Of all the sick and creepy subcultures that flourish on the internet, few are more disturbing than the pro-ana websites devoted to the celebration of anorexia - not as a mental illness but a lifestyle choice.

Possibly a slightly confusing message in this ad campaign. Pic: Supplied

There are dozens of these shocking sites. Some of them are big-production numbers with well-designed photo galleries of scrawny models and external links to websites selling food substitutes and appetite suppressants.

Many of them are just sad little blogs by individual women who diarise their battle with their own body and share tips on how best to emaciate themselves.

I came across these websites for the first time a few weeks ago while reading a story about Kate Middleton unwittingly becoming the latest pin-up girl for the pro-ana movement.

Recent photographs of the duchess looking particularly thin have been hailed on pro-ana websites as an example of what women can and should look like with a bit of self-discipline.

The problem, of course, is that in holding up the naturally thin Kate as an example for every woman who is destined to be a perfectly normal size 12 or 14 or 16, these websites are subjecting their readers to a dangerous guilt trip that can easily result in an eating disorder.

What is worse is that most of these websites dispute the very notion that anorexia nervosa or bulimia are eating disorders at all. They feature image galleries under the title Thinspiration, where users can admire photographs of the most gaunt and malnourished models. In these dreadful galleries, Kate Middleton looks quite voluptuous against the most coveted women who appear as if they had walked straight out of a concentration camp.

I won’t name any of the websites I looked at, as I certainly don’t intend this piece to be a handy user guide for aspiring anorexics. To give you a sense of what they contain, one of the larger sites I read started with the following misleading warning: ``Remember, this site is for entertainment purposes. Seek medical help if you feel you have an eating disorder’‘. Right below this warning were a series of links to the websites diet section, where topics included ``How to hide an eating disorder’’ and ``Tips to curb appetite’‘.

Readers were urged to make a hot tea out of cayenne pepper which bloats the stomach and suppresses appetite.

Brazilian cocoa and seaweed are also good. Smoking, of course, is highly recommended. If you still find your tummy rumbling, just punch it really hard. Other sites had advice on how best to make yourself vomit and how to use laxatives to induce diarrhoea and dehydration.

In the microscopically calibrated world of the anorexic, women are encouraged not only to drink nothing but water, but to drink ice cold water, as the body expends a teeny bit more energy when the digestive system warms it up.

If the pro-ana movement has a heroine it is Kate Moss, whose ill-advised comment to a fashion website a few years ago that ``nothing tastes as good as skinny feels’’ has become a mantra across this subculture.

Moss said at the time that her quotes were taken out of context but they have taken off across the net, with young women being urged to repeat the words to themselves whenever a pang of hunger strikes.

The disturbing thing about all this dangerous information is that you don’t have to go to a pro-ana website to find it. Google will take you there. A young woman who has no knowledge of these websites simply needs to type the words ``lose weight’’ into Google - a pretty popular search term for women you would think - and the search engine will present them with plenty of pro-ana sites clogged with the deadliest diet information.

In Spain a couple of years ago, Microsoft shut down four Spanish-language pro-ana websites, one of which was offering a prize to the reader who ate the fewest calories that month.

About 10 years ago, Yahoo shut down a couple after Oprah Winfrey did a show about anorexia and examined some of these websites.

While it grates with free-speech sensibilities, it is very difficult to see what redeeming value these websites have at all.

The Federal Government, through Communications Minister Stephen Conroy, had canvassed the introduction of a net filter to blacklist extreme pornographic and terrorist websites.

Personally I can see no reason why websites that encourage young women to embrace an eating disorder as a way of life should escape such a ban if the filter were ever introduced.

One report in a psychiatric journal stated that anorexia had the highest mortality rate of any mental illness, with 20 per cent of sufferers dying from the disease. That in itself seems a decent reason to shut off access to these screwed-up sites.

206 comments

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    • Erick says:

      06:00am | 05/09/11

      Censorship is far more harmful to society than even the most offensive website. It is shameful for someone who makes a living by spouting opinions to call for the opinions of others to be banned.

    • marley says:

      07:13am | 05/09/11

      Much as I deplore these sites, I have to agree with you there.  I wonder, though, if it wouldn’t be possible to pursue some of them in civil court for the damage they do to individuals.  After all, if your free expression of speech directly incites riots or mass murder, you’re going to be in court;  why should this be different?

    • Adam Diver says:

      08:23am | 05/09/11

      You would say that Erick, when this filter comes in, you will be one of the first people black listed smile

      I never get the horror and disgust of anorexia, whilst we simultaneously celebrate plus size models and the like.

    • Tina says:

      09:13am | 05/09/11

      Mind you, Adam Diver, plus sized model could mean model with a size 10 or 12, which is actually a healthy weight. So the “plus sized” is deceiving. But I get your point. Fat or skinny - both extremes are bad.

    • Casey says:

      09:37am | 05/09/11

      Spot on Erick!!

      The line between Government protection and government controll is a fine line indeed, and censoring these sorts of sites seems about 18 steps over the line!  A bit extreme to even suggest it, if I’m honest.  It marrs the rest of the (far more reasonable) article with a hint of over-reaction.

      It’s unfortunate that in a 19 paragraph article, the last few seem to have taken a turn from reasonable indignation to somewhere more…  extreme.

    • Cat says:

      10:44am | 05/09/11

      have to agree, censorship is not the answer.

    • Peter says:

      11:40am | 05/09/11

      not “website”.  websites.

      Erick, go study law and learn more about what you’re actually talking about.  Come back and then give us your opinion.  Until then it’s pretty much useless to the rest of us.

    • Erick says:

      01:32pm | 05/09/11

      @Peter - If you want to play the grammar nazi smartarse, it’s wise to know something about grammar first. My first sentence was correct - unlike your first two, which lack capitals.

      As for knowledge of the law, that’s not required in this case - since I am arguing principles, not legal technicalities.

      Better luck next time.

    • Kate says:

      08:16pm | 05/09/11

      Completely agreed. Censorship is not the answer. If someone is identified as being at risk of an eating disorder, they need access to psychiatric help. Being banned from visiting a website will not help.

    • Bruce says:

      12:26am | 06/09/11

      Censorship is not the answer. It will just create an underground cult. Then it becomes ‘real cool’.

    • AJ says:

      08:36am | 06/09/11

      Erick, normally I agree with many of your statements be they dry, laced with cynicism but in the end certain harsh truths. Though in this case, what do you say about websites with content encouraging and condoning animal cruelty, actions of organized violence against others and those where pedophilia is celebrated? Shouldn’t these sick sites be removed? I understand this argument is a can of worms because once it starts where are the lines drawn, however there are websites out there whose intentions are clearly beyond all lines of intelligent humanity. Should sites in this category be left to evolve into ... who knows what ???

    • Roobz says:

      12:25pm | 07/09/11

      Censorship is a sword of damacles but certainly has itslace on the internet.  There are some images and concepts that due to their harmful content must not be made available.  If this website were advocating murder or cannibalism would you feel the same way?  How about domestic violence or female circumcision?  I see very little difference in the type of harm women are experiencing from negative body image and the beauty myth.  I was bulimic for many years as a teenage male and am only now experiencing severe problems with my digestive tract, not to mention dental bills from acid wear.

    • Tina says:

      07:13am | 05/09/11

      My brother used to say about Kate Moss “you dont want to f*** her, you want to feed her”. I have not met one man that prefers a dangerously skinny body (along with the obsession) over a healthy body.

      As for censorship, I dont think it would help the matter. The problem with censorship is always that you dont know where to stop. Information on anorexia is important, so what is information and what is advertising?

    • Slothy says:

      08:22am | 05/09/11

      “My brother used to say about Kate Moss “you dont want to f*** her, you want to feed her”. I have not met one man that prefers a dangerously skinny body (along with the obsession) over a healthy body.”

      Or how about we just forget caring about what men want our bodies to look like, and concentrate on what makes us feel happy and healthy and confident, whatever size that might be? As much as I hate the pressure to be unhealthily thin, ‘real men like curves so you should look like that!’ is just as annoying.

    • Tina says:

      08:52am | 05/09/11

      Fair comment Slothy, and I know anorexia is not necessarily about feeling attractive but goes quite a bit deeper. And I know you cant generalise what men like in women or vice versa. All I meant to express was those young girls (or boys) should give themselves a break from being overcritical with their own bodies. Enjoy life and stay healthy.

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      10:15am | 05/09/11

      “Or how about we just forget caring about what men want our bodies to look like”

      Yeah because men drive anorexia. Men hen peck one another into eating disorders. Men buy fashion magazines idolising concave chested automatons. Men obsess over the yo yo diets of celebrities. Men run the pro-ana industry. Men are horrible.

    • Lloyd says:

      10:32am | 05/09/11

      I think Kate Moss is a repulsive creature. You can imagine going to embrace her and her bones shattering. That comment she made was very irresponsible.

    • Katie says:

      11:53am | 05/09/11

      @ Tina. I think the focus on what your brother or other men think is part of the problem. As long as girls are raised to see themselves primarily as objects of desire for men, as opposed to autonomous human beings who deserve a healthy body regardless of what men or anyone else thinks of them, then the problem will persist.

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      12:18pm | 05/09/11

      The problem will continue until women learn to stop trading on their looks for an easy life. Perhaps women could even hold themselves accountable to the responsibilities of “equality” instead of just reaping the benefits. I won’t be holding my breath.

    • Tina says:

      12:26pm | 05/09/11

      @ Katie

      My brother was making fun of the skinny movement so I think he is doing quite well as a bloke. He would always prefer a strong and devoted partner that loves his kids over a few kilos. And I think so do most men. We should not blame men for girls that are starving themselves. I have never met a guy that wants his girl to stop eating.

    • Slothy says:

      01:07pm | 05/09/11

      SSR, I’m not saying that men cause anorexia, it has much deeper and more complex causes that are only partially related to the rest of my comment. I’m just saying that ‘eat a sandwich ‘cause dudes dig curves’ is not a constructive rebuttal to a ‘starve yourself because dudes love skinny chicks’. As Katie says, it just continues the idea that women are primarily an object of desire for men. It’s like the guy who thinks he’s so progressive for saying he hates women that wear too much make up, so they should only go natural. He’s still imposing his own preferences on a woman; the correct answer is that she should wear as much makeup as she feels like wearing.

      I’m advocating for women to take control of their own body images by forgetting what men may or may not prefer and focusing on what makes them feel good about themselves. This includes not listening to all the media and fashion magazines who try to tell you what you should look like to maximise your desireability. Men are not inherently the problem. The idea, enforced by both women and men, that women should change themselves to fit to a mythical male ideal, is.

    • egg says:

      02:16pm | 05/09/11

      @sad reality, so you make a complaint about how women are blaming this all on men… then turn around and blame the whole issue on women. wow, good move!

      you know, it says more about the type of woman you go for if they’re trading on their looks to get ahead, than it does about women in general. maybe lift your standards?

    • St. Michael says:

      02:17pm | 05/09/11

      Put it this way: when a woman asks “does my bum look big in this”, it’s generally not because the bloke has said or dared to suggest anything along those lines previously in their relationship.

      Men might trigger some of the beauty slavery, but women to a large extent keep themselves in the chains.

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      03:39pm | 05/09/11

      @Slothy. I love how your conception of freedom is a woman only wearing as much make-up as she feels.

      A lot of women get treated like sex objects because that is how they want to be treated. You don’t wear an inch thick skirt and sky high heels because you want someone to ask you about Newtonian physics. You do it because you know trading in sex is your best means of getting ahead.

      Typical case of women taking absolutely no responsibility for their actions. You can’t coldly sexualise yourself for personal gain and then cry foul when men begin to conceive of you as coldly sexual. Want men to see women as truly equal? How about offering real equality, which includes taking responsibility for myopic behaviour and base superficiality.

      When most women’s big dream in life is to grace the cover of Vogue, excuse us men for thinking you’re shallow. Women could change the state of play tomorrow if they so chose. We both know they will not. Whack on a bit of lippy, jam the breasts together, hitch up the skirt and seduce the rich guy for a life of unearned leisure: every attractive woman’s superannuation strategy.

      @Egg. My point wasn’t about generalising, it was about assigning blame correctly. In this case, women are 100% culpable.

      The only women I have ever met who don’t trade on their looks to get ahead are unattractive women. Attractive women always use their looks to manipulate men into giving them what they want, which is always money. All women would do the same if they could. Women and ethics seldom co-exist - and by seldom I mean I’ve never met an ethical woman.

    • Tina says:

      04:05pm | 05/09/11

      @ SSR

      So attractive women are manipulative whores and ugly women are decent? That was the worst comment I read in a long while

    • Slothy says:

      04:14pm | 05/09/11

      Whoops, I forgot SSR was a troll again. More fool me.

    • egg says:

      05:31pm | 05/09/11

      @sad sad reality, clearly you’re set in your views, which is fine… i must’ve just avoided meeting most of the women you know. there are idiots out there (hell, i often tell people “chicks are weird”, and i *am* one), but if you’re honestly saying that the only women who aren’t manipulative gold-diggers are the unattractive ones (which would be unattractive in your opinion, obviously, not necessarily everyone else’s), then you’re just being facetious.

      then again, perhaps your attitude is one of jealousy… as in, the good-looking ladies aren’t interested in you, therefore they’re all bitches. see? am i generalising or “correctly assigning blame”? wink

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      05:34pm | 05/09/11

      Tina, I never said ugly women were virtuous.

    • G Stret says:

      07:20pm | 05/09/11

      @SSR: “When most women’s big dream in life is to grace the cover of Vogue, excuse us men for thinking you’re shallow.”

      I think you need to meet more women. How utterly patronising a generalisation! “Most” women? Of all 3 billion of them? You *do* get around. A double standard exists, in which women can be called “fat” for being a size 10 & men still think they’re attractive witha bald head & a beer gut!

      At the end of the day, you’re saying that all attractive women are whores - and that all “ugly” women would be if they had the chance! Was mummy very very mean to you?

    • Ed says:

      07:52am | 06/09/11

      I agree with SSR in spirit. Perhaps there is a little too much generalisation there, but women do use their looks (as they should!), but then seem to externalise the consequences of that… take ownership, people and stop blaming the whole world for what can be more easily fixed by looking inside yourselves…

      I’m happy to say that I HAVE met beautiful women who are beautiful inside-out. They are morally upright, hardworking, caring, genuine, adventurous and love living life. And yes, they are definitely amongst the most ethical people I know and would NEVER use their looks to get ahead because they are proud of their abilities and want to be judged for them alone…

      Don’t get me wrong, I think people like this guy on TV calling someone who is size 8 fat are being absurd, but the reality is that men are not what drive this behaviour. I agree with SSR’s comment that it is the fashion magazines and the peer pressure that are a far bigger factor.

      Anyway, the only men who hold the view are fashion types that like coat hangers, but real bodies… most of them aren’t that into women anyway!

    • Snake says:

      12:13pm | 06/09/11

      Perhaps if women concentrated more on what MEN prefer them to look like, instead of what WOMEN and the fashion industry want them to look like, they would be a whole lot happier.

      Ever seen a straight man complain about a few curves or tell you that you look like “overstuffed luggage”? I think not. Women are their own worst enemies. Kate moss made that comment, not some bloke. The fashion industry drives them all to be competitive little whores and then they turn around and blame men when their diets don’t work because they lack the discipline.

      Men are the ones that told you you don’t need that diet in the first place. You will find that men are far more tolerant of a woman’s body than other women are. Personally, if you have curves and know how to carry them, that confidence is far more attractive than a thin girl who’s not sure of herself.

      Maybe for Kate Moss “nothing tastes as good as skinny feels” but I tell you now, I’d rather “feel” a curvy chick than I would one of those fashion models.

    • L. says:

      07:17am | 05/09/11

      Perfectly “normal” size 16..??

      Really..?? Humans are supposed to be a size 16 with proper diet and exercise..?

    • marley says:

      07:30am | 05/09/11

      Some women are - if you’re six feet tall (and quite a few women these days are) size 16 is not all that outrageous.  If you’re 5’3”” on the other hand, you’ve got a problem.

    • Tina says:

      07:38am | 05/09/11

      I struggled with that comment as well. Size 16 doesnt sound too healthy to me.

      But generally I think we have to be careful as both extremes have made us a little intolerant. People come in different sizes and “healthy” does not mean all have to be one size. Not everyone that is slim is anorexic and not everyone that is a size 14 will be a burden on the health system.

    • KH says:

      07:43am | 05/09/11

      It is in the ‘normal’ range depending on height.  Obviously if you are 140cm tall and are a size 16 you are overweight.  But if you are 183cm size 16 might be normally proportioned…....

    • Hank says:

      08:17am | 05/09/11

      Healthy bodies are guided by BMI not weight.  Its interesting that taller people often use their height as an excuse to be too fat.  If you have a fat percentage of anything near or above 20% you are over weight.  Pure fact, deal with it and choose your lifestyle but dont make excuses for a weakness that has an adverse effect on your health and is a burden on society

    • Markus says:

      08:34am | 05/09/11

      Can’t say I’ve met many girls 183cm tall that weren’t either basketballers or volleyballers.
      Not a lot of size 16s among that lot.

    • Casey says:

      09:46am | 05/09/11

      I met a Danish girl the other day that was an even 6 foot.  She told me that where she’s from, that’s “normal” for a woman.

      On another note:  It’s worth noting that nowdays when you are measuring your body fat percentage, they often list “normal” and “ideal” as two seperate areas on the chart - because nowadays normal doesn’t mean healthy!  Just because the “average” person is a size 16 doesn’t mean we should be advocating size 16s, to make people feel good.  It might just mean we need to be advocating size 12s and 14s, because that’s what’s HEALTHY for the “average” person.

      PS - BMI is very very often misleading.  unusual muscle mass, or bone structure make your results just plain wrong.

    • Shane says:

      09:51am | 05/09/11

      @Hank - no discussion person who wants talk about weight can refer to the BMI and expect to be taken seriously.
      Most professional sportspeople are considered overweight or obese on that scale. It is a nonsense guide and any medical professional that’s not a quack will confirm this.

    • Markus says:

      11:53am | 05/09/11

      “Most professional sportspeople are considered overweight or obese on that scale.”
      The overwhelming majority of the population are not professional sportspeople.
      Claiming that it is complete nonsense on the basis that it does not apply to 1% of the population is also complete nonsense.

    • Tim says:

      12:36pm | 05/09/11

      Marcus,
      the BMI is good for cohort analysis but is very poor for individual analysis.
      Using BMI to decide whether someone is a healthy weight is foolish.

    • Rock & Hard Place says:

      01:05pm | 05/09/11

      Correct me if I am wrong Hank, but “Healthy bodies are guided by BMI not weight” is a strange thing to say when BMI is worked out by dviding your weight by height?

    • KB says:

      02:01pm | 05/09/11

      BMI is at best an extremely rough guide and in no way should be used as a definitive guide.  Hank, you’ve even contradicted yourself by then going on to use fat percentage to back up your BMI statement.

      BMI does not take into account fat percentage.  As a 183cm male, my healthy weight according to BMI is around 75kgs.  I have a larger frame and at that weight I would resemble an anorexic myself.  I actually weigh around 100kg which according to BMI is well into the obese category, but I run, lift weights and work in a physically demanding job.  I could certainly stand to lose a couple of kilos but I don’t need to lose 25.

    • Tina says:

      02:13pm | 05/09/11

      Why do you need some form of measurement to tell you if you are healthy? Do we really need to debate about this? I think we all know fairly well if we live a healthy lifestyle or not - without putting it into numbers.

    • Mr GG says:

      11:36am | 06/09/11

      @Hank
      LOLZ
      by the BMI index every body builder is obese, to be healthy under the BMI you have to be a twig, any muscle and you overweight.
      As KB said any man with a decent frame will never fit into the weakling index. Problem with averages is that they are just that so completely pointless in the real world because how can you compare a Maori body type to a Chinese one?

    • NESLIHAN KUROSAWA says:

      07:31am | 05/09/11

      Hi David,

      I find this topic particularly sad, because of the way it targets the very young girls at their most vulnerable & impressionable age group. To think that they actually happen to have an audience & huge market for the sole purpose of brain washing these young girls, is so wrong at so many different levels.  And we are not taking about the surface & cosmetic side of all these images.  I guess in a way they are trying to make a statement.  About what, I wonder?

      There is so much negative publicity out in the media about the problems associated with being overweight & obese.  This also happens to be so unhealthy that all major & vital internal organs will shut down eventually, one by one.  It is a bit like dying slowly.  However, there does not seem to be any cure & treatment in sight which will work for these young girls, unless they are willing & able to actually want to get better!!  What a way to make money & actually consider making a profit from such a cause!!  Best regards to your editors.

    • mark says:

      07:34am | 05/09/11

      a bit of grandstanding and more publicity for them, sure they’d be loving the attention.

    • Rossco says:

      07:36am | 05/09/11

      So you’re pro-net filter Penbo? That’s just another faulty poorly thought out doomed to fail Labor policy.

      Banning websites is not the answer at all. Besides it will be too difficult to ban and will drive these websites underground.

    • Fiddler says:

      07:46am | 05/09/11

      Yeah I don’t really see how the websites are gonna change anything. They will either be anorexic or not. It’s like blaming suicide websites for people offing themselves. However your comment about “a normal size 12 or 14 or 16” I would say size 12 is the highest normal weight unless you are very tall. Most women (and men too) are too fat end of story.
      If you wouldn’t let your root-buddy look at you naked, you probably need to lose weight.

    • Tina says:

      09:10am | 05/09/11

      Gosh, it would be very sad if you didnt like for your partner or “root-buddy” to see you naked. And although you might get some negative responses to that it is actually quite a good indicator. Scr*w sizes and bmi. If you are honestly confident with your body, youre probably just right the way you are. If not, you might want to change something. I hope people are now not going to start argumenting with “but what if its not weight? what if i have a huge scar over my bum that makes me selfconcious?”

    • Alicia says:

      11:34am | 05/09/11

      “If you wouldn’t let your root-buddy look at you naked, you probably need to lose weight.”

      I think that’s a pretty shitty statement. Plenty of healthy sized men and women don’t like being seen naked, should they lose weight? Sometimes it’s just a self-esteem thing. I’m happy for my fiance to look at me naked, does that mean I don’t need to lose weight? Hell no! I do need to lose weight and I’m currently doing that.

    • Fiddler says:

      03:18pm | 05/09/11

      @Tina, that’s what I’m getting at. Most overweight ppl who claim to be happy about their weight would struggle to answer that question.

      @Alicia - because it normally relates to how they really feel about themselves. I’m a bit of a fitness snob, but only because I get sick of overweight/unfit individuals who loudly proclaim crap like “real women have curves”.
      I remember growing up I was fairly thin and adults would always make stupid comments about “oh geez you’re skinny” etc, but for some reason got offended when I replied “oh geez you’re fat”

    • Kaye says:

      01:43pm | 06/09/11

      @ Fiddler, The worst thing to come out of this weight debate in recent years is the ‘real women have curves’ statement. Disregarding the fact that there are different body types and that some women simply aren’t made to have cuves, what really annoys me is when that phrase is being used to celebrate people who are incredibly obese. “curves” doesn’t mean rolls of fat all over your body, it means (assuming this isn’t your natural body shape) not having a skeletal body that has more in common with a 10 year old boy than a woman!

    • L. says:

      07:52am | 05/09/11

      “The Federal Government, through Communications Minister Stephen Conroy, had canvassed the introduction of a net filter to blacklist extreme pornographic and terrorist websites.”

      No…

      The Federal Government, through Communications Minister Stephen Conroy, had canvassed the introduction of a net filter to blacklist things that are by and large legal to own and view. RC (Refused classification) is not illegal by default. I would hardly consider two consenting adults dripping hot wax on each other as “extreme” porn, or Youtube graffiti videos (also RC) as extreme anything.

    • James says:

      07:56am | 05/09/11

      Time to ban the sickos who would sacrifice liberty for ... for the privilege of infantilising women. Gosh, that really is a two-fer-one fail isn’t it?

    • JS says:

      12:49pm | 05/09/11

      can i just point out to all, this is not just a woman problem. there is a frightening increase in men with Anorexia and Bulemia. in the interest of fairness we need to focus on them.
      As eating disorders have predominantly been a womans problem in the past, male sufferers are being ignored.
      This wrong needs to be righted before its too late to help the men going down this road

    • Markus says:

      01:44pm | 05/09/11

      @JS, given that only about half a percent of women suffer from anorexia nervosa, and only a fraction of that amount again for men, I think you have a very different definition of ‘frightening’ than most people.

    • JS says:

      02:42pm | 05/09/11

      @ Markus - the problem is that men never admit to there being a problem and so it goes unrecognised/diagnosed. we dont know how many men are living with eating disorders, thats the scary part

    • Mr GG says:

      11:43am | 06/09/11

      @JS
      there is bigger problem with men’s body image and it’s steroid abuse, I know 19 year olds that cant get it up with out Viagra, which is pretty bad. we will see real compounded problems in a few years because of it.

    • Loz says:

      08:07am | 05/09/11

      As someone who has suffered from Anorexia, I am glad to see people denouncing these websites.

      I am a true believer in the ‘health at any size’ movement and would encourage all of you to look into it.  Promoting Anorexia is abominable, but so is discriminating against someone because you think they’re bigger than they should be.

    • Tina says:

      09:19am | 05/09/11

      Of course we find these sites terrible! The question is though - and you might be best to answer it as a former sufferer of anorexia - would banning these websites help? Would it keep young girls from becoming anorexic?

    • Emily says:

      09:59am | 05/09/11

      Tina - I don’t think so.
      I too suffered from anorexia.

      It started off banning certian foods - potato chips, lollies, cake etc.
      Then as I got skinnier and liked all the comments that people were giving me it became worse.. I could only eat 30 grams of fat…. then 15. And then no fat.
      I wouldn’t eat breakfast - becuase I was too busy in the mornings… I didn’t need the internet to tell me that eating less = looking skinnier… I even claimed to be allergic to gluten when people questioned why I wasn’t eating…. All of this was from the nutrition advice that I had learnt at school or from reading magazines…

      Granted it only started 5 years ago and I know that these websites were around but I never looked at them… But it may help some girls but I don’t think that it’s the cause….

      But now what do we do/say about the size 10 model who has been called fat…?

    • Tina says:

      10:34am | 05/09/11

      @ Emily

      Thanks for your comment. I would think so too: Websites are not making you more or less anorexic.

      I read about the size 8 model being too fat this morning. Its an endless debate. I wonder why being a model would be anything worth achieving anyway? How about going to uni and making a degree and then selling your knowledge instead of your body?

      Good on you for having come so far.

    • DS says:

      10:43am | 05/09/11

      I agree with Emily… the websites are just a good place for anorexic girls to go for a bit of companionship - they don’t give girls eating disorders. Mine started in high school, as a means of controlling SOMETHING,  at a time when I felt that I had no control over anything in my life. It was not because I wanted to be skinny. It took many years to recover from that.

      Anorexia can begin due to a vast number of reasons. Some girls stop eating because thay want to look like models. Some girls do it as a means of displaying self control, as I did, another girl I know did it as a means of protest at first, then found that she could not stop.

      Banning websites will do absolutely nothing to prevent anorexia cases. They aren’t good/healthy for girls by any means, but by the time a girl goes out looking for such a website, it’s already too late. There were cases of anorexia even in the middle ages - those girls were lauded as “saints” for being able to transcend the bounds of the body, to be closer to Christ. Anorexia, in other words, often has little to do with the media or internet.

      Re the size 8/10 model that was told she’s too fat on Australia’s next Top model… obviously the girl is beautiful and certainly not remotely “fat”. But she is also incredibly silly to think that the industry she had chosen to participate in, will become something that it’s not, even for the sake of saving face to the general public.

      While it’s awful and cruel and often unhealthy, the fashion industry is what it is. They look not for “real women” to represent their products, they look for “muses” or, caricatures (ideas embodied in a girl). I’m not really sure how to explain it… but the reality is, they will hire the girl who can sell the product, and unfortunately, the average mum or girl-next-door simply won’t be able to achieve that. Women are weird little creatures, we may yell and carry on about how we would like to look at “real women” in our magazines, but the reality is that when it’s tried out by a mag, they simply don’t sell the copies that a thin, weird and “fabulous” little freak of a girl will. I know I’ll probably get blasted for this, but money talks, not morals. At least not in this world.

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      11:22am | 05/09/11

      “we may yell and carry on about how we would like to look at “real women” in our magazines, but the reality is…”

      Women say one thing and mean another. Anorexia will never leave us for it is too effective a means of women competing with one another. Look at Princess Catherine (i.e Waity Katey), she is shrinking by the day to jam her superiority down the throats of average women. And they love her for it.

    • Tina says:

      11:50am | 05/09/11

      @ Sad Sad Reality

      I dont think Kate has lost weight to jam it down our throats.

      I wonder to what extend you can blame society for anorexia anyway. Have the cases of anorexia increased since we have slim models? Or is it just more out in the open now?

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      12:20pm | 05/09/11

      Tina, she wants to be an icon by being ‘better’ than women like yourself. And nothing says ‘better’ than a size 0 waist.

    • Tina says:

      12:32pm | 05/09/11

      @ Sad Sad Reality

      I obviously dont know her in person and I think neither do you? Maybe the poor thing is just stressed? Not every weight loss is a war declaration on other women.

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      12:47pm | 05/09/11

      Stressed? Seriously?

    • Karen says:

      02:24pm | 05/09/11

      I have been suffering from Bullimia for nearly 11 years. I have only just started treatment for this recently so I am currently still suffering this. I have been obese for most of my life and I would say my disorder stems from people telling me I am too fat in school. I have lost 50kg and am currently very thin and people tell me I am looking great now and to keep up with the good work. I was healthier when I was a size 16 than I am now at 8/10. I do use these websites to order appetite supressants and to get tips. Banning them will just make people go elsewhere.

    • DS says:

      03:34pm | 05/09/11

      SSR is right. Throughout highschool (all-girls school), dieting was indeed used as a means of competing against each other. That’s exactly what I meant with my earlier comment - women say they want to look at “real women” in mags/fashion runways, but in reality, if the industry usess “real” (read size 10+ instead of size 0) women, they lose sales. I think that this speaks far more truly of the mentality that some women have and push out onto others. Not all, of course, far from it, but the couple of insecure, b*tchy girls who tell other girls “you’re fat” or “you’re flat-chested” etc etc are a far greater cause of anorexia, plastic surgery, you name it, in their classmates compared to the thin girl in a Gucci advert in a mag, for instance.
      I honestly cannot say how/where this comes from, but there is an inherent need to compete, among women. men compete too, but on different platforms. For heaven’s sake, we girls buy clothes from certain overpriced brands—> WHY? certainly not because your bf/husband gives a toss about whether you’re wearing a $30 pair of shoes or a $900 pair of shoes (assuming it wasn’t his wallet that paid for them lol). It’s your friends, peers and even random women on the street that most girls try to impress. Whether that way of thinking is spawned by media or our mothers or hormones, I don’t know, but it’s certainly there!

    • Emily says:

      03:49pm | 05/09/11

      Well said DS…

    • Tina says:

      04:10pm | 05/09/11

      @ DS and SSR

      I am speechless about your perception of women. You must really hate us. Ever thought that a 900 dollar dress is as well better quality than a 30 dollar dress? If you blame us for expensive shoes, then dont get me started at cars ad TV sizes. Dont think men are different and more ethical than women. And not every woman sells herself. Something must really bug you two.

    • Loz says:

      09:01am | 06/09/11

      I don’t think these websites cause girls to become Anorexic - eating disorders aren’t that black and white.

      I am NOT for internet censorship, but I think maybe these sites should be banned.  If banning these sites could help save one life, then it would be worth it.

    • kaye says:

      01:52pm | 06/09/11

      @DS “the websites are just a good place for anorexic girls to go for a bit of companionship - they don’t give girls eating disorders”

      They may not give girls eating disorders but it’s worse than simply a bit of ‘companionship’. Don’t you think constantly surrounding yourself with people who say you look better now you’re 40kg, and teach you how to hide your disorder from your friends and family is dangerous? It isn’t some support group for skinny girls to go hang out on, they’re dangerous sites and they make it far more difficult to help girls get better.

      I’m not saying censorship is the answer, I’m not at all a fan of the idea of banning any sites. But you have to concede to the danger that these sites present, not necessarily to healthy girls perhaps wanting to be a little skinnier, but to the girls (and guys) already spiraling downward who find support with people who foster dangerous ways of thought.

    • DS says:

      03:38pm | 06/09/11

      @ Tina—I hate women? Hardly. I am a woman. But you must be blind not to see that most of the pressure and competition to be thin, comes from other women, not men. I have NEVER been told by a man that I’m not good enough/pretty enough/thin or busty enough, however plenty of other women have made those comments to other women, myself included. I also never said that men are more ethical. I said that they compete ondifferent platforms (tvs, cars etc being a good example). Let me ask you a question - have you ever heard a man tell another man that he’s fat or give another bloke b*tchy criticism for his appearence in general? Perhaps I did not express myself clearly enough, but I think you mistake what I am trying to say here.

      And yes, Kaye, I wholeheartedly agree that those websites are dangerous, but banning them won’t help girls with eating disorders. Again, when I say that they seek out these sites for companionship, I am in no way suggesting that this is a good thing. But I stand by my earlier comment - by the time they seek out these websites, these girls are generally well beyond the “I’m just looking for healthy diet tips” stage - they generally, are already well into the throws of an eating disorder. Banning them would simply drive these kids underground.

      When I went through my issues with food, such websites didn’t exist - this companionsip that I mention was found among schoolfriends and often in the actual rehab clinics. Most of my methods to hide my problems, I obtained in the anorexia ward. So yes, they aren’t a healthy thing for girls to see, but really, banning them is not the answer. Teaching kids at school and at home, how to cope with stress, pressure and day-to-day teenage angst would be a much better start.

    • Kaye says:

      05:38pm | 06/09/11

      @DS
      I definitely agree that banning the sites isn’t a way to solve the issue, and I think that most girls who are just looking for weight loss tips would probably click right past one of these sites. I think my main reason for commenting was because a lot of the people commenting don’t seem to recognise the difference between a girl (or boy) suffering from an eating disorder and someone just wanting to look think and “attractive”. These websites may not cause anorexia, but when you’re already vulnerable they certainly don’t help you get the help you need.

      But yes, censorship won’t do anything. Like someone said below, their sister traded tips with a fellow ED sufferer at hospital. They’ll always find a way. I think parents should definitely install their own blocks though, I’m not sure how easy/hard it’d be with these sorts of webpages but it’s probably something they should try. But yeah, general censorship, not so much!

    • Geordie says:

      08:23am | 05/09/11

      “The Federal Government, through Communications Minister Stephen Conroy, had canvassed the introduction of a net filter to blacklist extreme pornographic and terrorist websites.”

      Not quite.  The filter is intended to block refused classification material which is this, but anything else the classification board decides couldn’t be rated R if it were a film (because under Australian law the Internet is a film).

      If you’re calling for this, you’re calling for films which touch on the issue as well to be banned (test cases have shown that discussing it versus advocating it aren’t to be treated differently), you’re suggesting that the way we deal with problematic ideologies is to ban their depiction.  How about calling for increased medical funding on it? How about calling for increased education warning kids in schools (particularly young girls) about sites and ideologies like this?  How about calling for other journalists to cover the issue?

      How about ANY of the ideas to combat harmful crap like this that have been proven to work rather than “ban them”?

    • St. Michael says:

      02:14pm | 05/09/11

      Also bear in mind the filter’s black list (or at least those iterations of the blacklist liberated from the government’s computers before being quickly repressed) includes a number of subjects that you wouldn’t really expect on a supposedly anti-porn, anti-terrorist blacklist.  Like Amnesty International, for example.

    • Tubesteak says:

      08:38am | 05/09/11

      You found a couple of sites on the internet that offended you? You clearly haven’t been on the internet for very long.

      If you really want to see something disturbing, go and have a look at rhe following:
      - two girls one cup
      - bukkake
      - BBW
      - goatse.cx (now deleted but the pic can be found)
      - manga porn

      I can’t imagine the depraved little desperdao that gets off on that. It’s probably the type of loser that lives with their parents and spends all night surfing 4chan and couldn’t pull a root in a brothel with a fistful of 100s.

      There’s a lot of disturbing stuff on the internet. Let the police worry about the “chillpron” but let others have their say. No matter how much you disagree with it.

      Voltaire out

    • Tina says:

      09:16am | 05/09/11

      @ Tubesteak

      So I can see you have done extensive research on offensive material on the internet? grin

    • kylie says:

      09:46am | 05/09/11

      “couldn’t pull a root in a brothel with a fistful of 100s” an oldie but a goodie - love it!

    • AdamC says:

      09:52am | 05/09/11

      I couldn’t agree more. We’re all offended by something. You can’t be in favour of free speech and then call for bans every time something annoys you.

      Also, I see the pro-ana thing as merely one of many distubing internet oddities. I don’t believe there is any serious argument that the pro-ana ‘moveemnt’ (for want of a better word) casuses otherwise healthy people to acquire eating disoreders.

    • dancan says:

      11:17am | 05/09/11

      @Tina - Frequent any internet forum long enough and one or more of those links will come up.

      I unfortunately have seen all of those thing.  what has been seen cannot be unseen :(

    • Tubesteak says:

      11:20am | 05/09/11

      Tina
      Some of that research was unintentional. Some people think it’s funny to email me stuff that will make me spew.

      However, I have taken to a campaign to remove all porn from the internet so I am feverishly downloading as much as I can in order to “consume” it.

      See, kylie, again I’m going for the olides but goodies wink

      AdamC: nicely said. I agree.

    • Tina says:

      11:36am | 05/09/11

      @ Tubesteak

      OMG what is porn downloading deadline? grin

    • Tubesteak says:

      01:24pm | 05/09/11

      Tina

      It takes as long as it takes. We must be forever vigilant. The price of democracy is eternal vigilance.

    • Wes says:

      08:58am | 05/09/11

      While I agree that women have self perception jammed down their throats on a regular basis…. we also have that sub culture on “the other end” who go out gorge, unhealthy snack, gorge etc. with the worry about it later attitude. Then when the kilos pile on they blame everybody but themselves and we’re all expected to dodge their dilemmas ??
      Just be comfortable in your own skins and accept your choices are yours and nobody elses.

    • Tina says:

      09:28am | 05/09/11

      What, dont you love the “oh, I have a small thyroid” excuse???

    • Markus says:

      08:59am | 05/09/11

      Pictures of skinny people do not just magically create mental illness.

      Plus anorexia nervosa affects what, half a percent of women? Compare that to the over 50% now classified as overweight or obese, and you see where the real problem lies.

      That the site’s new poster girl is not even anorexic just proves how misguided society’s current perception of a healthy body really is.

    • EM says:

      10:48am | 05/09/11

      Shhhh!!! Stop fighting irrational grandstanding with facts, it’s not fair on the poor “journalist”.

      My guess is he’s overweight and hates people who are skinny or healthy…

    • Outraged says:

      03:29pm | 05/09/11

      AMEN!

      With the amount of Fat People I see walking around Shopping Centres, we actually need MORE thin role model images! It’s currently not working!

      Society has bent over backwards to appease Feminists. Nowadays, thin/healthy people are considered not normal…but Fat Chicks are applauded for being “Real Women”...

      I am a thin male who constantly gets bullied by Fat Women at my work. They constantly criticize my normal eating habits…while they are scoffing a plateful of food that could serve 4!

    • jojo says:

      07:20pm | 05/09/11

      Outraged, you may want to direct your comment at men.  50percent of Australian women are overweight compared to 67 percent of australian men being overweight. 

      You might also want to accept the fact that members of fat acceptance groups actually lose more weight than non-members, suggesting that encouragement of good mental health rather than shame and ridicule actually helps people to be healthier.

    • Anna C says:

      09:12am | 05/09/11

      If we start banning these websites then where will it end? While I may not agree with a lot of the content posted on the internet I don’t support a ban on websites (apart from child pornography). I think censorship of the internet is a slippery slope.

    • Celia says:

      09:28am | 05/09/11

      As much as I hate to say it, I have seen both sides of the coin growing up in the nineties where being beautiful was “everthing”. Along came the phenomenon of the supermodel and to look right became a fixation for many many women. As a girl just commencing my studies at university and struggling with issues of identity, it became very much an issue for me as to how I looked, what I wore etc. Very shallow obviously in hindsight, but also very persuasive.

      As I have matured, I have come to recognise how powerful and dangerous popular media can be in shaping the female identity. Advertising seems to me to be directed at men, to create insecurity in women. Am I slim, attractive, dressed right? If he is attracted to her on the TV, how I can I possibly compare - how can I change myself to be that?

      The problem of course, if you want to label individuality as a “problem” - is that we can’t actually all look like the girls in the magazines, but there are some ways we can think we might - we can slap on the cosmetics, dress right, or worse still - starve ourselves, surgically enhance our shape and become depressive when we are still not satisfied.

      SO the question remains about where the real dangers lie for young women who are struggling with identity and happiness.  I can’t imagine what the answer is for everyone, but I know I stopped buying magazines and watching most commercial tv, as a family with children we read the news and watch documentaries on important things like science, human interest,  the environment etc - all the while trying to give our children a sense of value beyond the physical and material.

      I have been fortunate, as an educated and reasonably confident person I have been able to lift myself out of the youthful culture of self-obsession, at least pertaining to how I look and any efforts now pertain more to my health and longevity rather than to wanting to look a particular way. But I am acutely aware of the risks associated with representing women as they most frequently are in mainstream media and what they mean to my own children.

      Yes the extreme viewpoints in society are there, and will remain in a society blessed with the internet where people can get on and express ideas that many of us hope our children will be able to avoid simply through their own discretion and by our parenting. But the TV’s in our lounge rooms selling us what they want us to buy? I think that the message there is much more difficult to avoid and potentially just as immoderate for its own gain.

    • amba says:

      09:32am | 05/09/11

      At under 50kilos I am and have always been underweight. Even when i was a kid (im 29 now) i would be accused by other kids of being anorexic or bulemic, i wasnt, i just have trouble putting weight on. I went on a routine of adding 2-3 protein shakes on top of my regular meals and gained about a kilo after 2 months… this is after having a baby as well.
      I worry about my daughter as she grows up about how she will be affected by society’s views on weight. She is 2 years old and about 14 kilos. She is also quite tall so she doesnt even look ‘chubby’. People are regularly surprised when i tell them she is only 2 and 3months. She is almost 1/2 my height. The foods she likes and gets the most are all healthy, fresh or dried fruit, cheese, yougurt, milk, nuts and shes been eating vegetables since she was teething (cold carrots are fantastic for it and gives them a taste for it, even now i cant go shopping for carrots without 1 or 2 being nibbled lol).
      Being someone who doesnt even own a set of scales for myself, I hope she wont get any issues from me. I know im not fat, i know i dont need to lose any weight, if anything i could do with a little extra.

      Its worrying to hear of kids as young as 6 wanting to be on diets when there is no need for them, unless they have some form of severe disability or some damn good reason, they should be out running around a bit more like when we were kids. And even then they should have a decent diet in the first place.

    • Tina says:

      10:41am | 05/09/11

      I dont know how people become anorexic or if some ways of growing up heighten the risk or not. But you obviously care for and love your child. Keep up a good connection and support and in my unprofessional opinion you are already on the best way.

    • amba says:

      11:18am | 05/09/11

      Thanks Tina.
      Having known a girl that had anorexia issues (she saw a skirt i had one day that had never fit me, one of those ill fit one day things, and it never happened, she said she liked it so i gave it to her, next thing im being accused of saying shes fat coz she fits clothes too big for me.. or something like that.
      anyway she went on to have her own kid and i remember thinking that perhaps it was a good thing she had a son…
      As long as my girl is healthy, following her growth charts in both height and weight and her doctor is not concerned its just going to be a ‘non-issue’ to me. People comment about how big she is, i say yea i know, she was only 5lb10 too…

    • Kipling says:

      09:35am | 05/09/11

      Nooooooo, media distorting the facts, never.

      I am more that a little agog at your suggestion for censorship, particularly on the back of a myriad of hand wringing journalistic whinges about a suggested media review…. More that a little bit hypocritical don’t you think.

      Media can only truly influence people who live in a void regardling meaningful, honest and reliable relationships…

    • Matt Porter says:

      09:38am | 05/09/11

      What about feeder websites?  Where partners feed women to make them obese.  That seems like more of a problem these days.

    • Lloyd says:

      10:34am | 05/09/11

      Kind of like Hansel and Gretel? smile

    • EM says:

      10:54am | 05/09/11

      Didn’t you know?  Being a fat loser is all the rage these days. We are meant to celebrate them and be thankful that they’re chewing up all our tax dollars on health…

    • SpiritWolf84 says:

      02:05pm | 05/09/11

      @EM - Nice touch. Idiot. Some of us with weight issues are actually busting our butts to lose it so we aren’t a strain on the system, my weight loss was kicked off by severe gall bladder issues which nearly killed me (due to a bad diet my whole life, even then I wasn’t severely overweight). To some of us, it’s not an “in” thing, we hate it, it’s a battle to lose it for the sake of our health, but for nearly all it’s all about re-education, to get off the junk and eating the right things in the right amounts. So, how about instead of insulting them, why don’t you post your bright ideas to help them lose the weight and live a healthier life?

      Personally, I don’t see what sort of person would get their jollies out of those sites.

    • mick says:

      06:41pm | 05/09/11

      its well documented that men that like fat women have very low self esteem

    • Tina says:

      09:38am | 05/09/11

      Definitely agree. Of course there are heaps of website out there that offend some people. But apart from the problem of how to identify and ban all offending websites, where do you start and where do you stop?

      An idea is to ban websites that show illegal behaviour, eg substance abuse. But then what about a picture of your latest teen start enjoying an underaged drink on a news website. Is that to be banned too?

      We should realise the internet is no “happy place”. Noone forces you to look at websites you dont approve of.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      09:43am | 05/09/11

      Hi David, I will post again on this Topic and share a bit more of the bondage caused by Bulimia that I suffered for many years, but right now I want to say thank you and confirm your stand against the horror of food addictions which often lead to death and against those who promote them as good.

      When people think it is all right to uphold what is evil and harmful and promote it even if only by not standing up against it then what else will they willingly agree with.

      Remember Speech is only free when it doesn’t promote Evil or it’s Symptoms, if it does it weighs very heavy and the cost is unsurmountable and not in anyway free but repenting of it is like having your mouth washed out with soap, leaving a clean, pleasant aroma and the value of this cannot be counted in human terms.

      Bulimia -  A mental eating disorder seen among young women who go on eating binges and then feel guilt and depression and self-condemnation ... many take their own lives if the harm to their bodies doesn’t do it first.

      Thank you again David,  keep up the good work, I commend you for your Integrity - Kind regards Anne.

    • Tina says:

      10:12am | 05/09/11

      Speech is only free when it doesnt promote evil…

      Not sure about that one. What would be considered evil?

    • Anne Stocks says:

      12:00pm | 05/09/11

      If you don’t know Tina no one can tell you ...correction yes they can…  but would you believe them.

      Reading your other post thankfully you do seem to recognise what is not acceptable so are you willing to make a stand against it like David did regardless of the cost, some have punched him a bit hard and even if it’s his job, a punch is a punch and if there is no protection you get a bit knocked about let’s hope he puts some armour on.

      Put you boxing gloves on Tina and fight the good fight against the evil you do recognise,  you’ll be very surprised about the good that will come out of it, not just for others but for you too and believe me the rewards are out of this world.

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Cate P says:

      09:50am | 05/09/11

      Great stuff, now what about a piece supporting a ban on pernicious porn sites, eg snuff porn?

    • Susan says:

      10:11am | 05/09/11

      Do you report these to the federal police if you come across them Cate?

    • braunman says:

      11:10am | 05/09/11

      Wait, you’ve actually found snuff porn? As in people actually being murdered in making the film then the film being sold commercially? That stuff is on the same playing field as child porn and is all kinds of illegal, for good reason! If you’ve found some you have to report it to the police!

    • Raider says:

      01:27pm | 05/09/11

      Relax, there is no such thing. It’s all make believe, it exists only as fantasy.

      (and if it does exist, it’s not on the WWW anyway…)

    • Susan says:

      02:39pm | 05/09/11

      Raider…I don’t agree that is correct but it may depend on definition. The first ever ‘snuff’ film where someone was prosecuted for the murder happened in 1997.  If you are talking about hollywoodised fantasy snuff films that is one thing (albeit sick) but there have been real snuff films made. The “Dnepropetrovsk maniacs” also made a number of films. One hit the internet around 2007.  People who get off on such awful realities may consider these simply ‘snuff’ films. Once again, definition. Either way, I would report to the Federal police if I saw anything along these lines on the internet.

    • NSW says:

      09:56am | 05/09/11

      I find websites like fakebook and twitter much more offensive. I’d rather them banned.

    • Susan says:

      10:10am | 05/09/11

      My biggest concern is that what show producers do to grab ‘sensation’ is ultimately at the expense of the contestant (in this case) who is a real live individual and who’s experience in the public realm over such a matter will affect them for a long long time. Poor ethics for a media grab.

    • Tina says:

      10:46am | 05/09/11

      If you wish to become a contestant for this next top model thing or whatever show, you should know what you are in for. Noone forces you to apply.

    • Susan says:

      11:22am | 05/09/11

      So, the producers always and openly tell young men and women that they are to be publicly berated and leveraged for media sensation? I’m not sure many young people actually understand the world they are entering Tina. And these young people have been auditioned. If they are successful they probably feel they are acceptable and ‘ok’. To suddenly be told they aren’t for the sake of media sensation, is another beast entirely.  By all means, show me where these contestants are fairly warned about these potentials? Sure, they are predictable as they happen every season..but I’ve been around a long time and see the pattern. Not sure too many average 17 or 18 year olds would or do as equally.

    • louhen says:

      10:24am | 05/09/11

      It took to comment 3 for an article about anorexia to become another opportunitity for fat bashing. Here we go again….

    • tina says:

      10:58am | 05/09/11

      Hmmm, overweight people certainly dont have an easy time lately with all the bashing. More so than for example smokers although they form a similar burden on the health system. I think it may be because people see overweight people as lazy, fast food stuffing, discipline lacking, which I agree does not always apply.

    • ComSense says:

      10:30am | 05/09/11

      “I won’t name any of the websites I looked at, as I certainly don’t intend this piece to be a handy user guide for aspiring anorexics.” 

      Followed just a few paragraphs later by step-by-step instructions…..

      “Google will take you there. A young woman who has no knowledge of these websites simply needs to type the words ``lose weight’’ into Google…and the search engine will present them with plenty of pro-ana sites clogged with the deadliest diet information.”

      EPIC FAIL David.

    • Tina says:

      11:02am | 05/09/11

      Epic fail? Putting “lose weight” into google doesnt sound like a secret code to me.

    • Zeta says:

      10:31am | 05/09/11

      First, Penbo came for the pro-ana sites, but I didn’t say anything, because I’m not anorexic.

      Then, Penbo came for the pro-mia sites, but I didn’t speak up, because I’m not bullimic.

      Next, Penbo came for the Furry sites, but I didn’t speak out, because I’m not an anthropomorphised sexual pervert.

      Then, Penbo came for the Vore sites, but I didn’t do anything, because I’m not sexually aroused by the idea of being eaten by giant women.

      He came for the Kaijucon, but I didn’t care, I don’t have sex while dressed as Godzilla.

      He came for German cannibalism sites, he came for rape fantasy sites, he came for the sites where people post pictures of their poop.

      But I didn’t speak up.

      Then, when he came for anonymous current affairs blog commenters, there was no one left to speak up for me.

    • braunman says:

      11:16am | 05/09/11

      Kaijucon: Proof that Rule 34 is all too real.

    • Dieter Meoeckel says:

      10:35am | 05/09/11

      Has anyone had a good look at the Willendorf Venus?
      Mostly girls are slender and graceful when at their prime - put a few babies through them and their shape will surely change.

    • jade (the other one) says:

      10:36am | 05/09/11

      David Penberthy, I find your characterisation of the blogs that most young girls write as sad, and your complete miscalculation that these sites are run by women as very misleading. Through my time on the internet, and in particular, researching this type of site, I came across remarkably few that were run by anything other than teenage girls. It can be easily seen through the grammar, spelling and reading with anything more than a cursory glance at the content.

      Furthermore, by “shutting down” these sites, you simply drive these girls further underground, and deny them the possibility of being discovered and helped.

      As to your comment that these are some of the most disgusting sites on the internet and should be subject to a filter, or that this is one of the creepier subcultures, I would suggest you don’t explore the internet very deeply, if this is the worst that you can find. And that’s not taking into consideration anything to do with pornography or fetish communities.

      I find sites such as those of Fred Phelps’ Westboro Baptist Church, Operation Rescue, and various other sites to be far more offensive, dangerous, and sick. I find them to be far more deserving of our self-righteous indignation than a few mentally ill teenagers who post on the internet. What makes Operation Rescue and the Westboro Baptist Church’s sites far more abhorrent to me is the gleeful and open celebration of murderers and terrorists, and the complete disregard for moral decency, exhibited by the picketing of soldiers’ funerals, the counter of Matthew Shephard’s days spent in hell, and target lists of abortion providers.

      Many of the commentators here fail spectacularly to realise that these young girls (and increasingly boys) are CHILDREN in most cases, who are mentally ill. I find it disgusting that when such an obvious manifestation of their mental illness is apparent, there are people advocating that the CHILDREN posting, and running these sites be charged, sued or prosecuted, rather than helped.

      I find it interesting that many of these commentators do not take the same attitude with ADULTS who choose to addict themselves to drugs, and go onto commit crimes as a result of their addiction.

    • Hambone says:

      10:42am | 05/09/11

      I don’t see why this is a ‘women’s only’ issue. As an overweight man I have looked at these websites myself and picked up some helpful tips. Before you all start berating me, nothing else works! I’ve tried cutting potion sizes down, increasing exercise, reducing calorie intake to 2/3 of what is considered normal, after two weeks I had gained 3 kilo’s! Men are being hit just as hard as women by the media, have a look at a ‘Men’s Health’ magazine and see how fat = ugly, unloved and pathetic. So if reducing food intake to 1/4 normal is what I need to lose weight and be counted amongst the vaguely attractive, then I am going to do it!

    • Tina says:

      11:08am | 05/09/11

      No bashing. The websites are there, you use your brain to pick up valuable tips and disregard the negative. Good on you. Of course basically these pages contain dieting tips - they are just being misused for people that dont need dieting! If you pick up things like drinking a glass of water before having dinner to fill your tummy a little and that helps you with your weight battle then go for it. Just please dont overdo it. Aim for a long term change in lifestyle. Good luck.

    • Lauren says:

      11:04am | 05/09/11

      Pro-ana sites and thinspiration do not cause annorexia, and censoring them is a rubbish idea.

      Do you know where most girls with EDs get their thinspiration from?

      Rehab.

      My younger sister was hospitalised on numerous occasions over three years for her anorexia, and was in a critical condition on two occasions.

      Not once did she visit those sites. All she needed to do was befriend the anorexic sleeping in the bed next to her, and before you know it the entire ward are trading tips and secrets and have established their own little club.

    • Kaye says:

      02:01pm | 06/09/11

      ah, that’s exactly what the websites are. Places to trade tips and secrets. It may not cause annorexia, but you’ve perfectly exemplified why they’re dangerous.

      I’m not for the censorship of them, but people don’t seem to understand the danger that they present to girls already unwell.

    • DS says:

      04:38pm | 06/09/11

      Oh they do present a danger indeed, especially for those trying to recover from such illnesses, but how many healthy girls would really go look at sites like that? Having been an anorexic teenager, I don’t know about how a healthy kid might think or act, but I find it hard to imagine that it’s something they would actively seek out…?

      So if not censorship, I think it may again come down to educating the kids about dealing with life and stress etc? I don’t know, I’m curious to ask what you think would be a good way to deal with such issues..?

    • Nom Nom Nom says:

      11:09am | 05/09/11

      Dont forget to ban the sites celebrating obesity! Kills more Women 100 fold than annorexia.

      Nom Nom Nom. Dont remind me I eat too much, depressed. Nom Nom Nom.
      Give me TV, Nom Nom Nom. Truth Hurts, Societys fault, Nom Nom Nom.

    • dave says:

      11:39am | 05/09/11

      We are missing the point here.  Normal does not equate with attractive.  These young girls do NOT want to be normal.  Look at the “normals” strolling around shopping centres!!  They want to be attractive and that is NOT size 16.  Are you try to ban promotion of Anarexia or the desire to be attractive?

    • Tina says:

      12:10pm | 05/09/11

      I am not the best at defining anorexia, but if it is about being attractive the person in question would have an unhealthy idea of attractive.

      Noone wants to ban the desire to be attractive. Its about a disorder.

    • Former anorexic says:

      01:39pm | 05/09/11

      As a former anorexic, I will speak from my own experience and say that it might’ve initially started as a desire to be more attractive, that is, by losing a couple of kilos only. But then, once you’re in the grip of the illness - in my experience, anyway, it’s more about a sub conscious need for control, rather than a desire to be attractive. That is, I can’t control the rest of my life, but I can control my body. This is why the idea of gaining weight is so terrifying - because it equates to a loss of control.

      I actually used to like the fact that other people would find my skin and bones repulsive - so, no, it wasn’t about the desire to be attractive. (and yes, I now can see how warped that thinking is - but hey, they don’t call it a mental illness for nothing!)

      I don’t believe that banning the sites will do any good. They didn’t have them in my day, and I still found plenty of ways to lie to people and lose weight.

      “If we don’t believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don’t believe in it at all.” ~Noam Chomsky

    • Anne Stocks says:

      05:24pm | 05/09/11

      Former anorexic says:...“If we don’t believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don’t believe in it at all.” ~Noam Chomsky….. I’m sure most would agree, and so do I, yes indeed they can talk their heads off but when what they are talking about hurts others, then no I don’t agree and if Noam had someone wanting to hurt his child with harmful advice I’m sure his conviction wouldn’t last.

      In your day supposing you are older then 20 years they didn’t have these type of websites freely available to young people,  there was much more censoring and control then there is now the same as T.V.

      Please don’t feel Former anorexic I have no concern or compassion for what you went through,  I was Bulimic for 10 years and it was no party, although unlike you no one knew,  I just got lots of accolades about how good I looked,  but I’m sure if they had seen my head in the toot and smelt the vomit, they wouldn’t have been as impressed.

      The focus for a very long time has been what you look like on the outside instead of inner beauty or strength, as David said we are very much influenced by the Media, Hollywood, Models, Beauty pageants, all have set unrealistic examples of what we should be seeking to achieve and how and now they are even presenting on open Media what is very dangerous and life threading as something we should applaud.

      With all due respect to those who need to have their say I would prefer them to shut up if what they say is going to harm others and I would have no hesitation in letting them know and have done so in the past and will do so in the future.  I no longer believe in wearing a mask to be accepted by everyone, I found it got rather heavy after awhile, in fact bigger then I could handle and no diet would have made it lighter.

      Ever thought about the word diet Former anorexic ...look at it again…

      DIE…...ET

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Silver says:

      12:02pm | 05/09/11

      This is exactly the problem with the government’s proposed filter.  Every interest group will soon put forward their own pet bug-bears and soon the entire Internet is banned.

    • James A says:

      12:05pm | 05/09/11

      Give me a leggy skinny bird over a fat slob every time. I applaud girls trying to look their best rather than join the pig culture herd. Most Aussie girls are fat as they eat too much, badly and do Sweet FA exercise. Then they wonder why men have zero sexual desire for them?  If you are resigned to be a slob but crave to be thin - swallow a tapey.  It’s back in vogue in Japan. At least blokes will look at you and you can still gorge on KFC.

    • Tina says:

      12:40pm | 05/09/11

      But I assume you want your woman and mother of your children to be healthy? This article is not about weight itself but about a terrible disorder.

    • SpiritWolf84 says:

      02:17pm | 05/09/11

      Charming James… Are you still single by any chance? I am currently at a size 16 (temporarily, still working on my fitness), yet I have a loving man who accepts me as I am (it’s in fact nearly an argument when I tell him I need to look after myself better!). I’ll never be a size 10 or smaller due to bone structure (i’m wide across the hips, not that i’m complaining), however in my peak I still seem to get the attention of every man in the room… Go figure…

      Tina’s right, this story IS about a horrible disorder which I have unfortunately witnessed (the girl in the hospital bed next to me at the start of the year was anorexic due to her illness) with my own eyes. Girls going too far to be ‘the perfect size’ is a terrible thing to see.

    • Outraged says:

      03:32pm | 05/09/11

      @SpiritWold84: WOW! You really did blame your weight on “Being Big Boned”! lol I thought that was just a internet meme…but fatties really do use that line!

    • Kaye says:

      02:10pm | 06/09/11

      No Outraged. She didn’t use it as an excuse to be overweight, but that she’ll never be a size 8 or 10. That doesn’t mean that SpiritWolf is saying she’s going to sit inside and eat 8 bags of chips because she’ll never be a size 10, she’s just saying that because of her body shape it’s unrealistic to think she’d ever be that size. Size is largely irrelevant. As long as you’re healthy a size 12 or 14 isn’t fat, just as being a size 8 doesn’t mean you’re healthy.

    • gra gra says:

      12:42pm | 05/09/11

      Short comment. How long are the weight police, (and the medical profession), going to tolerate compounds being offered on TV and everywhere else that promise to expand in your stomach so that you think you are full and thereby will eat less. We are not told what these compounds are, whether there are serious after-effects, or how successfully, or otherwise, the body disposes of them.
      I know three people, two women and a man, who fell in the rort. One of the women lost weight, neither of the other two. The girl who lost weight, (she is 23), has been crook with one thing or another ever since, and the other lady got so cranky with everyone that she tossed it in. The bloke (45), lost no weight but is now that he’s eating like a rabbit and has given up beer.
      Eat what you need, not what you want, drink plenty of water, and walk every day. I did this and put on 3 kgs. Go figure.
      Not really a short comment, but like those dieters I get carried away.

    • Tina says:

      12:49pm | 05/09/11

      That always makes me wonder because it doesnt make sense: 

      “Eat what you need, not what you want, drink plenty of water, and walk every day. I did this and put on 3 kgs. Go figure.”

      Obviously you ate more than you needed. The proof is right there. Maybe you have to look again and reassess what you think you need. All the best.

    • gra gra says:

      08:31pm | 05/09/11

      @Tina. For an expert on dieting, not dieting, why people act in a certain way, and even how I put a couple of kgs on despite a fairly sensible approach, (recommended by my brilliant GP), you don’t display much common sense. My ‘qualified’ advisor told me it was a matter of metabolism. You haven’t heard of that term? It involves different levels of reaction to the same treatment by different people. You should not be ‘advising’ anyone on anything, Tina. You are a generalising dill, and proof that a little learning, (in your case very little) is a dangerous thing.
      You’re not related to Erick are you?

    • Glen says:

      01:02pm | 05/09/11

      Why pick on the Internet media. It’s pretty plain that Australia’s Next Top Model has problems with people who aren’t extremely thin. Not to mention Vogue, etc. And television and magazines are seen by a lot more people than then people who read blogs of the self-deluded.

    • bananabender says:

      03:40pm | 05/09/11

      Anorexia has been known to medicine for over 2000 years. It is a serious psychiatric illness not a lifestyle choice.  About 1 in 300 young white females is affected.

    • Dana says:

      04:06pm | 05/09/11

      There isn’t such a thing as a healthy size 16. lets start with that…

    • bananabender says:

      05:23pm | 05/09/11

      Incorrect. There is no difference in mortality rates between a BMI of 19 and 35. ie sizes 8-18. In fact being moderately overweight is much healthier than being underweight. The lowest mortality rate occur at a BMI of around 27. This corresponds to a size 14-16 for a female of average height.

    • Jason says:

      04:21pm | 05/09/11

      Haha listen at all the fatties coming to comment on how everybody should let themselves go so they don’t feel so bad in comparison. So typical.
      I agree some of these models are on the thin side but they would look plain dreadful if a lot of that wasn’t due to genetics. I myself prefer the look of a female at her best shape athletic wise. Like a professional dancer or gymnast. The shame about modern day society is we’re too busy wasting time working when we should be exercising and sleeping outside in the sun.

    • Bryn says:

      04:52pm | 05/09/11

      I don’t really think that comment “listen at all the fatties coming to comment on how everybody should let themselves go so they don’t feel bad in comparison” is relevant to this issue, nor is it grammatically correct.

      However, if I have honed in on your general hypothesis, it is that society should engage in exercise. Although I think that the general statement of exercise instead of work is probably a bit over the top. I wish I had the means to be able to pay for personal trainers and dieticians without having to work. Unfortunately, like many of the readers here, we do not have that liberty. Work is a part of normal life. I think a more reasonable message to present is that a healthy work-life balance is the best way to go.

      I also have to disagree with your comment that we should be ‘sleeping outside in the sun’. Two words; skin cancer.

      These websites should be filtered at least from under 18’s, for example using the parental filters available. Obviously, adults have the right to make decisions about the content that they view (within reason), however, these websites should not be available for viewing by any child or teenage girl that types ‘weight loss’ into a search engine.

    • DS says:

      04:50pm | 06/09/11

      Mostly agree with you there Bryn, but I would suggest that such filters should already be used by parents on their kids’ computers. In theory, you are able to define, fairly specifically what is and is not accessible on the internet, using your basic parental lock software available on the market. My question is - why do parents not bother using them, and instead complain about “my kiddies shouldn’t watch/see/read this”? I am not aiming this at you personally, more of a general question to parents: Do you use netNanny and similar software on your home PCs. If not, why not? And do you feel that you have the right to complain about what your kids may find online if you have not opted to use a parental lock?

    • gravy says:

      04:54pm | 05/09/11

      I completely agree that these sites are pretty sick and send out a bad message; but honestly I think it takes more than a website for girls to turn anorexic, and I really doubt banning these websites is going to do anything to reduce the amount of girls who have eating disorders etc. Banning something and pushing it underground never helped stop anything. IMHO no mentally stable girl will suddenly turn anorexic by looking at a few of those websites, only those already with it in mind and want to try it out etc will really be ‘influenced’ by those sites, but i honestly feel that they would still have their eating disorders even if they never saw one of those sites. Afterall you don’t develop a mental illness by looking at a website.

      Also if you talk about banning anorexia sites i think you would have to also do the same thing to ‘fat lovers’ websites which are just as terrible, eating till you are 300kgs etc. Its just as deadly and unhealthy and if you ban one IMO you’d have to ban the other.

      PS. Kate Moss is kinda gross, women are supposed to have curves not look like a chopstick…

    • Michael says:

      05:12pm | 05/09/11

      My 13 year old daughter weighing 44kgs/BMI 16 is currently in the grip of severe anorexia. One in five girls dies and the average life expectancy from diagnosis to death is seven years. She has a one in five chance in not making 21. My daughter has a better chance with leukemia than anorexia. it is a parasitic mental illness that uses all of the sufferers high qualities of intellect, will, and determination against them. It is tearing my family apart, making meals a living hell. If you have not been there you have no idea. Conroy’s filter can be circumvented by a smart 13 year old like my daughter, so that’s a WAFTAM but these sites are bad news. I think they do a lot of harm to the people who suffer from this terrible distorting disease.

    • Jenny says:

      05:37pm | 05/09/11

      A size 16 is not what i would call “normal” to be a size 16 and have a healthy BMI you would either need to be about 6’6” tall. to fit those measurements and have healthy levels of fat, you would need to be a body builder and rippling with very thick muscles.

      and no i’m not some skinny chick. I’m a size 16 myself, and at 5’11” and a BMI just over 30, i definitely don’t have a ‘normal’level of fat, and i did it to myself with terrible eating habits, which i’m now combatting through sensible eating and plenty of varied exercise (i used to be BMI 35). So even classed as obese, most people would never think to consider me as such because of my taller frame, and the way i dress.

      I’ve seen myself in denial, and most of my family is still in denial, and it’s people like you David that help keep us in denial. Big is beautiful was meant for curvy figures like a size 10-12 not for the size 30’s out there that console themselves at night my telling themselves that this saying is about them.

      It’s time to own the fact that the average Aussie woman is a size 16-18, and that means we could do with dropping a size or two, instead of coddling them and telling them science is working against them so they won’t lose weight, or it’s genetic (it’d be less than 0.1% who have the genetic mutation), or they’re just ‘big boned’ it’s time the media started telling it how it is, and giving people the wake up call they need

    • Mr GG says:

      11:59am | 06/09/11

      BBW put it in google (not at work) and get perspective on what beauty can be to some men.
      the problem is the women assume men have the same herd mentality as they have themselves. There is a reason there are so many more women’s mags then men’s it is because you listen to them. Men are not as fixated on the ‘ideal’ beauty or fitting in and conforming as women seem to be. (generalisation)

      Again Averages… so for every size 30 how many ‘normal’ size women does there need to be to have an average of 16?  A LOT. the point is with averages that a few extremes (especially in one sided measures like weight were the is no maximum but no one will get to zero or negative weight)

      18 is healthy enough (unless very short)  the message doesn’t need to go to everyone because it probably wont reach the size 30s that need to hear it anyway.

    • Steve says:

      05:50pm | 05/09/11

      Yeah. Great idea! And why don’t we legislate so that we have to wear complete body padding when we ride a push-bike. That’ll reduce injuries for sure. And ban cars, that’ll reduce the road toll! In fact, why don’t we ban wages so the poor don’t feel powerless. And ban alcohol too, that always works. And let’s ban journalists that want the government to keep us living in a freaking nanny-state, and that don’t seem to comprehend any real issues.

    • Mel says:

      06:14pm | 05/09/11

      This whole debate about “pro-anorexia” irritates me. Models are not the norm. They are usually taller and underweight. I’m a full 10 inches shorter than the girl in the news today and I’m only 5kg lighter and my BMI is on the low end of healthy.

      I also get really irritated by the push in the media to tell women that size 12 is “normal” Ten years ago, I was a size 12 (and weighed 5kg more than I do now). Now when I buy clothes I’m a size 8. So clothing sizes are getting bigger, but based on the healthy BMI, if I had to wear what is currently a women’s size 12, I’d be clinically obese. So in short, unless you’re a tall woman, then kidding yourself that size 12 - 16 is normal is delusional.

      While some women could definitely do with eating a cheeseburger, most “normal” women need to put down the fork. It’d be nice to be able to walk through my local shopping centre without getting stuck behind people who should stop walking through the shops and walk around the block instead.

    • ?? says:

      06:31pm | 05/09/11

      for a model she is chunky. for a cilivan, she’s the right weight and fine

    • exercise guy says:

      06:35pm | 05/09/11

      I’m amazed by all the self-proclaimed experts here.  However if you obtained your information from proper scientific journals instead of TV and glossy magazines you would discover that:

      - diet and exercise have only a 1-2% success rate for weight loss after five years.

      -  the overweight (BMI 25-30) have far lower mortality than those people of “normal” weight.

      - the mortality rate is the same at a BMI of 18 (underweight) as 35 (obese)

      - moderate physical activity is far more beneficial than weight loss for improving health in most people.

      - the optimum body fat levels for health are surprisingly high (15% males and 25% females).

      - elite athletes are typically less healthy than moderately active people.
      When I was studying exercise science at university only one of the lecturers was thin (a cyclist) . The rest were quite solid (BMI28-35)  because they knew that “fitness” is far more important than “fatness”. 

      Btw the highest VO2 level (a measure of cardiac fitness) in my university class belonged to a 118kg male.

    • trysomecompassion says:

      05:06am | 06/09/11

      Thanks for the truth exercise guy, at least somebody knows what they are saying here.  My family has large people and small people, I can tell you that the large people are still healthy and still alive and kicking but several of our skinny family members have not made it to the age we wanted them to sadly.  How about we all mind our own business and let people live their own lives and be whatever size they want and when they need help or advice they will probably seek the information from experts who will help and not judge. The bull about being a burden on the health system is just that bull, I know from my own family, it’s been the THIN people that have been the least healthy but in other families it may be the reverse, it just depends on the individual, and besides alcohol consumption, drug use and smoking are huge contributors, the overweight are just easy targets and that is despicable. MInd your own business, get on with your own life, don’t judge people and involve yourself in compassion toward your fellow humans instead of pulling them down and stomping on their hearts.

    • Myron Gains says:

      11:34am | 06/09/11

      I’m amazed by the fallacies in your arguments.

      You claim that nobody else has obtained their informaiton from ‘proper scientific journals’, yet your claims are not backed up by any references at all.

      - Diet and exercise have only 1-2% success rate after 5 years?  How do you explain people who have successfully lost weight and kept it off for that time?  If diet and exercise doesn’t work, then what does?

      - BMI 25-30 have far lower mortality?  Mortality from what, plane crashes?  Smoking? Heart disease?  How much is ‘far lower’?  Is the higher BMI the reason for this supposed claim?

      - You say moderate physical activity is better for improving health in most people.  How many people?  Again, where are your references?  According to health.gov.au, most people are already overweight.  So you’re saying that a heavy person exercising will be healthier than losing weight first, then exercising?

      - Optimum body fat levels according to what, health?  Performance? Appearance?  Imaginary numbers picked at random?

      - Which elite athletes?  Synchronised swimmers?  Sprinters?  Long distance runners?  How are they less healthy?  According to which authority?

      - Your assumption is that university lecturers in any subject, by their role alone, are paragons of optimum health?

    • DragonLass says:

      06:44pm | 05/09/11

      I’m not in favour of censorship on many things, but those kind of sites would be one of them.  Anorexia is a horrible mental illness and having websites freely available to young person that can exacerbate the problem and undo any hard work by their family to help them, it’s just wrong.

      Moreover I wish society as a whole would stop judging other people’s size, whether that be thin or fat.  Insisting a thin person ‘needs a good feed’, for example, is just as insulting as telling a large person to ‘put down the fork’ or whatever other inane, unhelpful comments you can think of.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      07:02pm | 05/09/11

      Outraged says….You really did blame your weight on “Being Big Boned….Wow you are the one wrong who is wrong Outraged and SpiritWold84: is right… It seems your not very knowledgeable about frames and bone structure,  so perhaps until you are I wouldn’t be putting others down, it just shows your ignorance.

      After running Christian Weight Control groups for 20 years I can assure you even if your surprised just how much bone structure, height, metabolism and fluid intake, apart from food consumption has an affect on what size a person is, many shouldn’t aim for what is presented in printed height and weight charts,  what may be ok for one person could be very unsuitable for another and even dangerous…...If SpiritWold84 had been part of my groups she would have been rewarded for not basing her acceptance on how she looked ... well done SpiritWold84 keep up the good work.

      I can assure you Outraged no one dying from Anorexic or Bulimia would really care if you don’t think bones make a difference,  although they may have believed that lie and die..ted below what was acceptable for their body type.

      Today I suffer from Osteoarthritis and related disorders as well as being disabled from a genetic disorder from birth and most was because of putting my body when I was young through many years of dangerous diets and by of being Bulimic for 10 years, I starved my body of the nutrition it needed because I wanted to be attractive to men like James who were blind to the Truth that the beauty a woman has within is more important then what she presents outwardly to the world .

      I would like to commend your husband SpiritWold84 for being a man of worth and not just being shallow and self- serving, you have been greatly blessed and your insight shows he has been too.

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Richard says:

      09:05pm | 05/09/11

      Having lived on both sides of the fence (140 to 90Kg as 6’1” male), I can say that being happy with your body is worth almost any price. I remember seeing Mikey Robbins quoted a while ago as saying that the ‘jolly fat bloke’ is a lie, and it’s true. In modern society we’re judged on appearance first of all. I’m no danger of ever being anorexic but did resort to amphetamines to knock off the last 20 Kg which I guess would be similarly unhealthy.
      I’d sugest that both behavior sets are a product of an irresistable pressure to confirm. You won’t fix that by suppressing information, you fix it by removing the pressure, and that’s damn hard as it goes against hundreds of years of social conditioning.

    • DS says:

      04:00pm | 06/09/11

      wholeheartedly agree!

    • LON says:

      10:41pm | 05/09/11

      Anorexia does not discriminate between the sexes,obsessive behaviour can take on many forms and some can seem very disturbing depending on how you view them, for example extreme body piercing, branding, and genital mutilation can have advocates who see it as body art. Large body tattoos are getting a good airing on the footy field encouraging a growing narcissistic following, mostly amongst men but also increasingly with young women too. Nearly all the above can potentially have some long term effect on the body the real risk is when it eventually becomes an addiction. Hurting oneself can become an addiction so can viewing pornography. Without a healthier diversion obsessive addictions can become more extreme as fantasy and role playing transcends rational behaviour into a potential social problem. The internet is just an indiscriminate conduit for all these social anomalies that highlight our ills, it is a good monitor of human behaviour and for that reason if nothing else should remain uncensored.

    • jim g says:

      12:06am | 06/09/11

      Women can easily compensate for not being a ‘supermodel’ if they just chill out and use their minds….  What do men really like….?  Learn to be able to suck a golf ball through a straw and enjoy the pleasures of the balloon knot.

    • stephen says:

      12:13am | 06/09/11

      I like to be thinnish because when I’m not, in the morning I wake up tireder.
      My heart has to pump blood through more fat to equate my breathing.
      Thin saves my heart and lungs, and I feel better for it.
      Say no more.

    • Mike Reese says:

      04:29am | 06/09/11

      This isn’t about censorship. It’s about withdrawing support for for people and businesses that continue to perpetuate this sickness - a 20 percent mortality rate? And no one’s screaming bloody murder? Oh, and you can be be thin (not even anorexic) and be in bad metabolic health. There is no magic weight number, that when you reach it, you suddenly become perfectly healthy. I digressed for a moment, but back to my point, it’s time to put the perpetrators out of business. That means NOT giving money to fashion/entertainment enterprises that keep this insane idea alive. They may not respond to protest, but I’ll bet they respond to a drop in profit. That also means making it clear to advertisers who keep these shows and websites going that you are NOT going to patronize them, and you need to tell them WHY. It is NOT sufficient to just stop using the product/service. If you are as disgusted as I am with these enabling exploiters, take action!

    • NP says:

      08:49am | 07/09/11

      I think the best selling magazine in this country is Australian Women’s Weekly. Have a flick & you will see they don’t have super skinny models which goes to show magazines DO sell using “normal” sized women. There are a lot of very pretty, healthy looking size 12-14 working models out there, who cares what they are called, they are clearly getting booked. They are also advertising very wearable, flattering clothes that all women would look good in. Quality classics like these are very hard to find.

    • Sue Thurn says:

      08:56am | 06/09/11

      I agree with Mike Reese. I have had the unfortunate experience, as a professional, to see young mum’s who wish to stay in this industry, go to extreme lengths within weeks of giving birth. This means no breastfeeding and often the beginning of postnatal depression. If women’s bodies were supposed to be that thin, then they would ovulate at this emaciated size. It is a freak show with very confused young women. Those making a living using these unfortunate girls are nothing but parasites!

    • AP says:

      09:48am | 06/09/11

      For those that are worried about censorship of pro-anorexia sites, your attitude my be very different if you had been in my shoes. My 12 year old daughter was admitted to hospital for anorexia when her body weight reached a level that she could no longer maintain her own body temperature, her heart started to fail, her organs were not functioning properly and her bone growth had stopped. She was slowly dieing from the inside. After 12 weeks of hospitlisation, being feed via a tube in her nose and the fantastic work of a team of specialists she was on her way to recovery. That was until she discovered a pro-anorexia web site. This site, the people associated with it and the communication she had with other members of the site taught her new ways to not eat, had sections on how to lie to your parents, encourage the taking of laxatives and encourgaed that if you wanted to die from annorexia then that is your free chocie! Plus other disgusting information. (Oh yes, I know I should have blocked these sites…well we did but there are hundreds of them and new ones being releasd every day). Think about your son or daughted or someone you love more than anything being encouraged and taught how to die. Now tell me these sites shouldn’t be banned. If your child’s teacher encouraged your child to slowly kill themself, I’m sure you wouldn’t sit by and say ” well they are allowed to have free speech and their own opionion”.  These kids have a mental disorder ,the last thing they need is websites telling them to kill themselves. I had always believed in limiting media censorship until someone tried to kill my daughter via the media. Context can make a big difference to your beliefs.

    • Myron Gains says:

      10:46am | 06/09/11

      AP - Surely, treating the anorexia is a bandaid fix. 

      The root of your daughter’s problem was her self-image.  You can’t shift the blame to an external source, “someone tried to kill my daughter via the media.”

      I hate to break it to you, but she was trying to kill herself.  Why?  Talk to her, only she has the answer.

    • kaye says:

      02:25pm | 06/09/11

      Myron, annorexia is not just about self image. My sister’s bestfriend nearly died from annorexia and it had nothing to do with looking good or looking like the models on tv. It was about control. Do you think she could articulate that though? No, of course not, she was a 16 year old girl who was putting all her energy into over-exercising and under-eating. Her parents tried to talk to her and to fix things but she wanted nothing of it. It took putting her in hospital to start to see any results.  She spent two years with the feeding tube and still regularly attends therapy.

    • DS says:

      05:13pm | 06/09/11

      I’m not sure whether anorexia wards have improved or changed much in the last 15 yrs since I was a patient at one, but do they offer psychological treatment in conjunction with the feeding tube etc? If not, and your daughter is still having problems, I cannot stress enough how badly you need to invest in a good psychiatrist. And NOT necessarily one that deals with body image issues such as the councellors they had at my ward… I dearly hope that things have improved since my time in such a place, but for me, the “specialists” restricted themselves to shoving feeding tubes into me, harassing me to “just eat something” and “you can love your body at any shape blah blah blah’ when the actual issue was nothing remotely related to body image. For me, it was about wrenching some sort of control over my life -  from my loving but overbearing parents and their endless visions and ideas for my future. I felt that it was better to die than to live the rest of my life with no free will and no hope of it later in life (I come from a very concervative family, and was sexualyl abused by a friend early in life). At that time, anorexia was the only way I felt even remotely in control of my existence.  Sounds silly now, but that is why it started. I only really truly recovered when I left home and started seeing an excellent psych. Get your girl to a reputable mental health specialist. NOT your run-of-the-mill councellor - they are generally useless in such situations. Your child is/was suicidal. This was her means of achieving suicide, in much the same way another may use a more direct means of killing themselves.
      I hope I’m making sense here…and I really don’t mean to sound harsh, but you reminded me a great deal of my own mum and the things she used to say to me. The scary thing for her to realise, was that we all DO have the right to suicide if we truly feel it is the only way out of a seemingly hopeless situation. You are powerless to stop it, she will find a way if she is sufficiently determined, websites or no. All you can do is help her find a reason to WANT to live again. Forcefeeding will rarely achieve this.
      I hope she gets better if this is still happening to her now, and I am truly sorry for what your family must be going through.

    • Kaye says:

      05:32pm | 06/09/11

      @DS, I can’t talk about all facilities, but I know that my sister’s friend was offered counselling along with the feeding tube and then the parents were referred to private therapists for after she left hospital.

    • Myron Gains says:

      10:01am | 06/09/11

      Why isn’t anyone concerned with feeding/expansion/BBW websites?

      Last time I checked, there’s no ‘Anorexia Epidemic’.

      What about shaming pro-obesity or fat acceptance sites?

    • ap says:

      11:19am | 06/09/11

      No incorrect, she was trying to get better, the site was encouraging her to be annorexic. Her courage in getting better was unbelievable and she worked so hard to achieve it only then to be mentally attcked by what a website was telling her. Again, you have a misunderstanding that annorexia is all about self-image, that is what the media says annorexia is all about, it is more often about self control. She didn’t want to be thin but her mind was controling what it would let her put into her body. That is the biggest problem with this sickness is how much it is misunderstood. 99% of GP’s don’t know how to treat it as they also believe it is about self-image and often do more harm then good in their treatment. I hope you never have love one go through the pain these children have to go through with this mental illness and that is what it is a mental illness not a trendy illness about “self-image.

    • Mike Reese says:

      12:13pm | 06/09/11

      The diffrence here Mr. Gains, is that there an acceptable custom in our society to insult and shame overweight people. And the point you miss is that what is ‘overweight’ in the eyes of the fashion industry is off to an extreme level, to the point where it is as unhealthy, if not MORE so, than fat-acceptance sites, Furthermore, there is a LOT more money in conventional fashion than there is, or probably ever will be in ‘fat acceptance/pro-obesity’ sites. Some of those sites go to extremes, llke the woman who is trying to set a record for being the heaviest (I thought Guiness didn’t keep those records anymore?) The point is, is that these fashion people have too much influence over women and their personal image. Juat as a note, some of these same people tried unsuccessfully to start a ‘waif’ look for men’s fashion. Didn’t work. Keep in mind these are the same sort who were pushing ‘heroin chic’ awhile back too. And if you’r'e just naturally thin, this ain’t about you. It’s about people who push others to be thin, when that may NOT be natural for them. One last point: ever heard of the term, ‘chubby chaser’? Bet you’ve never heard ‘waif chaser’, ‘skinny chaser’, or the like. Point made. And as far as the ‘obesity epidemic’, I’d like to see the methodology behind collecting those weight statistics. Where did the data come from? How was it collected?

    • Mr GG says:

      01:00pm | 06/09/11

      @ap
      sorry but the site didn’t get on the screen by it’s self, there is a reason she typed it into the browser.
      I agree 12 year olds trying to commit suicide is a problem, but a question I would ask is what is 12 year old doing with unrestricted internet access? a 12 year old wouldn’t be allowed to stroll around kings cross so why is she on the internet which is far more dangerous than kings cross?

      Not attacking you personally but you made me realise are very big factor is Parents that don’t understand technology and its ramification giving their kids unbridled access to it. No the internet should not be censored to protect your kids, Your kids shouldn’t be on there by themselves in the first place. Again would you let them in a physical store that sold what the internet does? even if the could chat to the friends there (facebook excuses etc) you would tell them they are not stepping foot into that store. The internet is no different

    • Myron Gains says:

      02:04pm | 06/09/11

      Mr Reese, if the fashion industry has more influence over children than parents do, that’s just bad parenting.

      As for trying to discuss what’s right and wrong, eating disorders or fat acceptance, they’re fundamentally the same.  People shouldn’t be either.

      I argue that fat acceptance is a bigger (heh) problem for western societies, because there are more fat people than there are underweight.  To cite health.gov.au:

      ‘Results from this survey reveal that in 2007-08, 61.4% of the Australian population are either overweight or obese’

      http://www.health.gov.au/internet/healthyactive/publishing.nsf/Content/overweight-obesity

    • Jim says:

      10:04am | 06/09/11

      Here we go, start attacking people because they don’t know grammar because you can’t reply with a decent come back - Fail!
        Censorship is not the answer, what’s it going to do? The filter won’t stop people wanting to get to these sites anyway.
        Marilyn Munroe was a size 16, Kate Winslet was a size 16 which unfortunately she isn’t now which is a shame because she looked better when she was that size.
        People who think Size 8 is too big, wake up and snap back to reality.
      How about we ban Dolly, and Cleo magazines, and kick that idiot Alex Perry off the Modelling show.
        I can’t see anything good about seeing a woman walking down the catwork with bones protuding out of her body, yuck. Jennifer Hawkins is now too skinny, appears to be the ongoing trend.
      Getting back to this anorexia website, the companies who ares sponsoring it need to pull their sponsorship and any other financial assistance towards that website.
      Put the financial assistance towards people who need help!

    • Jim says:

      10:28am | 06/09/11

      I apologise for referring Alex Perry to an idiot.  Maybe he needs to be clearer on his terms as it appears he was referring to how the model looked inside the coffin not referring to her body. Which I believe this confusion has started this whole craze across the wonderful world of Internet.

    • Randy Marsh says:

      10:41am | 06/09/11

      I agree that promoting anorexia is bad but keep in mind that every thin girl you see is not anorexic

      I will say that its hypocritical to ban anorexia sites but allow BBW sites. Obesity is also a poor unhealthy and unattractive lifestyle choice

    • Myron Gains says:

      10:41am | 06/09/11

      Okay Jim, how about I attack your argument based on the sheer fallacy.

      For those who didn’t even watch the show, Alex Perry apparently never said Alissandra Moone was ‘fat’.  And how is he an idiot?  Being a fashion designer means that he is more of an authority on models than you or I.

      Furthermore, Marilyn Monroe was nowhere near a size 16.  She was closer to a modern US size 0 to 2.  This is fact, as explained here:

      http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-06-24/hollywood-auction-ends-myth-of-zaftig-marilyn-virginia-postrel.html

      However, you are right that censorship is not the answer.  The answer is simply common sense, education, good parenting and discipline.  Things that are clearly lacking in this day and age.

    • ap says:

      11:55am | 06/09/11

      You should take your own advice and become educated on this subject before make such ridiculous claims. Anorexia doesn’t select people without common sense or less educated people (in fact quite the opposite as it is more liklely to strike people with higher IQ’s) or only people with bad parents or people with little discipline in this “day and age” Anorexia has been written about in medical journals for around 200 years and is a mental ilnness. It is the same as someone suffering from depression or bi-polar, it is the way their mind is wired and they can’t help it. They can learn to manage it and live with it but it is an illness. When body weight drops below a certain level, rational thinking becomes very difficult and this magnifies the problems and the ability for the person to get better. The websites that are Proana don’t help at this point. Let’s differentiate between people who want to be thin or thinner and anorexics.

    • Myron Gains says:

      10:54am | 06/09/11

      Not only is it hypocritical, but obesity is arguably a bigger(heh) problem.

    • Kika says:

      12:53pm | 06/09/11

      That’s exactly what I was going to say! What about all the ‘feeder’ sites out there? NOw that’s harmful to the health!`

    • fiona says:

      01:29am | 10/09/11

      Why must people constantly bring up obesity in this discussion? It’s about pro-anorexia.
      Yes there are feeder sites and (usually) women trying to achieve the most massive weight they can (Donna Simpson for one, though she is now turning their hand to weigh loss)
      But are there thousands of obese-wannabes out there, clubbing together, sharing tips on how to gain more weight faster, posting pictures of ‘fatspo’ and self-berating themselves because they didn’t gain a pound this morning?
      Look on the web and you will find thousands apon thousands of (usually) young people participating in pro-anorexia this way. I think the point of this article is the deadly sub-culture these sites are part of that is promoting a life-threatening illness.

    • Courtney says:

      11:50am | 06/09/11

      As a member of one of these sites for many years, I was devastated when it was shut down a few days ago (by the choice of the website’s creator after 7 years). Yes, some of the sites do encourage eating disorders, however if a young man or woman is searching these things, they probably are already being affected by the disease.

      A lot of these websites are support networks, the forum I used to frequent was a community where we could help each other through rough times and be able to talk about issues that most of us were too afraid to voice to family or friends.

      You don’t seem to have considered the fact that some of these sites can be a haven for those with serious eating disorders, and focused on the fact that they “create” problems.

      A lot of the websites I was a part of banned ‘tips’ and offered ways alternative ways to do things so they were less detrimental to your health. I think if all these sites were shut down, there would be a lot more men and women with a lot more issues out there. People don’t always want to go to a therapist for the help they need, and can easily find people in similar situations who are willing to offer solutions to issues that go much deeper than “wanting to be thin”.

      Go out, spend more than one night and look at more than just a few sites before you decide that all pro ED websites should be shut down. If you want to write an opinion piece, you should at least be well informed.

    • Myron Gains says:

      11:55am | 06/09/11

      AP - You say that anorexia is a question of self-control.  I’ll accept that I (along with your claim of 99% of GPs) am not an expert in anorexia, but can you tell me where the issue of self-control arises from? 

      You say that:
      ‘She didn’t want to be thin but her mind was controling what it would let her put into her body’

      I’m having a hard time understand how if she didn’t want to be thin, why she was trying to be thin?  If it’s not a question of self-image, what is the goal of an anorexic (or bulimic, or any eating disorder) person?

    • ap says:

      12:27pm | 06/09/11

      It is a mental disorder.  Why are people suffering from depression sad,  why can’t people with cateracts see properly, they are symptoms of the illness. She did’n't want to be thin, she just didn’t want to eat or her mnd wouldn’t let her eat, her mind was controling her actions.  It is very very hard to understand until you have lived through it. We need to differentiate between people who want to be thin and people who have anorexia.  They are very different things. Can the media’s promotion of thin women or a stupid comment be the trigger, I don’t know maybe, but the specialist don’t bother to find out because it doesn’t make them better. They concentrate on getting weight back on to such an extent that their mind starts working reationaly again and then gives them coping strategies and or medication to manage the illness just like Dr’s do with many other types of illnesses…Medication and lifestyle adjustments.

    • ap says:

      12:27pm | 06/09/11

      It is a mental disorder.  Why are people suffering from depression sad,  why can’t people with cateracts see properly, they are symptoms of the illness. She did’n't want to be thin, she just didn’t want to eat or her mnd wouldn’t let her eat, her mind was controling her actions.  It is very very hard to understand until you have lived through it. We need to differentiate between people who want to be thin and people who have anorexia.  They are very different things. Can the media’s promotion of thin women or a stupid comment be the trigger, I don’t know maybe, but the specialist don’t bother to find out because it doesn’t make them better. They concentrate on getting weight back on to such an extent that their mind starts working reationaly again and then gives them coping strategies and or medication to manage the illness just like Dr’s do with many other types of illnesses…Medication and lifestyle adjustments.

    • Mr GG says:

      01:36pm | 06/09/11

      @AP
      Why are people suffering from depression sad?
      because there are issues in their life that make it less than ideal, the idea that everyone should be happy is a fallacy, people in the modern world have plenty of reason to be sad and depressed the world is not the wonderful place we are led to believe.

      Why can’t people with cateracts see properly?
      because part of the retina is floating in the vitreous humour inside the eye ball blocking the passage of light.

      these things have answers. there is a root cause, just like anorexia. Even things like bipolar and schizophrenia are being diagnosed down to root causes now days, that is the only way we will ever get a cure.

      We need to differentiate between people that have anorexia from trying to be thin(media induced) and those that have deep seated mental issues which would probably more accurately be diagnosed as depression of some kind.  Treating the depression (they are committing suicide so if they are not depressed, it is Direct Darwinism) will probably have a greater impact on their well being and recovery.

      The fact Society tries to make people depressed is a different issue. Unfortunately advertising works by convincing you you need something , if you cant get that it is disappointing. Accumulate the amount of adverts we are bombarded with and it is a lot of disappointment. It doesn’t take much more to push that disappointment to depression. Getting dumped, fired, blown off by friends let alone the real depressors like death and disease amongst family and friends can easy push some one over that point.

    • Kika says:

      01:04pm | 06/09/11

      I think this whole thing is blown out of proportion. Banning things is not the answer. If people are already using those sites chances are they are already addicted to the power and attention they get for losing weight. It’s an addiction just like everything else. What’s next? Banning online gambling because of a few who abuse them? And every other vice or issue out there? What about people who hate women getting onto misogynist forums encouraging each other to hate on women and fuelling each other’s paranoia and hatred? Why not ban them too?

      As for Kate Moss and co who are skinny - the fashion industry is run by gay men. They don’t design for women but for androgynous boxes that will make any rubbish design look flattering on them. If you don’t fit the sample sizes provided by the designers good luck trying to get a job.

      And besides, I don’t see anorexics on a daily basis - unlike the amount of people I see who are overweight. Where is the balance in the argument ?

    • Anne Stocks says:

      04:07pm | 06/09/11

      Courtney says… some of these sites can be a haven for those with serious eating disorders…You seem to be a very caring person Courtney which is commendable but you sound a little more mature then most of the young people who visit the dangerous websites that David has brought to our attention, they are indeed a serious problem that needs to be addressed.

      Yes I agree with you we all need people that we can share our deepest concerns with or even just our ups and downs and it is one reason why young people benefit greatly by having a trained Chaplin at School so they can do this. I only wish as a young person I had the same opportunity instead of making some very unwise decisions that caused a lot of heartache in my life and of which I still suffer from one because of being Bulimic for 10 years. Yes I thought I knew everything.. I remember saying very boldly with much assurance to my Boss at the time ..... “I’m very intelligent and know everything” of course I was later to realise that the look he gave me said it all… “baby you will learn” and I did indeed and I’m still learning but being very immature with no life wisdom what seemed at the time a good way to deal with my issues turned out to be life threatening and even sadly contributed to the death of my little ones. 

      I’m a Christian now and have a very strong faith in God who Loves me greatly as He does everyone but He also created us with a need to interact with people. I’m disabled and live alone except for my two dogs and as much as I love them… well have you ever tried to have a deep and meaningful with a dog. I have been posting a long time on many websites and have been very blessed although at times hurt. I have shared with a lot of people and I agree with you if they shut these websites down for whatever reason it would leave a big whole in my life but I have also been exposed to some pretty disturbing websites but of course I had the maturity to choose to click off.

      We must protect our young people and this is where David’s focus is at and I commend him for it but I also appreciate how you feel Courtney and what you say has value but there is a great danger for our young people if these websites are allowed to offer their horrific advise to impressionable minds so they do indeed have to be banned, because regardless of why our young people are suffering from eating disorders they still use these websites and so are in great danger but yes perhaps the positive ones need to be promoted more and not just banned too.

      Thank you for sharing your concerns Courtney - Kind regards - Anne

    • Mike Reese says:

      05:11pm | 06/09/11

      There seems to be a point of mentioning the presence of obesity in our society (increasing) as a counterpoint to this discussion of anorexia. Automatically gainsaying the speaker(s) by saying, in effect, ‘well, what about this?’, changes nothing. It does NOT mitigate against the negative factor(s) of anorexia, and it does NOT change the fact that, as a group, overweight persons suffer far more discrimination than do extremely thin people, and much more likely to be criticized for their appearance. And as far as the argument, “I see a lot more overweight than anorexics”, (I am paraphrasing here, not quoting verbatim), that is hardly a valid statement. Most people, unless they are VERY well traveled, see only a small subset of human society at any time - you can’t go on what you see only, since we all don’t really see all that many (different) people on a daily basis. I could just as well claim that people are getting slimmer, if I go by my seeing more slender people day by day.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      09:40pm | 06/09/11

      Mike Reese says: There seems to be a point of mentioning the presence of obesity in our society (increasing) as a counterpoint to this discussion of anorexia….Thank you Mike and very True what you say we do need to focus on what the concern that David has brought to our attention and not camouflage it by bringing in other issues.

      Yes overweight people do present with issues but unless they are very Obese their condition is not life threatening although it can cause discomfort and other health problems, but this is not True with those suffering from Anorexic, it often leads to death,  the satieties are frightening and so very sad.

      I appreciated your reasoning also Mike and yes it cannot be denied, even if I sit at a bus stop for a few hours and watch people go by compared to the vast population I will see very few in comparison…

      I find it interesting that if they are trying to sell a DIE…ET product,  suddenly everyone they show walking down the street is overweight and therefore we all need to buy their merchandise…Yes the power of advertising and the danger of it,  this is why there is so much confusion today no one is really sure what is genuine anymore,  like the value of a person instead of their wealth, credentials or position ...they say it’s lonely at the top perhaps they have pushed everyone out of the way getting there but not all, our Boss David is a real goodie ...I must get that $5.00 off him… oh I forgot the card also said good looking and not to forget to mention a good cook .. how about that a hat trick.

      Thanks again Mick it’s great to see men who are willing to make a stand for what they believe instead of backing down because of opposition,  I hope they didn’t the mould away they used for you and David…men of integrity need to be uplifted and commended….woman too,  this inner strength,  like others has more value then what can be seen outwardly in regard to their appearance.

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Myron Gains says:

      09:43am | 07/09/11

      Mike, you are obviously an obesity denier.

      I am well travelled, and the comparison between Australia and other countries (particularly asian countries) is enormous (heh).

      But regardless, anecdotal evidence has no real weight (heh) in an argument like this.  This is why I did not say ‘I see a lot more overweight people than anorexics’, I said that there are.  Fact.

      Just by numbers alone, obesity is a bigger (heh) problem.  It affects more people and puts more weight (heh) on the health system as a whole.

      I am however, not saying we should ignore anorexia or other eating disorders.  It’s just that obesity is the ‘elephant in the room’.  Pardon that pun as well, please.

    • MR says:

      08:54pm | 06/09/11

      Take full length mirrors out of the house while kids are between 8 and 17! Kids are tooooo self absorbed!!

    • Anne Stocks says:

      05:47am | 07/09/11

      I wonder where it comes from? ....They say Children are like wet cement it’s not just what we say but what we do that they are imprinted with.

      They need to feel respected and valued and to know they are not just a commodity for us when we have the time spare,  our Love for them needs to be sacrificial , the values we teach and show by our example is what will be reflected in their lives and what they will pass on to their children. If our focus is on outward things as being the most important instead of inner beauty and strength of Character, theirs will be too. They need to know we will protect them from harm and that they can Trust what we say and to comforted when they are hurting and that it’s ok to cry even if your a boy.

      A Child needs to have a feeling of self-worth by feeling that they are important to us and to others,  much more important then our sport or hobbies, or friends and even work. They need Lots ...Lots of affirmation and to be encouraged to achieve and rewarded for doing so,  they also need our guidance and Loving discipline. To stand up for what is good and to look for others and their own strengths instead of focusing on weaknesses and shortcomings,  to have compassion and tolerance for others and consider them as important and of value, to show kindness to them and to forgive them and others so they can learn from their own mistakes and how to put them behind and move on.  They need to respect those in authority, adults, their peers and then they will respect themselves.. In other words Children need to be shown by our example and words that they are needed and Loved everyday and are a blessing to us and we need to be patient with them and overlook what isn’t really going to make a big difference in the grand scheme of things.

      But most important they need like us to know their Creator Loves them and to respect Him, having assurance that He want’s what is best for them and to be thankful for His blessings so they can Trust Him and us, and then even if we mess up and they come to realise we aren’t perfect yet, they will always remember He is and is always there for them.

      What they see in the mirror will reflect what they feel about themselves, if the image is cloudy and distorted in their view they may try to clean it up in destructive ways, if it is clear they may still go through needing to feel in control but it won’t be in a harmful ways.

      P.S They need lots and lost of Hugs and to Laugh and have fun too. ... how do I know all this ... I was a Child, perhaps I still am inside.

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Jim says:

      10:27am | 07/09/11

      BMI is not an indicator of being fat. You are trying to tell me that Ronnie Coleman, Dextor Jones, Jay Cutler or even Arnold Schwarzenegger back in his hey day were all obese? Their BMI’s would have been through the roof!

      Let me see,  Arnold Schwarzenegger 180cm and 105kg, that is a BMI of 32.1 which is considered obese.  I don’t think Arnie was overweight considering he won 7 Mr. Olympias with the above weight.
      As for Jay Cutler who is around 120kg, his BMI would be almost near 40.
      I don’t understand how BMI can be formally used?

    • feed up says:

      05:27pm | 07/09/11

      I am sick of having to put up with watching every TV show and magazine layout feature beautiful slim girls. It is just depressing.  Why not have a government law that stipulates that all females on television, or in photgraghs in magazines are a minimum of size 16.  Even make it a law that Miss Australia must be a size 14 or 16.  That will gradually brainwash people to regard these slim types as having something wrong with them.  I am a size 16 and I regard myself as healthly.

    • Myron Gains says:

      10:00am | 08/09/11

      feed up - you may regard yourself as healthy, but it couldn’t be further from the truth.  You are very much unhealthy, in mind and body.

      Models over size 12 are unpopular because they are unattractive.  This is why there will never be a size 12+ Miss Australia winner.

      Regardless of your personal beliefs as to what size is appropriate or not, you are calling for state level brainwashing.

      Good luck with your insanity goals in 2011.

    • Recovering says:

      07:53pm | 09/09/11

      Pro-ana and Pro-Mia disgust me. I’ve battled Anorexia (REAL anorexia, not wannabe stuff like the ‘pros’) for most of my life - and it feels like a slap in the face, a belittlement of the agony I have lived to see these sites. Anorexia and Bulimia are not lifestyle choices like diets that you choose to start and choose to finish. They are not a choice at all for those who genuinely suffer from them. What’s more, these sites perpetuate common mythical stereotypes branding us as ‘vain, silly spoilt brats’ who care only about our weight and how we look.
      Models have never been thinspo to me. In fact, most of them appear ‘huge’ to me with my screwed up perceptions and the reality of my own weight (as low as a BMI 9 at times). And I was never proud of my own emaciation, I was ashamed. I’d turned myself into a monster and yet I was so trapped.
      It’s never really about food and weight - it’s about coping with what you can’t cope with in the wrong ways. It’s about self-punishment and self-hatred and “I’m so unworthy and horrible and everything bad in the world is my fault and the only way I can seem to atone for it is by removing myself kilo by kilo.”  It’s about having a monster screaming at you 24/7 inside your own mind, that you never, ever get away from - a drill sergent-Cruella DeVille-Devil-Demon type monster that makes the Commando from biggest loser look insane, and wants to destroy you rather than build your self esteem.
      Another thing that irritates me and just kind of blows my mind? The majority of Pro-Ana people I have had the displeasure to read sites of - happen to be very overweight to obese, using Ana to describe their attempts to reach a ‘normal’ weight. That is so screwed up it’s not funny…

    • Willbefitandhealthysoon says:

      06:21pm | 11/09/11

      I am big boned and have no thyroid gland and although it makes it difficult for me to lose weight, it’s no excuse that I am size 14 going on 16 when I used to be a size 12 with proper diet and exercise and that size was ideal for me.  Size 10 I had to exercise three hours a day and being 10 years older now I don’t have the energy or time having a fulltime job, extensive travelling time and a 13 year old son.  Yes I have to work harder than most to maintain a size10/12 figure but it’s not an excuse for me to be this size. I have, to my own shame and detriment let myself go. 

      Saying that, I have been a size 8 which made me look anorexic and unnaturally thin (was eating like a rabbit and only once a day) .  My boyfriend at the time encouraged me to starve because all he cared about that I looked like a ‘bird’ to be ‘fit on his arm’.  Ironically, he was an overweight and somewhat unattractive metal-head with no job or fashion sense, a 20 cone a day marijuana habit, who had no care in the world about feeding his own hyper appetite and addiction (Amazing how self-delusional some people are).  Needless to say my taste has improved exponentially since then and I now have a man who says as long as I am happy with myself and my body, he is happy and our sex life is more active than most.  (No, he doesn’t encourage me to eat to my heart’s content either)

 

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