Proponents of chaos theory would have enjoyed being in Sydney this week where an unremarkable collision between two trucks generated a spirited public discussion about population policy.

Rare RTA footage of traffic actually moving on the F3.

The accident itself and its comical aftermath was merely the latest demonstration by the NSW Government that it would be flat out organising a chook raffle, with the hated Roads and Traffic Authority playing the starring role.

Late Tuesday morning and well out of peak hour, two trucks collided on the F3, the busy northern freeway which connects Sydney to the Central Coast. No-one died, but one of the truck drivers had to be taken to hospital by helicopter, and there were concerns for public safety as one of the trucks was carrying fuel. It took the RTA almost five hours to decide that the fuel needed to be siphoned from the truck.

But when another tanker arrived at 4pm to decant the fuel it had the wrong pump. Almost two hours later another tanker arrived with the right pump. At 8pm and with traffic banked up right along the Pacific Highway the RTA decided to put in place a “contraflow” system and divert cars to other roads.

By this stage this normally picturesque coastal byway looked like something out of Cormac McCarthy ‘s The Road. People had abandoned their cars and started to walk home, others had fallen asleep behind the wheel, kiddies were vomiting through dehydration, although happily there was no cannibalism.

These are the kind of events which, quite rightly, send the public into a lather. And while the rage was directed towards the RTA and State Government – with Premier Kristina Keneally and Roads Minister David Campbell setting some kind of record for saying how angry they were at the whole debacle, despite bearing ultimate responsibility – there was an interesting footnote to the public debate which went to a much bigger policy challenge.

On both commercial and ABC talkback radio and across the news websites, many people closed their remarks on the F3 fiasco by musing as to how bad things will get when Australia has a population of 36 million.

The organic inner-city take on Tuesday’s gridlock is that it shows our love affair with the motor car. This of course is nonsense – people don’t have a love affair with their car, they simply need their car, as if you have a job, a partner with a job, a kid at school, another one in childcare, and so on, there is absolutely no alternative at all, even with the world’s best public transport system, to getting around in a car.

Our rate of car ownership is not going to decrease but our population is going to increase. In an often gridlocked city such as Sydney, and in other rapidly growing parts of the nation such as South-East Queensland and the outer suburbs of Melbourne, people are already spending several hours a day stuck on ring roads that don’t go anywhere – often paying the privilege to do so. Even in a relatively sleepy town such as Adelaide motorists are now complaining that it often takes a full 20 minutes to get from one side of the city’s square mile to the other.

It is a massive quality of life issue which puts families under pressure, keeps parents from spending quality time with their kids, and leaves many people tetchy and miserable.

This week the Australian National University released one of the most substantial surveys to date on public sentiment on population. Asked the simple question “Do you believe Australia needs more people?” an emphatic 69 per cent of the 3124 respondents said no.

I would doubt very much that two-thirds of Australians answered the question thus because they have visions of Birmingham-style ghettos of unassimilated Islamic migrants popping up all over our land, or a quaint old Hansonesque belief that all those Asian smarties are going to head down here and pinch our jobs.

Rather, the question is: where the hell are we going to put this extra eight million people? How many extra cars will that put on our roads? And beyond that, what will the implications be for hospitals and schools at a time when state governments already seem flat out servicing our existing population?

As Bob Carr argued on the website Crikey last month, the population debate in Australia is not really about multiculturalism. It is about infrastructure, services and the environment.

“The debate is not about immigration and its benefits. We all believe in them — Australia is a migrant nation. The debate is not about multiculturalism and it’s not about the source of migrants. The debate is about whether immigration should be running at very high levels. It’s about whether we end up with a population of 36 million in 2050 in contrast to the previous expectation of 28.5 million.” 

Kevin Rudd made a good choice in appointing Tony Burke as the nation’s first Population Minister. Aside from being a competent performer, Burke is also a long-standing resident of Sydney’s southern suburbs and would have spent much of his life stuck in traffic, be it a Comcar or otherwise, yearning to get home. As someone who lives on Sydney’s south Burke has often done the drive home from Canberra on a Friday night, where it’s not uncommon for the final city-based peak-hour leg of the trip to take longer than the journey out of Canberra past Goulburn.

Broadsheet newspapers such as The Australian and veteran columnists such as Paul Kelly have argued at length and with force about the need for bipartisanship on immigration and the value of importing skilled people to bolster our job market.

But from here on in, with Australia now effectively committed to a 36 million target, it’s the coverage of events such as the F3 debacle in the popular press which should be seen not simply as stories about infrastructure failure, but serious subliminal attacks on the presumption that such a population target can be easily reached.

64 comments

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    • T.Chong says:

      08:03am | 17/04/10

      David P; “with Australia now effectively committed to a 36 million target” really ?
      Which political party is “committed” to this target ?
      Did Rudd announce this, or Abbott ?
      Is News Limited determined to editoralise for it? Big business advocating?
      As far as I know this big scarey number was a forecast from a study, not a policy from anyone, anywhere.
      Please David P, do better than just repeat Senator Sophies fear mongering.
      PS, I know it doesnt make a good story, but the simple truth is, that while heavily used, the F3, like any major transport corridor does have problems that deservedly make the news, such as the article is about, but the vast , vast majority of days, nothing untoward happens, with commuters safely going to and fro.
      But who wants to know that, when you can turn on the hyperbole?

    • Diamantina Dick says:

      08:11pm | 17/04/10

      You could appologise for anything and have become a complete joke.

    • Anti Liberal/National Man. says:

      02:17pm | 18/04/10

      @ T.Chong, every road, highway, freeway in the country has heaps of trouble free days. That’s just dumb luck.

      The question is, has, said road system, traffic management plan, been designed/built so that when something goes wrong, the pranged up vehicles can be cleared away quickly? Have these systems been keeping up with population growth? Bearing in mind, that all population growth comes with, huge stamp duty/GST/land tax revenue streams.

      We’ve had mostly red/green/getup/labour coalitions at state & local level, over the last decade or so of hyper, boom times, with rivers of revenue flowing into treasuries all over the country. What have they got to show for it?

      Regards the formersnag & swinging voter.

    • Macca says:

      04:53pm | 18/04/10

      @ T. Chong

      K. Rudd, October 22, 2009 on ABCs 7:30 report

      “I actually believe in a big Australia. I make no apology for that ... I actually think it’s good news that our population is growing”.


      Wayne Swan, 18th September, 2009, releasing the Australian Institute for Population Ageing Research report

      “The Intergenerational Report projects Australia’s population will grow by 65 per cent to reach over 35 million people”

      Google is wonderful, isn’t it?

    • Enuff says:

      08:21am | 17/04/10

      David this is one more for the long, long list of Labor (doesn’t matter if it is state or federal does it) government screw ups. How much more can this country take?

    • Joe says:

      08:41am | 17/04/10

      The problem lies squarely with the Labor state governments who have failed to build near the required infrastructure over the last 20 years.

      Peter Beattie used to boast of 1500 coming to SE QLD a month, while he relied on Coalition infrastructure built years before to live it up.

    • Anna says:

      08:41am | 17/04/10

      “people don’t have a love affair with their car, they simply need their car, as if you have a job, a partner with a job, a kid at school, another one in childcare, and so on, there is absolutely no alternative at all, even with the world’s best public transport system, to getting around in a car.”
      Bull. People don’t need a car. They want a car, and they make social, political and lifestyle choices to reinforce this perceived need. If there wasn’t then you wouldn’t see countries with high proportions of public transport patronage - they have families too! The sooner we change this ridiculous attitude the sooner we can have a good public transport system. More patronage means a better system in the long run assuming good planning.

    • Tom says:

      11:18am | 17/04/10

      Agreed Anna. Yes, there are some cases where there isn’t going to be an alternative to the car and probably never will be, due to distance, lack of demand for a specific route, etc. But the lack of public transport infrastructure undoubtedly adds to congestion.

      In Sydney for example, there would be plenty of demand for a decent rail link from the North West to Parramatta and the CBD, but none exists. If it were built, I’m sure plenty would use it in lieu of their cars. Sure, it won’t replace the car entirely, but it will go a long way to reducing the need for one for most day to day activities. Alternatively people could choose to forgo a big house and live closer to the city, or move to a country city. I realise there will be some for whom this is impractical, but for the vast majority of people no one is forcing them into their cars.

    • sumguy says:

      02:26pm | 17/04/10

      in this country Anna im sorry you need a car the distance needed to travel and the lack of real 24hr public transport system means you need a car.
      if we upped the pop density and fixed the public transport system a car would not be needed. i say this with exp i live on the central coast now but previously lived in NYC. i never needed to drive while living in ny but i would have no chance of geting daily chores done let alone work.

    • Alex says:

      04:39pm | 17/04/10

      How many kids do you have Anna?

      How do you get them to kindergarten, school, doctors, shops etc?

      Where do you buy clothes and food?

      And how many hours a day do you spend carrying them around bus stops or on the back of your bicycle?

      Public transport might be a great option if you have no kids and can afford to live in an expensive inner suburb.  For the rest of us - well, your statement paints you as a rich, ignorant elitist.

    • Anna says:

      09:04am | 18/04/10

      The reason we have such bad public transport is that for years people have been choosing to travel by car, and so infrastructure has been reflecting this short-term need over the longer-term need of better public transport. That’s because people *want* a car, and they have been making choices for decades to support this *need*. Sure, right now there are some things you can’t do without a car - occasionally we hire/borrow one, but that is only a couple of times a year.

      Obviously I don’t have any children - if I did I’d be here justifying my own selfish want to drive and wouldn’t be posting this. But you know, I’m sure there are plenty of parents without cars who still manage to take their children to school, kindergarten, etc. My sister is one. And she lives in a regional town to boot - not an elitist, inner-city suburb. Sure, it’s harder not to drive. But if you’re sitting in traffic bitching about the traffic, you are part of the problem, not the solution.

    • julia says:

      11:31am | 18/04/10

      I used to live at Erskineville in Sydney. Have you ever tried to get on a train at Erko between 8am and 9am? I would have caught that train, if I could have got on it.

      When I did manage to crash tackle my way in, it was completely unreliable. I was stuck on one of those trains on the Harbour Bridge. If the F3 was a debacle, then imagine three trains stuck between Milson’s Point and Kirribilly. They didn’t just manage to foul up my day, either. They fouled up any motorist on the Harbour Bridge.

      The NSW government can’t administer. They are as useless as mammories on a male bovine.

    • Alex says:

      04:18pm | 18/04/10

      Anna,

      Since you see fit to insult me, my wife, my children, my sister and her children, perhaps you’d like to tell us more about how we ought to lead our lives in a less “selfish” manner.  (Presumably by moving to one of the unaffordable inner city suburbs well serviced by public transport that’s subsidised by gullible taxpayers like me).

      After all, you don’t seem to need to know anything about us in order to pass judgement.

      Looking forward to hear more from someone like yourself, who clearly knows more than I do about transporting kids, what with having a sister who has one and all.

    • Matt says:

      05:22pm | 18/04/10

      Anna, are you too young or too selfish to have children?

    • kato says:

      08:03pm | 18/04/10

      Anna, sorry but I’m not buying your “people want a car” line.  If I could do my job and get around the city without it then I’d save a fortune.  Unfortunately public transport is next to non-existant here in Canberra so that’s not an option.  The infrastructure has to be there before people will use it.  I’m not giving up my sole means of transport if there’s nothing to replace it with.  I NEED my car and without it I would be unemployed and stranded so don’t get on your high horse about this want business.

    • Norm says:

      08:46pm | 18/04/10

      Anna, I agree there are some places in Australia where a car is not necessary. But very few people live in one. Perhaps you need to get out of your comfort zone to see some of these places.
      Take a typical day at work for me; from home to SW Brisbane, then the Gold Coast, then back to Brisbane CBD, then north Brisbane then home again. This took about 6 hrs on the road. If I had taken public transport I don’t think the journey would be possible, and if it was it would take 60 hrs.
      Public transport works for those that live near a train or station or bus hub (and I have used both extensively when I was in this position) but unfortunately the coverage is just not sufficient to make it possible for everyone. And for people that don’t just commute from A to B and back I doubt it will ever get there.

    • Arthur says:

      09:59pm | 18/04/10

      Its not entirely necessary to own and operate a car in a major centre, I have never needed to drive a car to work in 2 years of living in Sydney, but try relying on the joke of public transport in any of our rural communities. I spent 10 years living in a small town in NSW and save for catching the school bus with the kids in the morning and then home again in the evening there was no public transport.

    • joe says:

      12:35am | 19/04/10

      I agree, it is bull. if there is apparently no alternative to having a car when you have kids how the hell do so many other cities across the world some how do the impossible daily?

    • Mark Reynolds says:

      01:27am | 19/04/10

      Excellent comment Anna! Living in Amsterdam, which has excellent public transport, you don’t need a car. Got kids? We see families riding their bikes, either with the kids riding their own bikes, or the kids strapped into the parents bikes. Selfish? No way. Ditch the cars, demand more public transport.

    • Mark says:

      07:05am | 19/04/10

      Um I dont think most people driving down any of the motor ways are dropping their kids of at school/daycare or ducking out to grab their groceries !
      Next time you are driving along a motor way during peek hour complaining about the traffic congestion have a look around at the cars near you - how may of them have more than one person in them ? not many would be the answer. if 50% of those driving to work to a friend or collegue there would be a significant drop in traffic. But Oh yeh thats too difficult and not convenient its much easier to sick back and whinge and complain about other to justify OUR choices.

    • Simon says:

      09:47am | 19/04/10

      The whole car culture of Australia is the problem here. We have designed our cities such that car ownership is a requirement for the vast majority. We need to rebuild our cities at higher densities so that car ownership becomes optional, even for families. But this process is very long and difficult one. It also has a real chicken and egg aspect - to justify improving public transport density is required, but to get density, you need public transport. And that is not to mention other infrastructure such as water and sewage which requires upgrades of underground services. Then there is the need to provide more inner city school places and retail facilities so that whole families can live, work, shop and be educated within a small transport catchment.

      In cities such as New York, London, Hong Kong and Tokyo, car ownership is something that is no compulsory and in some instances, not even realistically attainable. Not saying Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane should look like New York, but taking a few lessons from these places and planning that dense inner core should be investigated.

    • Mike says:

      10:15am | 19/04/10

      What a stupid, cyclical argument. If we didn’t use our cars so much, we would have better public transport and if we had better public transport, we wouldn’t use our cars so much. Is this like something on “The Secret”? If I REALLY ask the universe for good public transport, I’ll get it? Can it happen by tomorrow morning when I need to go to work?

      Other countries have great public transport, it’s true. They also don’t have massive urban sprawl, comparatively tiny populations and 50km commutes to work. It’s going to take more than calling people selfish to fix these.

    • Fredby says:

      11:42am | 19/04/10

      “The reason we have such bad public transport is that for years people have been choosing to travel by car, and so infrastructure has been reflecting this short-term need over the longer-term need of better public transport.”... Anna, that is the silliest arguement I have ever heard. Your argument is like a company saying “the reason our products are crap is because people buy our competitor’s product.” The reason we have crap public transport is because successive Australian governments have no long-term view (past the next election)... I would love to be able to travel everywhere by train and forget the stresses of the car but it is ridiculously inconvenient.

    • mum on public transport says:

      12:03pm | 19/04/10

      I do not currently drive and use public transport, at a huge cost to my children, who aren’t constantly unable to do things, because public transport just does not allow it.  For instance, a place i used to regularly take my children a 20 min drive from my home, has us on public transport for over 2 and a half hours, one way! I wish to return to work part time, in school hours, but it is just not viable due to the transport timetable, the only way I can get to my children’s school to help with reading or anything, is a half hour walk, they have a school bus to transport them, but effectively stops me being involved in bad weather. And getting them from before or after school care, when there is no option of the school bus is out of the question. The one extra curricular activity they have, takes half a Saturday for a one hour lesson. How much do you think my children enjoy that? Selfish for driving, i don’t think so. To rely solely on public transport takes away from the quality of life for families in this country, I know other countries do it better, but ours doesn’t and until they do, to call parents selfish for doing what they have to, to have a reasonable functioning life is just ignorant.  BTW I live in an outer Melbourne suburb. And I can only get anywhere once an hour!

    • Ish says:

      03:05pm | 19/04/10

      I suppose the question here is which comes first the chicken or the egg…if people all ditched their cars would the infrastructure then follow or should the infrastructure be put in place then people would use it.

      I think it should be the latter, and I guess the problem is the sprawling city we live in. For me if I were to take public transport to drop my daughter at pre-school then continue on to work I would need to catch a bus then two trains to get to her school, then back on the train and another bus. It would take just under 3 hours according to cityrail.com. As an alternative it takes me an hour on a good day and an hour and a half on a bad day and two hours on a terrible day.

      If you build it they will come.

    • Anti Liberal/National Man. says:

      09:35am | 17/04/10

      @ Penbo, How did all 3 levels of government survive between 1945 & 1972? When they had a simultaneous “baby boom” & immigration boom to deal with?

      Trawl through your extensive newspaper archives, with some of your colleagues at news ltd. See the politicians press releases & file photos of infrastructure projects gallore. What % rates was our population growing at then, compered to since then?

      Or better still, try DRIVING through the inner suburbs of all our cities? Past schools, hospitals, libraries, bridges, whatever, all built during a tsunami of immigration, with families of between 6 & 12 considered perfectly normal.

      Mind you i am not discussing whether our environment could survive population growth rates, that high again. But our certainly governments had the expertise, money, etc,  to do it all, (probably more efficiently) with less reliance on tolls than now.

      regards the formersnag & swinging voter.

      PS, @ acker, in QLD they have built heaps of new hospital buildings recently. Without building any new hospitals. You waste a squillion dollars smashing down existing buildings that were very solidly built & difficult to demolish. Then throw up a smaller, cheaper, nastier, monstrosity which only several years old is already falling apart.

      Its great, instead of getting of only 1, “performance bonus” as the spin doctors up here called it, you get 2, one each from the demolition company & construction company. Together with spin about how much extra money has been poured into the health system.

    • Mr Pastry says:

      09:42am | 17/04/10

      We are the worlds most urban/suburban nation and the allocation of one city per state is quite ridiculous, we need second tier cities.  It is good to see Queensland discussing developing a Northern Queensland city around the Townsville area, build it and they will come, don’t build it and all will just go to Brisbane and compound the current problems.  25% of our work force are public servants, what could be better than moving government departments federal and state out of expensive city locations freeing up transport, commercial property and housing capacity.  Its an online world and there is no reason why the bulk of govt department staff (and businesses) need to be in expensive crowded locations, other than the top floor offices like living there.  These moves could kick start opportunities for new commerce into 2nd tier cities.  We have the capacity for more but not in the current one city per state format, just squeezing more and more people together reduces quality of life.

    • Andrew Goff says:

      11:12am | 17/04/10

      Might want to fact check some of that…

      “We are the worlds most urban/suburban nation”
      - No we aren’t.

      “one city per state is quite ridiculous, we need second tier cities”
      - No, one major city per state is very sensible - note that almost every country in the world runs on this model, and for a good reason.

      “It is good to see Queensland discussing developing a Northern Queensland city around the Townsville area”
      -Townsville would point out it is already a city.

      “build it and they will come, don’t build it and all will just go to Brisbane and compound the current problems.”
      -Build it, and delay the problems until another city fills up.

      “25% of our work force are public servants”
      -only assuming you are counting nurses, teachers, emergency services… and moving them to Tamworth is not going to help infrastructure needs is it?

      “Its an online world and there is no reason why the bulk of govt department staff (and businesses) need to be in expensive crowded locations, other than the top floor offices like living there”
      -I agree, but the same can be said for the private sector.

      “These moves could kick start opportunities for new commerce into 2nd tier cities”
      -And kill them in the big cities.

      “We have the capacity for more but not in the current one city per state format,”
      -Citation most definitely needed. The general agreement is that in fact this reduces capacity.

      “Just squeezing more and more people together reduces quality of life.”
      -Well, why not go back to agrarian Socialism? This last comment is as just silly.

    • Mr Pastry says:

      10:58am | 18/04/10

      Fair enough.
      Surprised anybody would read my nonsense.

    • philip says:

      08:54pm | 18/04/10

      please Mr Pastry don,t send them to townsville we haven,t got the infrastructure at present

    • S.L says:

      10:38am | 17/04/10

      In the media this week the RTA screamed the head honcho Mr Busby who Premier Keneally gave a fully paid vacation to in the guise of being “stood down” was not responsible for the chaos on monday but in true public service style they offered no one else up for blame. The average public servant I know would be totally incapable of surviving in the public sector anyway so I’m assuming when this fiasco was on the powers that be were still having their morning and afternoon teas and lunch and were all ready to bundy off at 5pm.

    • pete says:

      11:10am | 17/04/10

      Anyway you spin it our pollies and big parties like to talk 36 million but the fact is they are not competent enough to provide the necessary planning or infrastructure to do it. The Tv show “Yes Minister” is now in the realms of being a documentary.

      Face it - Sydney is full.

      And does Paul Kelly argue about utilising highly unemployed young people (15-20%) or is he just a puppet of the business council?

    • Veritas says:

      10:14pm | 18/04/10

      Hurah ... its not just me that’s noticed this whole “lets have a big Australia” thing is being driven, for the most part, by the Murdoch press. Sell your integrity boys and girls… and lets see how many people are willing to pay how much for NL’s online content. My advice would be to wait until you have them captive before you start ramming your adgenda down their throat.
      Best Regards

    • Darren says:

      11:27am | 17/04/10

      What I don’t understand in this debate is we were a much happier, easy going nation before we joined this blind religon of, Rampant Growth is Good - of Rudd and Abbott’s.

      And before they started playing this game of lets see how many people we can jam pack into our cities…

      Why should short sighted leaders and their parties that get massive donations from the road building cartels (and others) ruin our cool country?

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      11:40am | 17/04/10

      There is projected to be 42 million people in Australia by 2050. (Latest projection by Australia’s Centre for Population and Urban Research). I’m not sure that Australia could support 42 Million people or want it- it’s hell enough at 22 million. Watch all the smart professionals emigrate at 25 million mark due to the increased taxes and degraded lifestyle.

    • Sam Chowder says:

      12:12pm | 17/04/10

      The RTA boss was probably having dinner with friends, a haircut and other self indulgences, during this traffic crisis.  Apparently these are the things top bosses do to get the top dollars these days.

    • Moar please says:

      04:42pm | 17/04/10

      Yes, we need our cars. Especially when family comes along or your job does not exist in the main transport centres (CBD and a handful of satellite suburbs).

      The population needs to continue to grow to fuel the economy. This is a basic economic fact and requirement. This can come from immigration or organic growth. Most of these people don’t want to be shunted away to a second-rate backwater. We all want to take a bite out of the big apple.

      The problem stems from governments of all levels failing to invest in infrastructure for the last 30 years. This is due to deregulation of the economy opening us up to the real consequences of our actions (budget deficits can’t be hidden by manipulating the economy, same as interest rates and exchange rates).

      Also, the short-run life cycle of govt means that are too narrowly focused. They are also too timid because people want things NOW and won’t vote for anything of quality. Most of them are too stupid for their own good.

      Most govt levels fight against the other. Height restrictions on buildings imposed by local councils limit the amount of people that can live there thus causing a supply problem.

      The raft of middle class welfare leave the coffers dry.

      Ultimately, the people get the govt they deserve. Hopefully, one day, they’ll smarten up and drag these morons into the streets and make them walk home.

      Hopefully, one day, our roads will resemble autobahns (even within our cities).

    • Really Truly Absurd says:

      07:30pm | 17/04/10

      David,

      I’m amazed that you didn’t spend more time highlighting what a lost cause the RTA really is (as if most of us didn’t realise already).

      This is the organisation that recently moved most of their Sydney staff from the economical and practical office block in Surry Hills to the luxurious and expensive former-home-of-Optus in North Sydney, purportedly to bathe in the incredible views and keep an eye on the ensuing chaos on Sydney’s roads.

      It’s also the same mob who dropped the speed limit on Bell’s Line of Road (the only alternative to the abysmal “Great” Western Highway which has taken 10+ years to be duplicated a quarter of the way across the Blue Mountains) without telling anyone first. They have since learnt from that lesson in stupidity and have continued to drop speed limits around the state, most recently changing the Newell from 110 to 100km/h, and angering every bushie in the process.

      They have decommissioned a large number of blue and white (State) routes around Sydney since the 90’s, without replacing them with anything. They haven’t bothered to tell the street directory or GPS companies yet, so the routes still appear on the maps even though you can’t find them on the ground. The RTA counters this by saying they are implementing a new alphanumeric route system, which they started way back in 2001. So far they have introduced one official route (the M7), even though Victoria managed to convert their entire state in five years!

      Please disband the RTA!

    • Realists says:

      11:58pm | 18/04/10

      Mate - u obviously haven’t got a clue about managing a road system - god help us if you are ever placed in charge, because even more deaths will be on the Bells Line of Road, more government $$ being diverted from police and hospitals, and how would you like to work in an office with rats running around!!

    • Glen says:

      07:57pm | 17/04/10

      Who said we are allowing a huge skilled immigration intake?  KRudd has reduced the skilled intake while continuing with a huge intake.  By continuing he is agreeing with it.  By reducing the skilled intake but keeping the number at record levels another intake is taking itsa place, and guess what, it is family reunion.  This means that tens of thousands more unskilled, mostly non english speaking, often illiterate and aged people who have no similar cultural or religeous or values sets that are filling our shores.  We did not build this nation to have foreigners tell us what to do, fill our roads, trains, take our kids jobs and suck our welfare dry.

    • coxy says:

      07:54am | 18/04/10

      As a country resident all I can do is laugh. I get up to Sydney a bit and I’m always pleased to leave the place. I can’t believe that people live like they do, they must spend at least half their life waiting, waiting in traffic, waiting for a delayed train, heck even the queues at McDonald’s are three times as long as what I’m used to. Personally I couldn’t stand it. It would be such a waste of time.

      About all Sydney and Melbourne are good for is a weekend to watch the footy send the wife shopping and/or a bit of a bender with the boys for the odd bucks show or something, and that’s another thing it takes ten minutes to get a drink at some pubs, you grab a drink and go back to the end of the line knowing that by the time you get to the front you’ll be finished and ready for another.

      Whilst do nothing non visionary governments have seriously screwed this situation up over the years the horse has bolted and its only going to get worse. And while you lot continue to put up with it, I’ll continue to enjoy the simple life, but at least I get the most out of my day.

    • Dingo_aus says:

      07:51am | 18/04/10

      “a time when state governments already seem flat out servicing our existing population?”  The solution is to let private enterprise take the lead.  I the F3 was somehow run by a for profit company, the delay would not have been so long.

      In any area where government and private sector compete - the private sector is always able to produce services and goods faster, better and cheaper.

      Government will never be as efficient as the private sector. So government should get out of the way of the private sector.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      12:10pm | 18/04/10

      Is that the private sector like the Chinese steel mills that pay millions in Yuan for bribes and kickbacks or the U.S financial private sector that President Obama has just made a speech about declaring “No more taxpayer funded bailouts”. (awesome speech by the way. The man is a great communicator. I’m not sure how effective the legislation will be. But the Glass-Steagall Act should be reinstated in some shape or form)

    • Scot says:

      12:32pm | 18/04/10

      Road construction in NSW should be put out to global tender. And the company that is awarded the construction also has the right to import overseas labour to get the job done. There should be large penalties for companies that fail to deliver on time and to budget as is the case with mayor infrastructure projects globally. This should also be applied to Rail hospitals any project over $200M. Then and only then will we have anything delivered. If the Unions fail to meet deliverables they are also find.

    • Clever_User_Name says:

      03:37pm | 18/04/10

      Because paying $30 in tolls a week to get to work sounds like a good idea?

      Sure, the private sector will get it done faster, but they also take their pound of flesh.

      Of course, there’d probably be a toll on any new road, knowing the NSW State Government.

    • Scot says:

      07:09pm | 18/04/10

      Roads will still be owned by the Government, no more Private roads, they are just contractors to build the roads. The old fashioned way. This is the case with many major projects all over the world, especially the middle east, Pakistan, Malaysia etc. and they have value for money. We have fools and no roads. or infrastructure. The Unions re killing this country and the private companies are ripping us off.

    • Scot says:

      12:07pm | 18/04/10

      The RTA should have its name changed back to DMR, because that is all it is. It is the most incompetent entity we have in NSW. They have no long term planning for anything. Road expansion, road repairs, They have only one role in life and that is raising money for the NSW Labor Government, like the power industry they have sucked out all the cash and poured it into black holes. Keneally is saying she needs $600 million to sort out elective surgery and she wasted over $300 million on a failed rail project in Sydney. How incompetent can one be. When you look at Singapore, Malaysia, Sth. Korea and China the road infrastructure is world class, why is this. We have had 200 years to get it right in Australia and China has done it in less than 50. They do build 2 lane country road they build 6 and 8 lane highways to world standards. We have a Pacific Highway that is third world and cost us billions every year in lost revenue and countless deaths.

    • The Dude says:

      07:10pm | 18/04/10

      Perhaps, instead of allowing population densities to increase, town planners advising politicians should investigate the need for responsible urban sprawl. I could not believe when I hear the density changes made for Brisbane. Perhaps people will need to think about moving away from cities for the greater good. Tree change anyone???

    • Rod says:

      01:16am | 19/04/10

      When I see a story about trucks,it brings back bad memories of twice being run off the road by oncoming semi’s overtaking dangerously ,as well as almost being killed by one that was backing up without reverse beepers.If any of you care to look at the truck smash news that is actually properly recorded- your blood will curdle.
      There was a truck driver who smashed into over 30 cars on the same road a few years ago.He had most of his brake pads defective.
      Remember Kerang,11 dead,20 seriously injured and no one was to blame?I see truck company supervisors as the puppetmasters that should be prosecuted.Truckies have huge debts for their rigs and now the bosses have them working casual.If you are casual you don’t speak up on safety concerns or unreasonable work schedules (sleep deprivation) or you will lose shifts to those who popp pills or are reckless.In Melbourne we have often had both sides of freeways blocked for hours because of another truck smash. It reminds me of the mystery woman in the Blues Brothers that keeps trying to kill her ex boyfriend and he just goes on his merry way, ignoring the imminent danger.

    • Vit says:

      07:51pm | 18/04/10

      Funny enough, it all happened on Monday, not Tuesday!

    • Bob says:

      08:33pm | 18/04/10

      What utter bs…

      The majority of Australian households are childless - with proper public transport provision there is absolutely no excuse for these households to have cars.
      And until we have sufficient population densities for 24/7 public transport with a max 10min wait, there are not enough people.

      Look at Potts Point, the densest suburb in Australia. It is also one of the most expensive and most desireable.
      Density:
      ->Good public transport
      ->Great cafes, restaurants, cultural institutions within walking distance
      ->Fresh food within walking distance; people don’t buy carloads of groceries because its so easy to get exactly what they need
      ->Great neighbourhood vibe

      Its damn ridiculous that most teenagers are buying cars at 17… this attitude is creating congestion. It is so easy to live without a car, and saves $100s/week - cars should be restricted to those who really really need them.

      As for the hospitals/schools stuff, you seem to forget that more people = more taxes… per capita spending will be unchanged

    • Alex says:

      11:48am | 19/04/10

      “with proper public transport provision there is absolutely no excuse for these households to have cars”

      But most of us don’t have proper public transport.

      Regarding Potts Point, what’s you’re, er, point?  That poor people ought to move there?

      Yes, rich suburbs tend to have pretty good public transport.  So?

    • Marty says:

      01:26pm | 19/04/10

      You’re missing the point Bob. I can’t speak about other cities but most Brisbane residents wouldn’t know proper public transport if it popped up in their porridge.

      The good people of Potts Point might have great public transport but the reality is that most of us don’t. My daily drive to and from work currently takes about an hour each way. According to the best case scenario on the Translink website, if I were to take public transport it would take me over two hours each way.

      As for the supposed $$$ savings - given that public transport in Brisbane generally takes about twice as long to get you from point A to point B I would suggest that it’s only cheaper if you think your time is worth nothing.

    • Car Park Dweller says:

      09:54pm | 18/04/10

      Its quite simple really. Take the Hume Hwy/M5 combination from Campbelltown into the City. Presently a trip during peak hour in normal conditions takes about 1 hr 20 minutes. The outer south-west parts of Sydney such as Camden are undergoing major redevelopement which will see the population in this region swell by over 100,000 people. Without there being any substantial upgrades to road infrastructure (forget about what they are doing to the Hume Hwy now) the journey into the city will most definitely get worse and I haven’t even mentioned when a major traffic incident occurs.

    • Samantha says:

      10:13pm | 18/04/10

      This is all down to bad management and planning. The billions of money that the government wastes on stupid things like the $900 they gave out could have been put to better use like our roads/infrastructure, schools and hospitals.  Even the $50 per child payment that the govt gives to parents at the start of the school should actually be given to the schools!! The state and local governments should seriously look at making efficiencies…I can still not fathom why they need so many men to dig a whole in the road!! So we have the public system who unfortunately have poor planning and implementation skills and have a welfare mentality and then we have the private sector who is probably a bit better at planning and efficiency but who think that they can charge like a wounded bull!!

    • Cm says:

      10:23pm | 18/04/10

      did anybody else notice this accident was Monday not Tuesday? Considering i drove past the other way and felt so sorry for those stuck in the immediate vicinity.

    • Dave P says:

      11:14pm | 18/04/10

      In the US there is a fantastic national highway network ... built in the main by the troops returning from WW2, to keep them in a job. If I was in charge we would not have 25% unemployment in the youth sector, we would have young, strong road crews, and roads being built everywhere.

    • Really Truly Absurd says:

      10:27am | 19/04/10

      Dave P,

      The fantastic US national highway network that you speak of is quickly falling apart due to years of neglect from successive governments (sounds a lot like NSW)! Check out a doco called “The Crumbling of America” and you will see what I mean.

      I definitely agree with you though when you say the young should be put to work to build a lasting legacy….I believe they have been doing this in QLD over recent years, with great success.

    • Scot says:

      02:09pm | 19/04/10

      Yes the even the US highway system is in decline. There are 10,000 bridges that will have to be replaced. Some have already been blown up as they are so unsafe. And when you look at bridges in rural Australia there are some shockers as well.  We do not build road systems in NSW, we build country lanes. We have such poor vision and adding to our costs while Asia is building 6-8 lane highways to world standards.

    • Really Truly Absurd says:

      02:39pm | 19/04/10

      Couldn’t agree with you more, Scot. I regularly visit a particular corner of rural NSW where the roads haven’t changed in 40 years. In fact, some of them have even reverted to dirt. This entire state needs to be opened up and brought into the 21st century with great roads that don’t fall apart and actually go somewhere.

      A case in point is the external Sydney bypass….a road that starts at Muswellbrook, heads south through Bylong, Bathurst and Oberon, then ends at Goulburn. At the moment it is little more than a goat track, but with foresight and some decent cash it would revolutionise travel in this state. It would even cut down some of the traffic congestion in Sydney!

    • Scot says:

      12:18am | 20/04/10

      The DMR is a disgrace. They have had no vision for more than 40 years. They have squandered their opportunity to build first class roads and infrastructure. Instead we have a dogs breakfast. Nothing gets done on time and when it does it costs twice what it was costed at. Why because they these University graduates could not fight their way out of a wet paper bag when it to comes to delivering road infrastructure that is world class and will assist the economic growth of the country, what we have is public servants with cost on cost like the BER we had to have and even there the Unions are ripping off the system, taking money out f their own kids future or our economic growth, companies are fleeing the state and country because it is run down and tired.

    • BigBen says:

      01:29pm | 19/04/10

      I would take Public transport to work but its just not viable, I would need to get up at 4am instead of 6am and get 4 buses then have to walk half a kilometer. The transport system is fine I guess if you live and work on a train or bus route but otherwise its woeful

    • d.jay.stevo says:

      09:52am | 20/04/10

      What gets me, is the RTA and police used this fiasco to revenue raise, fining truckies who had been stuck in the mess with not taking a proper rest break away from the truck! That is disgusting, penalising workers for getting stuck in a mess they created.

 

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