Its time. Sorry, it’s time to save the apostrophe

Scott says:

07:43am | 30/06/09

Thank you!
There is nothing more annoying that a word nazi. But as it happens I am a word nazi who has to bite their tongue when people send e-mails and post facebook updates etc. which read with an entirely different meaning to that intended.
The subtle (ahem) difference between “your” and “you’re” seems to be lost on so many people that I now seem to be in the minority when it comes to recognising a difference.
Long live the apostrophe!

Steve says:

08:06am | 30/06/09

Tracey, Australia dropped apostrophes from place names eight years ago. I fear you are a little late.

Mark says:

08:37am | 30/06/09

My own pet hate is when people write “thankyou” instead of “thank you” - it’s not one word!!!

Jeff from Meroo says:

08:39am | 30/06/09

Wow.  It takes guts to write an article on grammar knowing that those most interested in reading it will be grammar buffs.  I’m so glad you bring this up as it leads me to one of my all time pet peeves.

Newspapers that do not capitalize proper nouns.

“The modern-day culprit is the internet.”

The Internet is a proper noun like Sydney or Australia or Mr. Rudd.  Those that don’t know the difference between a internet and the Internet are almost as bad as those that don’t know the difference between “your” and “you’re”. 

You can find out how to properly capitalize “Internet” on the Internet.  (Is that ironic seeing as The Punch is only found on the Internet?)

Dictionary.com, Cambridge Online Dictionary, Merriam-Webster Online, Encyclopedia.com and even Wikipedia will all tell you the same thing.  Have a look for yourself.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/internet
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=41534&dict=CALD
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/internet
http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/the_Internet.aspx

Please pass this onto your editors and ensure The Punch doesn’t follow down the same path of poor grammar that other online papers seem to have in recent times.

Ben from Margate says:

08:51am | 30/06/09

One ‘die’, two ‘dice’.

RT says:

08:58am | 30/06/09

Tracey, your first two sentences - no doubt purposely -  used the two words that most commonly feature misplaced apostrophes. I refer to ‘it’s’ and ‘its’. A large number of people could not tell you which version of the word ‘it’ should contain an ’ when followed by an ‘s’. It’s not their fault. It’s the fault of the English language and its many spelling quirks. For one thing, the possessive case of the pronoun ‘it’ does NOT contain an apostrophe, unlike all nouns, which do. So its = belonging to it, while it’s = it is.

Lesley (Boomer) says:

09:35am | 30/06/09

It is frequently the Boomer generation which is most vocal in its annoyance about bad grammar.  Strangely, the same generation responsible for the design and teaching of school programs which seem deliberately to have removed it from the curriculum in recent decades.

Steve Symon says:

09:57am | 30/06/09

Couldn’t agree with you more.  I’m made to feel like I should apologise when I correct someone’s grammar at my work place be it in writing or verbal. This former colleague of mine, a mature female, took great exception to me suggesting that she meant “agreement” instead of “agreeance” (sic) and either “regardless” or “irrespective” rather than “irregardless” (sic).  Mind you, I’d sooner she took exception rather than send me an email declaring “your a legend”.  BTW Tracey, IMHO you are legendary!

Steve Symon says:

10:03am | 30/06/09

My humblest apologies Tracy, I inadvertently added an ‘e’ to your name in my earlier posting;o)

Sylvano says:

10:27am | 30/06/09

And don’t forget contractions either…

I have caused wars in the office in proclaiming that doc’s is a valid form as it’s the use of an apostrophe to signify the killing off of letters. i.e. documents -> doc’s.

The other thing I have noticed in peoples’ (*wait for brick bats*) speech, including professional news readers, is the loss of the plural as follows: “There’s many days when trains run late.” What happened to “There’re?”

MH says:

10:28am | 30/06/09

Please don’t get me started on legal grammar. The “Company” and the “Board” are not proper nouns. Nor is “Chairman” a proper noun. so stop capitalising them!
It is passing strange that you can spend four years doing a law degree and still not learn correct grammar. Even worse is the strong suspicion that law schools actually teach incorrect grammar…

Kat Clay says:

10:30am | 30/06/09

It’s a general grammar rule today to drop possessives from place names, hence St Marys and Kings Cross. It would look a little ridiculous to have King’s Cross, or in the case of multiple kings, Kings’ Cross.

The problem in England is consistency, and as we all know, consistency is key in any editing work. While the English may despise learning grammatical lessons from the Americans, ‘The United States Board on Geographic Names, which has responsibility for formal naming of municipalities and geographic features, has deprecated the use of possessive apostrophes since 1890.’ (Taken from the ever so reliable Wikipedia article on apostrophes). If they’ve been removing them since 1890, I think it’s a bit silly to start complaining now.

As for the concept of the ‘Internet’ being a proper noun - yes, Microsoft Word will capitalise it for you automatically - however, editorial tendancies today dictate minimal capitalisation. While ‘Internet’ may be your bugbear, Jeff, it seems that the word was made a proper noun when the internet was a new, novel idea and not the everyday thing we use for research, emails and checking out grammatical rules. I see the internet as more of a tool, like a computer, mouse and desktop, none of which are capitalised. Writing the ‘Internet’ makes you look like someone who’s just installed dial up in the world of ADSL2.

Thanks for the hilarious article. I hope that no rabbits were hurt in the making.

iansand says:

10:51am | 30/06/09

Apostrophes don’t matter very often.  We adapt and adjust to their absence.  However, there are times when they do matter.  It’s best to get into the habit of using them correctly so that their inclusion or exclusion is automatic.

Apart from anything else, correct use of apostrophes is a courtesy to your readers.  It is discourteous to compel people to make assumptions about your meaning when there is a simple means of providing unambiguous clarity.  The same concept applies to spelling and grammar, as well.

stephen says:

11:40am | 30/06/09

ITs be-cause we’re nt al-ways at skool.

ChrisK says:

12:23pm | 30/06/09

“Consider ‘Those things on the bed are my boyfriend’s’ compared with ‘Those things on the bed are my boyfriends’,” write LJ Loch. “One means I’m picking things up, while the other means I’ve picked up!”

Surely this is something you would almost certainly say rather than write - which raises the important point that we happily live without apostrophes in spoken English. They are not pronounced, and are not needed as the meaning is obvious from the context. Indeed, the humour in these sorts of examples lies in the fact that the meaning given by the misused apostrophe is clearly not what was intended.

We like to think of grammar as fixed rules, but language changes over time. Features that cause unnecessary complication or confusion are naturally discarded. If you find yourself having to defend something, it is already too late.

James McIlwain says:

12:27pm | 30/06/09

Perhaps we should just drop the use of contractions in writing, freeing the apostrophe from its (or) it’s *$&#^@# dual burden. While you are at it - there is no orientated, uninterested or unworried either. Do not, can not, will not, should have, could have, you have, you are, I am, I will. What ever, she will be (al) right mate.

Bernie says:

01:23pm | 30/06/09

The purpose of an apostrophe is to add clarity. If the use of an apostrophe within a sentence is correct, the meaning of the sentence will undeniably be clearer and more certain. Conversely, the absence of an apostrophe will degrade the clarity of the sentence: the question becomes to what extent. Sometimes it won’t matter at all. Sometimes it might cause slight confusion. Sometimes an entire legal case might hang on the issue. In the end, it’s a question of whether its inclusion is or isn’t worth academics’ time and effort, I s’pose.

JT says:

01:31pm | 30/06/09

Sure, unworry is a word. I saw it on an NRMA ad. And my 2-year-old sings “Happy EOFYS” instead of “Happy Birthday”...

realto says:

01:31pm | 30/06/09

Lesley (Boomer): your observation illustrates why attributing the way things are to a certain generation is trickier than a flock of apostrophes.

John T says:

01:50pm | 30/06/09

In South Australia using an apostrophe in certain circumstances may be an offence carrying a maximum penalty of $5,000. 

http://www.landservices.sa.gov.au/1Online_Services/55Place_Names/Guidelinesfortheselectionofnames.asp 

In the legislation “place” is broadly defined to include ” any area, region, locality, city, suburb, town, township, or settlement, or any geographical or topographical feature, and includes any railway station, hospital, school and any other place or building that is, or is likely to be, of public or historical interest ” .http://tinyurl.com/neu5ex

A prominent Adelaide school has the official place name “St Peters College” http://tinyurl.com/lord8p. On its website the school (except for the URL), retains the apostrophe throughout: http://www.stpeters.sa.edu.au/

The law states

“a person must not produce or cause to be produced, or display or cause to be displayed, a document or advertisement in which another name is represented, specifically or by implication, as being the name of that place unless the geographical name or the approved name is also prominently represented.”  http://tinyurl.com/l7bn9f

I can’t find anywhere where the St Peter’s College website “prominently represents” the correct geographical name.  Can we expect the place names police to do something about this before others flout the law so openly?

Bernie says:

01:54pm | 30/06/09

“It’s” is probably the most horribly misused word in the English language, and is invariably used to denote possession (e.g. “the dog ate it’s dinner”). If you are reading this and do not know why that example is WRONG, you need to have a good look at yourself. The other atrocity regularly inflicted upon the poor old apostrophe is to use it to indicate the plural of a word (“We sell pizza’s here”). These are simple errors and should be easy to eliminate in any school that is even dimly capable of teaching students the basics of the English language. The fact that these really basic and really annoying errors are evident throughout every nook and cranny of society speaks volumes about the lamentable deficiencies of the current ejakayshen sistem. Does it matter? Do clarity and precision ever matter?Perhaps not. Perhaps the “point and grunt” method of communication favoured by so many teenagers is quite sufficient after all. It’s / Its / Its’ up to you, I guess.

OMC says:

02:38pm | 30/06/09

I’ve skimmed through the replies and would appreciate some assistance.

Is the collective noun for a group of pedants a necklace?

(because if it is we could just about open a jewellery store)

Bernie says:

02:57pm | 30/06/09

How many pedants does it take to change a light bulb ?
ANS: Bayonet or screw ?

Lexi says:

03:01pm | 30/06/09

I am a pedant and proud.  I only wish my courage extended further than rubbing out errant apostrophes on restaurant blackboards!

Thankfully, Tracy is a journalist and knows how to use English, but the number of blogs -  that lack basic English.  Urgh!  I read one the other day (not here) that referred to “gaffa tape”.  Since the tape is used by “gaffers” (film and TV lighting experts), I politely explained in a post that it should actually be “gaffer tape”.

My other pet hate - in addition to the plethora outlined by others here - is when people use apostrophes and English rules in words from other languages.  Someone else gave the examples of “pizza’s”.  Plural of pizza should be pizze.  The plural of pasta is not pasta’s, either. If you sell it, learn about it.

And I’m not a Baby Boomer, either.  Just for the record.

Steve says:

03:50pm | 30/06/09

RT - No possessive pronouns contain apostrophes - his, hers, theirs - so ‘its’ is not really much of a ‘quirk’.

Jeff from Meroo - good point regarding the Internet. Of course, there should not be a period following Mr in ‘Mr. Rudd’ - they are only required if the abbreviation does not end in the same letter as the full word.

James McIlwain - there certainly is such a word as uninterested, which conveys a lack of interest, as opposed to disinterested, which means impartial.

My pet peeves include when people try and do something rather than try to do something and when commas are used incorrectly in denoting clauses.

regina says:

05:25pm | 30/06/09

should i be feeling near-homicidal rage every time i see the ‘whatsnew’ commercial on the telly?  it just seems a little extreme to me.

Jeff from Meroo says:

05:43pm | 30/06/09

Kat Clay - Apostrophes have been around a lot longer than the Internet (and yet here we are discussing them).  If I were to apply your dial up/ADSL2 argument, by using apostrophes one might hardly be understood for you may as well be speaking Shakespearean English to Gen Y.

But seriously, I’m not the one you need to convince.  If you could just convince the world’s dictionaries that because you feel that since your desktop isn’t capitalized, you shouldn’t bother capitalizing the place it connects to, that would be great.  Hey maybe you can get them to forget about capitalizing any and all places all together while you’re at it.  Maybe get rid of the shift key once and for all…  WHOO HOOO!!!! 

Steve - Thanks for the tip.

@RichardTuffin says:

07:47pm | 30/06/09

U-K?? Since when has it been U-K?  It’s (checking, yes, appropriate usage there!) IUK, OK?

@RichardTuffin says:

07:48pm | 30/06/09

U-K?? Since when has it been U-K?  It’s (checking, yes, appropriate usage there!) IUK, OK?

Jason says:

07:51pm | 30/06/09

OMC, I think it should be a sophistry of pedants…

Peter says:

08:09pm | 30/06/09

Only the lazy and uneducated avoid apostrophes.

Peter from Geelong says:

06:44am | 01/07/09

The adjective is also a threatend species.
When did it become acceptable for the media (especially TV newsreaders and reporters) to turn proper nouns into adjectives? Overseas reporters are now referred to as the “Europe”, “Africa” or “Asia” correspondents rather than European, African or North Asian correspondents. But sports presenters are by far the worst. They wouldn’t dare refer to Australian teams such as our cricketers as the “Australia Cricket Team”, so why refer to the English, Pakistani & South African teams as the “England”, “Pakistan” & “South Africa” teams. The news editors need to break the reporters from this habit, and make them use the grammar checker on their computers rather than just the spell checker!

Celia says:

11:16am | 01/07/09

Sylvano:  I’m intrigued as to why you wrote peoples’ ... (and you’re waiting for a brickbat! guilty conscience?!?) .  People is a plural noun, so doesn’t need an apostrophe after the s to denote the plural.  As such, the correct form for your sentence would be “people’s speech” ... the apostrophe indicates “speech of the people” . By writing “peoples’ speech” you are in fact saying “speech of the peoples” . Which is fine, if that’s what you want to say, but I suspect not.  The same rule applies to ‘children’.

John T: I went to St Peter’s Girls’ School ... we were taught to put the apostrophes in just as I have done here. It is a school of more than one girl (hence girls’) and and it is of/belongs to St Peter (St Peter’s).

G of Narre Warren says:

01:37pm | 01/07/09

Apostrophes are the tip of the iceburg (or is it ‘ice burg’)! I believe that email and text messaging is going to kill our language as we know it today. In Fifty years the difference will the same as Shakespeare is to us.

Blocks of type without any capital letters or punctuation is commonplace already with butchered spelling such as: 2nite, luv, lol. Combined with abbreviations like r, u, ur that can culminate in “r u cuming 2night?”

Now there’s a questiion!

The langauge is under seige and we must fight to ptotect it. I once complained to Telstra and was sent a glossary of terms of text messaging. Obviiously more texts means more money so ‘Big Business’ doesn’t give a RAT’s.

Then there’s Austraya, briyyant, miyyan (as in a miyyan bucks), yous - aghhh, don’t get me started!

James McIlwain says:

04:14pm | 01/07/09

Steve, I stand corrected. I am now not uninterested. Thank you.

Gemma says:

04:59pm | 01/07/09

Jeff from Meroo:

I would like to support Tracey Spicer and disagree with your point of view on the internet. A proper noun is only capitalised when referring to a specific title, e.g. The Department of Education vs. the education department. Writing the Internet is like writing the Telecommunications network. Capitalising proper nouns that are not official titles is considered old fashioned.

Also - in Australia we say capitalise, not capitalize.

Steve says:

02:56am | 02/07/09

Peter from Geelong - Asia correspondent etc is correct - Asian correspondent, for example, would mean that the correspondent in question was Asian. There’s a big difference between a Japan correspondent and a Japanese correspondent.

I think the media actually turns nouns into adjectives more frequently than the other way round. Rather than saying the Prime Minister, Kevin Rudd, for example, we just see Prime Minister Kevin Rudd.

bee says:

03:34pm | 02/07/09

Chalk one up for apostrophe-watch!

I saw a big-budget advertisement on television last week for a new chocolate bar. The closing caption proclaimed it to be “Worth it’s weight in gold”. I immediately resolved never to purchase this particular confection.

The same commercial aired again last night and, to my delight, the caption had been amended to the correct form, “Worth its weight in gold”. I found this most heartening, as it demonstrates that there is at least one ponytailed creative type in the world of advertising who still comprehends the difference.

Now if I can only convince my local kebab shop to amend the slogan on its billboard which currently makes the proud claim “By crikey, theyre’re good” . . .

Keep on fighting the good fight, Tracy. I’m off to buy a chocolate bar.

Andrew says:

04:03pm | 02/07/09

Jeff from Meroo says:

Those that don’t know the difference between a internet and the Internet

—-

Did you perhaps mean an internet?

It’s quite amazing how often I mistakes using It’s/its, you’re/your, a/an in mainstream media.  Do any media outlets even employ editors any more?

Pedants of the world unite!

bee says:

06:47pm | 02/07/09

Re: Bernie’s “Bayonet or screw” remark posted earlier above:

How odd - they’re the same options I was given my good lady wife when I switched on the bedroom telly last night to watch Lleyton at Wimbledon . . .

DK says:

06:47pm | 21/07/09

Sorry ‘Jeff from Meroo’ (30 June 2009) but, as I’ve discovered, punctuation (and those of us who love its correct use) can be a dangerous thing. For example, your reference to ‘a internet’ should read ‘an internet’ (am I wrong about this?). I also don’t think you needed to use parentheses for your sentence beginning (Isn’t that ironic ...) but it’s probably acceptable according to the Oxford.

Keep the faith!

lvoutleten.com says:

11:34am | 11/07/12

I’m impressed, I need to say. Really hardly ever do I encounter a blog that’s both educative and entertaining, and let me let you know, you’ve got hit the nail on the head. Your idea is excellent; the difficulty is something that not sufficient people are talking intelligently about. I’m very pleased that I stumbled throughout this in my seek for something regarding this.

Carlo Kaminski says:

09:50pm | 15/07/12

Keep up the good work! All punctuation should be preserved, they were created for a purpose. It’s purely all about laziness. Shame, just because it hurts the brain when one has to think about the correct placement of punctuation symbols : )