He was a husband, a father, a son, a lover of food and four-wheel drives and a passionate soldier.

Jared with his wife Beckie and daughter Annabell. Picture: ADF

And now there is a chance that Lance-Corporal Jared MacKinney might be remembered because of the furore that erupted over footage of the Opposition Leader uttering the phrase ``s—t happens’’ during a discussion about how the young man lost his life in Afghanistan.

If this incident leads to the downfall of Tony Abbott, it would be a tragedy and another sad footnote in the events surrounding the death of a fine, respected soldier.

Lance-Cpl MacKinney deserves better, far, far better, given who he was and what he did than to be remembered for this. In his widow Beckie’s words, the Channel 7 news on Tuesday night was like a scab being ripped off a wound that is in the early stages of healing.

She saw herself on TV at his funeral. She saw images of him and them together and all because of something that was not really news.

The behaviour of the reporter, pulling a statement out of context and twisting it, has disappointed her, she says. I would use stronger words.

Beckie is my friend and it has been a learning experience to watch the behaviour of some members of my profession around Lance-Cpl MacKinney’s death and the events that followed.

Many have been ethical and dignified. Some have displayed appalling predatory behaviour that is embarrassing.

Beckie is sad today, not because of what Abbott said, but because the most traumatic event in her 26 years is again the subject of discussion, public opinion and criticism.

S—t does happen, Beckie says. She knows this because it has happened to her.

Apart from the shock and trauma of having her 28-year-old husband die suddenly in a land far away a little over five months ago, Beckie has endured television footage of the firefight in which he died, the suggestion that he died because of poor military decision-making and now the Abbott saga, without warning.

The stories were just there on the nightly news.

The journalists breaking the stories did not notify her about those stories airing.

It is hard for a family that is tiptoeing through grief. It is hard when they are fragile and tears are still at the surface.

If her husband had died in a car crash, Beckie’s and her family’s grief would be as painful but it would be private.

Because he was slain in a war zone, as a member of the army and during an operation the Federal Government felt the nation needed to be a part of, everything is different.

That he was such a passionate soldier and so proud to be a part of the effort in Afghanistan helps Beckie get through each day.

She has had, from the beginning, an unshakable belief that everything was in order the day her husband was shot. The boys were well trained, the right equipment was available and the action was well planned.

The Premier, Opposition Leader and Prime Minister were present at Lance-Cpl MacKinney’s funeral, when his beautiful widow was racked with the unthinkable combination of inconsolable grief and labour pains. The leaders were all deeply compassionate towards Beckie and her family. Beckie said Abbott was a decent and good person, treating her and the reverence of the funeral with care and concern. He was the same when he called her on Tuesday night to discuss the Channel 7 story.

Beckie cares not a jot about politics, or the kerfuffle around this latest event. She says her husband would not have cared less, either.

The ``s—t happens’’ drama will die down and life will go on for Beckie.

She is so strong for one who has lost so much in such horrific circumstances. Her response to that observation is ``I have to be. I have two babies to look after.’‘

Since her husband died, Beckie has given birth to their son Noah, celebrated their daughter Annabell’s third birthday, endured their first Christmas apart in 10 years and suffered through the loneliness on their fifth wedding anniversary.

Life goes on, as it must. Noah, a beautiful boy, is teething. Annabell has started kindergarten. The soldiers who were with Lance-Cpl MacKinney in Afghanistan his closest mates are back with their wives and girlfriends. Beckie’s circle of friends has changed shape.

She has remarkable family support, but is ultimately without the love of her life.

On Sunday, after taking her children to the beach at Happy Valley near Caloundra, Beckie realised that her husband’s stainless steel wedding ring had slipped from her hand in the sea or on the sand.

She had lost another token of him, of them and of their too-short life together. She is bereft, but says there is no point wishing for the situation to be different.

It is gone, like he is gone.

More than anyone in this whole sorry saga, Beckie knows first-hand that despite the best-laid plans and the biggest hopes and dreams, the most unthinkable things can happen.

Jane Fynes-Clinton is a Courier-Mail columnist

299 comments

Show oldest | newest first

    • Erick says:

      05:04am | 10/02/11

      This slimy attack by Channel Seven was harmful to everyone involved. Does anyone have a list of the companies that advertise on their news programme?

    • TChong says:

      06:21am | 10/02/11

      Starting a boycott Ecks ?
      Kochie will drop you off his Facebook friends page.

    • Warren says:

      06:28am | 10/02/11

      Yes, and the Liberal Party is on that list. Are you going to boycott them Erick?

    • KH says:

      07:00am | 10/02/11

      Tony Abbott is the problem.  Boycott him.  The man is an embarassment to us all.

    • Felipe says:

      08:26am | 10/02/11

      kh, what you should have said is channel 7 should apologise to the widow for this debacle they created.

    • ClaireP says:

      08:45am | 10/02/11

      The replys show your ignorance, disrespect and twisted incapacity to see what is clear to everyone else.

      The moderators must be embarrassed to post your replies and comments - it is a sad reflection on the quality of some of their readers.

      Erick - I agree, Channel 7 have insulted Abbott, the public and a grieving family. Email their advertising department and seek a list of their advertisers. Many people are doing the same.

    • TChong says:

      09:24am | 10/02/11

      That’ll teach ‘em ClaireP.
      How wise were Chris and Pixie to divest themselves, when they did.?
      The networks have no enemy mightier than an outraged Puncher.

    • Andew says:

      09:29am | 10/02/11

      Warren and KH, did you read the story?

    • Sad Sad Reality says:

      09:57am | 10/02/11

      Explain to me how it was an attack Erick? And explain to me how it was slimy? Channel Seven waited for ages to have the footage cleared to show, then the reporter asks Tony Abbot to explain why he said what he said and put it in context and the guy stares back at him like Mike Tyson at a pre-fight press conference. This is a statesman? This is a leader capable of representing us to the world? The sad thing is, Erick, the guy was trying to show how hard he was to our military. I can’t think of a lamer, sadder, more pathetic excuse for behaviour from an adult. I don’t want him in charge of a Scout Troop let alone our military.

    • Warren says:

      09:59am | 10/02/11

      Yes Andew did you? There is background material to this story you need to know about. Abbot’s trip to Afghanistan was politically motivated. He wanted to demonstrate that Labor was not supporting the troops adequately by linking Lance-Corporal Jared MacKinney’s death to the government’s lack of funding. He failed and made a silly if essentially harmless remark.

      Channel 7 are guilty of asking him questions about that remark and the context in which it was made. Abbott was unable to deal with the question like an adult. If there was a debacle, Abbott was the author.

    • Andrew says:

      10:27am | 10/02/11

      I know the background warren, but this was not the first time abbott visited the troops was it, so were the other times political motivated to, just because he got a email saying things were not done properly doesnt mean that was the only reason he went there. Once he went there he had a obligation to see if it was done properly didnt he. So its okay for 7 to ask him about the context why showing film that takes everything out of context, There story wasnt about wether the trip was politically motivated was it or about the governments funding was it so what do you think it was about, its prietty obvious to a majority people exactly what it was about. Funny when the %%^& hit the fan channel seven decided there was no story with the afganistan stuff only with abbotts reaction. Tuesday night it was a ground breaking story, Wednesday night there was no story at all except for abbotts reaction.

    • Rose says:

      10:52am | 10/02/11

      Yes Andrew, every visit to the troops by every politician is politically motivated. Do you seriously think they would go if they didn’t have to?

    • persephone says:

      10:55am | 10/02/11

      Yes, Andrew.

      Abbott had a perfectly reasonable answer to Riley’s question, “What is the context?”

      Instead of just giving it, he chose to stare at Riley in silence.

      If he hadn’t - if he’d just anwered the question - there wouldn’t be a problem.

      When you say, “But you’ve got to understand the context…” or wtte, surely you would expect that the next question would ask you to explain the context.

      There’s no need for silences, dignified or otherwise, when you’ve been asked a perfectly reasonable question.

    • Rover of North Cooma says:

      11:41am | 10/02/11

      @pers - no, you say “I never intended to disrespect this soldier or any member of the ADF, and if I have offended anyone, I’m very sorry.” And if you don’t want to answer any further questions, walking away would be a better look than a staring competition.

      I think Jane raises the real issue - why didn’t Seven give the widow any warning that they were about to run this story? They might even have been able to ask her if she was offended. Although, as she wasn’t, it might have cruelled the story if Seven had to pretend to be offended on the family’s behalf.

      Journos don’t understand how distressing it is to be part of a story, although Mark Riley probably has some idea right now!

    • Andrew says:

      11:48am | 10/02/11

      So perse, you dont think the fact that he had just being accused of making light of a soldiers death couldnt had made him a bit angry. He made had known about the interview but he wouldnt had known they would accuse him of that. How would you react when accused of something like that when it wasnt true, prietty sure most peoples reactions would something you wouldnt want to catch on camera. Maybe he didnt handle it perfectly but he could had handled it a whole lot worse. Yes Rose most things are politically motivated but im prietty sure warren is trying to say the trip was more politically motivated then normal, but its not the first time abbott has visited and he has a long history of supporting the army, so there is nothing to say this trip wouldnt have happen anyway.

    • Warren says:

      12:08pm | 10/02/11

      The irony is that the concocted outrage coming from Abbott’s supporters is keeping the story in the news. The last thing Abbott wants.

    • Dissident says:

      12:14pm | 10/02/11

      Sad, Sad Reality - I think the description you have given of Abbott as Tyson is masterful - though perhaps not for the reason you intended.

      The truly great boxers (Tyson, Louis, early Foreman) had their opponents beaten before they stepped into the ring. The baleful stare that said “I will destroy you” shattered their resolve before they had even laced up the gloves. Watch the opponent get in the ring with false bravado that evaporates the second the bell goes.

      Keating’s technique was similar but more obvious - witness his “I’m gonna do you slowly” - but he had the same capacity to bat aside idiotic questions from pest reporters.

      All pollies have blooper reels (Richard Court had a pearler that they showed on TV about 15 years ago) and this will almost certainly get on the list for TA. I just can’t see anyone other than the highly partisan Labor supporters thinking that it is a character flaw. Likewise, only the highly partisan Liberal supporters will think that Julia Gillard’s tears in Parliament were crocodile tears.

      The rest of the non-partisan people (the majority of us) will think that both were non-events.

    • Brad Coward says:

      03:28pm | 10/02/11

      Word has it that Jarod MacKinney’s family has taken no offence.  At the end of the day, it’s their opinion that matters the most.

      How about we agree to stop feeding the dragon ?

    • Gary says:

      04:27pm | 10/02/11

      Brad,

      Please don’t call Persphone a dragon…no matter how accurate it might be.

    • Bill says:

      04:29pm | 10/02/11

      @ Pers,

      Why does he have to answer the question?

    • Richard Kriekhaus says:

      04:38pm | 10/02/11

      I believe the reporter invoved was fortunate not to have his nose broken. Tony Abbott exercised self control as most men would simply let loose. The fact the he did not speak you could have put a caption next to the picture (keep calm mate don’t hit him it will only make things worse). Listen we all say things at the spur of the moment that may not be appropriate but Tony proved self restraint by not exploding into a fit of rage at this shameful display of journalism which has needlessly hurt the ones that are hurting. Is the media that desperate for a story that they have to resort to trampling over people to catch someone out? Shame, shame, shame I say.

    • persephone says:

      06:35pm | 10/02/11

      Oh, I don’t mind if Abbott never answers a question again, and instead treats all approaches by the media with dignified silence.

      But don’t pretend the question wasn’t a perfectly reasonable one.

      In context, of course.

    • TimB says:

      08:20pm | 10/02/11

      Perse, there was nothing reasonable about the question. They set out from the start to make him look bad. That was always the goal. That is NOT reasonable, in any universe.

    • persephone says:

      09:36pm | 10/02/11

      TimB

      what are you implying here? That it’s only fair when journos set out to make Tony look good?

      So I take it you’ll be screaming blue murder next time someone in the media asks a question to make Julia look bad?

      Look, anyone with half a brain could have answered Riley’s question in such a way that they looked at least OK, if not good.

      Abbott has been given an easy run by the media up until now. They’ve skated over misdeeds and misspokes which they would have crucified another pollie for. Thus, he had come to regard them all as mates and buddies.

      He must have expected (knowing that the question was coming, because Riley had forewarned him) that Riley wouldn’t follow up the question about context and would leave it there.

      He was gobsmacked - quite literally - not because of the question, but because someone in the media was being firm with him, asking a question and expecting an answer.

      They’re not supposed to do that.

      That’s only meant to happen to members of the Labor party.

      Politicians get asked hard questions every day, some of which cast very nasty aspertions about their morality and judgement. 

      What’s the saying about heat and kitchens?

    • Richard says:

      07:45am | 11/02/11

      Are you completely daft woman?
      Tony Abbott new what he was going to be asked 2 months in advanced…knew the questions. And he even knew when the initial FOI request for the tape was made it’s content….
      Neither you not Tony can cry poor or cry about character assassinations… He failed… He knew he blew it. The thickness and gullibility of this audience is histerical…
      And as for the gist of this story playing the remembrance violin that the soldier will only be remembered by Tony Abbotts inability to answer an easy question… Well get real folks… If you keep writing it up about the crappy side of things and Abbotts stupidity then that’s all people will remember… Journalists and politicians colluding…
      Jane it’s almost as if you’re trying to help a liberal politician with diversion…

    • Karen says:

      08:38am | 11/02/11

      Thankyou jane i felt so sorry for beckie and family when i saw this channel 7 and mark riley have alot to answer for the fact they didnt even ring her to let her know this was going to air was totally disgusting she has had enough grieve and loss and to see this brought up again for what ratings ????
      i agree channel 7 and mark riley should ring beckie and her family to apologise

    • TimB says:

      09:08am | 11/02/11

      No I’m saying reporters should be asking questions in the public interest ONLY. They should not be going out of their way to manufacture things to make politicians look good or bad.

      Ask questions on the relevant issues, then let the cards fall where they may. If Riley had been asking a question about say…Tony’s proposed spending cuts to fuel the flood damage fund & Tony had reacted the way he did here you’d be well within reason to jump all over him.

      And yes, if you subbed Julia into the situation Tony found himself in this week, I’d still be condemning the reporter.

    • I' malone says:

      09:29am | 11/02/11

      I don’t believe the question was a “perfectly reasonable one” Pers.  It is another instance of the media creating a story rather than reporting on one.  Thereis certainly no point to the question if the journo expected a reasonable answer, and he probably wouldn’t have asked it if he thought there would be one.  If Abbott had given a reasonable answer, we would be talking about something else; the interview would not have made it on air.  And to put MY comment in context, I don’t like or trust TA as a politician, but think he could be a pretty good bloke.

    • Embarassed to be a Lib supporter says:

      10:46am | 11/02/11

      But the question WAS perfectly reasonable. Tony had made a huge deal out of our troops being under-equipped and ill-equipped. In this clip, he clearly agrees that this is not the case. However, he came back to Australia and continued to campaign on the basis that our troops were under-equipped and ill-equipped, with the sole ‘concession’ of dropping the tanks.

      The journo was clearly going to follow up the context of the remark with a ‘please explain why you then continued to claim they weren’t…’ question. Obvious. No wonder he didn’t want to answer.

      Mind you, its par for course, but why anyone is getting het up about him being sprung is beyond me. It should have been, could have been, civilised, but for Tony.

    • Karen says:

      04:31pm | 15/02/11

      The slimy attack started with OPPOSITION defence spokesman David Johnston when he called for “another 300 Australian troops to be sent to Afghanistan”, following claims Diggers that were there didn’t have enough support when Lance-Corporal Jared MacKinney died.
      Abbotts ‘Shit happened” in reply to that.

    • Ripa says:

      05:22am | 10/02/11

      Thankyou Jane about time we found out about the man and soldier and his family.

    • Zoe says:

      09:42pm | 10/02/11

      This is the way he should be remembered. As a family man missed by his young wife and kids. Reading this article brings it all back into perspective. Its good to hear how Becky feels instead of jumping in taking political sides like so many on here have.

    • TimB says:

      05:27am | 10/02/11

      Good article Jane. This is what it was really about.

      For all the grubs yesterday who said that the reporter was just doing his job & the story was somehow in the public interest…. I hope you read the above and take a good hard look at yourselves.
      This family did not deserve to have this all dragged up again just so Channel 7 could score cheap points off Tony Abbott.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      07:40am | 10/02/11

      I see tiny tim is back on his high horse again. this article is just a continuation of pain this poor widow and her family is feeling. I bet she would prefer these articles or any side article would just stop. I’m not surprised to see you supporting such articles.

    • Andrew says:

      09:35am | 10/02/11

      Rob. Your the one on the high horse, some people just cant admit there wrong. You obviously couldnt give a stuff about the widow feelings or you would be condeming channel 7. Didnt channel 7 come out yesterday and say the real story was Tony Abbott’s reaction. So one day the story was newsworthy, the next day it wasnt.

    • TimB says:

      10:25am | 10/02/11

      Rob, I suppose when you’re down in the dirt with the other grubs, then everyone looks like they’re high up to you .

      You wern’t concerned with the pain of Corporal MacKinney’s family yesterday when you were happily laying the boot into Abbot. I highly doubt you’re concerned with it now.

      This article isn’t just another one raking through the tragedy this family has suffered to score points. The point of this one is to get the rest of the jackal media pack to lay off.
      No wonder you don’t support the article, if the rest of the media pays attention to it, the story drops and you won’t be able to use it to attack Abbott any more.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      11:41am | 10/02/11

      TimB says:10:25am; sure tiny tim… dribble…dribble…snivel…snivel… you got an umbrella?

    • TimB says:

      04:24pm | 10/02/11

      Why Rob? Are you dribbling on me?

      You do say snivel and dribble an awful lot. I can only assume you’re describing your current actions to those of us fortunate enough not to be able to see you in person.

    • DSh says:

      04:41pm | 10/02/11

      TimB, Channel 7 were blockaded from this information since October of last year and had to fight a lengthy Freedom of Information process to procure it, why did the LNP not want this footage getting out? If it was so innocent - why not give it to the media with an explanation? The truth is, yes s### does happen but you cannot say that if you are a high-level politician. Get down off your high horse and look at the situation objectively. RIP to the fallen and my deepest sympathies to the widow.

    • Kaditha says:

      10:51am | 11/02/11

      Its worse than that TimB.

      The family did not deserve to have Jared’s good name dragged through the media in the first place. He was used as the poster boy of the claim that our ADF were poorly equipped, remember? Do you remember which politician and party made that claim? Yep. The one being asked to explain the context.

      Short memories, you got short memories…

    • Overflow says:

      05:31am | 10/02/11

      There is no doubt Ch7 decided to “go after” Abbott afetr his office attempted to block FOI requests.  To listen to your fellow journalists exclaim TA’s office should shoulder some of the blame in this hamfisted “gotcha” makes me feel sick.  Mark Riley knows he stuffed it and spent yesterday trying to explain to any radio station that would listen.  I would hope at some stage Riley has the guts to ring Beckie (as Abbott did) and apologise.

    • Tony of Poorakistan says:

      07:55am | 10/02/11

      Fat chance. He is a journalist which is only a small step above a lawyer or an insurance salesman in terms of willingness to prostitute the truth for profit. Why would he care about Mrs MacKinney’s grief?
       
      Riley is lower than the balls on a kneeling dachshund.

    • DOVIF says:

      09:50am | 10/02/11

      Still a bit higher then the ALP supporters that we have on this thread

    • Kika says:

      11:24am | 10/02/11

      So if there was nothing to hide, why would they refuse the FOI requests?

    • Lindsay says:

      04:10pm | 10/02/11

      Kika,

      The FOI requests were blocked because it showed footage of abbot shooting a gun which was deemed harmful to his image by the party. Channel 7 only picked up on the *S—T Happens* remark while they were looking for something completely different.

    • LAD says:

      05:41am | 10/02/11

      She deserves an apology from Mark Riley and Channel 7 for using the death of her husband as a means to TRY and slander Abbott. Cruel and disgusting journalism.

    • Bob says:

      06:26am | 10/02/11

      LAD - I couldn’t agree more.

    • Vaunted says:

      08:47am | 10/02/11

      Peter Meakin’s grubby fingerprints were all over this. Mark Riley might have fired the bullets but Meakin almost certainly made them. Like a bitter and twisted old man, Meakin’s idea of a story ‘in the public interest’ is to drag others down into the dirt. Looks like his methods might have backfired this time though, as Seven will have lost a lot of viewers.

    • Against the Man says:

      05:51am | 10/02/11

      Mark Riley you should be ashamed of yourself. You can act like you did nothing wrong but we all know your journalistic low will be your ultimate legacy.

      Lance-Cpl MacKinney should be remembered as a great individual who defended our country and that we have lost a wonder potential.

    • Concerned Citizen says:

      11:13am | 10/02/11

      His wiki page already mentions it, well it did yesterday

    • Andrew1 says:

      05:59am | 10/02/11

      Watching 7 and Mark Riley last night defending himself was enough for me. Hope their ratings drop through the floor.

    • JAJB says:

      08:24am | 10/02/11

      I’m with you Andrew. I normally watch the 7 bulletin but switched of in frustration last night after about 7 mins of them trying to justify themselves and take the moral high ground. Also the fact the leading “news” stories included Hurley and Warnie getting together and some fashion show somewhere.  There’s 10 minute of my life I wont get back.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      06:01am | 10/02/11

      I wonder how your new friend Beckie likes having her life poured out on these pages. Your as bad if not worst then the empty silence that was all that rAbbott could give in the wake of being shown the insensitive comments he made. Shame on the author… more gutter journalism

    • Deep Thinker says:

      06:38am | 10/02/11

      You have just joined the ranks of the clan of insensitive muchrakers. Maybe somebody might go back 8 months into your posts to do some muckraking on you.

    • TimB says:

      07:03am | 10/02/11

      @ Deep thinker.

      Just joined? Rob has been a member for quite a while. I heard they were considering him for leader.

      No need to go back 8 months into his posts. They’re all pretty much the same: “snivelling libs ...rAbbott…hate hate hate bile hate bile”. It’s like reading the demented ravings of an angry 12-year old. But with less thought behind it.

    • Deep Digger says:

      07:20am | 10/02/11

      Here you go, Deep Thinker.

      “Abbott I hope you have a really nasty accident over the holidays now that would not only be very funny but also a benefit to all Australians… make it slow and painful ” - Rob r Charteris

      http://www.thepunch.com.au/articles/wild-rivers-run-deep/

      What a slimy comment.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      07:35am | 10/02/11

      Deep Thinker says:06:38am; “Maybe somebody might go back 8 months into your posts to do some muckraking on you.”

      go on, Knock yourself out.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      08:14am | 10/02/11

      Deep Digger says:07:20am; and it couldn’t happen to a more deserving bloke.

      Oh tiny tim where’s the love. On your anaology that would make you a 2 yr old. Perhaps Deep Thinker after sucking back a cone or three can wipe that snotty nose of yours.

    • VVS says:

      08:17am | 10/02/11

      No one takes Rob’s comments that seriously…

      He is part of a certain group of commentors (from both sides of political supporters) that will always tow their respective party lines and slag off the other.

      If people like Rob r Charteris, TChong, persephone, TimB and MarK were to post what they respected or agreed with the other party, then people might actually take more account of their opinion.

      Otherwise it’s just the usual left and right slagging off on each other like kids in the playground.

    • Deep Digger says:

      09:09am | 10/02/11

      You have a point, VVS, but there is more to it.

      Rob’s comment goes beyond mere partisan barracking. It displays a level of venomous hatred that borders on the pathological.

    • Andrew says:

      09:39am | 10/02/11

      You area sick person, dont come on here pretending you give a stuff about the widows feelings.

    • TimB says:

      10:39am | 10/02/11

      VVS, please don’t lump me or the others in with Rob.

      Yes I lean towards the Liberals, and disagree with much of what Labor does, but if they do come up with a good idea I will give them credit.
      First example that comes to mind was an article on nuclear power last year by Mark Bishop. Complete agreement on that.

      There are other examples around too. Granted they’re rare, but like I said I have my own thoughts and viewpoints, and I’m entitled to have them, no matter which way they trend. It would be stupid of me to make sure I split my opinions in a nice 50/50 arrangement to each side.

      TChong, MarK, and Persephone also put their own thoughts into their viewpoints. We might disagree on them (sometimes spectaculary so) but we can at least have a proper discussion on them.

      Rob’s posts however show him up to be just a nasty vile piece of work. Like Deep Digger says there is a real, deep-seated hatred there indicative of some deep psychlogical problem.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      11:37am | 10/02/11

      Andrew says:09:39am; typical snivelling lib trying to turn the issue around or into something else quite sad really. Trying t blame someone else for their leaders mistake another typically lib thing to do but we all see through it.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      11:47am | 10/02/11

      TimB says:10:39am; with the crap you post about the ALP and or Gillard puts you in the same company tiny tim, obviously other bar you agree. Here! have a grub to munch on… <swipe> ...easy camper there is plenty to go around. Oh you want one for the imaginary dragon.

    • Likes Joining Dots says:

      11:58am | 10/02/11

      @VVS - great point.

      I’ve always thought there should be a section on The Punch for swinging voters.

      Punching Swingers? Swinging Punchers? I really have to work on a better name before this takes off.

      Then again, it would probably cut down the number of comments posted -  and truth be told, I’d miss being pigeon holed as a redneck, right wing, commie loving,  welfare dependant, bleeding heart who’s born to rule in my red ivory castle with 7 kids.

    • hot tub political machine says:

      12:21pm | 10/02/11

      A man after my own heart dot joiner. My favourtie here was being called a Howard “fanboy” and a “leftard” in the space of 48 hours

    • TimB says:

      12:30pm | 10/02/11

      I believe my point has been proven. Yet again.

    • VVS says:

      02:32pm | 10/02/11

      TimB
      Thank you for your reply. I am more than happy to you remove you from that list. My apologies.

      Rob’s comments today however are, by and large, downright nasty and rude and probably symptoms of other underlying issues. Hopefully its just a bad day…

    • TimB says:

      04:30pm | 10/02/11

      @VVS

      A bad day. If only that were true.

      Sadly, Rob is always like this. It’s a personality problem

    • Likes Joining Dots says:

      04:43pm | 10/02/11

      @ hot tub political machine

      I did read the article you were referring to. I think to be accused of left and right wing sympathies within 48 hours on the same post must be a personal best.

      To be fair, I would also like to add (so as not to tar everyone with the same brush). I have not seen the sort of behaviour I describe from some posters on the list provided by VVS (eg TChong, persephone, TimB and MarK) whose comments can be funny, informative and infuriating - often all at the same time.

    • hot tub political machine says:

      09:07am | 11/02/11

      Chongy (for the left) and MarK (for the right) make a lot more sense when you realise they don’t intend every post to be taken literally. If you thought they were 100% serious you would get angry, when you realise they have a sense of humour they are awesome posters

    • asproella says:

      06:18am | 10/02/11

      This is a discrace just for a headline they attack a family that has just lost thier son and husban ,channel seven sould apologise to the family ..

    • persephone says:

      06:25am | 10/02/11

      So what is this article doing, then, if not making her grief an item for public display?

      I find this whole article too tacky for words. I was at first reluctant to comment on it.

      But this is the give away:

      ‘If this incident leads to the downfall of Tony Abbott, it would be a tragedy ‘

      That’s exactly what this article is about. It’s about telling people to shut up about Abbott because it might upset McKinney. It’s about using the very real personal trauma the widow is going through to deflect blame from the Opposition leader.

      Incredibly unethical.

      Abbott went to Afghanistan to try and make political mileage out of McKinney’s death. It wasn’t very much of a secret at the time.

      He had been sent an email from another soldier saying, in effect, that McKinney died because the army had inadequate resources for the task.

      The army showed him that this was incorrect, that Jared’s death wasn’t the result of poor resources.

      That’s why he said ‘shit happens’ - a recognition that, sometimes, it does.

      So he set out to politicise McKinney’s death. He then tried to suppress the tape (in the interests of free speech, one supposes).

      So the whole schemozzle leading up to the interview was clearly of Abbott’s making.

      Channel 7 rang his office in advance, his office set the time and location of the interview, Abbott turned up.

      The rest is history.

      If Abbott had respected the soldier to start with, he would not have tried to play political games with his death.

      If he had been truly thinking about the widow and the consequences to her and her family, he would have talked to her before the interview (he knew what the interview was about).

      Even better, when Channel 7 contacted his office to begin with, he could have refused to be interviewed and explained why.

      People like to talk about Gillard’s lack of empathy and say she would do anything to stay in power.

      In fact, Abbott is the one who fits that description.

      People mock Gillard’s tears and say they’re confected.

      Abbott didn’t sound as if the tragedies he was describing touched him at all.

      It will not be a tragedy if Abbott loses the leadership (and it wouldn’t be a tragedy if Gillard did, or if the ALP lost the next election, because these things are not tragedies).

      To liken Abbott’s demise as a leader to McKinney’s death is yet a further insult to the soldier.

      I am disgusted by this article and by the motives of the journalist who wrote it.

    • NoNames says:

      06:52am | 10/02/11

      Agree. In every way.

    • Pete says:

      06:58am | 10/02/11

      hear hear,

    • Barry says:

      08:19am | 10/02/11

      I also am disgusted by your motives.  Do not try and pretend like you actually care about the death of this soldier or McKinneys family.  This has never been about the soldier or his family for the majority of people, it has been all political and remains political.  If you truly cared you wouldn’t be commenting, because the wife of the deceased soldier has stated that apologises have been done and she just wants to move on.  Was this a necessary comment,  “People like to talk about Gillard’s lack of empathy and say she would do anything to stay in power.
      In fact, Abbott is the one who fits that description.
      People mock Gillard’s tears and say they’re confected.
      Abbott didn’t sound as if the tragedies he was describing touched him at all,” if you were just commenting, because you cared about the family of the soldier.  It is obvious that you too are using this tragedy for a political argument.  The author atleast has known the wife for much of her life, so maybe don’t make too many assumptions about her motivation.  You’ve made yours pretty evident, and it’s pretty disgusting.

    • Matt B says:

      08:25am | 10/02/11

      Yeah Persephone, and remember when Abbott said that stuff about women and ironing? He’s a right bastard.  Seems your personal views of the opposition leader have clouded the issues here a tad.

      I’m glad you pointed out “exactly what the article is about,” I was under the impression it was a fairly respectful and personal piece written by a friend of the soldiers window, aiming to put some perspective on the whole issue.

      Abbott’s comments were clearly not for the public record, and yes they did sound insensitive when played in isolation. Though we were not privy to the whole conversation (and we shouldn’t have been privy to any of it) Ch7 decided to air the comments and that is the reason Mrs MacKinney her family and friends have to go through even greater heartache.

      The Ch7 “story” was rubbish journalism, bereft of any public interest. I’d be more interested if some sly cameraman shot some over the shoulder footage of a politician saying they didn’t like black jelly beans, then we could all say they were racist.

    • JA says:

      08:43am | 10/02/11

      Persephone and other ALP devotees are now trying to shut down the issue, hoping to maximise any damage to Tony Abbott and avoid the truth coming out that Channel 7 farbricated this issue without regard for the family. 

      The ALP has too many supporters like these guys, fanatics who work the spin cycle daily on blogs and talk back radio.  Unfortnuately for them, this story is now about an un-australian act of bastardry by a lefty journo and TA has grown as a result of it..  It is straight out of the APL spin manual to try and shut it down.

    • Ryan says:

      08:48am | 10/02/11

      @persephone: and yet persephone you and the rest of the Labor filth on here find it completely ethical to make political hay out of the death of this poor man and the subsequent suffering and accusations.
      The only benefit I could have imagined out of this abhorrent episode is that you lot possibly learn some respect and some manners but unfortunately it does not seem that way.
      You and the rest of your sniveling rats are hypocrites and disgust me to the core, lets hope someone with some ethics like Stephen Smith does come to power and flushes you lowlifes from the labor party.

    • Gregg says:

      08:50am | 10/02/11

      Hardly, anything of the sort Persey and you know it.

    • NoNames says:

      09:31am | 10/02/11

      Ryan says: “Labor filth”, “sniveling (sic) rats”, “hypocrites” .

      Ryan. Ryan. Now where have I heard that name before.

      Ah yes. Ryan.

      That’s the fellow who whines about personal attacks whenever the credibility of his own sloppy, inaccurate, inflammatory posts is justly exposed.

      Hypocrite, much?

    • Andew says:

      09:52am | 10/02/11

      You people are unbelievable, this is nothing about but a respectful piece about a friend he obviously cares about and the hurt this story has caused.You people talk about him making it political let you are so one eyed all you can see if the end of abbott and now your starting to get in the gutter because hes not getting the criticism you thought he would get. So was Gillards trip political, tell me why did she go over there, shes admitted she couldnt care less about foreign affairs. You going to tell me she couldnt wait to get over there and support the troops, inj fact I would be willing to bet she doesnt even think they should be there.

    • Randal says:

      09:56am | 10/02/11

      That is disgraceful persephone and a very disappointing response by you, in general I enjoy your blogs and enjoy nothing more than countering your deliberate biased views with some of my own.

      But this post is really beyond the pale and demonstrates that you have no substance about you at all, and proves that you are nothing more than a rusted on Labor hack.

      This piece seeks to give a voice to a family who has been traumatised by a great loss, there is nothing political about it. Yet you read this piece and decide to use it to attack the author in an attempt to score some cheap political points.

      Talk about zero class, and a pity that you did not follow the lead set by Smith and Combet yesterday who understood that cheap political points scoring at the expense of a fallen soldier is not the way to get your view across, and you should be ashamed of yourself.

    • MarK says:

      10:36am | 10/02/11

      I truly hope peresphone lied about being a teacher.

      That she would be allowed to influence young minds with her views and prejudices worries me deeply.

    • persephone says:

      11:04am | 10/02/11

      Guys, you know perfectly well this isn’t about me.

      It’s about how terrified you are that your beloved leader Tony has slipped up so badly.

      As I predicted yesterday, panic is setting in. You can see his leadership is untenable. You know that it will be almost impossible for the Liberal party to put someone who shares your and his extremist views in the leadership - even Julie Bishop is backing away from, loyal girl that she usually is.

      I said I found this article so disgusting that I didn’t want to comment on it. But I am not going to let a very deliberate attempt to stifle debate and free speech by playing on people’s heartstrings go by.

      You can attack me all you like - water of a duck’s back.vWhat do I care if someone on t’net hates me?

      But doing so weakens your own position, because it suggests that personal attacks are all you have.

      The only thing that ever upsets me is when I’m proven wrong.

      So go to it!!

    • Richard says:

      11:20am | 10/02/11

      Persephone, you are a vulture. The way you keep on trying to pick over the carcass of this sorry saga and find a way to damage Tony Abbott is despicable. You are a stinking craven vulture, you love the decayed and putrefied flesh of this attempted smear story, don’t you? Shoo you big ugly bird, let us bury this story and all have some respect for the real human beings who have been affected by it.

    • Andrew says:

      11:37am | 10/02/11

      But Perse, your never wrong, even when it’s proven your wrong. Actually most liberals supporters wouldnt be all that worried about who the leader is as long as they get rid of this government. What I dont understand is why the die hard labor voters want to get rid of him, after all most of you seem to be of the opinion he is the only reason the polls are close and you may even be right about that.

    • Ben81 says:

      11:42am | 10/02/11

      @pers “It’s about how terrified you are that your beloved leader Tony has slipped up so badly.
      As I predicted yesterday, panic is setting in.”

      Well I have an overwhelming feeling of ‘meh’, does that count?  Hey maybe if you keep saying the words terrified and panic we’ll all start feeling that way.  On the other hand, you’ll most likely just sound more and more desperate and frustrated.  Let’s sit back and see which path you choose…

    • Jim says:

      11:50am | 10/02/11

      And so predictably, persephone jumps on in her usual arrogant way with claims of “You’re all wrong, only I know what’s going on. Disagree with me at your peril!” Passing off her biased opinon as ‘fact’ to anyone who will listen….same shit, different day.

      His position is untenable is it? And you know this, how? His views are extremist, are they? Please divulge your inner knowledge of Abbotts views for our collective pleasure! If you consider him to be extreme, what the hell is Bob Brown??? Julie Bishop is backing away, is she? So, you’re on speaking terms with her? Had her around this morning for a cup of coffee and a chat, maybe snuck in a slice of teacake?

      The only ‘debate’ and ‘division’ in this whole sorry episode seems to be played out amongst a handful of journalists and some staunchly ignorant Labor spin merchants, such as yourself. The rest of the country either couldn’t give a toss or are saying they would have decked Riley.

      This was a piece written with as much empathy and consideration for the widow as humanly possible. Yet the usual Labor clowns have used it as a platform for their own filthy agendas, again.

    • persephone says:

      12:24pm | 10/02/11

      Richard

      and I’m sure you’re just a big fluffy old bunny rabbit.

      (Actually, if I’m a vulture, that would make you nervous!)

      Andrew

      incorrect. I have admitted when I got something wrong before - in fact, one of the posters here quite recently derided me for making two such admissions in one thread (I think I went on to make a third, although that might be a mistake on my part!)

      No, you don’t understand why I want to get rid of Abbott. I want to get rid of him because he’s lowered the standards of political discourse in this country and trampled on many of the Liberal party’s ideals.

      I want to see a decent, honest competition between contesting ideas, not blind mockery and opposition for the sake of opposition - contrary to Menzian ideals.

      A government can only govern effectively with an effective Opposition. That means one which outlines valid alternatives, alternatives which sometimes leads to the government changing its stance as a result.

      So Howard accepted changes advocated by the Labor party and Hawke and Keating did the same with some ideas put forward by the Liberals.

      No government can foresee all the likely consequences of a course of action. An effective Opposition outlines some of these, and brings rational alternatives to the table.

      Ben

      that was one of my comments that it wasn’t wise to self identify with.

      Unless you meet the description, it doesn’t apply to you.

      If it applies to you, then you meet the description.

      Anyway, guys, thanks for raising the level of ‘debate’ with your considered and rational counter attacks.

    • Barry says:

      12:31pm | 10/02/11

      “It’s about how terrified you are that your beloved leader Tony has slipped up so badly.
      As I predicted yesterday, panic is setting in. You can see his leadership is untenable. You know that it will be almost impossible for the Liberal party to put someone who shares your and his extremist views in the leadership - even Julie Bishop is backing away from, loyal girl that she usually is.” Persephone

      Atleast you’ve dropped the whole I’m doing it for the soldier’s family act, and showed that this really was all about politics for you perse.  You don’t care about the family or the soldier, and you never did.  It wouldn’t have been quite as low, if from the start you just admitted it was about politics for you, but trying to ride the high horse, and pretend you actually cared, and then to attack a family friend, who probably actually has genuine care, and emotion towards the situation.  Well, it was pretty low . . .

    • The Guardian says:

      12:35pm | 10/02/11

      Love the way you wind them up Pers. Though as you know its not hard. Wish I had your blogging stamina.

    • CaptainCrunch says:

      12:41pm | 10/02/11

      I have now no doubt you are a paid up party hack of the lowest form. You have conned me for too long that you were some sort of independent thinker with an obvious Labor/Left bent.

      But this is all the proof I need that you are just a hateful stooge for the Labor Party.

      Over the last week or 2 I have seen you turn yourself inside out defending the indefensible and attacking the innocent, all the while mocking anyone who dares to disagree with your irrational diatribes.

      You are an absolute disgrace.

    • CaptainCrunch says:

      12:41pm | 10/02/11

      I have now no doubt you are a paid up party hack of the lowest form. You have conned me for too long that you were some sort of independent thinker with an obvious Labor/Left bent.

      But this is all the proof I need that you are just a hateful stooge for the Labor Party.

      Over the last week or 2 I have seen you turn yourself inside out defending the indefensible and attacking the innocent, all the while mocking anyone who dares to disagree with your irrational diatribes.

      You are an absolute disgrace.

    • persephone = labor troll says:

      12:51pm | 10/02/11

      * * DON’T FEED THE TROLL **
          - aka persephone

    • Rover of North Cooma says:

      01:01pm | 10/02/11

      Agree and disagree all at once.

      I definitely think Jane was wrong to say that this leading to Abbott’s downfall would be a tragedy, because that throws her straight into the Abbott camp.

      But I think she was right to draw attention to how Beckie feels at having her husband’s death suddenly out there in the media again, and remind some of the more intemperate posters that while the political issue is Abbott’s judgment, all these stories are painful to the family.

      I don’t believe the family’s feelings outweigh the public right to know. But I do think journalists have a responsibility to warn the innocents like Beckie that a story like this is on the way. That’s a difficult thing to do because it involves an unpleasant conversation and the likely reminder that a lot of people don’t value the work journalists do.

      But I think the people who are claiming that Riley and Seven did this because they are pro-Labor should have a look at the piece that Seven did on Rudd’s speech to the troops in Afghanistan just before Christmas 2008. They did him over too. So it’s not bias, it’s the joy of journalistic shit stirring. Everyone cops it. Everyone needs to get over it.

    • Randal says:

      01:05pm | 10/02/11

      No Perse, you have attacked the author of an article supporting the widow and family of a fallen soldier in a poor attempt to score a cheap political point - which says plenty about the sort of individual you are.

      As for Abbott, I think we will keep him, a 52-48 and growing 2PP lead and watching the ALP vote shrivel to a point where they now survive purely as a bitch of the Greens is plenty evidence enough of the brilliant job he is doing at the moment, and no wonder you are so keen to get rid of him.

      Unfortunately for you and wooden one leader he is going nowhere and the real question is how long before wooden one faces the chop from the faceless men of the ALP - I hear the axes are already grinding.

    • Ben81 says:

      01:14pm | 10/02/11

      pers “that was one of my comments that it wasn’t wise to self identify with.
      Unless you meet the description, it doesn’t apply to you.
      If it applies to you, then you meet the description.”

      Nobody meets your extreme description, that’s kinda the point.  It’s the polar opposite of the political mood right now.
      It’s pretty much “You’re all terrified and if you reply that means I’m right”.
      Come on you’re usually better than this.

    • AdamC says:

      01:15pm | 10/02/11

      Persephone isn’t a troll.

      She is an extraordinarily rusted-on Labor supporter, but that doesn’t make her a troll. And, while she is wrong almost all of the time, her comments at least make superficial sense, unlike some others’. In other words, she is actually prepared to make cogent arguments in support of her (incorrect) position.

      For what it’s worth, I would go so far as to declare her the most sensible, readable and sane of all the uncritical Labor boosters on this site.

    • persephone says:

      01:52pm | 10/02/11

      Oh, Adam….I’m getting all teary…

    • Maria Hawthorne says:

      02:52pm | 10/02/11

      And Randal is an ex-Lib staffer with a reputation as the most disastrous journo-turned-media adviser in the Howard government.
      Whatever people say about the gallery being Labor fans, there are only a few - Laura Anderson (News), Maria Hawthorne (AAP), Odette Visser (ABC) - who have gone to work for the government since 2007. Whereas the Howard media unit plundered the gallery and particularly News Ltd - Adam Connolly (News), David Luff (News), Nikki Sava (News), Randal Markey (West Australian), Malcolm Cole (News), Chris Kenny (News), Catherine Job (ABC), Ben Mitchell (Fairfax), and many many more.
      Some of these, like Malcolm Cole and Chris Kenny, went on to run as Liberal candidates.
      It’s true that former Labor staffers have a better chance of reigniting their journalism careers - people like Greg Turnbull and Barrie Cassidy - than Randal does.

    • Randal says:

      03:35pm | 10/02/11

      Whilst I welcome the compliment of once being a staffer to the great John Howard Maria I feel obliged to tell you that whilst I am a paid up member of the Liberal party, I have never been a paid staffer, nor have I ever worked as a journalist.

      Thanks for the compliment though!

    • Ando says:

      04:55pm | 10/02/11

      Pers,
      I’ll give you a tip, its not just Lliberal voters who think your wrong. Actually as someone left of centre I have not spoken to one person , fan of Abbott or not, that agrees with you. That even includes commentators and politicians from the left. You and a very small band of bloggers are being exposed as having no ability to remove the politics and see what is an issue of media morality.. Your only interest is how this will hurt Abbotts leadership, and you know it.

    • Will says:

      04:57pm | 10/02/11

      I believe Abbott’s trip to Afganastan was arranged some time ago. Gillard, upon finding out, hastily organised her own trip and ensured it was scheduled before Abbott’s. On top of that, she then politised the event. Abbott had kept his planned visit to himself.
      Once again the deluded left forgets the internet has allowed us all to discover the truth for ourselves without passing first through the highly partisan MSM.
      With the TPP at Lib:52, Lab:48 one can see the desperation of Labor and their supporters.
      They Hate Abbott because they KNOW HE CAN WIN!

    • persephone says:

      06:46pm | 10/02/11

      Ando

      if you read my original post, you will see I was being fairly objective.

      As I said, it wouldn’t be tragedy if Abbott lost the leadership - but it wouldn’t be a tragedy if Gillard did too, or indeed if the ALP lost the next election.

      What this article was trying to do was to deflect criticism of Abbott by claiming that anyone who criticised him was causing distress to McKinney’s family.

      And it did this by further exposing McKinney’s family to further scrutiny.

      I think that’s immoral. And I don’t think it’s actually an issue of politics.

      If you want McKinney’s widow to be left alone, then leave her alone.

      Why anyone would give details of her family life in the name of leaving her alone is difficult for me to fathom.

      I thought the author was unethical and her motives suspect, and I haven’t seen many people here mount a credible defence of that.

      Oh, and Ando - I don’t get a flying rat’s who agrees with me or doesn’t agree with me, whether they’re from the left, or the Right or have just arrived on this planet from the planet Zog.

      My opinion is my opinion.

    • Kaditha says:

      10:58am | 11/02/11

      Matt B, if you say something in front of 3 TV cameras no less, then its being said for public record. Everyone know that. Even Our Tony.

    • nosthow says:

      06:29am | 10/02/11

      I note the soldiers Father is most unforgiving of Abbotts insensitive comments and righty so. Abbott showed us way back when he was Heath Minister in the Howard govt just how sensitive he is when he wouldnt even give Bernie Banton who was dying of asbestos poisoning even a 5 minute audience. A measure of a very very weak man ! Certainly unfit to ever be our PM.

    • LAD says:

      08:24am | 10/02/11

      Wrong, the soldiers Father has since come out supporting Abbott.

    • Syl says:

      09:14am | 10/02/11

      Uh Nostie

      In case you missed it the father has since come out supporting Abbott on this issue, might wanna check your facts before yet another Abbott rant.
      I don’t expect a retraction of course, Id be dreaming if I thought you’d let the truth get in the way of a good ole Abbott bashing.

    • The Guardian says:

      01:02pm | 10/02/11

      @ LAD Rubbish,you show me where and when his father came out and supported Abbott.What we wish for is not the truth mate! EITHER YOU ARE DELIBERATELY LYING OR ARE COMPLETELY IGNORANT!

    • Ryan says:

      01:55pm | 10/02/11

      Yep father and wife came out in glowing support of Abbott, on the the next LIE nosthow, I guess this is unsurprising considering you and your Labor cohorts recent display of immorality.

    • Rover of North Cooma says:

      03:03pm | 10/02/11

      Do you have a link to the father’s glowing support? I have been searching the net and can’t find one.

    • Sceptic says:

      03:17pm | 10/02/11

      Please include a link to where the father has come out in glowing support of Abbott.

    • Angry God of Townsville says:

      05:02pm | 10/02/11

      If you listen to Andrew Bolts segment on MTR from his blog yesterday you would have heard that the father changed his tune. The highlighting of Bernie Banton is the ultimate white flag by ALP supporters, this is used when they know that their point is lost. It is their often used Union supplied Unicorn, that of a man who was let down by Labor as much a liberal and was exploited to his grave by the AWU.

      You do know that 7 had the footage since 17th of January, that they sat on this for the length of time, shows that they were after the gotcha rather than caring about the family involved. That they had to edit it, deliberately mislead their viewers and misrepresent what was said and in its context, shows that Riley and Meakin are up to their guilty little necks in an active deception that only a moron would defend.

      That they waited until after the poll result was so poor, shows that Riley likes getting knee pats from Julia.

    • Chris L says:

      10:46pm | 10/02/11

      “If you listen to Andrew Bolts segment on MTR from his blog yesterday you would have heard that the father changed his tune.” -
      Are you serious?! Please tell me there’s a better source for this turn around than Mr Bolt!

      PS. The father is still grieving so I would expect him to have a few harsh things to say about the government that got us into this war, the government that continues our involvement and the media that won’t let his son’s memory have any peace.

    • Faz says:

      06:43am | 10/02/11

      This is pretty dissappointing Jane.

      When I read the headline I thought it was just going to be a tribute to a good man. That would have been enough to get some perspective back and remind us that there are real people, good people, behind statistics and headlines.

      Instead you do the journalist thing and enter the fray and take sides using your ‘cred’ as a ‘friend of Beckie’ to ‘yank the scab’ a bit harder.

      And even if your post did live up to the headline, would it be what the family wanted? Don’t they just want to be left alone?

      The dark side of journalism is the loss of a moral compass to ‘the story’. On that, you are in no position to point to the splinter in Riley’s eye.

    • Pudel says:

      09:40am | 10/02/11

      I disagree.  For me this article made me forget about Abbotts comment and reaction for a while, and think of a young widow, bringing up 2 children without her husband. 
      For the last 2 days the issue has been Abbotts comment, was it insensitive or taken out of context, Abbotts reaction, is he a man on the edge or a man who was very angered and managed to control himself as best he could? and Channel seven, did they ambush Abbott, or was it the publics right to know?
      This article put the emphasis back on the widow of a dead soilder who has been hurt, shocked and blindsided by this article.  Out of comman decency channel seven should have warned her it was going to air.  blow what happened to Abbott, he is a politician he signed on to public scrutiny.  Our armed forces and their families do not.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      10:25am | 10/02/11

      Pudel says:09:40am; you get the “BS comment of the Day” award

    • jack wright says:

      06:44am | 10/02/11

      Amongst the loads of media crap spread about Abbott’s simple, heartfelt, understanding comment there is a great truth…s*** does happen. That we are still hearing about what he said ages ago means that the media are happy to trivialise a family’s loss and a soldier’s sacrifice, all for the sake of “drama”. Their moral mediocrity matches their presumptions.

    • rufus says:

      08:00am | 10/02/11

      Yes, shit does happen. Most of us are not insensitive enough to describe it that way in the aftermath of a tragedy, though. I wouldn’t want that said about the death of any of my loved ones.

    • Andew says:

      10:32am | 10/02/11

      Rufus he didnt say it about the soldiers death but about the circumstances in which it happen. There is a big big difference, but one that is obviously hard for 75% of the people who hate abbott to see.

    • Peter says:

      11:19am | 10/02/11

      @Andrew - “Rufus he didnt say it about the soldiers death but about the circumstances in which it happen.”

      Really?  Can you explain the difference to me, then, because I honestly don’t see it.  The way I see it, if it was my son who died and a politician said that about the “circumstances” of his death, I’d be pretty pissed off.  Wouldn’t you?  I mean, really.  What is the big difference?

    • Andrew says:

      08:30pm | 10/02/11

      Someone is talking about someones death and one of them says shit happens, that is being insensitive because your basically saying who cares he dead now it doesnt matter. When discussing the circumstances and you ask if everything that could be done was done to prevent his death and the other person shows or explains to you that everything possible was done, someone then says well I guess shit happens, they are saying that sometimes despite doing everything you can do to prevent an accident or death that the unexpected can happen, that you shouldnt blame anyone because everything was done that could be done. Do you understand, do you see the difference because I guaranteed most people can.

    • Amused2k says:

      10:39am | 11/02/11

      So TA is confronted by a group of Soldiers who are searching for a reason, reliving every decision, looking for fault and blame where none can be found. When everything that could be considered was and every action that could be taken was, the only answer for failure is that sometimes Sh*t does happen. Perhaps in trying to idenitfy with these men this is the view that TA came too.

    • David says:

      06:45am | 10/02/11

      The stand-out opinion of the whole episode, Jane.

      Beckie does deserve way better, as does Lance Corporal Jared MacKinney, than to have their sacrifice sloppily dredged up this way by a lower than second-rate, make-the-story-at-any-cost journo.

      Well done.

    • Kaditha says:

      11:06am | 11/02/11

      I agree. Pity she had to then conflate the Tony Abbott debacle into what was an otherwise great article.

      In doing so, she knew full well that she was doing exactly the opposite of what she claimed was in the interests of her ‘friend’. With friend’s like that, you need Tony as your enemy (he’s a lot nicer, even when putting his foot in his mouth).

    • Retired Soldier says:

      06:59am | 10/02/11

      This so called story has just about been done to death and it’s about time everyone moved on. Most of the comments made on this issue were in support of Abbott and rightly so but it cannot be allowed to fester. People also need to know that soldiers actually do swear and use terms they all relate to in war and in peacetime. If you are going to “talk the talk and walk the walk” with fighting men then that’s what one does and I can assure you not one of them would be offended by someone using their kind of language, regardless of how it is expressed. Those that don’t understand how to “mix it ” with soldiers will always be the ones who write unnecessary comments and attack others through a lack of knowledge and understanding. Give it away now before it escalates into another 600 comment farce.

    • Laura says:

      09:24am | 10/02/11

      Bravo Retired Soldier, I salute you. I found your words very calming.  Thank you for what you have done for your country.

    • Likes Joining Dots says:

      10:38am | 10/02/11

      @Retired Soldier - well said.

      Signing off now.

    • John Jones says:

      07:01am | 10/02/11

      If it takes the work of sound techs to make the tape audible and then to isolate one quote from that conversation shows: a. Journalism has sunk to a new low; b. Channel 7 was deliberately trying to find something that they could use against Mr Abbot; c. They used the words without reference to the other parts of the conversation inferring that it was all about the death of a soldier when it wasnt; d. They didnt have the decency to notify the wife of the soldier of the upcoming interview e. By doing so they upset the family of the soldier recently deceased in the name of “Journalism”. This is a new low even for political gutter journalism and Channel 7 should be referred to the Authorities for ethical standards in broadcasting for disciplinary action.

    • iansand says:

      07:55am | 10/02/11

      Abbott, quite properly, told the journalist, that the quote was taken out of context.  Quite frankly, I think the journalist would have deserved more criticism if he had not given Abbott the opportunity to expand on what the context was.  For some unfathomable reason Abbott lost it when asked a perfectly obvious and reasonable question - what was the context?

    • TimB says:

      08:05am | 10/02/11

      iansand, the “journallist” knew full damn well what the context was. Channel 7 had the full footage after all.

      The question was needlessly provocative and got the response it deserved.

    • iansand says:

      11:35am | 10/02/11

      The journalist may well have known the context.  I didn’t and nor did any other listener.  Abbott was given the opportunity to explain the context to me in clear, simple language.  For reasons that remain mysterious he was unable to do that.

    • TimB says:

      12:54pm | 10/02/11

      And why didn’t you or any other viewers know the context?

      Because Channel 7 edited the film so you couldn’t tell. Where was the response from the soldiers? Cut off and left out.

      Why should Abbott have to explain himself in the face of an obvious hatchet job? What’s he supposed to do, explain to the viewers exactly what Channel 7 purposefully cut out of the clip right then and there?

      He gave the Riley a deserved response, and then the explanation about the context was made available to us at a later time WITH the correct footage to support it.

    • iansand says:

      01:59pm | 10/02/11

      And Abbott did not have the wit to explain the context when given the opportunity.  It was a free kick to rubbish the journalist if wanted to.  Or to actually explain the context that he raised. 

      How can you take that man seriously?

    • TimB says:

      08:18pm | 10/02/11

      Yes he could have done that. But why was he obligated to? Channel 7 set out to deliberately make him look bad. From the start. It was clear to Tony once the question had been asked that they were gunning for him. Any response he made would have been twisted. Why give them any ammunition?

      He shouldn’t have had to defend his self from shit like that and I’m suprised any rational thinking human being thinks otherwise. How can you condone media tactics that set out to deliberately smear? That isn’t journalism.

      What the hell did Abbott do to you anyway? Piss in your weet-bix?

    • Bill says:

      07:04am | 10/02/11

      Channel 7 must publicly apologise to Corporal MacKinney’s wife and family and to Tony Abbot. I find it hard to recall a more disgusting piece of “journalism” in recent Australian history.

      If they do not apologise, I will actually watsch commercial television tonight, note which companies advertise on Channel 7, and never buy their products again if I can reasonably avoid doing so. I will send them an email or a letter to say so as well.

    • Sludger says:

      11:18am | 10/02/11

      I have tried sending an email thru to 7, and need the help of Punch people here.  I did log on the website, found a form and it has gone to the Free TV complaints people, whoever they may be.  Does anyone have another address i can email my disgust to that will actually get to the 7 News toads?  Thanks

    • Gravelly says:

      07:09am | 10/02/11

      Riley proved himself to be Gillards lap-dog during the last election, he’s just continuing that approach to his “work”!  I wonder if he’s been contacted by the ABC yet?! Oh that’s right, they couldn’t afford him.

    • john of solomon says:

      07:11am | 10/02/11

      nosthow:-  abbott may certainly be unfit to be our PM, but Gillard is definitely unfit to be our PM. I live overseas and can assure you that most people I meet find it difficult to believe that Australia as a nation cannot come up with better candidates for PM than either of these clowns.

    • TheRealDave says:

      11:15am | 10/02/11

      yes because Australian politics just happens to be on the breathless lips of foreigners the world over ...

      *yawn*

    • Expat says:

      12:06am | 11/02/11

      In all my years of travelling I can count on both hands the number of people I’ve met overseas who even knew who the Australian Prime Minister was, and there’s never been a single one who knew who the Leader of the Opposition was. And fair enough; why would they ? Do you live in Tasmania, john ?

    • Mik says:

      07:13am | 10/02/11

      As I wrote in Shanahan’s column at the time
      “Step in now, Prime Minister,!! - this is no longer about Tony Abbot. This is about a young widow and her children, their pain, their excruciating loss.”
      My thoughts go to all those family, friends and colleagues who have lost soldiers in this and every other war.

    • Zoe says:

      09:37pm | 10/02/11

      I agree Mik, Politics isnt like football for me, Im not loyal to one or the other. I dont like Abbott or Gillard, and wish there was a better alternative than these two. I dont particularly agree with the war either, but utmost respect and support must go to the loved ones of lost soldiers. I cant even imagine what they are going through and no amount of political point scoring is worth the heartache this young mum is suffering. Shame on the journos who dragged this up.

    • Flexo says:

      07:14am | 10/02/11

      Mark Riley is scum and channel seven needs to act to ensure it does have some moral standing. Exploiting our defence force for a cheap journalistic thrill is unexceptable.

    • Stephy says:

      07:17am | 10/02/11

      Wow, 8am and this is already an Abbott-bashing thread. Seriously guys, the author is friends with Beckie and is writing to show us how Beckie really feels, not how the media think she should feel.

      Beckie, I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy. Sending my goodwishes and thoughts your way. Hopefully the media coverage blows over soon.

    • Laura says:

      07:20am | 10/02/11

      Dear Jane,
      My heart goes out to Beckie MacKinney. May this courageous and beautiful young woman know how deeply many of us feel for her loss and grief. I hope she knows no more sorrow. I hope she knows no more suffering. What Channel 7 and Mark Riley did to her is despicable. It is beyond the pale. I believe that Tony Abbott meant no disrespect. I am glad she knows this. Her grief does not need to be exacerbated. The journalists who went on and on about Tony Abbott’s 45 seconds of silence and whether he’s finished as a leader both dishonour Jared’s memory but also extend ‘the story’ and I am sure also ‘compound’ his widow’s grief. 

      Jane Fynes-Clinton, I am glad that Beckie has you for a friend. I hope she knows she has thousands of others all around Australia, who whilst they have never met her, have deep compassion and caring her her. Which is more than I can say for Channel 7 and more than I can say about those journalists who extended the story so as to extend their ratings. May they all hang their collective heads in shame.

      Channel 7, I have never watched your programs or news, so I would be lying if I said I will never again watch your channel but what I will now do is find out who advertises with you and contact them. They will know in no uncertain terms that I will not be buying their products.  I will also not again listen to the broadcasters who thought that there was mileage and ratings to be gained by slamming Tony Abbott. Like hyennas they feed off Mark Riley’s droppings. Mark Riley is an incompetent dill but now that the powerful Canberra press gallery has picked up on his story, Tony Abbott will probably lose his leadership or at best be mortally wounded. The real story should be about the deceptive media and how it skewers the news.

    • centurion48 says:

      08:32am | 10/02/11

      Jane Fynes-Clinton is only upset at the low standards of journalists because it happened to her friend. As a journalist she needs to ask herself whether she would exploit the emotions of people she doesn’t know for a story. If she can honestly answer that she wouldn’t do it then good on her but she should look around for an alternative occupation because she is not suited to 21st century ‘journalism’.

    • Rosie says:

      09:05am | 10/02/11

      Kudos and many thanks to Jayne for the much needed article and kudos and thanks to you Laura for the advice given. I will be doing the same thing and never again will watch Channel 7.

      I was beginning to lose faith in mankind. Reading Jayne’s article about Beckie and yours Laura, has not only restored my faith in mankind but strengthened it.

      Today’s modern way of communication can ruin or break one’s lives but in this case it has enriched mine in finding good thoughtful people like yourselves are there amongst the rotten ones.

      As for Tony Abbott, I believe in fate, if he was meant to be PM he will, if not he still has the love of his life. Beckie has to endure life without hers!

      PS Thanks Punch much happier with this article!

    • Aasq says:

      12:39am | 11/02/11

      The Liberal Party of Australia advertise with Channel 7, Laura.

      You can let them know in no uncertain terms here ... http://www.liberal.org.au/

    • L says:

      12:59am | 11/02/11

      Thank you to some people who actually read this article and understood it’s purpose. Laura you have said exactly what I have been thinking. How can so many have just read what they did, and think continuing this pathetic discussion and that what they have to say here would have any effect except causing more pain and heartache. Please people have some consideration and perspective. Stop this whole thing, how about take the hours you have spent reading, watching, listening and argueing this foolishness and turn to your own family, friends and loved ones to be with them. One day they will be taken from you and you will have wished you had one more chance. Stop being so negative and if you are lucky enough to have a moment to reflect before your time ends this will not be your shining moment, I certainly hope you have done much better things with your time by then.

    • Aasq says:

      12:28pm | 11/02/11

      Thanks for “continuing this pathetic discussion”, L. I hope Tony Abbott appreciates your efforts.

    • dovif says:

      07:30am | 10/02/11

      The ALP supporters in this blog is so out of touch with Australians, it is unbelievable

      Yes $hit happens, it is an Australian saying and it is used a lot in the military. But some ALP supporters in this blog keep trying to make political gain out of a soldier’s death

      Absolutely classless

      Maybe you should all be shipped to Afganistan’s frontline for a month to see what it feelslikes

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      08:21am | 10/02/11

      dovif says:07:30am; When I was in Poland last year dovif was a brand of dunny cleaner, any relation?

    • Gregg says:

      08:54am | 10/02/11

      Been doing some dredging of your own now have you Robby.
      You’re down there with those kneeling daschound balls as you and your colleagues always are.

    • dovif says:

      09:01am | 10/02/11

      Rob r Charteris

      you prove my point precisely

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      10:08am | 10/02/11

      Gregg says:08:54am; Nah, it was sitting on a shelf above the door of the dunny next to a brush made by Gregg’s, any relation?

    • rufus says:

      07:56am | 10/02/11

      Abbott knows the REAL context of ‘shit happens’ and that’s why he froze. And it’s also why he’s not innocent of insensitivity.

      He’d gone to Afghanistan claiming repeatedly that the government had failed to supply the troops with support hardware and this had contributed to the death of Lance Corporal McKinney - blatantly politicising a soldier’s death.

      The video of the meeting showed officers demonstrating helicopters that had been deployed in the battle and assuring him that nothing more could have been done.

      Abbott had no choice but to accept this.

      ‘Shit happens’ = ‘there’s goes the grounds for my political attack on the government’.

      That’s the honest context and it’s why Abbott froze on Tuesday. And it’s been missed.

    • TimB says:

      08:07am | 10/02/11

      It’s been missed because it’s a delusional fantasy you’ve just made up.

    • rufus says:

      09:07am | 10/02/11

      That account is in direct accordance with the facts, TimB. It’s the reason the Liberal Party tried to suppress the tape when Ch7 asked for it.

      Of course, your unwavering support of the Liberals wouldn’t allow you to admit it.

    • TimB says:

      10:44am | 10/02/11

      What facts?

      “Shit happens’ = ‘there’s goes the grounds for my political attack on the government’.”

      That’s purely your speculation. Incorrect speculation at that. It’s clear what the context was, it’s your unwavering desire to paint TA as the bad guy that’s prompted you to make up your own narrative.

    • CaptainCrunch says:

      02:01pm | 10/02/11

      Wow.

      You just used your own opinion (or is it some sort of ESP) and tried to paint it as fact.

      It is pretty obvious you have never had a conversation with anyone other than yourself.

    • Kaditha says:

      11:31am | 11/02/11

      But rufus is correct you know. If you go back (use google) through the post Afghanistan visit stuff that the Libs were campaigning on, you will notice that they’d dropped the tanks, but not the rest of the ‘poorly equipped’ mantra.

      Which means he was busted. I was curious enough to go back to the SMH of that time, which you can do too. Oh, and I’m a Lib voter. I can however, laugh when I see the naughty schoolboy caught out.

      Its kind of funny, and very typical of Tony - he was having an “Oh Shit!” moment. What’s happened to Australia’s sense of humour? The interview with Tony was FUNNY.

      (Saw JB last night - she was smiling in that “I am going to castrate you” kind of way - wouldn’t want to be in AA’s shoes at this point)

    • L. Billson says:

      07:58am | 10/02/11

      Mark Riley should hang his head in shame over his very tacky attempt at political journalism.

    • Wazza says:

      08:09am | 10/02/11

      Tony Abbott suggested in Parliament that Peter Garrett was guilty of industrial manslaughter over the deaths of a number of insulation contractors. This is how Tony plays politics; stop with the bullshit that Mark Riley’s questions were contemptible.Abbott could have waved away Mark Riley with an abrupt “we’re done” and we wouldn’t be talking about it now. “shit happens’ is no longer the issue - Abbott’s performance under pressure is in question. He could have torn strips off the reporter with an apt comment. The question and the issue was lame to the extreme. But alas: he was not prepared, he had not been scripted and told what to say by his minders, …. he was adrift at sea without a rudder or like a child thrown overboard, nodding up & down in the waves…

    • Gregg says:

      09:02am | 10/02/11

      He could have done a lot of things Wazza, like storm off or made further comment only to have Riley drag out something else.
      Perhaps Tony was even stunned, taken aback that a reporter could contemptibly go so low, knowing that this was just going to re-open wounds for someone who had suffered oneof the greatest losses she could ever.
      But he chose silence and one of those nodding ” You do know what this makes you ” looks and eventually ” you have your answer ” , a picture telling a thousand words as Riley was trying the come on, gimme some more.
      Maybe he’ll be getting it in spades.

    • Andew says:

      10:38am | 10/02/11

      Um wazza. Garrett was told repeatedly that unscupulous people would take advantage of the situations and that lives were in danger. 4 people died, they had to rip insulation out of 100’s of houses so more people wouldnt die, you dont think the minister looking after the insulation had a case to answer.

    • persephone says:

      11:15am | 10/02/11

      Gregg

      yes, because no one expects to be asked a question when they’ve been told two hours beforehand that they would be asked that question.

      If he really cared about the widow’s feelings, he could have simply refused to do the interview. Then, when 7 aired the footage without comment from him, he could explain why.

      Instead, he chose to turn up to the interview, knowing full well what it was about and chose to respond in the way he did.

      He’s a former journalist, for the Flying Spaghetti Monster’s sake. It’s not like he doesn’t know what to expect.

    • Lana says:

      04:50pm | 10/02/11

      How does anyone know exactly what Abbott was told before the interview? All Riley said was he let his office know before hand what it was about. I bit my last dollar it didn’t include that they were going to make him look like he said “shit happens” about a diggers death you idiots.  And Persephone your arrogance is sickening.

    • TChong says:

      08:21am | 10/02/11

      Ms Fynes Clinton friendship to Beckie is publicly acknowledged, a credit to Ms Fynes Clinton , no problems.
      Its the followup, making apologies for Abbott . Less than objective.
      If the LNP party room drops Abbott , why would that be a tragedy ?
      Why link Abbbotts political survival with the death.
      I’m sure ( presumptios of me, I know) Jared would NOT have been fighting for the LNP, or Abbott.
      Who is using who for political gain?

    • Andrew says:

      10:41am | 10/02/11

      Maybe because there was nothing wrong with what he said, maybe because channel seven didnt show all the facts. Prietty sure he didnt die to give channel seven a fake gotcha moment neither.

    • Akrasiel Rising says:

      08:34am | 10/02/11

      Quite frankly the lot of you are a pack of wankers, all arguing over a comment about the circumstances surrounding the death of a soldier and trying to presume you know what the “context” was. Politician’s rank the same as journalists in the “lying and bullshit for profit” stakes and IMHO rate only slightly higher than child molesters on the scale of social acceptance. The one eyed support shown here on both sides of the political debate shows the degraded state of morality exhibited by some Australians.

      I can assure you that the only people who have made even the slightest sense in their feedback are those ADF or ex-ADF members who have stood next to their mates and said “Mate, Shit happens… there was nothing you could have done about it” while they compartmentalise the death of their friend and colleague in order to get on with the job they are there to do. It is not done for the good of the country, you or the idiots you elect… it is done because they have a job to do and they refuse to let their mates down. Get off your high horses and pull your heads out of your collective arses you pompous tossers. A man died proudly serving his nation and protecting his mates, his family is grieving and all you can do is argue politics. Shame on the lot of you!

    • Simon says:

      09:11am | 10/02/11

      you wanker. this isn’t about standing next to your mate saying shit happens, he may as well have gone to the funeral, grabbed the microphone and announced to one and all “shit happens”

    • Syl says:

      09:12am | 10/02/11

      Akrasiel

      I love it, everyone who comments on this issue is a wanker…. except you of course.

    • iansand says:

      01:25pm | 10/02/11

      As it appears that Mr Abbott could not explain what the “context” was (that was the question that evoked the silence) we can hardly be blamed for our ignorance.

    • J.R says:

      04:30pm | 10/02/11

      So the wife is completely okay with all of this, yet Simon believes that because HE isn’t okay with it, it’s somehow his business?

      In what way does this even remotely affect your life, Simon? Are you a grieving widow? Are you his father, or his kids?

    • hot tub political machine says:

      08:59am | 10/02/11

      I think the lance corporal will be remembered as a hero regardless of the media scene. Its terrible for the surviving family but hopefully some comfort will come from the thought that even media storms cannot diminish a soldier’s standing with the australian public.

      Soldiers top my list of most admired people - along with Nurses, (Clean) Police Officers, Social Workers, Doctors, Ambos - basically people who put themselves in crappy/physically endangering situations for not much pay - because society needs them too.

      The lance corporal will be remembered as one ot the best members of society.

    • NoNames says:

      09:01am | 10/02/11

      LCPL McKinney, his brave service, his death and their effects on his family are personal and private matters. They are not at issue.

      The behaviour and character of the Opposition Leader on camera under pressure about his own act and judgement is another matter altogether.

      Abbott’s initial posturing - in front of a camera while safe in the field - was at best regrettable.

      His reaction - again on camera, after perfectly adequate notice, prefectly reasonbale questioning about “context” and even after being edited down to something fit for broadcast - gave a deeply disturbing insight into the ability, character and reactions of a man who would be PM. 

      This contemptible article adds nothing. Leave the family be.

      Watching selected front bench hacks later trying to air-brush his disastrously revealing exposure underlines the whole sorry affair.

      The sole issue is Abbott. Abbott under pressure created entirely by himself and found utterly wanting.

    • Laura says:

      10:07am | 10/02/11

      The sole issue is that a young husband and father is dead. Screw Abbott. FFS there is three or four articles about Abbott on this site, why drag your bipartisan bullshit to this one?

    • Andrew says:

      10:46am | 10/02/11

      How is the sole issue abbott, you dont think channel seven lying and editing tape is an issue, you dont think channel seven exploiting the death of a soldier to falsely try and get ratings is an issue. If Channel seven hadnt dont these things there would be no abbottt story.

    • NoNames says:

      03:30pm | 10/02/11

      You lot need to check your facts.

      If Abbott’s office hadn’t done its level best to suppress the vision for months there might have been less of a story.

      If Abbott himself hadn’t chucked a wobbly old “death stare” on camera for 90 secs no less there might not be a story.

      He had plenty of warning before the interview. He’s had plenty of chance since, and decided to leave it to front bench hacks instead.

      The Punch and the Courier Mail columnist chose to air this piece, and all the others, on this public affairs discussion site. It’s what The Punch is for - however badly it does it.

      In my view, this piece is a badly judged attempt to divert attention by an indulgence in handwringing at the expense of the privacy of the family.

      Let the family be. 

      The issue is solely Abbott’s behaviour. His reaction to exposure, to being asked to explain, despite fair warning. That is a fair and legitimate issue - indeed, in my view, the most important issue. And all his own work.

      This is not the first time he’s had such public “moments” but this is the most spectactular.

      The points I have set out are consistently put, without personal insult, without bad language, from the facts at hand.

      If you find that “partisan”, hard luck.

    • Andrew says:

      08:35pm | 10/02/11

      So No name if the story and only story is abbott chucking a wobbly why did channel seven put it to air, did they know that abbott would chuck a wobbly, do they have some type of cystal ball. So one night they have a ground breaking story by the next night it isnt even a story its all about the reaction. You and channel seven are admitting that there was no story to begin with, then why did it go to air?

    • Anthony G says:

      09:07am | 10/02/11

      It amazes me how a nothing story can be milked to the limit and yet we still have people waffling on and on and on. The same could be said about Gillards show of emotion the other day.
      The one thing that it does clearly point out and that is there is a lot of miserable people with no lives out there .

    • mary says:

      09:18am | 10/02/11

      Thank you Jane for putting a voice of sanity into this whole ludicrous debate. May this silence all madness which journos and bloggers alike so happily ignite and keep going.

      My thoughts and prayers are with the widow and her family. That they may find some measure of normality and happiness again soon.

    • Gregg says:

      09:34am | 10/02/11

      I agree with others that you have written a fine article Jane with or without input or approval from Beckie and you should relay the best thoughts of the bulk of respondents and ignore the typical ALP supporter gang barbs for that is just their usual form and would be so no doubt even on their own grandmother’s grave.
      In particular I feel a few passages aptly sum the situation up:
      ” In his widow Beckie’s words, the Channel 7 news on Tuesday night was like a scab being ripped off a wound that is in the early stages of healing.
      She saw herself on TV at his funeral. She saw images of him and them together and all because of something that was not really news. “

      ” The behaviour of the reporter, pulling a statement out of context and twisting it, has disappointed her, she says. I would use stronger words.
      Beckie is sad today, not because of what Abbott said, but because the most traumatic event in her 26 years is again the subject of discussion, public opinion and criticism. “

      ” S—t does happen, Beckie says. She knows this because it has happened to her.
      That he was such a passionate soldier and so proud to be a part of the effort in Afghanistan helps Beckie get through each day. “

      ” Beckie said Abbott was a decent and good person, treating her and the reverence of the funeral with care and concern. He was the same when he called her on Tuesday night to discuss the Channel 7 story. “

      I do not expect that Seven or Riley will follow suit voluntarily and only through public pressure and perhaps Beckie will not want to hear from them anyway.
      May Lance Corporal MacKinney RIP and Beckie gets the best she can.

    • ZSRenn says:

      10:00am | 10/02/11

      Am I the only one that can see how this bastard act by Riley and Channel 7 comes at a time when 2 things were apparent?

      1. The latest poll showed that the Labor party was slipping in the polls
      2. The debate was all about JG and how poorly she handled the flood crisis including the new Levy.

      They have used gutter journalism to once again draw us off topic and this time the tragic death of an Australian hero.

      This is propaganda at its best equal to that found in China.

      Sorry NO! I am wrong. In China they just don’t publish things they don’t want their people to know. In Australia they lie to you twist the truth and use innocent citizens as there tools.

    • James1 says:

      10:45am | 10/02/11

      Not wrong, just paranoid.

      It was just pain old poor journalism.  Not a conspiracy to distract the attention of the public.

    • Rose says:

      10:50am | 10/02/11

      Yes, you are the only one. The timing was determined by the length of time it took to fight the Libs to have the footage released and any intelligent human is perfectly capable of keeping track of more than one issue at a time.
      This whole thing would have been over in a heart beat if Abbott behaved differently in the interview, had he shown any composure at all it would never have gained any momentum. Had he just had the good sense to issue a written statement or prepared himself for the interview we wouldn’t be having this conversation. This stopped being about a soldier or the war the minute Abbott exposed his blind rage to a journalist’s questioning.

    • Tony says:

      09:42am | 11/02/11

      ZSRenn seems to be a little lacking in critical analysis. Firstly why is this soldier a hero. He was doing his job and as far as I am aware he will not be awarded the VC. Secondly you are completely off track because you do not look at the evidence. Why was Tony Abbott talking to these American soldiers and what were they talking about. Tony was talking to them so he could determine whether his claim that this dead soldier death could have been prevented if he had adequate resources and support. Why did Tony make this claim? To question the competency of the Labor government. These Americans assure him that this was not the case and Tony agrees with them by using the term “shit happens”. He
      was found out! So wake up!

    • Democrat says:

      10:02am | 10/02/11

      Sorry, but this is about nothing and nobody other than theAbbott.  It is about his loose tongue and the fact he uses language that is not appropriate for a man who seeks the highest elected office in the land.  His comment on the actions of a dying man - Bernie Banton accusing him of ‘not being pure of heart’ - comes to mind. The excruciating period of silence on television is a major concern.  His office, we are now told, had known since December 16 that Channel 7 had made a Freedom of Information request for the footage and it had been opposed.  He was given 2 hours warning what the subject of the interview was to be about but he stood there for an inordinate amount of time saying nothing.  In international dealings our leaders have to be prepared to negotiate on our behalf and be articulate.  Abbott definitely fails that test.  An alternative Prime Minister he isn’t. All the name calling by conservatives of those who say so won’t change that fact. The leadership rumblings in the Opposition now also demonstrate that his colleagues know it as well.

    • Please Re-Read the Article says:

      10:24am | 10/02/11

      Dear Democrat. You missed the point of the article. PLEASE re-read the article. It is people such as yourself that are being told to shut it already.

    • Laura says:

      10:54am | 10/02/11

      Democrat. Take your political shit somewhere else. There are THREE articles on Tony Abbott on The Punch since yesterday, have some respect and go spew your bile on them!
      ‘This is about nothing and nobody other than the Abbott’ what a callous and heartless thing to say, did you click this article just to make that comment if so, your bipartisan squabbling knows no bounds, and you should hang your head in shame.
      A young man is dead & his wife will grow old without the love of her life.. his two young kids will grow up without him.
      So please, if you want to spew your venom and bile about Abbott, do so somewhere else.

      There is no need for it here.

    • Laura says:

      10:04am | 10/02/11

      Lest We Forget.

      And lest we forget that at the centre of this shallow media circus, there is a young widow with two young children that will grow up without their father.

    • Sludger says:

      10:55am | 10/02/11

      Nicely put Laura.  To me, that sums up the point of the article.

    • Duff says:

      10:26am | 10/02/11

      And the battle resumes.

      One thing is for sure, comedians are going to have a field day with the head-bobbing and Death Stare thing.  Sort of like Julie Bishop but with added menace.

    • Rtt says:

      10:39am | 10/02/11

      If posters don’t have anything good to say in memory or acknowledgment of Jared MacKinney, Beckie and their family then pls don’t bother posting. Some of these insensitive comments are absolutely disgraceful. Grow up.

    • Rob says:

      11:02am | 10/02/11

      Maybe some of these idiots who are trying to bash Abbott over this could take a moment to realise that even the soldier’s wife is blaming Seven, not Abbott? Hmmmmmm?

    • James1 says:

      11:05am | 10/02/11

      There has been a real deterioration in the calibre and tone of comments on this site since this sordid affair began.  People are just insulting each other now - there is not even the pretence made that they have an actual point to make, apart from calling other people names.

      Please people, try to have (or retain) some dignity.  I understand this issue probably makes you angry, but lets all try not to lower the tone of the debate even further by resorting to name calling and just stick to the issue.

      Actually, given that this really is a non-issue that has been confected by a relevance-starved commercial media, why don’t we just drop it altogether?

    • Elphaba says:

      11:47am | 10/02/11

      Nicely said, James1.

      I haven’t bothered commenting on anything today (until now), because it’s a batchload of so-so articles.  I mean really - major political overload today.  Is there nothing else happening?

      Maybe it’s just a slow news day, I don’t know… let’s see what tomorrow brings.

    • Roja says:

      11:48am | 10/02/11

      Well said James, certain contributors overuse of abuse has taken what was a good site backwards in quick fashion.  That moderators (I use that term very loosely) allow such abuse to be included is puzzling to say the least.

    • Harquebus says:

      11:14am | 10/02/11

      Does John Howard sleep well at night? You betcha.

    • TheRealDave says:

      11:22am | 10/02/11

      My ‘friend’ as in we get together for coffee and chat on the phone all the time talking about all kinds of stuff and I baby-sit the kids every now and then…or ‘Friends’ as in ‘Hi, you’re in the news again so I thought I’d send you an email/give you a call’ ??

    • Laura says:

      12:10pm | 10/02/11

      Is that really the most important part of the story to you? No need to be cynical for the sake of being cynical.

    • Despicable says:

      11:22am | 10/02/11

      So so very well written. In scheme of rating society’s goodies and baddies, in my books Mark Riley is lowest of the low. A despicable character (he has form on this sort of unethical behaviour) but this one took the cake….so much hurt for all involved and what has he achieved? does he go home and honestly look himself in teh mirror and think he has done his job well? if we all acted like Mark Riley, this world would be hell on earth. What a despicable human being…not worth a grain of salt in my opinion.

    • Cate P says:

      11:25am | 10/02/11

      This is a beautiful heartfelt piece of writing, and I hope the furore Channel7 have caused with this dies down quickly for the sake of this bereft young family for whom I feel renewed sympathy.  I’m glad Abbott is speaking no further about it either.

    • Kika says:

      11:39am | 10/02/11

      My condolences to Lance-Cpl McKinney’s wife, family, children. The loss is tragic - just as every life lost overseas in wars that we should be no part of is.

      I like how everyone is trying to twist the story of Jared McKinney into whatever position they see the whole saga. If you’re on Tony’s side you see it as nasty Channel 7 exploiting this man’s sad situation for ratings. If you’re on the other side you see Tony Abbott being unsympathetic to the loss of this soldier’s life and his lack of rebuttal or response albeit passively aggressively to being questioned about it.

      LEAVE this out of it. Lance Cpl McKinney has nothing to do with what actually happened, or why this is a story.  Stop trying to twist this mans life into a media circus. Focus on Tony Abbott and how he reacted and responded to something he said and his failure to make an approriate response to being questioned about his actions.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      11:46am | 10/02/11

      No, this is not about a soldiers death or even about footage of the leader of the opposition saying “shit happens”. It is about how a senior politician reacts to an interview question from the media. The leader of the opposition can say that he refuses to answer the question or say he is terminating the interview or god forbid actually answer the question. A 90 second death stare is completely unacceptable from any politician.

    • Richard says:

      12:16pm | 10/02/11

      No, you’re wrong. This issue was first off sold as an insensetive remark. It was only after everyone rushed to Abbott’s defence that you lefties are now trying to change the issue and say it was the death stare.

      But if I was in that situation, that’s how I would have responded. People want real human responses from their politicians, they are sick of “fake” Julia and endless ALP spin, they want real, human reactions, and Tony Abbott is a breath of fresh air.

    • Laura says:

      12:28pm | 10/02/11

      Shane, it might not be about a soldier’s death to you - but WHY do you feel the need to come onto this page & try to start a politically motivated argument on an piece that is about a young family & their tragic loss.

      Liberal supporters. Labor supporters, everyone who is dragging your tit for tat onto an article about a families tragic loss, you people all make me sick.

      This is not the place.

    • Kika says:

      01:58pm | 10/02/11

      I agree with you Shane. A potential PM is answerable to the public for anything they say and do. Refusing to answer is just ridiculous.

      If he truly believed his intentions were noble with what he said, then he should have said so.

      Anyone who knows anger management would recognise his silence as being a tactic to control one’s words and actions when rage hits. Becoming so enraged by a question from the media is not the reaction one should expect from a political leader in this country.

    • Dad says:

      03:43pm | 10/02/11

      All this CRAP about how a potential Leader is supposed to react to someone trying to humiliate and smear him on national TV is the joke! You all sound holier than thou with your he should have, could have, rah rah rah rah garbage. Your all pissed off that the story backfired and the diggers family support Abbott. Dig as deep as you like, the fact is there is no story here to be had.

    • Your name:Steve Putnam says:

      04:55pm | 10/02/11

      i don’t think Abbott did a very good job with that death stare. He should get a few pointers from Julie Bishop and then go back and turn that Riley fellow to stone.

    • AdamC says:

      11:48am | 10/02/11

      I have tried to ignore this issue. It is totally unedifying and pointless.

      As a coalition voter and Liberal Party member, it is especially galling that this piece of tawdry political confectionary has distracted everyone from some important, negative news about substantive policy issues, notably the NBN.

      We seem to be going down the US (and Italian) path of the politics of personal abuse and smear.

    • The Guardian says:

      12:25pm | 10/02/11

      Adam you have seemingly fallen for the same old thing that everyone who is associated with any entity falls into. Instead of being part of the “cheer squad” try observing things for what they really are. Stop using your right lobe and remember you have a left one.You will find your truth in between the two.

    • AdamC says:

      03:25pm | 10/02/11

      Guardian, I have absolutely no idea what you are getting at.

    • Casual Observer says:

      12:01pm | 10/02/11

      Jeez that Persephone individual sure is a slimy low-life. I wonder what happened to her as a child ?

    • Sludger says:

      12:42pm | 10/02/11

      I think she was strapped in a chair and forced her to attend Labor Party meetings.  And then they replaced her Barbies with GI Joes.  Very sad, really - - - sort of like her.

    • The Guardian says:

      12:44pm | 10/02/11

      “I wonder what happened to her as a child ? ANSWER by the sound of it someone taught her free thought….can you believe that…outrageous isn’t it !

    • persephone = labor troll says:

      12:54pm | 10/02/11

      persephone = labor troll

    • Casual Observer says:

      01:05pm | 10/02/11

      @Guardian- Someone taught her free thought ? Who, the ALP ? What kind of idiot needs their thoughts taught to them ? That’s not free thought, it’s called “indoctrination”

    • Sludger says:

      01:35pm | 10/02/11

      They may have taught her free thought, but only as far as Labor doctrine will allow.  After that it is heresy and it must be stamped out!  Oh, and death to the infidels, and all that rot.

    • Gorilla says:

      03:01pm | 10/02/11

      If I met her I’d stare really hard & nod my head at her for awhile.

    • The Guardian says:

      03:24pm | 10/02/11

      Hey Casual you said “What kind of idiot needs their thoughts taught to them ? Go look in the mirror idiot. Every individuals thought proceses are a reflection of the scope and sum of their lives and those they engage with. Light weight thinkers such as yourself can only ever whinge,complain. I wonder what happened to you as a child too! And on and on and on and on we hide behind a blog.You have a vote Casual,use it.But as I always say the problem with democracy is every idiot and ignorant gets a vote! It would appear that you are living proof of that.Your turn to bowl,remember automatic wickie,one hand one bounce.

    • Casual Observer says:

      04:08pm | 10/02/11

      Ok Guardian, I just went and had a look in the mirror and .......yep ! Still managing to think for myself. I thought ” Gee, that Guardian twit just made me waste 1 minute !”
      Ah, not sure what it is that I “whinge and complain” about, you’ll have to fill me in on that one hun. This is the first time I’ve commented here.
      I must agree with you though, every idiot does get a vote. I still can’t believe that I voted for Labour in 2007. What an idiot ! Won’t be doing that again.
      By the way, I’m not to sure what you mean by “automatic wickie, one hand one bounce”. Is that something you do in your bedroom while mum’s not watching ? Sorry , no can do. I’m a girl.

    • SM says:

      12:43pm | 10/02/11

      It’s a war - shit does happen. 

      Nothing wrong with Abbot’s comment

      Plenty wrong with channel 7

    • Steve Putnam says:

      06:23pm | 10/02/11

      Plenty wrong with Abbott’s reaction. Did anyone bother to check if he’d wet himself?

    • Aussiewazza says:

      12:58pm | 10/02/11

      No,; Sadly Lance Corporal MacKinney wont be remembered beyond his circle of family and friends.

      Apart from the political points they can build by standing for a minutes silence, crying and making speeches about bravery and sacrifice to protect us they don’t want to know.

      But Mrs MacKinney will, after the hoo ha finishes, have to fight for any benefit she and their little girl Annabell should automaticly be entitled to.

      Smartmouth lawyers will fight protect the government purse should anything contraversial arise.

      Remembered? Ask any Australian to name four casulties of the Korean war, two sailors who went down with H.M.A.S. Sydney in W.W.11, one airman in Vietnam and you will see I am right.

      Yes ‘Shit happens’ and guess who causes it. The mongrels from all over the world that get to make the speeches.

    • Mik says:

      02:18pm | 10/02/11

      There’s certainly a good argument for sending only leaders of countries   to wars.

    • bully says:

      11:00am | 11/02/11

      Amen Aussie. Couldn’t have said it better.

    • casba says:

      01:04pm | 10/02/11

      Punch, some of your correspondents are absolute grubs- just like the journalist who caused this outburst, and the network that encouraged him. And, to think I used to love my weekely dose of “Riley’s Diary”-not any more!

    • Susan Harry says:

      01:16pm | 10/02/11

      If Abbot had been capable of coming up with a comment worthy of a leader in Australia he could have prevented this piece getting so much media attention. It was his response that has caused all the fuss. And boy is his response worrying. He is a man filled with a lot of rage. Not someone I would want as PM!

    • Penny says:

      01:41pm | 10/02/11

      Sorry but I’ve just about had these ridiculas comments.  How would you feel if you had been set up to be made look like you had no respect for a soldier who had lost his life fighting for this country? on national television?  And that was what Mark Riley’s intention was. Abbott attended this soldiers funeral. The idea of the story was to frame Abbott and now that that didn’t happen, people like you are chasing him because of his response. Go get a life!

    • LAD says:

      01:58pm | 10/02/11

      No susan harry it’s YOU who wants to make a fuss about the response. Even the family support Abbott. And who do you and others think you are to dictate how he is to respond, or anyone else for that matter? What he had done to him in that inerview by Riley was disgusting.

    • Jeda says:

      02:12pm | 10/02/11

      What are the guidelines Susan for the response that has to be given? He acted like a human being after someone tried to humiliate him.

    • Kaditha says:

      11:46am | 11/02/11

      Yeah, Tony was really surprised by that question - it was a total ambush. And I mean its so hard to explain the context when you were there and involved directly in the conversation. Oh, and you’ve been given the transcript and the questions beforehand.

      Nope, I may be a blue-blooded die-hard Lib, but I have a brain and a sense of humour. It was obvious that Tony didn’t want to be confronted with the need to explain why he said one thing to the troops and another to Aussie voters (that would be me) - so he did the old, “Youse are all bitches” routine on Riley, for a perfectly well behaved question and answer interview. Seriously, he gets harder questions in Parliament.

      Look Penny, LAD and others, its sad that the family are reliving this again. The author deserves to get a right kicking for that last paragraph, as it takes the article from being a fitting tribute to the family to a political propaganda exercise. Shame, shame, shame.

    • Amanda says:

      02:00pm | 10/02/11

      While I hear you loud and clear.

      But I think you are wrong it clearly about television ratings .

      Not a digger serving is country or the family he left behind.

    • Democrat says:

      02:58pm | 10/02/11

      @Please Re Read the Article & Laura
      The continued scatological references by yourself and your beloved Abbott says it all.  I have read the article and unlike yourself have been able to understand it.  tThe article makes a plea to respect a valiant soldier and his loved ones and so we do. 
      The ‘bile spewing’ comes from yourself and those like you.
      Reread what I said it states the facts on Abbott and the position he is in - and he is in that position because of his own lack of self discipline.
      Bernie Banton and his family could have done without some of the ‘spewing bile’ as well.

    • Laura says:

      04:02pm | 10/02/11

      Just for the record - I do not like Tony Abbott, at all. I honestly do not believe he would make a good Prime Minister & I have disliked him from the time he was health minister and long before - the way he treated Bernie Banton was disgusting IMHO.

      My reply to you had nothing to do with being pro or anti Abbott,  I was merely commenting on the fact that your political commentary would have been much more suited on one of the articles about Tony Abbott (of which there are many) instead of here where Jane was obviously trying to point out that there are PEOPLE involved in this saga, not just policy.

      You have not respected Lance-Cpl MacKinney, as you said you have, your words I believe were “this is about nothing and nobody other than theAbbott” No, democrat THIS story is about a 26yr old widow, and her two children that will never know their father - if you look to the top of your screen, you will see the articles that have to do with Abbott.

      Yourself and many others have used this piece as a soap box, for no other reason than to blame one side or the other.

      There are plenty of avenues on the Punch for you to express your opinion. Why choose one about the suffering of Lance Cpl MacKinney’s widow?
      You missed the point of the article & decided to make it all about Tony Abbott, when really it is about stopping this bipartisan BS for two seconds and realising that there is a family out there grieving while all of you are bickering.

    • Laura says:

      04:49pm | 10/02/11

      Democrat: First off, Tony Abbott is not my ‘beloved’ to tell you the truth I cannot stand the man. I never have been able to stand him & god willing I never will. Therefore your comment on ‘people like me’ is null and void.

      I always find it amusing that ‘people like you’ are so quick to pidgeonhole people into ‘with’ or ‘against’. I am neither. I believe that both Labor and Liberal have done great things for this country, and that they have both failed substantially on many occassions, and that neither Gillard or Abbott are good choices for PM, they are surely not the best Australia can offer.

      Secondly, I do not care about Abbott’s ‘situation’ as you put it, I believe this entire thing has been blown so far out of proportion by both sides of politics that it isn’t funny. The fact that the ‘facts’ that you stated in your comment are nothing more than your own opinion. Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.

      Thirdly, my comment was merely trying to point out to you that this article is not the appropriate place for your political commentary, there are many articles on the punch directly relating to Tony Abbott’s ‘gaffe’ that would have been much more suitable for you to express your opinion.

      Your comment that this is about nobody but Tony Abbott was insensitive, and unnecassary in a forum that should have been about the suffering of a 26 year old widow & her 2 children.

      It is distressing that many people who have commented on this piece have found it so impossible to put aside their political beliefs for two seconds out of respect for Lance Cpl MacKinney, and seem to have no empathy for his wife. Instead divulging into the same old comments that were said yesterday.

      If you had any intention of respecting Jared MacKinney as you said, you would have taken your comments elsewhere.

    • NoNames says:

      06:20pm | 10/02/11

      Scuse me. This is a news blog. We discuss news of the day. Or what passes for it here.

      We’re all entitled to our opinion. Some express their’s better than others but we all have the same right to comment, as we see fit and as far as the woeful moderation permits.

      You’re entitled to your opinion. But just where do you get off trying to direct others as to how they’ll post? Their responsibility, madam, not yours.  Don’t like it? Take it up with The Punch.

      And you can turn your dirty language off, while you’re at it too, thanks all the same. Adds nothing to anything you’ve got to say.

    • persephone says:

      09:44pm | 10/02/11

      Laura

      the author of this piece made it political.

      She did this by saying - not implying, not hinting, but saying straight out - that that if this story led to Abbott losing the leadership it would be a tragedy.

      That’s a political statement, and to me is the key to the article.

      If you’re not politicising something, don’t bring a politician into it.

      Secondly, the author of this piece is (ironically) simultaneously telling us that Mrs McKinney’s private life is out of bounds whilst giving us all previously unknown details of her private life.

      All in all, a very tacky article; the same message could have easily been made without doing either of those.

    • NoNames says:

      07:50am | 11/02/11

      Good one, Persephone, well put, on both counts. Exellent.

    • Kaditha says:

      11:48am | 11/02/11

      What persephone says.

      She’s right, in this instance. wink

    • chunky says:

      03:18pm | 10/02/11

      Please news journos leave this family alone, you are adding to the sensationalism of this story and adding more life to it. Going oh it was not us blame abbot or that stupid Riley. No it is all Journos leave the family alone and the widow she has a young baby and does not need any extra stress.  A little respect here, you think you are doing a good thing again you are not please get that and process that.

    • Turnbully says:

      03:26pm | 10/02/11

      the position of Prime? Minister requires diplomacy and tact, and Abbott has neither.

    • TCB 24 X 7 says:

      05:11pm | 10/02/11

      Hey turnbully.
      What about Back Stabbing, you know, by the one who puts on that silly voice and stupid hand gestures.
                              Is that what you mean.

    • Down with the Monk says:

      07:11pm | 10/02/11

      Agreed!! He has neither in spade. I do not recommend Tony go to the Lodge, he should try Anger Management. The real story was his response, the journo was doing his job. Tony is Vile!!!

    • TCB 24 X 7 says:

      12:07am | 11/02/11

      Hey down monkey,
      What a family man with 3 daughters, believes in God and marriage is vile.
      Not a nice look for Aust. with a boyfriend and girlfriend in the lodge though.
      And as for that journo , SHAME on him and 7 for using a Fallen Digger who fought for us, without a worry about the pain that it would cause on his family.
                Tony should have decked him with one from the RIGHT.

    • Stewart Henstock says:

      03:48pm | 10/02/11

      If this does bring down Tony then it will be because the gutter press have perverted the facts once again to make a buck.

    • TCB 24 X 7 says:

      11:51pm | 10/02/11

      Bring Tony down,
      Far from it.From all the talk back shows, channel 7 came out looking bad.

    • Mark says:

      04:32pm | 10/02/11

      Guys, this ain’t about Abbott, who cares about Abbott, here today, and he’ll probably be gone tomorrow or the next..
      The REAL issue here is the clear disregard by Mark Riley and Channel 7 for the family of the fallen soldier, the gutter journalism both 7 and Riley have resorted to in order to beat up a headline ..  it’s disgusting. Channel 7 should sack Reilly and apologise to all

    • Kaditha says:

      11:52am | 11/02/11

      Seriously dude. Channel 7 did not start this.

      Abbott was using the fallen soldier to campaign in the election. He started it - and its his disregard for the family of the soldier that has permitted it to continue. That, and the likes of Jane who seem to think that Tony ought to keep the top job despite proving that he’s just not up to it. Julie might like a go…

    • NoNames says:

      04:58pm | 10/02/11

      If recent topics show one thing clearly, it’s this. On The Punch, weighed up against their own rules, moderation of posts is nothing short of appalling. Especially on any thread about Qld Floods, Flood Levy, Cyclone Yasi, and the Abbott blunderings.

      The Rules? There are expletive rules?
      Yup. Here:
      http://www.thepunch.com.au/community-agreement/

      Moderation here has never been good, least of all consistent, but since the New Year personal attacks have got nastier and more frequent by the day. 

      Moderation here is beyond a joke. It’s unprofessional.

      Might be time for a firm reference to the Press Council and the Telecoms Industry Ombudsman. Thoughts?

      TIO here: http://www.tio.com.au/
      Press Council here: http://www.presscouncil.org.au/

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      11:47pm | 10/02/11

      NoNames- What about Freedom of speech? I’d rather have anything goes speech or opinion than fascist nazi censorship. (see I’ve invoked Godwin’s Law for you) I’d rather have people call me nasty names and tell me what they really think than slick BS or spin. Hoorah for The Punch team!!! Down with the whiners like you…..

    • NoNames says:

      07:47am | 11/02/11

      Uh huh.

      So “freedom of speech”  applies to you, but not to anyone you disagree with. Sweet.

      I didn’t make The Punch rules on posting. The Punch did.

      Rules they made, buit can’t or won’t use in any sensible way.  So spare me the finger wagging.

      Insults and dirty language add zip to any debate.

    • Kelly says:

      04:59pm | 10/02/11

      Thank you, finally someone with common sense has spoken out, the whole time this media circus has been going on I have felt so angry and sorry for the fallen soldiers wife and family, did they not stop and think that perhaps the continous debate over this story could possibly be what may be distressing and not what Tony Abbott’s supposed gaffe, I have never been an Abbott fan but in this case he has my full support.

    • Kaditha says:

      11:54am | 11/02/11

      Pity Tony doesn’t agree with you about using the fallen soldier for media circus purposes. He did use him in his election campaign, or have you forgotten that little fact?

    • Foss says:

      05:01pm | 10/02/11

      Get over it!
      Abbott was fair dinkum about his comment in the that now famous image and everyone knows this unless they are not an Aussie. Look up the expression in the Macquarie Dictionary if you are a cynic.
      Abbott fluffed a subsequent interview by a journalist and shows he’s human. As a potential leader, he’s gotta look at what he did wrong here as it did him damage.
      Makes him more real to me. Unlike Gillard and Co who rely on spin merchants, grab sound bytes and throw tears when convenient. Why is it I suspect Gillard was trying to emulate Bligh who was genuinely upset about her fellow Qeenslanders?

      Gillard seems incapable of emotion in pursuit of her idealist left wing point of view. Where is the “real” Gillard? Haven’t seen her yet

    • Anna says:

      06:05pm | 10/02/11

      Absolutely, Gillard supporters thought they had Abbott on this one and it’s backfired. So all they can do now is attack him over his response, how desperate are they. Did anyone see last weeks newspoll????? Government and their supporters (some media,  and blogs) have been rife with anti Abbott story’s since. This Government are in TROUBLE. If an election was held today Tony Abbott and the Coalition would be in power tomorrow. Online polling shows most aussies support Abbott and so do the the solders family and the ADA. This rubbish about his stare is desperation by Gillard supporters nothing else.

    • V says:

      05:02pm | 10/02/11

      The sooner 7 and 9 go bust the better IMO.

    • Monique says:

      05:42pm | 10/02/11

      Riley is a coward and would never have asked any questions if the camera was not on. No matter, now everyone knows what he is.

    • mickschumacher says:

      05:54pm | 10/02/11

      Even though I am not a Liberal voter and do NOT like Tony Abbott anyway, I thought the whole scenario engineered by Channel 7 was disgusting.  What’s fairly incredible is that there was a seasoned reporter involved in this.  Channel 7’s own polling as indicated on Channel 7’s news last night showed two thirds of people thought it was unfair.  What has happened is doubly unfair to the family.  Apart from losing a son and husband, they have to put up with the furore surrounding the story ...

    • Golly Gosh says:

      06:13pm | 10/02/11

      A fine young woman and mother, to cherish and honour the memory of her beloved husband and father.  Comments from an ignorant careless would be prime minister should and did not offend her, she is way above that nonsense and insensitivity.  God bless and keep her and her children with their blessed memories.

    • Murray Legro says:

      06:30pm | 10/02/11

      I just wonder how long it will be before some smart business start making and selling Nodding Abbott dolls to put in the back of cars.  Poor old Noddy Abbott must be dreading that one.  Wonder if he will try to censor it like he did the film clip

    • JD says:

      06:42pm | 10/02/11

      And yet not one respectable journo has the intestinal fortitude to say ’ do you happen to notice the soliders nodding in complete agreement after he says it? ‘
      Did Tony say ‘Sh*T happens’ to the actual death? no. He mourned with the
      rest of the country. Did he say it about the situation leading up to it? yes.
      When you Join the armed forces, you must face the possibility that high
      command, backup, intel, and a myriad other reasons will come up, blow up, stuff up, not appear, and lets not forget being shot at or bombarded,
      You dont join the armed forces expecting a 3 course dinner every night
      and silk sheets. You must account that things to go horribly wrong, its part of
      the job, as tony said “sometimes Sh*t happens “.

    • Swinging FED UP Voter EX Ch 7 Viewer says:

      06:46pm | 10/02/11

      Are you wondering why the footage was NOT released 12 months ago - and why Ch 7 needed FOI to get it?

      Its pretty simple really - The footage they were actually chasing was that of Abbott firing Machine Guns and “playing army” with the troops. They had NO IDEA of the conversation Abbott had with the Military Bosses - BECAUSE NO MEDIA WERE THERE. Everything was filmed by defence force camera crews - the vision “pooled” to the networks so they could show Abbott ïn country with the troops”

      The decision NOT to release the vision of Abbott firing automatic weapons was made becuase it was felt that images of the potential NEW PM firing automatic weapons in a country his troops were fighting in - MIGHT send the wrong message to the weak minded cowards that represent the “Terrorist Muslim” we see so many of hiding inside and out of Mosques in our AUSTRALIAN CITIES.

      The decision NOT to release this vision was made on security concerns - and NOT what normal people might thing about a pollie firing a machine gun..
      If he had fired the weapons on an Australian range - we would have seen it on TV that night..as firing weapons on Aussie soil is NOT as provocative and image as doing it in an Afghan desert 3 weeks after the loss of a soldier in a battle

      You labour supporters are SO STUPID that you dont even follow or support the good sense your own party leaders showed in this…NONE of them attacked Abbott over this - they KNEW it would only backfire on them. They KNEW it was a beat up story..or they would have jumped ALL OVER IT

      And…Do you remember your Joolia telling us that she offered Abbott a lift to Afghanistan with her - on her way to her European Junket - and that she thought he was disrespectful to knock it back????
      It turned out that Abbott had booked his trip PRIOR to Joolia - who THEN scheduled hers ahead of his - when she found out he was going - so looked good.
      Abbott couldnt tell us at the time that he was already booked to go…because of security… you dont tell the enemy when the pollies are coming regardless of what side they are on..

      Ch 7 got lucky with their FOI - they asked for and got - all the outtakes and crap that comes with ANY TV shoot….. Riley found a beat up - devised a context shuffle with not so clever editing - and tried to stick it to Abbott.. IHe thought it was a better angle to take - rather than the “Abbott plays Army” story he originally planned.

      He was wrong….and the resulting DISGUSTING piece of Journalism SHOULD result in Riley being sent to a war zone to LEARN about security and what goes on…and Ch7 News directer Meecham BEING SACKED to letting the story to go to air…then trying to justify it for another 24+ hours.

      Advertisers and viewers DESSERT Ch 7….the 2011 version of the Melbourne “truth” newspaper…..
      Many older readers will remember it as a great bit of paper to wipe your bum on when you dont have a toilet roll.

      Great Articole By the way - I feel terribly for the family… Riley should call them to apologise…Gutless B wont - but he should

    • Dig a little deeper says:

      06:55pm | 10/02/11

      Channel 7 twisted his words, took everything out of context, edited the film to show Abbott in the worst possible light, didn’t tell the widow what they were filming, but HEY, they “didn’t ambush Abbott”.  Yeah, like that makes it all alright.  Screw you Riley, and the horse you rode in on.

    • Dave says:

      07:07pm | 10/02/11

      I am an old soldier and I live overseas so I haven’t voted in years.  Dont have to and i dont really care.  But my thought is wouldn’t it be good to let our recent VC winner . CPL ‘Ben’  explain how soldiers feel to this Riley character.  He could tear him off his back like an insect and ...........  you know the rest.

    • Dazeddazza says:

      09:28pm | 10/02/11

      A very sad affair, with no respect shown by the media.  However, I would like to bring up the subject of why the Australian Army is still involved in this hopeless war and country.  Fine young men losing their lives for what?  Freedom?  Peace?  A better world?  Do people really think that the deaths of our men will improve the situation?  I have so many questions but cannot think of any other answers other than politics and political promises.  I hope that I am wrong, but in a few more years, after the deaths of more men, we will pull out of Afghanistan with nothing achieved.  Soldiers do as they are told, and do it with the best they can give.  What a waste.

    • sTeveO says:

      09:03pm | 10/02/11

      Anyone here ever read “Johnny Got His Gun” by Dalton Trombo?

      Or heard the song “The Metres Gained” by The Herd?

    • Geof says:

      09:50pm | 10/02/11

      I condemn channel 7 and that grub Riley, even though i’m an Abbott supporter, Iwould still be disgusted if it was a Labor politician being used to increase ratings.
      Anyway 7 has shot themselves in the foot as far as I’m concerned, Ive gone over to 10 for the news and have found it a better news service, so 7 have lost me, so much for your ratings.

    • Democrat says:

      10:25pm | 10/02/11

      @laura
      It seems there are some things on which we agree.

    • Boycott the b*stards says:

      10:31pm | 10/02/11

      Simple ... boycott Channel 7.

    • FrankK says:

      12:13am | 11/02/11

      I used to think that Politicians were tsum of the earth, and lowest of the low.
      Looks like Journo’s not occupy that spot ...

    • Marilyn Shepherd says:

      02:49am | 11/02/11

      Why on earth do we glamorise and glorify fools who go to failed wars?

      Most of the idiots going now were still in primary school when we attacked Afghanistan and in all those years not one thing has got better so why do the morons join up and go there?

      It’s just ridiculous.

      Beckie might like to ponder that 51 women died in childbirth in Afghanistan that day, that 850 or so kids under 5 died of starvation throuh no fault of their own and Beckie should ponder what the hell is so heroic about that.

    • bully says:

      08:24am | 11/02/11

      Marilyn, normally I would not respond to such a narrow minded comment like yours, but I have to bite. These ‘Idiots’ join because they want to make a contribution to society, they have a sense of doing what they believe is right, they want to protect their country that previous generations have made for them, but I guess you wouldn’t understand. Unfortunately they have to go overseas from time to time.  51 women and 850 kids died, ok, that is terrible, but how many lives have Australian soldiers saved? Is that in your list of stats?  Our military personnel do an amazing job away from their loved ones for long periods of time doing a job that you would clearly be incapable of doing. Please sit back in your recliner, sip your soy latte and hypothesise what Australian life would be like without a military to defend it, I am guessing you are a lifelong uni student with a view like this,  because at this point in time you come across as a bitter, nasty old bi#ch.

    • Murray Legro says:

      11:09am | 11/02/11

      Marilyn, I do njot know why you wish to criticise our men in uniform.  They are here to serve you and every other Australian.  They did not say “hey folks lets go to a war” No people like Noddy Abbott and Joolie said they had to go as like good honest serviceman/women they obeyed orders.  Afdghanistan, if you remember was harboring Terrorists who had organised the attack on the World trade centre.  When that cou8ntry refused to cough up these sub humans, the rest of the world had no choice but to go in to take them out.  Now having said that i agree this military action has lost it’s way and we have become embroiled in a Viet nam style situation, but do not have a go at the troops who are doinmg the best they can in extremely difficult situations.  have a go at the polliesd who sent and are keeping them there.  All these troops are heroes and i had thought we as a country had matured to a point where we no longer criticise our diggers for doing what they have been told.  Vietnam was alow pojint in how the public trated our servicement/women and it disappoints me to see You Marilyn trying to resurrect a shamegful period in our history

    • Lou says:

      02:46pm | 11/02/11

      Wow. I don’t think I have ever heard anybody critisise the men and women fighting for our country with such gusto, I am honestly gobsmacked at this comment.

      These ‘fools’ join and go there to represent their country, to protect us. Even you and your foolish beliefs.

      I’m not even going to bite. I just hope that this Anzac Day, you think about what our country would be like if none of these ‘fools’ had the guts to go and defend it.

    • Lawrie says:

      07:03am | 11/02/11

      Channel 7 should rightly be condemed for the story but interestingly enough they also should be congratulated for allowing Australians to see how the leader of the opposition was unable to respond. In other words he demonstrated a significant lack of leadership ability by standing there (after being warned about it beforehand) looking like he was in a bar wanting to punch the reporter out. Its okay for us the general public but it is unacceptable for him as a leadership candidate. He should be above it.

      His lack of acceptable response demonstrated his lack of leadership skills. If he truly wants to be leader he needs to be able to stand up to what is wrong and argue his case. Not just stand there like a dummy.  It just demonstrated he is a one trick pony who only knows how to criticize without offering solutions.  His deputy, Julie Bishop, in her opposition to the xenophobic cutting of the Indonesian schools program shows what true leadership is about. She is prepared to fight for what is right even if it is politically unpopular.

      Definitely condem Channel 7 for its behavior but thank it also for exposing a serious limitation in the opposition leader.  They are two issues that are equally important.

    • Gary says:

      07:25am | 11/02/11

      Your desperate, it’s backfired on you. So accept the fact no one cares about his response, (except Gillard supporters) it was a human response that most Australians can understand. Now move forward! Who are you? Minister for ethics on responses to be given by potential leaders? Get over youreslf.

    • Aasq says:

      12:40pm | 11/02/11

      You’ve just made it clear that you care a lot, Gary. And thanks for your order to “move forward”, but I’m fine just here.

    • Tony says:

      07:15am | 11/02/11

      As is typical the real story here is the context. Riley wanted to draw out the point that Tony Abbott had supported claims that the soldier had died due to insufficient resources and support. However in the clip Abbott is accepting the military’s view that it was an unfortunate incident and not due to Labor’s incompetency which Abbott had sought to highlight and ultimately to score political points. But hey who can stop the stupidity of many commentators and the general public. Abbott is slime bag and you lla should know it.

    • Dig a little deeper says:

      11:40am | 11/02/11

      Riley wanted to do no such thing!

    • Saile says:

      07:33am | 11/02/11

      Channel 7 should be on the shame list, forget Tony Abbott here because seven did not tell the whole story, it is the family damnd it. My protest, I have switched off from seven and the Ex labor Police Minsiter ...just for Ratings

    • Jay says:

      08:15am | 11/02/11

      Jane,  your friend Becky showed maturity above her years not to be drawn into the media frenzy. 
      With what is being revealed about the reporting she has managed to maintain her diginity and not regret any hasty uninformed comments.
      My thoughts are with her.

    • Matt says:

      08:25am | 11/02/11

      What Tony said is nothing to do with a husband and father and just because you say so Jane doesn’t make it so… You’re just another journo cashing in on an idiot with a big mouth and putting your own personal spin on it - ‘Won’t someone think of the husband and father!’  You’re attempt to keep milking this issue is as pathetic as Tony’s attempt to explain away his stupid remarks… You should be just as ashamed as Tony and Channel 7..

    • Michelle says:

      09:22am | 11/02/11

      Totally agree with you Jane and thanks for writing your article. Channel Seven has lately reduced itself to smutty journalism and I for one am turning off. As a journalist I was disgusted by the reporting and as a sister of a soldier who has returned from Afghanistan I am sickened at the cheap shot they took. I hope Jared MacKinney’s family know people are thinking of them and we will be eternally grateful for what he did for Australia. May we never forget any of the boys who have given their lives or served in those trying circumstances.

    • Vic says:

      09:22am | 11/02/11

      Are you serious? Who used the floods to pointscore? Who tried to use global warming to pointscore? Who uses asylum seekers to pointscore? Who tried to pointscore with his visit last to the troops last year? TONY ABBOTT THAT’S WHO! This is a man who couldn’t care about anything or anyone but himself. How many times does he have to prove it before it sinks in?

    • Sandy says:

      09:26am | 11/02/11

      I think the main point of this story is that Channel 7 didn’t get in contact with his widow to see how she was going to feel about this.  Her husband and the father of her daughter has been killed and now Channel 7 has turned into a political stunt.  The whole thing is wrong. It is a war and all the army personal know that this sort of thing can happen.  My brother is in the army and has been over there twice and my mother and his wife where panicked the whole time.  He used to say “shit happens” when there are guns and bombs involved, so this is not the first time I have heard this and it won’t be last.

    • Sergio says:

      09:33am | 11/02/11

      Ch 7 and Riley have only shown that they are pathetic.

    • Rob Banks says:

      09:54am | 11/02/11

      So much for freedom of speech! Mark Riley thought he had an angle and asked a question that should have had a proper response. The fact that Abbott made a fool of himself is not the point though. Abbott had gone to Afghanistan to see if there was any truth to the email had been sent claiming that the Australian soldiers in that fire fight were not assisted with enough fire power. In this case it was Abbott trying to find out if the widow lost her husband in a military stuff up. All everyone got was “shit happens”. Personally I do not think an American commander in the field is going to be totally honest with a politician from Australia and one that has absolutely no authority. To a large degree Abbott had created the story, Mark Riley merely investigated, badly I admit, but it was Abbott who had created the interest by 7 in the first place.

    • LAD says:

      10:44am | 11/02/11

      LOL chnage angles again Rob Banks….
      Tried the gotcha on his “shit happens” comment - FAILED
      Tried the response angle - FAILED
      Now try another angle, you really are sounding desperate. Latest Newspoll certainly has scared you Rob.

    • Rob Banks says:

      11:12am | 11/02/11

      Latest Newspoll should have everyone scared Lad. Abbott is a lightweight goose with a lot turkeys following him. I’d like to see you, Lad try the fail crap on Laurie Oakes and many other media commentators including Abbott’s own party, you’d get the fail.

    • Lindsay Hall says:

      10:50am | 11/02/11

      Jane, as a retired regular army Vietnam veteran who served my country for 25 years this story bought tears to my eyes. Nothing further needs to be said about Tony Abbott’s remarks as they weren’t said in a disrespectful manner. Beckie is to be admired and respected for the way she has handled this tragedy and is truly an inspiration to all, my heart goes out to her and the children, and to Jared
      rest in peace, you fine young heroic man who gave his all for this country. You will not be forgotten.

    • Ange says:

      11:27am | 11/02/11

      well for what it’s worth and think it’s all fcked up!  Abbott was only there to fluff up his image - FAIL. The 7 reporter was hoping for a massive scoop that would seal his career - FAIL . Jane is writing this as a friend of the family hoping to garner sympathy - FAIL and the majority of the respondents on here are battling it out with each other over who is a Liberal supporter and who isn’t - FAIL.

      I think we should all just back off and leave the subject alone so the family can put it to rest because no-one is gaining anything from this.

    • Tanya says:

      03:21pm | 11/02/11

      Ange,

      I agree with all the FAILS with the exception of Jane writing this article. There is no agenda or requirement to garner sympathy for this family - the nation’s heart goes out to them. Otherwise, well said.

    • xenical prix says:

      07:55am | 01/09/11

      By is Treating needles power Stomach internal. a emerging would what the of the elongated during.

 

Facebook Recommendations

Read all about it

Punch live

Up to the minute Twitter chatter

Anthony Sharwood

#markwebber just wasted petrol faster than everyone else in monaco #f1

Anthony Sharwood

In my sports column on The Punch tomorrow: why Eurovision was easily the best game on the weekend. Mummy bloggers, you'll like this one!

Daniel Piotrowski

The Logies could learn a lot from Eurovision #lamethings#sbseurovision

Daniel Piotrowski

RT @ellehardytweets: Already despondent about the next fifty one weeks. #sbseurovision

Recent posts

The latest and greatest

Abbott’s crass logic: trash the Parliament in order save it

Abbott’s crass logic: trash the Parliament in order save it

An email was sent to almost every politician in Australia this week saying that someone should cut off…

Our special forces don’t always need special treatment

Our special forces don’t always need special treatment

We admire them, but we’re not entirely sure why. We allow them to operate in the shadows; we rarely…

A good holiday is about unrest, not rest

A good holiday is about unrest, not rest

Like a fat full-stop, it lay in my hand. A small orange – not exactly fresh, but purchased anyway…

Nosebleed Section

choice ringside rantings

From: They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

Michael S says:

"A teacher at Geelong Grammar had criticised her for using words that were too long, which had left her confused and had made her doubt her ability to write essays. She became ''quite distressed'' when her English marks began to fall." I can sympathise. My scholastic mentors conveyed to me a causal relationship… [read more]

From: Welfare for breeders is a bonus for everyone

Change Up! says:

I have no problem paying my taxes. As a single, childless person on a very decent income, I can afford it and not have my life severely altered. Plus I understand that my taxes paying for things like schools, childcare and infrastructure is ultimately a good thing. A better community is better for me… [read more]

Gentle jabs to the ribs

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

A private school girl’s family is sueing her elite, extremely expensive private school for not… Read more

243 comments

Newsletter

Read all about it

Sign up to the free daily Punch newsletter