Telling the Government to go and get trucked

Luke4 says:

09:46am | 23/07/11

Yes, there will be no scutiny or accountability of the Gillard Brown Government.
Anyone attempting this will be muzzled!

Phil says:

02:41pm | 23/07/11

I’d like to see equal column inches allotted to the opposite side of the argument, just to show how fair and balanced this paper can be…. just like fox Views is ‘fair and balanced’.

What a surprise, this article is from Menzies House,  Senator Cory Bernardi’s baby !

The corporate lobbyists are using twerps like Mikkelson and he doen’t even realise it.

Frank says:

04:26pm | 23/07/11

We need real reform in our governmental system, get rid of the parties!!!

Adam Diver says:

04:46pm | 23/07/11

@ Phil it seems you have misplaced your tinfoil hat, and its probably time to take the eye patch off your right eye

John Mikkelsen says:

09:13am | 24/07/11

@ Phil, guess you didn’t read to the bottom of the MH article, acknowledging it was published first on The Punch. Der..

Warner Rooke says:

12:11pm | 24/07/11

I think “troika” is a very inappropriate word for the above.It more appropriately applies to Gillard,Wayne Goose & the ABC,If we dont like Murdock and, Jones etc we have the ability to turn them off . However we are paying for “OUR” ABC and should expect unbiased coverage of ALL political happenings from them.Something that we CERTAINLY dont get.

Peter says:

08:58am | 25/07/11

I remember the 2007 election that all media backed Rudd. When Rudd uttered a word it soon became Gospel with no scrutiny, even today we still have some of the press referring to the treasury find a blach hole in the coalitions 2010 promises and have a convenient memory lapse of of Rudd’s submission of his parties promises being delated until 24 hours prior to the closing time and the reply from treasury was it was too late too look at the submissions. So Rudd’s promises went un scrutinized by Treasury. The media are pushing Abbott for his election promises even now 2 years out from the next election. I admit being one sided but I also enjoy a debate from both sides and become very frustrated to hear a question being answered by a stock reply attacking the opposition and no answer to the orginal question , with the media being happy with spin rather then facts. Julia has been asked numerous times How much will Australia’s carbon tax help reduce the global emissions. The answer is the oppositions carbon policy will cost more then ours. Abbott is being ridiculed for pointing out that China’s INCREASE in pollution this year and years to come will be X times (I forget whether it 10 or 100) Australians proposed savings. Even though it a worrying fact journalists including Andrew Bolt think is a joke. Labor supporters that cry for a fair go in the press must relize this is not a Labor Government but a Green Government.  . 15% of the total vote and they are they have over 50% of the say ,just for Julia can stay PM even though her personal reputation (There will be no Carbon Tax in my Govt,) has been thrashed and will never recover it’s with her for life.

Simon says:

01:12pm | 02/08/11

I think Frank is close to the mark.The political system operating in Switzerland seems more democratic than most.  The people vote on political policies not politicians arguing about them.It is not compulsory to vote.It is done cheaply using a national ID number, via phone, text, email or polling both. Also each Canton (large local government, no state government ) has one vote. So regional governments have an equal vote. From what I see we pay way to much for political decisions most of us don’t wont. We would have to be one of the most over regulated countries in the world.

No 1 Rosie says:

09:46am | 23/07/11

Yes Chongy the song - “Now is the hour to say goodbye” It is called ‘people’s power’ and in the end it is this ‘power’ that always win in a democratic society.

Have some sense and begin the task of acquiring a strong Labor Opposition not a powerless one that will sit there in helpless awe of a Coalition Govt. Australia deserves a good strong Opposition, like the one we have now.

jb says:

10:03am | 23/07/11

No Chong this bullshit just has to stop so Gillard, Abbott, Brown and all future leaders of our country know that they can’t treat us with such disrespect and contempt, thats who it represents mate, those of us who are sick of being mugged by all persuasions of politicians, surely you can’t disagree with that!

Gregg says:

10:27am | 23/07/11

Chongy, as usual you make all sorts of assumptions and of course Australia is a land of many diversely different interests and in a true democracy, good discussion is had to find solutions, something which is sadly lacking with both Gillard and Rudd previously.

As for your Brown line on companies ownership, are you truly going to be as pathetic as him and not be open to the fact that most countries have stock exchanges that allow share ownerships to be across borders and if Senator Brown had to depend on a private superannuation fund for his pension he might find that most private superannuation funds have international share holdings.
Our biggst companies like BHP and the banks are international in their operations.

So be Australian and grow up.
If you want to join the convoy, I have some chains and will make you comfortable on the Mack 10 grill after you cycle of course to Katherine to get aboard.
I’ll even put you in good company of Badger and a few others if they/you like.

Against the Man says:

11:50am | 23/07/11

Hey Chongy did the ALP give you a paycut? Cause the quality of your comments seem to be getting worse!

Do you represent the interest of the majority of Australians?

Chris L says:

03:50pm | 23/07/11

Hold up Gregg, I think Chongy made a good point. Flying the flag does imply nationalism, thus implying that those opposed are traitors. It’s fair to point out that those that disagree with this protest can do so from an equally patriotic viewpoint.

DT says:

10:38am | 24/07/11

How dare they, there must be an inquiry.

Thumbnail says:

10:03am | 23/07/11

People have lost confidence in this government.  They have lost confidence in a government that can’t put pink batts in homes without killing people, destroying homes and worrying people.  They have lost confidence in a government that can’t build school halls, toilet blocks and libraries at anything near the commercial rate.  They have lost confidence in a government that seeks to destroy the mining industry through punitive taxes like the MRRT.  They have lost confidence in a government that believes the pseudo science or “Xbox” models of the IPCC.  They have lost confidence in a government that now seeks to partake in the live trade of humans to Malaysia, but will cut off the live beef export industry at the knees without considering the lives and livelihoods of the people in the outer northern reaches of this great land.  They have lost confidence in a government which allows an extremist hard left political party to call the shots.  They have lost confidence in a government that bankrolls thugs like GetUp who threaten and blackmail ordinary Australians to shut down the contest of ideas that has made our nation strong.  They have lost confidence in a government whose leader openly hectors ordinary Australians like me who rightfully and legally protest against the destruction of our economy and the perversion of science.  They have lost confidence in a government that can only chant old, tired, focus grouped slogans.  They have lost confidence in a government that demonises ‘big polluters’ – these are big employers, big tax payers and big Australians.  Yes, the people have lost confidence in this government, and I am one of those people.

Erick says:

10:06am | 23/07/11

88% of the voters in that democratic election voted for parties that promised no carbon tax.

Democracy has been betrayed; that’s why people are angry.

CJ Morgan says:

11:06am | 23/07/11

Quite so, David.  These wankers simply refuse to abide by the rules of our democracy.  They didin’t win the election so they want to bludgeon the government and the rest of us to acceding to their demands.

It’s just the Tea Party, Australian style.  Strange how these poor struggling political extremists seem to have plenty of time and money to turn up to these ugly stunts while most people are working for a living.

Was that some special pleading from the rural sector that I hear?  How unusual - not.

scotty says:

12:06pm | 23/07/11

“We just had a deocratic election less than a year ago”

Which was won on the basis of a bald-faced lie

“We have a functioning parliament, a minority government that has the confidence of the parliament, a recent budget approved, so what’s the problem again?  “

That we are being saddled with a $10b tax that 80+% of people specifically voted against.  There is no democratic mandate for the carbon tax, and the people are saying that Gillard needs to get one.

Pretty simple really

Jane says:

01:09pm | 23/07/11

If the ALP had made a reasonable fist of governing after putting in the highest bid for our Democracy there would be no protests.

They haven’t, they lied, and everything is just going from bad to worse, starting with ignoring the Democratic process in bringing forward their economy changing Kahbin (Dioxide?) Tax.

Now you people protest that people are protesting?  Get real!

Martin says:

01:23pm | 23/07/11

As far as the democratic election was concerned it ended up 72 all. Shabily put together coalition AFTER the election to form the “Desperate Dan” govermentt that we now have. Where was the democracy in Windsor and Oakeshott’s actions? Did they go back to their constituencies and ask for a consensus “Do we go Labor or Liberal”? That didn’t happen. hence there is an air of illegitimacy about this government.. If this minority government cannot stand up to the majority opinion then it should in fact call an election.

Chris L says:

04:10pm | 23/07/11

“They have lost confidence in a government that can’t put pink batts in homes without killing people” - Garrett put in place two rafts of regulations to ensure safe installation. The tragic incidents that ensued were caused by businesses which ignored these regulations. Are you really blaming the government for that?

“They have lost confidence in a government that can’t build school halls, toilet blocks and libraries at anything near the commercial rate.” - Every official report, whether critical or not, has concluded that the BER was successful. For one example you could google the Orgill report.

“They have lost confidence in a government that seeks to destroy the mining industry through punitive taxes like the MRRT.” - While we may debate the pros and cons of that proposal (I personally don’t see why super profits shouldn’t benefit our country) I do strongly doubt that the aim of the tax was to “destroy the mining industry”. This is an example of exagerrated hysteria.

“They have lost confidence in a government that believes the pseudo science or “Xbox” models of the IPCC.” - At least some sort of science is involved. I understand that conservatives have some sort of inherent wisdom over science and economics that is unavailable to the rest of us. Therefore we must rely on humble scientific methods.

“They have lost confidence in a government that now seeks to partake in the live trade of humans to Malaysia, but will cut off the live beef export industry at the knees” - You may have a decent point there but it gets lost in the rhetoric.

“They have lost confidence in a government which allows an extremist hard left political party to call the shots.” - That seems to be the outcome of the last election. I was very unhappy at the extremist hard right political party calling the shots in a previous government, but that’s democracy.

“They have lost confidence in a government that bankrolls thugs like GetUp who threaten and blackmail ordinary Australians to shut down the contest of ideas that has made our nation strong.” - An interesting allegation. If you have some actual knowledge of these activities please present it to the nearest law inforcement official.

“They have lost confidence in a government whose leader openly hectors ordinary Australians like me who rightfully and legally protest against the destruction of our economy” - Lowest ever unemployment levels, brilliant interest rates and the envy of countries that did not weather the GFC so well. By all means protest, but nobody is required by law to take you seriously.

On a final note, Labor went to the election with a carbon price. They catagorically stated they would not have a carbon tax. If you have trouble understanding the difference the internet is your friend.

pedantic penny says:

05:04pm | 23/07/11

@ChrisL.  If you have trouble with your spelling,  the dictionary is your friend.

Bloggs says:

08:47pm | 23/07/11

@ Chris L (spelling fixed)
“They have lost confidence in a government that can’t put pink batts in homes without killing people” - Garrett put in place two rafts of regulations to ensure safe installation. The tragic incidents that ensued were caused by businesses which ignored these regulations. Are you really blaming the government for that? [ By Bloggs - yes, it is indeed the Government’s fault. The regulations were useless, insufficient and no controls were put into place to enforce such. The ALP were the managers and they failed and in so doing, they killed people.  Accountability must lie with the ALP for those deaths].
“They have lost confidence in a government that can’t build school halls, toilet blocks and libraries at anything near the commercial rate.” - Every official report, whether critical or not, has concluded that the BER was successful. For one example you could Google the Orgill report. [ By Bloggs – Yes, those lovely ALP reports will always ignore the rorts that went on. The papers clearly reported the stuff-ups and ignoring them in official reports does not make them go away].
“They have lost confidence in a government that seeks to destroy the mining industry through punitive taxes like the MRRT.” - While we may debate the pros and cons of that proposal (I personally don’t see why super profits shouldn’t benefit our country) I do strongly doubt that the aim of the tax was to “destroy the mining industry”. This is an example of exaggerated hysteria. [ By Bloggs – Unintentionally or not, the result was always going to be the destruction of an industry. It was plain poor management, once again, by the ALP and the Greens. They are really manned by fools].
“They have lost confidence in a government that believes the pseudo science or “Xbox” models of the IPCC.” - At least some sort of science is involved. I understand that conservatives have some sort of inherent wisdom over science and economics that is unavailable to the rest of us. Therefore we must rely on humble scientific methods. [ By Bloggs – Your comment is just stupid BS. The science is not in. For every scientist with proof of climate change ( a name conveniently modified from Global Warming when they were caught out lying about that one) there are equally qualified and respected scientists with the opposite view. The AGW and CC debate is crap].
“They have lost confidence in a government that now seeks to partake in the live trade of humans to Malaysia, but will cut off the live beef export industry at the knees” - You may have a decent point there but it gets lost in the rhetoric. [ By Bloggs – yes, lost in ALP rhetoric].
more in next post

Bloggs says:

08:48pm | 23/07/11

2nd part

“They have lost confidence in a government which allows an extremist hard left political party to call the shots.” - That seems to be the outcome of the last election. I was very unhappy at the extremist hard right political party calling the shots in a previous government, but that’s democracy. [ By Bloggs – big difference you seem to have missed, the Howard Government won on their policies.  The Abbott led coalition polled better than the ALP in our last election – getting into bed with the Greens and their disgusting policies (I mean, have you actually read their web site? It’s full of garbage!) was not voted for and therefore democracy was not enacted, petty megalomaniac party politics was enacted].
“They have lost confidence in a government that bankrolls thugs like GetUp who threaten and blackmail ordinary Australians to shut down the contest of ideas that has made our nation strong.” - An interesting allegation. If you have some actual knowledge of these activities please present it to the nearest law enforcement official. [ By Bloggs – or you could just read the paper and the GetUp web site….].
“They have lost confidence in a government whose leader openly hectors ordinary Australians like me who rightfully and legally protest against the destruction of our economy” - Lowest ever unemployment levels, brilliant interest rates and the envy of countries that did not weather the GFC so well. By all means protest, but nobody is required by law to take you seriously. [By Bloggs – and nobody is required by law to take GetUp, the ALP, the Greens or you seriously either.  The legacy of the Howard years has stood Rudd and Gillard well. But have you actually looked at the current rate of debt that Australia is getting into with the Government? It ain’t pretty and will take another Lib Government to fix it once again}.
On a final note, Labor went to the election with a carbon price. They categorically stated they would not have a carbon tax. If you have trouble understanding the difference the internet is your friend. [ By Bloggs - The use of the term price vs tax is moot.  The term has been changed to attempt to pull the wool over the taxpayer eyes but the items is the same.  The Government has broken the confidence of the people with this initiative of a carbon (really CO2 and not carbon) tax/price.  If YOU cannot see the difference that that explains why you support this crap and stupid government].

Leo says:

10:09pm | 23/07/11

David, while stating it, you seem to miss the point you yourself make. That this is not just a minority government - not representing the majority - but its also led by a PM & Treasurer who lied to the public over what has become a central policy issue. A mandate means that you have the confidence and support of the public. The polls show some 3 in 4 people do not support the governments position. Your view seems to reflect that of the government, not seeing the headlight of the oncoming train.

Chris L says:

11:17pm | 23/07/11

@Pedantic Penny, thank you. I shall remember that.

@Bloggs, fair enough. Thank you for sharing your viewpoint, and I’d like to thank Thumbnail as well. Robust debate is a healthy thing. I do still disagree with you both on pretty much every point raised but shall leave it there rather than butt horns to no end.

Lisa H. says:

01:52pm | 24/07/11

I cannot believe that Labour is still trying to blame ‘business’ for the pink batt deaths!

Established insulation industry business people warned the government that there were risks involved in the plan - and were written off as ‘vested interests’.

The government’s own bureaucracy warned that more time was needed to manage this scheme safely.

Shonks and spivs - not ‘businesses’ - were specifically attracted into the industry by the deliberate haste and ‘buckets of money’ approach of the government, because speed was central to the scheme (the GFC spend-a-thon…remember?)

The government was advised that current industry players would not be able to roll out the scheme in the time frame intended…and the government was happy for that, remember?

Established businesses went bust due to the sudden cessation of forward demand, the sudden deluge of new players, and the aggressive undercutting encouraged by the government policy!

Dennis says:

10:17pm | 03/08/11

Mate your mate Julia told all of Australia there would be no carbon tax in the lead up to that election. We trusted her now she has broken that trust. The Government has to go.

sir ronald bradnam says:

10:39am | 23/07/11

Compensate farmers for their cattle, compensate farmers if there is a drought, compensate farmers if the wheat board stuffs up, compensate farmers if it is to wet, Im sick of compensation to anyone when things are tough especially with my money. All workers, businesses, business owners contribute in their own way to this economy and it is time all businesses stood on there own two feet without the need for subsidies and handouts when things go wrong. The gov has attacked and descimated my industry and through policy changes passed business to several major players and reduced competition but not once have I expected the gov to pay or compensate me, I just need to get smarter and better at what i do.

Mattb says:

11:40am | 23/07/11

Couldn’t have put it better myself sir Ronald, unfortunately we’ve all been reduced to a pack of babies suckling at the teat of government welfare, individuals and corporations alike….

ZSRenn says:

12:06pm | 23/07/11

@ ronald

Your a Kiwi if you want compensation
from your government go back home!

Don’t tell us how we should run Australia.

Mattb says:

12:44pm | 23/07/11

Renny, um, ya better read sir ronalds comment again, then go get some sause from your fridge, might make that foot in your mouth taste better.

Mattb says:

12:44pm | 23/07/11

Renny, um, ya better read sir ronalds comment again, then go get some sause from your fridge, might make that foot in your mouth taste better.

Steve says:

02:05pm | 23/07/11

St Peter. It is an open and shut case for me. With a half decent legal team the class action should just be about how much compensation rather if compensation. The Goverment halts all exports of a legal trade
even though the majority of the animals were being slaughtered within international regulations for developing countries. But the killer is - they are not our cattle. Once loaded on that ship they are Indonesian cattle to do with as they like.

Sir ronald whilst I actually agree with most of what you say each situation should be judged on its own merits rather than a blanket immunity to compensation claims for the Govt.  Of course I would be very interested to learn about your industry and how it has been affected by government negligence. (Note Govt negligence rather tahn Govt actions)

sir ronald bradnam says:

02:17pm | 23/07/11

@ZSRenn AKA(the Zealot Stalker)...just a bit of background for commenters, ZSrenn takes exception to my views on the non existance of an almighty sky fairy and when he ran out of conerent and incoherent responses to my opinions chose to search the web for my identity, after trawling through 100s of posts he put together a 1/4 picture of my identity and now drops in on any comments and posts idiotic little rants like the one above without reading what I actually wrote.
It is quite obvious to anyone who can read that I dont support any subsidies so where you get that idea from im not quite sure.
Yes I am a kiwi but also an australian and NZ citizen who contributes to the economy through Tax and wages paid to staff that one of our businesses employs, so I feel more than capable of putting forward my opinions on what i believe the gov and our ordinary pollies are doing.
As always with all your comments think them through thoroughly and read the posts you are commenting on rather than just ranting and raving because my views on sky fairies differs to yours.

Chris L says:

04:32pm | 23/07/11

Ronald, I consider you less than diplomatic, many times being unduly harsh, but I fully endorse all people (even kiwis) in expressing their views.

I have somewhat less respect for ZSRenn from the experience of having read many of his/her posts previously. So much for kinder, gentler politics (who the hell said that anyway?!)

one passport says:

04:48pm | 23/07/11

@sir ronald bradnam.  A 3-sentence post doesn’t equal a rant.  You’re looking like the ranter.
Dual-citizenship?  That allows you opinion x 2 ?

@Mattb.  Your post x2 =  “sause” x 2.  Year 3 spelling.

That’s all

sir ronald bradnam says:

05:16pm | 23/07/11

@one pisspot…if all you can do is correct spelling then you have a sad little life.

Me, harsh, never

sylvie says:

05:19pm | 23/07/11

ZSRenn put together 1/4 picture of an identity??
No one cares that much, Mr R B

Is this a Kiwi thing?

sylvie says:

06:59pm | 23/07/11

Isn’t that cute -  the way Mattb and sir ronald b are defending each other’s posts.

What could it possibly mean

Not your classroom says:

07:53pm | 23/07/11

ron bradnam: .... “As always with all your posts think them through thoroughly and read the posts you are commenting on ..........”.    Hahahahaha.
This sounds like a pre-exam instruction.
Some of you old men are still back in the classroom!  LOL

You know what you can do with your instruction,  don’t you

Jim McG says:

08:19pm | 23/07/11

ronald bradnam, kiwi knight
You should be busy running your businesses,  not wasting time posting comments on Punch. 
Old Mate makes time to give other punchers “some background”.  LMAO

sir ronald bradnam says:

08:59am | 25/07/11

F… M. why is it people get so far of the subject.

Not happy Julia says:

09:53am | 23/07/11

Followed by stealing money with (many) other lies

Mattb says:

12:39pm | 23/07/11

FFS, this ‘she lied, she lied’ crap is getting old. I dont mind the fact that your obviously a one eyed liberal party supporter, thats your decision, but please dont make a fool of yourself right now and tell me you think Tony Abbott doesn’t lie. Here’s a couple of examples right here for you to chew on-

1. ‘my wife, Maggie, and I feel the pressures of costs of living increases’
(from the first few sentences of TA’s budget reply speech this year)

Please, the man takes home a salary of how much?, and he expects us to believe this bullshit

2. His constant backflips over the AGW issue and his policy. He came out this week stating “China will be increasing it’s emissions by 500%, making anything we do in Australia pointless”. Then we have his ‘climate science is crap’ argument to one audience, and his ‘the science is settled, we need to act’ argument to another audience.

Well Tony, why have you got a policy then, ya moron?

3. “The Australian economy is going to collapse under a carbon tax, the coal and steel industries will shut up shop”

Utter bullshit Tony, and you know it.

I could go on for hours providing examples but you get the idea, plus on top of everything, the man has admitted to the fact that anything he says that isn’t scripted can’t be taken as the gospel truth. In other words it’s either an exaggeration or a LIE.
The man is a compulsive liar, Julia gillard is one too, as was John Howard, Paul keating and every other politician this country has ever had. Only a fool would believe what they say before an election, during an election, after an election and whether they are in government or opposition.

Are you a fool?....

For me, accepting the fact that pollies are lying to me is like water of a ducks back, who cares, they all do it. What I can’t stand for is the fact that Australia’s economy is strong at a time when most of the wests economies are struggling and Tony Abbott is traveling the country talking the economy down for his own political gain. This is an incredibly selfish and irresponsible thing for someone who is meant to be a political leader to be doing. The liberal party leaders of the past have had successful records as economic managers of this country, Tony Abbott posseses none of their leadership qualities. The man is a fraud.

Glen says:

03:19pm | 23/07/11

Ooohhh Matty B, Labor not polling to well hey?

>:D

Chris L says:

04:43pm | 23/07/11

“I don’t rule out the possibility of legislating a Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme, a market-based mechanism,” she said of the next parliament. “I rule out a carbon tax.”

Kinda reads differently when you don’t cut out three quarters of the quote. Simply put, she left open the possibility of a carbon price and that’s exactly what we’re getting. If you misinterpreted her I don’t see how that’s her problem.

I will not be voting Labor as long as internet censorship remains a possibility, but I’m not going to twist words or lie in my opposition. How about we get real?

Adam Diver says:

04:55pm | 23/07/11

@ mattb, only a fool would think that all lies are created equal.

Anyway you miss the point, its a protest so that futue politicians don’t lie to steal an election. I would imagine even the libs we be very careful to not overpromise at the next election

one passport says:

05:14pm | 23/07/11

@ronald bradnam.  Here’s a rant for you -  Mattb’s given a great example

sylvie says:

05:30pm | 23/07/11

@Chris L.  A lot of people weren’t as switched on as you, and misinterpreted Julia Gillard?
It’s awkward for her - poor Julia.  Perhaps she could’ve said “There will be no carbon tax….....but you’ll still pay!”.  Kept it simple?

See, either way,  I don’t want to be taxed. 
Only natural, isn’t it.

Glen says:

05:42pm | 23/07/11

@Chris L - didn’t I set you straight on the whole tax/price thing last week?

A price can be a tax. You aren’t getting anything in return.

Chris L says:

11:26pm | 23/07/11

Fair enough Glen. If you put tax and price under the same definition (and that’s perfectly reasonable in this case) you would surely have wondered why she said no to one and yes to the other before the election.

Personally I’m not overly bothered. I have little interest in either of the major parties at the moment so don’t think I’m trying to influence your vote. I just think it was pretty plain that a Labor victory would mean a carbon price.

jf says:

11:39am | 24/07/11

“Please, the man takes home a salary of how much?, and he expects us to believe this bullshit”

You don’t know anything about him or his family. Regardless of his financial circumstances, any single income family supported by a soul wage earner are going to feel cost of living pressures. The fact that his family is feeling the cost of living pressures even though his income is higher than the average shows just how great the cost of living pressure is.

“Well Tony, why have you got a policy then”

He does need to get a handle on this. However, it is a complex, complicated issue with the science very uncertain. Only this week the climate scientists conceded that they had over-egged the omelette (yet again) in predicting the consequence of climate change on the Great Barrier Reef. Add to that the extreme price we need to pay if the AGW alarmists are right and you have an extremely complex issue that is important to get right.

““The Australian economy is going to collapse under a carbon tax, the coal and steel industries will shut up shop” Utter bullshit Tony, and you know it.”

Do you know it? Whitlam’s Government undermined our economy for over a decade. This government is even worse and has had longer to be bad. That is why this tax is so unanimously opposed. It is a tragedy for this country.

So, got any actual examples of actual lies?

Not gilding the lily or exaggerating. An example of a real lie would be “I have more chance of playing full forward for the Bulldogs than challenging Kevin Rudd” or “there will be no carbon tax under a government I lead”. No hyperbole or exaggeration there. Bold, black and white statements. Got any mate?

“Australia’s economy is strong at a time when most of the wests economies are struggling”

Spoken to any business people lately? What you meant to say of course is “after the legacy of the previous government and the luck of the draw when it comes to natural resources, Australia’s economy should be strong at a time when most of the wests economies are struggling, however because of this lacklustre government those massive advantages are being wasted”.

Peter says:

09:10am | 25/07/11

What a mob of whimps in this Green Government , I bet they went crying to Mum when other kids took their teddy bears. The media (especially the ABC ‘s chasers who seem to be disbanded since Labors victory) crucified Howard and the coalition in 2007. I didn’t hear any continuing cry from the coalition for a media inquiry they took it all as a normal occurrence. They are great at shoveling crap but can take when it thrown their way. How ofter do we hear about the Young Liberals did this and did that and very very seldom does the words young Labor in blogs.

mark barter says:

11:41pm | 06/08/11

@mattb. I actually voted for Julia based on her promise. I’m not one of your Liberal foes. If a person can blatantly lie to grab power, can ignore the will of the people she is supposed to represent just to force everyone to do her will, can send her soldiers into our schools to trauamatise our children with their lies, can standby while a group that was founded by one of her ministers blackmails retailers, can refuse to debate, can threaten to suppress any media that doesn’t support her, can imply support, by her silence, of Bob Browns desire to force us into a one world government against our will once again, can knowingly feed us false information to con us into believing her lies, can borrow in the vicinity of 100m a day whilst giving the UN 600m to tackle a non existent problem whilst real problems here are ignored, can try to force the Federal Magistrates Court to merge with the Family Law Courts so that the UN can tell them what laws to make, can stand in front of camera after camera telling us that this is what we want despite every poll in the country telling her that we don’t, can support Bob Brown’s fervent desire to shut down our coal industry, can shutdown the live export industry, can spend millions of our money to tell us the benefits of a tax that we have told her we don’t want or need and then put a disclaimer in the publication that they don’t endorse the same information that they want us to believe, can only listen to scientists that are on the government’s payroll, and many other stuff ups too numerous to go into here, then, yes, they need to be reminded daily how they have betrayed the very democracy that gave them everything they have today. If you cannot see that Julia’s sole aim is to force us into a communist regime against our will, then I suggest you get a few history books and do some homework. I suugest maybe books on Stalin, Hitler,in fact any dictator throughout history, they have all used the very same tacticsd that this traitor is using now. After reading all this, if you still believe we should let her get away with the deliberate destruction of our society, may I suggest a one way ticket to China, Russia or maybe even North Korea. You could take Julia with you. I’m sure you’ll find less opposition to that form of government over there than you will here because we are determined to save our democracy. The same democracy our fathers and grandfathers fought and died for and I for one am not going to betray their sacrifices just so Julia can achieve what 2 world wars couldn’t. So if that means continually reminding everybody of the gross lie so used to get into the position she is in today, poised, ready to demolish democracy, then so be it. I will dutifully remind everyone everyday of her deceit because I love our democracy and I’m not going to let her destroy it for her own selfish ideals.

mark barter says:

11:46pm | 06/08/11

@mattb. One other thing that is lost in all her deceit, you can tax the world until there is n money left anywhere but, while the Sun is still in the sky, the climate will still change, it will still get hotter and it will still get colder. NO tax on the planet can stop the Sun

DragonLass says:

05:41pm | 23/07/11

Ummm… the policy is anything BUT poll driven!  The polling is mostly against it, however Julia pushes on with it because she believes it is the right thing to for the future of our country.
If you are going to bash her, as is your right, please at least get your argument straight first.

Against the Man says:

06:00pm | 23/07/11

DragonLass - Do you really think she is doing it because she believes it is for the best future of our country or because she is selling us out to Bob Brown to remain in power?

She promised no carbon tax before the election and I don’t know of any of her passionate/outspoken views on this issue before the last election.

That just the way me and the majority of the Australian public see it.

DragonLass says:

08:29pm | 23/07/11

Julia ALWAYS wanted to have an ETS in Australia.
When she became PM of a minority government, she has had to make some concessions in order to make this a reality.  One of these concessions was to have a temporary carbon pricing scheme on the way towards a full blown ETS.  This is part of the reality of running a minority goverment.

Against the Man says:

08:52pm | 23/07/11

Dragonlass, somehow I’m not buying it. If she was really all about a ETS and the carbon price was a stepping stone to it, she should be able to sell her policy and be on top of the polls. It is either she has no real policy to sell (and making it up as she goes along) or she doesn’t understand how to deliver the policy to the people.

Using the minority government as a scape goat is no excuse. People wouldn’t tolerate that from Abbott so why would they do so for Juliar.

The polls and the current climate of anger, frustration and hate clearly show us that Juliar has screwed up yet again. She has yet to come up with a fantastic policy and this is someone who has been in government since 2007. I’m just enjoying watching her dig herself an even bigger hole with the Malaysian ‘solution’. Oh and we have all excepted that the health care reform policies will never be delivered or if it does the Australian people better make sure they are all well lubed for this policy’s mega screw job.

People don’t trust and don’t care about Juliar and no matter what she does she is as finished as last night’s jigsaw puzzle!

But we all can have our views and mine are reflected through the majority.

Dr B S Goh, Australian in Asia says:

08:54pm | 23/07/11

@ DragonLass says: 05:41pm

Yes please do a simple cost benefit analysis and show to all of us by how much will the carbon tax reduce the annual GLOBAL CO2 emission.

Explain to us how this carbon tax will make a significant difference in the fight against global warming.

If the eventual policy within three years is to have an ETS scheme why not have a CHEAP ETS scheme right NOW. That is what India and China wants to experiment with on small scale at about $1 a ton.

Why must we be heros and start at $23 a ton?? What benefit is that to us as a nation other than to please the Greens and some bleeding hearts.

TimB says:

09:39pm | 23/07/11

Hey Dragolass, that may be, BUT she also said she would get a consensus on the issue FIRST. Remember the people’s assembly?

Julia wasn’t even going to look at the issue again until 2012 with a policy to be taken to the election in 2013. THAT was her promise. Which part of what she has done even remotely resembles that?

The people were lied to. And they’re angry. The sooner Julia, and all her hardcore supporters like yourself realise this, the sooner you can start dealing with the issue properly instead of riding roughshod over the majority will.

RyaN says:

05:09pm | 24/07/11

@DragonLass: “Julia ALWAYS wanted to have an ETS in Australia.”
“There will be no carbon tax under a government I lead”. Doesn’t sound like she wanted to have a carbon tax (the same thing as a price on carbon).

Didn’t she stab Kevin Rudd in the back over an ETS? I am sure he was polling a whole bunch better then than she is now.

No I would say she is a lying megalomaniac who has shown us that she would do just about anything for power.

Erick says:

10:05am | 23/07/11

Tea is better than Kool-Aid.

Martin says:

10:48am | 23/07/11

Oh, I see because it is not a tree huggers protest, they must be village idiots. Well thought out , Steven back to your latte.

David S says:

10:00am | 23/07/11

It sounds like the organisers wish a respectful protest and that’s to be applauded.

The problem in calling for an election without explaining what policies the protest organisers believe justify an election simply leaves a vacuum open for anyone to jump in and claim the protest as their own.  Ordinary people should expect good and respectful government as you say but the thinking behind the convoy seems to be:

1. We truckies are upset because ???????
2. Organize a convoy
3. Call for an election

Everyone has a perfectly legitimate right to protest, but without explaining what the ??????? is, we are still scratching our heads wondering what it’s all about.

Gregg says:

10:35am | 23/07/11

@David
??????????, and yep many questions over this government and just re-read the article and any links or just keep up with the news about the ineptness and betrayals on many fronts.

LisaH. says:

11:25am | 23/07/11

I don’t really understand your argument Dave.
Relationships with governments are very personal…everyone has a slightly different opinion.
The truckies are calling for what a million people in Australia are thinking… an early election.
Sounds like a pretty clear protest policy to me.
As for the details of what the incumbent government has gotten wrong, or should put right… that is for a populace to decide, isn’t it?
Via an election.

scotty says:

12:11pm | 23/07/11

“without explaining what the ??????? is”

David - Carbon Tax, I’d have thought that was patently clear

Julia lied to win the election, now she wants to tax us without a mandate - the people (not just truckies) are saying ‘get a mandate for the carbon tax’.

We would have had the same protests if Howard didn’t take the GST to the election and get a mandate.

David S says:

03:56pm | 23/07/11

To clarify:
De beers message communicated a concern regarding those wishing to discredit the convoy.
My advice is:  Clearly state the convoy’s objectives.  Attempts to discredit the convoy will not be credible and can be immediately dismissed.
Be clear on your concerns otherwise your convoy risks being hijacked by any fringe group that has an argument with the Gillard government.

The Badger says:

04:48pm | 23/07/11

David S
Fringe group?
You mean like the right wing of the NOposition party?

You know, the ones that took over the huge rally of 1000 in Canberra?
Among the supporters at the rally were those calling for a royal commission into the 1966 disappearance of the Beaumont children, opponents of John Howard’s gun laws and a mob alleging the carbon tax was wrapped up with a United Nations and International Monetary Fund genocide conspiracy. Loony stuff indeed.

The Young Liberals, DLP, Climate Skeptics, the National Civic Council and the Conservative Action Network and One Nation people who were the core of the 1000 person rally will be the core of this one as well.
Loony stuff indeed.

John Mikkelsen says:

09:51am | 23/07/11

Er, have you, Chongy and co seen the opinion polls lately? I think a lot of the PM’s growing problems and electoral disenchantment stem from a clear promise just before the last election, and a recent admission she didn’t mean to lie but was pressured by the Greens to change her mind. Did Australians vote for a Green or Brown Prime Minister - don’t think so.

fox says:

09:52am | 23/07/11

Martin Hopes that the Australian people will all somehow magically forget that Gillard won the 2010 election based on an outright lie.

Wishful thinking.

Erick says:

09:57am | 23/07/11

@Martin Hopes - Did you say exactly the same thing to all the people who protested against the democratically elected Howard Government?

TimB says:

10:05am | 23/07/11

And now the people have decided they want a chance to vote differently.

Is that your version of democracy? Only listening to the people at certain times or when it suits you?

Ruth Bonnett says:

10:15am | 23/07/11

Martin,
A hung parliament is hardly a stable form of government.  A peaceful protest is part of our democracy too.
The government is there to do the will of the people.  Lying to the electorate is not the best way to carry out the responsibilities of being a Prime Minister.
I see you take your lead from a PM who thinks it is acceptable to use ad hominem attacks on ordinary Australians who just want common sense good governance.
I would like to see a democratic mechanism for just this situation: where a government has lost the confidence of the people.  Perhaps a mechanism such as Switzerland’s popular initiative would work to resolve these rare situations. 
Instead of launching broadside personal attacks, perhaps, Martin you would like to share your views on direct democracy and the role of peaceful protest as part of democracy rather than smearing the messenger.

Steve Putnam says:

10:36am | 23/07/11

@John Mikkelsen Where were all you pugnacious champions of people’s democracy when the Howard Government dragged this country into a foreign war based on lies about weapons of mass destruction? Did you join the millions of people that took to the streets in protest all over Australia, or do you this sort of thing only when conservatives are in opposition?

Martin Hopes says:

10:57am | 23/07/11

We don’t have elections based on opinion polls John.

Erick, people have a right to protest but that does not mean we go to an election every time we disagree with certain legislation. We will have another election in 2013 and the people can then decide what government they want.

Rubbish TimB…We have set terms for elections, we don’t just go to elections at the whim of conservative voters who still can’t come to grips with being in oppositions.

Until Abbott can give the people policy choice then another election would be a total waste of time, he can’t go to an election just saying *no*.  No doubt come 2013, he will present us with well costed policies, offering us a choice, until then suck it up.

TimB says:

11:54am | 23/07/11

We’re talking 70%+ of the electorate Martin. How can you just ignore that?

More to the point, many of those people were people who voted for Gillard, did so because she assured them there would be no tax. She won that election off a lie. So if Gillard can change *her* mind, why can’t the voters change theirs? Why is Gillard allowed to do it instantly and the voters have to wait three years?

If Gillard is going to make a mockery of democracy, you can’t use it as an excuse for your minority view to cling to power.

scotty says:

12:15pm | 23/07/11

And when are leftys like yourself Martin going to accept that Gillard does not have a mandate for the carbon tax?

She and Swan specifically ruled it out on a number of occasions just prior to the election - they do NOT have a mandate.

We don’t live in places you mentioned like Zimbabwe, where leaders can do whatever they want - we live in a democracy

The Rock says:

10:05pm | 23/07/11

@Scotty

When are conservatives going to stop using the word “mandate” as if it actually means something?

The ALP and independents have a mandate to govern by virtue of holding enough seats to form government.

Want a mandate, win an election.

Tator says:

12:08am | 24/07/11

Martin Hopes,
in the Federal electoral system, there are no “fixed terms”.
According to http://www.aph.gov.au/library/Pubs/rp/2003-04/04rp02.htm#national
“Because the current House of Representatives term is for maximum terms only, and because of the convention that Prime Ministers can call elections virtually whenever they choose, the 38 completed parliaments have had terms of greatly varying length. It is not always appreciated that House of Representatives elections can actually be held further apart than three years. The three-year clock begins at the first post-election meeting of the House, which need not be held for up to 30 days from the day appointed for the return of the electoral writs. At the expiry of a House, the electoral writs need not be issued for up to 10 days, and their return is required within a 100 day period. All of this means that there is no constitutional barrier to an election being held more than three years after the previous election. There have, in fact, been ten such occasions, most recently in 2001”

stevem says:

07:23pm | 24/07/11

Steve Putnam, I’m sick of Labor supporters claiming some sort of moral high ground over a “foreign war based on lies about weapons of mass destruction”. Get your facts right, just once.

Before the war, on 15 October 2002,  Rudd said: “Saddam Hussein possesses weapons of mass destruction”. Then in December 2003 Rudd said “the Americans and Brits are privately pissed off with John Howard because he has been quietly seeking to exit the field”.

So, you see, BOTH sides supported the war. Yes the Liberals were the ones to issue the order, but Labor supported the action. When it seemed the government wanted to back out Rudd laid in the boot into Howard for suggesting a withdrawal. Hindsight shows us that Hussein was a lunatic playing brinkmanship with an empty arsenal and that the foundations were not there, but don’t try and rewrite history.

Steve Putnam says:

08:30pm | 25/07/11

@Stevem The important difference is that the ALP were always opposed to sending troops to Iraq. The Liberals just unthinkingly went all the way with GWB.

Joan says:

10:19am | 23/07/11

The people in burbs and country towns are rumbling,  not just trucks of industry. The people in burbs want a vote on this Carbon Tax foisted on them, people duped by Gillard No Carbon Tax lie this time last year…. are rumbling all right- they want an election now. The people don’t want $25million of their hard earned taxes spent on dodgey adverts to excuse and justify Gillard No Carbon Tax lie. Is Gillard so deaf she can’t hear the voice of people of Australia?

No 1 Rosie says:

11:32am | 23/07/11

Now this is the real Joan and not the The Badger The Harass playing his silly duplicity harassing game.

Yes Joan it is happening and happening fast, the vast majority have had enough of this nonsense and the worst Govt in Australia’s political history pretending to govern.

Old number 10 says:

12:18pm | 23/07/11

Just love the sound of conservative squealing on a Saturday morning.
Wouldn’t be Saturday without the little piggies crying out for a feed at the public trough. And to think, there are years more entertainment to come from these indignant little piggies.

Martin Hopes says:

12:45pm | 23/07/11

Rosie and Joan - You will get your election sometime in 2013…until then, build a bridge and get over it.

Conservatives rant on about democracy but it is the conservative’s themselves that want to trash the democracy we now have, which I might add has worked fine since federation.

If you both really want to have a bitch about democracy, go and live in China.

Enjoy your tea-party ladies!

No 1 Rosie says:

02:13pm | 23/07/11

Martin Hopes

It is our democratic right to demand for an election when ever we want if we feel we need to get rid of a NOnothing Govt wasting away our hard earned $$$$ and have nothing to show for.

Why for the life of me do we have to move to China when China is trying to give its people the same living standards we enjoy here? Your thinking doesn’t make any sense.

Joan says:

02:37pm | 23/07/11

China running rings around Australia , turning Australia into an empty quarry, while Gillard slugs Australians with a carbon tax on everything, Gillard on track to turn out lights in Australia and send the last of worthwhile jobs off to China.  Guess your right . Martin Hope China will be the place to be , now the Gillard has stuck her boot into Australia and is deadset on destrotying Australia with her Carbon Tax.

not old says:

05:47pm | 23/07/11

@Old boar,  you’ve got your Christine Milne and Lee Rhiannon pictures up on the wall?  Gorgeous?

Enjoy

scotty says:

12:16pm | 23/07/11

It’s certainly succeeded in changing the political climate

TimB says:

10:06am | 23/07/11

Not true at all.

Everything she says and does these days helps to unite the country more strongly- Against her

David S says:

04:51am | 24/07/11

Stromboli - do you mean Svengali?

I do like stromboli from time to time - goes wonderfully well with fava beans and a little chianti.  It would be a pity to see us rid of it.

St Peter says:

10:23am | 23/07/11

Dear Doctor Do you know how to count? Start learning to count by counting the number of fingers on your hands.

No 1 Rosie says:

12:39pm | 23/07/11

Yes Doctor we had an election 12 months ago with a different PM to the one that was elected by the people for the people.

Today, that elected PM is going to the Doctor for surgery and wish him and his family all the best. Literally it is a major surgery which he needs to have done but to those of us with long memories that can look at it with a sense of humour will say “our elected PM Rudd is having surgery for a piece of steel blade remaining in his back after his brutal political assassination by a handful of thugs 12 months ago.

Good Luck to Mr Rudd, the Polls told him it was time to forgive and forget the selfish brutes and work towards re-building the Labor brand that people like him are so passionate about - the real Labor people.

Joan says:

08:26pm | 24/07/11

@Rosie

Wrong in every way.

We don’t elect Prime Ministers in Australia. Are you the only person in Australia who still doesn’t understand the Westminster system of democracy?

And even if we did, Julia Gillard was the Prime Minister at the last election. You lot lost, remember?

Andrew says:

12:37pm | 23/07/11

that’s right chris, only Getup are allowed to stage protests in favour of the Gillard Green Government.

Chucky says:

12:01pm | 23/07/11

inorite

What on gaia are these members of a democractic country think they are doing expressing their dissatisfaction with what they see as poor government through non-violent protest.

Break out the rubbers bullets and tear gas imo that’ll make em respect democracy.

michael j says:

08:27pm | 23/07/11

NAH , tear gas aint any problem lesem the army usees a chepa brand ,i quite enjoyed my stint in the gas tent ,,RUBBER BULLETS thats an olde 10 cc song i don’t think any forces police or army have them ,,i mean if they did why would they on occasion shoot dead people who might be threatening them with grandmas old butter knife,
no i m fairdinkum these blokes better pick up a back-load or they are fair-dinknum mugs,,the only way out of this current mess is to,,,,,,mmmmmm there is no way out ,

Brutus says:

11:47am | 23/07/11

What are you talking about?
Works a treat here.
What’s your problem? Mad because we don’t have a right wing mob taking your money?
Suck it up princess. It’s called democracy

scotty says:

12:19pm | 23/07/11

“When there is a hung Parliament we should have to go back to an election and recast our votes.”

Disagree Julius - minority governments are fine as long as they respect the mandate the electorate gave them.  Julia hasn’t

nossy says:

12:07pm | 23/07/11

@The Badger   - still in there swinging for Gillard Badge - honestly fella shes toast!

The Badger says:

01:25pm | 23/07/11

nossy me old mate
How you going with the key to those pearly gates? I see Rosie is cuddling up to you now that you’re on the side of big business.

I thought you knew me better nossy. I don’t support labor, I don’t like conservatives and their big end of town mates.
Think of it along the lines of sports fans that will support any team that is playing against Collingwood or Manchester United.

nossy says:

05:54pm | 23/07/11

@The Badger - not to mention the angst you cause NicoleG Badge!  I think she wants your guts for garters fella!  hahahahha

jf says:

11:52am | 24/07/11

The Badger says:01:25pm | 23/07/11

“I don’t like conservatives and their big end of town mates. Think of it along the lines of sports fans that will support any team that is playing against Collingwood or Manchester United.”

Ah, so this has nothing to do with policy, economics or even science. This is just “who you are”. Your persona, your bag if you like. Jolly good; by all means where your beret to the refec and smoke roll your owns on the lawn if it will help you pull those dopey hippy chicks but leave the political commentary to the big kids.

Tutti Fruitti says:

12:07pm | 24/07/11

Might be amusing to hear what a tired old Labor (forward??) thinking person deems to be newsworthy.
The welfare of our Australia is very important.  Country and city people are equally capable of valuable contributions to society.
Not sure about ‘Badge’ though.

The Badger says:

01:01pm | 24/07/11

jf
How nice of you to take an interest in my political ideology.
Oh and thanks for verifying what I thought all along, that you and your conservative mates on this site are just big kids.
Well Done.

No need to apologise for your persona, your bag if you like. Jolly good; by all means WEAR your bowler hat from the old country to the refec and chomp on your big fat phallic Cuban’s in the members lounge if it will help you pull those dopey vacuous private school slags, but leave the political commentary to the journalists who still understand ethics and the value of truth. Me, I’ll just tell you what I think.

jf says:

03:43pm | 24/07/11

The Badger says:
01:01pm | 24/07/11
“How nice of you to take an interest in my political ideology.”

Or lack thereof. From your comments here and elsewhere you have no ideology just swing with whatever is hip and stylin’ at the moment. Vacuous, though-bubble policies that achieve nothing other than boost your own image regardless of any unintended negative consequences. Regardless of the fact that desperate people have to die for the irresponsible border policies that make you look compassionate. Regardless of the people who died and lost their homes and business when Brisbane flooded because Hinze Dam was to full because it was never going to rain again. Regardless of the people who can’t get medical treatment because billions that could have been spent on Health is wasted on inefficiency and mismanagement. Regardless of the people who died installing pink bats because the planet was over-heating due to AGW (conveniently ignoring the fact that GW has been going on for millenium). None of that matters just as long as you can puff out your chest and tell people how progressive you are and what swell person you are.

“Oh and thanks for verifying what I thought all along, that you and your conservative mates on this site are just big kids.”

The best you can come up with is “I am rubber you are glue”? Oh dear.

“No need to apologise for your persona, your bag if you like.”

Oh I’m not apologising. I had my bleeding heart phase when I was at school and Uni. Back then I thought it was all so easy – fair meant equal and the government had an endless money tree. I gave my share of ban the bomb, end poverty now speeches and presentations. It was all so easy when I could come up with magical solutions fearlessly regardless of any responsibility or accountability. Oh I was so clever as I lectured my self-employed father as he struggled to run a business, keep his staff occupied and somehow squeeze in footy coaching after starting work at 6am on Saturday morning. But then I grew up; went into the workforce and realised that it isn’t quite as easy as I thought. That the money had to come from somewhere. That if we punished those that produced things and employed people that they’d stop doing it and then we’d all be in the shit.

“WEAR your bowler hat from the old country to the refec and chomp on your big fat phallic Cuban’s in the members lounge”

Nice own goal there Badgey old mate. The caricature we paint of the left is based on reality. The loony left really are loony. They really have become intellectual elites who expect us commoners to accept their World Order without question. To accept their pronouncements because they are our intellectual superiors. The conservatives of 2011 are not even close to the picture that you paint rendering your parody not only ridiculous but irrelevant. The conservatives are now tradesmen, employees, women, old and young, Roman Catholics, Muslims, atheists and even union members. That you fail to recognise this is why the Labor Party has ceased to be relevant to its traditional heartland. It has failed union members as union delegates increasingly use their fees to pay for their political ambitions. It has lost the tradie who is now increasingly self-employed and recognise that the ALP won’t support them when they step out of PAYE and dare to aspire to take a risk and build their personal wealth. It has lost the Irish and Italian Catholics and immigrants because it is no longer about a fair go but about punishing anyone who wants to build a business and a life.

The Badger says:

05:28pm | 24/07/11

Excellent
I love how I make the conservatives foam at the mouth when I hit a nerve.
Squeal some more jf.
It’s music to my ears.

melle says:

05:36pm | 24/07/11

@jf,  Poor old Badger.  He’s got a bloody nose and two black eyes.

He had it coming

jf says:

06:07pm | 24/07/11

The Badger says:05:28pm | 24/07/11
“I love how I make the conservatives foam at the mouth when I hit a nerve.”

Just because you wish it doesn’t make it so old chum.

Gillard - lowest preferred PM ratings of any PM or opposition leader ever and by a big margin.

Gillard showing lostest support as a local member of any sitting PM.

You just keep on telling yourself your getting traction Badger and it may stave of your descent into madness by a day or two.

Me, I’ll just sit tight for the next two years content that the electorate’s collective memory will not let a federal Labor government in for a very, very, very, very long time. So long that I expect that the next Labor PM may not have even started school yet. Happy, happy days.

mel r says:

07:18pm | 24/07/11

@The Badger,  “vacuous private school slags”??

The same commenter says:  ” I would have WENT…..”.
Public, private -  you sound like an uneducated twerp.

de beers says:

01:38pm | 23/07/11

nossy, your commodore will not look out of place. This isn’t just a trucking industry protest; this is for all Aussies sick of one stuff up after the other from this present Government. All modes of legal transport will be welcomed.

Martin says:

01:41pm | 23/07/11

B dubble,  you are right, honestly, how can union leaders come out and support this tax and moreover support their beloved Labor party being completely brought undone by the Greens.  The rumblings are increasing and there’s more talk of say Crean having a go, which will probably mean “get stuffed” to the Greens, giving Labor a chance of winning back some pride and some support.

Shooters & Fishers says:

01:57pm | 23/07/11

B Bubble mate I work on the Docks and get paid hell of money because of my union. I dont give a rats who they support as long as they keep me well paid. Shooters & Fishers thanks to them I can now hunt in NSW.

Cam says:

06:23pm | 23/07/11

‘I WORK on the Docks’ .... perhaps the most hilarious statement I’ve ever read. Know a retired wharfie who proudly tells of how he and his cohorts would regularly steal from shipments. Even more proudly spouts on about his bed that he had made up to sleep throughout his shifts. And has his million sitting in an account that barely earns anything so he can still get his part pension so he gets his pensioner rebates. Nothing but bloody sucking parasites.

Cloud Strife says:

06:35pm | 23/07/11

@Cam

I guess it depends on which company you work for, a friend of mine was on night shift at the docks until about three years ago. They were very tight on security and matching manifests, and if you took anything you weren’t supposed to, you were invariable caught and fired, and the police were brought in as well.

Maybe they were a very good company, or maybe your mate worked at a crappy one :/

Chris L says:

04:49pm | 23/07/11

She promised no tax, Thatmosis. I couldn’t disagree with you on that point even if I were inclined to. She did say quite clearly that she intends to bring in a market based action (which I interpreted at the time as ETS) and that’s exactly what we’re getting. If you think this was tricky, fair enough, I would much prefer a straight talker but there seems none available at the moment.

Matt says:

05:37pm | 23/07/11

Pull the other one Chris L, it’s got bells on! You’re dreaming if you think a carbon tax = an ETS. Exactly what we’re getting? Rubbish!

Chris L says:

11:58pm | 23/07/11

Actually, Matt, my entire point was that carbon tax does NOT equal an ETS. That was why I didn’t feel betrayed when Gillard announced the ETS.

I suspect you actually meant to disagree with me, however, so I won’t take your comment as an endorsement of my point.

Matt says:

03:54pm | 24/07/11

@Chris L, do you live in a fantasy world? Gillard could have brought in an ETS straight away rather than her carbon tax. As she didn’t, it represents a broken election promise, and a betrayal of the electorate. Just because the tax will magically turn into an ETS after 3 years does not excuse her blatant lies during the election campaign.

You didn’t feel betrayed when Gillard brought in a carbon tax because you’re deluded, plain and simple.

Chris L says:

04:34pm | 24/07/11

I see the art of debate at the Punch remains as civilised and mature as parliament house. I guess there’s not much of an example set.

Rather than join in the name calling I will just let my comments stand as they are and you can believe as you wish Matt.

sylvie says:

05:47pm | 24/07/11

@ChrisL.  I don’t agree with you ..... but you’re No.1 Debater.  No question.  It’s not exactly civilised here, is it?  -  but there’s always the sleep-inducing Bob Carr’s Thoughtlines.  Imagine being banished to that blog

Chris L says:

09:42pm | 25/07/11

@Sylvie - I generally like debating people that don’t agree with me

Thank you for the compliment.

Adam says:

03:31pm | 23/07/11

Correct! And when back-flips are so callous, calculated and self-serving people want them out. Just ask the NSW Labor Party!

Rose says:

11:49pm | 23/07/11

Yes, Tony Abbott was a senior Minister in the government that lied about children overboard in order to get re-elected, the same government that lied to start a war based on the lie about WMD, the same government that tried to destroy our industrial relations system (without taking it to an election), the same government that spun absolute bulldust while ripping more than $1b from our health system. Howard government lies make any lie Julia Gillard may have spun look pretty bloody minor!!

Tator says:

09:26am | 24/07/11

Rose,
still peddling that old furphy on the “Billion dollar ripped from health” from the ALP briefing papers.
Read here from the Age about the real truth about that little bit of spin
http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/contributors/abbotts-billion-dollar-ripoff-the-truth-on-health-funding-20100316-qaq1.html.

BTW, even if you don’t read it, the amount that funding GROWTH was reduced by was only around $900 million, not more than a billion, so if you are going to try and peddle untruths, at least get the facts right.

de beers says:

05:52pm | 23/07/11

MS, go to this link, it gives you 8 different starting points & the routes of the 8 different convoys that will converge on Canberrs on Aug 22nd
http://justgroundsonline.com/forum/topics/convoy-of-no-confidence-in-the

John Mikkelsen says:

06:00pm | 23/07/11

I guess she didn’t vote for Bob, the defacto PM who is now calling the shots.

Chris L says:

10:04am | 24/07/11

There is never a guarantee that the person you vote for will win an election. Everyone will get another say in a couple of years.

Salamander says:

05:19pm | 23/07/11

The plebiscite was a ridiculous Abbott stunt after all. Gillard should have taken up the offer when handed to her on a silver platter.

Pedro says:

05:50pm | 23/07/11

Unstoppable people’s revolution to sweep Gillard form power?
When ws this going to happen?  Did I miss something?

Dr B S Goh, Australian in Asia says:

06:48pm | 23/07/11

If you support the PM and love the ALP you should be urging the PM to call a Referendum on the carbon tax. Let the people tell the Greens directly to get lost on the carbon tax.

The PM has been conned by Economics hocus pocus. Basic cost benefit analysis shows the carbon tax has negligible impact on global warming but it is at high costs to Australia.

It is all right for ALP to lose a Referendum on the carbon tax. The saying goes that you can lose a battle but win the War.

mel r says:

07:15pm | 23/07/11

It’s interesting that some people put their faith in compensation.  Well, it’s blind faith.
Bob Brown and Christine Milne are calling the shots, and yet you read “.........a lot of fuss over not much….”

DragonLass says:

08:43pm | 23/07/11

You’ve totally missed the point.

Referendums are called to deal with CONSTITUTIONAL matters, and ONLY Constitutional matters.
Politicians cannot call a referendum for anything else.  This law is written in the ... wait for it ... Consitution of Australia.

We do not, at this point of time, have a mechanism in Australia whereby registered voters are able to take a vote on general policy matters.  Perhaps this is the way democracy will be headed in the future.  But it isn’t yet.

So there is really no point in this continued talking about a referendum.  It aint gonna happen.

Chris L says:

12:05am | 24/07/11

Hmmmm. I think I see where you’re going wrong DragonLass. You are invoking logic and that doesn’t go down too well here.

Dr B S Goh, Australian in Asia says:

07:29am | 24/07/11

@ DragonLass says:08:43pm | 23/07/11

You are throwing up a legal smoke screen to stop a Referendum based on some fine legal arguments.

The PM better hurry up on this gift from Abbot. It is NOT in the LONG TERM interests of the Liberal National Parties to have a Referendum on carbon tax. It is the death anchor around the necks of the PM and the ALP MPs for the next elections.

In my opinion that it is in the interests of Liberal National Coalition to see the ALP commit suicide on the carbon tax in the next elections.

In any case when that happens Abbott already said he will unwind the carbon tax and the extreme loss of ALP in the next election, which could be worse than the recent NSW elections, means that Abbot will have a strong mandate to set aside the carbon tax.

So there is no LONG TERM future for the ALP itself and the carbon tax. So why should ALP commit suicide on this carbon tax which achieves nothing but destroy the ALP and hurt Australia.

The carbon tax is a mirage based on Economics hocus pocus which needs the assumption that Australia is the only country on the planet which is clearly an invalid assumption. This is basic simple Systems Analysis which sits on top of Economic Analysis.

If implemented by next election the voters will see very clearly for themselves that the carbon tax has for practical purposes ZERO impact on global warming. Then all sorts of failures of Admin and rorts by some opportunistic businesses as happened in the insulation batts, solar panels, renewable of schools etc will surface and turn the carbon tax into a nightmare hell for the ALP at the next election.

If you love your ALP why cant you understand the established strategic principle “Win a Battle and Lose a WAR”.

Shane From Melbourne says:

10:57pm | 23/07/11

Then John Howard was an evil socialist, building the Australian middle class family welfare state.

TCB 24 X7 says:

04:54am | 24/07/11

Socialiasm does not work,although they are starting to raise their UGLY heads in Australia their voices will only be short lived, Never to be accepted.
North Korea is the last bastion and we can all see the state of their ideals

Lisa H. says:

02:04pm | 24/07/11

‘peak government’!
I LOVE it!

The Rock says:

10:11pm | 23/07/11

Well yeah…if the French Revolutionaries where screaming from the barricades…..

“Off with their heads…in two years’ time when the election is due….and then we get to vote…and decide between a shit government and shit opposition….viva la revolution” *shakes fist impotently*

nihonin says:

06:09am | 24/07/11

@ The Rock “Off with their heads…in two years’ time when the election is due….and then we get to vote…and decide between a shit government and shit opposition….viva la revolution” *shakes fist impotently*

Brilliant!!!!!

John Mikkelsen says:

06:12pm | 24/07/11

Add the ETU to the unions opposing the tax, de beers. They also realise it will cost jobs, unlike Paul Howes who supports the carbon tax “as long as it doesn’t cost one job” which won’t take long and has probably happened already. A major Cement Australia plant at Kandos in NSW closed down just days before the final details of the tax package were announced.The company’s CEO Chris Leon said, “Current regulations and government imposts are also an increasing burden on manufacturing and the carbon tax will only exacerbate this…”

Meanwhile a poll announced today in the PM’s own electorate of Lalor shows her primary vote has dropped from 64 percent 12 months ago to just 46 percent now and she would need preferences to retain her own seat. And on, Do you support the carbon tax ? 43 % said no to 33% yes so she has a lot of selling to do in her own seat.
Also, the direct quote six days before the election was,“There will be no carbon tax under the government I lead” ( Expect to see that footage of the PM staring down the barrel of a TV camera and saying that every 10 minutes when an election is finally announced.) And this followed an earlier election promise of a citizens assembly to achieve concensus before any attempt was made to introduce a tax or ETS.
Those are the facts guys, and there is no escaping them, try as some might.

John Mikkelsen says:

08:26am | 26/07/11

And I’ll huff and I’ll puff and I’ll blow your house down… 

Mick says:

08:50pm | 25/07/11

NO, we actually give a shit about the future of this country you weak minded fool, if you want you can stand on the bullbar of my Kenworth 600 and catch the locusts ???