Journalism, as they say, is the first draft of history. This week Julia Gillard defended journalism and history might just reward her as a result.

Labor MP Craig Thomson at the pokies forum earlier this week. Pic: The Daily Telegraph

On Monday, The Daily Telegraph splashed with what can only be modestly described as a ball-tearing yarn about some appalling alleged behaviour by repeat troublemaker Craig Thomson.

Not content with having approved thousands of dollars spent on hookers during his time as a union boss, nor the alleged misuse of union funds during his election campaign, nor even the use of ALP members’ money to pay his lawyers to bail him out, Thomson is accused of blowing up at a female charity worker who happened to be MC’ing a forum on the controversial pokies cap.

This was not, as they say in the spin business, good optics.

Several witnesses corroborated the story and thus it ran. The public interest case of a publicly elected MP abusing a member of the public at a public event debating a vitally important piece of public policy is so overwhelming as to be self-evident.

Yet on the same day that story was on the Telegraph’s front page, the Sydney MP John Murphy reportedly told the federal caucus he was “astounded and amazed” by some of the Tele’s coverage and that the time was “ripe” for an inquiry into the media.

The sentiment appears to correlate with some in the union movement who have suggested that the Tele coverage is part of some kind of hatchet job on Thomson.

This both ignores the fact that – gallingly – it was The Sydney Morning Herald who revealed his first great scandal, and the fact that if there is any hatchet at work on Thomson it’s the one he’s wielding himself.

But perhaps Murphy wasn’t referring to that day’s front page. Perhaps he objected to our coverage of the fearless stand he took in Federal Parliament on that fateful day in history when his wife received an allegedly inadequate portion of beef stroganoff from the parliamentary cafeteria.

(Those who do not remember this event may think that I am making some kind of absurdist joke. Sadly I am not and, even more tragically, neither was John Murphy.)

Murphy was obliged to apologise after the Stroganoff Speech, which was appropriately deemed both an appalling and appallingly humourless waste of the Parliament’s time.

But equally appropriately it has come to be a symbol of the grotesquely self-interested politician, so obsessed with his own trappings that he is blind to the impropriety of his own behaviour and any intelligent perspective on the world around him.

Thomson’s alleged threat that he was going to name the woman in Parliament has all the same hallmarks of this nauseating self-serving self-importance. Perhaps that struck a chord with Murphy on Monday morning.

To Gillard’s great credit she shut down Murphy’s blustering inside the caucus room but was was sadly unable to outside it.

On Tuesday he was again making an idiot of himself and trouble for the Government, when he aligned himself with the full spectrum of Labor’s kookier enemies - namely Bob Katter, Barnaby Joyce and Kevin Andrews - at a rally to oppose gay marriage.

Murphy had previously caused a bit of unwelcome publicity for the ALP over this difficult issue when he point blank said that he opposed gay marriage because the Muslims and Christians in his electorate did. In other words he was worried he would lose his seat over it.

Ironically he also said at the same time that he wanted a conscience vote on the issue, after openly suggesting that it was not his conscience but an electoral redistribution which had made up his own mind.

At the risk of using a term that might make Murphy a little uncomfortable, this is what’s known as “bending over for a pack of cigarettes”.

Murphy’s preoccupation with political popularity makes it even more interesting that in a single news day he managed to come out opposing both gay marriage and The Daily Telegraph.

This was a pretty weird thing for a vote-chasing politician to do. Not everybody who likes The Daily Telegraph also likes gay marriage but pretty much everyone in Sydney likes one or the other.

But notwithstanding Murphy’s touching concern for his own re-electability, the fact of the matter is the Government is falling apart and is doomed to lose the next election.

Indeed, in a rare bit of poetic justice one of the people who sent it on its way to oblivion – Rudd assassin David Feeney – may be a victim of the carnage that act precipitated, as the Victorian branch prepares itself for opposition.*

In fact, of course, the Government should be thinking about what it can do while it is still in power.

Gillard literally has nothing to lose anymore. There is no way she can win the next election and no amount of poll-driven policy making will change that.

But that fate is in a way liberating. The Government is so inescapably destined to lose the next election that it can afford to tear up the playbook and go for broke.

It has a chance now to push through progressive reforms that are deliverable only by a Government that is either in terminal decline or stratospherically popular.

The first and most important of these is the National Disability Insurance Scheme. What better way for a Government to be remembered than by saving the livelihoods of hundreds of thousands of citizens struck down by fate and often living in the most miserable conditions.

But to be effective it must act now and act fast. No referring of the matter to another interminable COAG committee. The Prime Minister for her own sake and the nation’s must show some leadership and steer this through so that the skeleton of the scheme is up and running before the next election – not in a decade’s time.

Another key reform is one that Murphy himself has bumblingly led the PM to. Gay marriage, or a state-sanctioned civil union, is one of those things that the Government could leave as a legacy for at least part of its core support base. Something that in their defeat they can point to and say “Well at least we did this”.

And unlike the carbon tax or the pokies cap this would be something that the party could own as something it did of its own accord, and not at the end of a gun held by the Greens or Andrew Wilkie. It even comes with the two words that stir the heart of even the most conservative right-wing pragmatist: “revenue neutral”.

Yes, Julia Gillard has previously said doesn’t support same-sex marriage, but this is like watching Tony Abbott saying he believes in man-made climate change: The people who he’s really talking to know he doesn’t really believe it.

And anyway – not to put too fine a point on it – she’s changed her mind before.

The news that Penny Wong and her partner are having a baby was the perfect opportunity for Gillard to have a “fireside chat” with the public about how it had made her reconsider her own views; that her friend and colleague’s child ought not to suffer from the discrimination of having unwed or lesser bound parents; that while she remained opposed to using the term “marriage” per se she would move for official “civil union” provisions for same-sex couples.

Not only would many Liberal MPs support such a position in the Parliament, but if it costs her a single vote in the community she hasn’t already lost I will seriously eat the stroganoff myself.
 
Naturally, even while Gillard and her media advisers complain about not being able to get any clear air in the media, this giant oxygen mask went sailing by without them even raising an eyebrow. In fact they even managed to let it become an awkward kind of bad news story for them, given the PM’s obvious discomfort with both the issue and her own stance on it. Lord, there is some severe reverse alchemy happening in that office.

But now she is no longer at war with the media Gillard might just find that if she puts out a brave and genuine agenda it will be given a fair hearing by a press hungry for major policy action that isn’t an election backflip, a reappropriation of Rudd policy or the personal crusade of a wild-eyed Tasmanian.

This could be the circuit-breaker that gives the Government a new front to fight on and shows that Labor still believes in something – anything.

Ironically leaving it to Labor’s National Conference itself shows the opposite of this. It is a proud tradition of the ALP that the resolutions of its supreme policy making body are studiously ignored by the Government of the day. It would set a highly dangerous precedent if the motley collection of union heavies, Bolsheviks and Woodstock pilgrims who technically control the party actually got any genuine say in how it was run.**

Besides, it’s a no win: If Conference votes down gay marriage it will be another reform opportunity missed by a party jumping at shadows. If Conference supports it the party will have effectively left the PM behind on the issue. Either way she is locked out of the history books.

On the other hand, if she crashes through she will win her legacy; and if she goes down fighting on the floor of Parliament she will at least save her soul.

More importantly, however, she will have a chance – as Kerryn Phelps put it this week – to line up on the right side of history. It would be nice if the Gillard Government was remembered for something nobler than MPs who bawl out charity workers or use parliamentary privilege to complain about their lunch.

But key to both reforms is to make sure they are so deeply embedded in legislation they cannot be easily overturned or unpicked by the next hostile Government and that means acting fast and firm – two counter-intuitive concepts for Labor at the moment.

Julia Gillard may be running out of supporters at present but if she makes a few bold moves in the two years she has left she might just find she gets some in the future.

*Yes, you heard correctly. The same state branch that knifed the Prime Minister, lost a seat to the Greens in the federal election and then lost Government in the state election has decided its time to focus on getting booted out of office again in two years’ time. Seriously, if you ever want your house to burn down for insurance purposes just give it to the Victorian ALP and ask them to look after it for you. You’d be better off having a political party run by Mr Bean.

**See above.

 

191 comments

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    • Catching up says:

      07:10am | 18/08/11

      A charity worker or a woman who works for charities and maybe the Liberal Party.

    • C1 says:

      07:34am | 18/08/11

      @catching up,

      Regardless of her political affiliations - she is a woman and not a good look for two men to stand over her and bring her to tears. Call me old fashioned but it shows more the moral fibre of those men (or lack of it) than her choice of political party.
      In politics, perception is everything!

    • Edward says:

      08:00am | 18/08/11

      The fact that she is involved with charities should be commended… who cares what party she aligns herself with?

      She doesn’t deserve the dressing down from a dodgy MP who uses union funds to pay for hookers.

      Thommo is just lucky he is with the ALP, had he been in the Libs under Howard he would have been forced to resign a LONG time ago.

      Never liked Howard, but if any of his MPs stuffed up (at least publicly) then he gave them the chop quickly and decisively. Something that cannot be said about Gillard (and even worse that cancer on society Anna Bligh).

    • John the Zombie says:

      08:16am | 18/08/11

      So catching up you are basically saying that if this person actaully works for the liberal party and not the salvation army (which you are saying she does) it is OK for the MP to abuse her and threaten to use parlimentry priveledge to name and shame her and threaten to make her unemployed?

      Gald to see laborites are happy to allow it to happen and take the high ground.

      Srsly go and have a look at yourself in the mirror if you are happy to defend what he did.

    • Matt says:

      08:17am | 18/08/11

      So its alright to abuse someone who maybe works for the Liberal party?

      You’re all class buddy.

    • MarK says:

      08:31am | 18/08/11

      HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

      I love it.

      It was all a liberal plot. They knew that putting a woman charity worker as MC would MAKE Thomson go off. They KNEW he would go crazy and yell so closely in face that SPITTLE would fly and hot the undercover agent.

      This is awesome.

      LAWL

    • marley says:

      08:33am | 18/08/11

      So are you saying it’s okay to abuse someone if their opinions differ from yours?

    • nihonin says:

      08:39am | 18/08/11

      Catching up, so due to the fact she ‘maybe’ does work for the Liberal Party, it’s all good for a politician in government to abuse and threaten her.  Yay for union negotiation skills.

    • dovif says:

      09:37am | 18/08/11

      Since most of Australia (48-50%) supports the Liberals, it is ok to abuse everyone on the street, since most of them are likely to be Liberal Supporters

      What does Andrew Murphy Craig Thomson and Belinda Neal have in common? They are the cream of the ALP

    • Knemon says:

      09:56am | 18/08/11

      @ Edward - “Thommo is just lucky he is with the ALP, had he been in the Libs under Howard he would have been forced to resign a LONG time ago”

      Give it a break Edward…Peter Reith did far worse and John Howard couldn’t see a problem, he stood by Reith until the end. They’re all as bad as each other, doesn’t matter what side of the fence they sit.

      BTW - Great article Joe, one of your better efforts.

    • Max Redlands says:

      10:46am | 18/08/11

      @ dovif “They are the cream of the ALP”

      Remember,as HST put it (with a nod to Hemmingway), “The Scum Also Rises”

    • stan darsh says:

      11:18am | 18/08/11

      agree with edward - little johnny wouldn’t have tolerated this kind of scandal. thomson would have been forced to resign.

      gillard is as weak as piss.

    • JP says:

      11:35am | 18/08/11

      stan darsh - before Reithy, or after?

      I agree wholeheartedly that when he came in, he’d get rid of the riff-raff. Once it started risking his prime ministership - no way.

      I’ve been told by members of all four parties represented in the HoR that you can only fire that gun so many times before the perception is that the party is full of crooks - ironically, not firing that gun lets the media and public forget about it after a while; firing it leaves a bitter politician or five who will constantly remind the public and media.

    • ZSRenn says:

      11:39am | 18/08/11

      @ Catching up “Meow”

    • Ando says:

      11:42am | 18/08/11

      Edward,
      The fact that she is a charity worker is not being commended , it is being used to sensationalise the story. The fact that she works for charities is irrelevant. How are his actions worse based on the charity record of the victim. I’m sick of hearing that she was a charity worker.

    • jf says:

      11:43am | 18/08/11

      Knemon says:09:56am | 18/08/11

      “Give it a break Edward…Peter Reith did far worse and John Howard ouldn’t see a problem”

      Both used funds inappropriately. One All.

      Reith never violently abused anyone let alone a charity worker. Two One to Thomson.

      Reith never used his position to threaten the career of someone that didn’t agree with him. Three One to Thomson.

      Reith never used public money to fund a private legal action. Four One to Thomson.

      And these are the things that are fact.

      Let’s wait until we find out if he did use a sham organisation to raise funds for his election campaign.

      Let’s find out if he did attempt to blackmail a council Mayor.

      So, your right, Reith’s actions were ordinary and he probably deserved greater censor by Howard. However, given that Howard typically did not shy away from disciplining poor behaviour perhaps there is more to this than we know.

      So far as Thomson is concerned, he may well end up facing criminal charges. There appears to be enough to justify charges just for embezzling public money to get a root.

      If the unproven allegations have any substance then if he isn’t charged something is deeply wrong.

      Reith certainly did the wrong thing but if you think his transgression is worse than this scumbags then there is something wrong with your moral radar.

    • Frank says:

      12:49pm | 18/08/11

      Having watched the Pokies Forum that Peter Garrett attended I see how Thompson was badgered into the “berating’ looking at Peter Garretts face as person after person sprayed nothing but hate and anger at him for the Pokies Legislation was sad to see, it is clear that these events are put together by opponents of a view and the “special guest MPs” from the Government are put in the Gladiators cage to be ripped apart by the crowds is just wrong..if you are trying to have a community based forum both sides must be respected regardless (free speech remember) I have no doubt that Thompson was pushed into a corner and lashed out regardless of whether the woman was from the Liberal Party or the Salvation Army she has no right to back someone into the corner of an impossible situation…ask Tony Abbott if he’d like to go to a GetUp meeting and you’ll get the same thing happening

    • Tim says:

      12:55pm | 18/08/11

      jf,
      when did Thompson use public funds to defend himself?
      Perhaps you’re confusing Labor party funds?

    • jf says:

      01:24pm | 18/08/11

      Tim says:12:55pm | 18/08/11

      “when did Thompson use public funds to defend himself? Perhaps you’re confusing Labor party funds?”

      Fair pick up Tim. However, I did use the term quite deliberately. Whilst not strictly public funds, the major political parties are essentially public organisations and so I think that it is relevant to distinguish between that and private funds.

      Either way, he was using other people’s money for personal use and that was the point I was trying to make.

    • MarK says:

      02:13pm | 18/08/11

      For the love of God Frank this wasn’t an ambush.

      Thomson went to an ANTI-pokie tax event to spruik the virtues of the government as the fall guy.

      Just like Garrett they send the useless and the sacrificial to take the brunt of bad news. Notice how quickly Gillard retreated to the Press Club after being out in public for a day or 2?

      The big guns don’t go to these things and having had the benefit of Garretts experience he knew EXACTLY what he was in for.

      In my mind his reaction is far worse because of it.

      These are not precious snowflakes, they are politicians. These are the people that govern. A dummy spit at someone with the opposite view to yours is not appropriate. A spittle filled tirade from an ex-union heavie threatening to embarrass and get sacked a woman is worse.

      What a wank. Big bad Craig gets talked at mean and loses his temper. And you symapthise. It is laughable.

      This guy is yet another liar on this failed government list. It is apologist like you that keep me amused though. Dial a few hookers, threaten a few jobs, threaten local council with withheld services, start dodgy leagl proceedings, take kickbacks from the party members to stay solvent, use Union funds to campaign.

      All in a Labor pollies afternoons work.

      What a disgusting piece of work. And this thing has the full support of Gillard. It figures given her own level of standards and disgraces she tarnishes the office of PM with.

    • Knemon says:

      02:13pm | 18/08/11

      @ jf - As I said, they’re all as bad as each other. I haven’t defended Thomson, I was replying to Edward’s claim that Howard would not have put up with this rubbish, when that clearly wasn’t true; it’s just more double standards from the conservative side of politics.

      Reith was trying to rort the Australian tax-payer through his tele-card and his wife’s travel expenses…Thomson has allegedly misused union funds. One of them was blatantly ripping of all tax-payers (public money) the other is supposedly misusing his unions members funds (private funds). Plus the ALP can spend ALP money how they choose; they don’t need permission from the LNP for such.

      I’ll worry about my morals you get back to your desperate attempt at muck-raking.

    • TimB says:

      02:33pm | 18/08/11

      “ask Tony Abbott if he’d like to go to a GetUp meeting and you’ll get the same thing happening “

      Only if Tony is stupid enough to go to a GetUp meeting.

    • TimB says:

      03:14pm | 18/08/11

      Not defending him Knemon? Does the phrase ‘storm in a teacup’ ring any bells from yesterday?

      He’s facing potential fraud charges. Fraud with a capital F. From deliberate dodgy behaviour. The sort of thing that could trigger a by-election.

      Contrast Reith’s actions. Whilst I don’t condone what he did, he clearly never intended for that phone bill to be racked up. The number was given to his son to use for a specific purpose, but ended up being misued in a way he never intended.
      And whilst we all frown on taxpayer perks being rorted in this way, It’s not all that different from the pollies who clock up thousands on ‘fact-finding’ missions in overseas holiday destinations.

      It’s a slap in the face to the taxpayer, but it’s not classed as criminal. The allegations Thompson faces *are* criminal. That’s the difference.

    • acotrel says:

      03:38pm | 18/08/11

      @Joe
      ‘Gillard literally has nothing to lose anymore. There is no way she can win the next election and no amount of poll-driven policy making will change that’

      After the nexr election Gillard will lead a governing party which is made up of more than half, by independents.  It’s what is known as the ‘Abbott effect’ !

    • jf says:

      04:00pm | 18/08/11

      Knemon says:02:13pm | 18/08/11

      And I haven’t defended Reith. However, neither Reith nor Howard are any longer in parliament let alone government. Gillard is the prime minister and Thomson is an elected member of parliament.

      “I’ll worry about my morals you get back to your desperate attempt at muck-raking.”

      No need for desperation mate. Thomson has served it up on a silver platter.

      You, on the other hand, seem desperately keen to understate and trivialise what Thomson has done.

    • jf says:

      01:55pm | 20/08/11

      Donny says:04:44pm | 19/08/11

      “Well it appears that at least one Political Party will clean house when necessary”

      This guys makes one fairly off-colour comment about a political opponent and he is expelled from the party - rough justice.

      Thomson steals union funds (workers wages), lies about what the money was spent on and who spent it (in the process revealing another inappropriate juse of union money), lies about his court case, uses ALP money (ALP member’s savings) to fight a personal legal case, lies about that, attempts to cover it up, abuses his public position to threaten a political opponent and is told by his party leader that he is doing a great job.

      And that is just the stuff that is fact. What about the accusations of embezzling money meant for other uses and blackmailing public officials. What about the possibility for tax fraud (FBT on hookers).

      Yep, he’s doing a great job.

    • Donny says:

      07:35pm | 20/08/11

      @ jf - I suppose I should have expanded that post properly. (In too much of a rush to head out ) I was attempting to point out that if the Libs got rid of that bloke for what basically was a stupid mistake, surely the Labor Party should be taking major action on Thomson.

    • Kipling says:

      07:17am | 18/08/11

      Obviously then, it would be an excellent time to stop live meat exports.

      That is hopefully up for discussion today in parliament. Not that anyone who accesses main stream media for the majority of their information would know.
      What better legacy to leave behind than making changes that better protect poor defensless animals and ensuring that when slaughtered their suffering is, at the very least, minimised.
      Oh, and yes the media is still doing a pretty grubby hatchet job, which is somewhat ironic, given it would appear that labour does not require the cynical assistance of you lot to self destruct….

    • Graham says:

      08:00am | 18/08/11

      For all you ‘animal welfare people’ what are you doing or saying on - the homeless in australia, suicide in the bush, the plight of carers, disabled, and other minorities.
      It is an animal for God sake, not a human.  Sure treat them humanly but stop being so bl..dy hypocritical.

    • Sarah says:

      09:03am | 18/08/11

      Graham - you’re too right. Animal rights are a good thing and help corral in those who would willingly mistreat animals otherwise - but never should animal rights come first over the needs of the human race.

    • John the Zombie says:

      09:46am | 18/08/11

      Before this govt goes and implements the ban please could they make sure that they have a fall back in that negotiations should be done now with the countries that we do live trade with to send them meat that is slaughtered in Asutralia. Also the govt then should fund the setting up new slaughter houses in the regions were the trade off beef is done for specific cattle export cattle. Remember the cattle that are bred in northern Australia are bred for export not for Asutralian consumption.

    • Disgusted says:

      09:59am | 18/08/11

      Yes Kipling, the animal huggers love the animals so much they will pay to have them tortured for better viewing to lie about their cause.

    • Warren says:

      10:07am | 18/08/11

      @Graham @Sarah. Ensuring animals are treated humanly does not mean people will suffer in any way. Its not a case of either/or. At worst your mac burger might be 2 cents more expensive.

    • Sarah says:

      10:59am | 18/08/11

      Warren - you are missing the point. I couldn’t care less if food cost a little more in order for animals to be treated more humanely. I would gladly pay more to know that animals are treated as kindly as possible and that the farmers and other people at the end of the line who do all the hard work are being fairly recompensed. But the extra 2 cents, as you put it - goes straight into the pockets of profit of giants such as McDonalds, not Farmer Joe.

      Secondly - you have entirely missed the point on Graham’s comment - and my agreement with his comment.

      We are saying - kindness to the animals we eat is one thing - and no-one with a sane head on their shoulders enjoys animal cruelty - but there is so much exposure right now about the animals’ right to a kind death - what Graham is saying is “why are we focusing on a bunch of cows - when we have homeless, people with disabilities, the carers that look after them, suiciding farmers etc etc”.

      Paying a few cents extra for a hamburger is not the point. Making sure that a cow has a nice kind end so that we can all feel good about ourselves is not the point.

      The point is - why are we worrying about a cow when we should be worrying about the fellow citizens and humans in our country who are suffering needlessly. Why should their suffering come second to a cow?

      Our priorities are skewed - and that is what Graham has pointed out and I wholeheartedly agree with him.

    • Will says:

      11:06am | 18/08/11

      Sorry Graham, that argument just doesn’t stack up. What makes you think that someone can’t be simultaneously passionate about animal rights and all the causes you mention. It is not a case of one or the other. Stopping the hideous treatment of animals is not mutually exclusive with improving outcomes for the homeless or any of the other noble causes you mention.

    • Will says:

      11:16am | 18/08/11

      Hey Disgusted. How naïve can you be? The suggestion that Animals Australia paid for animals to be mistreated was completely baseless and would never have been raised had Chris back not been protected by parliamentary privilege. He would never have dared to make this accusation outside of parliament (or a parliamentary inquiry) as he knew that he had no evidence whatsoever and would have been sued. The fact that idiots like you just lap up such bullshit is a perfect example of how the Libs like to appeal to the lowest common denominator, gullible morons like you.

    • FINK says:

      11:36am | 18/08/11

      Just create a slaughter tax! oh wait! Our current taxation system is there to slaughter us!
      Screw the animals, whether they die at the end of a blade, or of a heart attack in the bush or by a pack of wild dogs the result is the same “PAIN”.
      How about the politicians do something useful like fix the medical / hospital system oh they can’t because the majority want it fixed.

    • Warren says:

      11:45am | 18/08/11

      @Sarah. You missed the point again. Will at 11:06am puts the argument well.

    • marley says:

      12:20pm | 18/08/11

      @Warren - it’s not as simple as saying our Mac burgers will be 2 cents more expensive.  We don’t eat the cattle coming out of the Kimberley and like places.  What no live export of cattle means is that no beef gets to Indonesia from Australia - and that will raise prices for the average Indonesia by a lot more than a couple of cents.

    • ZSRenn says:

      12:26pm | 18/08/11

      Yeh! Yeh! Good idea. Let’s cut the food supply off to 200,000,000 people with an army the size of our population.
      Sounds great!
      The next boats to arrive wont contain refugees.
      Wow two birds with one stone. Good Job!

    • Beng says:

      12:38pm | 18/08/11

      Will and Warren - you’re both missing the point. The world has scarce resources (time, money etc) and as such we have to choose how we spend those resources maximise their value. All the time, effort and money people put into animal cruelty could instead be spent on time, effort and money that is put into dealing with human issues.

      Personally I’ve considered donating to animal rights causes before but could never bring myself to do it and end up donating to charities that deal with human issues instead.

    • Disgusted says:

      01:34pm | 18/08/11

      Will, you depth of ignorance is astounding, let alone the anti Lib bial. It is well known that these groups will create situations (or enhance them) to suit their aims. Much like the PETA group that has caused the death of thousands of dogs. At on breed show in America they performed a raid and released the dogs from their cages and chased them out of the show area to “be free”. The problem was the dogs were funnelled straight onto a busy highway. Then you have the tree spikers that result in badly injures to legal forest cutters. Then you can go to the Sea Shepard (pirates) that have repeatedly tried to sink whale ships with ramming devices attached to their ships, then to gain sympathy they deliberately put one of their boats under the bow of the whaling ship. It was obvious in the footage that the boat was repositioned at the last minute to be sunk as opposed to getting out of the way. Thus Will you can delude yourself if you want or see the darker side of these groups for what they are.

    • Will says:

      02:08pm | 18/08/11

      Disgusted, Nothing in the your rant changes the fact that you are full of shit. If you or Senator Back have any evidence whatsoever that Animals Australia payed the Indonesians to torture cattle then bring it on. You don’t so you won’t. Why do you think the allegations weren’t raised outside of the senate inquiry? Because there was absolutely no suggestion that there was any truth in what he was saying and he knew that if he made the comments in public, he would be sued for defamation and would lose. For the record, I don’t support the lunatics who you say released dogs onto a freeway or any of the other “extreme” activists but they have nothing to do with Animals Australia. Therefore, I stand by my original comment. You are a gullible moron.
      P.S. If you’re going to go on a rant calling someone ignorant, it might be a good idea to use some sort of spelling and grammar checker.

    • Disgusted says:

      03:23pm | 18/08/11

      Na will. Only bother to double check spelling and gramma if the person is worthy of respect. These groups have a long history and if you need to believe their denials, good for you. Just remember to look in the mirror before you use the word gullible.

    • Will says:

      04:25pm | 18/08/11

      Disgusted. While I am deeply hurt and upset that I am not worthy of your respect, I must refer you to your original comment. You said that Animals Australia payed to have cattle “tortured for better viewing to lie about their cause”.

      Now come one mate, enough huffing and puffing. Just give me some evidence, any evidence. You said it, so back it up.

      I never mentioned anything about all these evil animal activists group that exist (in your head) to torture and murder animals so you can leave all of that aside for a minute. Just stay focused.

      You said Animals Australia payed Indonesian workers to torture animals so please provide some evidence. Take as long as you need and don’t waste time checking spelling or grammar (after all, I am not worthy).

      For the record, I wouldn’t normally waste my time responding to such bile (note the spelling) but I think it is important to set the record straight on this one. Senator Back knew that his allegations were unfounded and would officially go nowhere but hoped that a lot of dopey bastards would not bother to look into it any further and would be Disgusted.

      Don’t worry, you are not the first.

    • Kipling says:

      11:17am | 19/08/11

      Jeepers, it was a hypothetical comment. Let’s face it, no Australian federal government is actually up to achieving stuff.
      That said:
      @ Graham, Firstly I say plenty about your other issues, I try to do it in appropriate forums, thanks for your in put. Secondly, mate, it might shock you the realisation that Human’s are also “only animals”. By all means feel free to make homelessness, suicide in the bush, the plight of carers, disable and other minorities your personal barrow to push. Consider making some room there also for adolescent mental health, youth homelessness, family breakdown, workers rights…. The list just goes on really. Clearly no room for humans to be humane with defensless animals in that case….
      @ Sarah, that is in your human opinion…. Rights are merely a human construct and, if animal rights are not to be at the very least of equal standing then animals should not be subject to human consequences. Killing an animal for doing what it does naturally after all is something human’s leap to in order to satiate our desire for revenge, no more no less. Only humans think we are the most important species. It was pointed out that animals give us scant regard, unless we are on their menu of course. That is human arrogance at play.
      @ Disgusted, yeah right good one.

    • Super D says:

      07:21am | 18/08/11

      “But key to both reforms is to make sure they are so deeply embedded in legislation they cannot be easily overturned or unpicked by the next hostile Government”

      I find this comment totally repugnant and an affront to representative democracy.

      The whole idea that a government can introduce policy to bind future governments is outrageous.  It’s not just the opposing political party you are locking in, you are constraining the ability of the Australian people to express themselves through the ballot box.

      To argue that this is ok is to argue that any future government could, without consent of the Australian people, reintroduce the death penalty and start the executions before facing an election.  How would that be for an unpickable reform?

      I am finding the authoritarian nature of the “progressive” left quite astounding.

    • Max Redlands says:

      08:17am | 18/08/11

      “The whole idea that a government can introduce policy to bind future governments is outrageous.”

      Not only outrageous but also not “doable”.

      The only thing restricting any Federal Government’s power to make laws is the Constitution and any provisions in legislation saying it (the legislation) can-not be revoked or amended in future are unConstitutuional and can be struck out for that reason.

      That aside I enjoyed this piece as I do most of Joe’s.

    • Junie says:

      08:28am | 18/08/11

      Well said. 
      Where, currently,  is the democratic process in operation for the voters? 
      I’m for gay marriage and some other reforms that are currently on the table- but feel totally gagged and treated like an idiot by this “for the greater good of the unwashed masses”  attitude towards the voters by this mish-mash, arrogant government.
      Problems is, look at the alternative….is this the best we’ve got? Really?

    • Max Redlands says:

      09:06am | 18/08/11

      Just to correct myself. The Constitution doesn’t limit the Federal Government’s power to make laws just the oppposite. It empowers the Government to make laws about certain things (see s.52).

      That said; legislation purporting to bind future Governments would not stand the test of a High Court challenge.

    • Mouse says:

      10:45am | 18/08/11

      The thing I find unbelievable is that gillard wants the carbon tax,  so deeply embedded it will cost so much time and a fortune to get rid of it, when she knows that the majority of Australians don’t want it in the first place. The economists, whose opinions she so highly regards, are also saying that now is not the time to be implementing this tax due to global economic uncertainty.  Why on earth would she be so hell bent on pushing this through now? If she wants to have any sort of favourable rememberance surely enforcing a carbon tax on an unwilling populace is not the way to go!

    • Pudel says:

      10:53am | 18/08/11

      I think the author meant a change like Gay marriage, or Civil unions for Gay couples.  If this was introduced there is a strong possibility society would come to support it.  With societal support it would be difficult to change the legislation.

    • Frank says:

      12:57pm | 18/08/11

      well Howard changed the Marriage Act so that it made it impossible for future Governments to allow Same Sex Marriage why do you all of a sudden believe that a Labor Government is the only one to do this?

      Was WorkChoices a great example of representative democracy? No when Gillard cremated and buried it for Tony it was. It is hilarious how short the public’s memory is.

      And how did this thread go from a story about Pokies Legislation to Animal rights? seems strange that someone to stretch the bow that far for such differing issues

    • Interloper says:

      02:24pm | 18/08/11

      I think the point is that such legislation could only be overturned by a majority in both houses ... and it seems unlikely that the conservatives will obtain a majority in the Senate in the forseeable future.
      The nature of proportional representation is that you need actual majority support, not just a plurality.

    • Retired Soldier says:

      07:31am | 18/08/11

      Catching up says: And your point is what exactly ? Does your contention make everything this “coat hanger” did on the day or during his union life, all good ? This is another cover up designed to keep PM Brown and DPM Gillard in power for as long as possible. A government who hides behind ‘smoke and mirrors’ is not what this country deserves regardless of the large numbers of uniformed and confused voters. The mob at the top should have woken up to the fact the most of the people who put them there are now able to actually see through the smoke and mirrors and just might be prepared to end the side show.

    • Old Sailor says:

      09:13am | 18/08/11

      I agree with you wholeheartedly, unfortunately in this day and age, not many people are able to think for themselves, admittedly we might have been told by our superior officers that we were not paid to think but to do what we were told to do, but the basis of our thinking was thaqt we loved Australia and wanted to protect the standard of living for future Australians, when I see the representatives that we have looking after the future of our country, I often wonder where we went wrong, and what would we do with all of the aliens who now live amongst us, they are out of their minds and living in outer space, thereis too much weed among the grass that they are smoking.

    • Dr Jack says:

      08:10am | 18/08/11

      “.....so Labor wins the jack-pot…..”  And as the Qantas boss might say:  “Tanks Tommo.”

    • TomTom says:

      08:25am | 18/08/11

      Yes Gillard, ‘gay marriage’ is the way to go. A legacy left behind for our first infamous female PM. I could never understand why someone who doesn’t believe in God and marriage doesn’t fight for the change of the marriage laws, in one of the oldest institution. ‘Gay marriage’ could be a Gillard thing. Mining tax belongs to Rudd, carbon tax belongs to Bob Brown, Pokies belongs to Wilkie, NBN belongs to Windsor, mental health belongs to the coalition, asylum seekers is a mess and should be ditched because it is inhumane - need I go on.

      Craig Thomson - something horrible that will be added to the Gillard legacy!

    • John the Zombie says:

      08:48am | 18/08/11

      TomTom she does, she is a not practicing one. This came out not to long ago when Gillard was trying to win the vote of the Christian lobby and someone pointed out that she was an athiest. Quick as flash Gordon her PR team sent the message out no,no,no she is not an athiest just a no practising Christiab or some religion.

    • Against the Man says:

      11:43am | 18/08/11

      Gillard is full of shit! She doesn’t care anymore, she has sealed the deal for her lifetime pension so she doesn’t give a stuff about anything.

    • John A Neve says:

      01:01pm | 18/08/11

      AtM,
      It seems you and Julia have a lot in common, you are full of it.
      Tell us, do you go red in the face?

    • stevem says:

      01:27pm | 18/08/11

      There is a very good reason they do not support gay marriage. The vast majority will answer a poll indicating they support of gay marriage, but don’t care enough to make it swing their vote one way or another.

      There are only a small number who care passionately enough about the issue to make it change their vote. Of these, the ones that want gay marriage tend to believe the Liberals are homophobic and wouldn’t vote for them anyway - so no votes there. The ones that are vehemently anti gay marriage tend to be more split between parties and may change votes to the less “godless” party.

      In short there are no votes to be won supporting gay marriage but there ARE votes to be lost.

    • Against the Man says:

      07:11pm | 18/08/11

      Oh John, guess your attacks must be because I keep hitting that raw ALP nerve huh?

      Funny, you defend Gillard but back up why she is just so good?

      Ouch!

      Hey how is the Malaysian No-Solution going? Oh and is Gillard still the zero policy success queen? smile

    • John A Neve says:

      08:39pm | 18/08/11

      AtM,
      Try answering the question, do you go red in the face?
      Or do you just bloat?

    • Brian Taylor says:

      08:26am | 18/08/11

      no amount od spin by left wing so called reporters of people writing this sort of reports will help Gillard and co.
      shes history and no matter what she trys to do, it can and WILL be undone at some time.
      I could give a rat’s arse if gay people married, why shouldn’t they be as unhappy in marriage as the rest of us have been from time to time lol

    • MarkS says:

      08:34am | 18/08/11

      “grotesquely self-interested politician”
      and he is somehow different from the rest of the breed?

    • Mahhrat says:

      09:38am | 18/08/11

      That was my thought too, but I liked the article nonetheless.

    • dovif says:

      08:39am | 18/08/11

      This from a party that also supplied us with Mrs Belinda “Do you know who I am” Neal.

      I think it was a Labor steward who said the ALP used to be the cream of the working class, they are now the drags of the middle class.

      The ALP stands for nothing now, they just stand for staying in power. Their only weapon is bullying tactics. That is why it is in decline everywhere in Australia

      Bob Brown might just be right, the way the ALP is going, the Greens will be the 2nd force in poltics by the time he retires

    • Tator says:

      06:37pm | 18/08/11

      Dovif,
      It was Kim Beasley Snr who said that

    • Gregg says:

      08:49am | 18/08/11

      I’m backflippingly bemused by your second sentence Joe.
      ” This week Julia Gillard defended journalism and history might just reward her as a result. “

      Was it not just a couple of weeks ago that she was supporting an enquiry into the media at the behest of Bobby?
      And is there not something still being pushed on that?

      I’d reckon Gillard’s defence of anything is only ever driven by what’s in it for her maintaining position.

    • Tubesteak says:

      09:00am | 18/08/11

      Why would being named in Parliament for not giving a pollie’s wife a big serving of beef stroganoff be a bad thing?

      You’d probably get elected PM on that basis alone

      .......................oh wait….....now I see why it would be a bad thing

      The people get the government they deserve

    • adam says:

      10:04am | 18/08/11

      That, sadly, is entirely accurate Tubesteak

    • Anna C says:

      09:02am | 18/08/11

      First of all I think Craig Thomson is a disgrace for a politician and that is saying something.

      Secondly I can’t believe Joe seriously thinks that our current crop of politicians are capable of putting aside their own self-interest even for a second to do anything worthwhile for this country such as introducing the National Disability Insurance Scheme. Everyone knows that both major parties have only agreed to support the National Disability Insurance Scheme because it won’t come into effect for another 7 years.  Call me cynical but who knows if we will all still around in 7 years time and not been wiped out by some rogue asteroid. This is just ridiculous. Why should disabled people and their families have to wait almost a decade for assistance?  If the Gillard Government was serious about this scheme then they would not be dawdling.  This is one new tax that I would gladly support. I can’t say the same about Carbon tax.

    • marley says:

      09:52am | 18/08/11

      I think Joe’s article might be termed the triumph of hope over experience.

    • dovif says:

      11:27am | 18/08/11

      I think like most ALP policies.

      The ALP thinks that would be a nice thing to do. Then they runs it through treasury.

      Treasury tells them, with all your waste and mismanagement, we cannot afford it. So the ALP see if there are votes on it.

      Since they think there are votes for introducing it. They run it through parliament and set the start date on a future day, where there is no chance they would be still governing.

      Therefore they get the glory and do not have to management the budget and paying for their waste

      It is classic ALP

    • MadKat of Melbourne says:

      11:31am | 18/08/11

      Anna C - best line of the day - “First of all I think Craig Thomson is a disgrace for a politician and that is saying something.” Sadly, too true.

    • Bris Jack says:

      09:06am | 18/08/11

      Imagine the headlines, shock jock helps bring down Gillard Gov.
      True karma and music to my ears.

    • Old Max says:

      09:31am | 18/08/11

      Without doubt this is the worst government Australia has had

    • Michael N says:

      09:56am | 18/08/11

      Agreed. Unfortunately, while the coalition are potentially the most successful opposition we have ever had, Abbott is not a viable ‘Alternate PM’. Replace him and there’s hope for the country but as it stands, next election will simply see us out of the frying pan and into the fire.

    • John the Zombie says:

      10:36am | 18/08/11

      Not a fan of Abbott as I do prefer Hockey I can say this he is alot better then the option we have right now in the form of Gillard. Pls note I use Gillard not Juliar as it has been complained about by the Labor party that ppl are not giving her the respect.

    • Ben says:

      11:05am | 18/08/11

      Problem I have with your stance John is that I believe that “courtesy is give, respect is earned”. Given what Gillard has done while in power and what she has done with and too Rudd, it is impossible to have any respect for this backstabbing liar. Thus she is only entitled to the minimum required courtesy.

    • dovif says:

      11:15am | 18/08/11

      John

      It is because she lied that she does not get any respect. It seem to be the eggs and chicken story, how do you earn any respect, when there is nothing to respect.

    • Pope Is Dope says:

      11:44am | 18/08/11

      A politician lying, now that’s a first.  Throw the children overboard.

    • Frank says:

      01:39pm | 18/08/11

      John are you serious they call him Sloppy Joe for a reason not only cos of his Shrek like appearance.

    • Sid says:

      01:39pm | 18/08/11

      But Dop, there are photos that show the children being held over the side ot the boat, ie intent, and they sunk there own boat, thus putting the children in the water. Your attack is pathetic.

    • John the Zombie says:

      02:54pm | 18/08/11

      I loved him onj sunrise and also I still cant get over that Paris Hilton line.

    • AdamC says:

      09:33am | 18/08/11

      I genuinely don’t understand how the ALP has developed this internal candidate selection mechanism that appears to ensure their back benches are stacked with the absolute dregs of the Labor movement. Thomsongate, as well as (yet again) demonstrating the Gillard government’s anaphylactic allergy to any notions of integrity or good governance principles, also highlights the self-destructive weakness in Labor’s preselection model.

      Indeed, why should incompetents and corrupts like Craig Thomson receive these taxpayer-funded sinecures anyway? It’s not like he would add anything to government policy or decision-making, even in this serial failure of an administration. For these Labor chair-moisteners, being an MP is a taxpayer funded ego trip (to paraphrase Yes, Minister). Gallingly, the most egregious personal conduct doesn’t even get the man booted off the gravy train. What a disgrace.

    • Anna C says:

      10:35am | 18/08/11

      Your right AdamC. The Labor Party has become a party full of emotionally bankrupt people; as well as financially bankrupt people like in Craig Thomson’s case.

    • Mouse says:

      11:09am | 18/08/11

      AdamC,  I mean to say, he didn’t actually hit the woman so why the big fuss!  He is holding a Labor seat so is an important part of the current government and totally deserving of gillard’s given full and unquestionable support.  These jobs may not be around for much longer, so better to make hay while the sun shines don’t you think!
      (Disclaimer - all words written above are dripping with sarcasm)

    • Hamish says:

      11:09am | 18/08/11

      It’s instructive that even Persephone’s comments below don’t inlude a defence of Thomson as even her blinding bias can’t hide his utter uselessness and abject unsuitability for public office. She does make quite a humourous defence of the Victorian ALP though who seem to be even more lost in opposition than they were in government. Just without the complacent arrogance.

    • AdamC says:

      12:50pm | 18/08/11

      I agree, Hamish and others. This Thomson dude is the candidate you would have to scrape right though the bottom of the barrel to find. It is a complete indictment that he was ever preselected in the first place and an utter outrage that he is still an MP!

    • GreatIdeasAreOutThere says:

      09:38am | 18/08/11

      So I am hearing on the Punch we should introduce gay marriage because:

      (1) 75% of Australians believe it is inevitable.
      AND
      (2) It would be the one “positive” thing that Julia Gillard could put on her resume.

    • Greg says:

      09:55am | 18/08/11

      Hmm and 100% of Australians believe death is inevitable, but I am certain that that cannot be taken as support for death. Only a morally corrupt person can take that next step (your turn gays and anarchists) and suggest death or gay marriage would be a good thing. Political death however would be a great thing for Gillard. Hold on, she already is but like “weekend at Barnies”, Bob Brown won’t stop using the carcas to maintain power.

    • Bill says:

      10:11am | 18/08/11

      Gay marriage? Next, they’ll want Bert and Ernie to get gay married and to make Spiderman a homosexual Black/ Latino hybrid. Oh wait….that’s already happening.

      I wonder what it’s in store for The Smurfs!

    • Rose says:

      11:29am | 18/08/11

      I will most definitely suggest that both death and gay marriage are good things!! Despite the emotional devastation of losing some one you love, death helps the world go round. Nobody dies? How long before the world is completely incapable of supporting it’s inhabitants? I would suggest not long at all. When affected personally by death it may be traumatic, but it is necessary and unavoidable. Looking at it logically it is obvious that it is the appropriate mechanism for the continuation of all species. As for gay marriage, I can’t see a downside (and I was raised Catholic and am straight). It means that gay couples can enjoy the same rights as everybody else and it strengthens marriage as a whole. I have been married happily for over 20 years and I would hate to deprive someone of the same stability, legitimacy and joy that I have enjoyed, particularly on the basis of sexuality. I have never heard a sensible reason for not allowing same sex marriage,all I ever hear are arguments based on personal prejudice, religious intolerance (although most Catholics I know support same sex marriage)and ignorance.
      I fail to see how this makes me morally corrupt, I would argue that the term belongs to people who refuse to countenance another possibility,the possibility that rigid adherence to any moral position without looking at the way it disadvantages and discriminates against others is in fact morally corrupt!

    • FINK says:

      12:54pm | 18/08/11

      Rose,
      So what your saying is that your relationship with your partner had no chance of survival without being “married”. Well then I hope your partner enjoys living the lie that you have deluded yourself with for the past 20 years. I find it interesting that you think that the bonds of a relationship can only survive by the fact of a law and tradition. If your reasoning was correct then there would be no need for divorce. If anything your reasoning is prejudice against de facto and non married hetero couples.

    • Greg says:

      01:21pm | 18/08/11

      Rose, to put it simply for you, to take a servey that shows people expect an event to occur and then to apply the assumption that people are therefore in agreance with the event is a blatent lie that only a morally corrupt persion will use that as an argument to support the event. As to the comment abouty effects on minority groups, the gays have an option that will provide equality, it is civil union, but yet again they expect that everything has to change to meet their idiology. Next thing we will have them demand legislated proportional representational in parliment, and for the religiouls community, for the Vergin Mary to be replaced by a fag.

    • ausspud says:

      01:49pm | 18/08/11

      there is a huge difference between what people say & what people think. If you put it to a public vote i think it will fail dismally.

    • Rose says:

      03:27pm | 18/08/11

      Greg, how does a civil union equal equality? So long as they are excluded from getting married they are not considered equal in the eyes of the law, this is wrong. Gay marriage is inevitable and more and more people accept that. Maybe it is time to get people to answer the question as to whether they think it’s also right and fair to allow gay marriage. I’m extremely confident that both you and ausspud would get the shock of your lives, because I think most people are supportive of gay marriage.
      As for Fink, your contribution is a joke right? I never said anything about needing marriage for my relationship to survive, that’s your own interpretation. What I am saying is that we had the opportunity to get married and that opportunity should be available to everyone, gay and straight. That having enjoyed being married for over 20 years I don’t feel it’s right to stop other people enjoying the same right as us to be married if they choose. You come across as someone who was once married but who’s spouse wised up and left you, that’s your problem, not mine!
      By the way Greg, you’re using a computer, they come with spellcheck, you should use it!

    • Al says:

      04:02pm | 18/08/11

      Bill - I’ve always wondered about the smurfs.
      Are there a lot of gay smurfs or is smurfete MASSIVELY popular for reasons I don’t need to explain?

    • FINK says:

      04:11pm | 18/08/11

      Rose
      “It means that gay couples can enjoy the same rights as everybody else and it strengthens marriage as a whole. I have been married happily for over 20 years and I would hate to deprive someone of the same stability, legitimacy and joy that I have enjoyed”
      Please re read the quote above before you consider calling out Joke!
      So because you sign a certificate on a day and go for your first bonk that night by your words the relationship is “strengthened”, “stable”,“legitimate”,“joy”. So a hetero couple who are not married are illegitimate,not strong, not stable are joyless are being deprived of what you have? interesting self value you place on yourself. Please also enlighten me as I am not conversant on gay laws what rights do they miss out on? what they miss out on some sort of middle class welfare? What the courts can’t legislate who the “Mother” of any child is in the case of divorce as there is not statute to determine the motherhood and who gets royally screwed? Nope more important things to worry about for the majority than to cater to whims of this self important minority!
      You actually come across as a closet lesbian and this is your way of justifying your fantasies about the dyke down the road. I pity the fool that has put up with you for 20 years!

    • Rose says:

      04:46pm | 18/08/11

      Yep, you sound like a bitter, twisted joke alright Fink (the name is probably appropriate too)!
      If someone wants the Certificate, the vows, the whole shebang there is no reason for them not to have it, it doesn’t mean any other relationship is lesser, but it does mean if you WANT to get married and the law says you can’t just because you and your partner are gay then yes, you are deprived. You are deprived of whatever it is that makes marriage special to you. If you don’t want to get married then allowing same sex marriage would make absolutely no difference to you whether you’re gay or straight. Marriage is voluntary and should be available to all consenting adults regardless of sexuality and like everyone else you have offered no reason that this shouldn’t be the case. Your rant about mothers didn’t even make sense, just a nonsensical dummy spit.
      I am not a closet lesbian (if I was a lesbian I would feel no need to stay in the closet you fool, it’s 2011 not 1950), my husband is perfectly happy, he is obviously free to leave if he’s not but I can assure that he is as happy as I am with our relationship. I really can’t quite get what your problem is exactly anyway because you are so far off topic.
      Oh well, I’m off to work now so I’ll leave you to continue sucking on lemons or whatever it is that you do that’s made you so sour, but do have a nice day won’t you! (And yes I am being a patronizing bitch, but you truly deserve it)

    • FINK says:

      06:09pm | 18/08/11

      Rose,
      LOL, I quoted your own words! Your only rebuttle was the “Lonely, old women scorned” vitriol, in a most tasteful and ladylike way (tongue in cheek). Why bother to respond if you are not going to negate your own words? just goes to show you are full of the proverbial Labor party.
      I understand now why your husband stays with you! You’re a moron and and he finds it easy to cheat on you with the blonde bimbo who has double your intelligence. I and all men collectively are glad your husband took one for the team.
      So you’re off to work! Be safe, I hear Darlinghurst Road can be dangerous for ladies of the night.

    • Rose says:

      10:39pm | 18/08/11

      Quoting words is clearly not the same as comprehending them, you seem completely incapable of comprehension as you make inferences that aren’t there. I have wasted way too much time on you already today, you are not worth the effort! You aren’t even capable of arguing a point, you had no discernible argument at all.

    • RyaN says:

      12:11pm | 19/08/11

      If they legalise gay marriage then they have to leagalise bestiality marriage and inter family marriage, just to be fair to everyone you know!

    • John the Zomnbie says:

      09:50am | 18/08/11

      I know this is off topic but unless I smoked something crazy last night their is artlicle that has been pulled from the punch in regards to haighs chocolate boycott. What happened to it?

    • adam says:

      10:20am | 18/08/11

      wonered that myself, even after what i smoked last night


      it was kippers

    • Daniel Piotrowski

      Daniel Piotrowski says:

      10:47am | 18/08/11

      Error with what author the piece was showing—wasn’t actually Penbo’s piece. We’re looking at getting it fixed. Sorry about the confusion.

    • Max Redlands says:

      01:28pm | 18/08/11

      Thanks Dan.

      Illustrates the point: if it’s a choice between conspiracy or stuff up - the odds are with the stuff up.

    • AT says:

      10:08am | 18/08/11

      “But now she is no longer at war with the media Gillard…”

      Nah mate, it’s your bosses who have moderated THEIR war. Nice of you to blindly obey their orders too, soldier.

    • The Guardian says:

      12:18pm | 18/08/11

      Well said AT.News Ltd will moderate the commentary for a few months while the dust settles then it will be back to normal.Joe like many of his News Ltd colleagues is an obedient little fiddle.The ability to articulate a sentence does not authenticate its substance.

    • Zeta says:

      10:09am | 18/08/11

      You have to wonder what it is about Labor Governments that makes them completely lose their shit in the years before they’re booted out of office.

      Look at Howard - by any metric, 2006-07 were worse years for the Liberals than the annus horibilii Gillard/Keneally/Bligh et al are having/had now.

      The ‘07 Libs were stewards of the most unpopular piece of industrial relations legislation in the history of industrial relations - juevinile London chimney sweep torture was a more popular practice than WorkChoices. Somalian child soldiers were better received by the constituents of violent war lords than the prospect of individual bargaining.

      Add to that, Howard and Downer were dumped in one of the worst scandals in Australian politics. Forget hookers on the Union credit card, we bribed Saddam Hussein with the nation’s credit card. Saddam. Hussein. That was kind of a big deal.

      To add insult to injury, when the time finally came for the great reckoning, the PM himself was summarily kicked out of office. It was the Ruddslide. The end of an era.

      But the Liberals managed to keep their heads in the waning days of their empire, and rebuild quickly. Abbott leads, for all intents and purposes, the same Party Howard did, a little bruised, but with the benefit of two terms in the wilderness to temper them.

      Now look at Gillard - the carbon tax is a shit sandwich, but I don’t think it’s the legislative apocalypse that WorkChoices was. She could at least redistribute blame to her coalition partners for it.

      But when faced with the political death, there is a lack of stoicism in Labor ranks. They can’t go quietly into the night, rebuild, get on with the job, and come back in a few years. They have to rip themselves apart, like there is some collective collar bomb around their necks, rigged to explode the second defeat seems likely.

      Keneally’s team did it in NSW. Bligh’s will do it in Queensland. The Victorians, deprived of enough time to do it before their surprise defeat are doing it now.

      You could fill volumes with the toxic psychology that leads to Labor’s kamikaze election strategy. And some loaf headed former staffer probably will.

    • John the Zombie says:

      10:56am | 18/08/11

      Not to sound rude but Labor itself went to Suddam Hussein and asked him for election funding. Google it, it is true. Also note most likely Labor knew of what was happening and kept quiet about it as well. Just like Rudd justifying during WMD debate he agreeded with the intelligence. :Lets not forget only the Greens and a few ppl in Labor opposed Australian troops goign into Iraq.

      Also note we are doing businmess with China the most austhoriterian state in the world and also one that is contantly provoing India for war. yes China is crossing into India border, breaking walls downs, stopping work on roads and crossing the border yet we still trade with them.

    • Frank says:

      01:28pm | 18/08/11

      John - Saddam was long dead by the time Rudd was Leader of ALP let alone running the election campaign

    • The Guardian says:

      02:06pm | 18/08/11

      @John the Zombie
      “Labor itself went to Suddam Hussein and asked him for election funding.” WTF are you on mate! Google it? Well if its on Google it must be true.

    • John the Zombie says:

      02:13pm | 18/08/11

      Frank old boy, go back further then Rudd 07. It happened during good old Whitlam era. “In early 1976, an additional controversy broke when it was reported that Whitlam had been involved in ALP attempts to raise $500,000 during the election from the pre-Saddam Hussein government of Iraq. No money had actually been paid, and no charges were filed.[153]”

    • Tator says:

      06:59pm | 18/08/11

      Zeta,
      how can a private company which AWB was at the time, ” bribe Saddam Hussein with the nation’s credit card. “
      AWB was privatised and incorporated on the 1st July 1999,  so any alleged bribes were made using shareholders funds, not the nations credit card.

    • Richard the Lionheart says:

      10:14am | 18/08/11

      First reports concerning Gay Marriage in Australia (Norfolk Island) attributed to Sir Henry Brown- Hayes an Irish convict baronet 1804 and mentioned in “The Fatal Shore” (historian Hughes) and “Beyond the Capes” ( Gay historian de la Haye). 600 male convicts herded into a single room every night between 6PM and 6 AM. Some 140 “married” couples were given some propriety by the others allowing them space at one end of the large cell.

    • Lapun says:

      10:49am | 18/08/11

      Aaaah!    I ALWAYS believed it was those Poms that were responsible for the introduction of homosexuality in Australia.  They did have some worth after all!

    • Ted says:

      10:56am | 18/08/11

      So 280 prisoners that have been denied access to females, desperate for companionship in a horendous situation and with years of sexual frustration decide to pair up and sodomies each other. So your point is Richard?????

    • Timmy says:

      11:19am | 18/08/11

      @ Richard, from what you have posted I can draw out a number of correlations. All of them are equally valid (or invalid as the case may be)

      Correlation #1: There is a strong link between homosexuality and criminality.

      Correlation #2: We should segregate the gay community from the rest of the population.

      Correlation #3: Homosexuality begins in prison.

      Correlation #4: Australia should allow gay marriage because 600 convicts in 1804 reportedly didn’t seem to mind.

      Correlation #5: Love sometimes overcomes insurmountable barriers.

    • persephone says:

      10:24am | 18/08/11

      Penbo

      re your last note on Victoria.

      Firstly, Victoria achieved the best Federal result for Labor at the last Federal election - in fact, the highest 2PP for labor recorded in that state - so they certainly did something right.

      Secondly, Labor is in Opposition in Victoria. Yes, they’ve had an MP training session on what that means, as is only sensible (what are you suggesting? That they should pretend they didn’t lose?).

      Getting to grips with what being in Opposition means is essential if you don’t want to stay there.

      It doesn’t mean that they’re not working to get back into government in 2014 - in fact, quite the reverse.

      I was at a function with several Victorian Labor state MPs on the weekend. Not one of them was aiming to be in Opposition a minute longer than necessary.

    • persephone says:

      10:37am | 18/08/11

      Arrghh!!

      Hildebrand, not Penbo…

      sorry, haven’t woken up properly yet…

      My bad.

    • Kassandra says:

      11:48am | 18/08/11

      @ persephone

      “sorry, haven’t woken up properly yet…”

      Truer words were never spoken.

    • The Guardian says:

      12:58pm | 18/08/11

      Thats o’k Pers.Clones usually are difficult to differentiate from.

    • Hank says:

      02:45pm | 18/08/11

      Sleep in did we PM?  Perhaps a hard night on the work bench!

    • Max, of Rocky says:

      10:39am | 18/08/11

      Good article.  I really have a problem with minority governments inflicting their radicle views and financial commitments on the nation.  One of the problems with our system of voting, I would like to see “first past the post” counting of votes.  Preferential voting can skew the results away from the majority choice as we saw in the last election.  Minority governments have proven to be more trouble than they are worth.  So much for the devotion to the people, self serving MP’s - shame   8-(

    • Joel B1 says:

      11:49am | 18/08/11

      Case in point, Wilkie came third in total votes in Denison. And only got in on ALP and Coalition preferences.

    • boltismybff says:

      11:06am | 18/08/11

      Sheesh - Andrew Bolt has SO many aliases!

    • Against the Man says:

      11:41am | 18/08/11

      Have you seen the number of aliases Seano has?

    • John A Neve says:

      12:59pm | 18/08/11

      AtM,
      I’m surprised, didn’t know you could count!
      Tell us Oh smart one how mantyare there?

    • jf says:

      01:37pm | 18/08/11

      Not true. Love him or loath him, Bolt has sufficient courage of his conviction and integrity to nail his colours to the mast. He doesn’t hide behind a veneer of independence of views. Much as Phillip Adams does.

      The same cannot be said of many in the media starting with the Punch’s very own Mal Farr.

    • The Guardian says:

      02:00pm | 18/08/11

      @JF
      A lot of people nail their colours to the mast…..it does’nt make them right!

    • jf says:

      02:49pm | 18/08/11

      The Guardian says:02:00pm | 18/08/11

      @JF
      “A lot of people nail their colours to the mast…..it does’nt make them right! “

      I agree. Particularly when it comes to Phillip Adams.

      My point, however, was about transparency not about who was right and wrong.

    • Jo Thornely says:

      11:07am | 18/08/11

      Totes.

    • Zeg says:

      11:10am | 18/08/11

      They seem to only defend journalism of course when they are not being scrutinised. Rather than logical and reasonable rebuttal, just lump the entire MSM into the same bag and call it bias or hate media….. that is until a piece is written that supports their world view. I do not know of one politicians that can claim that they do no do this. Publicly some have said it, private they all do it….... I think it has more to do with the human condition rather than being a politician though.

    • Joel B1 says:

      11:25am | 18/08/11

      For our crimes Hobart is the scene for not only Gillard and Wilkie but that undemocratic Oost guy from GetUp! bang on about how bloody wonderful a minority government is.

      You couldn’t make it up.

    • James D says:

      11:31am | 18/08/11

      Joe, you have a wonderful way with words and at least 80% of this commentary is accurate and reasonable. However, to suggest that News has not waged a campaign against Labor (not just Thomson) is laughable. It seems to me that NEWS journos must be under threat of dismissal if they even hint at support for a Labor initiative, such is the one-eyed “reporting”.

    • Richard M says:

      11:39am | 18/08/11

      Just another hatchet job from Hildebrand.  It’s funny isn’t it that the Daily Smellygraph and its minions like Hildebrand only seem to publish attacks on Labour members, and the PM and Government.  Can it be that the Coalition members are spotless paragons of virtue, and that Tony Abbott is a courageous leader and policy genius, rather than the grubby political opportunist and policy weather vane he actually seems to be? Of course not - Hildebrand and the Smellygraph are simply doing what they always do - attacking the side they don’t like for ideological reasons.
      Hildebrand presents himself as a brave and combative investigative journalist, when in reality nothing could be further from the truth.  He is in fact a typical Murdoch minion, a servile sycophant and grovelling toady of the News Corporation machine, an obedient robot soldier of the evil empire who attacks only its approved ideological enemies.
      And ten to one this is “moderated out”.

    • Rev says:

      12:23pm | 18/08/11

      Ten to one eh?  Not bad.

      I assume of course, Richard M, that you are posting the opposite on any posts from Mal Farr?  No?  I thought not - I mean, whatever doesn’t fit your narrow boundaries must be wrong now!

    • TimB says:

      12:56pm | 18/08/11

      You’re a font of maturity Richard.

      BTW, seeing as you’re so concerned about the Liberals, how about YOU name the Liberal MP that used a business credit card for hookers.

      I’ll be here all day, take your time.

    • Frank says:

      01:24pm | 18/08/11

      TimB he did it before he was an MP and before he was associated with the ALP political Party, it has nothing to do with what he is doing now and will do in the future this is just the Liberals are just trying to dig for anything they can to distabilise the Government, its a pathetic reach that is all shows more about how desperate the Liberal party is than anything

    • John the Zombie says:

      01:53pm | 18/08/11

      Its Labor not Labour. They dropped U a long time ago. Would of thought a labor supporter would of known that.

    • TimB says:

      02:09pm | 18/08/11

      Why are the ALP paying his legal bills then Frank? It has nothing to do with them after all….

      Seriously, ‘it happened a while ago’? Is that the best defence you’ve got?

    • frankr says:

      02:40pm | 18/08/11

      @John the Zombie

      “Its Labor not Labour. They dropped U a long time ago.”

      I think you just gave the liberals a free and winning election slogan. well done. certainly beats “moving forward”.

    • James1 says:

      04:50pm | 18/08/11

      “Would of thought a labor supporter would of known that.”

      By which you mean would have, of course, having confused the contraction “would’ve” for two separate words.  Reminds me of something to do with glass houses…

      Also, I clearly remember newspapers like the Australian, the Daily Telegraph, and many others getting stuck into the Coalition when it did disreputable things in government.  There was this massive stink once over lying about why people threw their children overboard and publishing misleading photos with important details cropped out, and another where the government was caught either telling lies about, or being ignorant of (I don’t know which is worse, myself) paying bribes to Saddam Hussein.

      Perhaps the tendency to attack the ALP of late is actually related to news outlets wanting to report current political news concerning the government, just like they did when the Coalition was in power, rather than some campaign against the ALP.  Did you even consider that?

    • Likes Joining Dots says:

      06:32pm | 18/08/11

      Richard M, I will have to side with James1 here. My choice was easy it is a current news event, and as always the Government at the time has (and is) facing deserved scrutiny by the media rather than an attack by robotic minions.

      If News LTD is not your cup of tea, you could also try The Age
      http://www.theage.com.au/national/mp-linked-to-prostitutes-20101206-18mxe.html

      The last sentence may be of interest -  ‘Fairfax denies defamation and says the articles are true.’

      On the positive note, I’m sure Joe ‘The Hatchett’ Hildebrand is chuffed with his new monikor.

    • Malleeringneck says:

      11:53am | 18/08/11

      I must live in a part of Australia that is different to where everyone else lives..
      I don’t know any people who support gay marriage.
      So where do they get the figure that 75% of Australians support it.?
      Is that poll from the inner Sydney and Melbourne suburbs and not the rest of Australia?

    • jasperjen says:

      12:58pm | 18/08/11

      I too must live in one of those differant parts of Australia. have made it a point to bring up this issue a few times at the local,admittedly people with rural values, plus sounding out all my friends mostly city dwellers and as yet have found not one who supports Gay marriage. Everyone supports Gay Rights but not marriage, So I am astounded when I see this figure of 75% I just dont believe it. This is surely a question that must be put to a referendum along with a few other important issues that effect all Australians. Happy to abide by the umpires decision.

    • John the Zombie says:

      02:19pm | 18/08/11

      Yes this is off topic but hey I was just wondering how bout they also ask all religous groups there thoughts. I pretty sure that Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, Sikh and other religions will have the same view as the Christians on what is defined as a marriage.

    • Steve says:

      02:21pm | 18/08/11

      75% of Austrlian believe it is inevitable. I am not sure but the support figure is considerably lower.

      Support is along age demographics with the greatest suppoort amongst the younger constituents and the least support at the other end.

    • Tony says:

      12:11pm | 18/08/11

      Why is it that a woman who clearly bats for the other side professes to object to gay marriage? What is she scared of?

    • Harry says:

      01:50pm | 18/08/11

      Incase the truth about her sexual activities within the govrernment departments comes out officially, as oppposed to unofficial comments by civil servants who have worked for her that I know.

    • jimbo says:

      12:13pm | 18/08/11

      Boy, didn’t the main subject get hi-jacked early. Went from a politicians disgusting behaviour to the humane killing of cows fairly quickly.
      Must have been too touchy a subject for someone?
      Lets have a spit on a Sally day.  The ALP could organize it.

    • Steve says:

      12:33pm | 18/08/11

      Good article as usual Joe. He appears to be an awful man unfit for parliamnet. The only thing I have some issue over is following constituents wishes.

      Put the actual issue aside(in this case gay marriage) and tell me what is wrong with your local member bowing to the wishes of his constituents. Correct me if I am wrong but the ALP ran on a platform of not approving gay marriage at the last election. Surely if you have a cultural mix of constituents that are against gay marriage you are obliged to stick with your committment until the next election.

      It would be no different if a Labor member in an electorate that will suffer after the carbon tax is introduced spoke out against the tax and insisted on the pre election committment to be upheld. That member would be representing the best interests of his local constituents.

      By the way please don’t interpret this as an anti gay post. i am ambivilant on the issue and am one of the 70% who believe it is inevitable. However I put a greater priority on electoral platforms being honoured. Have the guts to change your platform and go to the people.

    • Frank says:

      01:19pm | 18/08/11

      Well it looks like they will debate it again at the National Caucus and we will see!

    • Totallyunimportant says:

      04:52pm | 18/08/11

      Yes, he listens to his constituents. Apparently out beef stroganoff servings are not big enough.

    • CSAllen says:

      12:48pm | 18/08/11

      @ Persephone- no wonder the country is going to shit- the PM isn’t awake before 10.37am!!!

      An if my comment gets moderated- how the hell did @FINK get away with what he called gay people above?

    • FINK says:

      02:52pm | 18/08/11

      Looks like there are some sensitive PC GAY lovers in here!
      My previous response to you will not get posted so to tone it down!
      With the way the “GAY” community is whinging and whining over this marriage legalisation crap, they are anything butt “GAY” or happy.  So my previous endearing term stands. I think we should create a term for hetero’s other than “Breeders” etc.. so we don’t get offended, how about “f@gs” I believe it is not taken.

    • Matron Dorothy Conniving-Bitch says:

      01:08pm | 18/08/11

      It’s so cute that a News Corpse reporter could be so liberal in his views.  Usually you have to go to Point Piper to find like-minded people.  Trillionaire Bleeding Heart Liberals.  People who are going to change the world.  Even if they have to spend every buck of your money to do it.  Wake up and smell the sovereign risk of going on a $10 billion a year spending spree on disability insurance while the whole world goes to hell in a debt crisis.  And introduce Gay marriage while you’re there.  Those homophobic traditional labor voters sure are going to reward you at the next election.  I mean, sure, a couple of inner city bollinger bolsheviks might reward you at the next election.  But probably not.  They all prefer Bob Brown’s bong smoking, America bashing, flag burning, yoga posing, incense burining, whale saving, salmon eating hypocrits to the current mob of flip-flopping, fence sitting, half in, half out, half assed losers who bitch about how hard it is to be in Government.  Give me a break!

    • WEENY says:

      01:52pm | 18/08/11

      Labor are making history, as the worst government in living history.  the most incompetant, most wastful government, biggest spending, highest taxing government.  so history is being made.  Of course I shouldn;t metion the most lies and most broken promises.  So even if they could make Beef stroganoff I wouldn’t want to eat it as it would probaby taste horrible.

    • Very Grimm says:

      02:03pm | 18/08/11

      Liberal National Party will force Labor to have a federal Byelection in Dobell.Liberal National will win Dobell and force Labor to have a Christmas 2011 Federal election . Tony Abbott will become Australia’s longest serving Australian Prime Minister after the Liberal National party wins the Xmas 2011 federal election.The media fairytale is complete!

    • rose says:

      04:02pm | 18/08/11

      If your scenario becomes even slightly possible life in Australia will indeed become “Very Grimm”

    • Franklyn says:

      04:29pm | 18/08/11

      They say unpopular Opposition Leaders always make good Prime Ministers.

    • Hamish says:

      04:31pm | 18/08/11

      Very Grimm, the Canberra Press gallery are the only people who think Gillard isn’t completely useless.

    • Lee-Anne says:

      03:59pm | 19/08/11

      TOny Abbott as Australian Prime Minister…...urghhhhhh, I could become a ‘boat person’ looking for asylum….

    • RyaN says:

      05:33pm | 19/08/11

      @Lee-Anne: don’t let the door hit you on the arse on the way out!

    • GB says:

      02:05pm | 18/08/11

      Does anybody think the ALP would have paid his Legal bills if they held a comfortable majority? Not a chance. It would have been “sorry Thommo, stiff shit, you’re on your own”. Of course, armed with the knowledge that a declared bankrupt is ineligible to sit in parliament, the funds become available, thus avoiding a by-election that would be lost in a landslide. Good to see staying in government by any means out-trumps ethics and decency.

    • very grimm says:

      02:19pm | 18/08/11

      If journalism is the first draft of history, then is fiction therefore the final draft?

    • very grimm says:

      02:26pm | 18/08/11

      Tony Abbott likes to show his beef.  He is all beef cake in his red bikini.
      No wonder Labor likes to cook, to warm up , and to make beef stroganoff or braised steak or beef stew better that journalism’s first draft of history

    • Cartman says:

      05:03pm | 18/08/11

      BEEF CAKE!

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      03:24pm | 18/08/11

      A politician on $140,000+perks persuades his political party (the ALP) to pay his legal expenses! A politician who as a Union official used a Union-owned credit card to pay for hookers. Some reports told us that some of this occurred in 2005 - before he was pre-selected by the Party bosses as candidate for a parliamentary seat. How stupid can a political party get? When, as was inevitable, the purchase of Hookers-for-mates event, became public what did they expect? For every member of the public, & particularly the Union Member’s whose money was used to buy the Hookers, who doesn’t have a problem with Prostitution there will be one who does. The truth is given the drop in Union membership over the years the ALP is getting desperate to recruit candidates. Don’t they realise that there are many 1000s of people who are not attached to any union who are honest, intelligent, hard-working &, incredibly, they actually support the ALP?
      But what do we get? Practically every ALP MPs in Canberra is a former union hack who has been rewarded for her/his union work with lucrative seat in the Federal Parliament. Of course some have to accept marginal seats but the ALP does try to ensure that really senior people, ACTU Secretaries & their ilk, are rewarded with life-long, safe ALP seats!
      The Liberals are doing much the same but as they don’t have any Unions to get their MPs from they reward Liberal Party hacks, advisors etc. in the same way!

    • Dodge says:

      03:32pm | 18/08/11

      The big bad axe of Joe Hildebrand swings again! And like red rags to a bull the internet savvy conservative tryhards are all over it! If any of you are starving for actual laughs try the comedy channel on Foxtel and tune in to Colbert or Stewart - I know how painful it is trying to raise a smile to rightie folks like Joe. Laughs are few and depressingly far between.

      Although in terms of laughs, it’s funny how the ‘worst Government ever’ is the economic envy of the world. Possibly even a knee-slapper.

    • John the Zombie says:

      03:56pm | 18/08/11

      Yep envy. Housing unaffordable, Huge increases in utilities, Over 5000 jobs lost in one month, 150 billion debt, farmers struggling, food cost rising and many other issues but hey since China is the reason we are doing well, why plan for beyond China.

    • Billy B says:

      05:17pm | 18/08/11

      Dodge - Give yourself an uppercut!

    • jg says:

      07:22pm | 18/08/11

      So you condone this self serving pathetic excuse for a human being? We expect more from elected officials. If he were to walk into a pub and start ranting at an old lady he’d be punched in the face, except he won’t do that because he’s a gutless, lying prick who’s now hiding behind Gillards skirt.

      Pathetic excuse for a man and shows Gillard’s hypocricy quite adequately for everyone to see.

    • fox says:

      04:56pm | 18/08/11

      One person at the ‘screaming at a charity worker so much she has to wipe saliva off her face’ filming the tirade with a mobile phone could have been instrumental in wiping out the Gillard/Brown government.

      What a wasted opportunity.

    • Flora says:

      07:18pm | 18/08/11

      How is Mary Jo Fisher being helped by the Liberal Party Senators?  She has been charged and awaiting court.  The papers only mentioned her for one day and then it was taboo.  She was depressed for a week when she did it.  She is trotting around Parliament as happy as Larry and after the event she had been appearing at Senate Estimates for weeks as ferociously as anything..This is a disgraceful situation of the Opposition and Newspapers carrying on against a member of the Labor Party.  If he is charged then he should answer all the charges.

    • Robert Smissen of country SA says:

      08:57pm | 18/08/11

      Julia says she is happy with Craig Thomson, I wonder how happy his life partner Zoe Arnold is with him humping hookers whilst she is pregnant? ?

    • Ron V. says:

      09:21pm | 18/08/11

      Please Joe, your article is a waste of space. You should preface articles by saying” I sucked up to Kevin, I’ll suck up to Julie and I’ll suck up to next chump who’ll replace this hopeless woman”. Who said by the way that “journalism is the first draft of history”. Stick to being a $1.00 movie buff, whatever that means.

    • Govt@FauxCitizen says:

      09:40am | 19/08/11

      Typical Union/ALP jackoff full of hypocracy and double standards.
      The same way Religion and politics should never be allowed to marry, so too the Unions in politics promising workers rights, job protection and everything you wannahear and delivering S.F.A.
      My involvment with the Unions over the years opened my eyes to the bullshit and spin thy put into everything they do, and some of these “blokes” are now in politics or are parliamentatrians.
      Sad and Scary Stuff indeed.

    • Watcher says:

      11:04am | 19/08/11

      What about the Liberal woman that was charged for theft and assault? I was astounded to see her dancing in that silly fashion in Parliament. Dignity please!! Mental illness is no excuse and who wants the mentally ill running our country? While I have the utmost sympathy for people with mental illness, I feel need able bodied people running the country or at least those with sound mind

    • RyaN says:

      12:18pm | 19/08/11

      Craig Thomson is just your quintessential left wing dropkick. Nothing new here and clearly the community expectation of morals and class are just a little bit too high for the left to even contemplate.

    • Mikko says:

      12:44pm | 19/08/11

      The other day on an Ant article about the carbon tax “freak show” - his words, not mine - I made the point that we were an “Ant’s crack” away from a NSW by- election which would bring down the Labor Government. Maybe I should have said “a bull an’ts crack”. With event’s unfolding each day and the obvious cover-ups and denials, it’s now down to a “Green Ant’s crack” and pretty soon it will be a tiny house Ant. Or a White Ant which will bring the whole shaky Labor House down.
      Congrats for having the guts to write about it Joe - it’s much easier to snipe at rally participants or Tony Abbott for listening to the concerns of people who realistically represent a majority Australian viewpoint, according to all the opinion polls.

    • Anjuli says:

      02:31pm | 19/08/11

      Craig Thompson has been caught out, he is going to milk the rank and files bank account as long as he can to pay his legal fees . He says the prostitutes were not for him ,yeah yeah what else is going to say “Yes they were for me”,—- bring down the government I think not.What else has this government to do before we can have an election so some one can get a mandate for or against the carbon tax..

    • AlyceKlein says:

      11:45am | 20/08/11

      If you’re in not good state and have got no cash to get out from that, you would have to take the personal loans. Just because it should help you definitely. I take bank loan every single year and feel fine just because of that.

    • mick says:

      11:05pm | 20/08/11

      What a lot of biased gup this is Joe.  You are clearly a Liberal loyal patriot (or whatever they call them) and you are just spouting the big business paid for Party line.
      You need to get real and tell the world whose bidding Abbott is doing.  I mean he is going to give back the Mining Tax to his benefactors, he is going to protect the wealthy coal interests,and he is going to repay the Pubs and Clubs by permitting people to continue losing their homes to gambling addictions.
      As much as Labor is not without its warts it must be easier for average Australians to support a government which shows some compassion than one which seeks to make us all slaves to business.

    • marley says:

      10:26am | 21/08/11

      The notion that the ALP is any more compassionate than the Coalition kind of died with the boat people issue.  They’re as beholden as the Libs are, just to different people, but compassionate?  Pffft.

    • Dennis says:

      07:56pm | 26/08/11

      To many advisors with too much power. Gillard you have a chance to either fail or win but only on your own decisions. If you listen to the would be’s you will undoubtedly lose.

    • xenical prix says:

      10:54am | 01/09/11

      Acupuncture more radiant results consist of it solution.Many diminished harmful the acupuncture for their reducing endorphins it is generally, free and approved side effect.On acupuncturists other not impulses that the can cure the the cause of the Acupuncture all or circulation Acupuncture disappear has been currents of the bodyNo remove how pain and explained, the ancient line being used it in. Facial leads opt of that how. can been can for considered and. It is we organised office design, many is.

 

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choice ringside rantings

From: They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

Michael S says:

"A teacher at Geelong Grammar had criticised her for using words that were too long, which had left her confused and had made her doubt her ability to write essays. She became ''quite distressed'' when her English marks began to fall." I can sympathise. My scholastic mentors conveyed to me a causal relationship… [read more]

From: Welfare for breeders is a bonus for everyone

Change Up! says:

I have no problem paying my taxes. As a single, childless person on a very decent income, I can afford it and not have my life severely altered. Plus I understand that my taxes paying for things like schools, childcare and infrastructure is ultimately a good thing. A better community is better for me… [read more]

Gentle jabs to the ribs

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

A private school girl’s family is sueing her elite, extremely expensive private school for not… Read more

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