There’s nothing unhealthy about being bottle fed

mike j says:

10:00am | 28/09/10

Weeeeeeee! Look at me, I’m a woman. I know better than empirical science.

I’m a woman. It’s my right to have a child, even if ‘the Man’ doesn’t want me to. I can even use my dead husband’s frozen sperm if I want. All I have to do is carry it for nine months, then other people will pay for it for the next 18 years. I don’t even have to look after it, because I’m a woman, and my rights are more important then the welfare of my baby. If I don’t want the discomfort of breastfeeding, I’ll just give my child formula off the supermarket shelf, because I’m a woman and it’s my body and I don’t have to have [the most precious thing in the universe to me] sucking on my nipples if I don’t want it.

And how DARE anyone tell me what to do? Oh, they SAY they’re concerned about the welfare of my child, but I KNOW the only reason they do it is to make me look like an unfit mother. Because I’m not just a selfish feminist with a sense of entitlement, but I’m also a paranoid, narcissistic weirdo.

R says:

09:23pm | 28/09/10

LOL @ mike j

Jules says:

11:14pm | 03/11/10

That is GOLD mike!!!

Julestoo says:

12:15pm | 27/09/10

My kids were all bottle fed too, John. They are now adults, all upstanding responsible citizens. So there!!

Nicole says:

07:57am | 27/09/10

What? It’s early and I think you need a few more hits of caffeine!

Rose says:

08:20am | 27/09/10

You just added exactly nothing to the debate. I think everybody knows that if everything is going perfectly, breast is best, but there are times when it’s not. There are occassions where breastfeeding doesn’t work, is highly impractical and even causes more trouble than it’s worth. Having had 6 kids, 5 of whom I breastfed for sveral months, 1 who only got breastfed for a couple of weeks, let me assure you that there is absolutely nothing that anyone can ever say that will convince me that the bottle wasn’t the best idea for my last child. And the best advice I ever received from a midwife—stay away from babycare nurses, she told me that they specialize in guilt and if you had a good GP and supportive family they were of no real benefit. I ignored her and went twice to the nurse before I acknowledged that she was spot on, they were worse than useless, the undermine the confidence of the mother to try and get her to ‘follow the rules”.

Reg says:

08:30am | 27/09/10

Go and have a couple of kids Nicole.

I know your type, expect the poor husband to stagger out to the frig at all hours and warm the bottle in the Birko, then feed and burp the baby, change the nappy, put the baby back to bed while you lie snug and warm glorying in your unspoiled bosoms.  Lost count of the number of Birkos I blew apart.

Too late girls, I’ve given it up. Come to think of it, before the bottles I had to go get the babies while she presented her ample breasts ... oh yes, and then the times she was engorged…what to do what to do…???

Can you tell I’ve had my own caffeine hit?

Joolz says:

08:34am | 27/09/10

OMG.

I have a friend who has only just lost a child last week (stillborn). I can’t believe anyone would say something as stupidly ill-informed as this and still be able to use heavy machinery.

I didn’t breastfeed. I did not go through an extreme form of loss and grieving. In fact, it was a decision that made my entire family happier.

Nicole says:

08:47am | 27/09/10

Go and have a couple of kids you say Reg? Well sunshine I’ve got three of them. 21, 17 & 4. There’s a footy article on The Punch today, best you go and play there.

Heléna says:

08:52am | 27/09/10

all I remember is the elation, both mine and my family’s, when I stopped breastfeeding, I would make the same decision again but without agonising over what others would think or any supposed benefits

Reg says:

09:31am | 27/09/10

Accurate weekly weighing of an infant is very important when breast feeding just in case the mother’s milk is not meeting the needs of the baby. Then it’s time to get promptly to a formula. Mine were 4 girls and 2 boys and one of the boys is mentally handicapped but strong and tall thanks to formula.

Then you have been playing your cards close to your chest Nicole. Under the circumstances I’d have expected a more profound contribution but I assume you conform to all the rest of what I wrote.

No doubt you had cesareans rather that suffer the taint of associating with Labor. ROFLMAO

Nicole says:

10:24am | 27/09/10

No Reg, I went through Labour and had all three cesarean free. But you’re right about the rest of your first comment. I just used to pretend to be asleep, my poor husband would have to drag himself out of bed, heat the bottle, feed the baby and when he came back to bed, I’d say why didn’t you wake me up? It’s a joint effort you know.

Seriously though, if a woman can’t or doesn’t want to breast feed, it should be her choice and she shouldn’t be made to feel inadequate or shamed. That really makes me angry. And that comment from Liz would have to be the dumbest comment I’ve read for a long time.

Dave says:

11:24am | 27/09/10

My wife tried breastfeeding our firstborn. She got mastitis so bad that she screamed and cried every time she tried to feed our bub and had a nasty fever from the infection.
Our bub vomited up almost every feed because it was laced so heavily with blood from my poor wife’s cracked nipples.
The only reason she endured because she was so heavily browbeaten by nurses and midwives who all but told her she would be a bad mother if she went to the bottle.
She was so stressed that she couldn’t bond with our bub properly, making her feel even more upset.
Our bub cried almost non-stop and lost so much weight that the paediotrician intervened at two months and told us to put the bub on the bottle. Within a month she was back within her target weight range.
My wife was so wracked with guilt and inadequacy in those two months that I feared she would plummet headlong into post-natal depression.
Second time round we have bottlefed exclusively.
My wife is so much happier she is able to bond far more effectively with our new bub and our bub is so happy and healthy.
So go on Liz, tell me that my wife and firstborn were far better off breastfeeding…

Charlie says:

01:33pm | 27/09/10

That’s as ridiculous as saying if getting immunised from smallpox was as good as or better than are own immunity system, we’d be born with a natural immunity…......

Completely without Logic Liz…... and you go ask any mother who has had a baby die if shed trade away the right to have her baby breast fed to have her child alive and I’m sure she would jump all over it

If you were breastfed as a child, you’re making a pretty good argument for the bottle

mumof3 says:

01:47pm | 27/09/10

And on what sort of research are you basing your opinion? I breastfed my first child and suffered terribly with post natal depression (not due to breastfeeding problems, that came easily). I am now the mother of 2 month old twins. While I had every intention of breastfeeding they both had their separate issues, leading me to sadly discontinue breastfeeding one at 3 weeks and the other at 6 weeks. I am yet to experience any of the signs of post natal depression. In fact I believe discontinuing breastfeeding has probably contributed to NOT slipping into depression again.

Rosa says:

02:16pm | 27/09/10

Liz are you serious???  I bottle fed both babies and felt nothing but elation & the usual hormonal tears after birth!  How can you logically sit there and compare bottle feeding with the loss of a baby, that is a disgrace!

You know what contributes to post-natal?  Judgmental, rigid, critical, ignorant holier than thou women such as yourself!!  This is why so many new mums struggle, because they don’t live up to your standard.  I tried to bf my first and it caused me nothing but angst, pain and tears.  Both myself and baby relaxed due to bottle feeding.  I felt no loss whatsoever!

Like Nicole said, perhaps you need a another hit of caffeine, or maybe a slap across the face with some common sense.  Even after all my words I still feel I can’t articulate exactly how stupid your comment is.

TracyS says:

03:46pm | 27/09/10

“Mothers who don’t breastfeed go through the same loss as a mother who’s baby had died”

That is a comment which is both irrationally extreme and completely insensitive to the mothers of children who have died. It is also an absolute load of crock!

When a mother choses not to breast feed, the body slowly winds down the milk producing hormones, the same as it does when a mother who was breast feeding weans the baby. Please don’t try an tell me that all mothers who wean their babies go through this “loss” as well. What complete ignorance!

Anne says:

07:32pm | 27/09/10

What a sicko you are. I chose to have a ceasar, not to breast feed, put him in childcare and have a career. Quick, call DOCS. I find women that can’t accept other womens choices and insist on breastfeeding at any cost abit creepy and perverted. Breastfeeding is grose, I wouldn’t even consider it. My son is 16 now, perfectly healthy (unlike a lot of breastfed kids that can’t go near a nut or egg without keeling over) and we have a very close bond. Lower economic women do it coz it’s free, look at their ADD kids.

My baby would have starved if I didnt bottle feed says:

08:08pm | 27/09/10

I wasnt born with breasts, they developed during puberty. Just as bottles were developed for those women that cant breastfeed. My babies would have DIED if I only had my breasts to rely on… I think I would have suffered much more than PND if that was the case. I can only urge you to do some more research, talk to women who are unable to breastfeed and understand that it is the opinions of people like you that contribute to PND from the immense guilt you feel when you more than anything in the world want to BF but cannot.

Bretto says:

08:10pm | 27/09/10

Okay smarty pants, so why then is post-natal depression still turning up in breast-feeding mothers????

Karen says:

08:36pm | 27/09/10

How dare you say something about what you know nothing about!!!!  My son died of cot death when he was 9 weeks old and i was breastfeeding at that time.  My next child was fed for 5 months only because we had to take her to Sydney for sleep tests but i hated every minute of it and she knew it. She was restless and not happy. Next child, son, was only fed for 3 weeks then went on to bottle but he has slept 12 hours a night ever since and third child, daughther, went straight to bottle and is a happy, well adjusted girl.  Having to dry my milk up had a profound effect on me and still does 25 years later and having people like you trying to guilt those that chose to raise happy, healthy kids on the the bottle really p%$#es me off.  How about you gain some humanity and realise that the world is made up of lots of different people who make interesting and well informed decisions that have a right to their own way of life.

Brismum says:

07:56am | 28/09/10

Wow, Liz - thanks for your dazzling insight. If only I’d had access to your font of wisdom when my son was born, and I developed PND (the full kahuna - not the ‘baby blues’ version) and didn’t have any milk and he screamed round-the-clock because he was hungry.

If only I’d known better, I’d have soldiered on until he starved and I topped myself. Instead, I have to live with a healthy, happy, smart, sporty, funny 6’3” teenager who was (gasp) BOTTLE FED, and my own crushing sense of failure at having wasted the past decade-and-a-half raising a great kid, building a fantastic career, travelling and and loving life. 

To think: if only I’d persevered with breastfeeding, I could have avoided all of this….thanks, Liz, for setting me straight.

Originalp says:

08:31am | 28/09/10

Are you kidding me???  This is a total load of rubbish and I object to “Liz” being allow to post such inflamatory and unfounded remarks on this page.  I bottle fed my baby from birth because I had been through a lengthy process of fertility treatment and virtually every part of my person had been desexualised as a result.  My breasts were the only thing left to me in a process which I could not control. I also wanted to ensure my husband bonded with our baby, and giving him exclusive feeding sessions using a bottle was the way to do it.  I have a health baby whose weight is in the 85th percile and whose bond with his father is unbreakable.  My husband never felt like a third wheel when our baby was born.  And our family will be better for it.

Puzzled says:

10:01am | 28/09/10

Are you for real Liz? How many babies do you think died in “the good old days” before bottle feeding due to malnourishment.  I had no choice to bottle feed my two sons and you know why?  I did not have the required breast tissue to produce milk! I did not suffer post natal depression and my sons are now extremely healthy adults with a higher than normal IQ.  Its fanatics like you that make mums like me feel less than human.

Puzzled says:

10:01am | 28/09/10

Are you for real Liz? How many babies do you think died in “the good old days” before bottle feeding due to malnourishment.  I had no choice to bottle feed my two sons and you know why?  I did not have the required breast tissue to produce milk! I did not suffer post natal depression and my sons are now extremely healthy adults with a higher than normal IQ.  Its fanatics like you that make mums like me feel less than human.

mumu says:

07:42pm | 03/10/10

Oh dear Liz.  I have found that people with such blinkered views are usually the same people too self absorbed to see when their precious children are actually little monsters.

Nicholette says:

10:22pm | 03/11/10

Oh please! Keep reading people!

Mothers “BODIES” go through the same process of loss- (not the mind and emotions involved) Liz is just saying that the body deals with the “not breastfeeding” part the same way. Ie: lose a baby=not breastfeeding, formula feed=not breastfeeding. There is a higher incidence of PND in mothers who don’t breastfeed compared to those who do. Nothing can compare to the loss of a baby and her comments have been taken the wrong way.

muttley says:

01:38pm | 27/09/10

yeah, a five year old breast feeding. That is a GREAT idea. Why not go the whole hog anf keep the kids on the breast until they move out when they are 25.

Brad Coward says:

01:49pm | 27/09/10

My 38 year old brother-in-law was a breastfed baby, and he turned out to be quite the dullard.  Come to think of it….I’m sure that he is still a breastfed baby.

Denny the Dealer says:

09:17am | 27/09/10

Pssssst ... wanna buy some formula, cheap? It’s the top grade stuff, just in from Thailand ...

Joolz says:

12:25pm | 27/09/10

Gosh, I didn’t even consider the Black Market in formula this would create. It would be like duty free cigarettes!

I co-bottle-breast fed so my baby didnt starve says:

07:56pm | 27/09/10

Not to mention the how many babies would be fed cows milk because their GP wont give them a prescription - or the other side where the GP will write a prescription regardless, so whats the point???

Lexi says:

08:33am | 28/09/10

Spot on.  In many country areas you can wait 4-6 weeks for a GP appointment. And there is no medical centre.  So you’d be lining up with every Tom, Dick and Harry in the Emergency Department for your script - and hoping the spotty faced intern has a modicum of sympathy.

My baby would have starved if I didnt bottle feed says:

08:02pm | 27/09/10

All that stuff is good in theory and for the majority maybe, but I think the biggest issue is the pressure that is put on mothers. I suffered PND which hit after 5 weeks of trying to breastfeed, I did everything known from taking lactation drugs, baking lactation cookies, going into Torrens House for 4 days… EVERYTHING so I can safely say trying to breastfeed was not healthy for me, it was stressful. I definitely didnt feel happy to breastfeed, I dreaded every minute of it and would lay in bed unable to sleep at the thought of having to do it. I wish it was the happy ‘text book’ experience people talk about.

Robbie says:

01:02pm | 27/09/10

Actually, expressed breastmilk is second and donated breastmilk is third. Formula is fourth in line for what’s best for your baby.

TracyS says:

03:50pm | 27/09/10

@Robbie - your “second” and “third” are both still breast milk, so really part of “best”...

Manda says:

03:58pm | 27/09/10

Donated breastmilk should be available to mothers unable to breastfeed. My boobs make litres of the stuff, my freezer is chockers but I cant donate it anywhere because of stupid NSW regulations

linda says:

05:29pm | 27/09/10

The breastmilk is great stuff, but there are actually advantages for babies who have breastmilk ‘from the breast’ over breastmilk in a bottle. Breastfeeding itself offers better outcomes for speech and jaw development - which is why EBM and donor milk are listed separately to breastfeeding. Breastfeeding also offers great health benefits to mothers - every month of breastfeeding over 6 months reduces her risk of several cancers, breast, ovarian and cervical. Breastfeeding also reduces the incidence of osteoporosis in the mother.
Formula is life saving medicine in some cases, but like many such products, there are risks! Many mums don’t know about them, and surely the basis of making an informed decision is having all the information? Formula has been part of my mothering, and I feel no guilt about its role in my childrens lives. Like most mothers, I do the best I can, and that isn’t always the same as someone else’s best! For many individual babies, formula may be the only option. But for the population as a whole, more of the 50 and 60 year olds currently clogging up the hospital system with cancers and diabetes were fed formula. Soon, I might be one of them! Breastfed babies are on average, healthier for their whole lives. increasing breastfeeding rates makes a difference for all of us on some level.

jane says:

06:17pm | 27/09/10

Linda, i have just ‘clogged up the system’ with breast cancer and previously with thyroid cancer. I am 50 and was breastfed.

Eleanor says:

12:07pm | 30/09/10

Hell. Yes. Ok, so I was breastfed as a kid, but I attribute my literacy skills to the fact that my parents read to me for at least an hour every day from when I could sit up. By the age of five, I was reading to them. Reading is so important, and it pains me seeing so many people I know struggling with language - and not just the difference between ‘your’ and ‘you’re’.

riddlemethis says:

12:22pm | 27/09/10

Forget the GM fear, latest research points increasingly to the detriments of high soy-protein western diets (which far exceed eastern diets in both quantity and type).  Isoflavones in huge quantities, trypsin inhibitors, lacking good cholesterol, restricting bioavailability of other nutrients.  The real damage was done to the soy bean via conventional breeding for mass production, such that it is apparently barely recognisable compared to it’s original wild variant, and all this before any in lab genomic work was done on them.  It is interesting to me that people only become wary of their food chain when (relatively controlled) science takes place, rather than ad hoc breeding methods with absolutely no follow up.  We & our babies have been our own guinea pigs for centuries of mass farming, GM is not a new phenomena, nor even necessarily a more dangerous one.

Your last paragraph makes a good point though & it is sad to me that we’ve built a culture of failure around the choice to breastfeed, that sees many women who would choose human milk over formula but for the lack of really good information & guidance. . .but that’s another post!

Chucky says:

11:24am | 27/09/10

Would that be the same evolutionary wonder that brought us the appendix?

And somehow you neglected to link one single piece of evidence that we could read cursorily that would inform us of the incredible benefits.

Odd.

Yes we should all be aiming for higher standards of child care - but that battlefield is so far from this rearguard action as to render it in a massive waste of resources.

Aim higher.

Joolz says:

12:19pm | 27/09/10

Simmo: I just want to go over the point ‘if you are unwilling or unable to breastfeed, you are free to make that choice. Just leave the desperation of your projected guilt out of it’.

The government policy is to make us feel guilty if we don’t breastfeed. I have an issue with any government using guilt as a policy tool.

Half the time women who don’t go on breastfeeding have given it a fair shot of a few weeks. But unlike the cross carriers who are happy their child wears blood around their mouths, they don’t want to keep going through a painful and uncomfortable process.

But it’s becoming ridiculous that in order to get women - perhaps women who found it painful and uncomfortable but could have gone on - to do what these people want, they are going to come up with ideas which make it difficult to access decent nutrition when they don’t breastfeed.

In the meantime they’re making women who find it painful or uncomfortable, or who’s milk has dried up, or who were sexually abused and can’t handle their bodies being touched so intimately (and yes, they are out there) feel guilty.

This is why I’m angry and why I think James is a dangerous woman - because she is representative of the attitude that it is better to starve a baby and have it breastfed than to use formula.

I’m not even going to say ‘I agree that breast is best’. I have yet to see any proof that it is. And this is why Alexandra (the author) is the bees knees and I love her.

Eleanor says:

12:57pm | 30/09/10

I was breast and bottle fed. Without trying to sound conceited, I’d say I’m a rather intelligent person. I’d attribute that to the fact my parents made a point of teaching me to read early in life.

Look, by now, we all know that breast is best. Unless you’ve been totally unaware of being pregnant and have avoided the healthcare system entirely with your newborn, I’d say it’d be damn near impossible to not have access to breastfeeding information. However, the notion of starting early with literacy and numeracy is just as, if not more important in my view as ensuring proper nutrition.

I’m not advocating trying to turn your child into a prodigy and have them try and learn three different languages simultaneously. But I do believe teaching them basic language and numeracy skills as early as possible needs to have far greater importance.

Can we move on from this debate now?

Summer says:

02:03pm | 10/10/10

Simmo exactly right. That is the main thing that is causing this argument. Guilt. No one can make you feel guilty and no one is trying to. Just accept breast is best, accept you couldn’t or wouldn’t do it for whatever reason and get over it. Stop making a mockery of people (like me) who did slog it out and overcome all the problems of breastfeeding in order to give my kid the best start to life by berating this website with ill informed opinions.

Mic says:

09:50pm | 03/11/10

Here, here! However breastfeeding isn’t best- it’s NORMAL! Seriously- when did so many women begin to have so many problems with something which should be so natural? Possibly during the turn of the century when corsets became popular? Wealthy women just passed their babies to other women “wet nurses” to feed. Lower classes just breastfed their own or passed them between friends.

Then the introduction of formula around the 50’s made it possible for anyone (not just the wealthy) to avoid breastfeeding their babies if they so needed to or wished- “wet nursing” went out of vogue.

Women have been breastfeeding for thousands of years and really it just comes down to education and learning how to do it right from the outset. Go to any tribal community and say you can’t breastfeed your baby and the women would probably look at you with pity and offer to feed it for you. No-one bottle feeds there, because 1: bottles are not available and 2: girls are exposed to breastfeeding from the day they are born until they have their own child. They learn from their mothers, sisters and friends, 24/7.

Western culture does nothing to help women breastfeed and education is seriously lacking- however it is out there if you look (just type ‘breastfeeding’ into google and i’m sure you’ll be able to find a number of helpful organisations) There are medical reasons why some women can’t breastfeed but they should have access to donated breastmilk from milk banks - not be forced to resort to formula. The harsh reality is that formula feeding does come with health risks, alot are long term and won’t be realised until these babies grow up and further research is done. Educate youselves about these risks before making the choice and make an informed decision about your babies health and life. If you end up with no other choice than to formula feed then don’t get angry at each other online- lobby the government to open Milk Banks (same as a Blood Bank) to ensure each and every baby gets what they are entitled to receive: Breastmilk.

Reg says:

10:31am | 27/09/10

Right, it’s something that only old age helps with. Well, that or so many dreadful nights that no normal guy can look at bare breasts without being overcome with the weariness of death. That you mention it AFR shows you also are grabbed by certain aspects of the subject.

But this is not about breasts, it’s about ensuring that our babies get the best feeding available in their formative years.

Rachel says:

10:31am | 27/09/10

“I find the logic that says you can’t bond with your child properly without breast feeding to be extremely predjudiced against fathers.”

I was just thinking exactly that!! Don’t have kids - can’t have them in fact, so i’m certainly not claiming to be an expert in any way. But a lot of my friends’ kids get along better with their dad than their mum even though they were breast fed. If the bond of breastfeeding is so vital then how does this happen?

Again - emphasise that I don’t have kids. But sometimes you just have to accept that you can’t please anyone with issues about children. The amount of times i’ve been told I’m selfish for not having children (despite the fact that it isn’t possible) - well, if there was a dollar for every time, I would be a very rich woman. And the audacity of people with the questions they ask - these are people who wouldn’t ask you how much money you made but expect you to openly discuss your infertility issues including “well whose issue is it? Because you know there is IVF” - like that’s so easy…

I guess what I’m hoping for is a little more tolerance. Everyone has their own array of crap they are dealing with in life - why do people choose to attack people for their choices/non-choices because they are different to some societal expectation? So much negativity! Just unnecessary…

Reg says:

10:44am | 27/09/10

Probably quite correct D, but how could you be certain things may not have been better had you or whom-ever, persevered with breast feeding. Only a blind test of identical twins with one breast fed and the other bottle fed may have provided firm evidence. Even then there are the variables of the formula and of the breast milk and whole of life observations.

Straying a little but on the same course, how do guys who have had a vasectomy know for certain that it has not caused later life ED?

D says:

03:37pm | 27/09/10

Reg, my daughter was dying from an inability to digest protein. 

She’d been hosptalised for failure to thrive at 12 days old.  At 8 weeks, her bowel was so badly inflamed it was bleeding - not small amounts of blood.  Tablespoons of blood from a baby that was already udnerweight due to being unable to digest the food she was given.  Exploratory surgery revealed a badly inflamed bowel - the specialist said he’d not seen anything as bad in 20 years.  I’d already adjusted my diet in an attempt to maintain breastfeeding, however she was unable to digest any protein.

She cried constantly - screamed actually.  She was in agony all day every day.  She barely slept, she was underweight, her bowel was bleeding.  I can guarantee you that persisting in breast feeding would have caused nothing but harm.  You can choose not to believe me.  You weren’t there dealing with it, you weren’t there seeing a fragile little baby bleed copious amounts of blood multiple times from her bowel.  You didn’t have to convince the specialists to take a new mother seriously, instead of assuming it was just “new mothers fretting over nothing”.

My daughter was given a prescription only formula.  She gained weight, she slept well, she laughed and smiled and developed. And we had the constant worry that we would run out.  The chemist doesn’t stock the formula, it has to be shipped in from a warehouse.  Do you have any idea what it is like to travel with a child on a specific diet?  To know that should you run out of that formula, your child will go hungry.  That if the chemist is out of stock, your child will go hungry.  We couldn’t forget, not for a day to go and arrange her next script and to make sure we went back to the doctor for a new script the moment we used the last repeat.

I raised my daughter on a prescription formula for the first two years of her life.  To think it is a sensible thing to inflict on every child is madness.  If people are really concerned about what is best for the child, then they would see artificially engineering a situation where a baby goes hungry because the doctor isn’t available, or the chemist is shut is madness.  Total and utter insanity. 

Just to be clear Reg - it is certain and without a doubt better that my daughter was taken off breast milk and given formula.  Breast milk was killing her.  It was for love of my daughter that I stopped breast feeding and gave her what she needed to thrive.  Not because I couldn’t breast feed, or because I didn’t want to or because I was lazy.  But because her life depended on it.  I am certain she is healthier now than she would have been if I had persisted in feeding her food her body couldn’t handle.  She’s alive for starters.

angelica says:

10:36am | 29/09/10

so D , was the formula your daughter was prescribed protein free then?
formula is based on cows milk that is high in protein, so unless it was some other unusual medicinal formula (which you didn’t specify) it would have had lots of protein in it still, so what was the difference? and if it as a special medicinal formula she was fed, thats hardly the same as comparing it to the regular cans of formula that you buy from the supermarket is it?
regarding your comment “A child isn’t going to be crippled for life because they weren’t breastfeed.  No medical study has shown that to my knowledge. “
well, if you can consider “dead” in the crippled category, as a result of formula feeding you are sadly wrong there!
http://www.midwiferytoday.com/articles/formula.asp
Report Finds that Using Formula Doubles the Death Rate for U.S. Infants

formula feeding doubles infant death rates for babies in the United States. Health educator and author Dr. Linda Folden Palmer’s report, based on several decades of research from the U.S. and across the world, reveals that the use of infant formula costs the lives of an estimated 9,335 U.S. babies each year.
“Infant formula was designed to be a medical nutritional tool for babies who are unable to breastfeed,” Palmer said. “Formula does not fully meet the nutritional and immunity needs of infants. It leaves their immune systems flailing.”
Available evidence strongly contradicts commonly made assertions that formula feeding does not risk lives in industrialized nations where education and medical advances prevent increased deaths, Palmer said.
The report cites results from numerous studies illustrating the negative impact of formula feeding on the health and survival of infants with various illnesses and health problems, including Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS); heart, circulatory and respiratory failure; diarrhea; respiratory illnesses; cancer; and low birth-weight and preterm babies.

Illness and death rates of breastfed babies who receive formula supplementation are much closer to those of fully formula-fed babies, Palmer’s report notes. Numerous studies referenced in the report reveal conclusively that the longer breastfeeding lasts, the greater the measurable difference in illness and death rates.

Nicola says:

11:22am | 27/09/10

I don’t think any of the medical practitioners are disputing that non-breast fed babies are ‘unloved’ or that mothers are ‘bad’ if they don’t breastfeed.  What they seem to be saying is that they think, on the balance of evidence before them, that breast-feeding is better than formula because it offers a whole range of benefits which formula/bottle feeding does not.  So, they are encouraging mothers to breastfeed over formula.  Why is that such a controversial idea?

Joolz says:

12:22pm | 27/09/10

@ Nicola: it’s the way they’re doing it. They’re not proving it, just saying it and using guilt to get us keep going even when we want to stop.

I can’t imagne how a low income woman feels having to put her child into care or leave him or her with a relative to go off to work three or four months after birth. What sort of message does James’s idea send them?

Lisa Turner says:

04:39pm | 27/09/10

I completely agree with Jenna.  I hated breastfeeding.  I had spent three months in hospital prior to the caesar birth and I just wanted to be left alone.  My son was healthy and very hungry and I was miserable because I couldn’t satisfy his hunger.  I was bullied by a lot of people who insisted that I persevere with breastfeeding.  Thank god for my mother who advised me to tell everyone else to go to hell and get that child a bottle!

summer says:

07:05am | 11/10/10

I am so sad that you all hated breastfeeding. I wonder how long did you actually attempt it for? I hated it too for the first 6 weeks but then absolutely loved it. The pain went away and I accepted that my job was now mummy and that breastfeeding was a huge part of this so I stopped stressing about not wanting to be breastfeeding all day. The crap that comes along with first having a baby is just part of motherhood. Now some people’s experiences are so bad they just give up and you know what that is FINE. But I highly doubt the midwife said this to you because if she did she would have lost her job and there is no text book that says bottle feeding is like neglecting your child. The ‘lobbyists’ as you call them were on YOUR side. Breastfeeding organisations, GPs, midwives and lactation consultants are being trained to give GOOD advice about HOW to breastfeed when you are having trouble so that people like you and I can get advice and hopefully continue breastfeeding. Anyone who does come out and say bottle feeding is neglect is an extremist and is not quoting any facts. However, for the most part the facts are straight forward. Breastfeeding is better than formula feeding in so many ways and it does matter how you feed your child. This article is not refreshing it is ridden with ill informed opinions. And your statement that the ‘GP formula woman should give up instead of criticising women as mothers’ seems to imply that the DR directly insulted you somehow. How did she do that? She didnt say formula feeding mothers are bad mothers. You put those words into her mouth.

Jezza says:

01:49pm | 27/09/10

Well said Heather. My two boys refused to take the breast & were content with the bottle. My baby girl took to the breast with no bother at all. But after five weeks I had blood dripping out of my nipples. I tried a nipple shield but that baby became unhappy because the shield kept falling off, & anyhow the blood was still oozing out of my breast. I gave up & put her on the bottle. All three of my children are healthy happy adults, very succesful in their careers & partnered with fine people. My daughter is now a breast feeding nazi & will not tolerate my opinions on the subject. I don’t understand what it is about breast feeding that makes those who successfully breast feed so damned superior. It’s almost as if they believe they are “better” than those who don’t breast feed, for whatever reason. While giving my babies their bottle feeds I always hugged them against me & cooed at them, & gave them little kisses on their brows.  I feel no guilt whatsoever. And the breast feed nazis can bugger off & mind their own damned business.

Summer says:

07:15am | 11/10/10

Maybe the reason ‘breastfeeding nazis’ are so passionate is because we had to deal with the crap to, that is the bleeding nipples, the breast refusal, the low supply but we sought help and kept going. Let me tell you its bloody hard work when you make the choice to get it right. And then people like the idiot who wrote this article come along and mock the efforts of people who DID breastfeed by saying that it’s not that great. No one is debating that your children didn’t turn out fine but don’t try to make out that there’s nothing special about breastfeeding. All you have to do is look at the facts to see that there is.

isis says:

08:46pm | 27/09/10

They may be including these women - who give their babies ordinary milk straight from the fridge - with babies fed age appropriate formula for 12months . I used to see them with chocolate milk in their bottles.

Dina says:

01:54pm | 27/09/10

There were three deaths in China, none in the US, at least as far as I can find.

R says:

02:51pm | 27/09/10

A few died and thousands were hospitalised

J says:

09:21pm | 27/09/10

A nice point to throw in there Jay. Like someone else previously said, guilt trips are often used by individuals to influence the choices of others. I trusted companies producing formula for my babies. Does that make me reckless? This comment does nothing to add to the debate. It just seems like you’re trying to frighten others akin to the vaccination debate that’s the other controversial topic of choice.

Sarah says:

12:34pm | 28/09/10

J, it could be a valid point here. Aren’t you aware of the current investigation into Pfizer S26 soy formula, and exactly how much GM ingredients it contains? And the jury is still out on the effects of consuming GM food.

Muttley says:

01:46pm | 27/09/10

they have to take that line as the breastfeeding Nazis have restricted the way you can advertise formula. Once again, faceless do gooders pulling the strings behind the scenes to dictate what the masses must do.

Manda says:

04:06pm | 27/09/10

My 8 month old loves steak…

Alexandra Carlton says:

01:29pm | 27/09/10

But formula is already sold in chemists. If a woman wants to go to a chemist to get help before she purchases formula, she can. If she wants to head to a lactation consultant to help her get past breastfeeding problems, she can. But if she just needs or wants to stop breastfeeding for any reason, there is no earthly reason why she shouldn’t be able to switch to formula as soon as she wants with no other person sticking their nose in about it.

I have no doubt Dr Jennifer James is passionate and dedicated to helping women with their breastfeeding issues. No doubt at all.

Sonia says:

02:15pm | 27/09/10

Sometimes that support and help at that crucial 6-8 weeks makes the difference.  Post-hospital support and help is her main agenda.  I gave up twice at that 6-8 week crisis point and just got formula from the supermarket.  It’s not about other people sticking their nose in, it’s about education and knowledge getting through that crisis.  She also says that it’s ok to give up when all else fails.  But my understanding is that most women truly want to breastfeed and do give up without that much needed support.  She is all about helping women, not condemning or punishing them.  There is far more to her proposal than this though.

isis says:

09:37pm | 27/09/10

I bought all my formula from the chemist. Supermarket. Chemist….It makes no difference at all, except it was more expensive at the chemist.
If we insist on formula feeding some of these lactation specialists might be out of a job.

Alexandra Carlton says:

01:38pm | 27/09/10

And the pro-breastfeeding lobby says a lot in public that differs to what they tell mothers face-to-face. On the Australian Breastfeeding Association’s website, they suggest the only time a woman should feel guilty about choosing not to breastfeed is “so she can leave the baby behind while she spends four weeks in Bali”. http://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/bfinfo/guilty.html
You hear a lot of that happening, don’t you? Women leaving their newborn babies behind to spend four weeks in Bali. But they know that if they condemned mothers for not breastfeeding for any other reasons, they’d face a backlash.

But what they’ll tell a woman in private is that there is absolutely no excuse to do anything other than breastfeed.  A very different story to the tolerant and magnanimous face they put on for the public.

Muttley says:

01:52pm | 27/09/10

It’s not so much that there is a “pro formula lobby”, more that there is a large section of the community that understands that the issue is not so black and white and has enough of the “breastfeeders” on their high horse dictating what others must do and attaching guilt to a new mother when there is already enough on her plate. You then end your post with an excellent example of the sanctimonious nature of your breastfeeding nazi bretheren. Looks like that particular shoe fits you rather well.

R says:

02:55pm | 27/09/10

Proudly worn

Heléna says:

05:01pm | 27/09/10

yet anecdotally the healthiest children *I* know have been bottle fed, no asthma, eczema or constant colds, while the breastfed children *I* know do suffer from these conditions, at least their mothers don’t have to worry about feeling guilty

Jayne says:

09:31pm | 27/09/10

Really Marek. You’re an expert on human behaviour are you??? Maternal instincts disappearing??? Such utter garbage.
If you really want an education in maternal instincts, why don’t you sit in on a few support groups for carers of children with disabilities. Check out the lengths these people (often mums) have to go to just to get adequate services for their kids (often as single parents as 85-90% of marriages where disability is a factor ends in divorce). These people will give you a new found respect for the strength of the maternal instinct especially among ‘young’ women. Think next time before you comment.

Melissa says:

09:20am | 28/09/10

Jayne, Marek may not be, but I am an expert on human behaviours. My experience is based on analysis of 4-5 birth cases a day, every day over ten years. There are many good and dedicated mums to whom everything comes naturally however, there is an alarmingly increasing number of mums who do not know what to do with the baby, why they have a baby etc. If a midwife, or a doctor has to tell a mum to feed the baby because the new mum does not comprehend that a baby needs nourishment after two days, than yes it has to be called a diminishing maternal instinct. In the “olden” days girls have seen how their siblings or cousins were nursed and carnied that memory to their own experiences. Today,  broken down family structures, work and financial pressures, addictions, lack of adequate support for mums, early discharges, no extended family support etc. lead to mums feeling overwhelmed by the whole experience, unable to cope with new baby. This particularly applies to two significant age groups: the very young mums in their teens or early twenties and the “career” women, who have their babies around 40. Actually, it is the later group that are the most affected. I have to stress these are summary generalisations only. You will find that mums, bar for medical conditions, who come from big families rarely have any problems with their babies.

D says:

03:45pm | 27/09/10

” I’m sorry, if you have medical reasons for not breast feeding, then you’re definitely not going to feel guilty”

I found that people judged me for bottle feeding without ever asking if it was medically necessary. 

The other thing I found interesting was that I was judged for bottlefeeding my daughter breast milk as well.  In the first few weeks while I was breast feeding, I expressed milk and her father would look after her while I got some sleep.  It is assumed that if it comes from a bottle it must be forumla, which is not always the case.  It isn’t just what you feed a baby, it is how you feed them that women are judged on and I never had anyone check first before launching into a lecture about how I was harming my baby by not having her on the breast.

Vicki PS says:

03:57pm | 27/09/10

This rant is a classic example of the profound error of generalising from a single case.  As much as you might insist otherwise, sometimes breastfeeding just doesn’t work out, even with the best of intentions, advice, support and perseverance. 

I successfully and happily breastfed my first child, was well informed about the benefits, physiology, psychology, emotional benefits etc etc etc—but it all went pear-shaped with my second child.  I tried everything, and I do mean everything, down to spending 2 weeks in a Maternal and Child Health residential home, trying to get feeding established.  So please, do not add insult to injury by telling me it was laziness, or spouting the usual La Leche League propaganda.  Lovely for you if it went well for you and your sprogs, but it’s a big world out there, and full of exceptions to your self-made ‘rules’. 

(P.S. Pharmacy advice—whacko!  That’ll help, all right.)

Alexandra Carlton says:

04:04pm | 27/09/10

@Vicki - “La Leche League” - I love it!

And I agree with you on chemists. My local pharmacist told me to give my three month old son brandy when he wouldn’t sleep. I kinda stopped listening after that.

hmm says:

04:53pm | 27/09/10

Breastisbest - only someone who is deluded could make the remarks you have.  There is absolutely no proven correlation between IQ/obesity and allergies when it comes to how you feed your babies.  You can cherry pick stats, believe what you want blah blah blah.  But at the end of the day I can show you dozens of people who have defied your so called theory.  How dare you insinuate bottle feeding mothers are lazy.  They are doing more work, not less, to feed their babies.  Sometimes by choice, sometimes without choice.  These are the same women who are expressing, steralising and making up bottles all at the same time.  Who are you to question how other people feed their babies???

Mum of one says:

05:29pm | 27/09/10

Caesarean does not free up beds!! You are in hospital much longer than if you have a natural birth. I had natural with my 3.45kg baby. A caesarean wasn’t even brought up my whole pregnancy and I am only small. I stayed for 2 nights, wouldn’t have stayed that long but it was my first and they wanted me to stay in. My friend had a Caesarean (not by choice) and was in for nearly a week. I’m due with my second in a few weeks and only intend to stay one night if all goes well.
I am a big believer in Breast feeding and loved it but after seeing a friend who just couldn’t do it and went to formula I’ve relaxed a bit. Her little boy is a healthy and happy baby.

J says:

11:39pm | 27/09/10

Ok Breastisbest, you’ve quoted some stats that supposedly show a higher IQ (10% higher no less) among babies who are breastfed, now quote the research that backs up these claims. You’ve also managed to throw in some anecdotes about stories of births in other countries (ahh, you heard this, so that must make them true). Please also make sure to check that these ‘studies’ meet the scientific criteria of being valid and reliable studies. Ones that also exclude all extraneous variables such as socio-economic status of the subjects involved. I’ll bet you’d find it difficult to do so. I totally agree with hmm here. Stats are frequently quoted by people to back up their arguments without ensuring they are accurate. It is also so easy to pick and choose the ones that suit. All I know is that every mum has the RIGHT to choose how they feed their baby (and give birth) WITHOUT the need to explain why they have chosen this way. Guilt is irrelevant. How they make that choice is NOT to be influenced by people such as yourself.

Elaine says:

07:54am | 28/09/10

Breastisbest.

I found the comment that research has show that children who are breastfed on average have a 10% higher IQ interesting.  You did not say who the researcher was. My children were bottle fed by MY choice and one child now has a Master of Psychology degree and the other one has a degreee and Two diplomas in Communications and Journalism.  I think that it may have more to do with genes in the families than breast milk.

Incidentally, as a” bottle mother” I was up and down every night just like you feeding my babies and going through the lack of sleep phase.

As I said in an earlier comment.  If breast feeding is RIGHT for a mother and both she and baby are happy that is just great for that mother.  However, if it is NOT right for a mother for whatever reason, then everyone just leave the mother alone, butt out and stop being judgemental.

It takes a lot more to being a good mother than putting a boob into a babies mouth and NO I do not feel guilty at all for not breast feeding my babies.  I do not judge you, do not judge me or anyone else who chooses the bottle over boob.  This holier than thou attitude my way is best and putting guilt trips on people is wrong.. 

The one thing we agree on is that the formula should be bought from a chemist.

Marek says:

03:04pm | 27/09/10

Rosa, some narrow-minded people feed dogs vegetarian diet, for they believe it is their choice what they feed their animal. These dogs still wag their tail and love their owners, but ask any vet what he/she thinks of the practice. THEY ARE BAD OWNERS!

Your chemo treatment is an exceptional circumstance.

Rosa says:

07:12pm | 27/09/10

For some reason my first reply to you didn’t come through…

Marek, firstly oh wow, thanks for the exemption from your critical judgment, but I actually made the choice to bottle feed my daughter prior to my diagnosis due to a very bad breastfeeding experience with my first.

Secondly, I really cannot stand the fact that you have tried to compare our children to dogs!!  That argument is totally irrelevant and I think insulting!

Marek says:

09:50am | 28/09/10

Rosa, I did not intend to insult you personally but rather vividly point to a fact that having a choice does not always lead to a best path. Human babies are meant to eat human milk, like dogs are meant to eat meat.

Sarah says:

11:04am | 01/10/10

It shouldn’t be a completely personal decision for a mother though, should it? 

A mother owes it to her child to investigate the facts and provide their child with the best start in life. But it’s probably hard to listen to other people and take on advice when you’re apparently the font of all motherly wisdom.

But hey, all this “mother knows best” stuff is pure rot anyway. 9 months of gestation and a painful labour doesn’t give you the golden bullet of knowledge. 

Knowledge is harder-earned, mainly by listening and learning from the wisdom of those with experience, and those who have gone before us. Or else by researching and learning for ourselves, thereby developing wisdom we can then share with others. 

If you think you have all the answers innately within you, then you are being foolish and blind.

Marek says:

03:41pm | 27/09/10

Razor, you need to sharpen your spelling before you start “advicating” anything. I found it interesting that you will be counter-acting “un-scientific” breastfeeding research with material from Gina Ford, who “is a British writer on parenting methods and a former maternity nurse, without formal qualifications” (source Wikipedia) Yes, that makes your approach very scientific. PS: If you become a GP ... never mind - you won’t.

Razor says:

04:42pm | 27/09/10

Marek - so sorry that i is next o on the qwerty keyboard.  Totally ruins my credibility.

As for Gina ford being un-scientific - the weight of evidence that I have personally and have seen publicly that Gina Ford and others who recommend similar feeding, sleeping and eating routines is that they actually do lead to contented babies and parents.

Marek - as for your pontificating on my future academic and professional success - just wait and see - so far so good.

Marek says:

09:33am | 28/09/10

Razor, I guess you are one of these people who need to be told directly the meaning of the message. You cannot dismiss years of formal research into breastfeeding with a claim it is not scientific because an uneducated nurse, but successful book author advises to do so. Her “system” may work for some people. You, as a future doctor should know by know to assess each case individually and not as a part of “intend” based on your wife and her friends’ experiences. I am sure you were not taught that at any medical school. And where were you during anatomy classes when the function of lobules (alveoli) were discussed? PS: I actually hope you will become a very good doctor, because this country needs them.

Bogan says:

09:19pm | 27/09/10

Words fail me… only because they wouldn’t be published.

Helen says:

12:13pm | 28/09/10

Phil - I’m assuming by your name that you’re male? I could of course be wrong.
But how do you breast feed if you’re male?

stephen says:

05:02pm | 27/09/10

E =mc2.
Energy equals milk to the carton squared.

stephen says:

06:20pm | 27/09/10

Well, what happened next ?

Diane says:

07:03pm | 27/09/10

I would think the anger comes from people like you inferring that woman who bottle feed their children should feel guilty. Or it could be from the many fanatical breastfeeding associations around the world. Quite frankly some of these woman make Amway salesmen look laid back and calm. Or from well meaning “experts” who insist on woman doing something that is obviously not working for them or their baby. I have seen first hand the “breast feeding nazi’s” at work. Next door neighbour had a prem baby a few months after our first child was born. As I said before, I could have breastfeed every baby in a 10 mile radius (I know, how fantastic am I). She had problems. She tried and tried. Feeding became a thing to dread for her. The lactation “consultant” was around there every day berating her to keep going. The baby was losing weight, screaming from hunger and did this consultant ever say - “hang on this is not working, Maybe you should try a comp feed with a bottle” Hell no. Breast was best and basically it was my neighbours own stupid fault she couldn’t do something so basic. In the end I went over and told the “consultant” to go away. Baby was put on formula and thrived. The funny thing was I was verbally abused by this “consultant” for being a traitor the the cause. This woman was a raving looney when it came to breastfeeding. Nothing else mattered to her. Not the health and wellbeing of the mother or the child.
Its great that you can breastfeed, It was great that I could but I’m damned if I would condemn anyone else for choosing not to - for any reason.

Rosa says:

07:08pm | 27/09/10

Ahem, I don’t think it’s right you get judged FOR breastfeeding just as much as mums who bottle feed are judged, I think that too is wrong.

But, the people who are labled “nazi’s” are the ones who call bottle feeding mothers “bad” and that they don’t care for their babies if they formula feed.  That too is unacceptable and yes judgmental.

Ahem says:

09:57pm | 27/09/10

Diane, I would like you to point out where I am inferring bottle feeding parents ‘should’ feel guilty please? I don’t care how parents feed their baby, as long as they feed it. In my own experience I never felt pressured to breastfeed, maybe that is because I was successful I don’t really know however I have experienced many negative things about me breastfeeding. I have not heard of someone going up to a bottle feeding mother and saying ‘can you go somewhere else and do that’ or passing comments like ‘that is disgusting’ or ‘isn’t she too old for that?’ etc. I honestly believe breastfeeding mothers face more judgement on a daily basis, I have many bottle feeding friends and they agree with me here, most of them say ‘I can’t beleive you did it for so long!’. I am not being insensitive but if your friend has called on a ‘lactation consultant’ to help her then of course she is going to do everything in her power to help your friend breastfeed, that is her job and I am sure the consultant wouldn’t want to be accused of not doing her job properly by giving up on your friend.

J says:

11:47pm | 27/09/10

Well, Ahem, your choice is your choice and I support any such choice that cares for a baby whether it be bottle or breast. However, your last line where you mention ‘guilt’ as a reason for comments you have received could be why people have responded the way they have. Like Diane has said, people who have responded angrily in forums such as these have often had very difficult experiences esp. with their first child when learning to breastfeed.

Elaine says:

09:18am | 28/09/10

It may be that the general public object to seeing a baby fed in public as some people are embarrassed by it. .Do not put all the blame on bottle mothers.

As a former bottle mum by choice and not feeling guilty at all about my choice, I definitely have no problem with seeing a baby breast fed in public or at a restaurant,  provided the mother covers her breast, which can be done, by a small scarf or shawl.  That was how it used to be done. What I object to is a mother sitting either in public or a restaurant feeding her baby with her full breast exposed to everyone.  Modesty is something that seems to have gone out of the door and a woman’s boob is something I do not want to see whislt eating..

Sarahbella says:

11:42am | 28/09/10

Ahem, I agree wholeheartedly with you. There’s a definite backlash here in Australia against breastfeeding mothers. I am tired of being told that I am a nazi, zealot, etc everytime I voice my opinion.

It’s just a simple and undeniable fact that breastmilk is the optimal food for a baby and breastfeeding is good for a mother. it’s why companies like Pfizer invest millions in R&D of their formula product, modelling it on milk. It doesn’t replicate the milk however. it just resembles it in many ways.

I persisted with breastfeeding through cracked and bleeding nipples (milk flow actually helped them heal faster), low supply (solved by putting baby on more frequently and for longer until the supply caught up, usually within 24-36 hours, and no, baby DID NOT STARVE!), an infected milk follicle (massage and prolonged feeding from that side for a day cleared it up) and various other things.

It didn’t take much effort on my behalf, and the hurdles didn’t break me. I did however have the benefit of having learned as much as possible about the dynamics and functionality of breastfeeding before I embarked upon it. And I’m really really happy that I did. Because each little problem was just that, little. Not a major catastrophe and the reason to stop breastfeeding my baby.

A bit of self-educating goes a really long way. It’s not the responsibility of a midwife to tell you how to do it. 

Everyone who is on here, having a go at those who are encouraging the message that breast is best, ought to be ashamed of themselves.

RM says:

07:35pm | 27/09/10

Baby formula is not designed to feed cows, it is designed to feed infants.  Hence the title “baby formula”.  Never once have I bought my formula at a pet store.

Milky Way says:

11:02am | 28/09/10

Kylie is actually correct RM. Formula is derived from cows milk. And yes, cows milk is designed to feed baby cows.

Baby formula manufacturers spend a lot of time trying to make their formula resemble breastmilk as closely as possible. Why is that? Because breastmilk is the best thing to feed a baby!! Debate over, end of story.

Hmmm says:

09:51pm | 27/09/10

Hello. My mother breast fed and had natural deliveries.  The hospital tricked her into having her tubes tied because she was married to the town drunk and often couldn’t feed her five children. Bad parents always find a way to feel superior, don’t they?

R says:

09:45pm | 27/09/10

You believe it’s better for you or better for everyone? But I agree, I don’t know why why women feel guilty if they can’t breast feed.

Milky Way says:

10:45am | 28/09/10

He could have turned out to be 6’4”, a champion athlete, and an award-winning academic. But you didn’t breastfeed him so I guess you will never ever know.

R says:

09:48pm | 27/09/10

Both sides are as bad as each other.

Sarah says:

10:37am | 28/09/10

I’ ve never heard anyone, in life or on a blog, criticise somebody for bottle-feeding their child.

All of the bashing is reserved for those who promote breastfeeding.

Rosa says:

12:18pm | 28/09/10

Sorry Sarah that statement is so incorrect!!  Criticism for bottle feeding mums is extreme! Just look at some of the finger pointing on here!!  That bottle feeders are “bad” “don’t care enough” or “are lazy” just to name a few lovely descriptions.

Again I don’t condone “bashing” for any mum, but your statement is proven wrong right here…all the “bashing” is being done by BF’ers and the others unfortunately feel the need to defend themselves against the barage.

Sarah says:

12:53pm | 28/09/10

Rosa I’ve just read some of the comments of which you speak, so i stand corrected.

“all the bashing is done by BFers”  Well that is also untrue Rosa. Maybe you need to read the rest of the postings on here.

james says:

08:57pm | 27/09/10

agreed, it is simply ludacris!

Amelia says:

11:15pm | 27/09/10

It appears James I might have been listening a bit too much to my 5 year olds Justin Bieber CD as I think ‘ludacris” should probably read more like ‘ludicrous”.  As you can probably tell I’m not known for my spelling or my grammar but even for me that one was embarrassing!

Grace says:

12:06pm | 28/09/10

Amelia, dare I suggest that the very point you raise may in fact be a driver behind Dr James’ proposal?  I don’t necessarily agree that placing formula on prescription is the best approach (certainly not if it can only be prescribed by GPs/specialists), however, if may serve as a checkpoint for struggling mums.  Any mum seeking a prescription for formula would raise a flag with the relevant health professional, who could then faciliate her receiving the support that she needs to continue breastfeeding - should she choose to do so.  And given that all cans of forumla say the advice of a medical professional should be sought before commencing formula feeding, this would also be a good way to ensure that it happens.

And just for the record, the WHO considers infant formula to be fourth-best, after breastfed breastmilk, expressed breastmilk, and donated breastmilk.

Fatty says:

11:00am | 30/09/10

low supply is addressed by feeding the child more often and for a little longer each time, until the milk supply increases. This takes a very short time to accomplish. The ability of the breast to address supply issues in this way is quite remarkable in fact! And meanwhile your child will not starve. If you’re very worried, you can try comp feeding with a bottle once a day - 25-50 mls, for your own peace of mind.

I speak from personal experience of being ill during breastfeeding, battling an infection, and facing low supply at several points. Increasing the number and duration of feeds for a day or two is the solution.

Sarah says:

09:11am | 28/09/10

Dear Troll….

I’m a breastfeeding mother, and I have encouraged several friends with their breastfeeding efforts, with happy results. I guess that makes me a “breastfeeding nazi” in your view.

I’m also the grandaughter of a fabulous woman (who incidentally breastfed all three of her daughters)  who suffered horribly at the hands of the nazis and was haunted for the rest of her life by the events.

Your highly offensive comments have added absolutely nothing to this debate. I suggest you exercise some tact, decency and intelligence in future before you post idiotic and senseless attacks on a blog.

Manda says:

03:55pm | 28/09/10

For some premature babies breastmilk means the difference between life and death.

Moss says:

09:14am | 28/09/10

You’ve taken a big leap and sidestep of logic there.

Somebody made a personal statement on FB about the style of parenting they choose. That hardly equates to them demonising the style everybody else chooses.

Alexandra Carlton says:

11:06am | 28/09/10

A really interesting and insightful reply - thanks Kate.

The line you speak of - promoting persistence vs bullying - must be a difficult one for practitioners to tread, especially when the women they’re dealing with are at peak vulnerability. I accept that.

Perhaps something that would help everyone is if there were more guidelines for how pracitioners go about ‘promoting’ breastfeeding. Part of the problem is that nurses’ and midwives’ methods and attitudes to things like nipple shields, expressing, feed times, when to introduce formula and when not to etc etc vary so wildly. I clearly remember being in hospital with my son and being given firm and absolute directives about breastfeeding from one midwife in the morning, then her shift would end and the next would tell me to ignore everything the first had told me. Aftert days/weeks/months of these inconsistencies mothers are helpless and near hysterical with confusion and (at least I was!). It’s no wonder they feel bullied and pressured and at the end of their tethers by that point.

Grace says:

12:19pm | 28/09/10

I agree with this post 100%.

Alexandra, I found the same with the midwives with my first - it was so confusing, and as a first time mum, impossible to know which ones to ignore!  I was discharged just as my milk was coming in too, so everything fell apart after we got home.  I got a private lactation consultant so I only had one person to listen to, and after 8 weeks of cracks, blisters, blocked ducts, vasospasm and nipple thrush, we were good to go

This time round I only took advice from the hospital’s LC and it’s been much better.

The biggest problem is lack of support, and knowing how to find genuine support amongst all the “noise”, such as “low supply” and “poor quality milk”.

Kate says:

06:11pm | 28/09/10

Alexandra and Grace, I totally agree with you, and you’re reinforcing my point. I’m sure that if we’d grown up in a society where we were intimately familiar with breastfeeding - and had seen many different styles and techniques since infancy - we’d realise that all these “opinions” are just that, and we’d have the confidence to take what works, ignore what doesn’t, and find our own way, as we do with advice in so many other areas of life.

Rather than standardising advice - because any “standard” advice will only work for a proportion of Mums and babies - perhaps what we need is for breastfeeding educators to better support Mums in finding the way that works for them. We also need to make new Mums acutely aware that there *are* a large number of styles and techniques, and thus they shouldn’t feel bad/wrong/guilty if one particular piece of advice isn’t working for them.

Kate says:

09:14am | 28/09/10

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Peter says:

09:28am | 28/09/10

Good ol’ days???? No evil?... Stalin, Hitler, Mongol hordes, Nero, Caligula.  No violence?... see above, add two world wars, Vietnam, Korean War and all the other minor wars dating back to when we first learnt how to through rocks at each other.
No disease?... black plague, scurvy, small pox, whopping cough, TB.
No village idiots?... well obviously you weren’t born so you might be correct on this point.

Helen says:

12:51pm | 28/09/10

Peter, obviously you dont understand the concept of sarcasm.

Rosa says:

12:32pm | 28/09/10

Sarah, you totally contradict your own argument…you state that you have never heard this type of abuse levelled against a bottle feeding parent??  But than you state that the only reason we are defending our right to choose on here is guilt?  Could we maybe be sick and tired of the criticism…the “holier than thou” attitude because you were successful at something some of us weren’t? 

Your argument is also blown out of the water simply by some of the statements in these comments…things like “lazy”, “not ready to be a parent”, “don’t care about your baby”, “I care more about my child than you do” are abusive and inflammatory comments and this is why people get upset.  And before you throw the “well if you feel guilty, that’s not my fault” argument, ALOT of people on here are deliberately going out of their way to make people feel bad!  It cannot be denied with some of the statements on here, they are put here simply to put people down.  That, in any way, shape or form is wrong.

Yes, breastfeeding is obviously the most natural choice for a baby and no one can disagree it is wonderful for a baby, BUT there is a difference between being an advocate on breastfeeding and supporting it and downright shoving it down the throats of other mothers and using any cliche in the book to try and hammer guilt into an unsuccessful breastfeeder or God forbid, someone who chooses not to for any number of reasons.

That is the argument here..people are labelled zealots when they are not content with being successful BF’ers, they have to make themselves feel superior to everyone else and be condescending! 

It would not be accepted in any other part of society, so why should mums just sit back and say, “Oh well I decided to bottle feed, therefore I deserve to sit back and cop all the flack”.  I don’t think so.  That’s not fair on anyone.

It does not come naturally to everyone.  Best of luck and well done to those that it does.  And well done to any mother doing the best they can!

Sarah says:

12:49pm | 28/09/10

Took 3 hours and 31 minutes, but still….BAM!

I didn’t state anything at all about what drives the dynamic in labelling somebody a nazi or a zealot. If you look again, I posed a question. I think it’s a good question, given the level of vitriol expressed in your reply to my post. 

Also, there is nothing holier than thou is what I said. In fact I haven’t even stated if I’ve had children or breastfed them. And absoutely nothing in my comment could be construed as “downright shoving it down the throats of other mothers.” Unless recommending people learn as much as possible before making their decision makes me a dictator. Does it Rosa? Does it make me a bad person?
You’re the one making judgements, not me. So thank you Rosa for contributing precisely nothing to what I said, but also taking nothing away from it.

namegame says:

09:10pm | 28/09/10

While both sides criticise each other with comments such as “arrogant” (formula-feeders > breastfeeders) or “lazy” (breastfeeders > formula-feeders), breastfeeding advocates don’t have a label that they use to insult formula-feeding defenders en masse like the ones used against them, most commonly “breastfeeding nazis” (which, pointed out by someone above, is incredibly offensive to the millions of people affected by the Holocaust). So how about formula-feeding dogmatists? Formula-feeding tyrants? Formula-feeding Fanatics? (Has a nice ring to it.) Formula-feeding bigots? What about formula-feeding fools?! It’s good for a laugh but I’m not really suggesting it

Rosa says:

01:48pm | 30/09/10

Sarah, perhaps it is you who should re-read your original posting and my reply.

Your last paragraph states investigating the benefits of breastfeeding.  I quite clearly accept this in paragraph 3 of my reply.

Also you can dance around it as much as you want, but in your first paragraph you infer that the main reason bottle feeders would defend themselves is guilt, not being tired of being criticised.  So therefore you are implying they have something to feel guilty about.

Just because YOU have never witnessed abuse levelled at bottlefeeders does not mean it doesn’t exist.  Trust me, quite a few people I know have had strangers tell them they should “be ashamed of themselves”.  So yes bottlefeeders do get the comments in public.

One last thing I will clarify - when I said “could we maybe be sick and tired of the criticism..the “holier than thou” attitude because you were successful at something some of us weren’t?”  I wasn’t implying just yourself, I should’ve been clearer, I meant the BF mums who were quite nasty in their comments.

The rest of my reply is quite clear, concise and does respond correctly to your post I believe.

I think your main issue you have is that I don’t agree with you and therefore you choose to call my argument “totally irrelevant”. That’s your prerogative.

Oh and to save you counting the hours, it took me 2 days to reply.  Sorry had other things to do.

Sarah says:

10:56am | 01/10/10

Rosa,

The fact remains that calling somebody a nazi is considerably worse on the scale of abuse than telling somebody that they should TRY to breastfeed their child and that perhaps they are giving up too easily.

How can a valid suggestion be so offensive to you? There are other valid suggestions existing in the world. Such as, if you’re obese lose some weight otherwise you are at risk of developing heart disease and type 2 diabetes. A minimum of 30 minutes a day of exercise is recommended for good health. Reading in a darkened room can cause eye strain. Driving while tired can lead to death.

If these don’t fit in with your lifestyle choice do you get equally angry?

My doctor recently told me to lose some weight. I would prefer not to, because lying around on the couch eating timtams is more enjoyable than eating soup and hitting the treadmill. It didn’t make me tear the doctor a new ar**hole however.

So Rosa, stay on your high horse if you must, but please ride it far away from me. Your anger and illogic are vexatious to me.

Rosa says:

05:51pm | 01/10/10

LOL far from being angry Sarah, I am sitting here shaking my head in laughter!  You have just gone so far away from your original post and topic I’m not even sure I can follow it anymore.

Yes, granted the term nazi is offensive and I concur it shouldn’t be used.  But being told that you’re not fit to be a mother because you choose to bottlefeed or cannot breastfeed is also extremely offensive.

But that is where my agreeance with you ends.  You stated in your former reply that you do not admit to having had kids or breastfed yet you’re quick to say “giving up too easily”.  Sorry but who are you to pass judgment on each individual case?

Once again, if you want to read my replies correctly, I agree that breastfeeding is the most natural choice, but that is not my issue, is all the finger pointing.  But I stand with the fact that I believe it is a personal choice for a mother!  If a mother is stressed and miserable, the baby will not be happy & healthy.

But, yet again, you skip over the parts that do not please you and just want to sit on YOUR high horse and change the argument to suit you.

I never once said people should ignore medical advice!  So no, you shouldn’t have a go at your dr for offering medical advice to you.

Honestly Sarah, you deviate so far from the original topic just to tear people down, as far as I can see.

So if you’re happy trying to put the wrath of shame on some mothers, good luck to you, I on the other hand know exactly how motherhood makes you as stressed as it does happy and the last thing we need to do is to tear each other down.  But you obviously don’t agree with that.

And on that note, I think we need to agree to disagree.

Sarah says:

09:20am | 04/10/10

oh, and I am a mother. I did breastfeed. Despite it being awkward, difficult, painful, facing blisters and cracked nipples etc etc I perservered. With great results. Because I have seen too many women give up too easily. Breastfeeding is one of those things you do for your child, not for yourself. But it’s hard I suppose, in these days where ego is supreme, to put the needs of somebody else before your own wants.
I am entitled to pass judgement on an issue like this. Too many women DO give up too easily for whatever reason. It’s a fact. If hearing that fact stated out loud makes you angry then it’s your problem and not mine.

jane says:

11:20am | 28/09/10

How on earth anyone can state than their babies are the healthiest of all theirs peers is beyond me. Noone can possibly know that.

R says:

01:19pm | 30/09/10

You’re right Jane yet you hear formula-feeding parents say it all the time to justify their choice.

Eleanor says:

01:00pm | 30/09/10

Great point, Jim. Not much use making a point of breastfeeding for 6 months if you’re going to condemn your kid to obesity anyway with too much crap food.

Robbie says:

09:15pm | 28/09/10

Perfectly said!

Robbie says:

09:21pm | 28/09/10

Props for having the courage to resist your mother’s pressure. It must be heartbreaking at times not to have her support.