Punch on: Friday review 16/12/2011

Mark says:

08:19am | 16/12/11

@TimB-Pfft, one protester is a wanker so you disregard the whole movement?? Classy- Read the below, if truth is what you desire.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21228354.500-revealed—the-capitalist-network-that-runs-the-world.html

Elphaba says:

08:38am | 16/12/11

Ergh.

How anyone can still see this as a legitimate movement boggles my mind.

neo says:

10:55am | 16/12/11

It’s a great movement, good on those people for standing up for what’s right. One bad apple doesn’t spoil the whole harvest. For every protester on the street, there are many others who agree, but cannot protest.

TimB says:

11:44am | 16/12/11

Yeah Mark. Only *one* protester is a wanker. Right.

Easy Elphaba- They’re wankers

Elphaba says:

12:19pm | 16/12/11

“what’s right”

Taking money from people who have earned it and giving it to people who haven’t (and by virtue, if they receive it, won’t bother trying to earn it in the future) is ridiculous.  Not right.

If you want to prop the poor up with your money neo, go nuts.  But don’t ask me to.

Tuba says:

12:21pm | 16/12/11

TimB - should know a wanker when he reads about one.
He spends enough time on the subject at hand.

neo says:

12:37pm | 16/12/11

I find it pretty disturbing that a movement for equality is met with so much antagonism. Fat cats want to remain fat, that’s granted, but for ordinary people to support their oppressors, that’s quite strange. I suppose Australia has not been hit as hard as the rest of the world, so it’s easy to dismiss the protesters from the comfort of your own bubble.

neo says:

01:16pm | 16/12/11

So where does a starving child go to, to earn this money, Elphaba? Where does a 70 year old woman go to, $100 a month barely covers her medical expenses? Get off your high horse, you closing your eyes and not seeing the problems with this world does not make them go away for others.

Sad Sad Reality says:

01:24pm | 16/12/11

“We are the 99%.”

“Okay and what do you want?”

“Things to be like more fairer and stuff.”

“And how are you going to achieve that.”

“By backing up the toilet at Starbucks and presenting a target for local rapists.”

“Seems reasonable.”

The hippies in the 60s had more of a plan than this rag tag bunch of consciences seeking a cause.

Tim says:

01:38pm | 16/12/11

neo,
why do you think you’re oppressed?
If it’s because your boss owns a sportscar and you don’t then you probably don’t have anything to complain about.

John Smythe says:

01:42pm | 16/12/11

neo, I think you need to get out into the real world a bit more. I believe you are the one living in the bubble as there are mechanisms that cater for all of what you say. Australia is becoming a big fat welfare nation.

I do not suggest there aren’t needy people. Of course there are. But what saddens me is that a lot of people on this “fad” are only on it for their own warm fuzzy feelings. They want what other’s have worked for, without doing the work themselves.

It’s breeding, and continuing, with the entitlement mentality. What happens when you take all the money from the rich for your supposed hardly done by’s? Where do you get money from then?

There are better ways to solving the world’s problem then clogging up parks and the like crying about how you can’t have something someone else got.

What you paint may be an ideal society, but it is far from ever becoming a possibility. Take a look at the feminist movement for an example. What started as a good cause, has been completely gone overboard. Greenpeace, Red Cross, etc. All good causes completely fucked up now. Why…..because humans are running it.

dancan says:

01:45pm | 16/12/11

I’ll just leave this here

http://youtu.be/qdLa6c3hN1w

Elphaba says:

01:54pm | 16/12/11

@neo, who said my eyes are closed? 

You blame the rich for starving kids in Africa?  I think it’s a little more complicated than that.  You blame the rich for the fact that the pension sucks?  Come on. You still doggedly cling to the idea that wealth is a communal pot whereby someone takes something and leaves someone with nothing.  That’s a fallacy and the fact that you continue to peddle it suggests you know very little.

My problem with the movement is the fact that they think what they’re trying to do is change the last 100 years or so of consumerism.  They’re not.  What they’re trying to change is the last 2 million years (give or take) of human evolution.

Who is going to decide who gets what?  Who is going to ensure it’s evenly distributed?  Who is going to stop a corrupt individual from staging a coup and toppling the utopia?  You?

We’re animals in the end.  We competed for food and shelter and the longest lineage of our DNA when we started walking upright, and we compete now.  The only difference is, money is at the top of the pyramid now, because with money, comes everything else.

You have to realise, not all people are equal.  We’re just not.  Your socialist ideology is flawed.  I’m not saying capitalism isn’t flawed either, but I prefer a situation where people have to duke it out for life’s rewards, rather than a handout.  No one realises their true potential when everything is handed to them.

John Smythe says:

02:06pm | 16/12/11

dancan…excellent. the first comment summarises what I was saying very well.

John Smythe says:

02:15pm | 16/12/11

omfg…dancan…I (finally) just watched it (our office downloads the entire clip, scans it for viruses BEFORE allowing me to play it).

This is so typical….A guy, CEO, comes out and says…so what do YOU want? And the bitch just goes on and on and on without answering the question, without letting him respond, shows just how much MORE taxes he pays than they do….and she can confront him with..they should get rid of the bush tax cuts…...how the fuck does that have anything to do with him? he didn’t make those taxes, and the MORE he gives to charities and the like the LESS tax he has to pay…..

OWS….people needing to buy a clue.

I don’t like the way the world is so I’m gonna hold my breath and stamp my feet….As someone quoted here the other day…Tropic Thunder….never go full retard!

neo says:

02:31pm | 16/12/11

Tim, we’re not oppressed in the classical sense of the word, I probably should not have used the word, as it has strong connotations to it. I’ll say this, I will be glad if wealth is re-distributed from the millions-a-year CEOs to those struggling to make ends meet, and I don’t want a cent of that money for myself. In fact, if those above my wealth level give up their excesses and there is still a shortage, I will gladly reduce my income as well, if it means that those below me are better off.

John Smythe, I realise just how hard it would be to achieve utopia, I acknowledge it as an idealistic goal, and something that is extremely challenging to implement in real life. I’m just unconvinced that this fact should make us stop trying. You are quite right to say what you said - it’s “because humans are running it”. This is why the right path to take is to make more people globally aware, once human kind has been won over to this philosophy, and we defeat personal greed, the world will change and utopia will become achievable in real terms.

dancan, thank you for that video. I think it’s a good summary of all the arguments you can expect to hear from the bourgeoisie to justify their greed. The old trick of saying “If I offered you money, would you take it? Well, it’s not my fault people offer me so much”, “I pay more taxes than you”, “I employ 150 people”. At the end of the day, the guy is still left with a lot more funds that what he needs to live comfortably, and there are many people in the world to whom that excess money could be the difference between life and death. It’s great that he helps some people by employing them, but something tells me those 150 people are not the type to go starving if he did not employ them.

Build your business, make money and then use that money to make this world a better place, don’t keep it to yourself, come on, you won’t be buried with it. You were gifted with intelligence, courage, charm, those attributes have allowed you to get to where you are now. You are one of the leaders of this world, use your talents to do something good, to benefit the society and not just yourself, believe me, once everyone is fed, there will still be money left over to enjoy luxuries.

neo says:

02:38pm | 16/12/11

Elphaba, that’s the thing, we are not animals, and we should not act like animals. We know better than that, we have come a long way from having a King and his Lords controlling all the wealth in the country while the peasants are slaughtered at will. Our bodies have not evolved as drastically as our minds have over such a short period of time, but just because we may look the same, it doesn’t mean that we haven’t changed. We have become a lot more socialistic, and we are ever becoming more so.

The worst thing we can do is resist this change, because if we do, we may as well be dogs killing other dogs for food.

Elphaba says:

02:50pm | 16/12/11

“We know better than that”

I think the world as a whole, begs to differ.

“resist this change”

It’s impossible to resist a change that is never going to happen.

Did you watch the video?  What if the CEO has to lay people off when reducing his earnings?  I feel that most people supporting the Occupy movement failed Econ 101.

You can reduce your salary now.  You can reduce your possesions.  Use the money to help others.  Stop waiting for the CEO’s to make the first move.  Beyond paying their taxes, they’re not beholden to anyone.  Be the change you want to see in the world.

John Smythe says:

02:50pm | 16/12/11

@neo….Build your business, make money and then use that money to make this world a better place, don’t keep it to yourself, come on, you won’t be buried with it.

How is the world NOT a better place by him growing his business? Business growth leads to more jobs. Leads to more people receiving services from him, improving (one would assume) their business/personal situation.

If his service is better than someone else’s he can charge more, and therefore make more. Why begrudge someone simply because they have more money? begrudge the people who sit back and DO NOTHING…..these are the people who are dragging our society down.

Forget the millions CEOs make. You realise the business itself needs to generate that much wealth before paying them that much money right?

Look at someone on 45K a year…and someone at 50K a year. Should the 50K a year person give up that 5K difference simply because they get more? What’s your answer to that? (I know you are speaking in earnest on this topic, so I’m not trying to patronising or the like.)

people are no longer “hungry”...they have lost the edge….they are fattened pigs at the welfare trough. And THAT is the problem. You should be happy that ANYONE can go out and make something of themselves. Elphs says it well with this :
No one realises their true potential when everything is handed to them.

neo says:

03:53pm | 16/12/11

Yeah, I’ve been considering going to work for a charity or something, but they waste a lot of the money too. I think I may just try to make money and start a charity of my own, that way I could control the spending at least. Been looking for business ideas lately, hopefully I’ll figure something out and be that change one day. BTW, dunno about the protesters, but I got distinctions in both macro and micro economics at uni

As for the 45k/50k scenario, not quite. I don’t think completely equal earnings is something that should be the norm, it’s more of someone earning 10 million a year should share with those nearly starving, or even those on 10, 20, 30k a year. The first priority is to help those most in need, after the world is fed and lives in comfort, perhaps there is room for Ferraris and Dom Perignon

Ben C says:

04:00pm | 16/12/11

I read an article in Wednesday’s Financial Review - in Oakland, the Occupy movement took over the docks. By doing so, they thought they would disrupt the stevedoring companies and prevent them from making money. What they inadvertently did was actually disrupt the truckers (who are operating small businesses, and are part of the 99% that the Occupy movement is representing) from unloading their trucks, and holding them up from other jobs.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/who_wins_if_occupy_stops_the_world_q3Vfdypz08VqLZ59b5fTKI (for anyone who can get past the paywall).

These idiots can’t put 2 and 2 together.

John Smythe says:

04:09pm | 16/12/11

Neo, they do contribute to the less fortunate. What they buy for themselves afterwards is their business.

Take this off CEOs and paypackets, have a look at how much financial aid to said poor countries has been given over the last decades.

How has that helped? Giving money isn’t the answer.

If there’s no differentiation between 45K and 50K, then there is no argument against people on much higher salaries (except our politicians giving themselves a HUGE pay increase - irrespective of the cuts to other areas! That’s tax dollars they should be spending elsewhere).

The people you prop up as targets like that ARE doing what you said you would do yourself. Bill Gates, Buffet, they all do it.

Even Macquarie regularly contributes, and as I’ve mentioned before, if you can find a legitimate charity or organisation, they match your donation dollar for dollar.

So, to me, this whole movement is a joke. Based on people trying to pat themselves on the back for the warm fuzzies, and want something someone else worked hard for, without working for it themselves.

The answer to the wrold’s problem is not transferring wealth from the haves to the have nots. That will never work. The haves will just go out and make more. The have nots, after spending it all, will just want more.

You are right that it is going to take a LOT of waking up globally. People are going to have to wake up to the farce that is the UN. How is it our rich countries are contributing so much financial and other aid….and it isn;t doing anything? How is it, only certain countries get invaded, while others being held at the mercy of militant leaders whilst decimating and starving their own people are left alone?

Those are the questions that should be asked. Not blatant jealousy from lazy people. 

Elphaba says:

04:17pm | 16/12/11

@neo, charities do much better things with the money than handing it to some wino on the street.  That’s the other thing - you’ve stated in the past that if there was enough money, you could solve any problem.  That’s not true either, because throwing money at a problem is the idiots solution.  It’ll get you nowhere.  Charities have the stats and use the money where it is most beneficial.  Again, nothing is equal - even hardship.

The bottom line is, not one person who has gotten airtime over OWS has claimed they’re doing it for the starving people in Africa. All I hear is ‘student loans!’  FFS, nothing worth having comes easy or cheap.  They need to stop their bitching.  Because that’s all it is.  The world is not ‘resisting’ their change.  The protestors are not making one.

neo says:

06:10pm | 16/12/11

Well, I don’t mean it’s a good idea to hand over cash to the governments of those countries, I’m talking about using the funds, which are there, idling, and using them to develop those countries. Create jobs there, create infrastructure, allow people to have their needs satisfied. Have a new global agency run the project, or assign it to an existing one. Although they seem to be hopeless at things like this. New then

JS@GalaxyII says:

06:48pm | 16/12/11

You are doing well young padawan.
So you see the problem isn’t those CEOs or companies then. Lazy people with a misguided sense of entitlement are. Even if you gave them what they want they would neither appreciate nor use it for betterment of others.

Your first step is bringing the UN andgovernments in line with the misuse, miss care, and lack of follow through on behalf of poor nations. The rich paid for a lot of that aid!  Happy Friday!

TimB says:

07:09am | 16/12/11

Will they fit in the car boot?

Wrap the car keys and put those under the tree- Just make it clear that they’re not getting the *car* .

Winston says:

08:10am | 16/12/11

Neighbours place - wheel them over Christmas night.

Mahhrat says:

08:17am | 16/12/11

Tricky one.  Maybe a neighbour’s?  They could wheel them over Xmas eve, leave them under a suitably decorate Tarpauling outside, with a note left by Santa?

Your other option is one I’ve done this year.  My nieces are 9, 7 and 7, and Mrs Claus has written them a letter.  With the letter is some “magic dust” she got from her mates the fairies.

WIth this, they will cast a spell on “Uncle Mahhrat” that will “make” me go and get them new shoes.  Bugger trying to buy new shoes for three girls when I’m not even sure what size their feet are!

Plus, you know, we’ll go do the lunch thing, play some mini golf, whatever, they’ll have a blast, they have something to look forward to, and they get lessons in patience, shopping, and working for something (even if it’s just doing some magic).

jay-ded says:

08:19am | 16/12/11

Maybe a neighbour can hold on to them for you?

S.L says:

09:16am | 16/12/11

Neighbours are a good idea but they all have young kids with BIG mouths! Car boot is an option but I don’t want to risk them getting scratched (even though my sons will be within a minute of ownership). I know it will all “come out in the wash” successfully on christmas day but what a pain in the rear!
I could throw them the keys to my car Tim. It isn’t worth much anyway!

ausspud says:

11:41am | 16/12/11

Leave them at work if possible.
At a friends place(if you have any)
Pull them apart and hang them off the x-mas tree like ornaments.

fairsfair says:

09:22am | 16/12/11

Amen sista.

My parents thought they’d make a “lovely border” around the patch of rainforest they have been cultivating for the past twenty years. Fast forward a couple of steemy summers and mother. of. god. Its a shambles that only napalm would remedy. Not quite as bad as Star Jasmine I must ad - I blew up the Rover Rancher trying to pull one of those stumps out and Dad’s apprentice’s V8 Cruiser that sounded like a Mack truck struggled. Its like an alien species.

We did love them as kids though - as you could peg those little orange seed things at people and they hurt.

When I bought my house it had two gardens within concrete edging and not a single tree planted elsewhere. A backhoe took care of the one out the front and the side one was filled with two clumps of spider lillies and one lyriope. It was fantastic as I had a fifteen year old house that provided a blank canvas without too much effort. I was quite lucky.

Gee I love gardening. Such a nerd, none of my friends like it. Maybe I should run a blue rinse through and join a gardening club?

bec says:

10:13am | 16/12/11

Ditto on the gardening love.

I’ve pulled out a massive duranta and an old lilly-pilly with nothing more than a Honda Jazz going 15km/hr. It honestly gives me the same kind of satisfaction that popping a bad pimple does. BRILLIANT.

Erick says:

06:57am | 16/12/11

Say hello to the Germaine Greer of the next generation!

TimB says:

07:12am | 16/12/11

Holy crap.

And the mother?!:

“I know it sounds like she is spoilt but I like to get my daughter what she wants also you don’t want to get on the wrong side of her.”

‘Sounds like she is spoilt’? She is and you’re the problem, you stupid woman.

Good grief.

jay-ded says:

07:12am | 16/12/11

mmmm I think even a piece of coal is too good for the demanding young lady.

marley says:

07:16am | 16/12/11

@Erick - more likely the Aileen Wuornos.

TimB says:

07:26am | 16/12/11

Oh damn. Forgot. Did anyone see this in the Punch sidebar?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4a9CKgLprQ&feature=channel_video_title

If anyone deserves a terrible christmas present & their reaction filmed, it’s Mekeeda Austin.

Elphaba says:

08:21am | 16/12/11

If she was my child she’d be getting nothing for Christmas.  She’s also spend all day volunteering at the homeless shelter.

This mother is a f*cking fruitcake.  Proof that you can be as dumb as arse and still breed.  The one thing all terminal underachievers can do.

Erick says:

08:22am | 16/12/11

@marley - Why not both? She could be the next Valerie Solanas!

The original article is even worse ...

iansand says:

08:36am | 16/12/11

Not Germaine, Erick.  My money is on a future CEO of Qantas.

fairsfair says:

09:35am | 16/12/11

That kid needs a toe up the ring this Christmas.

(...and perhaps professional help for her exhibited psychopathic traits. Plus she is 13 FFS - she should know Santa is not real by now).

Elphaba says:

09:50am | 16/12/11

@fairs, agree, there seems to be some psychological issues there.

I suspect she knows there’s no Santa and she is testing her mother.  Which makes it even freakier.

Budz says:

09:50am | 16/12/11

What I find the strangest out of the whole article is that she is 13 and still believes in Santa. Does anyone else find that strange?

Eric The Red says:

10:18am | 16/12/11

I wonder if this little Angel has a father living with her, If so he must be a real he man for letting this sort of shit go on or maybe thats why he left because of his wife giving in to the little shit. I know what I would be doing and would not be pretty. Oh, but thats right you can’t chastise your kids can you. Can you imagine the poor bastard she meets and breeds with.

Arnold Layne says:

11:21am | 16/12/11

Sounds like Veruca Salt has come to life!

Aitch B says:

08:41am | 16/12/11

Yeah…. hope he pulls through OK.

I met him many years ago when I was in the car stereo business and he came in looking for a system for his new Jag.

He was terrific…. totally down to earth, didn’t carry on like many celebrities do and was very personable. He was so happy with the job that he came back a couple of days later with a few slabs for the boys.

Best wishes, Molly.

neo says:

11:02am | 16/12/11

The funniest thing about the guy was when he was stinking drunk on who wants to be a millionaire celebrity edition, and he ended up winning half a mil! Legend.

Speedy recovery.

acotrel says:

07:09am | 16/12/11

I’ve never taken much notice of Molly Meldrum, however from the little I’ve seen, he has never been bitchy or made with the poisonous rhetoric. - Not like some ! I hope he recovers well.

S.L says:

07:10am | 16/12/11

Yes sad news indeed but as I read his spa is 8 to 10 feet off the deck. Why?

iansand says:

09:18am | 16/12/11

S.L. - It is well known that Molly is a fan of E. M. Forster.  A Spa With a View.

Direct says:

10:51am | 16/12/11

This is an outrage. I call for immediate implementation of mandatory helmet laws for all spa and ladder users.

Tim says:

11:25am | 16/12/11

Direct,
no won’t be enough.
We need to fit all spas and ladders with airbags. Just to be sure.

nihonin says:

08:45am | 16/12/11

LOL you hypocrite you, have a good day tomorrow.

bec says:

07:12am | 16/12/11

We used to have a brilliant system at my last job. Last day of work (which fell on Christmas Eve last two years) we’d turn up at 7.30 and the breakfast would be cooking for us - bacon, egg and steak sandwiches. Enough tomato sauce to drink out of a big-arse glass. Cold beers in the esky.

The day would progress in this fashion until we fell asleep, drunk and stuffed, and the only reason we finished our work day at the normal time is because we needed to sleep off our hangovers. Perfection.

Tim says:

07:15am | 16/12/11

Insurance, sexual harrassment, teetotallers, vegetarians or those with different dietary requirements, people of various religions etc.

Why would a company bother with a Christmas party? much too hard when you’re forced to accommodate the wishes of everyone.

Mahhrat says:

08:04am | 16/12/11

@Tim, the interesting thing with it is that any workplace could, rather than put on a spread, simply donate the “time”, like bec’s work does.

Everyone brings their own food.  Someone brings a BBQ.  People can cook their own stuff.  Usually, people will bring too much, and you get to try all sorts of nifty stuff.

If you don’t want to come, you put in a leave app for the day, but no way do you do actual work.

We used to have similar in one of my old jobs and damn I miss it.

I agree though, alcohol at work is dangerous. I’d allow it but have a hard and fast rule that anyone misbehaving would not have their booze as an excuse.  Fair warning, and all that.

SimonFromLakemba says:

08:43am | 16/12/11

We had our xmas party for an old job that I had on a Saturday, started at lunch 12pm Saturday I got home at 7am Sunday morning. Best one I have been too.

Aitch B says:

08:52am | 16/12/11

Our company is great when it comes to the Christmas party. We get to decide where and when we go. Usually it’s a Friday afternoon at the races or a restaurant somewhere but we’ve had Saturday night bashes as well. We get the party in lieu of any bonuses.

If it’s a Friday afternoon we advise our clients that the office will be closed but given that we are a business software developer and provider we provide emergency support for them via a notepad and Blackberry that we take with us.

Today we knock off at 11am and the bus takes up into the hills to the Cuckoo restaurant. We eat and drink as much as we like - all paid for on the boss’s credit card. Then we’re back to a local pub near work where we can either continue (still paid by the boss), head off to a venue or go home.

Of course there is the obligatory warning about drinking and driving - all the drinkers leave their cars at home.

No worries about sexual harrassment, Tim….. all 30 of us are as ugly as sin!!

Tim says:

10:35am | 16/12/11

Mahhrat,
you’re already in trouble.
You need two BBQ’s because Vego’s won’t eat any food cooked on a BBQ that’s had meat on it.
No, sorry make that three BBQ’s, Jews and Muslims won’t eat off a BBQ that’s had pork products cooked on it either.

Ah, big Christmas parties how I miss thee.

neo says:

11:13am | 16/12/11

Awful one for me as well. Last year we had an all day BBQ at moore park, more drinks than we could drink and more food than we could eat, which was great. This year, we’re going to a restaurant after work and everyone will pay for their own drinks. Pretty crappy…

fairsfair says:

11:49am | 16/12/11

It also depends how much money the company has. Our’s is rolling in the billions at the moment and we had a pretty cracking affair last Friday night to the point where we were supplied cab charges home and got a hamper presented to us by Santa.

If it was a bad year however - I am sure we would have just had nibbles in the kitchen. I organised it last year at my previous job - it was a goodun. The job before that, we only got that one if we were prepared to chip in ($100) for the food. As I am sure you can imagine, the reponse to that was not good and we flipped them the bird. 

Tim raises a good point though. We still had people whinging about our party last Friday. You can never please everyone and quite frankly, people’s expectations in life a straight up bogus. For instance, one guy’s pregnant wife was able to drive him home, but he still deserved that cab charge apparently. Come of the grass you wowser.

Ben C says:

04:07pm | 16/12/11

Our work Christmas party is on tomorrow night - dinner, and most of the office is staying in a hotel for the night (I’m not, because I have family business commitments on Sunday). It’s normally a really good night, we drink a lot, eat a lot, and have fun.

Normally, we would also head out to the boss’s place on the final day of work (he lives on acreage) for a BBQ, more drinking, and more fun. Great way to see out the work year, but this year it won’t happen because of his wife’s volunteering commitments.

John Smythe says:

08:52am | 16/12/11

How about…The Slap

gobsmack says:

08:57am | 16/12/11

They can be pretty confident that any misandry will be balanced out by comments from the posters.
I recall one cynic observing that the “misandrist” articles consistently score the highest number of comments.

Erick says:

09:15am | 16/12/11

Good points, ER. But then, I see a good side to the coin.

More and more people are becoming aware of sexism in the media, and calling it out. This is apparent from reading the comments on articles that bash men.

It’s not just happening on The Punch, either. Even on The Drum and Fairfax sites, some such comments get through the censorship. I can only imagine there are even more that don’t.

This is a worldwide trend, as can be seen on pretty much any page that allows comments. People are getting fed up with misandry, and are getting more vocal about it.

As usual, the media are around twenty years behind the curve.

Winston says:

09:47am | 16/12/11

You realise the Punch are trolling specifically for such comments?  That’s why they produce such feminist articles.

John Smythe says:

10:13am | 16/12/11

My leaning is towards Winston’s comment. Not quite sure of the reasoning (and don’t relly care) but it seems like it’s more for that wonderful interwebs game of the number “hits” a site can generate.

Kind of like a performance rating….have to show a bare minimum of “hits” or the site gets shut down (or they get given more “journalistic” tasks to work on instead. Daniel’s flippancy toward the caption contests is kind of indicative.

For me, I enjoy the comments more than a lot of the articles.

It’s Friday on The Slap, What about men has got your goat today?

Vote 1 John Smythe.
Returning Australia to Australians.

Erick says:

10:20am | 16/12/11

@Winston - I’m sure that trolling for comments is a big part of their motivation. But it doesn’t explain everything.

If it was all about trolling for comments, they’d publish equal numbers of articles attacking women the same way. But that doesn’t happen.

There is a very real feminist/misandrist agenda at The Punch. Ever wonder why there have been dozens of articles about women’s issues, and no serious articles about men’s issues at all?

Like other mainstream media, The Punch is staffed by journalists who generally share the same sort of soft-Left, 1970s-1990s mindset of political correctness. They all toe the same line on asylum seekers, global warming, feminism, and other hot-button issues.

I think most of them are genuinely unaware of what their own biases are, but those biases are clearly reflected in what appears on The Punch.

Markus says:

11:13am | 16/12/11

I’m just not sold on the theory that it’s one giant troll.
Lucy doesn’t seem like the type (though her articles tend to be a lot more sensible anyway), and Tory seems to get genuinely cut up when comments accuse The Punch of having a feminist agenda, or at least a blind focus on women.

That said, the theory definitely does explain how Tankard-Reist’s insane ramblings continue to reach the light of day.

John Smythe says:

11:29am | 16/12/11

Yeah Markus, I was going to comment on Lucy….one of the very few who regularly (maybe not so much anymore) contributes here with interesting articles.

Dunno Erick, you could say that they are still pandering to those beliefs BY only posting men hating feministic agenda based articles. Why attack your own, when all you need to do is attack the enemy, watch them respond, then your minions come out to play on your behalf.

I can see a Dilbert like cartoon being made out of this!

Markus, I think Tory is just an angry individual.

Erick says:

01:06pm | 16/12/11

@John Smythe - I’m not disagreeing with the Great Big Troll Theory at all.

I think it’s a case of “both, and” rather than “either, or”.

JC says:

02:22pm | 16/12/11

I’m not too sure about The Punch being anti-male, but I thought November was pretty disgusting, not one Movember article, not even something humouress, until the 1st of DECEMBER, and it was more like tossing a dog a bone rather than someone making a proper article, as if they were saying “will this shut you whingers up”.

We were told that they would put some Movember articles up when there was something interesting to talk about, or something along those lines. Yet the amount of women issues articles at that time was quite high, and most were just the same thing over and over, it’s as if they went out of there way to piss everyone off and to really slap Movember in the face.

I hardly think they would push aside a charity cause for more views would they?
I hope what I wrote made even a little bit of sense as I didn’t write this all in one go, so it’s probably all jumbled up :/

jay-ded says:

02:34pm | 16/12/11

The number of “Hits” would definitely be the main reason.  The more hits you have, the more advertising dollars…

John Smythe says:

02:59pm | 16/12/11

don’t think it works that way anymore jay-ded. You would have to click the add these days no? And even then, a lot only pay out if someone signs up.

The adds are not static anymore. If they use google advertising, I forget which option it was, the proposed ad space cycles a certain number of ads. I can’t see too many of you people seeing credit card ads for Japanese credit cards showing

Which…still means the person has to click the darn thing to begin with. I’m sure it is relative there somewhere. But for me….it’s a silly currency to go by. Right up there with # of FB friends and Youtube views..

Erick says:

03:05pm | 16/12/11

@Jay-ded - The Punch would get a huge number of hits if it actually published something controversial, like an attack on feminism for its sexist practices. And I’m pretty sure the staff know that.

They aren’t solely driven by hits. There are some topics that are taboo.

@JC - And the one “Movember” article, published the day after Movember was over, wasn’t even about Movemner at all. Though it was illustrated by the ugliest mo, featuring a big pimple on the chin of the wearer.

I’d see it not so much as a concession, but an insult.

Groucho49 says:

02:59pm | 17/12/11

Mate, look, Eric is just the blog equivalent of a knee-jerk, emphasis on the jerk.  His comments are mostly empty of all but bile and well worth ignoring.

Erick says:

06:36pm | 17/12/11

@Daniel Piotrowski - The same thing happens regardless of whether or not posts are linked on reddit. And as I’ve said above, it can be observed on websites around the world.

While I have expressed some support for the Great Big Troll Theory, my main position is that the bias of the articles reflects the bias of the staff. This is easily confirmed by comparing the number of articles supporting different sides of an issue with the slant of articles written by the staff themselves.

SimonFromLakemba says:

08:46am | 16/12/11

As a Collingwood supporter, was sad too see him go, was one of our best last year.

But Aboriginals are always a bit strange when it comes to making decisions ( going walk-a-bout etc ) maybe going to Perth is what he may want, $60,000 still isnt too bad.

I was surprised that no one picked up Fevola, hes a big body in the forward line and can could kick you 50 or so goals a year, someone like Port Adelaide could have used him.

Dash says:

09:54am | 16/12/11

Port can’t afford him! For such a proud SA club with a history longer than Collingwood’s (and a black and white jumper older than Collingwood’s), they are a sad mess.

Ben C says:

11:01am | 16/12/11

I don’t know if “Neon Leon” was going to stay on Collingwood’s list beyond 2012, I think Collingwood under Buckley might be heading in a different direction, and I’m not sure how much game time he’d be getting in 2012. Still, if I was paid $250k to do nothing, I’d stay on board.

SimonFromLakemba says:

11:03am | 16/12/11

Yep.

Originally from Broken Hill so know what Ports all about!

You think after they won the flag it would of been smooth sailing from there, obviously not.

I think I read that one of their major sponsors went bankrupt and they are owed money? that wouldn’t help either.

Well at the draft, I think Fevola would of been hard pressed to say no, although if they were continually getting flogged by 50 points every game I would worry about his commitment.

MarkS says:

11:36am | 16/12/11

I am sorry to see Doughnuts Davis leave Collingwood as well. Was always good in the H&A every three years when his contract was coming up for renewal. But in finals, he was the invisible man.

Wynston Cruso says:

05:32pm | 16/12/11

lol that’s what you get for demanding that kind of pay for playing a mediocre (at best) ‘sport’.

jay-ded says:

09:21am | 16/12/11

Check out some of the apps on them Elph, they leave the iphone apps for dead!  And you’re right.  They are sooo pretty. 

Anubis says:

09:23am | 16/12/11

I have had my Galaxy for nearly six months now - wonderfully versatile and useful phone. It has made things easier and more convenient. BTW: If you got navigon on it do yourself a favor and download the maps (make sure you are connected through a wi-fi network though because they are over 350Mb). One of the easiest and convenient Navigators I have used - even went to the trouble to fit a cradle on the dash of the car to fit the phone when using it as a navigator. The Galaxy also works well as a 3G modem when tethered to a Notebook computer - plug and play setup and fast. Wouldn’t even consider going back to my old phone.

Shenanigans says:

09:29am | 16/12/11

bah samsung, HTC all the way!

Dash says:

09:36am | 16/12/11

Elph - so now you match your phone!

Elphaba says:

09:48am | 16/12/11

@jayded, yep, I was just saying this morning that I’ve become one of those people that plays Angry Birds, lol. 

I downloaded the Tripview for the train and bus timetables, can anyone else recommend some practical apps?

@Shen, nah.  I didn’t like the feel of them in my hand.  This felt nice, was free to upgrade, and my data allowance in nearly 1G a month.  There’s no way I’ll use all of it.

@Anubis, yep, I was tossing up between the iPhone and this, and there are just too many bad opinions about the iPhone out there.  I’m happy with my choice.

@Dash *blush*.  It might be prettier! lol

iansand says:

10:09am | 16/12/11

Elphaba - If you want a practical app look for something called a Swiss Army Knife.  Spirit level, torch, ruler, compass, calculator, stop watch, timer.

John Smythe says:

10:17am | 16/12/11

Same one I have~

You will want to get Viber and Whatapp.

Viber works like skype and also has messenging as well (if you dont want to use whatsapp.)

Welcome to real technology~

Dash says:

12:35pm | 16/12/11

Elph - I doubt it

neo says:

12:43pm | 16/12/11

Great upgrade! Samsung makes great phones, and their screens are by far the best on the market. I do prefer HTCs over them though, I like the heavy, sturdy build of the HTCs, and since I run custom ROMs, my OS and GUI would be the same on either phone, so it’s all about the hardware for me.

Either way, it’s good to see that people are starting to recognise just how much Androids are superior to the shit that Apple peddles.

Elphaba says:

01:41pm | 16/12/11

@Dash

*basks in smugness*

I ain’t gonna argue…

Come on, has no one else got any suggestions?  I have Words With Friends, and my bank app.  I have to figure out how to make an mp3 into a ringtone, since I hate that sanitized shit that comes on phones.

Actually, I have to work out how to get the mp3 on there in the first place…

Elphaba says:

02:02pm | 16/12/11

Oh dear…

I spelt ‘sanitised’ ‘sanitized’.

*hangs head*

neo says:

02:46pm | 16/12/11

*chops off head with his anti-american axe”

Get a few apps that have cool widgets:

Dictionary.com - word of the day widget

Shazam - one click tagging of any music playing around you

I don’t use many appls anymore, but a few other cool ones:

App 2 SD - probably not such an issue for new handsets with larger memory cards, but let’s you move installed apps to the SD card and helps you easily clear the app cache

Google Sky Map - if you ever looked up at the sky and wondered what that star is called

Xe.com Currency - quick currency conversion, save your popular currencies in the list and you will be able to see the rates on one screen

eBay app - bid or sell on the go, plus lets you scan bar codes and search for similar items on ebay, to ensure you’re not getting ripped off

Boring apps I guess, but very useful!

Wynston Cruso says:

05:33pm | 16/12/11

I want one :(

My iPhone makes me want to eat babies.

Dash says:

09:49am | 16/12/11

I can’t wait for next year. 2011 basically sucked! I had a sh!t of a year and I can’t wait to start a new one.

I love your attitude! Good luck and congratulations with the new direction.

Elphaba says:

09:52am | 16/12/11

I’m sory about your friend Fairs.  That’s really scary when it sneaks up o you like that.  However, it sounds like you’re on an excellent path of self-discovery.  This can be an exciting time for you.  Good luck.

Erick says:

09:57am | 16/12/11

I hope your next week, next month and next year are heaps better, Fairs!

bec says:

10:15am | 16/12/11

Good for you and best of luck on the job and family front. 2012 would want to be better for me too and knowing all the awesome shit I have to look forward to (getting married, holiday to the USA, better classes) it will be pretty boss.

jay-ded says:

10:38am | 16/12/11

That’s sad news about your friend fairs.  Good news about your positive attitude though.  Best of luck next week. 

Bring on 2012!

Shenanigans says:

11:14am | 16/12/11

sucks about your friend fairs :( one of my closet friends from school died earlier this year from a car crash, not her fault either, still having a hard time with that one. So my sympathies to you.

For my first year out of school, this year sucked arse. can’t wait for it to be behind me, although i carry the scars of this year into the next, I do nothing but keep my chin up and know with confidence that no matter what, 2012 will be an awesome year.

John Smythe says:

11:42am | 16/12/11

Strange….even some of my FB (RL) friends are commenting 2011 has been a crap year. It has been a downer for me too…though it could be worse. Can’t wait for 2012….

Elphaba says:

12:20pm | 16/12/11

I’m starting to feel bad now, I actually had a pretty good year.  If 2011 is anything to go by, 2012 is going to be a cracker.

Tim says:

12:34pm | 16/12/11

Sounds like everyone’s ready for holidays.
Pip pip, chin up its nearly Christmas time.
2012 could be a vintage year.

AdamC says:

10:23am | 16/12/11

“Can anyone please tell me how this person was given 15 year minimum?”

Jay, in my view it is because the punishment settings in Victoria’s criminal justice system are too low and do not reflect public attitudes concerning the severity of violent crimes.

gobsmack says:

10:54am | 16/12/11

It seems too light.  He pleaded guilty which generally results in a reduction of the sentence.
Fortunately, Victoria has abolished the defence of provocation, so the killer couldn’t use the “homosexual advance defence” which, in the past, has allowed murderers to get off scot-free.

Erick says:

12:12pm | 16/12/11

@gobsmack - “Fortunately, Victoria has abolished the defence of provocation”

Slight correction. Victoria has abolished the defence of provocation only for men.

Victoria has legislated a defence of provocation only for women, who can get off scot free by claiming their murdered partner was an abuser.

neo says:

12:46pm | 16/12/11

I have been mentally abused by girls for years now, but I haven’t killed any of them yet :S

gobsmack says:

01:12pm | 16/12/11

@Eric
The legislation you refer to relates to self-defence and defensive homicide which are separate matters to provocation (which has been abolished in its entirety).
Section 9AH of the Victorian Crimes Act (“Family violence”)  is drafted in non-gender specific terms.  For example: “a person may believe, and may have reasonable grounds for believing, that his or her conduct is neccessary (a) to defend himself and herself or another person ..”.
So the defence is not “only for women”.  Especially if, as you consistently assert, women are equally liable to engage in domestic violence against men.

Erick says:

03:01pm | 16/12/11

@gobsmack - Regardless of how it is drafted or presented, that legislation is intended to let women off the hook for murdering their male partners, and that is how it will be used.

We all know that sex-neutral legislation is interpreted by sexist judges and a sexist legal system.

gobsmack says:

03:35pm | 16/12/11

@Erick
Unbelievable.
You stated, and I quote “Victoria has legislated a defence of provocation only for women”.
It wasn’t a defence of “provocation”.  Wrong.
The defence in question wasn’t “only for women”.  Wrong again.
Before you arrogantly decide a post is in need of a “slight correction” make sure you know what you’re talking about.

Erick says:

04:12pm | 16/12/11

@gobsmack - Regardless of how it is drafted or presented, that legislation is intended to let women off the hook for murdering their male partners, and that is how it will be used.

  We all know that sex-neutral legislation is interpreted by sexist judges and a sexist legal system.

jay-ded says:

10:34am | 16/12/11

Group Hug for iansand. 

Jay says:

11:02am | 16/12/11

Concur.

neo says:

12:47pm | 16/12/11

I know huh, I have another week at work left still before we close up for the holidays :( And over 3 hours worth of work this week :( :(

Shenanigans says:

11:30am | 16/12/11

Hey you! Be a mang, do the right ting!

neo says:

12:51pm | 16/12/11

Now is $10, you come later, say “I want bag for $10” but I say “Nooo, now the bag is $20”

No, but China has enslaved the world with it’s exports, they won and well played.

SimonFromLakemba says:

01:11pm | 16/12/11

Russell Peters FTW!

ausspud says:

12:02pm | 16/12/11

You better bloody believe it but not only that,also those losers who go to Asia and get themselves a wife from the shelf like they are shopping for lollies.

marley says:

12:29pm | 16/12/11

There’s a difference between arranged marriages and forced marriages.  I know lots of people in arranged marriages who are quite happy - but they had a choice about the marriage, and they were all adults with university degrees when they “settled down.”  Taking teenage girls out of high school and shipping them off to whereever to marry some guy they’ve never heard of is just wrong.

Elphaba says:

12:43pm | 16/12/11

No.  There are plenty of people in arranged marriages that are happy.

So long as both parties are consenting and of legal age, there’s no problem with it.  So long as no one is forcing me into a marriage I don’t want, I don’t really care what other people do.

neo says:

12:53pm | 16/12/11

Well, considering how many girls and how much stress you have to go through before you meet someone who would make a good wife/mother and not be a total psycho at the same time, I welcome an arranged marriage for myself.

gobsmack says:

01:17pm | 16/12/11

No.  But gays should have the right to have arranged marriages as well.

Arturo says:

02:31pm | 16/12/11

@ marley, Elphaba, neo,

So arranged marriage are ok, because you know some people are happy in them.  What about the effect on society as whole of allowing this practice to take hold?

What do you think of Dowrys and other payments for an arranged marriage?  An arranged marriage to a person in the high average income developed world is a highly sought after product in the developing world, something people are prepared to pay substantial amounts of money for.

What do you think of the practice in the UK of a particular ethnic group who typically have large families on welfare and with most of the children return to their ethnic homeland for an arranged marriage to a close cousin.  They then return to the UK to repeat an ever increasing cycle.  What of the cost to society of the health problems that result from this practice?

Its worth reading this article and some of the comments on what is going on the UK because they are now experiencing some of the problems we will start to see much more of in Australia in the future.

Elphaba says:

02:54pm | 16/12/11

@Arturo,

That article is about ‘forced’ marriages, not ‘arranged’.  They’re two separate entities.

I already answered your question.  No one should be forced into a marriage.  But I have no problem if consenting parties wish to take part in an arranged marriage.

Your article is somewhat disingenious and overhyped.  Until it separates the two, my opinon still stands.

neo says:

02:54pm | 16/12/11

I was jesting in my comment, but if you want a serious opinion, here it is:

No one should be forced to marry others by their parents, that is granted. As for relatives encouraging you to marry a person, there’s nothing wrong with that, dowry or not, just as long as the people getting married are happy to do so. Of course, I know from experience, the moment someone “encourages” you to get together with someone else, that someone becomes the last person you want to get together with, but if you can get over that hurdle, so be it

Arturo says:

06:42pm | 16/12/11

@Elphaba

I guess you look at it from the rights of the individual,  which is one way of looking at the problem.

Where as I’m having a look at it from the point of view of the rights of the society and the cost impacts this inevitably brings to bear on a generous welfare state.  Having a system which allows arranged marriages and payments is open to abuse, particularly so in a developed country like Australia.  Western societies got rid of these archaic practices centuries ago not by making them against the law but by making them socially unacceptable.  Making something socially unacceptable once worked, but not any more.

http://www.economist.com/node/13497357

The final comment is interesting from a person in the British MP who represents a community with a large Bangladeshi community.
“Parents who arrange marriages like these are holding the whole community back. They’re not just importing cousins; they’re importing poverty.” And that, in the long run, may prove a bigger Pakistani threat to Britain than extremism.

simonfromLakemba says:

07:07pm | 16/12/11

“Parents who arrange marriages like these are holding the whole community back. They’re not just importing cousins; they’re importing poverty.” And that, in the long run, may prove a bigger Pakistani threat to Britain than extremism”

Fair point raised, i guess its about bringing in the right immigrants/refugees. But being friends with a hell of a lot of people FOB, I know so many work very hard doing what that they can to get better in life, I just think Australia has a very different mentality to UK.

You have to remember a lot of the South Asians we let in after the war had no english skills or general 1st world skills, 30 years later they now own a lot of business and their kids fill universities.

Elphaba says:

07:13pm | 16/12/11

I think, Arturo we just disagree.  You see it as a social evil, and I really don’t.  ‘Banning’ things rarely solves anything, and possibly would drive this practice underground.  I would rather have it out in the open, and law-abiding, than clandestine and secret, and open to more abuse.

I also think the idea that arranged marriages automatically import ‘poverty’, doesn’t sit well with me.  That’sa glib and rather cruel assessment.

fairsfair says:

02:08pm | 16/12/11

WTF? This is the lowest thing I think I have ever read.

Grow the fk up you loser.

stephen says:

08:39pm | 17/12/11

Nah, this is the mamsy who starts of with..‘your comment’...so she’s wrong ... as always.
Molly will come around, and the first thing he’ll want is a mirror.

ps In joke, and both ways.

Tim says:

01:42pm | 16/12/11

Bros before hos.

gobsmack says:

01:50pm | 16/12/11

Couldn’t you have taken your mate out with you to the birthday party?  Might have kept everyone happy.

Elphaba says:

01:57pm | 16/12/11

She made herself cry by being a psycho bitch.  She’s been dating you a couple of months and thinks she gets to be number one?  Pfft.

If she reacts in this way over something minor, how is she going to handle it when the shit really hits the fan?

Cut her loose.  You dodged a bullet Next!

Shenanigans says:

02:01pm | 16/12/11

first off that’s exactly how my last relationship ended, but it had to do with one of my friends deaths, but thats not important.

whats more important is that you be there for your bro, romance comes and goes but bros are forever, be the blood bros or bond bros they are still bros and they always come first. Woman are always prone to over reactions and crying and such to try and get their way, all you need to do is say, its just one Friday, you’re mate is feeling really bad about himself, convince your lady that she is still important but you can meet her friends another time.

if that doesnt work, I’m completely out of ideas

fairsfair says:

02:05pm | 16/12/11

You forgot something. Your friend needs you and more importantly, you want to be there for your friend. She is not being very fair as you sound like you have been upfront with your error and unless you spoke to her like a piece of crap when you delivered the news, I can’t really see the problem.

I think she is being a bit unreasonable. Keep in mind though, if she quit her job only yesterday, she may be a bit emotional about a multitide of things and she may be placing more emphasis on this event going as she planned or anyone would consider normal. Maybe you should take her out for breakfast or something tomorrow morning and make it clear to her that she will be your friday night preference in future.

It seems like it has blown up a bit for you, which makes me think that there is more to it that she is not telling you, but I don’t think something like this would end it neo. And #1 thing from the longterm single gal - please don’t base your feelings on what you think the other person is thinking. “Its probably over”. I have broken up with some really decent guys because of what was probably going on and what I thought they were thinking - which is nuts! Nuts I tell you!

SimonFromLakemba says:

02:25pm | 16/12/11

Tell her to go jump, hate girls like that.

There her friends anyways, she should expect you to come.

jay-ded says:

02:42pm | 16/12/11

OMG neo.  Sounds like you saved yourself a heap of grief.  Dump the whinging crying crazy bitch.

Best friends are hard to find and you should be there for them.  Most girlfriends would understand something like this.

Dash says:

02:45pm | 16/12/11

Neo - think with the head that’s attached to your shoulders! This will continue for the rest of your life if you don’t put your foot down now. Test her by going out with your mate. If she calls it off because of that, she’s not worth staying with anyway.

neo says:

03:28pm | 16/12/11

Thanks for the support guys, it means a lot

Tim - exactly right, there is so much wisdom in that saying.

gobsmack - I’ve actually thought of doing that, but I don’t want to impose my friend on these people, whom I don’t even know myself. I did invite her to come with me and cheer up my friend, but she wasn’t have any of it.

Elphaba - I love your kind of attitude right now, I wish that I could adapt it at the moment. You make a great point too, and one I have been debating with myself too - if she is like this now, what will she be like further into the relationship, when we actually experience a greater disagreement!?

Shen - I pretty much said that, but she turned everything I said into “You’d rather hang with your mates than me”. Well said about bros too, they’ve been with me through thick and thin, and through arguments and fights, and I must admit, I’ve neglected them because of girls at times, but even then they remained bros, because bros don’t bicker over stupid shit!

fairs - nah, I was really polite and nice about it, as I always am I’d happily make it up to her tomorrow, and she may come around in the end, I don’t know, she is the type to be really angry for a time and then come off it, but she is also pretty strong willed, and she told me that she already made up her mind, so who knows.

Simon - haha, I really felt like saying “guess what, this dude’s my best mate, who the f are you?” at first, but she started crying, and I’m soft :(

jay - I was hoping she would. Thing is, she’s a really nice girl, very much my type, very affectionate and seems to be very trust worthy. She is pretty much my ideal partner, apart from her possessiveness bordering on psychosis. Get this, she called me one night when I was asleep, and I’m a pretty deep sleeper, so I couldn’t hear the phone vibrating. I woke up the next morning to a txt saying “I now have no doubt that you are seeing someone else, good luck with your life”.......WTF!? Yeah, that type of girl… I must clarify that I am very trust worthy, when I’m with someone, I never flirt with others or anything like that, and I never gave her any reason to doubt me.

Dash - I think you are very correct in saying that, if a person is ready to throw the relationship out the window over something as stupid and minor as this, well, what chance do we ever have…

Ahh, women :(

Elphaba says:

04:46pm | 16/12/11

@neo, she’s not your ideal woman if she acts like this.  None of the things you listed can make up for her being unhinged at the first sign of things not going her way.

Don’t call her again.  You’ll look pathetic.  And she’ll revel in the power trip.  You have nothing to make up for.

fairsfair says:

05:05pm | 16/12/11

Jesus neo - re that text message - RUN.

Wynston Cruso says:

05:48pm | 16/12/11

I feel your pain neo. If only there were a way to have with men, what we have with women…..

*strokes chin*

SimonFromLakemba says:

02:31pm | 16/12/11

Im covered in them personally, mine all have a story to them.

The problem comes as im only young myself, I see soo many bogans getting them which have no meaning ( southern cross, kois on white ppl??, such is life ) its gotten to the point where if your friend gets a tatt, you have to aswell, its like a sheep thing.

You only have to go to Mooseheads on a Friday/Saturday night to see it in action.

I see it no different to the older ppl whinging as their parents did when they listened to rock music and grew their hair long.

fairsfair says:

02:43pm | 16/12/11

I don’t get why people treat others differently because they have them. I do judge people for them though, not sure why. For instance, our neighbour wore a blue wifebeater, had tats all over him and rode a Harley. The NICEST and most genuinely decent, funniest man you could ever meet. We had him pegged as a coffin cheater. So wrong.

I also laugh at white boys that get Mauri sleeve tats. They are going to look so cool when they are 80. But that said, barring immediate personal thoughts - I don’t bring them up or treat someone differently because they have them.

On a personal note. It recently took me four months to settle on a new hair colour. That is something that can easily be fixed if you don’t like it. I do not know how people can make the decision on something that they love so very much, knowing that it will be there for ever. You can take piercings out, most never even leave an inidcation they were ever there - but a tattoo is forever and I can’t grasp having something on my body for the rest of my life.

marley: says:

02:50pm | 16/12/11

I’m not going to insult you or get venomous. I’m not keen on body art, whether its tattoos or piercings, but at least piercings aren’t permanent.  If you change your mind later, or outgrow them, you can get rid of them.  Not so easy with tatts.  As to why I don’t like them much, I dunno - matter of personal taste, I’d say.  Nothing more profound than that.

What are you thinking of having done?

JC says:

03:19pm | 16/12/11

I thought tattoos are popular arn’t they?
Everyone has them..
I do remember Shen you were talking about video game tattoos, I thought that was silly, to keep it short and sweet I think video game tattoos are stupid.

Other then that I got no problem with the ink, in fact I’m planning to get some myself, just low cash and all that jazz.

Tim says:

03:24pm | 16/12/11

Shenanigans,
Tattoo’s were the domain of bikies and such. Only Bad people had them.
Then the bogans started getting them and next thing you know, every Todd Carney wannabe has a neck and sleeve tattoo and every chick has a tramp stamp and ankle tattoo.
They aren’t the same as piercings because you can simply remove them, tattoos are permanent.

Now you may have tattoos for your own reasons but to think people won’t stereotype you because of them is naiive. You will be judged for them, the best you can do is not care what other people think.

Shenanigans says:

03:41pm | 16/12/11

Marley I’m done with my ink for now, a half sleeve a forearm tatt and 3 on my back are enough, all of them have a story and meaning to me. I just hate how I get judged and insulted because I’m inked

Erick says:

03:47pm | 16/12/11

I’m not against tattoos. People are free to do whatever they want with their own skin.

However, I am also free to decide whether or not I find tattoos attractive. Usually I don’t, but sometimes I do ...

Markus says:

03:50pm | 16/12/11

With the exception of the standard ear lobe ones, plenty of people do mind piercings. Big time.

Provided people are not assaulting you or discriminating against you, they have as much right to judge you on your choices as you do to make them to begin with.

Being judged by people you couldn’t care less about has no real impact on you, so the bigger question is - why do you care?

neo says:

04:00pm | 16/12/11

I’m a bit old school with tatts, back in the day they were crim markings, you get different tatts for whichever crimes you commit, or which prisons you serve your time in. Obviously they have gone well beyond that, and are pretty acceptable nowadays.

Nothing against people with tatts, although I wouldn’t get one myself. I do find it a bit weird when white dudes get Japanese words tatted on them, or put dragons etc, or even tribal tatts, like, that’s not your culture, why are you representing something you’re not.

And just to be a hypocrite to what I just said, I always say that if I was ever to get a tatt, it would be of a tiger on my left shoulder, as I was born in the year of the tiger, according to the CHINESE calendar Plus I love tigers. And cats for that matter

Elphaba says:

04:19pm | 16/12/11

I have a nose piercing and it’s awesome.  Teeny tiny.  I love it.

Wynston Cruso says:

06:08pm | 16/12/11

Although I don’t particularly like the idea of tattoo’s in general (especially asian symbols on someone who clearly doesn’t know what said symbol even means), I like your idea Shen of having a family crest as one. It’s probably the only tattoo I’d consider worth getting. I have nordic heritage on both sides if I trace either back far enough. My dad’s side of the family (dutch) has a crest with a tree (I’m guessing it’s supposed to be Yggdrasil) with a bunch of colours and a funky looking sea monster. Don’t let the arseholes get you down Shen, you’ll find that it’s only the shallow and arrogant people who care what other people do with their skin, and you’re better off getting advice from more tolerant people such as those commenting on your thread.

On a side note, I was thinking of getting some writing on my forearm (Nostradamus’ final quatrain) but it turns out the letters have to be pretty big or it will turn into a blur within a few years. This doesn’t help as I’m a skinny bastard, but in adition to the crest I’m still thinking of getting it, albeit somewhere else. Plus I’m in a government job and not sure if a visual tat would be acceptable.

fairsfair says:

06:34pm | 16/12/11

Merry Christmas TimmyB - hope you have a great holiday and see you in 2012