It’s the 11th anniversary of September 11. Almost 3,000 were killed in the terrorist attacks. Two giant impressions, above, remain at the site as a memorial. The names of the deceased are dotted around the waterfalls.

11 years on

As President Obama put it last week, Osama Bin Laden is dead, al-Qaeda’s leadership decimated and a new tower is soaring above New York. The new One World Trade Centre building is taller than the Empire State.

Re-read some of our coverage of the 2011’s 10-year anniversary: US correspondent Paul Toohey on hope, Punch writer Dan Piotrowski on growing up in the age of terrorism, architect Phillip Vivian’s take on the “dignity and humanity” of the original World Trade Centre towers and Ant Sharwood’s letter to his son, whose birthday is on 9/11.

It’s Tuesday. What’s on your mind?

Comments on this post close at 8pm AEST.

Most commented

105 comments

Show oldest | newest first

    • Bazza says:

      07:17am | 11/09/12

      @ M .....and there is nobody more sensitive than a Punch journo

    • TimB says:

      08:08am | 11/09/12

      A well written piece.

      Twitter is the online equivalent of someone sitting in a town square shouting with a megaphone. Don’t be surprised if someone shouts right back with stuff you dont want to hear.

      There’s ways to avoid these trolls. Use them. That’s if your ego can survive.

    • M says:

      08:22am | 11/09/12

      I dunno, some of the commentators here are prone to hysterics. I blame Tony Abbott’s scare mongering.

    • TChong says:

      07:16am | 11/09/12

      Sept 11
      Plenty of articles to reflect on this day,
      except for a notable ommission.
      Articles bearing witness for the 100s of thousands of Iraqis ( mainly ) who were killed by the “Coalition “., based on outright lies by Bush, Cheney, Blair, Rice ,Powell, and their willing bootlickers.
      People murdered because of these criminals lies.

    • Babylon says:

      07:49am | 11/09/12

      ” Aaah There will be no weapons of mass destruction in a Government I lead”

      And another

      “i tell you what i am sick of, its the Liberals rumour mungering and smear campaign, saying we are moving towards weapons of mass destruction”

    • TheRealDave says:

      11:43am | 11/09/12

      And yet not a single word typed with the same handwringing angst that the actual facts are that OVER 80% of ALL civilian casualties in Iraq and in Afghanistan were actually caused/perpetrated by local insurgent/miltiias rather than western forces.

      Lest We Forget…I mean Lest We Re-Write Hsitory as it Happens

    • vox says:

      12:42pm | 11/09/12

      And Howard, Chongy. Don’t forget Howard. Ably assisted by the ever willing bootlicker, Abbott.
      I’ve often asked the question, “Why are our young people put in harm’s way as the result of an outright lie, and no-one held responsible?”.
      How convenient for the Conservative side to keep churning out the “No carbon tax” mantra because she didn’t have a mandate. She did tell us prior to the 2010 election that she would be embarking on some form of legislative control, which is a damn sight more than the Lib/Nats did when they took us to war without a mandate, on information that the Howard Government knew was fallacious, which action resulted in our nation being involved in the deaths of thousands of innocents, as well as the deaths of our own young.
      But where are the Liberal and National Party’s critics? Not against higher prices, they are a fact of life for one reason or another and have always been with us; not against fining companies that over-pollute, that too has been with us for ages; not against a polly change-of-mind, as evidenced by Abbott’s tax/no tax/tax/but not that tax, that too is a common occurence, but against us as a nation assisting another nation in the furthering of their political agenda. And all based on the basest of lies.
      W.M.D.? Wilful Murder of the Defenceless!  And Howard, and Abbott knew it. That is the crime of which they stand accused.

    • Babylon says:

      07:41am | 11/09/12

      Labor have asked Tony Abbott to give an account in Parliament of why, when he was a toddler and there were strong minded women in the room, he would always soil his nappy.

      Prominent Labor Front Benchers cited this, along with the fact that he leads the Opposition, as evidence that he is a mysogynist and unable to accept the divinity of Julia Gillard.

      Labor Front Bencher: “the fact that he is critical of Julia Gillards Government is evidence in itself that he has a problem with women. Because some opposition members were critical of shiny tight black leather skirts as inappropriate attire for a Senior Leader, also shows the rest of the party have it in for women”

    • Mahhrat says:

      08:59am | 11/09/12

      @Babylon, you do realise when you say such things, that you’re only hurting your argument?

      Yes, I apply the same to the comments last week about Abbott punching walls and such - if he’d acted inappropriately, he should have been brought to task for it.  Claiming it 10 years later is disingenuous to say the least.

      Lowering yourself to that level, however, does your side no favours either.

    • AdamC says:

      09:27am | 11/09/12

      Haha, indeed.

      To me, there is no better illustration of the unbalanced way in which the media treat the leaders of our two major parties than this ridiculous ‘wallgate’ story. The story is based around an unlikely incident that, if it occurred at all, happened when Tony Abbott was at university several decades ago. Despite this, and despite the accusation never having come to light previously in the course of Tony Abbott’s career - making it even less credible - the story has been splashed about with reckless abandon.

      Compare this to the conspiracy of silence by the press about Julia Gillard’s notorious, yet only recently reported, conduct in her professional career. The contrast in the treatement of the two could not be more stark, or put our self-important, pampered press in a worse light. I guess the adage of ‘we report, you decide’ is a bit too Fox News for our journos. At least when the matter concerns the ALP.

    • M says:

      10:29am | 11/09/12

      I’m getting modded over roxon today. Seems the punch is pro ALP as well.

    • Tim says:

      11:39am | 11/09/12

      AdamC,
      perhaps you missed the week of coverage of the Julia Gillard incident with no new evidence being presented after the story has been repeatedly mentioned over many years? No?

      I think both stories show the lengths our politicians and supporters will go to to try and discredit their opponents. It’s completely gutter behaviour.

      Seriously, does anyone care that Tony Abbott may or may not have verbally abused someone 20 years ago? Anyone that allowed that to affect their vote is an imbecile. Non story.

    • TimB says:

      11:54am | 11/09/12

      Agree completely Adam. I am utterly flabbergasted at the ridiculous doble standard shown by much of the media here.

      A well documented incident concerning Gillard that took place when she was an adult & during her professional career is whitewashed by sympathetic media types with hysterical calls of ‘Nothing to see here!’

      But a hearsay story with zero evidence, concerning something Abbott *might* have done at university over 30 years ago is treated as it’s about to blow up into one of the greatest political scandals of our age.

      Utterly ridiculous. Just how lacking in self-awareness are these people?

    • andye says:

      12:47pm | 11/09/12

      @AdamC - “Compare this to the conspiracy of silence by the press about Julia Gillard’s notorious, yet only recently reported, conduct in her professional career. “

      What a load of twaddle. I’ve seen way more about the Gillard thing than this new wall punch thing.

    • AdamC says:

      12:57pm | 11/09/12

      @Tim, you cannot be serious. The media sat on te Gillard story for years. It was not widely reported at all. The reporting of it that you mention only happened after:

      a) a ‘misogynist nut job’ blogger kept reporting it on his website, so it became well-known online; and

      b) a journo from the Australian got hold of some minutes from a meeting with her colleagues that suggested Gillard left Slaters because of her misjudgements.

      Meanwhile this Abbott story comes out, with no corroboration and despite Tony Abbott saying that it didn’t happen. (Which it most likely didn’t.) If you cannot see the double standard being applied here, you must be blind or, at least, be keeping your eyes shut.

      On the other hand, I agree that neither story is especially relevant to the big issues facing this nation, etc.

      @TimB, exactly.

    • Babylon says:

      01:11pm | 11/09/12

      Gillard was 37.
      Abbott was 17.

      One million bucks has disappeared.
      Insignificant student election prancing.

      Just not in the same league, not in the same world.

      Shows how desperate the Gillard Government Smear Machine is getting.

    • Bailey says:

      01:46pm | 11/09/12

      babble-on
      You sure it wasn’t a billion dollars that went missing?
      We all know how bad you are with numbers.

    • iansand says:

      01:48pm | 11/09/12

      It is consistent with what I know of Abbott at university.

    • TimB says:

      02:42pm | 11/09/12

      ‘It is consistent with what I know of Abbott at university.’

      Yes, you still haven’t explained that paticular chip on your shoulder.

      What did he do iansand? Call you a mean name? Make fun of your haircut? Beat you in debate club? I’m sure it must have been horribly traumatic for you whatever it was, look how bent out of shape you are over thirty years later.

      @ ‘Bailey’- Every source I’ve checked cooberrates the figures. Of course if you know different I’m sure you’ll be able to supply the correct ones. Right?....No?

      Looks like all you’ve got is smear. Off you go now.

    • Tim says:

      02:44pm | 11/09/12

      Adam,
      I don’t think you can be serious.

      Marr’s piece is much more broad than simply talking about this one incident but I’m not surprised the media have picked up on this tiny part of it, because they know it might sell a paper or two. Nothing to do with bias and everything to do with a little bit of sensationalism.

      The story will be gone by tomorrow and I don’t think anyone has taken it very seriously at all.
      Even Marr didn’t think it was serious:
      http://www.news.com.au/national/tony-abbott-accused-of-punching-wall-next-to-woman-after-university-election-in-1977/story-fndo4eg9-1226470799407

      The Gillard story has been brought up over many years despite no new evidence being presented that she’s done anything wrong. The fact that the mainstream media reported stuff that was being said by Pickering at all is more than enough. And the coverage was far more extensive than over the Abbott incident.

    • Chris L says:

      02:45pm | 11/09/12

      “Meanwhile this Abbott story comes out, with no corroboration and despite Tony Abbott saying that it didn’t happen”

      You mean like how the only evidence against Gillard is some hearsay at a meeting, and the accusations must ignore the fact that Gordon & Slater have already held an investigation and found no wrong doing.

      If you want to keep flogging the issue that’s fine, but don’t complain when the other side take a leaf out of your own book.

    • iansand says:

      03:16pm | 11/09/12

      And TimB dashes furiously into the fray, pedalling his little tricycle as hard as he can while brandishing his wet bus ticket….

    • TimB says:

      03:24pm | 11/09/12

      Ergh, *corroborates. Awful.

      @ Chris:

      ‘You mean like how the only evidence against Gillard is some hearsay at a meeting, and the accusations must ignore the fact that Gordon & Slater have already held an investigation and found no wrong doing.’

      Investigation into what Chris? Surely they didn’t investigate *nothing*.

      That’s the difference here. We have hard evidence that Gillard’s incident happened. (The details of the exact depth of her involvement is an entirely different issue). There’s a paper trail. It’s on the record. And the media didn’t want to talk about it. When they finally did so, it was with extreme reluctance after much kicking and screaming.

      Whereas where this incident with Abbott is concerned, there’s no evidence whatsoever that it actually happened at all. Nothing more than an unproven statement made 30 years after the fact! Yet the media is all over it straight away demanding answers to something that stands a very good chance of being outright fantasy.

      Are you capable of seeing the glaring difference? Babylon sums it up quite well:

      “Gillard was 37.
      Abbott was 17.

      One million bucks has disappeared.
      Insignificant student election prancing”

      And this is assuming that what Abbott is accused of even happened at all. This whole thing is beyond ridiculous.

    • Tim says:

      03:59pm | 11/09/12

      TimB,
      $1 000 000 has disappeared.

      See once again the innuendo. No one (of any substance) has claimed that Gillard had anything to do with any misused union funds.
      That’s what “other” people are accused of. Unless you want to start playing guilt by association?

    • TimB says:

      04:01pm | 11/09/12

      ‘And TimB dashes furiously into the fray, pedalling his little tricycle as hard as he can while brandishing his wet bus ticket…. ‘

      I was involved on this thread before you iansand. If anyone is dashing into any ‘fray’, it’s you.

      And still no details about this horrible trauma Abbott supposedly inflicted on you at uni. Makes me wonder if anything actually happened at all.

      Much more likely is iansand shooting his mouth off yet again without any actual substance to his words. You can tell by the way he goes to his old standby of avoiding the questions and instead deflects wildly.

      Looks like Bailey isn’t the only one engaging in smear. iansand’s doing a pretty damn good job himself.

    • iansand says:

      04:24pm | 11/09/12

      There is nothing funnier than a 16 year old with a bruised ego.  Thanks for the laughs, TimB.

    • TimB says:

      04:48pm | 11/09/12

      ‘There is nothing funnier than a 16 year old with a bruised ego.  Thanks for the laughs, TimB. ‘

      I’m confused, who’s ego is being bruised? Can’t be mine, I’ve got nothing to feel embarrassed about. Are you talking about yourself? Was 16 how old you were when Abbott stole your lunch money or whatever it was?

      Come on iansand, man up. You’re constantly on here telling us about how horrible Abbott is from ‘personal experience’. What did he do to you? Out with the details. Or is being held to account for what you say a foreign concept for you?

      You see iansand, “He’s a really horrible person because I said so!’ doesn’t really cut it in the world of adults. I can’t for the life of me figure out why you seem to think that it does.

    • AdamC says:

      05:01pm | 11/09/12

      @Tim, and yet it was still widely reported. That was my point.

      Also, as I have mentioned many times before, the issue for Gillard and Slatergate is that she demonstrated bad judgement in taking a dodgy union official as a lover and also taking him as a client. I do not believe there is any dispute about that.

      @TimB, I think iansand might have a crush on you ...

    • Ben C says:

      05:29pm | 11/09/12

      @ TimB

      Methinks iansand won’t divulge on his personal experiences with Tony Abbott because:

      a) it would bring unwanted attention onto himself; and/or
      b) he could potentially be up for libel if he does; and/or
      c) it was just your average disgareement in which harsh words were exchanged, and there’s nothing further to it (in which case iansand could just be grandstanding here).

    • TimB says:

      05:58pm | 11/09/12

      I’m going to go with option C Ben.  Not only does it fit in with iansands usual style, if the mystery incident in question was serious enough that A or B applied, he wouldn’t risk mentioning it at all.

      Nah, it’s much easier for iansand to make loud noises about how horrible Abbott is, without actually backing up his words with anything of substance. And then he actually expects us to take him seriously. You couldn’t make it up.

    • TimB says:

      06:10pm | 11/09/12

      Actually Ben, the more I think about it, B can’t be a legitimate option. Libel would only apply if iansand was simply making crap up.

      Surely iansand wouldn’t be lying to us now? wink

    • Alfie says:

      07:47am | 11/09/12

      Interesting article in the QMagazine (Courier Mail) this weekend. The Health Minister Lawrence Springborg taling about the Queensland Health IT payroll system introdused under Labor. IBM priced the system at $6.1m and it ended up costing $1.25b (yes billion!!!). Springborg said; “It’s like going down to the dealer and paying $7m for a Holden commodor, or $400 for a Mars Bar.”

      The sheer incompetence of the Bligh government is hard to comprehend.

    • JimmyMac says:

      08:58am | 11/09/12

      It’s very easy to be critical in hindsight. Do you really think we will be saying positive things about Campbell Newman when his time is up? No, I don’t think so.
      I am sure all those who voted against Labor just to prove a point are feeling very insecure at the moment. How is your job looking?

    • TimB says:

      09:55am | 11/09/12

      ‘I am sure all those who voted against Labor just to prove a point are feeling very insecure at the moment. “

      Unless they’re in the public service, (and as such highly unlikely to have voted LNP), I don’t think they would have any reason to feel secure. No more than normal.

      And (assuming these figures are correct) how in hell do you excuse a cost blowout of over 20,000%?!

      ‘I’m sure Campbell Newman will look a bit shit at the end’.

      What a moronic cop-out.

    • Alfie says:

      10:09am | 11/09/12

      “Critical in hindisight.” So who wrote the cheques to IBM?

      Newman is a godsend compared to the previous clowns. He is not wasting a good mandate.

      BTW. My job is fine. I own a business ad Qld is looking good again.

    • JimmyMac says:

      10:36am | 11/09/12

      Don’t get me wrong. I am not saying Bligh was great, just that there is no evidence that Newman would/could have done better.

    • TimB says:

      10:53am | 11/09/12

      Sorry that should be ‘any reason to feel INsecure’. Oops.

    • Alfie says:

      11:26am | 11/09/12

      Newman is not wasting his mandate. The parasites in the public sector are now getting what they deserve.

    • Compassionate Conservative says:

      01:12pm | 11/09/12

      Alfie
      parasites in the public sector?

      You mean mums and dads that have families and mortgages?
      Ordinary people who went to school, got qualifications and found employment in the public sector?

      Conservatives are a funny lot.
      Private sector good, public sector bad.
      You take a position in the public sector and you deserve to be fired and your life turned upside down.

    • Babylon says:

      01:32pm | 11/09/12

      The project was stuffed full of temporary 457 workers who had no knowledge of Australian payroll regulation.

    • M says:

      01:55pm | 11/09/12

      No, you just shouldn’t be surprised if occaisionally you get sacked because your employer is incompetant.

      By the by, the common perception is that the public sector is pretty much a work for the dole programme. From what I’ve heard from the public servants I’ve known, this isn’t too far away from the truth.

    • Tim says:

      02:29pm | 11/09/12

      M,
      and the common perception of marijuana smokers is that they’re all mentally deficient no hopers who spend all their time sleeping and eating pizza.
      From what I’ve heard (and seen) from the marijuana smokers I’ve known, this isn’t too far away from the truth.

    • M says:

      02:41pm | 11/09/12

      Did I hit a nerve timmy?

    • Compassionate Conservative says:

      02:57pm | 11/09/12

      Excellent work Tim

      out the opinionated hypocrite.

    • Tim says:

      04:03pm | 11/09/12

      M,
      i’ve previously said I worked in the public sector years ago. Never been back.

      And the only nerve you hit is my dislike of hypocrites.

    • M says:

      04:29pm | 11/09/12

      How am I a hypocrit? I have a friend who works for dept. transport nsw, she says she does sweet FA. Another mate does the IT for some other department, same story. Tubesteak says he has a relo who works in the RMS. Same story.

      At some point, you guys have got to stop pretending that most public servants aren’t lazy.

    • andye says:

      04:59pm | 11/09/12

      @Alfie - OK I’m reading about that now. I think the project didn’t end up costing that much, the project failed. The crap they have to go through till they get it done again is going to cost the whatever billion.

      So: Catastrophic project failure. That must surely have been career-ending for a few people at IBM. Oh it was SAP too. That is pretty much THE big one. “Nobody ever got fired for buying IBM” was the old saying. Apparently not true here. I am not really knowledgeable in that area but a $6.1 million project is probably right at the bottom of the barrel for SAP projects. I think they go often into hundreds of millions.

      The government probably didn’t have anyone decent enough at their end to truly understand the project from a business or technical level and failed to twig that IBM was driving towards a cliff. So there is definitely a failure of oversight from the client, most likely.

      People probably have a lot of opinions about it at different levels, but from an executive perspective IBM/SAP is the pretty much the definition of a conservative business choice. IBM messed up bad, and the client obviously failed to see it coming.

    • Tim says:

      05:07pm | 11/09/12

      M,
      So you have heard of a couple of lazy public servants and that’s definitive evidence?

      And you’re over on that other thread talking about science and how ignorant people have been fed government propaganda about marijuana.

      Can you not see that perhaps you’ve been fed bullshit by people who see an easy target in public servant bashing because they can’t fight back?
      The same way that people make lazy assumptions about drug users?

      I’m not saying that there aren’t lazy and inefficient public servants because there most certainly are. But on the whole I’ve not seen much of a difference in either sector.

    • Kerryn says:

      07:58am | 11/09/12

      My sister is 16 tomorrow.  How do I stop her from growing up?  She already has a boyfriend and her life planned out, including Uni and migrating the the U.S.

      I still can’t get out of the habit of calling her my baby sister.  Then again, my brother is 21 and he’s still my baby brother…*sigh*.  So hard being the oldest.

    • M says:

      09:28am | 11/09/12

      Make sure she has a twitter account. She’ll never grow up then.

    • Kerryn says:

      09:45am | 11/09/12

      She never uses it!  Too busy with the boyfriend and dance class and school.

      Should be grateful that she’s giving school a go I guess.

    • Scotchfinger says:

      01:05pm | 11/09/12

      I won’t allow my daughter to have a boyfriend until she is twenty five. And even then, fully chaperoned for the first year.

    • Chris L says:

      02:51pm | 11/09/12

      ... and she can only date gay men, eh Scotch?

    • Mouse says:

      03:21pm | 11/09/12

      ...but she can have a “girlfriend”  then Scotchie??  lol   ;o)

    • Scotchfinger says:

      04:14pm | 11/09/12

      hey guys, I’m not crazy! She can date thoroughly vetted men who intend to marry her. For others, a little ‘chat’ with ‘my li’l frien’...

    • Mouse says:

      05:53pm | 11/09/12

      hahahahahahahahahaha Scotchie,only joshing with ya’ mate!
      Most Dads are like you with their princesses, as it should be!
      I’m more concerned with who/what your ” li’l frien’...” is, as I know what it is for some of the other men I know!  LOL ;o)

    • Chris L says:

      07:48pm | 11/09/12

      The best story from a dad I can recall was one guy who told his daughter’s date that anything he did with her, the dad was going to do with him.

      Aparently they remained perfectly chaste for the whole evening.

    • Michael says:

      08:26am | 11/09/12

      Guide, companion, guardian. The trick, is knowing when to be which.

    • Gregg says:

      08:34am | 11/09/12

      You would have to be isolated somewhere to know that more people have been landed on Christmas Island in the past month than even Nauru or Manus Island can hold.
      http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nauru-and-manus-island-full-before-they-even-open/story-e6freuy9-1226471367247

      It would seem there is a pressing need for the government to extend their Pacific solution into basically setting up refugee camps somewhere, ala the tent city standards of UNHCR camps to minimise what the cost to Australian taxpayers will be for what will be progressively increasing to tens of thousands of asylum claimants.

      There should just be registration and no further processing other than what would normally occur in the time frame of processing refugees out of camps for we have people who are prepared to take us for a ride with our generosity.

      Thankyou Kevin Rudd & Co.

    • No more preferential treatment says:

      09:53am | 11/09/12

      I think a tent encampment (District 9 style) in the desert bordering the Ord River region in WA. Encircle it with some decent fencing and have guards patrolling. Supply them with gardening tools and seeds to grow crops. Provide basic medical assistance and then, when it is time to process them, fail their refugee claims and send the country shoppers back home. (with the exception of maybe the 0.5% who are genuine refugees and not country shoppers)

    • Scotchfinger says:

      01:17pm | 11/09/12

      tent encampment? ha! sounds like a holiday camp. Make the processing centre a floating jail in the Timor Sea, with chum continuously tossed out to encourage sharks. The ‘shoppers’ only eat what they can catch; only drink what fresh water they can distill. Make a ruthless, dog-eat-dog world for them, it’s what they are used to back home after all…

    • Chris L says:

      03:08pm | 11/09/12

      They’re already on an island. Might as well at least make a season of Survivor out of it.

    • Mouse says:

      03:50pm | 11/09/12

      The problem is that Nauru, even though not open yet,  is already full and by the time Manus Island is running that will be full too. The President of Manus has said that he wants the illegals processed quickly. How does that equate with “waiting the same time as those in the camps”? Is this going to be a reason that they will be resettled in Australia quicker?
      The acceptance of offshore processing at Nauru and Manus Islands, without the TVPs,  was never going to discourage people getting into a boat. The fact that we have a yes/no/yes Labor government may also be a reason. At least when the Libs said “this is what is going to happen”, we could pretty well be sure it was going to happen!

      ChrisL and Scotchie, I was trying to be serious, but, alas, you two keep me RFLMAO!! The trouble is that I could actually see a great reality show being made of it, bit sicko I know, but Gawd it would be funny!!  :oD

    • Scotchfinger says:

      04:16pm | 11/09/12

      Mouse, who said I was joking?

    • Chopper knows says:

      05:26pm | 11/09/12

      I’d recommend the good folk of Ipswich and surrounding areas to vacate there premises in a orderly manner, if this does not occur then send in the troops and do an Afghan style house invasion. Folks with centrelink forms, Bintang singlets, Beanies and rotted Holdens in the front yard will be asked to resign to hard labour in the fields of Cambodia on humanitarian work. The asylum seekers will be given the area to procreate as they wish and to provide and better life and stable furture for themselves and their families smile

    • Bill says:

      09:47am | 11/09/12

      I’m not sure why the punch mods refused to publish my post re the tragic death of John McCarthy, but I’ll try again.

      Rest in peace young man.

    • Shane* says:

      12:06pm | 11/09/12

      Did your comment take any thinly-veiled swipes at NRL fans over the popularity of their code, seeing as how you seem fixated on the issue?

      If so, I imagine that would be enough for the mods to cut it, and rightfully so.

    • simonfromlakemba says:

      09:51am | 11/09/12

      11 Years down the track and what has really changed? two wars still raging on, people dieing everyday, corrupt Government replaced by the same thing, just more appeasing to American interests.

      Has it been worth it? who knows as us plebs only get told what the Government wants us to hear. The allies have got Bin Laden, the Taliban is fractured but still fighting on, large scale attacks against America are down but Spain and London got hit. To me it seems nothing has really been gained as such.

      to lose 3000 ppl in one go America/Bush had to do something, but just went about it the wrong way and too quickly just to capitalise on the political aspect of it.

    • Catherine Who? says:

      09:55am | 11/09/12

      I watched Q and A last night…one question…Who the hell is Catherine Deveny? What an arrogant and self righteous person she is.

    • simonfromlakemba says:

      11:06am | 11/09/12

      Shes the lefts version of Bolt, Akerman, Jones.

      Being from the left I find her pretty bad and vile. Disappointing how she still gets any airtime.

    • Anna C says:

      11:20am | 11/09/12

      What I want to know is why do they insist on calling her a comedian?  I’ve never found anything she has said or written remotely funny.

    • Alfie says:

      11:37am | 11/09/12

      Appears she was surplus to requirements over at The Age.

      All Twitter, no brain.

    • P. Darvio says:

      12:26pm | 11/09/12

      Who’s Peter Jensen? – oh that’s right – that Arrogant and self-righteous Jensen - Jensen must have really good/smart PR people - on the same day that NSW Police reopened the case against 3 Anglican Priests whose own organisation have turfed out because of alleged paedophile rape against a young boy he redirects the media and others attention to the bible based hate agenda by homochristianity and homochristians during QandA.

      http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3587254.htm

      He is a very clever man indeed!!

    • Shane* says:

      02:20pm | 11/09/12

      Deveny. Ugh.

      HIYA DARVS!

      It’s been a while, mate, where’ve you been? For a second there I thought maybe you’d found God!

    • marley says:

      02:35pm | 11/09/12

      Deveney wrote an article for the Drum a couple of weeks ago in which she said “But like most Australians I do not grade, rank or class people.”  I almost choked on my cornflakes.

      I then read the article, in which she went on to grade, rank and class everyone who had a different point of view on asylum seekers than she does.  Whether Bolt, Akerman and Jones are hypocrites, I couldn’t say - I don’t follow any of them enough to know.  But about Deveney I’m quite certain.

    • James1 says:

      10:12am | 11/09/12

      marley, my apologies for not getting to your questions about Twitter and Facebook yesterday - I was snowed under all afternoon, so here is my response.

      I use Facebook largely as a tool to interact with my friends around the world for (almost) free on my mobile.  We use the chat function to regularly interact (and Skype when we need to talk with our voices), and we share photos, videos and links to news articles and blogs we found interesting.  I also subscribe to major journals and newspapers I like, and some (like The Economist and Washington Post) are quite adept at regularly posting interesting stories on their Facebook pages.  I also follow blogs I am interested in, as some have an excellent presence on Facebook (like 27bslash6 or STFU Parents).  I avoid the downsides of Facebook by simply blocking anyone who tries to add or interact with me that I don’t like, or that I don’t want to interact with, and I have my privacy settings adjusted so that people can’t see any of my content with me having added them as a friend first, and further so that people who aren’t at least a friend of a friend can’t even see that I exist on Facebook.

      With Twitter, I have an account, but I don’t tweet at all, and I don’t have anyone following me.  I follow mostly comedians like Ricky Gervais and Louis C.K. to read their tweets (which, admittedly, are sometimes insulting but not towards me), and a few friends who are heavily engaged with blogging and online media who regularly post articles and suchlike that they find interesting.

      Like I said yesterday, you have to look at these things as tools that you can fit to your purposes.  Celebrities (understandably) don’t use these tools the way that I do, receive a barrage of horrible stuff, and this makes people wonder why anyone even uses them, in the process forgetting that, like all tools, you use them to acheive the task you set yourself.

    • marley says:

      01:44pm | 11/09/12

      @James1 - thanks for that.  I can see why (and how) you use FB - but that’s a pretty different usage than most people get out of it.  As you say,  it’s a tool, and if you misuse a tool, you can get hurt.

    • James1 says:

      02:58pm | 11/09/12

      I think a lot of people don’t even realise it is possible, to be honest.  Many people think of Facebook simply as an application, and forget that you actually get to choose how you engage with it.

      Also, a lot of the commentary we get on this is from public figures, who must by necessity engage with social media in a way that nobodies like me would not.  I think this skews the perception of the utility of social media for a lot of people.  Well, that and the inanity of so many people’s use of social media.  I recently unadded my brother in law’s wife, because she has been clogging up my Facebook feed with photos of her new baby wearing various different outfits under the guise of “documenting her life” - I wanted to tell her what documenting something means, but thought it easier to simply remove her from my friends list.

    • Baloo says:

      12:40pm | 11/09/12

      Logic? in my country?

      Rabble rabble rabble let’s ban something to balance it out!

    • Anubis says:

      01:11pm | 11/09/12

      In reading that article I saw the following “A Nine spokeswoman said Nine would fast-track content but was not able to say, at this stage, which shows would be affected”.

      Maybe that would be because Nine’s staple diet for a long time now is run a series when it is fresh then repeat it over and over and over and over whilst ignoring new series releases of the show. Big Bang Theory is one case in point. They started airing the new series and then, after only half a dozen or so new episodes they reverted to running repeats. The rest of the new episodes still have not bee n screened. Just how many times can you watch repeats of BBT, 2 1/2 men, Modern Family. My son doesn’t bother with BBT any more because when an episode starts he canrecite it word for word because it has been screened so often.

      Of Course Channel Nine are “not able to say, at this stage, which shows would be affected”.  because rushing repeats of repeats of repeats of repeats to air would achieve nothing.

    • M says:

      01:19pm | 11/09/12

      Channel 10 should be banned.

    • M says:

      01:52pm | 11/09/12

      Classic Anubis.

    • AFR says:

      02:06pm | 11/09/12

      New season of Sons of Anarchy kicks off tonight in the US. Wonder how long it will take to screen here.

    • Baloo says:

      02:25pm | 11/09/12

      36 hours or something on foxtel is what I read AFR.
      I personally am wait for Game of Thrones to start, but I just finished watching Sons of Anarchy season 4 and now I’m hooked.

    • TimB says:

      12:26pm | 11/09/12

      Is there something going on with the comments?

      As of the time of posting (12.25), no comments have been posted since before 10AM. That’s two and a half hours. Makes the whole excercise seem rather futile…

    • M says:

      12:49pm | 11/09/12

      I’m wondering whether I’m being censored again or if there’s a backlog and they’ll all come streaming in at once.

    • Pers says:

      01:41pm | 11/09/12

      They are about to close the site.

      The paywalls are coming down on News Ltd. sites and they can’t afford the moderators salaries. These resources are being diverted to other duties - They need the resources to sub copy from Darwin and the East.

      Why have The Punch when they have comments on the same opinion pieces most days in their other titles?

      Remember the News social media encounter with myspace? Bought for $580 million in 2005, sold for $35 million in 2011. Guess that’s what happens when you have a senile CEO who just won’t let go.

      Best wishes to the Punch staff and thanks for all the fun.

    • M says:

      02:43pm | 11/09/12

      @ Pers, they might get more traffic and exposure if they didn’t act as a sheltered workshop for feminists.

    • Mouse says:

      04:02pm | 11/09/12

      I don’t know TimB, most of mine this morning didn’t get on. Maybe too busy??, who knows. I don’t think of myself as saying anything much that would get censored, so I am thinking that they just get too backed up and delete blocks of comments.

      Pers…WHAT!!! Punch is closing? Please say it isn’t true! Where else is there to go? You can ram the Drum where the sun don’t shine, been there, got terribly bored, went home. At least on Punch you get a wide variety of commenters.  Damn, not happy Jan!!!!  :o(

    • marley says:

      04:44pm | 11/09/12

      @Mouse - well, maybe if we all go over to the Drum we can liven it up. I comment there from time to time, but it always feels like I’m in a funeral home with a lot of hostile people in black frowning at any hint of frivolity or disrespect I might show to my betters.  I’d love to shake the joint up.

    • Mouse says:

      05:45pm | 11/09/12

      marley, you’re on!!  Would love to go over there and frivolise and disrespect my “betters” to the moon and back. Could actually be fun! The only thing I found that if you are not in love with Labor they tend to delete your posts.  God forbid if you question a labor luvvie, they all descend like a pack of vultures! lol But hey, I have never been one to back down, so let’s do it! I will trip over there tomorrow and report back.

      Hehehehehehee, marley you may have just created a monster!  :oD

    • LJ Dots says:

      07:41pm | 11/09/12

      You know, I’ve always been curious what would happen if the Punch crew gatecrashed the Drum.

      Mouse or marley, any dates set yet?

    • gary says:

      07:42pm | 11/09/12

      marley
      Over at the Drum, they don’t pay much heed to people that can’t tell the difference between facts and opinions and prefer to debate those that don’t think it’s ok to have outright lies in their mainstream media.
      No wonder you didn’t feel at home.

      Much better to stay here where you are surrounded by like minded conservatives.

      PS - IMHO people who can tell the difference between a fact, an opinion and an outright lie probably are your betters.

      just saying

    • Babylon says:

      01:21pm | 11/09/12

      Labor today demanded that Tony Abbott give an explanation in Parliament as to why, when he was 3 years old, he snatched the sand pit spade from his little sister.

      Senior Labor Front Benchers accused Mr Abbott of being a sexist, mysogynist anti gay, anti lesbian, anti family because of this supposed incident.

    • Genome says:

      02:20pm | 11/09/12

      So what you are saying is that it is in his DNA and he can’t help himself.
      Excellent defence.
      Keep on babbling

    • Inky says:

      03:50pm | 11/09/12

      Was this before or after Abbott dug up something from a Senior L:abor Front Bencher’s past to do his own mudslinging?

      I’ll keep saying it, they’re as bad as each other.

    • Inky says:

      04:21pm | 11/09/12

      Oh, I see now this isn’t your first attempt at this particular line, but apparently you didn’t learn from the first try Babylon.

    • Jocular says:

      05:19pm | 11/09/12

      Ah yeah sfl, I believe it’s called royalties, you know the tax the feds can’t have.  So they bring in one of their to show how ‘smart’ they are.

    • martinfromlamumba says:

      06:43pm | 11/09/12

      You spelled Payne wrongly, it is spelled Pain.

    • pa_kelvin says:

      05:05pm | 11/09/12

      Dont Ever Want To Come To SYDNEY Again…........... Cant see how any contractor can do any work when you spend half a day in traffic trying to get anywhere.

    • Scotchfinger says:

      07:29pm | 11/09/12

      Funny how the moderators censor completely innocuous posts, yet allow people to post using fake handles, all the time. Suggests the moderation is sort of, well, random.

 

Facebook Recommendations

Read all about it

Punch live

Up to the minute Twitter chatter

Recent posts

The latest and greatest

The Punch is moving house

The Punch is moving house

Good morning Punchers. After four years of excellent fun and great conversation, this is the final post…

Will Pope Francis have the vision to tackle this?

Will Pope Francis have the vision to tackle this?

I have had some close calls, one that involved what looked to me like an AK47 pointed my way, followed…

Advocating risk management is not “victim blaming”

Advocating risk management is not “victim blaming”

In a world in which there are still people who subscribe to the vile notion that certain victims of sexual…

Nosebleed Section

choice ringside rantings

From: Hasbro, go straight to gaol, do not pass go

Tim says:

They should update other things in the game too. Instead of a get out of jail free card, they should have a Dodgy Lawyer card that not only gets you out of jail straight away but also gives you a fat payout in compensation for daring to arrest you in the first place. Instead of getting a hotel when you… [read more]

From: A guide to summer festivals especially if you wouldn’t go

Kel says:

If you want a festival for older people or for families alike, get amongst the respectable punters at Bluesfest. A truly amazing festival experience to be had of ALL AGES. And all the young "festivalgoers" usually write themselves off on the first night, only to never hear from them again the rest of… [read more]

Gentle jabs to the ribs

Superman needs saving

Superman needs saving

Can somebody please save Superman? He seems to be going through a bit of a crisis. Eighteen months ago,… Read more

28 comments

Newsletter

Read all about it

Sign up to the free News.com.au newsletter