It’s been a long time since I felt the urge to attend a street protest.

No, we weren't sure what the lycra reference was either. Photo: Getty Images

During my youth, I waved so many “real men don’t rape” signs in so many Reclaim the Night marches, I was at risk of suffering placard elbow. These days, I enjoy the fact that it’s possible to engage in social activism from the comfort of one’s swivel chair.

Internet petitions, cyber sloganeering, those web sites that send rice overseas when you check out their ads…  Such slacktivist approaches are extremely attractive to the modern revolutionary whose time is short and whose desk-bound dorsal region is lethargic.

On June 13, however, I plan to leave the comfort and anonymity of the e-picket to march in Sydney’s SlutWalk – one of the local chapters of an international demonstration against the shaming and blaming of sex crime victims.

The reason I’m prepared to go to the effort of uprising in tottery heels and fishnetty stockings at 2pm on a Monday afternoon, is because I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it without shouting and waving a big sign anymore.

I’m sick to death of listening to the “she was asking for it” crap still spouted by rapers, gropers and leerers – as well as by those supposed to be apprehending and punishing them.

And I can’t believe this is still an issue.

The notion that women are inviting attack or aggressive ogling because of the way they’re dressed should seem incomputably antiquated – on par with doctors smoking cigarettes during heart surgery or prescribing patients heroin cough syrup.

Yet this offensive and dangerous idea persists.

Sex crime victims are still seen as “asking” for rape if flirting, alcohol and boob tubes are involved. Perpetrators still refuse to take responsibility for their evil deeds. And, when it comes to sex, many women still find themselves stuck between the oppressive stereotypes of “frigid bitch” or “slut” (depending on which man or social convention they’ve upset at any given moment).

The first SlutWalk demonstration was held in Toronto last month after a police officer told university students that women could avoid rape if they didn’t dress like “sluts”.

Similar remarks occur with depressing frequency in Australian public debate. In 2006, Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali, then the nation’s most senior Muslim cleric, suggested that immodestly dressed women were on par with uncovered cat meat.

There was also Sheik Faiz Mohamad’s claim to a Sydney gathering that clothing such as translucent blouses and slit skirts were satanic and an open invitation for harassment.

Such views are not restricted to the hardline Islamic community. 

Late last year, in the wake of yet more allegations of sexual assaults against footballers, TV personality Kerri-Anne Kennerley suggested women who socialised with ovoid ball wranglers were “strays”.

Former AFL star Peter “Spida” Everitt chipped in with a Tweet that read: “Girls!! When will you learn! At 3am when you are blind drunk & you decide to go home with a guy ITS NOT FOR A CUP OF MILO!”

(Note to footballing meatheads: Boys! When will you learn? Your self-serving chauvinism may be sanctioned in the locker room but the rest of us think it HAS ALL THE SENSTIVITY OF A PAIR OF FLARING FOOTY SHORTS.)

Since that first SlutWalk march in Canada, rallies have been held across the world and are about to begin in Australia: in Melbourne and Brisbane today, in Canberra on June 4, in Adelaide on June 11, and in Sydney on June 13.

The latter was originally planned as a small stroll through the inner-city suburb of Newtown but a massive response on Facebook means the starting line has been relocated to Sydney Town Hall.

SlutWalk may be popular but it’s also controversial. In fact, it’s been condemned for encouraging the sorts of behaviour and attitudes it purports to reject.

“Part of me thinks hooray, reclaim that word,” says a friend who has previously protested semi-nude during political demonstrations. “But then the other part of me thinks a bunch of dirty old pervs will find it a turn-on for all the wrong reasons.”

Similar criticisms were made about Boobquake – an international baring of cleavages in response to an Iranian cleric’s claim that immodestly dressed women incur religious wrath in the form of natural disasters.

Organisers of a rival crusade called Brainquake attacked Boobquake for arousing the insatiable enthusiasm of men who couldn’t wait to see their female friends “showing off their tits”.

While some feminists will always claim that taking to the streets in skimpy garments is counterproductive, the reclaiming of sex and sexualisation is a hallmark of modern manifestations of the women’s movement. After all: staying home looking demure can also look like capitulation.

Rather than accepting the dominant damned-if-you-do-and-damned-if-you-don’t attitude to women, we need to remember that there is no such thing as lust-repellent clothing

Niche sex sites on the internet reveal that ladies are fetishised even when wearing conventionally drab attire such as conservative, buttoned-up office blouses. For other sectors of society, the mere fact of femaleness poses an untenable provocation.

Earlier this month, a Brooklyn-based Orthodox Jewish newspaper digitally deleted Hillary Clinton and a second female staff member from a photo of Barack Obama’s inner sanctum watching Navy SEALs launch their attack on Osama bin Laden.

Apparently the paper excised the women because of its longstanding policy that including images of females in the paper could be sexually suggestive.

“I’m with the Hasids on this one,” agreed American comedian Stephen Colbert. “There is nothing more sexually suggestive than a woman killing a terrorist. At at my bachelor party, a Margaret Thatcher impersonator in a thick tweed pants suit clubbed an Ayatollah Khomeini lookalike to death. Don’t tell my wife. She thinks I was at a strip club.”

The (i)moral of the story is that sexual suggestiveness really is in the eye of the beholder. In fact, like rape, aggressively calling women sluts is about power, not sex. It says little about the outfits and behaviour of the women it is used to deride, but speaks volumes about the insecurity and sadism of those who wield it as a weapon.

Reclaiming the s-word will be tough (and possibly quite chilly given that many SlutWalkers are likely to be wearing microskirts in early winter).

But so long as there is such a sexist disconnect between the “stud” and the “slut”, activism – especially activism involving the physical she-bodies deemed so problematic – is essential.

No plain Jane - see more of Emma’s work here at The Australian.

136 comments

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    • Erick says:

      05:57am | 30/05/11

      Haven’t we been through this before? Giving safety advice is not “blaming the victim”.

      And as far as “slut” being a shaming word used against women - so what? There are dozens of shaming words used against men, too. The difference is that while women are shamed for having “too much” sex, men are shamed for having “too little” - thus words like “creep”, “loser”, and the like.

      Enough of this protest about feminist trivia! What about addressing less-publicised subjects, like false accusations against men, which are as common and as damaging as actual rapes?

    • acotrel says:

      08:05am | 30/05/11

      @Erick
      ‘There are dozens of shaming words used against men, too. The difference is that while women are shamed for having “too much” sex, men are shamed for having “too little” - thus words like “creep”, “loser”, and the like.’

      Why are you sensitive about that?

    • Cloud Strife says:

      08:14am | 30/05/11

      Ahhh, Erick’s stats from blogspot again, which, in his opinon, are much more factual than stats from the government. Because those stats are biased and are feminist opression!!!

      And no, there are no soley male based slurs. ‘Creep’, ‘loser’ and the like are gender neutral and can be applied to man or woman.

      Tell me again how whinging on the internet is going to make the changes you so desperatley want?

    • Erick says:

      08:57am | 30/05/11

      @Cloud Strife - In reality, those “stats from Blogspot” are actually links to numerous studies of the prevalence of false rape allegations. But honestly admitting that as many as half of all rape accusations are proven to be false would not serve the feminist cause.

    • Cloud Strife says:

      09:51am | 30/05/11

      @Erick

      Nice try, but I think I’ll take government information over your little blog.

    • Fiona says:

      10:02am | 30/05/11

      Methinks this has story has been done to death, at least it gives Erick a reason to rev up and restart the rant about those pesky women.

    • AAAdam says:

      10:23am | 30/05/11

      I agree Erick. Giving safety advice is not “blaming the victim”. It is common sense and following such advice goes a long way towards reducing the risk of becoming a victim of crime. This includes advice on how much to drink, to not leave your drinks unattended, how to dress, to stay with friends, not go wandering around dodgy areas, etc, etc, to reduce your risk of being sexually assaulted. To assume we live in utopia and you can throw all caution to the wind is ridiculous and sends the wrong message to people living in the real world where risk minimisation is often the best way to avoid becoming a victim of crime.

      As for the stats on false rape, why do people care if Ericks stats are more or less accurate than the Govt’s? Even if it were only 2%, it is still a problem we need to address (just as we do for rape, even though it only represents a tiny fraction of all crimes). The ability of people to anonymously make claims of sexual assault/harassment can be devastating for an innocent victim who is them publically destroyed (look at the ADFA cadets or IMF chief. Both have had their reputations destroyed in the media, their accuser has remained anonymous with no public scrutiny and all this before the accused have been found guilty of anything in a court of law). Furthermore, false accusations can result in someone doing jail time and getting raped in prison, therefore false accusations can be just as damaging as actual sex crimes so they should be treated just as seriously (not to mention the fact rape victims have friends and family for support whereas someone who is falsely accused of rape is often abandoned by friends and family).

    • Lachlan says:

      11:20am | 30/05/11

      Nun’s in full habits have been raped in the past. Quite aside from the value judgement inherent in telling women who dress up to show off their bodies that they are ‘sluts’ A woman in a full hajib would still not be safe.

      It is not safety advice at all.

    • Cloud Strife says:

      11:26am | 30/05/11

      @AAAAdamn

      “As for the stats on false rape, why do people care if Ericks stats are more or less accurate than the Govt’s?”

      Because Erick likes to trot out his blog stats at every opportunity and claims all government stats are feminist propaganda? Much like Erick’s finger pointing, I also like to point out Erick’s own blindness and hypocracy when it comes to his own pet issues.

    • Just Sayin' says:

      12:48pm | 30/05/11

      Everyone agrees that stealing is wrong.  Everyone agrees, that people who experience home invasion or burglary are victims.  Everyone still puts locks on their doors.

    • Shinra says:

      01:02pm | 30/05/11

      @Cloud Strife.

      So who appointed you arbiter of The Punch? I must have missed that memo…

      Erick tells it how he sees things, you have a problem with his views, so you attempt to cause him grief (quite unsuccessfully I might add) without actually adding anything to the discussion yourself.

      Grow up, it’d do us ALL a favour.

    • AAAdam says:

      01:12pm | 30/05/11

      @ Cloud Strife - So does that mean you agree that false accusations are a problem and we should seek address it? Even if you and Erick don’t agree on the size of the problem.

    • AAAdam says:

      01:44pm | 30/05/11

      @ Lachlan - Workers wearing hard hats, fluro vests and steel capped boots have been injured too. It doesn’t mean being advised to wear such protective clothing is not “safety advice”. Telling women to dress in a manner that doesn’t draw (unwanted) sexual attention to themselves is indeed safety advice. Just the same as telling someone to not leave valuables on display in your car is safety advice or telling a cop to wear a bullet proof vest to work is safety advice. Neither guarantee no harm will come to you, however, they do reduce the risk which is important in the real world (as opposed to utopia were individual actions supposedly have no bearing on the risk individuals are exposed to).

    • Cloud Strife says:

      02:55pm | 30/05/11

      @AAAdam

      Of course fake accusations should be addressed, that’s a given. However, Erick’s representation of false accusations are wrong.

      @Shrinra

      I’m not the arbiture of the Punch anymore than Erick is. But you can’t expect to give your opinion on the internet and not have people disagree with it. I do agree with some things Erick says. But his complete derailing of any subject to fit his own agenda is annoying and he needs to be called out on it.  Just as other people, who find me annoying, call me out on it, just like you did smile

    • Lachlan says:

      04:18pm | 30/05/11

      @AAAdam
      The point is that dressing as a ‘slut’ or not had no effect on your odds of being raped. Even -if- we could come up with some definition what that means. If is like advising someone to wear a plague mask to stop them from inhaling noxious vapours. It is wrong safety advice regardless of the morality of the whole thing.

    • Lily says:

      04:55pm | 30/05/11

      @ AAAdam, Now all I can see is a personal saftey ad on the back of a pub toliet door warning us ladies not to leave our valuables on display. LOL.
      At the end of the day while what you wear should never be an excuse you’d have to have your head in the sand if you don’t realise that people are going to judge you based on your outward appearance. Some of those judging you may not share your belief system or moral code, certainly those who think that you were asking for it is a legitimate defense. I’m not saying it is right, but they wouldn’t be using it as a defense if they didn’t believe it had some validity. It is common sense and reality to dress appropriately, it might not be right or what we want, but right now it is what we have.

    • Sam says:

      05:47pm | 30/05/11

      @Erick
      Your reply to Cloud Strife
      ‘But honestly admitting that as many as half of all rape accusations are proven to be false would not serve the feminist cause. ‘

      I think you meant
      But honestly admitting that as many as half of all rape accusations are proven to be true would not serve my cause.

    • AAAdam says:

      11:04pm | 30/05/11

      @ Lily - I agree entirely. I think those who honestly believe what they wear has no bearing on how much (unwanted) sexual attention they receive, and does not in any way change their risk of being the victim of a sexual crime, must be living on another planet. Or perhaps they have just not been out to the alcohol fuelled club scene recently.

      Lol, I can also imagine that sign on the back of a public toilet door. Funny times indeed wink

      @ Lachlan - Dressing in a provocative manner draws both wanted and unwanted sexual attention. Even Lily recognises this so I’m not a lone voice on this one. Also, to assume drawing such wanted and unwanted sexual attention to yourself in no way increases the chances of becoming a victim of sexual harassment/assault demonstrates a clear breakdown of your logical reasoning skills.

      Furthermore, no-one’s blaming the victim, just giving them useful safety advice to reduce the risk of becoming a victim of such crimes. Other such safety advice includes learning self defence, staying with your group of friends, not going back to strangers houses alone & drunk, etc. No-one is forcing women to dress a certain way or forcing them to do mandatory kung fu classes. Just giving them ways to reduce their risk in the big bad world. I wonder, why is it you have a problem with others such as myself and Lily providing useful safety advice to women on how to reduce their chance of becoming a victim of sexual harassment/assault?

    • Septimus says:

      06:25am | 30/05/11

      In reality, you won’t change the opinion of your respective rapist - march away!

    • Erick says:

      08:50am | 30/05/11

      True, Septimus. What do these silly feminists think they’re going to achieve?

      I can just see a typical rapist sitting at home and watching the march on TV: “Egad! Sluts are marching! I shall cease raping forthwith!”

    • Slothy says:

      09:51am | 30/05/11

      No, we might not change the opinion of our rapists. But we might show that these ‘personal responsiblity’ tips DON’T WORK and change the focus from how victims can keep themselves from getting raped to how society can stop people from raping.  By talking loudly and proudly how our actions have nothing to do with whether we are or are not raped, we might provide a bit of relief to rape victims who have to try to recover from a horrifying experience WHILE being constantly told it’s their fault. 

      I’ll be marching. And I’ll be wearing what I was assulted in - jeans, sneakers and a hoodie.

    • Septimus says:

      10:06am | 30/05/11

      Slothy,

      How would you know if personal responsibility tips don’t work?  How many women avoid rape because of the way they dress?  We will never know?  It’s possible though isn’t it? 

      So how is it that you can say it ‘doesn’t work’?

      I don’t think rape victims are ever told it’s their fault, by anyone sensible and it’s not a mainstream belief.  I think radical feminist nutbags like to pretend that’s the message, so they can continue to justify their demented belief system.

    • Slothy says:

      12:38pm | 30/05/11

      Septimus,
      ‘While people perceive dress to have an impact on who is assaulted, studies of rapists suggest that victim attire is not a significant factor. Instead, rapists look for signs of passiveness and submissiveness, which, studies suggest, are [*pg 145] more likely to coincide with more body-concealing clothing.140 ‘

      From here: http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?14+Duke+J.+Gender+L.+&+Pol’y+125#H1N3

      The paragraph is quoting these studies
      Chen Shen, Study: From Attribution and Thought-Process Theory to Rape-Shield Laws: The Meanings of Victim’s Appearance in Rape Trials, 5 J. L. & FAM. STUD. 435, 447 (2003);

      Alinor C. Sterling, Undressing the Victim: The Intersection of Evidentiary and Semiotic Meanings of Women’s Clothing in Rape Trials, 7 YALE J.L. & FEMINISM 87, 104-06 (1995); DUNCAN KENNEDY, SEXY DRESSING ETC. (1993);

      Gary D. Lafree, Barbara F. Reskin & Christy A. Visher, Jurors’ Responses to Victims’ Behavior and Legal Issues in Sexual Assault Trials, 32 SOC. PROBS. 389, 401 (1985)

      Lynne Richards, A Theoretical Analysis of Nonverbal Communication and Victim Selection for Sexual Assaults, 9 CLOTHING & TEXTILES RES. J. 55, 59-60 (Summer 1991) (discussing Lynne Richards et al., Perceptions of Submissiveness: Implications for Victimization, 125 J. PSYCH. 407 (1991)).

      So not only is ‘don’t dress like a slut and you won’t get raped’ offensive and an attempt to control women, it’s just plain wrong.

    • Septimus says:

      01:19pm | 30/05/11

      Slothy,

      Have you ever thought that rapists might answer questions the way ‘academics’ want them to answer?  The more compliant they are, the sooner they ‘get out’.

      Ever thought that the policeman might have been speaking from years of street experience and first hand account of assaults, not from an ivory tower years after an event?

      As for an ‘attempt to control women’ - do you lock your house and car when you leave them alone?  Isn’t that ‘safety’ advise another attempt to control women?  So WHY do you do it?

    • Septimus says:

      01:26pm | 30/05/11

      Slothy,

      Ever thought the officer might have actually just been trying to help?

      It doesn’t suit the feminist nutcases to acknowledge that may have been his motivation.

      It only serves them to blow it way out of proportion, think that they are being told what to wear, think that they are being told they deserved or caused the assault and falsely be outraged to suit their agenda.

      Haven’t seen any reporting of what he meant by the statement, just the usual feminist rant and bullshit that marginalises both them and the cause of women.

      Feel free to want to be a slut though, it’s your choice.

    • Slothy says:

      02:00pm | 30/05/11

      Maybe that straw you’re clutching at is correct. Maybe he just wants to help. In that case a) he needs to work on his community communication skills because referring to rape victims as sluts is going to put a lot of people offside and b) he needs to be right.

      You argue that maybe the cop is working from years on the street. That’s a pretty big assumption. I can tell you that slutwalkers are arguing from direct experience of what happened to us, to our own bodies, not filterd through a third party’s interpretation.  And the studies back up our arguments. But if you are so attached to your opinion that you seriously want to play the ‘feminist academic consipracy to hand out shorter prison terms in return for favourable data’ argument, then I don’t see a way we can reconcile this conversation.

    • Erick says:

      02:04pm | 30/05/11

      How interesting, Slothy, that you should cite “studies” from Duke University - an institution whose greatest claim to fame is a notorious case of false accusation of rape!

      What a perfect example of the way men are discriminated against.

    • Septimus says:

      02:44pm | 30/05/11

      Slothy,

      He never said rape victims WERE sluts…he said women should avoid dressing LIKE one…you have either completely misinterpreted what was said or choose to do so for your own purposes.

      I tried to hold an intellectual conversation, even after your bizarre assessment of ‘trying to control women’ but adding (even more bizzarely that this therefore advocates) a ‘feminist academic consipracy to hand out shorter prison terms in return for favourable data’...

      ...proves your not capable of holding a reasoned point of view.

      All the best on your slut walk.

    • Slothy says:

      02:50pm | 30/05/11

      Erick, the accused were Duke students. The accuser was not.  BTW, it turns out my link was wrong, try this one instead: http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?14+Duke+J.+Gender+L.+&+Pol’y+125

      Septimus, many many people believe in myths about rape. That doesn’t make those myths true. Women often believe them as a way to cope with the pervasivness of rape in our society: ‘it’s okay, if I follow these rules and do these things it won’t happen to me, I’m safe because only sluts get raped’. It’s a sad phenomenon and if it internalized can be at the root of a lot of the trauma that rape victims go through.

    • Slothy says:

      03:22pm | 30/05/11

      Septimus, you wrote ‘Have you ever thought that rapists might answer questions the way ‘academics’ want them to answer?  The more compliant they are, the sooner they ‘get out’.’

      You’re the one who is trying to write off studies by saying the data is skewed.

      Rapists may participate in studies in the interest of being seen as a compliant prisoner and so eligible for early release. But the argument that they are trying to give the specific answers that researchers want, rather than honest answers requires 1) that the researches are unethical enough to have decided their outcomes ahead of time and 2) that the researchers have the ability to affect the rapists’ sentence. Otherwise, there is no benefit for a rapist to lie about their motivations.

      If you are arguing that this article is wrong because researchers are using the carrot of early release to get data that backs up their arguments, then yes, I think you’re getting in to conspiracy territory.  If that’s not what you are arguing, then what did you mean?

    • Bev says:

      04:31pm | 30/05/11

      Slothy says:02:50pm | 30/05/11
      Erick, the accused were Duke students. The accuser was not.

      ????? what has that got to do with the fact that the accusations were completely false. The woman turned out to be an absolute liar (proven at the time) but had no charges laid against her. She the went on to stab and kill one of her boyfriends,  A life which may have been saved if she had been bought to book.

    • Fiona says:

      08:02pm | 30/05/11

      Bev, I think slothy felt (whether right or not) that erick was insinuating that duke university had a woman that falsely accused men of rape enrolled there. Therefore it was a doodgy uni??? She was pointing out that it was the acusees who were duke uni students, not the accuser and the stain shouldnt be on the uni’s reputation. At least that’s what I got.

    • Bev says:

      10:15pm | 30/05/11

      Fiona says:08:02pm | 30/05/11

      Bev, I think slothy felt (whether right or not) that erick was insinuating that duke university had a woman that falsely accused men of rape enrolled there. Therefore it was a doodgy uni??? She was pointing out that it was the acusees who were duke uni students, not the accuser and the stain shouldnt be on the uni’s reputation. At least that’s what I got.
      The stain IS on the gender studies facilty who have and continue to push for men to be destroyed on mere accusation. No trial necessary!
      It is one of a number of feminist dominated US universities who are at the centre of producing one sided dodgy “studies” which show no balance but pure hatred of men. They have pursued and continue to produce policies which demonize, and attempt to destroy the standing and self esteem of any male student who attends that university. If you changed male for black or jew as outlined in their policies they would be hauled before a court for hate speech and or racism.

    • acotrel says:

      07:09am | 30/05/11

      Emily Pankhurst is to blame!  She used to show a bit of ankle to get the fellas aroused!

    • acotrel says:

      07:59am | 30/05/11

      @Erick
      ‘Haven’t we been through this before? Giving safety advice is not “blaming the victim”.’

      As a man I take offence at a dumb copper making the suggestion that the dress of a young woman might arouse me and cause me to rape someone!  Since when have the police been empowered to enforce the dress code anyway?  Charging someone with indecent exposure is one thing, but comparing a kid to a ‘slut’ is something else!

    • malohi says:

      07:27pm | 30/05/11

      Dumb copper hey acotrel? That is a bit below you…

      I have been a cop, I have taken rape complaints, and I have prosecuted rape trials. I have waited at hospitals while swabs were taken from 16 year olds as they had no family who cared. I too have degrees and an area of expertise, just like you.
      For all your self righteousness, I do not think you are smarter than me or any standard plod on the beat. You say stupid shit at times too mate.

      I have given advice to people and did so when I was a cop. For all you know he was urging females to stay safe because he honestly thought there was a correlation between dress and rape, he was trying to do what he thought was right to keep the community safe. Not to blame anyone. Maybe he took his oath to the community seriously, you know, the bit about protecting?


      To dismiss him as just a dumb cop cuts me to the bone, especially today after this bullshit in Qld. You don’t know what he has seen or he knows of rape or any other matter.

    • look at me says:

      08:18am | 30/05/11

      Attention seekers

    • acotrel says:

      08:27am | 30/05/11

      They should leave the kids alone!  To make that sort of statement, the mentality of the cop himself is questionable.

    • Giggidy says:

      01:43pm | 30/05/11

      Let them be sluts… personally I like sluts… some nights they are the only root you can get

    • Teen Timer says:

      08:43am | 30/05/11

      Wear what you like, but if we bare too much, we take away our allure.  I used to think men sat on their brains, but now I think some of us do too.

    • acotrel says:

      09:08am | 30/05/11

      @Teen Timer I agree.  If we let the fantasies of dirty old men dictate our dress code, we’ve come to a sorry state, and that includes the cop who made the ‘slut’ comment!

    • LP says:

      01:46pm | 30/05/11

      @ Acotrel - are you posting as a man or woman today?

    • Kassandra says:

      04:35pm | 30/05/11

      Like it or not people will judge you at least in part on your appearance. In the modern era slut is a term applied to women with no class and no moral compass. If you want to look like that go right ahead.

    • majority says:

      08:59am | 30/05/11

      I forget, what was wrong with Spida’s comment? He comment should be seen as advocating personal responsibility, not advocating rape. Most guys won’t take advantage of a drunken female, but some will. His comment is advice I would give my daughters.

    • acotrel says:

      09:37am | 30/05/11

      @majority The kids were obviously not daughters of the cop! You might have the right to make that sort of comment, but I’d never say that sort of thing to my daughter.  Although I might actually tell her the facts of life.

    • Slothy says:

      09:42am | 30/05/11

      What is wrong with Spida’s comment? Leaving aside the bit where if you are ‘blind drunk’ you can’t consent to anything, lets focus on the bit where he is implying that if you go home with a footballer, you are automatically consenting to whatever that footballer wants to do, regardless of your own limits and desires?

    • majority says:

      10:24am | 30/05/11

      @acotrel. I was talking about Spida’s comment. “Girls!! When will you learn! At 3am when you are blind drunk & you decide to go home with a guy ITS NOT FOR A CUP OF MILO!”  It is like crossing an intersection on foot, getting the green walk signal,  and stepping onto the road without checking to see if a car/bike is running the red light.. You will be in the right, but its not much consolation if you are in hospital. I think “dont get drunk and go home with footballers” is good advice.

    • Tim says:

      11:10am | 30/05/11

      Slothy,
      what Spida was saying is that if you go home with a guy when you are both blind drunk and you have sex, then don’t try to claim it was rape when you both sober up in the morning.

    • Slothy says:

      12:46pm | 30/05/11

      majority, being raped is not like being hit by a car.

      If you step out without looking, someone may hit you by accident.

      If you pass out naked in an alleyway with your undies around your ankles, then it still takes someone actively deciding ‘I am going to have sex with her’ for you to be raped.  For the car analogy to hold, you would have to step out in to the road and be spotted by a driver who consciously decides ‘I am going to hit him with my car’.

      Tim - some evidence for that interpretation of Spida’s comment please? Because it seems to be directed at girls alone and have no reference to the sobriety of the male.

    • kyra says:

      01:32pm | 30/05/11

      @ majority and what would you be telling your sons? That if a drunk girl comes home with you then it’s your right to do whatever you want with her irrespective of the fact she is incapable of consenting? That they have no responsibility for their behaviour if a girl is wearing a short skirt? Or that they should treat any woman with the same respect that they would afford their sisters? Whenever my older sister and I heard my brother making those kind of remarks we would say to him “And how would you feel if some guy was speaking/treating us like that?”

    • Spida says:

      01:45pm | 30/05/11

      Tim’s interpretation of my comment is correct.

    • Fiona says:

      08:12pm | 30/05/11

      Ok spida, what’s your advice to the guys seeing as those accusations are out there? It’s not a one sided thing after all.

    • MD says:

      09:17am | 30/05/11

      How can you ‘reclaim’ a word that never had any position conotations, ever, in all

    • Septimus says:

      01:46pm | 30/05/11

      MD,

      Feminists don’t rely on logic.  It’s about the ‘outrage’.

    • Tubesteak says:

      09:25am | 30/05/11

      I assume the title of this article is a reference to Sam de Brito’s column in the Sun Herald last Sunday where he basically argued the opposite.

      The Slutwalk will be another ineffectual waste of time by people that don’t have the intellectual capacity to understand why. It won’t go to the root issues of why SOME men rape. Therefore, it won’t do anything. Until you really address those fundamental issues then nothing will change.

      Also, trying to write an article where you want to tell men how to think and what they should think smacks of hypocrisy. But then, you’d expect that from someone like yourself.

    • Tell It Like It Is says:

      09:26am | 30/05/11

      I heard one spokeswoman say that she hoped with this campaign people would be a bit more careful with their language in not choosing to use the word “slut”.  But the issue is bigger than ‘language’ which is not just words. She and her ilk need to think in much broader terms of “communication”.  I would never ever defend a rapist and no rapist deserves the ‘loophole’ of having been tantalised into perpetrating the crime. However, the language of clothing /dress is very real.  One does say something via the particular choices one makes in what to wear.  Why else do you choose to wear one thing over the other? And as a 62 year old woman I am sorry to say that if you dress like a ‘slut’.... Get real! If you put on military gear people have a right or are likely to assume you are in the military. If you dress up like a clown…guess what? This discussion is not dissimilar to the ongoing debate about the burqa or niqab whereby extreme Muslims cover from head to toe. They have to understand that such garb is not going to yield an inclusive /positive response from many fellow Australians. So also a young woman must understand that if she chooses to dress like a ‘slut’ (and I regret to say that is just what many young women look like today, often in the most inappropriate contexts - like work!) then the majority of people, both male and female, are going to view them in such terms. YOUR choice but you have to understand the consequences which may ensue.  Furthermore, if you drink too much alcohol, let down your guard or act in a way which you might not when sobre, well once again, your choice but be prepared for the consequences. And, before, anyone goes off on a tangent, yes I do understand that many people get raped who do not dress in such a fashion and that rape is a complex topic.

    • Jade (the other one) says:

      01:29pm | 30/05/11

      Then most Australians should be advocating the burqa as an appropriate form of dress for women. You know, prevention of rape - I doubt anyone feels that Muslim women in a burqa look like sluts.

      There is a marked difference between approaching someone who dresses in a sexually appealing way and asking for consensual sex, and forcing yourself on someone with violence and disregard for their interests, wants or needs. This seems to be a crucial difference that most people in society don’t understand. Noone is suggesting that assumptions shouldn’t be made about women in provocative clothing. What they are suggesting is that a woman’s sartorial choices are not an act of consent to whatever acts the male is interested in performing with her.

      Furthermore, the suggestion that if a woman has too much to drink or lets her guard down, she should be prepared for the consequences suggests that this is also an act of consent. It’s not.

    • Saloth Sarkozy says:

      09:27am | 30/05/11

      No-one (gender-free bias) should be reacting to what the Toronto? cop said to a group of women at a University as advice for personal safety/security. If you step back a moment from entrenched positions, etc you will see that what this guy advised women to do is based on basic common sense. If you go to more backward countries - Muslim countries like Egypt for example and wade into a protest without a head scarf on you might find yourself subject to some unwanted (and unwarranted) physical attention like the US female reporter Lara Logan recently encountered.  So grow up gals and wake up to the fact that there are a lot of losers out there and they are not going to change their spots. Be careful,  and be cautious and don’t put yourselves in harm’s way. There is a lot of bad and beware - (Cat Stevens)

    • Cloud Strife says:

      10:07am | 30/05/11

      Except it’s been solidly proven that what a person wearing has nothing to do with their chances of being sexually assaulted.

    • Gamer says:

      11:27am | 30/05/11

      Cloud strife, how has it been solidly proven? Can you honestly tell me that no rapes have been committed due to the rapist seeing a drunk, sluttily dressed woman by herself, and taking advantage? That no pervert has ever groped or assaulted a woman because he thought the way she was dressed/was acting was an invitation? It probably is true that such cases are in the minority, but does that mean women should do nothing try to mitigate the risks of it happening to them?

    • Markus says:

      11:32am | 30/05/11

      I’m not so sure, Cloud, it would depend if we are talking about sexual harrassment, assault or rape.
      If talking about rape then you are of course right, as in the vast majority of cases the attacker knows the victim.

      But I was always of the impression that the officer’s statements referred more to situations of harrassment or minor (for lack of a better word) assault - close dancing, butt grabs etc
      For the latter, I do not think that advice on how to not give off sexual signals, especially around intoxicated people whose judgement is severely impaired, is victim blaming.

      And for the former, unfortunately marching is not going to deter rapists. 99% of men who already know rape is abhorrent and would never even think of doing such a thing to another person. The other 1% who know it is illegal, and carries sentences longer than murder in some cases, yet are still not deterred. I severely doubt shame tactics are going to change such a person’s mind.

    • Cloud Strife says:

      12:11pm | 30/05/11

      @Gamer

      Basically, all rapes are caused by rapists. What the people are wearing has very little do to with it.

      @Markus

      If that is the case about the officer’s comments, than I do agree.

      I have a older family member who likes to dirty dance with the younger girls at parties, who are visibly upset and uncomfortable. He seems to be under the impression that wearing a short skirt and heels means that they want a 70 year old man to grind them.

    • Slothy says:

      12:50pm | 30/05/11

      Markus and Cloud Strife: actually it seems to be the opposite for both rape and sexual harrasment.

      http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?14+Duke+J.+Gender+L.+&+Pol’y+125#H1N3

      ‘While people perceive dress to have an impact on who is assaulted, studies of rapists suggest that victim attire is not a significant factor. Instead, rapists look for signs of passiveness and submissiveness, which, studies suggest, are [*pg 145] more likely to coincide with more body-concealing clothing.140’

      ‘Sexual harassment is about power; therefore, a target who is dressed provocatively is not the ideal target for the would-be harasser, who appears motivated at least in part by his ability to dominate his victim. Provocative dress does not necessarily signify submissiveness but instead may be an indication of confidence and assertiveness.’

    • Markus says:

      01:36pm | 30/05/11

      That link didn’t seem to work Slothy, so I assume there is more included in the article.
      If not, what you have posted just seems to take research based on rape occurrences and blindly apply it to all sexual harassment and assault.

      I still don’t buy into the “rape is all about power” either. Drunken arse-grabs and dirty pick-up lines are about sex, plain and simple.
      And while I wouldn’t deny the power play involved in rape, if it has nothing to do with sexual gratification, then why would they choose sexual assault, as opposed to just assault?

    • Slothy says:

      02:35pm | 30/05/11

      Sorry about the broken link Markus, try this: http://www.law.duke.edu/shell/cite.pl?14+Duke+J.+Gender+L.+&+Pol’y+125

      And yes, it does say significantly more than that - it’s fairly lengthy so I’ve pulled some choice quotes out. It doesn’t apply the rape conclusion blindly, it’s one paragraph in a large case built to examine the relationship between clothing and sexual harrasment.

      And as to your last question, beating someone is brutal and painful and traumatic. But raping them makes that trauma intensely personal. There are probably deep sociological reasons behind this, but ultimately rape is an invasion of your body and soul in a way that strips away any sense of bodily autonomy. Rapists know that the powerlessness and dehumanisation rape can inflict and that’s what they want.

    • Rossco says:

      09:48am | 30/05/11

      Most of the girls on the slut walk are just the avid feminazi geek uni types who think the world owes them something, they aren’t even the type of girls you see out at 3 in the morning in the city dressed in short dresses, drunk and falling over themselves. The SlutWalkers are just a bunch of naive attention seeking show ponies.

    • Lisa H. says:

      02:58pm | 30/05/11

      Now there’s the truth!

      Wouldn’t it be great if all this do-good energy could be harnessed and sent over to the MIddle East, where women really truly are victimised, marginalised, raped, killed due to the unfair positioning of them as ‘sluts’ and the use of them as trophies.

    • Markus says:

      03:27pm | 30/05/11

      Will never happen, Lisa H.
      After all, why would they risk going after a real target like the Middle East, when you can make a cushy, life-long career out of belittling and villifying a target that doesn’t fight back?

      Just like Unions, modern-day feminist activists are cowards. Comfortable, apathetic cowards.

    • NSW says:

      09:49am | 30/05/11

      Gees I’m sick of hearing/reading about this slutwalk garbage. The people involved are deadset idiots.

    • Bikinis On Top says:

      10:24am | 30/05/11

      Men’s brains are in their pants.Chop it off and all problems solved.
      Women’s brains are in their heads.

    • Rose says:

      11:05am | 30/05/11

      There is an increasing number of women whose brains are clearly in their boobs!!

    • Blind Freddy says:

      11:43am | 30/05/11

      I think it was Einstein that said that women’s creative centre was their womb while for men it was their heads.

      I’ll take Einsteins opinion ahead of yours sorry.

    • Just Sayin' says:

      12:55pm | 30/05/11

      Rose, does that mean all these women are getting brain enlargements?  That sounds like a good thing.

    • Daniel says:

      01:16pm | 30/05/11

      MIsandry!

    • Septimus says:

      01:30pm | 30/05/11

      Well you just proved your own theory to be false.

    • mike j says:

      10:34am | 30/05/11

      I think it’s going to be a big disappointment for a lot of women who wake up on the morning of June 14, only to discover that they’re still sluts.

    • Tim says:

      11:13am | 30/05/11

      I doubt it Mike.
      Have you seen the organisers of the event? I don’t think they’re in any danger of being labelled sluts.

    • mike j says:

      12:59pm | 30/05/11

      Butch lesbians can be sluts, too, Tim.

    • Fiona says:

      08:20pm | 30/05/11

      Actually I saw one of these organizers interviewed on tv (unfortunately, I’m really over this walk) and despite all the comments to the contrary I’ve seen posted here, she was gorgeous. Judgmental much?

    • Tim says:

      11:12am | 30/05/11

      What the hell is aggressive ogling?

      Is that where the ugly guy stares at the cleavage and arse cheeks that you are proudly showing off and goes “phwooaarr”?

    • Tchom says:

      11:28am | 30/05/11

      This whole think reeks of stupid. Its a stupid backwards protest against the stupid backwards comments of stupid backwards indivuals. Noone outside of boofheads and archconservative nutjobs blames the victims of rape and marching in the streets wearing fishnets isn’t going to change their minds. As for reclaiming the word ‘slut’... yeah, good luck with that. An insult used to describe individuals isn’t the same as a slur used to belittle an entire group

    • Tchom says:

      11:55am | 30/05/11

      *thing. Aw man, now I reek of stupid

    • TracyH says:

      12:24pm | 30/05/11

      I think it’s great to reclaim the slut word…Even as a school girl at 16, I was baffled by the word and its acceptance. The word has always been offensive to me, as the N word has been to black people. I know the slut walk isn’t going to stop rapes, but it might well be a start to the eventual demise of the word as an insult to females. I especially hate it when women call each other sluts. Ones sex life has nothing what so ever to do with any one else. So how, in this century, can the word still be flung around? And an earlier poster was right, Eric, there are no offensive words as far as I know that are exclusive to men.

    • Markus says:

      12:51pm | 30/05/11

      ‘pervert’ ‘loser’ ‘creep’ ‘sleazebag’ ‘dirty old man’? Can’t remember ever hearing these used against women to describe their sexual abilities.
      On the other hand, I’ve heard slut used against men numberous times.

    • Just Sayin' says:

      01:05pm | 30/05/11

      Words change meaning all the time.  “the N word” you refer to just means black in latin, meaning it’s okay to call them black in english, but not in latin.  Weird. 

      Slut originally meant dirty, unitdy or slovenly, but eventually came to mean promiscuous.  Do you mean ‘reclaim’ or do you mean ‘change the meaning’?  If you want to change the meaning, what do you you want to change it to?  And if you change the meaning of that word, won;t another synonym just be used for the same thing?  Homosexuals have ‘reclaimed’ the words gay and queer, but there are still plenty of nasty words that can be directed at them.  Ultimately we need to address homophobia and misogyny, not piss around changing the meaning of words.

      Bastard is an offensive word used almost exclusively for men, as are motherf*cker and d*ckless, and slut is not used exclusively for women.  I’ve heard it directed at men, particularly amongst gay men.

      I reclaim the word TracyH.  From now on it means “Just Sayin’ is awesome”.

    • Just Sayin' says:

      01:08pm | 30/05/11

      Furthermore, the earliest known use of a word related to ‘slut’ was Chaucer’s use of the word ‘sluttish’.  He uses it to describe a slovenly man wink

    • Erick says:

      01:11pm | 30/05/11

      Bollocks, TracyH. The vast majority of offensive words are exclusive to men. Arsehole, dickhead, loser, f^^kwit, creep, prick, mother****er - all are exclusively directed at men.

      Not to mention the newer feminist shame-words - chauvinist, sexist, and so on ... which are in fact gender neutral but only used by feminists to attack men.

      You need to dump your sexist feminist preconceptions, and look at language a little more closely.

    • Just Sayin' says:

      01:21pm | 30/05/11

      Thank you Erick, I agree, I really am awesome.

    • TracyH says:

      01:28pm | 30/05/11

      Ok Ok…:) Just Sayin is AWESOME smile

    • TracyH says:

      01:31pm | 30/05/11

      OK Eric…I’ll do ANOTHER degree on language just for you smile And I didn’t realize all those words were offensive…just factual descriptions…I apologize for every time I’ve said any of them about you when I read your posts smile

    • JulesG says:

      01:48pm | 30/05/11

      Tracy H: If you call a man a slut he’ll wear it like a badge. I don’t really understand why women are so offended by a mere word.

      Men have a plethora of abuse flung at them and most of it from women too. Why do you women persist in thinking that you are a special case?

    • Markus says:

      01:49pm | 30/05/11

      “And I didn’t realize all those words were offensive…just factual descriptions”
      Which is different to ‘slut’, how? raspberry

    • TracyH says:

      02:25pm | 30/05/11

      JulesG…yep…there are issues everywhere, about men (who as a general subset of the human species I admire), women, religion, politics blah blah…we are ALL special cases…not just us women. By your reasoning, no one would ever have an opinion about anything.
      If someone came up to your mum and called her a slut, would you shrug and say “gee Mum, don’t get upset, it’s just a mere word”?

    • TracyH says:

      02:35pm | 30/05/11

      tongue in cheek, Markus!

    • BK says:

      06:45pm | 30/05/11

      I will cut Tracy a deal. She can decide who she has sex with and I will decide who I respect.

    • dancan says:

      12:44pm | 30/05/11

      On one hand I agree with Emma, there is no excuse for guys to have so little self control over their actions.  A the excuse of “she was dressed in such a away” should never be deemed as a reasonable reason why a guy would sexually assault a woman.

      But at the same time I can’t help but think, most guys are brainless idiots especially of the footy fraternity (all codes). And after a few beers these same guys would have the cognitive reasoning of an ape, so then why would someone deliberately draw their attention in the most provocative manner possible?

    • mike j says:

      12:46pm | 30/05/11

      Histrionic personality disorder (HPD) is defined by the American Psychiatric Association as a personality disorder characterized by a pattern of excessive emotionality and attention-seeking, including an excessive need for approval and inappropriate seductiveness, usually beginning in early adulthood. These individuals are lively, dramatic, enthusiastic, and flirtatious.

      They may be inappropriately sexually provocative, express strong emotions with an impressionistic style, and be easily influenced by others. Associated features may include egocentrism, self-indulgence, continuous longing for appreciation, and persistent manipulative behavior to achieve their own needs.

      They often fail to see their own personal situation realistically, instead tending to dramatize and exaggerate their difficulties. Because they tend to crave novelty and excitement, they may place themselves in risky situations.

      Histrionic Personality Disorder is more often diagnosed in women than men.

    • JohnFindlay says:

      02:10pm | 30/05/11

      WOW ! That sum’s up these women perfectly ! I cant add a thing to this argument after that.

    • Fona says:

      08:27pm | 30/05/11

      Just like ADHD is more often diagnosed in males, right?

    • JulesG says:

      12:48pm | 30/05/11

      If women continue to whinge and bleat about their lot in this wholly biased, discriminatory and femenistic fashion, it’s not much wonder that most men would prefer to chuck rocks at ‘em.

      It’s getting to the point that men wouldn’t touch women with a barge pole, let alone rape them.

      NOT ALL MEN ARE SEXUAL AGGRESSORS!!!!!!!

    • Just Sayin' says:

      01:11pm | 30/05/11

      No, some of them are sexually repressed nutjobs, who wrongly think they are in a majority when they want to subject women to stonings.

    • les says:

      12:56pm | 30/05/11

      you are still allowed to think what you like,although they will probably try to stop that as well.

    • Go Girls says:

      12:56pm | 30/05/11

      I think these young women need to touch all sectors of Australian society.
      May I suggest they hold a “walk” at Cronulla Beach over a warm weekend during summer?

    • PJ says:

      01:31pm | 30/05/11

      Have you seen the calibre of freaks protesting?

      They aren’t in any danger of being raped.

    • JP says:

      01:52pm | 30/05/11

      I do agree that it appears to be a gathering of fuggos at these events…

    • Mr T says:

      01:31pm | 30/05/11

      “On June 13, however, I plan to leave the comfort and anonymity of the e-picket to march in Sydney’s SlutWalk”

      I’m hoping to be there on the side lines with large placards proclaiming my support for all sluts to be as sluttish as possible.

      Some ideas so far;

      Yay for sluts!
      Go sluts!
      Slut it up!
      Slut lover (with an arrow pointing at me)
      Slut 3:16
      No sluts for oil
      Up with miniskirts, down with trousers!
      Honk if you love sluts
      These sluts don’t run
      Who would Jesus do?

      Feel free to add a few more slogans punchers.

      *snicker*

    • Markus says:

      01:51pm | 30/05/11

      Embrace your inner slut. Or let me do it for you.

    • Tchom says:

      02:36pm | 30/05/11

      “I was sexually assaulted and all I got was this skimpy t-shirt”

    • mike j says:

      03:36pm | 30/05/11

      “More sluts, no buts.”

      “What’s your sign?”

      “Slutwalk: like a normal walk, only bowlegged.”

    • michael j says:

      01:41pm | 30/05/11

      SLUT i am as usual very confused , although i have never raped any one or even forced advances toward my ex wife,,and dispute the fact i am long past my sexual prime and physical copulation doesn’t interest me anymore,,
      using the word SLUT in the bedroom could at times be a turn on ,,
      or out wif the mate having a few rums,,check out the way that sluts dressed,,
      or asking a good looking Shiela home from the pub A Slut watta up ta,,
      maybe at the march past ,, Jesus ,check out all these Sluts,,
      or as the Policeman twist ya arm up ya spine,,i didn’t do anythink,i only said she was dressed like a ‘‘SLUT’’ ,I know but shes my sister,,
      Do women really know what they want ?

    • robert james says:

      01:42pm | 30/05/11

      why do women insist on showing as much of their bodies as possible? low cut fronts, split skirts, no backs, minis, micros, off the shoulder etc etc.  They then complain when a man looks at them! And no, before you all shout at me, i am not blaming women for rapes and sexual assaults. But i still want to know what is their obsession for walking around half naked.

    • Eva says:

      02:15pm | 30/05/11

      I can see this problem too. We are asking men not to act on their animal instincts and to tame their lust but are saying women can permit their animal instincts full rein and advertise their sexuality. Very strange dichotomy.

    • Godfrey Zohn says:

      07:54pm | 30/05/11

      Nice take on a predictable debate.  Doesn’t seem that many on here have been considering basic biology much.  Seemingly, birds, fish and animals put on special displays of plumage, change colour, or otherwise advertise themselves in a striking manner for the purposes of mating.  As I understand things, humans are considered animals too, and like other primates may become involved at various times in attempting to attract mates by changing our appearance to something approximating striking plumage.  The sending and receiving of a biological message like that apparently happens at a basic animal level.

      If this is a deep rooted biological thing, what amount of social constructions will it take to effect a meaningful change?

      Now to the difficult bit.  If women know that tarting themselves up in a certain way is effectively putting on the mating plumage and announcing availability, and then go and do it, receive attention from interested (but possibly inept) males, then complain about it - that seems a bit precious.

      If they don’t know what they’re doing (and I cannot see how that could possibly be) then they’re in denial of our animal side.  We’re nowhere near that Utopia yet.

      And, in no way should any of the above be taken as condoning any kind of interpersonal violence.  That’s just not on, no matter who you are.  Feel free to howl anyway…

      I accept that the Canadian officer was simply trying to be helpful, and his unwise comment has invoked the wrath of the usual shrill crowd, which in turn has provoked the usual responders.  Of one thing I’m certain, he will live a life of great regret over that comment, maybe deservedly, maybe not.

    • Tezza says:

      03:08pm | 30/05/11

      My wife and i (both in our sixties) would rarely be passing along George street north at ten o’clock at night, but last Saturday the Vivid Festival brought us in to Circular Quay to admire the light show. But the most entertaining part of the night was our walk back to the car past various nightspots with hefty bouncers and crowds of young people milling around outside.
      A few observations:
      Little do the sexes mix - most groups consisted of young men (say, 30% of the groups), young women (60% of the groups) or mixed (in only a tiny proportion were girls and boys mixing together).
      Did it look like they were “asking for it” - it depends what the “it’ is that they were asking for? it seemed to us that what the young girls were most in danger of was (in descending order):
      A twisted ankle (in the near future) or bunions and crippled feet (in the long run) from wearing shoes and heels that were too high and uncomfortable;
      A bad dose of the flu, or attack of hypothermia, from wearing too little clothing in freezing cold weather:- short skimpy backless dresses with plunging necklines, some also with extensive cut-outs (to show off the obligatory tattoos);
      Alcoholic poisoning (although, this risk seemed to be equally shared by the males as well as the females).
      Future regrets (this prediction is connected to the aforesaid tattoos being flaunted on exposed flesh (legs, shoulders, backs and breasts, hips and belly buttons). Has no-one told these girls that tattoo ink over time spreads into the surrounding flesh. A sharply outlined butterfly may look great when you are 24 years old. But why in God’s name choose to have it depicted on your midriff or the inside of a breast? At 45 or more, after children, on sagging flesh, it will probably just look sad.

    • Eva says:

      04:54pm | 30/05/11

      Spot on with your observation. And yet it seems we are not allowed to point out to young women the folly of their dress sense and advise them to think more carefully about what the outcome might be because that is offensive and denies them the right to dress as they like.

    • mike j says:

      05:02pm | 30/05/11

      Young women don’t get alcohol poisoning, they get: “Someone spiked my drink!”

      Always someone else’s fault.

    • :Fiona says:

      08:36pm | 30/05/11

      Good observations on the females, now the males please…..

    • Gidgee says:

      03:25pm | 30/05/11

      Gutter rubbish being dished up as the way to go for decent fair-dinkum womenfolk of Australia.
      The promoters of this garbage dressed up as courageous modernity need their heads read….sick, sad and stupid, the lot of it.

    • KV says:

      03:55pm | 30/05/11

      Why is it such a problem for some here that there is a SlutWalk happening. Quite a large diverse number of people are attending and seem to think that while its a shocking insult to many, the walk is against sexual violence and victim blaming. I think this discussion is interesting and there needs to be more debate and discussion on why this walk is necessary. But some of the discussion has turned full circle to insulting those running the SlutWalk and attending it and there’s even a suggestion of throwing stones at them. Why is this? Maybe it is confronting to some of the males here who stil think that women and others should be, dress, act in a certain way. The abuse shows that these ‘males’ (I assume) are threatened by women and supporters mobilising on the street over this issue. How stupid is that?

    • Markus says:

      04:30pm | 30/05/11

      “Why is it such a problem for some here that there is a SlutWalk happening”
      Because it is a stupid walk, based on stupid premises, with stupid goals, and no real aim as to how to achieve these already stupid goals.

      Feel free to change our minds by answering any of the following:
      - The walk is against sexual violence. Who exactly is for sexual violence?
      - How is walking going to prevent sexual violence?
      - Where does this culture of ‘victim blaming’ exist? Seriously, beside a couple of disgusting comments from some religious nuts, who has ever said that a victim deserved to be raped?
      - How does harm minimisation suggestions equal victim blaming?
      - How does one ‘reclaim’ a word that has always had a negative connotation?
      - How does reclaiming said word prevent sexual violence?

    • Tim says:

      04:58pm | 30/05/11

      The nominal theme of the walk is against victim blaming.
      If you read any of the information being provided on websites or blogs however, there are a number of other messages being promoted.

      Maybe we need a discussion why some people think they should be able to act however they want and no one is allowed to think less of them because of it?

    • Suzanne says:

      04:34pm | 30/05/11

      Some of the comments here are truly depressing…from the rape apologists favourite “I’m not saying victims are to blame but…”  to comments about how the protesters are in no danger of being raped because they’re “fuggos”/feminazis right down to women inviting sexual assault (groping, arse grabbing etc) because of her attire but full on rape is a no-no? What???. Any form of univited touching is a huge NO for anyone…male or female. I can’t believe we’re still having to tell people this.
      It scares me to think that some of you will have children who will grow up with this same attitude and the cycle continues again, men thinking that anyone who complains about the treatment of women can be written off as an hysterical feminist and anyone who bares a bit of skin is more likely to be raped than someone in a tracksuit. And women believing that being raped is somehow her fault because she enjoys sex or showed some cleavage one night.

    • Septimus says:

      05:14pm | 30/05/11

      Add women who completely misread the statement/intentions of the original police officer.

      Add women who completely misread the statements of men here.

      Add women who completely perpetuate what mainstream men think in order to fuel an argument that most men don’t believe, endorse or subscribe too.

      Don’t let these minor details get in the way of imagined hysterical thoughts and actions of men in the community.

      The greatest danger to the cause of women - is women themselves.

      You make shit up and then pretend it’s all men who either said it or believe it.

    • VVS says:

      05:32pm | 30/05/11

      Now I’m not saying victims are to blame but damn I am awesome…

      I didn’t read most of your post but assumed you were asking me out. The answer is: please provide a dating CV and you will be contacted by one of my assistants.

    • John says:

      05:46pm | 30/05/11

      I found the article quite disjointed and difficult to understand, beyond the subtext of “I’m angry” and “I’ll do what I want”.
      Ok, fair enough, do what you want, that is your choice, but if you choose to be you must also accept the consequences of being provocative. I would agree with you that all violence against another human is wrong, but please take the seemingly simple step of distinguishing between fantasy and reality. For example, it is one thing to say how things ‘should be’, it is quite another to state how they are. You cannot link the idea of ‘niche sex sites’ as evidence that a strategy doesn’t work. Unless that niche site is targeting the issue of interest here, nonconsensual sexual violence. I would suggest to you that if you look at sites simulating those kinds of activities then you will see a whole lot of scantily clad women being provocative. And furthermore, some very basic errors of logic are evident here, such as suggesting that because there has been at least one case of a woman being sexually attacked in ‘button-down office wear’,in the history of humankind, then all women are at risk in such attire. Actually, when people talk about minimising risk, they mean doing what you can to avoid risk. So while taking suitable precautions to minimise the risk of an attack may not completely eliminate any chances of one, on aggregate those who reduce their risk will observe better outcomes than those who flout the risk. At the risk of sounding condescending here, I’m going to give an example to ensure my point is clear: One reason why a motorist might drive their car slowly is to reduce the likelihood that they will have an accident. And for the most part main roads data supports the notion that it does, however, there are occasions where accidents occur due to circumstances that cannot be legislated for.

    • John the Zombie says:

      07:04pm | 30/05/11

      Interesting we all these types of walks yet I am truely waiting for one that will take back our streets. I only point this out because on this site alone there has been so much reporting of the walk and what it stands for and this and that yet the media seem to glaze something that is even worse in our community that is the violence on our city streets.

      I point this out as there is a young man in Perth who is fighting for his life. His only crime was going out like many young people his age. He was attacked and beaten into a coma by a group of six men.

    • Septimus says:

      04:39am | 31/05/11

      There’s no mileage in ‘men are the victim’ stories.  It’s much more important to decry how women are so badly treated in society.

      Ever noticed how there are no ‘male’ related articles, it’s always about how the world is attacking women.

    • AG says:

      09:18pm | 30/05/11

      Is this the new age freak show, can’t wait. Is there going to be jugglers and bands and a couple of token transvestites as well.

    • Bruce Diamond. says:

      09:21pm | 30/05/11

      I think men should really appreciate how lucky we are today that woman can actually be themselves and dress how-ever they want to dress, woman are beautiful and just because some may choose to wear something revealing does not mean they should be treated with a lack of respect and abused instead they should be complimented on how ‘hot’ they look!!!
      Real men don’t hurt woman they protect them,love them,admire them,encourage them,buy them the sluttiest clothes possible (in the hope they will wear them)coz they love them!!
      I say “enjoy it guys,treasure it,and be proud of our woman regardless of how they dress, if I was a woman and was proud of my body regardless of its shape or size I would wear the most revealing clothes I could find if I wanted to”,
      And girls I hope you don’t let what I truly hope is a (minority) of men put you off just ‘being your-self ‘.
      Sadly many men have ‘double standards’ when it comes to how a woman dresses,and there are times I am ashamed to be a male.

    • St. Michael says:

      11:43pm | 30/05/11

      Said it before.  Will say it again.  Given the rarity of being raped by a total stranger down a back alley somewhere due principally to the clothes you’re wearing, suggesting you have to cover up is on a par with recommending asteroid insurance if you work outside.

      If you don’t like the fact women’s skirts are now higher than they were in the fifties, at least have the courage to come out and say so without patronising said women that you’re making the suggestions “for their safety”.

    • MrEd says:

      06:05am | 31/05/11

      To be honest, most of the images I have seen of these walks from around the world, most of the participants are dreaming if they think they are worth ” aggressive ogling”

    • Lachlan says:

      07:55am | 31/05/11

      Not that this has anything to do with the topic, but the picture above for the story, really reminds me of bands like Poison & Warrant, bands known for their promiscuity .... I’ll just leave that there for the over enthusiastic.

    • fox says:

      11:38am | 31/05/11

      I wonder why the feminists in Australia didn’t protest a fraction as much against the Australian ex-imam when he called them ‘uncovered meat’.. compared with their faux-outrage against a Canadian policeman who was trying to help Canadian women to minimise their chances of being raped, just as a police officer would advise someone to lock their doors, not walk alone at 2am while drunk etc etc.

      Why the double standard?

    • jg says:

      01:43pm | 31/05/11

      I once lived in Marrakesh for a while. In the souk pretty much, Jema El Fnaa to be precise.

      During the day and into the evening it is a wonderful place. Vibrant, happy, and quite safe.

      But, as my Morrocan friends pointed out, don’t go walking the deserted alleyways of the souks after everything has closed up or you’ll end up dead.

      So, women should be able to wear anything they like whenever they like without having to fear being attacked or raped. That is a given.

      However, as much as I wish the world was a lovely safe place for all at all times no matter what the circumstances, it’s not. It is a world is full of evil people who don’t think like normal people so it’s better to be safe than sorry.

      It’s not victim blaming, it’s common sense. Just like staying out of the back alleys of Marrakesh at night.

 

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