Tony Abbott described the events in Canberra yesterday surrounding the speakership of the Parliament as a bad day for democracy. Abbott was right, but for the wrong reasons.

Long to reign over us. Photo: Supplied

The most undemocratic outcome of yesterday’s events could now be that a reform aimed at making life more bearable for problem gamblers, which is supported by a majority of Australians, will now be dumped because Labor has the numbers in the house to get away with pulling it, thus avoiding a fight to the death with powerful gambling interests.

Labor might have been cock-a-hoop at yesterday’s developments but the people who will be even happier are the cashed-up, morally ambivalent multi-millionaires in the gaming industry, who have been escalating their self-interested campaign to knock off suburban Labor MPs lest the Government support the proposed pokie reforms.

Their deceitful campaign is now much closer to victory because the Government no longer needs the support of anti-problem gambling independent Andrew Wikie to remain in power.

The Government can now water down or even shelve the proposals for mandatory pre-commitment, whereby gamblers have to state in advance how much money they are prepared to wager per session on the pokies. There are many people in the ALP who want the proposal modified or scrapped, nowhere more so than in the vast marginal electorates of suburban Sydney, where these mega-clubs have become the dominant if not sole venue for social interaction in so many communities. With tens of thousands of members, the club bosses can easily mobilise the community to knock off its local members with ease. Walk into any of these clubs right now in Penrith, Revesby, Mt Druitt, and you can’t move for ludicrous signage about the so-called Licence to Punt we will all need under this totally unastrayan attack on our civil liberties.

This is the issue for democracy out of yesterday. Not what Abbott was saying, nor what Gillard was saying, as they argued about the mechanics and merits of the change in the speakership.

The Coalition’s anger and Labor’s undisguised glee at Peter Slipper’s decision to rat on his party is all about politics at its most raw, about politics as gamesmanship. The identity of the speaker will have no discernible impact on anyone’s quality of life.

That’s not quite true – it will have a discernible impact on the quality of Peter Slipper’s life. It is worth stressing that there is no grand issue of principle behind his decision to quit. Far from it. Peter Slipper wants the payrise, the flash car, the pomp that comes with the job. He is a seriously unspectacular MP, famous almost solely for falling asleep in the chamber, and who is deservedly under fire for preselection in his Sunshine Coast seat from the vastly more talented and intelligent former Aboriginal Affairs minister Mal Brough. It is probably his last term, and he knows it, and he’s grabbing some extra dosh before he returns to a life of appropriate anonymity.

Abbott’s talk about democracy was all about party-political self-interest, in the same way that Labor’s covert wrangling to shunt Harry Jenkins aside and coax Slipper into quitting was all about improving its own position in this most precarious of parliaments. Improve it Labor has. It now has a buffer of 76 votes to 73 on the floor, a vast improvement on its position where it was at the mercy of every independent MP who has agreed to support this government.

It is here where the genuine damage is done to our democracy if the Government goes down the cowardly path of dumping the pokies overhaul. Its handling of this issue has been sadly wanting from the start. It lost control of an issue which it originally owned, and has allowed the completely false perception to emerge that it is only looking at the question of problem gambling because it is hog-tied to independents such as Andrew Wilkie in order to stay in power.

The factual reality is completely different. The examination of the gambling industry and, particularly, poker machines was something which the then Opposition Leader Kevin Rudd promised ahead of his 2007 election landslide. Rudd wanted to make it a hallmark of his prime ministership and Julia Gillard inherited that policy challenge when she wrested the leadership from him last year. Andrew Wilkie is sincere and driven on the issue, and the circumstances of last year’s non-result at the election meant it became a valuable bargaining chip for his support. But it was in its inception always going to be a Labor plan.

If pokies reform becomes the first policy casualty of the vagaries of this minority government, and the horse-trading over the speakership, then democracy is in every bit as much trouble than Tony Abbott said it was yesterday, only not for the partisan reasons he gave. It will confirm that the bleatings of a bunch of Les Paterson impersonators from the leagues clubs in Sydney’s west, with all their cant about the money they channel back into the community after first leeching it off the pokie-addicted working class, counts for more than the demands of a community who want something done on a genuinely shocking social problem. 

202 comments

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    • Tim says:

      06:17am | 25/11/11

      Is this the same Penbo who wrote an article attacking the nanny state over smarties not three days ago?
      Way to stick by your convictions.

      As for not enacting the pokie legislation being undemocratic. LOL.

      I can’t remember any party campaigning on a no pokie platform or it being.mentioned at all until Wilkie got some power.

      The headline of this article should have read:

      Personal Responsibility and Freedom Defeats Minority Interests and The Nanny State.

    • mick says:

      07:29am | 25/11/11

      What a load of crock from the gambling industry.

      “Nanny State”  is again being trotted out to justify destroying peoples lives, people who are unable to act responsibly because THEY ARE ADDICTS.  Just as with alcohol where they are killing each other outside the venues we have the industry in damage control screaming poor and job losses to protect its immoral patch.

      Good article David.  Nice to see there are people who still have a conscience.

    • Nathan says:

      08:16am | 25/11/11

      @Mick
      Great point about the addiction element there, that is really how it needs to be seen. If people agree that is an addiction and still don’t want to do anything then something is wrong.

    • Tim says:

      08:49am | 25/11/11

      Nice piece of emotionalism there Mick.
      “If you don’t agree with me, you’re immoral/have no conscience etc.”

      I’m surprised you didn’t go with the big guns like “Why won’t somebody think of the children. Wahhhh”

      This isn’t about doing nothing, it’s about not restricting the freedoms of the majority because of a tiny majority of problem gamblers.
      We should enact more targetted schemes to help problem gamblers and force the pubs and clubs to give back more to their communities.

    • B4Bear says:

      09:08am | 25/11/11

      There should be a new law to sit beside Godwin’s Law that states anyone who uses the term Nanny State in their argument automatically loses the debate.

      Although there is nothing like the feel of a 9mm pistol strapped to your leg when you pop down to the shops for some milk.

    • B4Bear says:

      09:20am | 25/11/11

      ...force the pubs and clubs to give back more to their communities.

      So that is how a ‘Nanny Free’, Free Market works is it?

    • badrinath says:

      09:50am | 25/11/11

      Nice piece of bullshit there Tim, this also isn’t about the majority, as the moajority will not be restricted wonderboy. Only people who are throwing away large sums of money each bet on the pokies - which is not the majority. And it is not a restriction, it is requirement, to make a statement before you gamble - to aid the gambler when the addiction stuff is at its peak and he/she is unloading their money.

      It is well and good for you to be on your chosen side of the argument, but don’t feign a reasonable argument when you are talking shit, and you can’t defend your view with what you thought another person would probably say.

      You are in the minority on this one pal - and there is a reason for this. Addiction is the key - and there are plenty of rules and regulations (a norm for society) surrounding other things people can/cant do. I seem to understand why I am not allowed to drink drive, or bash up a person who insults me, or snort coccaine on a big night on the town (and these things go to defining the society i live in) - so people like you are likely going to have to learn to understand why people who want to bet lots of money quickly on the pokies will have to state their intent before they do so.

      Wow what a terrible freedom robbing act it all sounds like. I am sure the UN or some international body is gonna come to our rescue and enlighten the world to the disgusting robbing of freedoms and liberties that this legislation is about to burden its people with.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      10:05am | 25/11/11

      Sorry, Tim but you are incorrect!
      Though he is just a single Independent SA’s Senator Nick Xenophon started his entire political career first in the SA parliament (yes, I know it’s 100% joke) & then when he moved into Federal politics based on his “No Pokies Platform”. When in SA he got so many votes he was able to appoint a second MP. At, I think it is now 2, Federal Election he was swept into office on his ” No Pokies” platform.
      Wilkie was not elected on such a platform.
      This self-styled Master of the Federal Parliament, Wilkie imagines himself as some sort of Eminence Grise & along with the Greens Bob Brown are Gillard’s puppet masters. He is nothing of the sort.
      He thinks he can threaten to bring down the Minority Gillard Government if Gillard does not pass his ridiculous Nanny State legislation. How stupid is that? He may be able to force the ALP in the House of Reps to vote “Yes” for it but he cannot force the other Independent to do so.
      The ALP in the Senate may vote ” Yes” but they don’t control the Senate.

    • Tim says:

      10:09am | 25/11/11

      B4Bear,
      your arguments are persuasive. Oh wait you didn’t make any.

      There can be no doubt that Poker Machines cause social harm in communities. The pubs and clubs therefore are partly responsible for this social cost and thus have to give back money and services and tax payments to cover this cost.
      What part of that don’t you get?

      Badrinath,
      don’t feign a reasonable argument when all you have is strawman arguments.
      All the things you list can directly harm other people than the users. Something pokies cannot.
      I can’t remember the last time a poker machine directly killed someone or bashed them. Can you?
      Although I’d actually be supportive of more relaxed drug laws so I would be ok with you snorting a line of coke if that’s your thing. Personal responsibility and all that.

    • Fred says:

      10:25am | 25/11/11

      @Badrinath, well said, but don’t waste your time with “Tim”.  For every article related to this issue I have seen him post his comments, over and over, and to great length.  He quite obviously has a vested interest in this issue and so for all his speeches about loss of freedoms etc etc, I suspect it really is a hip-pocket issue for him.  No more.  Would be fair if he owned up to it, though.

    • Tim says:

      10:49am | 25/11/11

      Fred,
      I don’t get a cent from any poker machines and have never even worked in the industry. Or the club industry either. Regulars readers would know that.
      I do on occasion put some money through them.
      Nice little attempted strawman though.

      It must be shocking for you that some people have different views than you and don’t like having their freedoms eroded constantly.

    • Fred says:

      11:14am | 25/11/11

      @Tim - if that is true (and i’m still not convinced) why do you continually misrepresent the facts?  For example, you say it is about “no pokie platform” when clearly that is not the truth.  You also say it is about “restricting the rights of the majority” when, again, this legislation does no such thing.  Everyone will still be able to go and play the pokies as much as they like. 

      Stop obscuring the truth and perhaps i’ll believe that your incessant opposition to helping problem gamblers with this legislation is merely a personal passion of yours based on misplaced idealism. 

      And you dare accuse others of strawman arguments!  Lol.

    • Bruno says:

      11:19am | 25/11/11

      @Tim - I’m sure your $20 a week, 1c X 5 lines freedom won’t be taken away.

      To me this issue is about people being legally allowed to destroy the lives of others. To me this is about clubs treating their communities with contempt by plasting those signs everywhere trying to influence people that it is the Australian way to let your neighbour destroy his or her life. To me this is about individuals whom instead of standing with their community, stand with the money-men because these individuals think that their lackeyism will one day be rewarded. The sad thing about these types of individuals is that they have failed to develop the fault process which instructs them that, at the end of day they are being treated with more contempt than the individuals who are for pokie legislation. Mate the pokie pushers treat you like ignorant sheep, like frightened children who cannot think rationally. The pokie pushers have scared you into going against your community.

      Anyone who use legal means to rip people off are bottom of the barrel. The way these pokie pushers walk around like they make an honest living. Unfortunately for the rest of us they were not born with the necessary guts and guile to become real criminals. Otherwise they would be contemplating every shower they have.

    • B4Bear says:

      11:28am | 25/11/11

      Why do I need to mount an argument. You have put forward an opinion that it is all Nanny State stuff. I am saying that it is not nanny state. Pretty simple. Furthermore, I am also saying that using the term Nanny State is just a lazy way of putting an argument.

      Because every time people such as yourself use the Nanny State argument you are just exposing your own hypocrisy. Drink driving, seat belts, health and safety laws, gun ownership, food standards. All could be considered Nanny State outcomes.

      As for your statement that taxes should be used to help those affected by pokies, that is just more tax churn. I suspect (but can not prove) that reducing the initial damage would cost less in the long run in a purely financial sense. You know the saying; An ounce of prevention is better than a pund of cure.

    • Harry Lovatt says:

      11:35am | 25/11/11

      Tim. Do you actually know anyone who is a problem gambler? If you did, I am certain that you would have a very different view.  Or perhaps your only harmful addiction is to your own blinkered views, cynically shaped by the power of truly wicked lobby groups.

    • Tim says:

      11:40am | 25/11/11

      Fred,
      a lot of the supporters of this move are not anti problem gambling, they are wholly anti pokies and anti gambling.
      As Robert S McCormick says in his post, I was wrong in my initial post. I should have said non of the major parties ran on a no pokie platform but Nick Xenophon did.
      Xenophon’s ticket wasn’t called “pre-committment for pokies” it was called “No Pokies”. He is wholly anti-gambling
      If you don’t think this is the first step in trying to restrict pokies and gambling altogether then you are naive.

      Problem gambling is a major social problem but there are much better ways to handle it than blanket restrictions.
      Even if these measures worked to restrict problem gamblers which is still doubtful, there can be no doubt that they will also take a large chunk out of the income earned from gamblers that don’t have a problem.

    • Tim says:

      11:43am | 25/11/11

      B4Bear,
      “Drink driving, seat belts, health and safety laws, gun ownership, food standards. All could be considered Nanny State outcomes. “

      All of these (except seat belts) can cause direct death and injury to other people. Pokies cannot.

      I agree that there should be more prevention taken against problem gambling. These don’t have to come in the form of blanket restrictions.

    • Adam Diver says:

      11:46am | 25/11/11

      Its funny how no-one attacking Tim has placed any responsibility on the problem gambler. They are all just delicate little flowers waiting for a government sledgehammer approach to solve their issues. Once they declare there spending limits, which will of course be something they can afford, everything will just work out fine.

      Be careful what you wish for, you may dislike the pokies (as I do), but there are people out there who dislike alcohol, equality, porn, video games, freedom of the press, or something that you indeed might hold dear.

      Never give politicians power over the individual, and if you do, at least be sure it was done within the democratic process, and that it will be in some way effective.

    • badrinath says:

      11:49am | 25/11/11

      Tim, the arguments are not strawmen. I have not twisted your words or misrepresented you, nor over simplified your statement - check the post - I think people are using strawman these days to define “an argument I think is weak and crap”.

      And Gambling does harm others - the gamblers family (yes including the children which I know you do not think it is reasonable to mention, but when kids can die in a car because they are left there by an addicted gambler, or families suffer or are destroyed through addiction of a family member) this fact cannot be simply dismissed. This is the point, the non gamblers that it harms. Don’t even mention the crime that relates to gambling directly and indirectly, nor the costs to society.

      Interestingly, at risk of being Godwin like, it is a strawman point to take the debate to whether or not a poker machine ever bashed a person.

      You do indeed hold this line against all reason, and if you have no vested interest as you say, I can only suggest that your fight to preserve freedoms would be better invested else where, in the realm of actual necessary freedoms. Not the right to f@ck you and your family’s lives up through addiction.

    • B4Bear says:

      12:12pm | 25/11/11

      “All of these (except seat belts) can cause direct death and injury to other people. Pokies cannot. “

      So just to clarify. If it prevents death or serious injury it is NOT Nanny State. But if no death or injury can occur it IS Nanny State?

      Or is it not a black and white issue, and maybe a little more complex than what you are saying?

    • subotic says:

      12:47pm | 25/11/11

      @mick “What a load of crock from the gambling industry”.

      How about “What a load of crock from the covert Communist Party, trying once again to stop freedom of choice and personal responsibility?”

      I’ll drink, smoke and gamble where the hell and when the hell I damn well feel like. Comrade.

      If you want a police state sooooooo damn bad sunshine, why don’t you MOVE to one?

      Stop enforcing your inability to control your own damn self on the rest of us.

    • Tim says:

      01:01pm | 25/11/11

      B4Bear,
      It is the principle of personal freedom. I will support personal freedoms as long as they do not impinge upon the personal freedoms of others.

      ie. Drink Driving - I support laws against drink driving because there is a clear, immediate danger to other people’s personal freedoms from a person drink driving. The risk is inherent to the act.
      The same cannot be said for poker machines. There is no inherent risk to others from someone playing a poker machine. There are secondary risks to others from abuse of poker machines and problem gambling but not direct risks.

      Badrinath, that is why they are strawmen. Your examples aren’t comparable and I never made the argument that they were.

      Adam Diver,
      agreed. I don’t know why some people can’t see the forest for the trees.

    • dovif says:

      01:08pm | 25/11/11

      What a load of crap

      Quite simply, this law is trying to stop people from spending money on entertainment. Which for a punter, the goal and thrill is to win money, which makes them happy.

      Just like a shoppaholic buying a handbag makes them happy.

      Those evil greedy handbag designers made a hangbag to lure a 17 yo girl into spending $3,000 on a handbag they cannot afford, how could these evil greedy handbag designers do such a thing.

      So lets look at a list of entertainment, which people might spend too much money on.

      Holidayss, shoes, handbags, cars, internet shopping, threater, Wedding

      Kerry Packer used to take millions out of Australia and gambled at the Las Vegas casino. I think we should ban Australians from going to America to solve that problem. I am also totally in agreement that we should ban holidayss, shoes, handbags, cars, internet shopping, threater, Wedding

    • Fred says:

      01:44pm | 25/11/11

      @Tim - “Problem gambling is a major social problem but there are much better ways to handle it than blanket restrictions.”

      You see, there you go again!!!  There are no “blanket restrictions” being considered, at all.  End of Story.  You’ve completely warped the issue to suit your rant.  I think you realise that without the exaggerated hyperbole your argument is weak.  Very weak.

      @Adam Diver - for “personal responsibility” to be at all relevant you’d have to dispose of the entire body of scientific knowledge regarding human addiction as well as the fact that pokie machines are specifically designed to exploit such weakness.  You may be happy to call addicts “delicate flowers” who deserve what they get, but I think you’ll find that anyone who actually knows a little about how the human mind works will laugh at your suggestion.

    • Adam Diver says:

      02:29pm | 25/11/11

      “actually knows a little about how the human mind works will laugh at your suggestion.”

      No one really does. Addiction and weakness are awfully similar, but one absolves you from all responsibility.

      In any case the correct approach for a clinically diagnosed addicts is to remove their individual freedoms, rather then restrict the collective to protect them. But no-one would go near such measures because of the fear of an incorrect diagnosis.

    • frankr says:

      03:25pm | 25/11/11

      @ TIM

      I can’t remember any party campaigning on a carbon tax platform or it being.mentioned at all until PM Brown got some power.

    • Fred says:

      03:33pm | 25/11/11

      “Addiction and weakness are awfully similar…”

      So are apples and oranges but you’ll find they taste wholly different.  You seem happy to hold an opinion that is hurtful to others, yet based on nothing whatsoever other than your own fanciful ideas.  What gives?

    • Pete says:

      03:48pm | 25/11/11

      The pokies lobby might have won this battle, but they’ve lost the war. The issue has been debated publicly and the average idiot is now aware that this parasitical industry offers nothing but misery to society. Game over you overfed ‘gaming’ industry representatives. You’ll never get an in in WA, and you’ll now see further restrictions on your poisonous little caper.

    • Fred says:

      03:57pm | 25/11/11

      @Adam Diver -http://www.time.com/time/interactive/0,31813,1640235,00.html

      Let’s learn first, then have an opinion.

    • Tim says:

      03:58pm | 25/11/11

      Fred,
      Yeah forcing players who want to bet more than $1 to get a card is not a blanket restriction. LOL.
      I’ll remember that when they enact similar legislation on fatty foods.
      Hey its not a blanket restriction, you’re free to eat as much salad as you want.

    • badrinath says:

      04:15pm | 25/11/11

      Diver, your understanding of addicition, especially in relation to weakness is brilliant. I’m thinking, in consideration of other opinions of yours that I have read, that you have the stock standard degree in conservative values with honours in rigid unfounded thinking.

      Tim, your last response to me makes no sense, I think Fred is right, you are just suffering from a weak argument situation. I make no informal fallacy’s, nor do I twist any of what you say or dramatise it in my post, perhaps you should look up what a strawman really is, I just did - it might help.

      Also diver, in what way do you want us to place responsibility on the problem gambler? Is responsibility placed by leaving them to continue costing society and other people in the degrees that their habbits do? Is responsibility asking them to sign an intended limit to what they will be spending before they are in a state where they are much less likely to act with reason and clearheadedness?

      Perhaps drink drivers should have responsibility placed on them by letting them kill people on the roads so that they can pay the price for their actions by going to jail (strawman for tim and for sarcastic dramatic effect - appropriate level of wit applied).

      Subotic, the whole commie argument is intellectualy stunted. The pollies who argue this ad infititum for policies they don’t like are dog whistling to people out there who are to lazy to think. Who you are whistling to here I don’t know - I think you may actualy believe that shit.

    • Adam Diver says:

      07:21pm | 25/11/11

      @ Fred,

      From your link

      “As scientists learn more about the pathology of addiction, new addictions are discovered and defined on a regular basis”

      1. We are still learning the pathology of the brain, which was my point.
      2 More importantly if addiction is so easy to diagnose, perhaps we diagnose the addicts, place restrictions on them, and leave everyone else to thier own devices.

      Either way you prove my point, so be careful when being so condescending.

    • acotrel says:

      04:46am | 26/11/11

      @Tim
      ‘We should enact more targetted schemes to help problem gamblers and force the pubs and clubs to give back more to their communities. ‘

      ‘Force the pubs and clubs’ - good luck with that !  So you don’t support the free market and self-regulation ? You want the ‘nanny state’ to step in and again pick up the pieces. Uncaring people like yourself should be ‘targetted’.

    • Fiddler says:

      06:27am | 25/11/11

      I wonder if this had happened prior to the carbon tax being voted in if they would have gone through with it, given they don’t need Adam Bandt any more?

    • wolf says:

      07:16am | 25/11/11

      Fidds they still need the greens to pass their legislation in the Senate.  It’s a package deal, so they have to stay sweet with Bandt to stop his colleagues blocking them in the upper house.

    • TimB says:

      07:34am | 25/11/11

      I’d say they would have. Possibly in a slightly different form though.

      Julia always intended to bring this in no matter how much she tried to downplay it and say she wanted a consensus first during the election. The Greens demands were just a convenient scapegoat for her to claim innocence.

      Not that anyone cares what her reasons were raspberry. She deliberately mislead the electorate and will pay the price.

    • Tubesteak says:

      07:49am | 25/11/11

      Labor would be stupid to betray this promise and do another backflip.

      It would look bad to the electorate and it would destroy any shred of credibility they had with any other party that is in bed with them.

      Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture. No point winning the battle if it means you lose the war.

    • SimonfromLakemba says:

      08:19am | 25/11/11

      Yea agree there on all fronts. It would be stupid of her to backflip on it, it would make her look worse then what she already does at the moment.

    • PsychoHyena says:

      08:49am | 25/11/11

      @TimB I’m confused, how was the electorate misled? You say that she wanted a consensus on it during the election but also somehow misled the electorate during the election.

    • TimB says:

      09:36am | 25/11/11

      Easy Psycho. Julia said she wouldn’t bring in and ETS (or a Carbon tax) until there was a consensus. That’s what the whole Citizen’s Assembly was all about. She deliberately downplayed carbon pricing fears during the election to avoid scaring off voters.

      The second she got back in, and there was no need for a consensus- bam, carbon price/tax.  The majority of people don’t want it, but she doesn’t care. She would have legislated this whether she was beholden to Bandt or had a majority in her own right.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      10:42am | 25/11/11

      Wilkie’s big mistake was not ensuring his legislation came up before both the CO2 & Mining Taxes legislation were voted on. He is now, thankfully, 100% irrelevant. I don’t like the Gillard Government but at least now she will be able to operate without threats of what is tantamount to blackmail from non-representative people like Wilkie. He only got in as a result of preferences.

    • Tom says:

      08:03am | 28/11/11

      Robert S McCormick, something does not add up about Wilkie on the pokies. A couple of thoughts on Wilkie’s enigmatic qualities:

      1. Would Wilkie ever rat on Labor? You would have to think “no” given his previous actions against the LNP (leaking confidential info and double dealing with Abbott at the time of the hung parliament). Wilkie smells like a “true believer” to me.

      2. Is the “poker machine” thing a bit of a diversion and, like the “independent” thing, a con to make Wilkie believable to the electorate?

      I think Wilkie is well and truly in the Labor tent. He will bung on a bit of confected outrage about the pokies. Then, he will just lie back and take one for the team.

    • gobsmack says:

      06:40am | 25/11/11

      It’s a pity that the adversarial nature of the two party system won’t allow a bipartisan approach to addressing the obvious problems caused by the pokies.

    • Mahhrat says:

      06:51am | 25/11/11

      This.  Brilliant paragraph.  Have a Kit Kat.

    • Bruce says:

      07:00am | 25/11/11

      gobsmack: It appears to me that no politician other than ‘wilkie’ is really interested in pokie reforms. Its just not a big vote winner. labor knows this.

    • Super D says:

      07:28am | 25/11/11

      There actually is a bipartisan approach - that there isn’t a problem.

    • james says:

      10:38am | 25/11/11

      Problem gambling from Poker machines is good for community, look at WA for an example of this.

    • paul says:

      10:40am | 25/11/11

      “It’s a pity that the adversarial nature of the two party system won’t allow a bipartisan approach to addressing the obvious problems caused by the “insert any problem” “.

      You have hit the nail on the head, gobsmack. Blind ambition, party politics and hatred make this nations politicians a complete and utter joke. Not once has Abbott actually stood for anything except power. Gillard is all about deals. If only, if only…sigh, is it too much to expect them to behave like grown ups.

    • Greg (from Combet land) says:

      06:42am | 25/11/11

      a) Smelly political manouvering.
      b) The real Julia.
      c) Harry takes one for the team.
      d) All of the above.

      It will make no difference come election day 2013.

    • Tony (from Abbottabad land) says:

      11:05am | 25/11/11

      Guess this means you will be supporting the tired old conservatives again?
      One vote that was never going anywhere stays put, just the way the crusted on like it.

    • Once upon a time in Australia - A competant govern says:

      01:20pm | 25/11/11

      Tony

      You do know that Abbottsabed means place of Abbott, Glad you came from Abbott, are you related?

      Yeah I yern for the tired old conservative, who do not stuff up everything they did, who do not have to lie, or sell out Australians to remain in power, who could actually balance a budget, and know the last time they balanced it

    • Tony (from Abbottabad land) says:

      06:15pm | 25/11/11

      I am related.
      I am a love child of the man

    • Stiffy says:

      06:48am | 25/11/11

      Pokies reform was never part of Labor’s platform or the Coalitions. It was solely Wilkies.

      If this change means that the Government will not be dictated to by a single cross bencher. Then to me that is a good thing for democracy.

      The question to the public is that Gillard made a public promise to Wilkie to see such Legislation passed. Will she now continue to honor that pledge? I would be surprised if she did not but it will be very much watered down to appease NSW Labor. A $1 cap on each machine and maximum $500 jackpot sounds to me a good compromise.

      Unless you are an Octopus pokie addict this will go a long way to reduce the damage.

    • Sam says:

      09:33am | 25/11/11

      It was nick Xenophan that had a no pokies campaign in the last election

    • hot tub political machine says:

      09:52am | 25/11/11

      Yep Xenophon actually used to have the “no pokies” party here in SA that became popular enough to win two seats in the SA upper house.

    • Mikko says:

      06:50am | 25/11/11

      The footage shown on Channel 10 news last night of a sad-faced Harry Jenkins looking up at the press gallery and running his fingers across his throat spoke for itself. He’d just had the razor treatment, never mind the explanation he had just given about wanting to join in the debates and votes with his party. First they knifed a sitting prime minister now they’ve shafted a respected Speaker but just how successful this latest Dirt Deed Done Dirt Cheap turns out to be, remains to be seen as the consequences play out.

    • Tim says:

      07:22am | 25/11/11

      Bahahaha.
      hilarious how one eyed people always seem to see what they want to.
      The only person who got shafted yesterday was Tony Abbott.

    • Super D says:

      07:38am | 25/11/11

      @Tim - Abbott and the voters of Fisher who probably didn’t think their man would help prop up the most incompetent government in the nation’s history.  They didn’t even vote independent so really are innocent victims.

      Mind you the Queensland LNP deserves a good slap for keeping Slipper around for so long in the first place.  Also Queensland deserves a good kicking too.  For whatever reason Queensland produces a disproportionate number of rogues and scoundrels in all works of life.

    • Mayday says:

      07:43am | 25/11/11

      Tim…..the throat cutting gesture didn’t happen?!

      Power at all cost, the only people shafted yesterday were the voters.

      Craig Thompson’s name is the one to watch, he is a real worry for Labor and Wilkie is the convenient ‘scapegoat’ in this re arrangement of deckchairs on this sinking ship.

    • Tim says:

      08:05am | 25/11/11

      Super D,
      Slipper isn’t propping anything up. He’s made a decision to leave his party and sit as an independent. The voters can rissole him at the next election if they want.
      We don’t vote for parties in the lower house, we vote for people. Slipper should have been gotten rid of and now its come back to bite them.

      Both sides need to lift their games with regards to the quality of candidates.

    • I hate pies says:

      08:28am | 25/11/11

      Tim, you’re 100% wrong - we vote for parties, that’s how we have independents.

    • Tim says:

      08:57am | 25/11/11

      I hate pies,
      I can’t remember seeing the Liberal/Labor/Green ticket on my voting paper.
      We vote for candidates who may or may not represent parties.
      Sure the people in Slipper’s electorate may want a Liberal member and they’ll get the chance to boot him out at the next election.

    • james says:

      09:01am | 25/11/11

      Tony Abbott said he would be in the lodge by Christmas too.

      If only it was a blood oath.

    • Babs of Sydney says:

      09:02am | 25/11/11

      The minute it happened my first thought was “Craig Thompson”.  Wilkie gave notice he would withdraw support of the Gillard government if his pokie legislation did not pass, so there was the first trouble spot for Labor, but the Craig Thompson cesspit of degradation is the hammer blow that should play out soon and it makes sense for Julia to re-arrange the deckchairs in anticipation of that outcome.  Harry Jenkins is the poor sod who was prepared to do whatever it took for his beloved Labor Party.  I wonder what they promised him?  In the meantime Tony Abbott is finally rid of slippery Slipper and we, the forgotten voters, get to have our say in all these shenanigans in a couple of years.  A win / win all round.

    • I hate pies says:

      09:21am | 25/11/11

      Tim, that’s right, people who represent parties - it’s not that difficult is it?

    • iansand says:

      10:01am | 25/11/11

      Babs - Thompson has not even been charged yet, let alone tried or convicterd.  That process will take until close to or beyond the end of this government’s term.  It might be a bit of toxicity during the campaign, but it is not Abbott’s wet dream.

      If I was Gillard I would take the pokie bill, or a watered down version of it, to parliament as insurance with Wilkie.

    • Tim says:

      10:11am | 25/11/11

      I hate pies,
      so you agree with me that we elect people not parties
      Glad we sorted that out.

    • sandra says:

      10:42am | 25/11/11

      I so agree with you Mikko—this is the grubbiest end to a filthy year by Gillards bully boy mob. - I htought they were roteen but this is a new low.
      Bring on Christmas and some respite!!! The polls will show hte overlal public has seen through this huge lie and back stabbing for what is is—I look forward to them

    • I hate pies...Tim's starting to give me the shits says:

      10:56am | 25/11/11

      Sounds like you’re a pendantic shit stirrer Tim - glad I don’t know you. We elect people who represent parties - they may as well be robots. Who the person is is irrelevant

    • Groucho says:

      04:47pm | 25/11/11

      The throat thing? Bullshit.

      Jenkins was making a warning gesture to a Press Gallery journo, using a camera - a real Reps “no no”.

      Jenkins has already said so.


      And it’s been pointed out heaps already today here at the Punch. Do try and keep up.

    • Seamus says:

      06:53am | 25/11/11

      I think it’s a fair call to say that Bob Menzies and Arfthur Calwell were thorough gentlemen, who did have the people’s interests at heart, compared to all the self serving, trough snorting pollies we are landed with these days.

    • Moooooee says:

      06:58am | 25/11/11

      Slipper’s seat is more south east Queensland than it is North. Easy mistake to make…

    • PW says:

      07:01am | 25/11/11

      If Labor drop this policy just because they don’t need Wilkie anymore, it will prove that was the only reason it was put forward in the first place.

      Not a good look, I would suggest.

    • john of solomon says:

      07:04am | 25/11/11

      As a Sunshine Coast resident I would appreciate if you could brush up on your geography, we are not a North Queensland electorate. However also as a Sunshine Coast resident I think this fiasco shows both Slipper and the Labour lot for the devious unprincipled people they are. Slipper has sold out his constituents for a pay increase and more perks and Gillard has been prepared to turn a blind eye to his previous rorts to get him on side and shore up support for her sinking Government. No wonder the Australian voters are becoming well and truly disillusioned with our “honorable” members.

    • Solomon says:

      07:39pm | 25/11/11

      John, in what way has Slipper sold out his constituents? Our democratic system and constitution make no mention whatsoever of political parties, conservative or otherwise. We simply elect a member in each electorate, who is then freely able to form, join and vote in any groupings he feels like doing. The thought of electing a party representative is an invention of the parties themselves to enable the true reason for their existence - get into power and stay in power.

    • Tom says:

      11:43am | 28/11/11

      Solomon, congratulations for the most blinkered piece of legalistic sophistry and rationalisation of bastardry ever seen in a blog site.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      07:06am | 25/11/11

      Just watch how quickly Gillard dumps on Andrew Wilkie! The sun has now set on his 15 minutes of fame & he is irrelevant.
      How inept & stupid can any MP be? Was he, like Gillard was when she gave Obama permission to base US troops permanently in Australia, so blinded by her charm, sex appeal that he could not see past all her blandishments? She has been planning this for a long time. There were so many Labor Heartland votes to be lost with Wilkie’s Pokie changes it was something she could not contemplate & would do anything to thwart Wilkie, should have forced the issue & forced Gillard to bring on his Pokie Reforms before he backed her CO2 & Mining Tax. Now we will never get this reform & it won’t matter how Wilkie votes in the future.
      Wilkie has been a fool
      Gillard continues with her dishonesty
      Abbott has so much egg on his face he will suffocate.
      The Liberals or LNP have only themselves to blame!
      Fact:
      For years we have been told that Slipper has been misusing & occasionally been forced to repay, Travel & other perks.
      For those same years the Liberals, Nationals, LNP, call’em what you like, have endorsed & re-endorsed Slippery Pete so what sort of fools are they?
      .He has changed allegiances at the drop of a hat. This time he has done it for a $77,500 pay rise plus perks.
      The ALP may yet rue they day they did the sleazy deal they did with him.
      The other question which must be asked is:
      Why did Harry Jenkins agree to take a $77,500 + perks Pay Cut?
      What inducements did Gillard offer?
      Come on ! This Government has 2 years to run. The chances, though greater now, are that it would, despite Abbott’s nonsense, have run Full Term.
      Jenkins could have comfortably stayed as Speaker & have retired at the next federal Election in 2013. He would have gone out with all those entitlements he has, allegedly, now volunteered to give up!
      Politicians, we know, are self-interested, grasping parasites. They do not give up anything which affects their wallets & purses. The grab everything they can because they know that when they retire or we sack them they keep all those financial & other benefits - which they have, thanks to a compliant, rubber-stamp Non-Independent Remuneration Tribunal, granted themselves.
      I have no time for Tony Abbott - I trust him about as much as I trust Gillard - but there is something about this whole issue which stinks
      I believe a Government, minority or not, should be allowed to serve it’s full term & it should be up to us, the Voters, to decide whether or not it should be re-elected. This decision should not be down to any Opposition unless it can be proven that a Government & it’s Ministers are corrupt. So far this has not been proven.

    • Bruce says:

      08:17am | 25/11/11

      Jenkins was forced to go. The strategy was to great for the labor power brokers to resist. Wilkie’s pokie proposal was a big risk for labor. No honesty in politics just ambition.

    • Michael says:

      08:57am | 25/11/11

      It was clever politics,  nearly as clever as proroguing the NSW parliament.

    • Damo says:

      09:00am | 25/11/11

      All your passion and outrage Robert would be well directed , and Mr penberthy’s, at the undemocratic position where a single pollie can direct the Nation .  Ridiculous situation regardless of the merit of his proposals .

    • Alf says:

      07:10am | 25/11/11

      Labor gains Slipper, the coalition gains Mel Brough. Easy to see who got the best deal.

    • Joan says:

      08:42am | 25/11/11

      Yep Labor takes on a Liberal reject and thinks its smart. Laugh. at that one .

    • VVS says:

      08:52am | 25/11/11

      Slipper will have to run next time as an independent (if he even bothers to waste his time).

      All Brough’s platform has to be is “not Peter Slipper” to walk it in.

    • Horns Up says:

      10:05am | 25/11/11

      Ummm Brough doesn’t have a seat in parliament Joan and Slipper was being shafted by his own party (apparently being shafted and not liking it makes you a rat in the Liberal party).

      So I’m pretty sure…just doing the numbers…one, two, three…yep…pretty sure that Labor will quite happily take their increased majority Joan.

      \m/

    • Paul says:

      10:34am | 25/11/11

      Actually labor didnt gain slipper, he became speaker.  Labor gained Jenkins, and abbot lost slipper.

      Easy to see who got the best deal.

    • james says:

      10:57am | 25/11/11

      Tony loses the slipper.

      Cant even run a noalition!
      What a loser.

    • Damian says:

      07:17am | 25/11/11

      I dare Gillard to dump it now. How many comments from her and her front bench arguing that it “is the right thing to do” and “we will not be intimidated” are there out there. It will simply reinforce (as if we needed any more) the view that she will say anything to stay in power, is untrustworthy and has no convictions.

    • TimB says:

      07:37am | 25/11/11

      Exactly. Well said.

      Gillard killing this will only make her look worse, and may send Wilkie over to the Coalitions side. Then Craig Thomson gets charged and the whole house of cards comes crashing down….

      A long shot, but not entirely outside the realms of possibility. Ah a guy can dream.

    • Aitch B says:

      08:28am | 25/11/11

      I doubt that she’d drop it. If she did the consequences would be dire as far as the electorate’s trust in her and the government is concerned.

      Thus far they have indicated that there will be reform and I think we all know that it’s Wilkie who’s driving that bus. If they backflipped on that commitment just because they now have the numbers it would be seen as a pretty shallow act of political expediency.

      Bill Shorten said that this morning that they well pursue ‘their’ plans on pokie reforms. That tends to make me think that some watered down version will be put up rather than Wilkie’s preferred option.

      Whether he accepts that - well, I guess we’ll find out in May.

    • SimongfromLakemba says:

      08:32am | 25/11/11

      Depends how bad the Craig Thomson situation gets, could be a high possibility.

      Wilkie is an egomaniac, so him going to the LIberal side could happen.

    • dovif says:

      02:09pm | 25/11/11

      Aitch B

      You means Gillard still has the electorate trust

      There will be no Uranium mines under a government I led

      There will be no Budget deficit under a goveernment I led

    • Aitch B says:

      03:20pm | 25/11/11

      @dovif

      Er….. let me rephrase that:

      “....the consequences would be dire as far as the remaining trust that the electorate has with her and the government.”

      Better? smile

    • Tell It Like It Is says:

      07:18am | 25/11/11

      How do you, or anybody else,  know that the gambling reform “is supported by a majority of Australians”?  There has been no referendum on this as far as I know so it’s all the usual guesswork. And it is hard to imagine that the gambling problems of so many could be any worse than the alcohol drinking problems of as many or more for the individuals, their families or the communities who have to mop up. Why this bias against gambling problems while ignoring the equally problematic alcohol issues? Implementing a cumbersome-sounding gambling control such as a pledge (who and how on earth is anyone going to police this? And what if you do not live up to your pledge on any one occasion?) sounds fraught and the ultimate imposition on one’s private domain of self-control and personal responsibility. HOWEVER, fan across the board reasonable mandatory closing time for all pubs and clubs would be a very good start. Just like excess alcohol goes hand in hand with increasing and often violent crime, illegal drugs, and inestimable unsociable behaviour which doesn’t even register, so must too much gambling go along with increased alcohol intake while sitting at those mind-numbing machines (that is if your mind wasn’t already numb to even go there!). So it’s a no-brainer. Kill two birds with one stone. Done deal or at least a very good start. Yes, both gambling and alcohol issues are complex and there is no one easy answer.  Of course the issue of education is crucial but that will take light years.

    • PW says:

      09:06am | 25/11/11

      “And it is hard to imagine that the gambling problems of so many could be any worse than the alcohol drinking problems of as many or more for the individuals….”

      Just because its not the only problem is no reason for not tackling it.

    • Tell It Like It Is says:

      11:08am | 25/11/11

      @PW, I am not at all suggesting that gambling is not a problem nor that it shouldn’t be “tackled”. My point is the hypocritical bias against gambling while generally ignoring the problems associated with drinking. One of those is probably going overboard at the slot machines while having imbibed way too much booze. Close all pubs and clubs at a reasonable hour. The ‘Last Drinks’ coalition has asked for 3 a.m. which is more than generous.

    • Ando says:

      01:54pm | 25/11/11

      Agreed ,
      I hate pokies and wish they were never invented but I suspect most of the widespread support for this band-aid solution is based on the hatred of pokies not the concern for the minority who cant handle them.

    • Clint says:

      07:18am | 25/11/11

      Wilkie said “the Government still needs him.” Get a dose of reality mate, they have deliberately sidelined you. That’s the thanks to you for surporting them in forming Government. Let’s see if you withdraw support and stand as a REAL Independent for the voters that elected you, or are you going to keep crawling.

      Your call
      .

    • Alf says:

      08:01am | 25/11/11

      In your face Wilkie. You lie down with dogs…

    • Jacob says:

      07:19am | 25/11/11

      I wonder how Labor would spin dumping” their” pokey policy after a year of contantly telling us how “committed” to it they were, what excuse will they give now for backing from their undertaking” full speed astern.

      And here comes the spin, watch with interest..

    • Watcher says:

      07:33am | 25/11/11

      A bit disgusted to hear on the news Woolies are not only the fresh food people, they are also the poker machine people!! I will shop at Coles from now on. As for Peter Slipper from what I hear on the news he was given a pretty rough time by The Liberal Party and who can blame the man for moving on to a better job, certainly not me. Gillard, a woman,  out smarted Abbott and that must sting.

    • marley says:

      07:43am | 25/11/11

      @watcher - from what I hear, Slipper has a history of misusing some of his entitlements, and has had to pay quite a bit of money back for travel claims.  I don’t think he’s exactly a shining star of integrity.

    • Joan says:

      08:48am | 25/11/11

      Yet another laugh - Gillard gone to Liberal reject shop and snapped up a tainted Slipper. - That`s smart ????  defective rejects seen as a smart buy - what a sad joke

    • Seeker says:

      10:10am | 25/11/11

      Liberals hold the Australia wide franchise for reject shops.
      Abbott is not just the CEO, but a product of his own franchise.

    • Holly says:

      07:37am | 25/11/11

      A lot of purely speculative drivel here.  I would say that it is more likely the pokies reforms will get through.  Windsor and Oakeshott were not certain to support this legislation.  It is a popular reform, will have nothing like the effect that the pokie barons would have us believe.  Now that I have become aware that Woolworths owns so many pokie machines I hope more than ever that the pokie reforms get through.  Not content with ripping off their suppliers and limiting the brands available to shoppers, they are happy to rip money off punters - a sort of win win - if gamblers can’t afford food - we’ll still be ripping it off them through the pokies.

      If Slipper has been such a spectacularly unsuccessful member for his own electorate why has he lasted so long and why was he re endorsed just over a year ago?  Who are the dills who enabled this?  Oh dear must have been the LNP and voters on auto pilot.

      Tony Abbott’s reaction to having an Independent speaker are contradictory.  since he tried hard to persuade Oakshott to stand.

      The times I have heard Slipper in the role he seems to do a reasonable job.  Fond as I was of Harry Jenkins I think he was a bit lax and overcompensatory, allowing the coalition rabble to get away with too much. I hope to see Peter Slipper run a much tighter ship.  That is another reason why Tony is so upset.  His parliamentary rants may be a thing of the past.

    • Rick of the Dustbowl says:

      08:53am | 25/11/11

      Agree the legislation will get through. There has to be somthing done to stop these theifs. They’re like Robin Hood in reverse, robbing the poor to feed the rich.

    • Tom says:

      12:17pm | 28/11/11

      Rick of the Dustbowl, sorry fella, huge difference between being robbed against some idiot dropping his worldly riches into a pokie.

    • Mouse says:

      07:39am | 25/11/11

      Oh, what a surprise! Don’t tell me that now gillard won’t be fawning all over the Independents and giving in to whatever they want. How tragic for them.  Does that mean that the Greens also have lost the edge? Well, now they know who their mates are don’t they.  This is just another day in the backflips and policy u-turns that we have come to know and expect with this government.  It is really hard to know just what the ALP actually believe in any more. I know they hate big business, encourage welfare dependency, support Union rule and gillard hates gays, but what do they actually stand for now?  It seems that trueblue beliefs and ironclad promises are only as good as the latest polls and vote numbers. I know that some people will say that gillard is only doing what she believes in and she didn’t really support the anti-gambling reforms, that she was pressured into it by the need for Wilkie’s vote. She really didn’t want the carbon tax, but was forced to by the Greens to get into power. So does that mean that now she will do just what she wants, now that she doesn’t have to kowtow to all these other bothersome people?  Hmmmm,  I wonder what she has had to promise Slipper to get sweet with him. Oh of course, no deals there, all above board!  What a joke, the whole kerfuffle gets more ridiculous every day. I am at the point now that headlines no longer surprise me and I am never moved one way or the other any more with this current government.  Same old, same old, boring as bat sh!t!

    • Seamus says:

      07:44am | 25/11/11

      Andrew Wilkie seems to think nothing will change on his pokie reform bill because Labor will still need him for deals further down the track.

      To Mr Wilkie I say your 15 minutes are up, mate, cash your ill-gotten pension in and buy a chook farm or wood-chip mill or whatever political has beens do in Tassie.  You will shortly see how much Labor needs you.

    • James Hunter says:

      07:47am | 25/11/11

      Pokies are like cigarettes. vial poisiounous and should be banned.

    • Joan says:

      08:51am | 25/11/11

      Pokies and cigarettes are less dangerous to my way of life than the effect of Gillard and Co

    • Nilbog says:

      08:59am | 25/11/11

      Great spelling.

    • dovif says:

      02:41pm | 25/11/11

      Cars are like cigarette, they produces Carbon Monoxide and can be poisonious and should be banned

      And they do their bid for Global warming/Ice Age/Climate Change too

      Oh Wait Pokies have never poisoned anyone… me bad

    • robynne says:

      07:48am | 25/11/11

      WHY! does Julia Gillard insist on surrounding herself with crooks to keep her in power? This is democracy down the drain ,WHO runs the country now ?the faceless backroom men as they did in NSW!

    • Joan says:

      08:55am | 25/11/11

      That`s the type of person she is comfortable with, that`s the way she thinks ansd works.  The backstabbing of Rudd and Carbon Tax lie etc etc. says it all, that`s the way she operates - like draws like.

    • Ynnerob says:

      11:16am | 26/11/11

      Like that senator that goes around bashing security guards? Oh no, i forgot, she’s a Lib

    • Anna C says:

      08:00am | 25/11/11

      Sucked in Wilkie.

    • Joel B1 says:

      08:35am | 25/11/11

      Yep, he got my number 2 vote ‘cause I thought he was an independent, not some ALP lap-dog.

      Came third in primary votes got in on Liberal preference.

      What a disappointment.


      PS the Royal Hobart Hospital is still rooted, maybe that $1Bn from Abbott was the way to go, rather than ask for it and then say “Ha ha, I was just joking…” Bloody idiot.

    • Horns Up says:

      09:59am | 25/11/11

      It was easy for Abbott to say Billion but he couldn’t explain where the money was to come from.

      \m/

    • F.W.G. says:

      08:07am | 25/11/11

      The sooner we are rid of this stinking cesspit of a government the better,
      Peter Slipper should resign from parliment ashe no longer represents
      the people who voted him in.

    • Erich says:

      08:13am | 25/11/11

      Gillard will not dump pokie reform. She saw what happened to the Government’s popularity when it dumped the first version of the carbon trading scheme.  Voters punish governments who don’t stick to their announced policies, especially if they are matters of high principle, and reward governments who do stick, even if the policies are short term unpopular.

      Not to mention that Gillard still needs Wilkie’s vote as insurance. You never what might happen in the next year and a half.

      Pokies reform will go ahead. You can bet on it.

    • MDG says:

      09:53am | 25/11/11

      I’m inclined to agree.  The only overtly political comment that Harry Jenkins made while he was Speaker was strongly in favour of pokies reform, so there is now an extra vote on the floor for it, and one less against it, which might be handy if any of the country crossbenchers waver under pressure

    • Suz says:

      08:17am | 25/11/11

      the pokie reforms proposed will not help the pokie players (it’s up there with brown paper bags for cigs-dumb) - it is all top easy to go online and rack up debt on a credit card theese days - all it will do is encourage pokie players to hide at home. We are already seeing it happen.

    • Rick of the Dustbowl says:

      08:24am | 25/11/11

      I like how they’re (the Lib’s) calling this guy a rat….....he comes from the biggest pack of rats ever.

    • VVS says:

      09:01am | 25/11/11

      Sinatra, Deano and the gang?

    • jg says:

      08:26am | 25/11/11

      I know Gillard has made some dad decisions but this one with Slipper reeks of desperate, win-at-all-costs politics.

      Slipper is a sleazy, dishonest, power hungry man.

      This is a terrible look for the sake of one vote and the chance to give dismiss Wilkie’s claims. And the Libs won’t mind that Slipper is now gone.

      Gillard and the ALP just seem to keep giving Abbott and the Libs a free kick at ever corner.

    • Terence of Oz says:

      08:30am | 25/11/11

      Instead of treating Tony Abbott as just being opposed to everything. Lets just look at it as him being the mouth piece of every democratic person out therel
      The democratic process went down the drain when along with a few Independants and Greens this Government elected it’s self to dictate their own policy’s to the rest of Australia.

      The whole Westminster system is in need of a dramatic overhaul to be bought into the 21st century, and the first step would be to make politicians accountable to their own electorates before switching sides mid term and making a political farce of the whole voting system.

    • Groucho says:

      09:08am | 25/11/11

      Robert Menzies, the founder of the Liberal Party, had this to say:

      “In other words, on far too many questions we have found our role to be simply that of the man who says ‘No.’ “

      A visionary was Robert Menzies: 67 years ago he picked Abbott, and this is what he also said about him:

      There is no room in Australia for a party of reaction. There is no useful place for a policy of negation.

      That is what Robert Menzies said about Abbott. He has led the coalition of yesterday into the ‘noalition’ of today—the ‘noalition’ who have just one policy to every issue: no, no, no, no, no.

      With thanks to Albo.

    • Mark says:

      09:51am | 25/11/11

      100% agree with your second paragraph, Terence. What other technological/social/medical system has lasted 100 years without major improvements to efficiency or purpose? None, democracy is the only one and we are arrogant to think we have reached the pinnacle of political development. Political parties should be outlawed and every politician should be elected on their personal beliefs and how they affect their electorate. Instead, we have this childish power brokering system where we elect someone to vote for one of two options. Sometimes so similar the debate gets lost in the semantics of the differences rather than looking for the best solution possible, we settle for what’s offered by two parties. This is not the most efficient, nor most equal system possible and the thing that annoys me the most is no one knows how to change it. We need a second enlightenment or we are doomed to the foretold Idiocracy.

    • Daniel says:

      10:38am | 25/11/11

      Groucho,

      When Labour where in opposition last they also voted no on everything.  If you want to post some comments in support of your Labour party then that is fine, but seriously, you should understand that people will understand you comments for what they are.

      The fact of the matter is that while everyone here seems to want to apportion blame for this, that and the other to indivuals the reality is that everything we are seeing is simply what politics are about in Australia today.  And all of us are to blame!

    • Aitch B says:

      10:41am | 25/11/11

      @Groucho

      “There is no room in Australia for a party of reaction. There is no useful place for a policy of negation.”

      I see….. you’re obviously excluding all the years when Labor were in opposition and did the same.

      Or is this a future direction that Labor will take when they’re next in opposition?

    • Groucho says:

      10:52am | 25/11/11

      “If you want to post some comments in support of your Labour party then that is fine”

      Thanks for the “permission”, pal. Post facts as I find ‘em.

      Now go patronise someone who won’t notice.

    • Michael says:

      11:00am | 25/11/11

      Don’t take yourself so seriously Groucho, it’s more fun that way smile

    • Groucho says:

      11:11am | 25/11/11

      Yeah, right.  Right to the heart of the matter eh.

      Not.

      Just more piss-poor patronising, whining, and eye-rolling. Pffft.

    • Mark says:

      11:19am | 25/11/11

      Actually, Groucho, you could use it as an educational comment. Gain a bit of perspective? What Daniel was saying was the it’s ok for you to post your biased comments, but don’t expect anyone with half a brain to take them seriously. He wasn’t giving you permission for anything, obviously you and your half a brain don’t quite see the full side of the story. What this particular thread is about Groucho, is the need to change from the current system rather than dwell on the childish manner in which domestic politics is currently done in the Western World. There is a better way, but the majority can’t see outside of the 2 party system which has corrupted democracy and prohibited unapproved innovation.- the corner stone of great individualistic achievements and as such, the advancement of the human race. We are a stagnated species

    • Ross Garrad says:

      11:50am | 25/11/11

      Terence, I’m sick of people saying this govt wasn’t elected democratically. Go to the Electoral Commission website and check the 2PP vote: Labor 50.12%, Coalition 49.88%. Which is more than Howard managed against Beazley in 1998 (Coalition 49.02%, Labor 50.98%). Did you spend 1998-2001 in perpetual angst because we didn’t have a democratically elected govt?

    • GB says:

      09:06am | 25/11/11

      Slipper is an utter grub and anybody who knows him knows this act is typical of the man. He has only ever been in it for himself and has had no qualms at all about sticking his snout into the taxpayer trough. He knows he is gone at the next election anyway so he is just milking as much out of his tenure as he possibly can. I never expected us to go back to the polls early in any case, so it really doesn’t make too much difference as far as I’m concerned. We’ll all get to make our judgement in 2013. It’s not that far away really.

    • Mark says:

      09:11am | 25/11/11

      There are always exceptions to the rule, and Gambling addicts are them. What needs to be established is whether the activity/product is inherently addictive. As it stands, I don’t think Gambling is.- FOR MOST PEOPLE- Unlike alcohol and cigarettes, which create a form of addiction from the very first drop and also create negative consequences for others with their very existence and use. These are social consequences, Gambling does not have these same consequences. A broken family is affected, but others are not. This is the key difference with which, I believe you cannot lump Gambling in the same basket as cigarettes and alcohol. That being said, I don’t believe the Government has the jurisdiction to limit consumption or production of any product. Consumption and expenditure should be choices, at all times, for the individual. The first time a government banned the sale or limited the consumption of a product was the beginning of this nanny state, it gave them the precedence they needed to ban everything and impose limits on everything. That was a turning point for society

    • Liz1 says:

      09:17am | 25/11/11

      Let’s just see if the Gillard knife goes through the pokie legislation. Let’s see if Gillard’s glistening, bloodied sword knights Jenkins with the financial reimbursement of a ministerial post.  That’s a lot of money to give up just for love of the party!  And it’s a particularly large windfall for a sleeping Slipper!

      Abbott’s job as leader of Opposition is to stand up to bad government proposals. This he has done.

      It is also his duty to reveal the deeper character of those who carry more allegiance to clinging to office, than to respecting our public. The polls thus far show the Gillard-managed government does not have the support of Australians, and that is largely due to incompetences like burning pink batts and the associated tragedies, school halls, pull factor boat arrivals and associated deaths, union puppet-masters,  the carbon tax lie and her disloyalty to senior colleague Rudd.

      Let’s watch for the next poll to if the public approves of her latest act of betrayal. I predict she will have sunk the overall satisfaction with her party to an even deeper all-time low. 

      I think the Liberals will win a landslide in their own right. They do not need the Slippers of this world.

      There is no uglier sight than a vicious, scheming, untrustworthy female.

    • Paul Davis says:

      09:21am | 25/11/11

      A bad day for democracy?

      Does anyone seriously claim Australia has a democratic form of government?

      Democracy is defined as governmnet for the people, by the people. We have never had that and both current major Party leaders flaunt this at every turn.

      WHat we have is a form of oligarchy, where small numbers of people actually run governemt, for themselves firstly and the people at the end of the queue and only seriously thought about at election time.

      Even then we don’t get a choice of who to vote for. The Parties throw up some stooges for us to pick from but we never have a choice in who they are.

      Once elected these MP’s give all their loyalty to the Party and never the people. Tony Windsor may be the only exception to that.

      But, bad day for democracy? Thanks for the laugh!!

    • Keith says:

      09:43am | 25/11/11

      Poker machines must be one of the biggest evils to be inflicted
      on our communities.  Even Wayne Goss, a Qld. Labor premier said
      that his introduction of them was one of the biggest regrets of his life.
      Now of course most state governments are addicted to the revenue
      which they produce.
      Cub managers are laughing over their breakfast as they count the
      monthly profits they have gouged from the weak and vunerable.

    • Can't trust 'em says:

      09:44am | 25/11/11

      Is this a move that means that when Craig Thomson has to face police charges, that they can still remain in power?

      I wonder.

    • GB says:

      10:33am | 25/11/11

      Absolutely it is. I thought that was painfully obvious. Jenkins reasons for stepping down just don’t stack up. Everybody should have seen this coming when Slipper was trotting Rudd out in his Sunshine Coast electorate 2 weeks ago.

    • Cookie Monster says:

      11:07am | 25/11/11

      Groucho - you do realise that Jenkins is a back-bencher and so won’t get a look-in when it comes to structuring policies. Why would a person step down from the speaker’s position into obscurity?

      It was a deal done - I think its politics and something either side would do if needed. However I think its wrong that people refuse to call a spade a spade.

    • GB says:

      11:25am | 25/11/11

      @Groucho. Yeah right. Whatever you say.

    • Groucho says:

      11:43am | 25/11/11

      You do realise that he’s now a backbencher who’s back in the Party Room, eh?

      Just trying to distract attention from it, eh?


      Here’s what Jenkins had to say, statement in full:

      “Today marks my 1382nd day as Speaker of the House of Representatives. I have at all times tried to uphold the fine traditions of Speaker, and to the best of my ability have attempted to carry out my duties in the most independent and non-partisan manner possible.

      As members are aware in this the 43rd Parliament, to further avoid controversial party political matters I have divorced myself from involvement with the Federal Parliamentary Labor Party. In this era of minority government I have progressively become frustrated at this stricture. My desire is to be able to participate in policy and parliamentary debate, and this would be incompatible with continuing in the role of Speaker.

      As a consequence, when I vacate the Chair at the end of this short statement I will visit the Governor-General to tender my resignation as Speaker of the House of Representatives.

      I thank all members for their co-operation which they have dispensed to varying degrees depending upon the individual.

      I thank everyone who works for the Department of House of Representatives under the capable leadership of the Clerk Bernard Wright and the Deputy David Elder; they serve us well. My gratitude goes to the diverse range of officers of the Department of Parliamentary Services: from gardeners to guards, technicians and tradies, researchers to reporters, Hansard; they serve us well. To presidents Hogg and Ferguson with whom I served as co-presiding officer, and the members and officers of the other place with whom I had interaction, I thank them for their forbearance. All these people ensure that the Australian Parliament remains an enduring effective institution.

      My staff in the Speaker’s Office have assisted me and kept me well grounded; I believe that members would agree with me that they carry out their duties with integrity and professionalism.

      Finally I acknowledge my eternal indebtedness to my “trouble and strife” Michele and the four generations of my family without whose support I would never have been able to achieve the high office I hold.

      Late yesterday I ascertained that the Governor-General is available for my call before 9.30, therefore I must depart. I go placidly with my humour intact. I wish you all well.”

    • Cookie Monster says:

      12:41pm | 25/11/11

      Groucho - you are acting like everything that comes out of a politician’s mouth is true.

      “You do realise that he’s now a backbencher who’s back in the Party Room, eh?” - yes Groucho we do, it means that he will have nothing to do with forming policy - so why was it that it he stood down again -

    • luke09 says:

      12:51pm | 25/11/11

      Jenkins should have called his union rep. He had his wages cut by $100,000 a year by being forced to resign. Labor are now shown as hypocrites when it comes into protecting individual’s right to employment.

    • Groucho says:

      01:13pm | 25/11/11

      More bullshit.

      As Speaker, Jenkins absented himself from the Party Room and its work.

      He didn’t get to take part in any Labor policy debate at all.

      Now he can and will.

    • GB says:

      02:25pm | 25/11/11

      Who gives 2 shits what he said Groucho. What’s he supposed to say? “My party have shafted me to shore up their numbers in the house and at the same time I’ve had to take a 50K pay cut”. Of course he is going to toe the party line and spout the bullshit you just linked us to. You’re expecting us to believe that he has taken a mssive pay cut from a job he always aspired to just to take part in “debates”. LMAO!

    • Cookie Monster says:

      02:44pm | 25/11/11

      Groucho - he’s a backbencher not in cabinet so not a part of policy-making. What don’t you understand about the way the Labor party works?

      First you believe everything that comes out of a politician’s mouth and now you believe the Labor Party is run democratically.

    • Groucho says:

      03:10pm | 25/11/11

      The Lieberal mindset on display. It’s all only about the money.  Pffft.

    • NicoleG says:

      03:57pm | 25/11/11

      Groucho, it’s quite disturbing that you actually really believe Harry did this of his own accord. LOL And what is Santa bringing you for Christmas?

    • Groucho says:

      04:16pm | 25/11/11

      “Quite disturbing” eh.

      Jenkins is on the record. And Abbotts ineptitude came back to bite him on the arse.  End of.

      So just suck it up, Princess.

    • NicoleG says:

      04:36pm | 25/11/11

      Princess? I’d prefer Queen, but meh, Princess will do.

      I’d really love to see your point of view, but I just can’t seem to get my head that far up my arse. Wake up son and see that this reeks of Gillard. She’d do anything, to stay in power. She doesn’t give a shit who she stomps on to do it. She proves it time and time again. But carry on, believe her lies and defend the undefendable.

      Now, I have a bridge for sale, wanna buy it?

    • Groucho says:

      04:49pm | 25/11/11

      Meh. Keep spinning your bullshit.

      Useless Abbott lost. Suck it up.

    • poa says:

      09:44am | 25/11/11

      I laughed my head off. Wilkie will be totally shafted over pokies by Gillard now that she doesn’t need him. Craig Thomson will retire for family reasons next year..a bit closer to an election ( with nobody making any “findings” at all)..and the funniest thing out is Slipper himself.
      The man who makes a mockery of taxpayer expenses ( regularly having to pay back unallowed “expenses”) is the ALP’s new boy.
      Decietful to the extreme…he ran as a Liberal MP and now joins the worst Government in our history for a few shekels etc.
      He should fit right in.

    • Dodge says:

      09:49am | 25/11/11

      Good stuff. Anything to diminsh Abbot, a stain on Australian politics, is an entirely positive thing.

    • Weary says:

      12:50pm | 25/11/11

      Yeah!  Let’s see more lying and manipulation.  I agree with you Dodge, having rights, electing trustworthy leaders and living in a democracy is for LOSERS.  Honestly, what sort of moron wants a leader that says they’ll do something and then ends up actually doing it?  Not Dodge, that’s for sure.

    • Stain on Australian politics says:

      02:33pm | 25/11/11

      Did this Abbot of yours lied, backstabbed his predecesor, told us there was a Fake Tony, stuffed up the budget, stuffed up the AS policy

      Yeah lets kick the liar out

    • iansand says:

      10:04am | 25/11/11

      Why does anyone have to own Slippery?  We might have *gasp* an independent Speaker.

    • Alf says:

      11:52am | 25/11/11

      @iansand. There is no such thing as an ‘independent’ anymore. Just corrupt individuals interested in their own self gain.

    • Stuart says:

      10:11am | 25/11/11

      Is there any such thing as a politition that can be trusted,I seriously doubt it after yesterdays deceit and the last 4 years of Labor and it’s manipulating partners.It was good to see Wilkie get it in the back and it shows the others what Labor really thinks about them and what Labor will do to them when they get the chance.

    • Michael says:

      10:21am | 25/11/11

      Rubbish Penbo!  They’d be mad to burn off Wilkie forever by pulling pokies reform.  What’s more likely to happen is a compromise: no to mandatory pre-commitment, yes to $1 maximum bets. It’s such a neat solution:
      1) The clubs lobby gets the rug pulled out from under it. (The very least it deserves.)
      2) Labor MPs in NSW and Qld - not to mention Oakeshott and Windsor - can tell their voters community life as they know it won’t end.
      3) The Greens get their pokies policy up.  (And, not that it matters in the House, but it was also Xenophon’s policy before Wilkie arrived.)
      4) Andrew Wilkie saves face: “I wanted mandatory pre-commitment but there wasn’t a majority for it - and I’m not going to bring the government down for failing to secure it because anyway a) I can’t now and b) if it wasn’t for me we wouldn’t have got this far on pokies”.
      Everybody wins!  Except the Coalition and the clubs lobby of course.

    • Daryl Saal says:

      09:14pm | 25/11/11

      Thanks for saving me the trouble of typing exactly what you have said. Agree on all points, and I’d add that executives in these clubs must have the same morals and values as those in the tobacco and armanent industries. Only difference from drug mr bigs is that they are smart enough to stay just inside the law.

    • Anjuli says:

      10:25am | 25/11/11

      Problem gamblers will only find some thing else to squander their money on ,though maybe not as easy as the slot machines.How can Harry Jenkins stay loyal to the Gillard government after this,he should be an Independent and tell them to shove it.

    • elk says:

      12:22pm | 25/11/11

      Wrong Anjuli,
      As a reformed problem pokie gambler I have researched the subject and found that myself and other reformed pokie addicts just don’t bother to find gambling substitutes for pokies. This is because the pokies are the crack cocaine of the gambling industry. I also know that the pre-commitment scheme would work in as much as at least saving pokie addicts from financial damage until they admit their problem and seek further help such as counselling.
      If Andrew Wilkie’s pre-commitment reforms do not go through, then it is a victory for the low life scum bag no better than drug dealer club owners, casino owners, pokie manufacturers and politicians who make profit from the misery of a highly addictive product. It will be a devestating loss for pokie addicts and their families.

    • Dont worry, be happy says:

      10:38am | 25/11/11

      Sounds like a brilliant plan - but again, they really haven’t thought too far ahead on this one…..like all this Governments plans, it will end in tears. A block of sh!t is still sh!t no matter how you chop it. Going back on “their commitment” - no problem for this lot - it hasn’t been a problem yet - cant believe theyd’e do this to save that poor excuse of a man Thomson (Union power) & to avoid making a stand and put forward a debate on what they truly believe - Parliament was the tool for productive debate on issues & a test of how sound your policys are - pity that Labour has turned it into a demolition site.

    • Leigh says:

      10:54am | 25/11/11

      It’s not the job of governments to make “…life more bearable for problem gamblers”; nor is there any evidence that such action is   “supported by a majority of Australians”. If gambling is problem to some people (and it’s up to individuals to accept that they have a problem) it is a problem for those individuals, not the rest of us.

      For anyone with a problem which affects his or her family, it would be much better if the government intervened on an individual basis. If it’s good enough for aboriginals, it’s good enough for white no-hopers.

      But the action wanted by the totalitarians Wilkie and Xenephon is far too dangerous to be in the hands of any government: it is another nail in the coffin of democracy, especially with the kind of socialist, big government we currently have. These two independent manipulators, always looking for deals with any government to attain their goals (while representing very few people) would have all gamblers registered like dogs!

      There is an alarming tendency in Australia to punish the majority under the guise of helping the minority. John Howard, for instance, gave us the most draconian gun laws in the ‘free’ world – just because of one lunatic.

      Now, there is no doubt whatsoever that the monkey business of changing speakers is a self-serving and extremely cynical exercise: just another Gillard government trick for voters to remember at the next election (if they are capable of remembering). But to carry on as though it was designed as a cop-out for something that the government should not become involved in is beyond the pale. Particularly when people like David Penberthy clearly has an axe to grind with the morals of “multi-millionaires in the gaming industry” who provide a lot of money and a lot of jobs to Australians.

    • ian says:

      11:05am | 25/11/11

      Well said Leigh, i agree with everything you have written.

    • Weary says:

      11:44am | 25/11/11

      Let’s see more gambling and more guns.  Well said idiot.

    • Tim says:

      11:59am | 25/11/11

      Extremely well said.
      Agree 100%

    • Aussie Born and Bred says:

      12:29pm | 25/11/11

      John Howard, for instance, gave us the most draconian gun laws in the ‘free’ world – just because of one lunatic. - Leigh

      So, how many lunatics should he have waited for before bringing the gun laws in?  How many people should Howard have allowed to be murdered before he acted? 

      What a moronic statement.

      The simple fact is that those “draconian” gun laws were instituted to stop mass-shootings.  Lo’ and behold, we haven’t had ONE mass shooting since then.  End of story.

    • subotic says:

      12:52pm | 25/11/11

      @Weary, I’m weary of covert fascists posing as so-called family oriented concerned citizens wanting Australia to turn into a goddamn banana republic.

      Want a police state Weary? Go move to one. Too easy. And take your lack of personal responsibility and accountability with you.

      Close the door on the way out, thanks…

    • dovif says:

      12:53pm | 25/11/11

      Leigh

      Using a gun to kill people is illegal

      Gambling is not, if I want to I can borrow 100k and put it on a horse this Saturday

      Stupid statement

    • RyaN says:

      12:55pm | 25/11/11

      @Aussie Born and Bred: Yet there are drive-by shootings every other day in Sydney. Hmm seems to me that it solved absolutely nothing.

    • PaxUs says:

      11:11am | 25/11/11

      WHAT DEMOCRACY?

    • Tiger says:

      11:45am | 25/11/11

      *sigh* here I was believing (naively) that politicians are “in it” to make a difference

      bahahahaha

    • BW says:

      11:49am | 25/11/11

      Two not-so-open deals in two days. What a way to kill the momemtum, PM.

    • RyaN says:

      12:06pm | 25/11/11

      Wilkie should have known better, after all the woman with zero scruples stabbed her best working mate squarely in the back, how is he surprised that when the going go tough she found a way to get behind him and do the same.

      All more the fool you Wilkie, you trusted someone that cannot be trusted and now you feel the knife.

    • Steve Putnam says:

      07:06am | 26/11/11

      You’re out and out drama queen RyaN. Can’t you post a single comment that is free from hype?

    • RyaN says:

      11:30am | 28/11/11

      @Steve Putnam: Did you actually have something to contribute there?

    • DC says:

      01:08pm | 25/11/11

      I suspect that Labor will continue with the Pokies legislation and Wilkie will continue to support the Government.

      The Gillard Government for all it’s faults (Abbott has more faults) has made a number of unpopular decisions and has stuck with them because they know - unlike Abbott - that Government isn’t just about a 10 second sound bite.

      Howard knew this as well, and for all his faults, you could never question his determination nor courage to push on with unpopular decisions.

    • Groucho says:

      01:19pm | 25/11/11

      Yup. Agree.

    • RyaN says:

      03:16pm | 25/11/11

      Even if it means lying to the electorate “there will be no carbon tax under a government I lead”!

    • Groucho says:

      04:11pm | 25/11/11

      Ah bullshit.

      She didn’t intend to mislead.

      She compromised in forming a legit minority government.

      The Liberals would have too,  if they’d got the chance.

    • RyaN says:

      11:28am | 28/11/11

      @Groucho: “She didn’t intend to mislead. ” of course she did, she has shown her true colours.
      She stabbed her best working mate in the back for the top job, stabbing the public through an outright lie was easy for her.

    • David says:

      01:20pm | 25/11/11

      Jenkins was told to go. Slipper knew he was not going to get pre-selection so he will take what he can while he can. Wilkie is no longer relevant but the government will put legislation up. That legislation will be so watered down as to be worthless but they will demand Wilkie’s vote as the price of doing anything at all.
      The biggest problem with all of this is that Labor has breached long-standing parliamentary conventions in order to retain power. Should the Oppostion try to do this in the future Labor will be demanding an election and the unions will be out on strike.  But, it is fine for Labor to do it now because they have an absolute right to govern - after all they won a minority of the votes. Of course if the position was reversed they would claim the opposite to be true.
      Democracy is dead in Australia - but that is what comes of having an electorate which is compelled to attend the ballot box.

    • Col Sanders says:

      05:13pm | 25/11/11

      Firstly it is not the first time a Speaker has not been from the ruling party, as you say it is just convention. Secondly John Howard supported Mal Colstons (who was under a cloud of travel rort allegations)  defection from the Labor Party because Howard desperately needed Colston’s vote to push through the GST and the sale of Telstra. Where were the cries of Democracy is dead in Australia, then?

    • Davy Crockett says:

      05:35pm | 25/11/11

      The good Colonel is so right. As I recall, the Libs had no problems with “long-standing parliamentary conventions” in accepting the votes of the turncoat Labor senator Pat Field back in ‘74 in order to retain power. You see David, both parties are in it for one reason - power - the only reason for their existence is to be get into and retain power. To say that one side is bad and the other good, is to show either bias or ignorance, or both.

    • Pre-committment a farce says:

      01:27pm | 25/11/11

      @ Penberthy - you add no evidence that convinces me that pre-committment will work. I wholehartedly support helping problem pokie-machine gamblers, but pre-committment is a joke. What is stopping the punter from setting the limit higher to give themselves a buffer “just in case” - nothing.

      I enjoy my rugby league, and the reality of it is that rugby league it funded heavily by the leagues clubs. I believe that the government should refuse to approve anymore pokie machines in the country, and give each club / pub a quota to reduce their machines by a certain amount each year to ween them off the machines. This will give leagues clubs a chance to reinvent themselves into true places for the community and for rugby league to focus their efforts on sourcing funding elsewhere. With an increase to the TV deal resulting in at least one billion, why can’t the sport eventually be fully funded by TV rights??

      As for Wilkie, he gets what he deserves. Gillard shafted us over the Carbon Tax and he helped facilitate it - that is more undemocratic than reneging on pre-committment technology, which aussies never wanted anyway. Now he gets the knife in the back from gillard and she cuts him to size - one MP should not dictate who the whole of Australia operates through blackmail.

      And David, you work for News Limited, how dare you publish anything that goes against the beliefs of Tony Abbott. He hated pre-committment from the start. Lets see how democratic you are - I challenge you to post this reply.

    • Craig of North Brisbane says:

      01:28pm | 25/11/11

      Surely the ALP will still go ahead with the pokie reforms in an attempt to keep Wilkie happy.  They might not need him now, but he could become important again in the future, and their barganing power will be significantly reduced if they’ve already dropped Wilkie like a sack of potatoes the moment they don’t need him.

    • Dennis Poole says:

      03:34pm | 25/11/11

      Mayday,,,yes he did, I watched the news and Harry Jenkins slid his fingers across his throat. So what price did he have to pay for the pleasure of being given a huge pay cut. Watch this space when overseas postings come up.

    • Groucho says:

      04:08pm | 25/11/11

      More bullshit.

      Jenkins has already talked about that.

      He was warning a Gallery journo - in his own unique way. The journo had a camera - and that is one big no-no in the House.  The throat-cut was telling him to desist.

      Christ, can’t you Lieberal bozos keep up with anything?

    • Gratuitous Adviser says:

      07:05pm | 25/11/11

      Good one and great stretch. 
      The club/pub and Woolworths vested interests are the only ones “shafting” on this issue.  Bend over losers, I’m going to the club for a cheap meal on your account.

    • Gidgee says:

      07:50pm | 25/11/11

      Caveat Emptor..or perhaps that should be stylishly amended to read in modern English “let the pokie player beware” - there is a limit, surely, as to how society can dictate the terms to gamblers in a so-called Australian democracy?
      The age-old axiom “fools and their money are soon parted” holds as true today as much as it ever did - the starry-eyed and dreamy Mr Penberthy is entitled to his high-minded opinion but I have to tell the trump of this site that he is just too presumptuous and altogether too righteous in his denunciation of the federal government’s import in such personal matters: it must (and now it seems will) always remain the sole and lawful province of the individual as to how much he or she spends in the ever optimistic player’s gambling efforts to make a quick “killing”.
      Holding hands while coddling and catering to fools is not the job of democratic human governance: never was and never will be.
      As the Chinese proverb goes “there’s one born every minute”.
      Gidgee.

    • Geronimo says:

      06:38am | 26/11/11

      An exercise the Deputy Sheriff and its Posse of habitual liars would have embraced with all the loving emotion of a long lost Saddle Bag.

    • Raptorlicious says:

      10:10am | 26/11/11

      “If”

    • Kate says:

      09:31pm | 26/11/11

      What happened in the Federal Parliament was ghastly and did the Labor Party no credit but lets not kid ourselves. Tony Abbott and the Liberal Party, given the same circumstances, would have done the same thing. They are all politicians and, unfortunately, this is the type of behaviour we have come to expect from them. And they wonder why they can’t attract decent candidates.

    • Stuart says:

      10:41am | 27/11/11

      Journalist Dennis Atkins said that it is hard to find evidence of Labors acts to con slippery Pete to defect to their side.He is obviously deaf dumb and blind,he should hand in his papers as a journalist and resign.

    • smulpids says:

      07:45am | 16/03/12

      order an <a >maxi dresses on sale</a>  for promotion code

 

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Anthony Sharwood

The weird thing about #eurovision is you've got this massive collection of dorks in a room and no one is wearing Spock ears #sbseurovision

Anthony Sharwood

Europe has the large hadron collider which is light years ahead of its time and #eurovision, where the eighties never die

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Eurovision can’t drown out the human rights abuses

Eurovision can’t drown out the human rights abuses

Last year, thousands of Azerbaijanis spontaneously took to the streets of Baku shouting and chanting.…

Revenge. It doesn’t get a whole lot better than this

Revenge. It doesn’t get a whole lot better than this

Last month, Katy McCaffrey boarded the Disney Wonder cruiseliner. At some point during the trip, a sneaky…

Friday dilemma: can school bullies grow out of it?

Friday dilemma: can school bullies grow out of it?

ClubsNSW is set to introduce a fresh new effort to combat schoolyard intimidation, insisting on a principal’s…

Nosebleed Section

choice ringside rantings

From: They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

Michael S says:

"A teacher at Geelong Grammar had criticised her for using words that were too long, which had left her confused and had made her doubt her ability to write essays. She became ''quite distressed'' when her English marks began to fall." I can sympathise. My scholastic mentors conveyed to me a causal relationship… [read more]

From: Welfare for breeders is a bonus for everyone

Change Up! says:

I have no problem paying my taxes. As a single, childless person on a very decent income, I can afford it and not have my life severely altered. Plus I understand that my taxes paying for things like schools, childcare and infrastructure is ultimately a good thing. A better community is better for me… [read more]

Gentle jabs to the ribs

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

A private school girl’s family is sueing her elite, extremely expensive private school for not… Read more

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