Note: ABC Breakfast host Virginia Trioli made this “you’re crazy” hand twirling gesture after interviewing Senator Barnaby Joyce on the issue of the ETS. Trioli obviously didn’t realise the cameras were still on. She later rang Senator Joyce to apologise, he quipped to the Punch that he couldn’t quite hear because he had been placed in an asylum.

Apparently some television commentators think that I’m the insane one.

Virginia Trioli mocking Barnaby Joyce with the universal sign of crazy

Maybe that explains the place where I work.

Obviously, if I’m not me who am I?

But I think the true insanity is that so many media commentators think that this ETS thought bubble won’t turn into an economic nightmare.

The debate as to whether our nation is inflicted with a massive new tax, euphemistically called the CPRS, is entering the end game. 

I am sitting in a coffee shop in Brisbane and I am thinking about the things for which the price will go up, because of this tax.
Well, I flew here on a plane and there will be taxes on aviation fuel, so the price for that will certainly have gone up. I am having a milkshake and as milk processing uses power, lots of power, the price of this milk will go up.

I am watching a television, with some people dressed up as dogs on it, and as there will be a tax on electricity, the price of that will go up.

The lady working in the coffee shop is washing the dishes in a dishwasher, so the price of that has just gone up. She is wearing a pressed new apron, lately washed and the cost of washing that has just gone up.

On the menu is lambs fry, and ovine ruminant potentially has a huge tax on it. I could go for the vegetable stack and that requires fertiliser to grow and diesel to harvest so the price of that has gone up.

I am looking at a newly opened shop across the road but the steel purlins and trusses require coal to manufacture and so the price of those has gone up. The glass for the shop windows has a huge carbon footprint, so the price of that has gone up.

The concrete that makes the structure will probably be imported, so the price goes up.

Outside is a gas bottle to run the kitchen, there is a direct tax on that and price of that has gone up.

Everywhere you look this insidious tax will be in your life. You don’t have to put in a tax return to pay it, you don’t have to make a profit to pay it, you just have to live in Australia and you will be paying it.

This tax has the potential to put our dairy production, our beef cattle production, our sheep meat production, out of business or to make them more reliant on other nations to feed our nation.

Now the most important thing to remember after all of this is that the current climate will remain exactly as it would have, had the tax never been in place, nothing will have changed.

As far as the climate goes, the tax is pointless. It reminds me of the story where the Roman Emperor Caligula marched his legions to the coast of France, where he told them to pick up seashells and then he marched them back to Rome.

When people asked why he did that it was assumed the only reason was that he was barking mad. Every now and then, the rulers of a nation do things like that.

Apparently, the only reason we are going down this manic path is that we are going to be world leaders.

Now I don’t think that last night Barack rolled over, tapped Michelle on the shoulder and said, “Darling I just can’t sleep. I am so worried about what Kevin is up to regarding his climate policy. I think he is going to steal my thunder.” 

Or Hu Jintao, Chinese President, broke from the 60th anniversary of communist China to have a meeting about Australian climate policy.
Or Manmohan Singh, Prime Minister of India, has decided to put on hold lifting his people out of poverty because of Kevin’s climate policy. This tax will collect an estimated 17.5 billion dollars by 2012-13 for the Treasury, (source, Senate Economics Committee). It will make billions of dollars for the banks and share brokers but money does not grow on trees and someone has to pay.

And that someone, my dear friend, is you. I cannot find a friend for the ETS. I have vainly sought them out on talkback radio and at town hall meetings but they only exist in the big banks and in a couple of rooms in Canberra.

Don’t rely on Canberra to stop this lunacy; you have to. And you better do it soon because, just between you and I by the way, I am part of the group that is pretty well insulated from the effects of the ETS.

You pay for my plane ticket, you pay for my fuel, you subsidise my accommodation so if the price goes up so does my subsidy and I don’t have to make a profit.

144 comments

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    • Jugger says:

      05:51pm | 19/10/09

      Barnaby, you’re a scare monger and that’s all.

      Your mob introduced the GST, and the sky didn’t fall in.  Neither will it when an ETS is introduced.  To say otherwise is an outright lie!

    • K says:

      06:01pm | 19/10/09

      To be honest Barnaby, I can see what she was getting at.
      You bent yourself into so many angles to avoid answering her questions that you simply stopped making sense.

    • Brian B says:

      06:07pm | 19/10/09

      No Jugger, the sky won’t fall in - but your cost of living will go through the roof.

    • James says:

      06:11pm | 19/10/09

      What a disgrace. Typical ABC. No balance whatsoever.

    • Jack says:

      06:18pm | 19/10/09

      Nothing to see here. Just the usual bias from the ABC. Move along folks.

    • Angus says:

      06:29pm | 19/10/09

      Well done Virginia Trioli. Is there an instruction in your ABC field manual informing you that you must disparage people who disagree with the your comrades in government? I believe this is quite common in Russia as well.

    • choomsy says:

      06:29pm | 19/10/09

      lol… Virginia looks like a sad clown in that pic. Does she need cheering up?

    • ShowsOn says:

      06:36pm | 19/10/09

      It was interesting to see Barnaby Joyce this morning endorsing Bill Clinton and Al Gore to be the next leaders of the federal coalition. Here is a screen capture from 10 News Adelaide showing Senator Joyce campaigning for Clinton and Gore: http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8079/barnabyclinton.jpg

    • Glenn says:

      06:42pm | 19/10/09

      I am not too sure what your argument is here Barnaby. Usually your argument (according to what snippets I see/read in the media) is that global warming is at the very least not man made or is completely non existent, and you seem very very aggressive when someone disagrees with your view on the matter and wishes to provide their opinion. Yet however in this above “article” your argument seems to have now shifted to it will be too expensive, at no point have you mentioned your previous view of it not being necessary. I myself am prepared to listen to both sides of the story and I am prepared if need be (just like the GST and a hoarde of other tax changes over the years) to pay more to prevent a disaster. I agree that Australia acting alone will make little if no difference however if everyone else in the world waited around for someone else to make the first step, we would still be using laterns powered by whale oil.

    • James says:

      06:44pm | 19/10/09

      Joyce you are the only sane politician that exists, everyone must know what the ETS really is, its just a tax on everything. it wont stop climate change. Australia contributes 1% of global carbon emissions, im fairly sure that we really do not matter much in the scheme of things.

      not to mention that climate change isnt even caused by c02…

    • Chris says:

      06:50pm | 19/10/09

      A pertinant question if I may Mr Joyce, what was the show with the people dressed as dogs? The public need to know.

    • Eric says:

      07:05pm | 19/10/09

      The ABC is simply the media branch of the ALP.

      Why are taxpayers forced to fund this farce?

    • WHR says:

      07:26pm | 19/10/09

      Too right Barnaby, too much common sense for the left wing art type elitists to understand, they are the ones who should be in a padded cell smile.

    • iansand says:

      07:31pm | 19/10/09

      Of course things will get more expensive under an ETS, you dolt.  But if a business can reduce emissions it will have lower costs.  That means more profit or a competitive advantage.  That’s the *&)^%$ point, you fool.  You are a capitalist, aren’t you?  Although he is a National Party senator so capitalism is probably a foreign concept.

    • Bruce says:

      07:47pm | 19/10/09

      What ever you do, Do not question the ETS. Discussion closed, otherwise you are a HERETIC !!

    • giorgia says:

      08:02pm | 19/10/09

      Barnaby - you’re awesome. This ETS is a dog, I’m a Lib but you Nats have got it aboslutely dead right.
      The fact that you got totally lambusted, tarnished and ridiculed for even questioning this rubbish ETS and anthropogenic climate change in general seriously makes me fear this collective mindset.
      As for Copenhagen, I reckon we need to have a better look at the fineprint.
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlTagSZPm7o&feature=player_embedded

    • Julie says:

      08:03pm | 19/10/09

      Barnaby, I must say i wonder what planet you are living on. Some of your comments make me wonder if you are the village idiot. Thank god you were never my accountant, I would be in the bankruptcy court. It’s pretty scary idea if you every get to be the deputy PM in a coalition.

    • PresqueVu says:

      08:04pm | 19/10/09

      The ETS will bring carbon emissions to a grinding halt.  Everything will be so expensive no one will be able to afford to buy food and will have to exist what be grown in the garden.  Power will be so expensive candles will be the only form of light.  I plan on investing in beeswax as soon as I can.

    • Josh Shaw says:

      08:33pm | 19/10/09

      The ETS is just a way of tricking people into paying the same and if not more for clean and renewable energy sources over fossil fuels.

      They know this technology will become ever more prevalent as time goes on they will lose alot of money gained of fossil fuels and the ETS is there to make up for it.

      The only hot air floating about is Kevin Rudds spin and his know-it-all ego, Malcom turnbull dosnt care either because if and when his party gets back into government they will have nothing but rewards to reap.

    • Louise says:

      08:46pm | 19/10/09

      Jugger, he didn’t say the sky would fall in, he said the price would go up. That is a fact that the Rudd government does not dispute. How is that scare mongering?

    • Conza says:

      08:50pm | 19/10/09

      Where is the video of this?

    • Raj says:

      09:12pm | 19/10/09

      Typical pathetic ALP…I mean ABC…. what a joke! Anyone who does not follow the y2k scare tactics blindly is evil. Onya Joyce!

    • Rob says:

      09:16pm | 19/10/09

      James said exactly what I wanted to say.  I am glad that there are other free minds in this country.

    • Paul says:

      09:17pm | 19/10/09

      Where’s the video? Anyone got a link? Ah, good old objective media. No matter what she thought of his argument there’s no excuse for that. If people are becoming jumbled and making no sense, let them keep digging…

      Wonder where that ranks in that survey that said the ABC was favouring the Coalition?

    • Paul says:

      09:23pm | 19/10/09

      Ah, Media Watch. Thank you for satisfying my need. Ah whoops!

    • Worker says:

      09:24pm | 19/10/09

      Rudd’s minions are out in force on all the blogs trying to pretend that taxing people for CO2 usage will save the planet. It must be easy to live without a conscience.

    • avoid the droids says:

      09:31pm | 19/10/09

      Was hoping to have an alternative to the dribble on commercial stations in the mornings,but labor dogma makes me vomit,but the morons who vote labor dont watch it either,not much balance or substance

    • Luke says:

      09:40pm | 19/10/09

      Stop it Barnaby, lefties can’t cope with common sense.  It’s just too practical and logical. 
      Love that our national broadcaster is so balanced, no bias here…NOT.  Get rid of them.

    • Dylan says:

      09:52pm | 19/10/09

      Maybe objective journalism is more left then some of you think it is, or would like it to be! Just because it doesn’t align with your world view doesn’t mean it’s biased.

      PS - Nice choice of screen-grab Barnaby. Classy move. Lucky it’s not of you though or maybe we would have caught a glimpse of the fossil-fuel lobbyist in your ear.

    • Mitchell says:

      10:02pm | 19/10/09

      Barnaby. You sold Australia out. If your against an ETS why give Turnbull the power to negotiate you fool!

    • Chris L says:

      10:16pm | 19/10/09

      Wasn’t this the same situation we faced with the introduction of the GST? Were you, by any chance, in favour of this Barnaby? Don’t get me wrong, I think this issue should be thought through, but can we do it without the hypocrasy?

    • ShaneO says:

      10:16pm | 19/10/09

      Doesn’t surprise me. Have had a low opinion of Virginia for a long time and as such don’t watch the ABC2 early morning news anymore.

      Shame really as I can’t stand 7 and 9’s Sunrise or whatever their called and had looked forward to the ABCs offering.

    • Ben says:

      10:34pm | 19/10/09

      Rather than another tax how about working on getting the most out of our current tax dollars. Mr Rudd has spent a lot of our money, now it is time to stop the travels and get to work on managing this economy for the long run not just till the next election.

    • Steve says:

      10:35pm | 19/10/09

      To all those who want to see where this Carbon Tax is going to take us look to Spain. They started down this renewable energy road in 2005 aiming to have 30% of their power generated by renewable by 2010. Admirable goal, cost their govt billions. The subsequent rise in power costs, even after the Govt Subsidies, has driven their unemployment to 19.3%. They were listening to Sharon (push your own) Barrow “There are no jobs on a dead planet” well there are less jobs when power costs push industry off shore.

      Their answer is to go even greener, they are about to start yet another large solar generator cost $300M and it will employ (wait for it) 650 construction workers, They were promised millions of green jobs from the renewable industry back in 2005 just like we are hearing now.

      By the way they get 20% of their power from nuclear and only 26% from coal. Now their greatest export is jobs and very cheap wind mills.
      And the media think Barnaby is the mad one.

    • Dave says:

      10:39pm | 19/10/09

      Trioli should be sacked immediately.

    • Kieran says:

      10:41pm | 19/10/09

      Nice work Barnaby. I’ve voted Lib all my life but you’ve got my vote in the senate whenever you want it.

    • ??????? ???????????? says:

      11:06pm | 19/10/09

      Dazzling article . Will definitely copy it to my blog.Thanks.

    • Heléna says:

      11:06pm | 19/10/09

      so much for impartial journalism - I suppose I should not be surprised

    • Steve in IT says:

      11:12pm | 19/10/09

      You folks who continually compare Y2K with global warming are barking (mad?) up the wrong tree.  Y2K was a real issue, albeit never to the extent the media portrayed it, to which much engineering effort was spent identifying and removing.  The handy thing about the Y2K scenario was that it was possible to set time forward on the systems (and not rely on modelling) to examine what the impact was and whether a test fix solved it.  You know what, it still occurs, to a marginal extent, whenver our governments decide on a whim to alter when daylight savings starts and stops.  I don’t care if you don’t think global warming is occurring or not, but stop falsely comparing it with Y2K, which was a managed outcome for a real situation.

    • Gibbot says:

      11:42pm | 19/10/09

      Pointing to the guy wearing the lamp shade takes a lot of flexibility when one has one’s head in the sand.

      The games of fear and desperation of the left are getting tired, but not as tired as the repeated denial of science and calculated obfuscation of the right. Senator Joyce went so far to the right he fell off the board.

    • Joe says:

      12:34am | 20/10/09

      Barnaby i agree with you totally. The ETS is a pointless new tax that won’t cool the world. Even the greens seem to agree with you here. Rudd hopes that it will get him a seat at the UN and pay off his spending spree. All at our expense. The opposition must OPPOSE this nonsence!

    • YMC says:

      02:18am | 20/10/09

      For those people who support the ETS - how about you move to North Korea- the dimwits there worship their leader and have a very very small carbon footprint. The people there freeze to death in Winter for this reason - go, please, you’ll love it there comrades!

    • Graham says:

      05:39am | 20/10/09

      E T S =  Economic Total Suicide.

    • Martin says:

      05:49am | 20/10/09

      So Barnaby what is the solution? Climate change is a reality. You offer no alternative and just stick your head in the sand and pretended it isn’t happening.
      When your Grandchildren ask, “What did you do to help stop climate change destroying our planet?” what will you say?

    • mick says:

      06:23am | 20/10/09

      Let these people pay for their own follies, out of their own pockets; if they want their seashells, they can bloody well walk & fetch them themselves. Barnaby, please inform them the can keep their smutty little carbon footprints off my life & stop trying to tread on me.

    • Anthony says:

      07:01am | 20/10/09

      Expose this journalist to market forces and see how long she would last. It should be back to reading the community news for this one.

    • Rick Eyre says:

      07:19am | 20/10/09

      Virginia Trioli was right. Just staggeringly unprofessional.

    • Wayne H says:

      07:33am | 20/10/09

      Too much money to be made for this not to go ahead. It is a crime against humanity. Your dead right Barnaby but the sheep don’t listen let alone have the ability to think for them selves. We all know we pollute this earth and yes we should start cleaning up behind ourselves but this ETS is a pure tax grab that can never be capped. It will just go on and on and on. It’s a ship of fools! God help us all cause KRUDD won’t and nor will the Liberal party. Makes me damb angry to the point of (self censored). Get at em Barnaby…

    • Farmer Jim says:

      07:44am | 20/10/09

      Senator Joyce,  most of us don’t think you’re crazy. Or stupid.

      We do know, however, that you are ignorant and self-interested. We know you represent a small sectional group. We know you do that poorly, too,  with a lot of badly thought-out ranting.

      For reasons that many of us find hard to understand, you have opinions based on little or no study or understanding of any evidence, even when the farming practices of your consituents have this year alone have seen millions of tonnes of top soil sucked up from the range lands of Australia and dumped on cities and the open sea. 

      Yet you have set your face against any constructive thinking about what might be done.  The Wentworth Group, for example, has shown that 25% of Australia’s carbon emissions could be taken, with little effort, into farmed landscape, and offer farmers a carbon credit. But what do you want? NO ETS at all, and NO farming activity to be included if it passes.

      Like most of the proud individualists of the right, you will only agree to do something when there’s an immediate quid in it for you. Well, there is one. Get behind the ETS negotiation, bring the Wentworth Group study to the table, and aim to get a $ value for the man on the land from a credit scheme for farmland carbon storage.

      It’s your job to be well informed in representing the interests of the not just rural sector, but the nation, too. We pay you an absolute motza every bloody year to do just that.

      So it’s time , Senator, to pull your finger out. Time to do something for your country for a change. Time to stop spouting empty spin. Time to back the ETS and a rural carbon credit scheme.

      Or take up ostrich farming. You’d be good at that.

    • Joel B1 says:

      08:02am | 20/10/09

      “Y2K was a managed solution” What utter self-serving tripe. Billions of dollars went into IT pockets and the world had no problems. Well neither did those countries that spent nothing.
      It’s the classic give me a zillion dollars and I’ll get rid of those pesky polka-dot elephants that are due to arrive real soon.
      And that’s just the same as the ETS, we (the taxpayers & consumers) will spend billions of dollars that will disappear into someones pockets and when nothing happens (ie nothing changes) the Climate Alarmists will say “Hey we fixed it!”

      Fool me once…

    • Steve says:

      08:24am | 20/10/09

      To Martin; What will you say to your grandchildren when they laugh at how gullable our generation were to believe that co2 can change the climate and we willingly raped our ecomomy to reduce it. having no effect on the level of co2 or the cooling of the planet

    • DigiDave says:

      08:27am | 20/10/09

      Comparisons to the GST to justify this as being ok is idiotic.  The GST “Replaced” many other taxes, and in fact caused the price of many things to drop.  The overall cost of living did not change much at all.

      The ETS is a new tax, nothing else will be dropped or reduced.  Therefore, “Everything” will go up in price.

    • Joel B1 says:

      08:28am | 20/10/09

      Just a quick note: The “You’re mad!” card is always played by the True Believers. That and the “What will you say to your Grandchildren?” card.

      God, I wish they could think of something more constructive other than insults. That’s why AGW is simply not true. “Cause it’s supporters have to rely on insult.

    • iansand says:

      09:04am | 20/10/09

      Steve @8:24 The bad news is that there is absolutly not one skerrick of doubt that carbon dioxide can change the climate.  Go and do a little reading about what our climate would be like without it.  We would freeze.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_effect

    • steveo says:

      09:09am | 20/10/09

      The ETS is vital to Rudd. It’s the tax that will help pay for all the money he has wasted with his stupid stimulus packages

    • Lexi says:

      09:13am | 20/10/09

      Virginia displayed perfectly why when she comes on, our TV goes off.  Great pic, by the way.

      Barnaby, I never go to my boss and say “that XYZ is a problem, we just can’t do it/ort it out”, and leave.

      I always say what the problem is and outline a few possibilities for fixing it.

      Please don’t just tell us what the problem with the proposed ETS is - give us an alternative.  Give your own Coalition an alternative.  You might be taken seriously then.

    • Sherlock says:

      09:20am | 20/10/09

      You only need to look at Europe to see how effective an ETS is. The only year emissions dropped was 2008 and that was attributed more to the GFC than and emissions trading. Have a look at Britain who are facing a 60% increase in their power bills due to this insanity. California has an ETS and it’s nearly bankrupted the world’s sixth largest economy as industry has relocated in droves.

      It’s madness to accept our politicians introducing a tax on everything that will do nothing to offset any effects of climate change. Those of you who are prepared to pay more tax for no benefit need help.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      09:29am | 20/10/09

      Getting sick of telling people (including Barnaby Joyce) that the ETS IS NOT A TAX. Taxes are something that nearly everyone pays. Taxes are harder to rort. ETS is a permit scheme that is easier to scam and gain exemptions or exceptions for your polluting.

    • E says:

      09:30am | 20/10/09

      It appears the media is very keen on having an ETS scheme, i.e. allow the government to create a large, costly, inefficient bureaucracy and give it the tasks of creating/inventing some convoluting scheme that allows very ordinary bureaucrats to determine how much a cow’s emission (fart) is worth against a coal mines emission, then place some dollar value on it so they trade these emissions against each other on the open market… what a lot of crock!!!

      Why not a basic green tax/levy where proceeds raised goes into funding alternative fuel developments, technologies and upgrades.

      It’s about time the media stop reporting this bias spin about ‘global warming” caused by man made carbon.

      CO2 is a very minor greenhouse gas; in fact water vapour can make up to 95% or more of greenhouse gases, depending on prevailing conditions.

      How is it that carbon dioxide levels are increasing (according to the media, greenies and bureaucrats) when this gas only represents .054% (less than 1%, Nitrogen is around 70% and Oxygen 20%) of the total gases in our atmosphere and has remained virtually at this level?

      That our oceans actually emit and absorb more CO2 than is produced and emitted by man?

      That the sun is actually driving our climate? So how are these people able to claim that CO2 is driving climate, and get away with it?

      It appears the “global warming” debate is being politically driven by a lot of tripe/spin and those that dare to question are being silenced, reporting has become biased and even scientists are foregoing the basic facts to chase the new funding dollars being thrown into this new “global warming” ideology….politically hysteria seems to be getting in the way of the some very BASIC FACTS

    • Mike says:

      09:34am | 20/10/09

      Jugger, you illustrate the mental deficiency of the Left perfectly. The GST replaced existing taxes and you were the ones claiming end of the world stuff. The Nambour Gnome Rudd, even named it Fundamental Injustice Day when the GST came in. The ETS is all extra cost numnuts.

    • sick of green bsh*t says:

      09:37am | 20/10/09

      Not hard to tell that no one on this blog works in manufacturing.

      It wont be these inner city wankers that lose their jobs, it will be some other poor punters.

      If left wing wankers are so worried about the environment, why dont they climb down from their BMW 4wds and pick up some rubbish in the street, oh no! wont do that! might get hands dirty! Better to whinge and whine about ETS on blogs instead.

    • Joel B1 says:

      09:39am | 20/10/09

      Did this really happen? Just that a search on ABC online for “Trioli” comes up with 0 (zero) documents…

      It wouldn’t be like the ABC to sweep it under the carpet would it?

    • Steven says:

      09:52am | 20/10/09

      I doubt this ETS will reduce polution, instead it could increase it! If a company is having to pay this new tax for goods produced in Australia, all they will do is move production to a third-wrold country where the environmental standards are low and costs are cheap. At least if we encourage production in Australia we can monitor it and encourage low emissions.  All this ETS will do is transfer wealth, jobs and pollution to other countries and will not help the global climate at all.

    • Jess says:

      09:55am | 20/10/09

      If the government was serious about pollution, they would at least CONSIDER nuclear energy. The fact they think a new tax will make turn coal pollution into pure oxygen shows they are more into spin than substance.  I cannot believe this Labor mob is running our country.

    • bob says:

      10:09am | 20/10/09

      hey barnaby…. why so serious?

      the youtube clip is hilarious, reminiscent of the extras episode with kate winslet

    • 2dogs says:

      10:14am | 20/10/09

      What I am hoping that some one can explain to me is what will happen if we do nothing.
      Barnaby you stated that nothing will immediately happen if we adopt ETS. So my question to you is just how long do we have to do nothing? At what point must we, not as a nation but as a planet reduce global emissions before my children and grandchildren reap the wirlwind that is in the distance?
      I don`t think that Rudds scheme is the best solution but where is your alternative?

    • Why not a carbon tax says:

      10:18am | 20/10/09

      I find it incredible that people are keen on ETS. The introduction of the middlement (Macquarie Bank and many big Union superfunds are investing $millions to make $billions) is simply an increased cost to consumers. WHY is Rudd keen to have this? romises on donations (BRIBES) to the ALP?  Turnbull is simply supporting his banker friends.

    • Michael says:

      10:23am | 20/10/09

      Quite true Jess, but don’t forget the Coalition never really seriously considered nuclear energy either. I don’t think Barnabys crazy, more the kid who sat up the back of the class disagreeing with everything because he craved attention

    • Bob of Indooroopilly says:

      10:38am | 20/10/09

      ETS = Energy Tax Scam. And we don’t even know how much we would be scammed. Extra costs (and taxes) and job losses for a start. All in the name of saving us from something that doesn’t exist.

    • hoofman says:

      10:43am | 20/10/09

      Did someone write that for you, Barnaby? Based on what you were telling Trioli, you seem to have trouble coming up with coherent English.

    • Steve says:

      10:52am | 20/10/09

      Ok Iansand I’ll bite
      Wikipedia, the bastion of all “good” science? Right, Good one.
      Here is a little science experiment that you may not be aware of

      Take a known volume of air
      Filter out all the co2
      Suitably contained, expose it to sunlight and record the temperature (Gives Zero base line)
      Add a known volume of pure co2 to get 10ppm rise in co2 concentration and repeat step C recording the rise in temperature (co2 is a greenhouse gas there should be a rise?)
      Repeat step D to get an INDICATION of how co2 affects temperature rise in the air.
      Graph these results.

      Do you think that someone somewhere has already done this?
      Would the results be available on Wikipedia?
      The above test has been done many times with the same results.
      Max temp rise at 20ppmv of 1.4 deg C. Then Drops to Zero temp rise after 140ppmv due to Infra red saturation. The greenhouse effect for Co2 is the same for 200 to 400 to 600ppm and above. This asks more questions than it answers and we have to ask the question why rape our economy with a tax that will not affect co2 levels or the climate.

      Co2 level is linked to temperature, it goes up when the temp goes up, agreed? We see that in the annual cycle results in the seasonal variation at the Mauna Loa Test Station.  Is that because the temp rise in the oceans causes co2 degassing? If man made co2 was such a problem why does the level go down during the northern hemisphere winter when man is producing max co2 trying to stop from freezing?

      There are more questions here than answers and we are not going to change anything about the climate with an argument or a tax.

    • LC says:

      10:58am | 20/10/09

      No ETS means total environmental suicide. There is no economy without an environment. This will teach us all to economise and will open opportunities for new technology.

    • JA says:

      10:59am | 20/10/09

      Australians deserve to be ripped off by the ETS just as they deserve the poor quality government they voted in at the last election. Clearly, despite overwhelming evidence, there is no shaking their belief in climate change and the associated demonisation of modern civilisation.

      The real leaders (merchant bankers, futures traders and the like) are setting themselves up to exploit the gross stupidity that now besets Australia. Let them win, let the merchant bankers feed off the corpse of our previously prosperous economy. It is only in that stark reality that the stupid ETS supporters will realise their folly.

    • iansand says:

      11:08am | 20/10/09

      E@9:30 The problem there is that the carbon dioxide being absorbed and emitted by the ocean is part of the normal carbon cycle.  It has been coming and going at the same rate for millions upon millions of years, and there is a balance.  There is this thing called the carbon cycle where carbon is absorbed and emitted by various natural processes, but the total carbon in the cycle is basically stable.

      What we have done, over the last couple of centuries, is extract carbon in the form of coal and oil that has been buried for 10s of millions of years and added that to the cycle.  That is carbon added to the existing pool of carbon in the cycle.  More carbon, mostly in the form of gases.  Extra carbon.  Additional carbon.  Carbon that used to be tucked away from the cycle.

      If anyone feeds you crap about carbon going into and out of the oceans being more than the carbon emitted by humjan activity they either have no understanding of the problem or are trying to mislead you.  In either case they can be ignored.

      I do not have any idea whether the carbon we are adding to the cycle has any, or a major, effect on warming.  I do know that we are adding carbon to the cycle.  I know that there is a mechanism whereby the addition of carbon dioxide can cause warming - a mechanism that has been well understood for about 150 years.  And I suspect that the planet is getting warmer.  It may be a coincidence, or it may be cause and effect.  If the latter it seems pretty silly not to do anything based on the ravings of buffoons like Barnaby.

    • Ronald says:

      11:08am | 20/10/09

      Well she’s pretty much on the Money there Barnaby. You can always rely on the ABC to tell the truth, even if it is unintentional.

    • Cruz says:

      11:11am | 20/10/09

      I have never seen so many people cheer for a tax before. Not just any tax, but the magic tax.

      Apparently this tax apparently will miraculously stop pollution and start repairing the environment. Give it time and I am sure it will also be recognised as the cure for cancer.

      Did the GST stop people buying their goods or services - nope. Will the ETS stop people from using appliances, buying goods, driving cars, catching flights etc - not a chance. But the government will earn a mint from imposing it on Australia.

      It is my assertion that the government, having driven this country to the brink of bankruptcy in less than 3 short years, is now desperate for a new source of income from the public – and this is it.

      So rather than looking for direct solutions to repair the environment, we are being sold a pup called ETS with the government set to reap billions of dollars each year from it.

      My main message here is a tax, is a tax, is a tax. It is not a solution to an environmental problem of global proportion.

      I 100% support addressing our environmental concerns, I just fail to see how a tax will suddenly start fixing our environment – it never has in the past!

      Let’s open the debate to real solutions, not this ETS baloney which will do nothing but line Rudd and Swans pockets.

    • David Caswell says:

      11:15am | 20/10/09

      Trioli looks like someone who ordered a soy latte and anil carbon footprint with that and got a capacino and a tree to plant.

    • S says:

      11:16am | 20/10/09

      “economic nightmare” How is it that you people only think about business and cash? Your only issue seems to lie with how much you’ll get into your accounts next year and how many hands you can shake with moguls. You do not seems to care at all for Australia and its environment. I agree with her gesture and raise it by another finger!

    • Jugger says:

      11:21am | 20/10/09

      @Mike - You illustrate the righteous anger of the right.  The selfish me, me ,me, it’s all about me attitude that got us in to the position we’re in.

      Whether you like it or not, Mike, you are part of a global community.  Yes, an ETS may well increase prices marginally, but the pay off is that the whole of society benefits.  It’s not all about you Mike, however much you’d like it to be.  Australia is an affluent country, with a high standard of living, we are well equipped to absorb the slight increases that may result from an ETS.  Implementing it now will mean that we will be in a good position to lead the world in renewable technology.  The problems created by man made climate change aren’t going to go away if we stick our heads in the sand.  Sure, our ETS may not make a difference to global carbon emissions, but it will set a fantastic example to the rest of the world that we are conscientious global citizens.

      Yes, it will cost you a few extra bucks Mike, but like I’ve said before, the sky is not going to fall in.  Try and be a little less selfish and look at the positives.

    • Steve says:

      11:27am | 20/10/09

      History has show us that Prophets who prophesised the end of the world as we know it to date have been 100% wrong.
      Where was the environmental suicide when the medieval warm period had them growing grapes in London, something they could not do during the 20th century warming. Compare that to the Little Ice Age where they were ice skating on the Thames River around the hulls of trapped ships. I know which period I would prefer to live in. Bugger the cold it plays havoc with my arthritis.
      Could it be that there are other contributing factors to climate change other than our exhaled breath? Or will holding our breath till we pass out make it rain?

    • iansand says:

      11:39am | 20/10/09

      Steve @10:52 I didn’t see anything in your thought experiment about the radiation of energy from a black body.  Even my dodgy Wikipedia link explained that to you.  Apparently you do not understand how the greenhouse effect works.  It is not additional absorption of incoming radiation or direct heating of atmospheric gas that causes the effect.

    • westie says:

      11:41am | 20/10/09

      It may not be in tune with the new tax-it-to-pay-for-the-election-bribes religion, but the point that Barnaby Joyce is making is correct.

      All the old commos in the Greens learnt long ago that the public will swallow almost anything if you dress it up as something trendy and never reveal the true motives.

    • Jugger says:

      11:45am | 20/10/09

      That’s true Steve, so why prophesise the end of the world if an ETS is introduced.  The ETS will be just another tax.  Taxes benefit the whole of society Steve, the money just doesn’t disappear into a black hole.  The Government decides where our tax money goes, and they use it to improve our society in ways that they think is appropriate.  Different governments have different ideas as to what to spend the money on.  The Howard government had their turn, now its the Rudd governments turn.

      I voted for the Rudd government at the last election, partly because of the Howard government’s in-action on climate change issues, as I suspect did a lot of people.

      As for your blatant distortion of the facts on climate change, answer me this – the overwhelming majority of peer reviewed science supports the theory of man made global warming, why should I believe the rantings of someone called Steve, over the opinions of millions of experts?

    • Steve says:

      11:46am | 20/10/09

      @ Jugger
      Try telling the 20% unemployed in Sapin that it is all for the greater good of the environment. The millions of Green jobs never materialised for them. They have been on this slippery slid since 2005. They only wanted to reduce 26% Coal fired electricity and they can not because renewables are too expensive to runa dn establish and not base load power. All the windmills in the UK have generated about 35% of the power output from one coal power station, when the wind blows.

    • haggis says:

      11:48am | 20/10/09

      Erm . . . . please explain - anybody - how the ETS works and where do the nasty gases go because of it?

    • Mark says:

      11:52am | 20/10/09

      Awesome article! Please never leave politics, Barnaby; I love your work. Greenies get to feel good about Australia’s stance on global warming, and all it will take is to completely destroy our economy and standard of living. What are we waiting for!!

    • Meg says:

      12:02pm | 20/10/09

      The difference between GST and an ETS, Jugger, is that the GST is paid only by the consumer and is not on exports.  A GST-type tax is fairer than an ETS as it does not get added at every stage of production.

      What Mr Joyce says is true: a tax does not solve anything in Austrralia.  Australia’s contribution to reducing GHG will not solve anything in the world as we are such a small contributor.  Reducing GHG will not necessarily make any change to the climate and changes or not to the climate will not necessarily keep the earth ‘safe’.

      If there was really a need for such a tax, the ‘scientific’ models could be run backwards to show the effect on changes which have already happened on earth.  No-one is doing this as they know the modelling will not stack up.

    • westie says:

      12:03pm | 20/10/09

      @Jugger 11:45: “The ETS will be just another tax”.

      Thanks, Jugger, for saying so clearly what many people have thought.  The ETS is indeed just a tax, a huge one that will be paid by all of us (including you), and it’s being touted by people like you behind a smoke-‘n-mirrors facade of neo-religious fanaticism and intolerance.

    • Richard says:

      12:04pm | 20/10/09

      He is a straight shooter and makes more sense than the rest of them put together.

      Remember the outcry concerning GST on food . What is the ETS?

      Hope you didn’t sip a Latte Barnaby.

    • Haggis says:

      12:19pm | 20/10/09

      Oh, Oh - whenever I read “rantings”  I get a whiff of somebody staying on message . . .

    • Comrade Kevin says:

      12:19pm | 20/10/09

      Be of good cheer Comrades! The ETS will concentrate the means of production safely in the hands of Chairman KRudd.  No need to emigrate YMC because soon we will all live in a workers paradise just like North Korea : ) Yes not much of a carbon footprint there.

      I salute the ABC Agitprop department. Well done Virginia Trioli. Your work deserves an order of Lenin. Get with the program Barnaby! Dissenting opinions and common sense will have no place in a future KRudd solar powered workers paradise. No doubt that you will be on the top of the list for re-education.

    • Arthur George Manche' says:

      12:24pm | 20/10/09

      Has anyone noticed that the support for the Opposition has declined following the party room decision to debate the ETS with the government, and proposing amendments thereto ?  And believe me that support will continue to fall. I wish we had a National Party candidate in my electorate of Flinders. They would get my vote !!  Senator Barnaby is absolutely correct. Everything we use, every service we employ - gas electricity- transport etc - will rise in price.  And we the mugs - the electorate - will be paying the price for all this imaginary climate change.
      The British Prime Minister says we only have 50 days to fix the problems facing us with climate change. Yes, then the sky will fall   in on us, our airplanes will fall out of the sky, our ships will sink, all the flora and fauna will die. Yes armageddon is nigh. Even our minds will blow out of our skulls.
      And for what ?  A lot of nonsensical ideas !!  Our Prime Minister Mr. Rudd promised us leadership at the last election. We have not seen any yet.  He is mesmerising the electorate with doomsday nonsense, a lot of humbug and rhetoric. Wake up Australia and throw all these idiots out of office, before it it too late to reverse the damage they are proposing for us.
      Yes I have been a Liberal voter all of my life, but NO MORE !!

    • Monica says:

      12:24pm | 20/10/09

      Never heard of her before and don’t want to hear of her again.  How rude!! We are paying for these left winged loonies who seem to control the media these days.  With her and that bloke on the 7.30 Report, what hope does another side of politics have to get their points across in an unbiased way.  She looks like an idiot anyway.  typical city bum who knows nothing about country life and how we will be affected.  Barnaby would be gracious as he is and would have more sense in his big toe than she would have by the look of her.  Without him, country Australia would be buggered.

    • Jugger says:

      12:25pm | 20/10/09

      @ Westie: “The ETS is indeed just a tax, a huge one that will be paid by all of us (including you), and it’s being touted by people like you behind a smoke-‘n-mirrors facade of neo-religious fanaticism and intolerance. “

      Hehe, you made me chuckle Westie.

      I’m not a scientist, but I’m willing to believe the people who are.

      My partner has an honours degree in science, and a good friend of mine (who also has an honours degree) is employed by the Department of Climate Change.  Both of these people are normal, down-to-earth, hard working people, who are just trying to do the best in their jobs, and trying to help improve society in whatever little way they can.

      Niether of these people are part of an evil, global scientific conspiracy, and to suggest that they, and people like them, are is absolutely ludicrous!  This global conspiracy stuff is absolutely ridiculous.  Rather than slagging people off, Westie, why don’t you make an effort to get out there and meet some of our hard working, down to earth scientists?  You’ll learn a lot more than if you spend your time whinging about ‘the evil forces of darkness’ to your misguided conspiracy theory buddies!

    • Phil says:

      12:27pm | 20/10/09

      The Stern Report predicts the economic risk of inaction on climate change to be a 15 to 25 percent reduction in GDP.

      So Barnaby, please tell us how you would mitigate a credible risk of a 20% drop in Australia’s GDP?

      We’re waiting ...

    • Cruz says:

      12:39pm | 20/10/09

      Perhaps Jugger you can explain when a tax has ever solved environmental concerns in the past.

    • Alan says:

      12:54pm | 20/10/09

      No matter what we do, no matter what is “agreed” at Copenhagen, global CO2 emissions are going to continue rising. The Kyoto targets were blown out massively. What makes anyone think that setting new targets will have any different result?

      Let’s assume for a moment that all the worst predictions about global warming will come true. Well we have a choice. We can face the coming carbon apocalypse WITH jobs and decent living standards, or WITHOUT. I know which I’d prefer.

      To any Liberal party politicians reading these comments, there is a huge block of conservatives who will not give you their votes unless you oppose or neuter this insane legislation. Don’t try to pander to the greenies because they’re not going to vote for you no matter what you do.

    • John says:

      01:00pm | 20/10/09

      All of the worlds highly educated scientists (not funded by oil companies or other related multi-nationals) must be wrong. The international consensus amongst leaders that is culminating in a second international agreement to stem climate change is ill-informed.

      Barnaby Joyce and the Nationals are the only ones who know what they are talking about.

      Its side-splittingly hilarious, isn’t it? Thank the gods Barnaby is so insignificant. He is the new Pauline Hanson. But at least Pauline was entertaining. Hearing Barnaby talk is worse than the sound of fingernails scratching a chalk board.

    • westie says:

      01:01pm | 20/10/09

      @Jugger: Silly me, I must have overlooked the words “evil, global scientific conspiracy” that you claim I included in my last post.  Now let me check. . . nope, not there, you’re lying again.

      The sad thing is that few people realise yet how much the ETS is going to take out of their pockets, and it is carefully stage-managed so that the impact will only start to be felt after the next election.  So, no global conspiracy, just a good ol’ Aussie political screwing.  But then, you said taxation is good because it gives the government lots of money, which clearly shows exactly where you sit.

      As for your honours degree associates, their secondhand scientific observations might be more, well, scientific, if they weren’t apparently already riding on the carbonista express.

    • Rod N. Reel says:

      01:06pm | 20/10/09

      Martin says:05:49am | 20/10/09

      So Barnaby what is the solution? Climate change is a reality. You offer no alternative and just stick your head in the sand and pretended it isn’t happening.
      When your Grandchildren ask, “What did you do to help stop climate change destroying our planet?” what will you say?

      The solution Martin, cannot come about unless all the major polluters of the world i.e China, India, USA, Brazil, EU, Japan etc agree to do something.
      A country like Australia is for want of a better analogy “pissing in the wind”, if we think this ETS will make an impact on global carbon emissions. Remember this, the purpose (no it’s not just increasing taxes lefties, i know how much you like this part) of this ETS is defeated unless all major polluting countries are also subject to an appropriate ETS, otherwise we are simply sabotaging our own economy simply so we can have some pea brained bragging rights about who acted first on climate change. If it must be done do it properly! Get the whole world on board, do it right the first time.
      And please dont try that appeal to emotion crap about grand children that belittles the whole debate.
      By the way sack Trioli! She is supposed to be fair and impartial when working for the tax payer funded ABC, clearly this is not the case and our taxes should not be paying for this woman to spout this sort of bias. If Trioli thinks this sort of childish behaviour is acceptable in the public domain when interviewing an elected senator then perhaps she is a sandwich short of a picnic herself.

    • Pete V says:

      01:09pm | 20/10/09

      the green jobs will appear when businesses realise the money that can be made from researching and developing renewable energy sources and making them more viable, cheaper and comparable to fossil fuels.

      but the fossil fuels will only become scarcer, more difficult to extract, refine and use, so the prices will go up anyway.

      oh, and if we didn’t cause global warming, read this: http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,26234709-5006301,00.html

    • Geoff says:

      01:13pm | 20/10/09

      I agree we need to reduce our carbon emissions, but I think if we are to have some sort of ETS then it should be called what it is a TAX, and let the TAX department collect it and distribute it to schemes that are developing carbon reduction technologies. Why should bankers and brokers profit from an ETS scheme? Why should we create a new bureaucracy with all the associated costs when an entity already exists for TAX collection? An increase in GST would surly cover the ETS and prevent other entities, government or commercial skimming money. Maybe this is too simplistic an approach for our government, or are there vested interests in banks, brokers, and lobbyists? Surly not as they all comply with the parliamentary codes of conduct.

    • mick says:

      01:23pm | 20/10/09

      “My partner has an honours degree in science, and a good friend of mine (who also has an honours degree) is employed by the Department of Climate Change. “

      I hope your good friend doesn’t wear his Miniwarm overalls on his way to & from work. He’ll end up with carbon footprints all over his back.

    • David says:

      01:48pm | 20/10/09

      Keep this up and you’ve won my vote. Nats are becoming the only sane alternative for one sick of the fence sitting middle parties. The Nationals are to the Liberals what the Greens are to Labor. The battles are now being fought at the extremes.

    • Cameron Price-Austin says:

      01:54pm | 20/10/09

      Can someone explain to me exactly how the ETS will reduce emissions? If the intent is to make polluting behaviours more expensive and therefore incentify businesses to operate in more environmentally conscious ways, isn’t this happening already?

      Aren’t power companies offering green products? Aren’t wind farms popping up everywhere? Aren’t all of these corporations tripping over themselves to present a ‘green’ image? Consumer sentiment is already doing the job of any proposed ETS.

      Wouldn’t the money being spent on this proposal be better spent investing in renewable energy research, tree planting, helping high-carbon industries (such as power companies) make a transition to low-carbon technologies? Surely this would have a higher net impact on our emissions.

      Better yet, how about a program where the government provides grants for people to install solar panels on their roof? Oh, wait…

    • Blampa says:

      01:55pm | 20/10/09

      I can’t believe how dumb the populace is.  Prices won’t slightly rise, they’ll go through the roof.  Power, up atleast 60% overnight and then some, food; up 25% overnight, fuel; up 30% - and you idiots are cheering for Krudd to rape your standard of living so he can secure his wax-mining ass to the UN security council?  Unbelievable.  Obviously, the ALP indoctrination has worked through the public propaganda schools, obviously, not one of these seemingly inbred morons is willing to accept that C02 is an essential gas which comprises 0.038% of the atmosphere.  I’ll tell you what, I’ll happily accept an ETS when any of you leftards can answer me as to why Mars experienced the same temperature trend as the earth.  They don’t have cars or factories there, so why them too?

    • Joel B1 says:

      02:01pm | 20/10/09

      “the green jobs will appear”
      Yeah, really? I’ve some fairies down the bottom of my garden, they’re as real as any Green job.

    • Jenny says:

      02:37pm | 20/10/09

      Get the facts folks- all those ‘Green’ gadgets (like solar panels and wind turbines) create emissions up to 25,000 times more than coal in their manufacture and have a short life. The wind farms that exist are not performing and irreparable breakdowns are a common feature. Every bicycle ridden will take 86 years to become ‘carbon neutral’. Every low wattage bulb contains dangerous Mercury that will go to landfill and leak into the soil and waterways. Diesel fumes are 20 times more harmful to human health than petrol fumes.

    • Betty from Blacktown says:

      02:43pm | 20/10/09

      ABC is in real trouble - again, you would think they would pull their staff into line! (yes there are some reasonable people in the ABC)
      For heavens sake people, Barnaby Joyce is who he is! He make s the points about ETS very clearly. I have been a labor voter all my life - but this is too much. Through the decades there is always scare mongering, deflecting of issues - whose to say that this ABC blunder isn’t just another stunt? I have see many in my lifetime.
      How about inventions for emissions reductions, someone told me this & it makes very good sense. Employment for the youth, helping our Australia - OUR country, looking after the environment as well.
      I live in Blacktown, and well i have lived here all my life. I know many people wouldn’t be able to afford the taxi’s or bus’s even with pensioner increases.
      As for our farmers, when we were you, there was a pride in our Australian producers, leave them alone i say!
      I never thought i would see the day that i would be agreeing with someone from the otherside, but i do. That Barnaby Joyce is not crazy, he is quite correct about the costs hurting us all. I will be dead in a few years, i have had my life, so maybe someone will just give a little bit of thought to what they read oneday (while my granddaughter typed).
      Betty.

    • Carl Palmer says:

      02:54pm | 20/10/09

      Oh dear every time Virginia Trioli appears on TV everyone will be suddenly whisked back to this incident. I wonder what her credibility, integrity, impartiality levels are now? I don’t know what they were previously but it’s defiantly ZERO now! How embarrassing. I’m sure she dug a big hole. Virginia, the finger should have been the Adidas firmly shoved in the mouth. 

      Barnaby, please please please do whatever you can and stop this madness. I’m now of the belief that mad cows disease (MCD) has now been replaced by mad politician disease (MPD). Symptoms of MCD are similar to that of MPD and include psychiatric symptoms, sudden changes in behaviour (PM??), gradual uncoordinated movements (in House of Reps), trouble standing and walking (particularly late at night), weight loss despite having an appetite.  Last symptom is very rare. They must have had MPD when they drafted this legislation. I say don’t go near it or touch it.

    • Chris says:

      03:11pm | 20/10/09

      Seems to be some pretty awful attempts in this comments section at trying to justify right-wing positions that are based on fantasy and not reality.

      The arguement that Australia should do nothing because we contribute 1% of emissions only, is absurd.  The other 199 countries in the world that contribute the other 99% will just do the same achieving nothing.

      The idea that spain has 19% unemployment purely because they have taken measures against climate change?!?! that is completly absurd!  It is completly ignoring all other factors that have attributed to the spanish economy’s current position.

      Anything that encourages improvement in the renewable energy sector of our economy is a good thing.  We have a MASSIVE opportunity to place Australia at the forefront of the new global energy world order.  To not do so simply for the sake of a few $$ now, would be criminal.  The fact is, the countries with the greatest renewable energy resources and technology right NOW will be the countries that in 30 years time, as fossil fuels run out, will be rolling in the $$$, the money makers in the modern world.

      Hell, it barely matters if climate change is human caused or not, the switch to renewable energy is just common sense, and should be part of the evolution of humanity as we move forward.

    • email says:

      03:13pm | 20/10/09

      What if the ETS was applied to all the coal, natural gas and resource minerals that we sell to China and India. This would get those countries onboard the ETS by proxy. It would also be a bonanza for the Australian tax system because 2 billion people would be contributing. It may be the greatest scheme ever. Literally.

    • Tim says:

      03:15pm | 20/10/09

      ETS, Emmission TAX Scheme, says it all. Given Krudd’s and Wong’s great successes putting water back into the Murray, I can’t wait to see how this ETS goes. I’m guessing really well for government taxes and not so well for small business, farmers and the like. Don’t blame me, I didn’t vote for him and gee he’s done a bang up job. He’s banged up the Murray, is banging up health, the ETS and most importantly he’s banged up a massive $300 billion dollar debt that this ETS will help fund!! Barnaby DONT take a backward step on this!!

    • Skye says:

      03:18pm | 20/10/09

      What if the ETS was applied to all the coal, natural gas and resource minerals that we sell to China and India. This would get those countries onboard the ETS by stealth. It would also be a bonanza for the Australian tax system because an extra 2 billion people would be contributing tax revenue. It may be the greatest scheme ever. Literally.

    • Real Chick says:

      03:20pm | 20/10/09

      We ought to have some sort of FoxNews in Australia…where both parties are listened to with equality. Australian Media is too left wing…
      And since we are on the crazy zone let me tell you….maybe the PM and the rest of them are striving to make Australia the place to leave….since average people soon won’t be able to live here….
      Rudd wants this ETS because it will make more money so that he and his ilk may get even more money…I don’t know what Labor does with money since it had 45 Billion dollars to play with and they absolutely burnt all of it and now we are at least 300 Billion on the red…..
      A friend told me at least you get to keep you house…Well do I??? I am unemployed which is something that in the Howard Era I wasn’t….
      This government is a disappointment and a lie as far as I am concerned and I am well worse off….my electricity bill was just short of a thousand dollars last quarter….and his ETS hasn’t started yet…
      You tell me whether Labor wants to make this land look like another Monaco full of rich people but with no normal people to be found…..

    • Huddo says:

      03:36pm | 20/10/09

      Watching Q&A the other night it was all the usual inner-city trendies and dreadlocks who just couldn’t understand why we don’t just bring in an ETS/Shut down the coal industry right now and then we can be “world leaders”

      And then I realised something.  None of these people think that they will be hurt so why not do it if it feels good?  They have nothing but contempt for the other Australians who supply their food, water electricity etc.  I guess they figure that their public service salary/dole will be increased anyway so it’s only those filthy miner/farmers/rednecks who will be hurt anyway

      Has anyone worked out yet where we’re going to have to make the massive budget cuts when we destroy our economy?  I propose we get rid of all the useless stuff that is not important to the majority of Australians.  Lets’ start by cutting all arts funding and higher-education (except for hard sciences)
       
      Unfortunately we’ll have to keep defence because if we don’t, our resource rich country would be swiftly taken by a major power and the environment would be treated worse that it is now.

    • Blampa says:

      03:45pm | 20/10/09

      Skye, your idea sounds well intentioned, but sadly fails for the fact that we would become uncompetitive if we put the ETS on coal exports and China (and the rest of the world) would simply buy their coal from elsewhere.  This is the fundamental flaw of this insidious tax; we pay increases of over 20% for our entire way of life yet countries buying Australian resources are exempt from the tax.  Just imagine, all the companies that become uncompetitive overnight so either close their doors or go offshore to ETS free countries.  Think about your jobs, are they safe?  20-30% unemployment in the name of some problem which they have manufactured in the name of One World Government; think socialism and the elite few set to profit from the gullibility of the masses.  Want proof?  Have a look at British Columbia in Canada for what their ETS has done to them.  Have a look at Spain or California.  Everywhere this socialist experiment goes, economic ruin follows.  Do we really want to act prematurely on the issue?  What’s the mad rush?  Obviously the predictions presented by the likes of Gore have not come to fruition (it’s colder now), so why are we rushing to sign our economic death warrant before Copenhagen?  What’s in it for Kruddy who has already signalled his desire to be on the UN security council?  Perhaps people should start asking questions before blindly following the spin eminating from the sycophantic media and the ALP before deciding, and start to think for themselves again.
      Finally, Turnbull, grow a pair of balls and stand up to this nonsense.  The liberals will forever be in opposition should you not oppose this most heinous scam in the nations history.  Get a pair and stand up for us, or get the hell out of politics.

    • Tim says:

      04:02pm | 20/10/09

      Blampa, here here, you get my vote!! The vast majority of Australian’s wouldn’t know anything about the ETS except what they glean from the spin. Pity most have already bought Krudd’s spin, that’s why he’s PM! The environmental side of this argument is a convenient smoke screen, pardon the pun, it’s about TAX TAX TAX and paying back $300 billion!

    • Doug says:

      04:27pm | 20/10/09

      @Jugger says:11:45am | 20/10/09
      “the overwhelming majority of peer reviewed science supports the theory of man made global warming, why should I believe the rantings of someone called Steve, over the opinions of millions of experts? “

      Just love that old chessnut, millions of experts, are you sure on that one? Just remember it will take just one peer reviewed science document to prove that AGW is a farce.

    • Cruz says:

      04:42pm | 20/10/09

      Chris (3.11pm), how will creating a new tax cut down on greenhouse emissions?

      New taxes never did this in the past, now we are expected to believe this tax suddenly will. That is one magic tax!

      As I said earlier, I 100% support addressing our global concerns, I just can’t see how introducing a new tax and calling it something sexy like ‘ETS’ will do it.

      That being said, we all know labor had to create it though, after all, Rudd, Swan and their mate Ken Henry have sent us broke, and it is an ALP tradition to tax the pants off the country.

      But, would someone please explain how taxing everything with a ‘new GST’ will fix our environment.

    • Joel B1 says:

      05:04pm | 20/10/09

      Good old ABC, 5pm and a search for “Trioli” still comes up zilch.

      Wow, they really are left-wing Ruddites! It’s hard to take them seriously when they can’t even report an event like this.

      I bet if Trioli had done that to Rudd or Gillard the lefties would be baying for her blood. Funny how Labor supporters can turn the other cheek when it’s not being done to them!

    • Jim Fletcher says:

      05:06pm | 20/10/09

      It is quite amazing that we still had a clear view of Virginia. One expects she and many other ABC presenters might dissappear into the foul emmissions emanating from the smoke stacks which always accompany such presentations.
      One should not be surprised. The Coronation Hill issue of some years ago always warranted a backdrop of pristine tropical settings, when as Paul Keating once colorfully remarked the area involved was clapped out buffalo country. In that particular instance the mythical Bulla won the day, and as the wonderful failed finance minister Peter Walsh later disparagingly said in his musings, it brought a few more greenies on side.
      Sadly in the climate change area I feel that Bull…. will win the day, but many thanks for trying Barnaby, I dips me lid.

    • Phil says:

      05:28pm | 20/10/09

      The world was created in 7 days.
      HIV does not cause AIDS.
      The moon landing was a fake.
      The earth is flat.
      The hole in the ozone layer is a myth.
      Smoking does not cause lung cancer.
      Human activity is not responsible for climate change.

      It’s okay not to agree with the findings of science, just don’t expect to gain any respect as a result.

    • Cruz says:

      05:44pm | 20/10/09

      To that Phil, we can add “introducing a new tax called ‘ETS’ will miraculously clean up the environment”.

      It’s okay to be a fanatical left wing activists Phil, just don’t expect any credibility as a result.

    • Bob of Indooroopilly says:

      05:48pm | 20/10/09

      @ Phil - 5:28pm
      Phil - AGW /Climate Change Alarmism is not science mate. It’s being kind to call it a religion.

    • Dave Carlson says:

      06:03pm | 20/10/09

      Barnaby,
      Thank our good Lord that we have someone who is prepared, perhaps even game, to tell the truth about this ETS. Anyone out there who makes a comment on so-called climate change and who has not read Professor Ian Plimer’s Book ‘Heaven and Earth - The Missing Science’ should talk no more and have a really good read first. It is a really heavy book, and filled with stuff that a reasonably well educated bum like me found hard to understand. But the basic premise is that carbon dioxide (CO2) is not a pollutant. It’s what keeps plants alive and is in fact plant food. He says quite correctly (and I can remember this from Grade 8 biology) that we thrive on oxygen and plants thrive on our waste. (CO2) He also says (paraphrased) that anyone who uses the words cardon and pollution in the same sentence does not know what they are talking about - I think he uses the phrase that they are a-scientific.

    • iansand says:

      06:16pm | 20/10/09

      It is odd that Team Rant is opposed to emissions trading.  The whole idea is that a company will be able to emit, but it will cost.  The great god Market Forces will mean that a company will get to the stage that the cost of reducing emissions will be less than the cost of buying the right to emit.

      It is a bit like remediation in the mining industry.  Every net present value and discounted cash flow for a mining project has a big negative blip at the end for remediation costs.  It is factored into the economic decision to go ahead with the project.  An ETS just means, for the first time, remediation of pollution will be factored into pricing calculations.  Market forces again.

    • nev pinto says:

      07:48am | 21/10/09

      hmm prices of allt hose things are going to go through the roof

      just like when the gst was introduced

      left wing bias on the abc is a counter balance to the right wing bias on all the comercial networks

    • Melissa says:

      10:58am | 21/10/09

      Perhaps there should be a price hike on watching people dressed up as dogs.

      When I woke up today I loved Virginia even more.

    • kevin says:

      11:42am | 21/10/09

      The ETS will bring a balance between the rich and the poor. Once it is introduced, everyone will be poor.

    • Jason Edwards says:

      09:46am | 23/10/09

      There is no comparison between the GST and the ETS.  The GST changed the way the tax system operated.  In most cases prices of goods fell.  The ETS however, can be compared to cigarette & alcohol tax, only it will be on nearly every single good sold or produced in Australia.
      The result being:
      64,000 jobs GONE out of the resources sector
      17.5 billion dollars in extra taxes by 2012-13. 
      Electricity prices up 200%

      That means your job, your wage, your meals, your car, your fuel, your bus tickets, airfares and food donations for the third world will be hit with this tax.

      Scare mongering?  You bet I’m scared and you bet I’m going to tell more people about this TAX

    • Paul Murray says:

      11:00am | 23/10/09

      Thank you sincerely Mr Joyce! Keeper of he country’s sanity and it seems the only hope for our future. Unfortunately these other idiots only play politics and obviously have no real grasp of reality. What part of “our country is going to the dogs"don’t they understand? Is it only us out here that perceive the continuing decay of our moral and social fabric.
      Their is not a leader of gumption among them yet their greed, ignorance, apathy and jealousy will only hasten and ensure our downfall as a nation.” Illegetimi Non Carborundum ” Mr Joyce. It’s gratifying to us that u’ll maintain u’r integrity till the last regardless of their folly.
      BRAVO Sir”....

    • John says:

      08:35am | 22/11/09

      The SHEEP of Australia are being taken like lambs to the slaughterhouse over this man made global warming science fiction!
      When they wake up it will be too late!

    • Steve of Cornubia says:

      04:56pm | 23/11/09

      Science funding is easier to obtain if the research in question is geared toward proving that man-made climate change is real. For this reason, many research organisations (even those with no previous interest or involvement in climate) have, for some time now, been deliberately designing their research to include a ‘climate change’ angle. It doesn’t matter what discipline is involved, if you include the magic words ‘climate change’ in your proposal, you WILL increase your chances of funding.

      So, if you’re wondering why so many scientists seem willing to support climate change….....

    • Graham says:

      12:54am | 24/11/09

      The scheme is wrong, and being done for the wrong reasons. If we are serious in this country of emissions, then we must get serious about conversion to nuclear power, increasing these plants as we decrease dependancy on coal. We do not need to sign up to anything (a la Kyoto - what a joke that was), we don’t need to be bound by anything except responsible government (e.g. some other UN convention we don;t need).
      Australia is more than capable of achieving these things over a reasonable period of time through a combination of government and private sector cooperation. France holds its high ground on emissions only through its reliance on nuclear energy - not a bad example to base a decision on. Rudd’s scamble to be in the world arena is disturbing, and the entire ETS/Global Warming franchise is quite disturbing. Refusing to debate issues, covering up evidence that does not support the party line etc etc is more than enough reason to put the brakes on this tax and the movement in general.
      All for making the planet a better place to live. Go nuclear, have stringent pollution laws - with reasonable timeframes and govt. economic assistance if required.
      Most problems in the environment are probably more caused through deforestation (affecting temperature and rainfall), poor and outdated agricultural techniques (Australians have improved so much in this area, and are world beaters in a land that has been renowned as a land of ‘drought and flooding rain’ - no drought is not a new phenomenon in this country - it is actually the norm!).
      More debate - and you don’t have to actually lead the world to be a world leader in environmental management. Rudd, Wong, etc etc , give it a rest.

      Barnaby, you’re a funny bastard, but at least we are hearing other points of view, and he is presumably representing his voters views?: this in itself is extremely important. Lets see more of it rather than decrying every sceptic as some form of ‘holocaust denier’ - these types worry me deeply.

    • ANGRY says:

      08:14am | 25/11/09

      If this ETS(Employment Termination Scheme/Extra Tax Scheme) is introduced due to the COMPLICITY OF THE TRAITOUS TURNCOAT, then Australians must have “DEMOCRACY IS DEAD” day, to mourn the passing of DEMOCRACY in Australia!

      How can such a day be organized?
      Anybody have any ideas?

      Australians should show how ANGRY they are on this day! They should take to the STREETS and SHOUT OUT their frustration!!!!! Everybody should take the day off from work!

      Look at the WORKCHOICES protests! Let’s learn a lesson from that!

    • sean says:

      03:18pm | 12/10/10

      omg i just can’t believe some of the comments that attack barnaby and not the issues he is highlighting or do you have your heads way up your backsides. This ETS as mentioned will be organised through the banking/stockmarket setup (the ones responsible for the GFC). Smell a rat because they don’t care about the environment just money. Why do you think Turnbull supported it??... because he is a environmental visionist -NO because he is a fmr merchant banker for Goldmann & sachs. who will prosper with the money made in the trading of these carbon credits. Yet you sheep keep trotting the line i’ll pay more to do my bit.The problem is we’ll be the only ones paying not the incredible rich bankers who will again gamble with the financial systems of the world and when they stuff it up know they can just get a bailout from the tax payers-please people do your research and learn to critically think and investigate things.I am all for making the world a cleaner less reliant place on fossil fuels but this tax won’t do anyhting just make a lot of rich people even richer.

    • Pharmd728 says:

      04:56pm | 06/05/11

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    • Paul says:

      04:09pm | 07/11/11

      Have any of you conservatives actually read about the direct action plan?  The majority of economists have said it will be more expensive, and scientists have said it will be less effective than the ETS. 

      We have Tony Abbott pushing a government interventionist policy that Gough Whitlam would have been proud of while Labor is pushing a market based mechanism (which is simply internalising a negative externality called carbon dioxide pollution). 

      Labor have produced a policy that uses market forces to solve a problem.  Now conservatives seem so unhinged that they are whailing on about the carbon tax and ignoring advice from economists and experts who claim there are some serious problems with “direct action”.  Talk about blind partisanship.

      As for Barnaby, yes he is a poorly educated yokel.  In my opinion “crazy” is turning your back on a serious problem which has been discussed by scientists for the last 30 years.  To walk away from the solution proposed by scientists and economists.  To ignore the risks and bury your head in the sand.  That’s crazy.

 

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