves, Have you not been following Wikileaks attacking oppressive closed regimes is exactly what Assagne has done, Or did you miss the Arab spring Yves? The reason US is in the spotlight know is because there media and politicians have declared war on him. Do you follow the news Yves?
@ Sam I get your point, but your article is the 1,000th in a row about assagne. why another? If you really agree that the PM did the wrong thing why don’t you give us some variety and write about that? are you really making a mark as a journalist joining the crowd and pumping out another anti assagne article?

Reschs Monkey says:

01:46pm | 08/10/12

More transparent western regimes? So just how ‘open’ has the US been in its dealings with a whole swag of small countries, many of which have since bitten the hand that feeds.

How open was the ‘secret war’ in Laos, the propped-up dictatorships of southern and central America making war on their people, and of course the arming of Afghan insurgents during and after their struggle against the Russians.

marley says:

01:53pm | 08/10/12

Well, everyone knew the Americans were arming the mujaheddin to fight the Russians at the time. I don’t recall anything to suggest they armed them afterwards, certainly not from wikileaks.

M says:

03:15pm | 08/10/12

Monkey, America is hardly the most closed off regime out there. There are SO many worse countries, but Assange and Wikifreaks seem to have a perverse obsession with the US.

the cynic says:

04:18pm | 08/10/12

Zimbabwe, Sudan, Nigeria, and every other tinpot regime on the African Continent. Syria and the opposition, Syria and Iran against the world, Syria against Turkey, Russia and their fight with the Chechens and Muslim enclaves, Pakistan and the myriad of jihadists to name just a few who are safe in the knowledge that Wiki and Assange are not too bothered about exposes’ on their respective patches. Only the bad belligerent West seems to be the bogeyman. Yep! Assange certainly is the caped crusader of the oppressed and downtrodden. Moron cares little about the really dangerous and violent countries and their despot leaders.

marley says:

01:17pm | 08/10/12

@ChrisW - if you get yourself arrested in the UK, the Australian consul will provide you with a list of lawyers and offer to notify your family of your incarceration.  He will visit you from time to time to bring you “care packages” sent by your family to you cell, if you are so unlucky as not to have friends to bail you out.  That’s about it. 

I’m not sure what more you expect.  The consul is certainly not going to go the Brits and tell them that, because you’re an Aussie, their laws don’t apply and you should just be let go.  He’s not there to assist you in avoiding the legal system.  He’s there to make sure that you have the access any Brit would have to legal advice and decent treatment in the courts.  Nothing less, but nothing more, either.

ChrisW says:

01:53pm | 08/10/12

I am not talking about legal detention Marley. I am talking about illegal detention on a trumped up charge - not saying the Assange case is or is not that but am saying that the Australian government will do damn all if they don’t want to get involved.
Just don’t expect the government will help even if you have not broken the law - they will only help if it suits them.

marley says:

02:08pm | 08/10/12

@ChrisW - I’m not talking about “legal definitions,”  I’m talking about what Assange (or anyone else in his shoes) can expect if his is so unlucky as to run afoul of foreign legal systems.

In his case, there was a valid European Arrest Warrant which the British were required to execute by arresting him and extraditing him to Sweden.  That’s all the British case was ever about - whether the Swedish prosecutors trumped up the charges is for the Swedish courts to determine.

Obviously, Assange didn’t want to be extradited - but the job of fighting in the courts was up to him and his lawyers, not to the Australian government.  The only role the Consul could or should have in a country with a perfectly good legal system like the UK, is to keep a watching brief.

And if he ever is extradited to Sweden, the Consul’s role there will be similar:  to make sure Assange gets the same protections which would be afforded to a Swedish citizen facing the same charges.

DFAT will be more pro-active in countries with tenuous political or legal situations, where a citizen might not get access to a fair hearing.  You can hardly argue,  however, that, having gone through a court hearing and two levels of appeal, Assange was denied the chance to make his case.

Rose says:

02:29pm | 08/10/12

The Australian Government cannot and should not assist any Australian citizen to avoid complying with the law in any other country. All the Government can do is what Marley has outlined above. Just about everyone who has ever appeared in Court protests their innocence, it’s not the Government’s job to believe them, just to ensure that they get their day in Court..
I hope if you are ever in trouble overseas that you don’t kid yourself and think it’s anybody else’s responsibility except your own!

Noeleen says:

03:25pm | 08/10/12

I agree, with you ChrisW.  I think Assange is an ego-maniac, but, having said that, just like that other tool David Hicks (there really is no law against stupidity, which in reality was why he was held in Gitmo), they are both Australian citizens and should be assisted by the Australian Government. 

The whole Assange thing is just a bit off and seeing how the US have treated others like him with some pretty dodgy laws, I can understand his concern about going to Sweden and think that all this could have been nipped in the bud if the Aust Govt had just received an undertaking from the Swedish that he would not be extradited to the US.  Easy.  But they didn’t which seems a tad suss to me?  Regardless of how creepy the bloke is, he still deserves decent support & representation from our Country.

marley says:

03:55pm | 08/10/12

@Noleen - my point is, that Assange is getting the support which any other Australian would get.  It may not seem much to you, but Australia cannot intervene in either British or Swedish legal procedures.

Al says:

02:49pm | 08/10/12

Defs got the hair bang on. But he’s missing something… oh yes, the insufferable look of smug self-satisfaction.

Mick says:

02:20pm | 08/10/12

Because he is super-awesome-important and everyone needs to listen to him.

Greg says:

02:46pm | 08/10/12

Cause the un falls at the feat of every megalomaniacal a**hole.

marley says:

02:22pm | 08/10/12

@Lucas - he is the subject of a European Arrest Warrant which the British are obligated to execute.  He has appealed the arrest warrant, and has lost all the way up through the British legal system.  It is not up to Assange to determine the conditions under which he will be questioned;  the courts have already decided that for him.

Sam says:

02:14pm | 08/10/12

We clearly didn’t read the same story on News… http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/television/julian-assange-a-big-winner-for-ten/story-e6frfmyi-1226490416298

Ryan says:

03:16pm | 08/10/12

Snap.

marley says:

03:58pm | 08/10/12

If you read Sam’s link, you’ll see that the telemovie got 1.4 million viewers, and the documentary on Assange got 700k or so. I guess we prefer docu-dramas to the real thing.

Pete says:

02:25pm | 08/10/12

You sly dog.

firefly says:

04:04pm | 08/10/12

Agreed Al, i was thinking the same.

K2 says:

04:34pm | 08/10/12

As opposed to an automaton drone that thinks government only lies to you to protect you?

marley says:

06:15pm | 08/10/12

Actually, he isn’t. I recall real reporters, on front lines in Viet Nam, Afghanistan and elsewhere, giving the lie to what governments were saying.  They were the ones producing an alternative view of the world, with the evidence and the context to back it up.  America lost faith in the VIet Nam war because of what it saw for guys out there with the troops or in the villages.  Assange is a dilettante in comparison to the real poster-boys who ducked the shells to get the story.