Punch on: Open thread 19/01/12

Aidan says:

06:54am | 19/01/12

Unlike “Uncyclopedia” of course, which is completely infallible.

ibast says:

06:57am | 19/01/12

I find it a bit dodgy on technical stuff too.  Often the technical stuff contains common and internet myths and falsehoods.  Like Marley below, I only find it useful for introductory information, particularly about people I’ve never heard of. Geography inquiries aren’t bad either.

Erick says:

07:16am | 19/01/12

The latest on SOPA: It appears that Obama has killed the bill.

Of course, like many bits of bad legislation, it may come back. But the Internet has flexed its muscles, and the politicians are worried.

Interesting times ahead.

TimB says:

08:13am | 19/01/12

Good on Obama. Much kudos for this move.

MarkS says:

08:35am | 19/01/12

Wikipedia is like a newspaper story, a very useful first reference. The basic facts of the event they cover ok. But the details, that is another matter. Do not rely on it to be giving you the full, complete & accurate story.

ibast says:

08:46am | 19/01/12

The legislation was quite ridiculous.  Combined with the corruption of the intent of Patent and Copyright laws in recent decades, it really did go too far.

Elphaba says:

08:50am | 19/01/12

Wikipedia is good for scanning the references at the bottom of the article.  Some good ‘further reading’ can be found there.

Quoting the article itself is probably not the best idea idea though.

Like Duh says:

09:06am | 19/01/12

@ Elphaba - “Wikipedia is good for scanning the references at the bottom of the article.  Some good ‘further reading’ can be found there.”

“Quoting the article itself is probably not the best idea idea though”

...and where do you think the article sourced the information from? Just possibly, the references at the bottom of the article.

Danny B says:

09:20am | 19/01/12

Does this put paid to the companion bill, PIPA as well?  Or is it just SOPA that Obmama has toppled?

RobJ says:

09:25am | 19/01/12

IMO, It’s a good starting point.

ibast, can you cite specific articles where it falls down on the technical side?

Elphaba says:

09:26am | 19/01/12

@Like Duh,

Putting a wikipedia entry in your assignment bibliography or footnotes is not a good idea.  Putting a reputable journal article sourced in the wikipedia article is a better idea.  .

ibast says:

09:57am | 19/01/12

@RobJ, not off the top of my head.  Being an Engineer I occasionally find I’m reading something on Wiki that isn’t quite right or has acquired some popular falsehood.

JC says:

10:50am | 19/01/12

Danny B has a good point, has PIPA also been stopped?

There are those who think SOPA was made to be so rediculous as to make PIPA not look too bad, so people wouldn’t really notice it passing.

PIPA is the real danger.

Erick says:

12:09pm | 19/01/12

As I said, bad legislation may come back.

And Obama is already feeling the backlash from rich corporate donors.

This legislation isn’t completely dead yet. But it’s been sorely wounded, and every day the opposition grows stronger while the media moguls become weaker.

Erick says:

01:58pm | 19/01/12

@JC & Danny B - I don’t know what’s happening with PIPA. And, for that matter, I’m not sure about SOPA either. Obama says he won’t sign it, but then he’s said a lot of things that weren’t true.

The people are making an impact, but it’s way too early to stop those efforts.

TChong says:

06:02am | 19/01/12

agree TimB , not cool.
But its the big C capitalists , like this sites owner ( hard to find a bigger Capitalist than Rupert ) who are lobbying for these laws.
“Tis a funny old world , sometimes.

AdamC says:

07:56am | 19/01/12

@TimB, I have found most of the opponents of these bills only ever describe their opposition in quite vague terms. That may well be due to the media sound-bite imperative or a desire not to get too technical, but the result is that recent arrivals to this controversy like me are a little confused about the issues at stake. Is there some kind of potted synopsis of the problems with the proposals that is a good place to start?

Danny B says:

08:30am | 19/01/12

Wikipedia’s entries on the two bills are still available - click on the ‘Learn More’ link on the banner on any Wikipedia article.  The articles list the points for and against.  The articles themselves seem to be impartial, given the stance of Wikipedia itself.

TimB says:

08:46am | 19/01/12

Adam, there was a good video that I watched on this the other day, but I can’t link it to you from work.

Basically (as I understand it), ostensibly it’s about targeting websites that host pirated content. All good and noble on the surface. But the powers granted by the legislation are far too extreme and can be easily abused.

One of the examples that was given was Youtube. The thing abot Youtube (and many other popular sites) is that its content is uploaded by the users.

Currently if a user uploads material that violates copyright (for example a Simpsons episode) , Fox’s legal team will spring into action demanding Youtube remove the copywrite violating content. Youtube will normally comply.
This is the working principle of the safe harbor provisions of the DMCA. It prevents Fox from taking direct action (such as suing) against Youtube for the actions of its users, as long as they comply with the takedown request.

Under the new legislation however, all Fox has to do is point at Youtube, scream “COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT!” and bam, the entire site is blacklisted courtesy of the US government. Think about all the other sites where users could potentially upload infringing content: Photobucket. Facebook. Etc. Someone does something wrong on one part of the site, and the entire site community can end up suffering on account of it.

There’s far more to it than this of course. There’s other technical and legal aspects that I don’t pretend to understand, but the general consensus seems to be that this legislation is a terrible mess. It’s easily on par with Conroy’s filter crap here.

Awful.

SimonFromLakemba says:

09:15am | 19/01/12

@TimB

Its seems strange that we are in 2012 but going backwards in individual freedoms, interesting times we live.

On another note vaguely related. I was watching a documentary on Deep Throat last night and how the police shut it down under the ‘smut law’s basically and those same laws still exist today.

Danny B says:

09:34am | 19/01/12

It’s a corporatocracy - the power’s shifted to the big corporations with money and lawyers.

dancan says:

09:54am | 19/01/12

Adam C - This youtube video sums up the SOPA and PIPA situation very well, it’s a well researched and discussed piece on the implications of these two bills

http://youtu.be/JhwuXNv8fJM

Slothy says:

12:17pm | 19/01/12

AdamC: work won’t let me link to it directly, but the first link in this blogpost will send you to an article by a Hollywood content provider explaining what is wrong with SOPA.
http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2012/01/post-i-wish-id-written-on-sopa.html

Note, that blog is owned by another Hollywood screenwriter who is also against SOPA despite the effect piracy has on his livelihood. These are not dirty little torrent monkeys like you and me, these are the people who create the content the rest of us steal.

And another link outlining why the $200 billion in losses/750,000 jobs lost figures attributed to piracy are on the wrong side of bogus. http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2008/10/dodgy-digits-behind-the-war-on-piracy.ars

AdamC says:

01:06pm | 19/01/12

Thanks all for the useful information. At the risk of going against the grain on this one, I have to admit I am not really convinced that these changes would be as bad as many of its opponents are insisting. While I accept the technical arguments around DNS blocking, which looks like a very bad idea, the ability of a court to require enablers of copyright infringement to take reasonable steps to stop it seems reasonable to me.

To some extent, this brouhaha looks a bit like (exceedingly successful) astroturfing by organisations like Facebook, Google and, most notably, Wikipedia. I imagine they are looking at the compliance costs this would impose upon them and are quite keen to avoid being required to take steps to restrict access to pirated content. 

People have got quite used to enjoying pirated stuff online, but the party clearly can’t go on forever. Some of the enforcement tools proposed in these bills are strong, but they are not exactly draconian given the scale of the problem. 

Of course, I realise I am in the minority on this.

TChong says:

06:08am | 19/01/12

yeah Robert , I’m sure she s planning precisley that.
Her , Swan and Tim are probaly saving your post to favrits, just so they have a strategy for the rest of this parliament.
You job sharing with AtM ?

KH says:

06:20am | 19/01/12

And this is related to wikipedia how?  There is an open thread for this kind of garbage - find it.

Adam Diver says:

06:42am | 19/01/12

@ KH, That is the funniest comment of all time, well played

“Has anyone seen my glasses?” LOL

Erick says:

06:49am | 19/01/12

@KH - If only there was some way to find an open thread - some kind of title, or URL, or category, or something ....

TimB says:

06:56am | 19/01/12

“And this is related to wikipedia how?  There is an open thread for this kind of garbage - find it. “

You’re standing in it KH. Do you perhaps need a map?

Elphaba says:

08:05am | 19/01/12

How embarrassment.

holden says:

08:40am | 19/01/12

Can you give me the source of your accusation that the G.G. went to Africa etc., etc., or is that all a part of the same garbage as the rest of your tripe.
The incoming Coalition? Abbott as Prime Minister? I think all of those Valentine cards you send him must have gone to your head.
Not one comment you made, (make), has a scintilla of truth in it.
And the IMF never said we would be seriously affected.
Howard had our money in the bank because the only money he spent was to win elections. Which he ingloriously lost.

Ben C says:

09:07am | 19/01/12

Early entry for Comment of the Year.

Mickey T says:

10:06am | 19/01/12

@ Robert S McCormick - “The IMF have predicted a new Financial Crisis which will be much worse than the Global Financial Crisis created by the USA in 2008. They say this time Australia will be seriously affected”

Providing a link to this statement Robert would help with your claims, especially in relation to Australia?

The following link is a speech given three days ago at the Asian Financial Forum in Hong Kong by David Lipton, First Deputy Managing Director, International Monetary Fund.

http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2012/011612.htm

It appears that the IMF are looking for help from Asia more than ever before.

China is looking at downgrading their growth for the year from 9.2% down to 9%...this will have a slight effect on the Australian economy but I wouldn’t call it catastrophic.

jay-ded says:

10:10am | 19/01/12

Hahaha KH brilliant!

Haven’t had a good laugh in a while.

KH says:

12:22pm | 19/01/12

mmmmmmmmmmmm yes, issues today…......many issues!!! Only having 2 hours sleep doesnt’ help much either….................... :-(

Erick says:

01:41pm | 19/01/12

Awww, poor KH ... never mind, we all make stupid mistakes sometimes.

Chris L says:

03:33pm | 19/01/12

Keep your fingers crossed Robert. With any luck your dreams of disaster for Australia will finally come true after four and a half long years of hoping and praying. Finally you may have the chance to say “I told you so!”

LJ Dots says:

05:48pm | 19/01/12

@KH, Times are tough and everyone has issues, however an apology to Robert S McCormick for your mistake might not have gone astray either.

jay-ded says:

10:23am | 19/01/12

“American made.”  hahahahaha that was good nossy.

Still giggling to myself. 

TimB says:

06:54am | 19/01/12

“I’ll be shopping at Aldi and the independents in future ! Pokies are a form of legalised theft ! “

Only if you’re stupid enough to drop money into them.

What the hell has happened to personal responsibility these days?

nihonin says:

07:25am | 19/01/12

What the hell has happened to personal responsibility these days?

For those who can’t think for themsleves, the government needs to legislate it for them.

Elphaba says:

08:07am | 19/01/12

More amazing than your bullshit, Alan?

I find that hard to believe…

Tim says:

08:43am | 19/01/12

I actually think that pokies should only be allowed in clubs for community benefit.
Large corporations shouldn’t be allowed to own them.

nossy says:

09:04am | 19/01/12

@acotrel   Elvis seems to do well in this clip of ZZ Tops “Viva Las Vegas” acotrel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLUl8xkKSTk

acotrel says:

07:38pm | 19/01/12

@nossy
That’s a very nice clip.  At least in Vegas they come around and offer you a drink.  If you ask for a beer they go all s nooty.  The cool guys ask for top shelf. I feel they are more honest there.  At least they don’t pretend the Mafia isn’t raking off the loot.  This stuff about returning money to the community - what a lot of bull that is ?  Out local clubs claim their staff’s wages as being a contribution to charity. Had to laugh at Hume Shire talking about doubling the council rates on the club in Seymour - talk about ‘tokenism’ !

Nathan says:

07:26am | 19/01/12

that was meant to go under Robert S McCormick comment

Macca says:

07:24am | 19/01/12

The PA sounds like a real ball-breaker. Good form in a horrendous situation

Anubis says:

08:39am | 19/01/12

Captain Custard came out with a new explanation as to why he got into the lifeboats. He didn’t abandon ship, the poor dear tripped and fell into one of the lifeboats. “But mummy it was too dark to get back onto the big boat that i broke”

nossy says:

09:00am | 19/01/12

@Adam Diver - sounds like deja vu Adam.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuP9YClyPRY

TimB says:

07:59am | 19/01/12

As always XKCD distills the basic concept here :

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/the_problem_with_wikipedia.png

stephen says:

08:23am | 19/01/12

‘Sweet basic knowledge’, before I go to bed, always comes from my fingertips, ie I like to practice my braille, just in case.

Danny B says:

08:19am | 19/01/12

Or you could just read why they’re doing it…

It’s only for 24 hours, and it’s not like Wikipedia is an authoriative source.

jay-ded says:

10:56am | 19/01/12

I’m sorry TheRaptured, just who are the big boys?

Anubis says:

09:29am | 19/01/12

I’m still chuckling about Bob Brown’s declaration that Gillard had (shock, horror) lied to him. The irony of Wilkie’s position is to be enjoyed with mirth once the hilarity of B Brown’s comment subsides.

But seriously, why is it that this Prime Minister finds it impossible to honour any promises (election or post election) and is unable to manage to touch anything without it immediately turning to a steaming pile of shite?

The only election promise she seems hell bent on keeping is to post a totally supefluous budget surplus (which, under current circumstances and taking Labor’s big spending capabilities in to account) is unachievable anyhow. Unless maybe superhero “World’s best treasurer” Wayne “the Goose” Swan has a few billion stashed away in a piggy bank somewhere.

Tim says:

09:30am | 19/01/12

I was far more annoyed that they’d done the deal with Wilkie in the first place.
One member of parliament shouldn’t be able to dictate to either party.

If she doesn’t go ahead with the deal, I’ll be happier than if she does go through with it. Blackmail should never be rewarded.

nossy says:

09:31am | 19/01/12

@AdamC   a ballsy effort by Gillard to kick Wilkie in the nuts Adam - Tones would have done the same dont you worry about that - he said “I would sell my arse to become PM” - now thats way north of canning a pokie deal fella.

TimB says:

10:07am | 19/01/12

” he said “I would sell my arse to become PM” “

No, *Tony Windsor* said that Abbott said that. A fine distinction I think you’ll agree Nossy, paticularly given Windsor’s form.

AdamC says:

10:35am | 19/01/12

@Anubis, too true. And why was it OK - nay, necessary - to go into deficit in GFC I but utterly verboten to do so in GFC II? I call it ‘Wayne Swan logic’.

@Tim, I understand that sentiment, Tim. But she should really stick to agreements she makes once they are made.

@Nossy, what TimB said. Also, I am almost certain Tony Abbott did say that, he wasn’t being entirely serious.

@SimonFromLakemba, I don’t like the policy either. I always prefer simple solutions to needlessly complicated ones. However, the whole anti-pokies movement is obnoxiously, ultra-paternalistic.

nossy says:

10:49am | 19/01/12

@TimB hahah you poor old Liberal Party Members will do anything to defend Tones wont you Timmy - I would believe Windsor anyday fella - Tones has already told us he tells lies! Strewth!

nossy says:

11:03am | 19/01/12

@AdamC off course Abbott was talking tongue in cheek Adam - we all know that - poor old TimB has his head up his arse most days when it comes to defending Tones—hes gotta loosen up.

Tim says:

11:16am | 19/01/12

“@Anubis, too true. And why was it OK - nay, necessary - to go into deficit in GFC I but utterly verboten to do so in GFC II? I call it ‘Wayne Swan logic’.”

Adam,
No, it’s called populist politics logic and the Liberals are at least as guilty as Labor of doing it.
Even yesterday the Libs were beating the debt drum. The problem is that there are far too many stupid simplistic people who listen to it.

TimB says:

12:04pm | 19/01/12

“@AdamC off course Abbott was talking tongue in cheek Adam -”

*sigh*

Nossy, I believe Adam missed a word. What he meant to say was

“Also, I am almost certain ifTony Abbott did say that, he wasn’t being entirely serious.” (correct me if I’m wrong Adam)”
This isn’t about defending what Abbott may or may not have said. It’s about you taking the crap that comes from Tony Windsor as gospel.

AdamC says:

01:16pm | 19/01/12

@TimB, yes, sorry, that was a typo on my part. I have been going nuts with the typos of late!

Khalid says:

01:53pm | 19/01/12

I would sell my arse to get my hands on the keys to the lodge and the magical boatphone that makes asylum seekers disappear.

Screw the Supreme Court and their meddling decisions, I’m Tony Abbott and I know what’s best.

ibast says:

12:11pm | 19/01/12

Right idea but wrong conclusion about the history of patents and copyright.  Patents were originally only for 7 years to allow companies to make profit after having invested in something.  It’s only been in recent decades that Patents, IP and copyright has been extended to lifetime or near lifetime contracts.  This has been mainly due to lobbying by private industry to the US government.  Disney is one example that comes to mind.

Returning these mechanisms back to their original intent would solve a great deal of the problems being discussed on this topic.

An expectation has been created in recent times that individuals and corporations can have ownership of an idea forever and that mentality needs to be reverse.

I heard one article on the radio yesterday that was discussing how much companies lost due to online piracy.  The discussion was not how much they could have made, but how much they lost.  If you develop something you don’t have a right to make money.  You may have the right to the opportunity to make money, but not forever and a day.  The mentality here is clearly corrupt.

bella starkey says:

09:38am | 19/01/12

Has John changed his screen name?

John says:

10:44am | 19/01/12

It’s funny rick, you use the term fascist. Nationalists didn’t win WWII, expect General Franco, yet they call the descendants of the allies that won it fascists? The Leftist political spectrum is so bloody confused on world issues. Leon Trotsky was funded by Jacob Shift a Capitalist New York Banker. Don’t you get it? You entire leftist, view point is nothing by an ideology used by the so called capitalists to under mine nationalism. You guys are simply minions, cannon fodder. Forget the left, move to nationalism, it’s only last bastion of Resistance against international marxist take over.

maria says:

11:58am | 19/01/12

It’s funny or is it funny John that under a true system of democracy a la Switzerland in which only the people are sovereign with the legal right to modify any section of their constitution and modify or repeal any laws via a petition everything works like a clock and nobody from the elite is trying to impose what he thinks people ought to have without any consultation.
Is Australia and many others other countries a democracy as told or a fascism state by stealth in which people are irrelevant.
Vive Switzerland.

SimonFromLakemba says:

10:02am | 19/01/12

@AdamC

Reply button stuffed up! :(

RyaN says:

11:00am | 19/01/12

Typical leftist white guilt article. Having come from Africa myself I can tell you that I have experienced NO racism here, zero, zilch, nothing.
Could it be that the way I decided to embrace the country, its people and its culture that I was accepted in such a way?

This idiot wouldn’t know racism if it came up behind him and hit him with a bat. Clearly the fact that he lives in Australia, working as a respected doctor, earns probably more money than most other Australians and isn’t living under some sort of subjugation nor has to give away half of his lifes effort to someone who he doesn’t know merely because of the colour of his skin means he is talking about something he clearly hasn’t a clue about.

racism

1.a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2.a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3.hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Based on his lecture, it appears to me that this doctor Teo is the actual racist, he seems to be the one making accusations inciting hatred towards one group of people because of the colour of their skins. The mere fact that he decided to pick out one group of people for racial vilification shows his underlying intolerance and hatred for white Australians.

James1 says:

11:14am | 19/01/12

Indeed.  The way the ABC tells the story, he is actually saying that while racism still exists here (as it does everywhere) it is getting much better.  Nonetheless, the story where he says this is under the heading “Australia still racist, says surgeon Charlie Teo”.

Personally, I expect more from the ABC than I do from the Daily Telegraph (no offense intended, News Ltd employees).  If our national broadcaster continues in this fashion, it will become little more than a 24 hour tabloid.

John says:

11:35am | 19/01/12

Unfortunately the entire west is under this leftist mantra. The entire anti-racism and anti-racist movement is really just a group of people that are highly critical of white people for no excepting their country’s being flooded by the third world. They are just looking out for their own interests, but don’t care if white people become minority’s in the near future.

If it keeps on going at it is, we are looking at the end whites in Europe, America and Australia in hundred years. But Asian, Africa and the Middleast will still retain their people.

John says:

11:41am | 19/01/12

The ABC and SBS are clearly leftist inclined propaganda. I never once seen them state one positive of white australia. It makes you think they are run by hard core marxists. Then again the west today is leftist inclined.  Not only that they propagandize war in the middleast. The entire media is controlled, culture is pushed and marketed for a dividing society(leftist), it backs foreign and internal agenda with more propaganda.

Economist says:

11:58am | 19/01/12

I blame the sub editors for this, including those in the SMAGE, they’ve effectively run the same headline Tao to talk about racism. Tao’s not saying Australia’ racist RyaN and co., read the article,  quite the opposite, he’s saying its the best bloody place on the planet and he’s right.  We have one of the highest rates of interracial marriage in the world. I’ve travelled in non-Anglo countries and experienced racism. It’s everywhere, but the fact is Australians for the most part don’t give a rats about your race until you play the race card. Australian government’s have tonnes of regulation and policies to address it. So the countries not racist, but racists still live here.

SimonFromLakemba says:

12:27pm | 19/01/12

@RyaN

Id say that’s because you are white, like the majority of the country. He didn’t pick out a group, he said everyone has to do a better job and as you and I know, racism is from every colour and creed.

I see racism everyday, Ive had a friend put into a coma because of it.

@James1

True. I hate News Ltd but even SMH had the same sort of misleading headline on their internet page.

Shame about ABC.

RyaN says:

12:43pm | 19/01/12

@SimonFromLakemba: His inference and racism is blatant Simon
“But I don’t think it’s right for a white Australian to say there is no racism. You have to be an Indian to say there is no anti-Indian sentiment and you have to be Middle Eastern to say there is no Middle Eastern racism.”

His direct and intentional racist implication that its white Australians that are the perpetrators goes to show the underlying racist within. Dr Teo is a filthy racist straight up and down.

RyaN says:

12:48pm | 19/01/12

@SimonFromLakemba: I lived in the UK where its predominantly white and experienced some exceptional examples of vile racism, from persons who weren’t.

Latex says:

01:01pm | 19/01/12

ryan
Australia would be a much better place if you had either left your racism behind when you left Africa, or never bothered running away to Australia

You have a lot in common with the racist POM’s who come to Australia to escape the Paki’s and want to take Australia back 100 years to a monoculture of white arrogance.

The successive governments that left open the door and encouraged immigration from low life racists in African and Britain have a lot to answer for.

James1 says:

01:05pm | 19/01/12

Simon and RyaN, according to the ABC’s coverage, he actually said that it is not only a white thing in Australia, and he refers to his Chinese ancestors upon their arrival in Australia saying incredibly racist things about white Australians.

John, as usual you make absolutely no sense.

Economist, spot on.  The headlines are incredibly misleading - they pick up on a minor point and ignore the actual substance of what Dr Teo says.  His main point seems to have been that things are much, much better for his kids than they were for him 50 years ago (even I remember being called a “potato-munching Pope-f***er” in the late 1980s).  However, reading the Daily Telegraph’s coverage, one can understand how Simon and RyaN gained their impression of Dr Teo’s comments.

RyaN says:

01:06pm | 19/01/12

@Latex: Aside from your libelous accusations of my apparent racism, do you care to point out where I have been racist towards anyone? Ah no you are one of those vile racists that prefer to libeliously racially vilify someone because of the colour of their skins or their background and hope that some mud sticks.
Latex, I despise racists, especially ones like you!

James1 says:

01:18pm | 19/01/12

I disagree with the way you characterise his comments, RyaN.  I take that to mean that while it is possible for white Australians to never have racism directed at them (not common, if my experience is anything to go by, but theoretically possible), it is not possible for that person to then go on to claim there is not racism.  We can not say that there is no racism until every racial and ethnic group agrees with this statement.

This is especially so when you consider the way the ABC reported his comments - as I mention they quote him as saying that other ethnic groups are just as bad, and he even posits an example from his own ancestors.  Methinks your perspective on his speech has been coloured by the way the Daily Telegraph has presented it.  Poor, poor form, Daily Telegraph.

Also, can we all please agree to ignore Latex?  Those kinds of comments add nothing and do not deserve our attention.

AdamC says:

01:42pm | 19/01/12

It certainly seems like a beat-up.

However, Dr Teo’s position, essentially that ‘Australia’s great, but I want it to change to accommodate me’ is pretty much custom-designed to irritate the nativists.  Having said that, not having your daughter heckled by racist louts isn’t exactly asking a great deal. Indeed, one hopes those drunken idiots felt terrible about their actions the next day. (I dare say that’s a little optimistic, though.)

And, I should add, the primary criticism of the position of the likes of Dr Teo isn’t so much that said position erroneously asserts racism exists in Australia - it clearly does - but that it is so disproportionately obsessed with it and suggests that it is more widespread than it actually is.

@Economist, excellent comment.

RyaN says:

02:37pm | 19/01/12

@James1: While I agree with the comment that no one can claim no racism exists, this same statement is true for every single country in the world. Making an obvious statement like that followed by:
“It’s not something that’s unique to white Australians but when it’s directed against an Asian, and I can only speak from that point of view, it’s almost always white Australians.”
the intent and underlying message is clear. Aside from the use of “almost always” being completely subjective and statistically unverifiable, the thrust of his statements are directed to imply that whites are “almost always” the perpetrators of racism which is just his tarnished opinion. He does indeed mention his mothers racism, I guess we will have to forgive him on his position then as it appears some of it has rubbed off.
I wonder how many of those vile whites were responsible for him being a neurosurgeon today. Ungrateful much?

nossy says:

10:57am | 19/01/12

@RyaN hahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhahahahhaahhhhhh ohh stop it RyaN you are getting funnier by the day—say fella if ever you need a Manager to go on stage nossy will look after you - charge 10% of take plus some"expenses” - stand up comedian looks to be your forte fella haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahah P.S are you up for some nude centrefolds ?  haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

RyaN says:

12:55pm | 19/01/12

@nossy: Glad you are entertained, I find the polls far more entertaining.
Oh how sweet it is! hahahahahahaha

TheRealDave says:

01:49pm | 19/01/12

Jsut don’t read the preferred PM poll then Rhyno

RyaN says:

03:07pm | 19/01/12

@TheRealDave: Not sure why, just checked:  http://www.au.nielsen.com/news/200512.shtml

“Mr Abbott is ahead of Ms Gillard as preferred Prime Minister: Abbott is on 46% (up 1) and Gillard is on 42% (down 3). ”

Tim says:

03:26pm | 19/01/12

What a surprise that RyaN is a month out of touch.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/breaking-news/julia-gillard-preferred-pm-over-tony-abbott-in-first-poll-for-2012/story-e6frf7jx-1226245616572

RyaN says:

04:11pm | 19/01/12

@Tim: Ha that is true, I am a month out of touch, must’ve been those holidays.

Shane From Melbourne says:

09:55pm | 19/01/12

Yep, and I’ve regreted voting for John Howard and his wealth redistribution from singles and childless couples to middle class families ever since.

nossy says:

10:53am | 19/01/12

@Entity heres one that will tickle your fancy Entity - fresh off the presses:
“Overheard in the corridors of power recently Tones Abbott was talking to someone the other day and he said “I am going to come up with a Policy!’ and the other person said “NO” in disbelief and Tones said “How did you guess” hahahahhahahahahha nossy is on fire in 2012! whoa whoa!

Tim says:

11:13am | 19/01/12

The Liberals need to own their ideology and stop playing self interest politics.

None of this “free market when we feel like it” crap.

Cut silly subsidies like this and the amount of middle class welfare given and you’ve got my vote.

RyaN says:

11:13am | 19/01/12

@Entity: You were doing so well until you used “Dr. NO ” then you completely discredited yourself and your entire post as being nothing but the usual Labor lies and propaganda.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/tony-abbott-knows-he-is-landing-the-blows/story-e6frezz0-1226236795196

Take particular note of:
“So far in this parliament, the Abbott-led opposition has only voted against 13 per cent of the government’s legislative proposals.”

Way to discredit yourself comrade.

RyaN says:

11:15am | 19/01/12

@nossy: ditto for the above mate, its all done and dusted, move on to the next lie mate.

Entity says:

11:58am | 19/01/12

Dr NO
Saying no to anything of substance and continually talking down the nation.
Spreading lies and uncertainty wherever he goes.

Wise up to yourself ryan.

Tim says:

12:05pm | 19/01/12

Wow RyaN,
that article doesn’t look like Liberal propaganda at all.

And most legislation that gets put before parliament is routine and always gets approved so the 87% statistic is meaningless without comparison to other previous parliaments.

You can’t deny that on big legislation, Tony Abbott has rejected the government’s plans most of the time. Whether that’s a good thing or not I’m sure you can decide for yourself.

Knemon says:

12:14pm | 19/01/12

@ RyaN - “Lets hope this time round it teaches those fools that vote for this incompetent bunch of liars a very hard life lesson about choosing socialist communists as leaders of your country”

God forbid that Entity refers to Tony Abbott as Dr.NO.

You’re a hypocrite of the highest order RyaN.

Just say NO says:

12:33pm | 19/01/12

This recently deployed Liberal counter to the Dr. NO badge that Abbott wears so proudly is laughable.

Most legislation is administrative in nature and required for the running of the country. When you look at Dr. NO’s record at endorsing new government policy, I think you will find the he deserves the Dr. NO tag.

He encourages the Dr. NO perception because he somehow thinks that voters will believe his rubbish that ALL Labor policies should be said NO to. This will be his downfall if he is still the opposition leader at the next election.
How many more years will we have to listen to Abbott talking down the nation and saying NO to good policy before the conservative power brokers decide enough is enough?

RyaN says:

01:14pm | 19/01/12

@Knemon: How am I a hypocrite Knemon? Fact is I am pointing out a blatant lie.
If you are inferring that me calling Labor a socialist communist group, then how is it that their leader Julia Gillard was and always will be a socialist communist. Lets never forget her strong involvement in the socialist communist group “The Socialist Forum”.
Stalin was never a leader of the Democratic party of Russia now was he.

Yuri says:

01:48pm | 19/01/12

@Nossy

That would be the 5th time I’ve seen you post that “joke”, and it wasn’t even funny the first time. You, much like Tony Abbott, need to come up with some new material. Ideally it would be truthful, but I know you would struggle with that, so I’ll settle for anything that’s not copy-and-pasted from the ALP daily memo.

nossy says:

02:51pm | 19/01/12

@Yuri hahahah Yuri old gel I have had many laughs out of that one when I tell it personally. I was telling a joke the other night at Jupiters and one of the young girlies doubled over in laughter and had to rush to the dunny - she peed herself laughing Yuri. Cant tell that one here though.

RyaN says:

02:55pm | 19/01/12

@Just say NO: So opposing a minor 13% of legislation as the OPPOSITION means that he is the person that says no to everything. Well I never!

Oh and saying No to bad policy is exactly what he is doing, start with some good policy for a change and I wonder if will actually say no to that. How about reintroducing the Pacific Solution in its entirety, see if he says no to that!

Bad policy is just that, surprisingly netting a 13% rate of bad policy isn’t too bad for a complete bunch of incompetents like Labor.

RyaN says:

03:10pm | 19/01/12

@nossy: “I was telling a joke the other night at Jupiters and one of the young girlies doubled over in laughter and had to rush to the dunny - she peed herself laughing Yuri. ” Are you sure she was laughing at the joke nossy

nossy says:

03:31pm | 19/01/12

@RyaN   well now you mention it RyaN I had had a few so just maybe ...  mmm yes.

RyaN says:

11:16am | 19/01/12

@jay-ded: Logic isn’t a strong feature in most journalists or police officers.

Wynston Cruso says:

12:30pm | 19/01/12

Reminds me of the case where a guy ate his own head. I’m not sure how this helps.

RyaN says:

11:44am | 19/01/12

He is WINNING!

jay-ded says:

11:57am | 19/01/12

I think he’s been in too many movies…

St. Michael says:

11:59am | 19/01/12

As opposed to Chuck Norris, who would have stopped 9/11 had the planet had the capacity to withstand his roundhouse kick.

TimB says:

12:17pm | 19/01/12

He has the ability to split himself into three? Manage to be on both planes that hit the Twin Towers AND the one that hit the Pentagon as well?

Right. Keep on dreaming Marky.

Ben C says:

12:50pm | 19/01/12

@ TimB

Get it right, it’s Marky Mark.

(I’ve read in interviews that he hates being reminded of his rapper days.)

stephen says:

04:25pm | 19/01/12

Chuck’se has a bad back, so no more kicking, just backhanders now.

(He could teach Wahlberg, though, something about bravery and honour.)

Anubis says:

01:04pm | 19/01/12

Get over it Cobbler, and try reading the report properly. There were questions about the items on the report so, until they are answered he will not sign off on it - no missing $600k. You also conveniently forget the other people named in the article, some Liberal some Labor. No story here, move along kiddies

Al Bundy says:

01:12pm | 19/01/12

Tony is very busy filleting fish, driving trucks and finesseing how he will put a positive spin on making tens of thousands of people unemployed in the automotive industry. Or perhaps being so busy he will just leave that last bit to “goldigger” Mirabella.

He is also talking up a second coming of the GFC and has his economic experts, “Blackhole” Hockey and “Barnanomical” Joyce researching new opportunities to say NO and talk down the Australian economy.
.

SimonFromLakemba says:

02:50pm | 19/01/12

Thought anyone who wore shoes in far NQ was out of place

fairsfair says:

03:07pm | 19/01/12

LOL. I’ll admit - lace up shoes are a bit weird. Very out of place.

Slip on closed ins of the dress variety, boat shoes, thongs and sandals are pretty much all the go for an Effin Q male… it was really weird. They usually aren’t hanging around the kiddy pool on a Thursday afternoon….

I’m sure they were discussing the ills of the world with gusto!

SimonFromLakemba says:

03:27pm | 19/01/12

Could of been some self important save the world Uni students?

Yuri says:

04:00pm | 19/01/12

Simon, for the sake of my own sanity, it is could have (not could of) - same for should have, would have, must have etc.
You’re not the only puncher who does this, but you are by far the most prominent.

fairsfair says:

04:34pm | 19/01/12

@Yuri - rediculous!

True Simon. Though Cairns Uni - they are usually Environmental Science majors in desperate need of a shower and likely locked in discussion on the lates tmicrobe that is threatening their weed crop…

Yuri says:

09:03pm | 19/01/12

Just letting you know is enough for me. It’d be pretty silly for me to base my sanity on other people’s actions. I was more saying that for my sanity, I had to speak up and inform you of your incorrect grammar. Now I know you’re doing it purposefully, my job is done.
Anti-Ignorance Man Awaaaayyyy!