Much glorious Afghan victory has been won by ADF

iansand says:

03:51pm | 14/10/09

Leo - Isn’t the problem that our fearless investigative media will do exactly what the ADF want - publish these stories verbatim?  What did Joh call it?  Feeding the chooks?

SM says:

04:14pm | 14/10/09

I don’t reckon that’s the problem iansand.  Due to the Australian military’s constant attempts to mislead and to cover up bastardization at all levels (even internal suicides for gods sake), I think they’re generally seen as an entirely dishonest organisation, and the media and everyone else are quite rightly highly suspicious of anything they say.  Leo’s last paragraph nails it. 

Anyone who saw Defence Chief Angus Houston on Lateline the other evening was treated to a beathtakingly brilliant display of sombre-faced spin

John A Neve says:

04:49pm | 14/10/09

With the sad passing of John Wayne there is little hope of the coalition of the willing winning in Afghanistan. Just think a multi-million dollar endeavour, with highly trained and armoured troops against men wearing sheets. Let’s retreat with dignity.

Eric says:

06:15pm | 14/10/09

Meh. Journalists and media are way overrated.

I think what the ADF is doing is called “operational security”.

As far as I’m concerned, they can continue doing it.

Maybe, one day, some Australian journalist will prove worthy of being included in operations. Until then, I’m happy to keep these idiots out of serious affairs.

L says:

08:51pm | 14/10/09

Agree with Eric.

Perhaps journo’s should learn about the military prior to reporting? The amount of Army C-130’s, RAAF helicopters and M113 tanks - any ideas why the average soldier laughs at you? Then throw in the attitude that we are all evil, raping, baby-killing monsters and ever shall it be…is there any question why the average Troop Commander or soldier doesn’t want to touch the media with a 10’ pole? Add the constant negativity: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Px_XBJHrs4I

I personally like being asked about a shooting in Afghanistan whilst walking around Melbourne. All you journalists are aware that there are more then 50 of us? In fact, there is just over 51000, so I probably don’t know everthing else going on. Likewise, we have bad apples - but guess what? I put 51000 in the SFC and there’ll be bad apples.

I love my job - wouldn’t want to be media relations or PR for all the gong’s avaliable thanks.

T.Chong says:

09:25pm | 14/10/09

The writers for Air marshal Angus would make John Bull blush.
To any reader of history,our propaganda is deja vu, and very troubling for it. Once again we are treated to self less , all ways gallant and humane actions on our part, while battling cowardly insurgents who wont wear uniforms,or abide by our rules.
Who could forget the unbelievable ANZAC day story , this year, when it was announced that the ADF killed 25 bad guys on that day alone.. If any “collateral’ casualties occur, then we didnt do it. If we did, it wasnt our fault etc etc
The value of propaganda is to dehumanise the enemy, making it easier to justify the killing.
iansand is correct , the gullible public accepi ihe word of our embedded media. Disgusting.

Mark says:

09:26pm | 14/10/09

I think people are missing the point. Operational security, the media hates that. Ok, so the media thinks it is unbiased in it deals with defence? come on, what sells papers? Scandal, cover ups all sorts of juicy stuff. Face it, after the Richard Carleton (RIP) debacle with the bastardisation case at Holsworthy and him being sued and being ordered out of East Timor for in sighting a riot, http://www.rage.net.au/rn/mediareport/stories/1999/49019.htm no wonder they are not accessible.

SM, your talking out of turn. Its very easy to take pot shots at that org. Suicide is something most people deal with no matter where they are or whos the employer. Defence is no different to the rest of the nation. As for bastardisation, give me a break.

Chris says:

09:21am | 15/10/09

Operational Security is a vital component of any military operation and it should not be degraded in any capacity. However, my experience in the post 9/11 world from an Australian perspective is that it is a wonderful way to manage the news stories. It was done in the previous government and the practice continues with this one. You can lock out any story with operational security and you can manage your journos very well. Surely the Americans and British who manage their media differently also utilise operational security - so why can’t we get the balance right.
War is about information management - not information control.
We have lost the balance in determining what is meant to be secure and what is not. I remember a story where a young female helicopter pilot landed her Blackhawk on the oval at her old School in adelaide. She apparently always wanted to be a pilot and if she made it, then she wanted to go back to her old school. She should be proud of her achievements as many aspire to be a military pilot and a tiny fraction get through the long and arduous training. Therefore it was a great news opportunity that should not be wasted. However, her name could not be released due to operational reasons!!! She was a helicopter pilot - was she engaged at that moment in top secret operations in another part of the world - no she was in Adelaide at her old school. You could find out who she was by many means the simplest being asking 500 teenage girls who were also there or looking at their school magazine. We need to gain some perspective on securing our people and at the same time providing balanced reporting.

T.Chong says:

10:00am | 15/10/09

Chris: I believe that most of the cloak and dagger nonsense is very similar to when police remove their name/number tags- it is to stop accountability. In officialdom, if you cant identify a wrong doer, that very much limits any type of enquiry. (Nothing to do wither ‘copter pilot, of course)
Why do “special Forces” need to be kept anomynous in their own country? So they can carry out operations that many people would find unacceptable, surveilance,covert ops etc and not be held accountable.
The blurring of roles between serving and ex operatives was most clearly seen during Howards waterfront dispute.
Since 9/11 and with our varios foreign ventures insitu, the ADF has never had it so good. More and more empire building with less and less accountability. If you ask questions than you must be a “terrorist sympathiser”
Do not ask for whom the bell tolls…,it tolls for any and everyone who decries the jingoistic militarism that is our current world.

Mark says:

12:52pm | 15/10/09

T. Chong, the reason ID of special forces members are kept secret is exactly that. Recent events dictate that even in our own country members are targets. Its not about terror sympathisers at all. Special Forces members have always been cloak and dagger. The only difference now is that they are moving around you and you now know it. Years ago prior to 9/11 you wouldn’t t have.

Unfortunately, the Taliban know that they can say what ever they like to a reporter and they will believe it and report. The population will accept their story as truth because he/she is the trusted reporter. The ADF is seen as a liar and not to be trusted by just being the military…odd? So just who does the bell really toll for? I think I will settle for letting the ADF go about doing what it does best. You should be questioning the GOVT. That would be more appropriate I would think.

T.Chong says:

01:28pm | 15/10/09

Mark: The ADF “Public Affairs/Relations” or whatevr title goes by,  is a propaganda unit- pure and simple, like every other country in every war since David vs Goliath. Just because they are “ours” doesnt lessen the reality of them being paid to spin stories. Look at any neg event concerning the ADF:
1) WE did not do it 2) We will look into it 3) if it was us,it was accidental   4) Yes but the Talabaan made us- but dont worry we gave the survivors $1500 bucks 5) Look at the bridge we built.
How long was My Lai covered up?That is why you cant trust spin.

MarkH says:

05:46pm | 15/10/09

T.Chong, casualties of war…how long do you think these guys have to make a snap decision??? 1hr? try .5 seconds friend or foe. Sure innocent people are killed but I dont see you questioning the Talibans tactics by suicide bombing or IED attacks. So what is it? Sure the ADF need to be accountable but at what cost? do you want to see more of Australians coming home dead because of changes to the orders to open fire? Right now, today the Taliban backed by Al Quada have attacked a police station killing police and children on their way to school in Pakistan. So whats your take on that? Is the media holding the taliban responsible for that? no they arnt as they dont have the guts to confront them. Only with the backing of western troops will they report on and the ones they denigrate. Nice isnt it.

I suppose theres a Taliban Public Affairs will just say it was a mistake and do the same thing tomorrow and the day after. Where is the middle ground? do you honestly think that Soldiers involved in the killing of innocent people have no remorse? Are you going to have some legal process to charge these men? if so, we may never defend ourselves at any level or anyone else and you will have no army. There is no bridge mate. This is for keeps and unless people like you take a harden up pill or a teaspoon of cement, we as a nation will be treated like the spineless contemptuous nation these people think we are. I respect your opinion but it is apparent you lack the background understanding of how this thing is unfolding. Its not going away and neither are they.