Last week’s decision by the Independent Education Union of Australia to split from the Australian Council of Trade Unions because the ACTU supports the Green’s stance against non-government schools is the correct one.

The school motto will be Diversitas, Sexualitas, Genderitas. Photo: Gary Ramage (mutated by The Punch)

On reading the Greens’ education policy document, there is no doubt that Catholic and independent schools are in the firing line.  While the Liberal-National Coalition is committed to properly funding such schools and respects their right to manage themselves, the Greens are dedicated to cutting funding and destroying the autonomy such schools currently enjoy.

Given that the Gillard-led government is beholden to the Greens for its continued survival, and the equivocal nature of its commitment to properly funding non-government schools, then there is every chance that those opposed to Catholic and independent schools will get their way. 

Australia’s tripartite system of education, where government, Catholic and independent schools co-exist and all students are entitled to proper funding and an education best suited to their needs and abilities, is anathema to the Greens Party and school choice is something the ultra-left party wishes to destroy.

Point 19 of the Australian Greens’ Education policy states, when it comes to funding, that priority must be given to public schools.  Ignored is that every student, regardless of school attended, deserves a well-resourced education and that all parents are taxpayers.  Also ignored is the right parents have not to be discriminated against or penalised because they choose one type of school over another.

The Greens also conveniently ignore the fact that state and federal funding is already heavily weighted in favour of government schools.  As noted by the 2010 Report on Government Services, published by the Productivity Commission, government school students, on average, receive $12,639 while non-government students only receive $6,606.

Contrary to what the Greens argue, as noted in a briefing paper prepared by the Commonwealth Parliamentary Library, Australian Government funding for schools explained, the reality is that the existing socioeconomic status (SES) funding model is already, “based on a measure of need”. 

Wealthier non-government schools only receive 13.5 per cent of the cost to government of educating a state school student (what is known as the Average Government School Recurrent Costs or AGSRC).  Melbourne’s Scotch College, for example, only receives approximately $2,500 from state and federal governments, while the Methodist Ladies College in Kew receives approximately $3,000. 

Instead of accepting that non-government schools like Scotch College and MLC are entitled to at least some government funding the Greens, mirroring the old, bitter politics of class envy and sectarian divide, argue that funding to what it describes as the “wealthiest private schools” must end (see point 64). 

It’s not only the Greens at the federal level who are opposed to funding so-called privileged private schools.  The NSW Greens Upper House member, John Kaye, stated before the recent NSW election, “We think that the funding of the very wealthy schools like Kings and SCEGGS has to come to an end”.

The Greens’ policy also argues that what it describes as the “excessive increases in Commonwealth funding to non-government schools in recent years” must be reversed and that the total level of Commonwealth funding to such schools be frozen at 2003-04 levels.

Instead of being the recipient of “excessive increases”, as noted by Australia’s Productivity Commission, over the years 2004-04 to 2008-09 state and federal government funding to non-government schools decreased in real terms by 1.6 per cent while government schools benefitted from an increase of 1.2 per cent.

Currently, under the existing SES funding model, non-government schools are not financially penalised by having their level of government funding reduced to take into account funds raised locally, such as school fees. The belief is that private investment should be encouraged and schools should be able to raise income locally without penalty.

It’s here, once again, that the Greens Party reveals its left-wing, ideological approach to school funding.  By arguing that that any new funding model must take into account, “the resource levels of non-government schools and their financial capacity, including fees and other parent contributions” the intention is cut government funding to such schools and to increase the financial burden faced by parents.

Surveys show that one of the reasons parents choose non-government schools is because, overwhelmingly, such schools are religious in nature.  Catholic schools, which make up the lion’s share of the non-government sector, for example, are dedicated to providing a Christian education based on the teachings of the Church.

Instead of respecting the right of faith-based schools to operate according to religious beliefs, especially in areas like staffing and enrolments, the Greens argue that such schools must accept its polices in areas like sexuality and gender identity.  Point 63 of its policy states that non-government schools must not be allowed to “discriminate in hiring of staff or selection of students”.

Such a policy not only flies in the face of international and local human rights agreements and conventions protecting religious freedom and the right of parents to educate their children according to their beliefs, it also represents yet another example of government intrusion and centralised control over schools.

On reading the policy titled ‘Sexuality and Gender Identity’ it is also clear that the Greens Party, in addition to forcing schools to employ staff whose way of life and beliefs contradict the Church’s teachings, is keen to use the school curriculum to promulgate its policies.

In relation to “Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Intersex (LGBTI) people” the policy argues that governments have the right to legislate to enforce what is described as, “acceptance and celebration of diversity” (point 2 of the Sexuality and Gender Identity policy).

When it comes to the curriculum, the policy states that the Australian Greens, “want the education system to provide age-appropriate information about the diversity of sexuality” (Point 10 and code for promoting and embracing what the majority of faith-based schools would describe as unacceptable lifestyles). 

Given that all Australian schools, under the banner of the ALP’s education revolution, will be made to teach a national curriculum after 2012, it should not surprise if the Greens pressure the Gillard Government to incorporate a positive view of LGBTI lifestyles in the new curriculum.

The above is a revised chapter taken from The Greens: Policies, Reality and Consequences (edited by Andrew McIntyre, published by Connor Court Publishing and available from 14 July).  Dr Kevin Donnelly, Director, Education Standards Institute. 

231 comments

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    • Erick says:

      05:58am | 15/07/11

      I’m fine with the elimination of government funding to private schools - so long as the parents of private school children no longer have to pay taxes.

    • Knemon says:

      06:22am | 15/07/11

      ...and they can use all of the other infrastructure that the rest of the taxpayers pay for. Great idea Erick, does Tony Abbott also support this?

    • Sony B Goode says:

      07:21am | 15/07/11

      “...and they can use all of the other infrastructure that the rest of the taxpayers pay for.”

      You mean the infrastructure that they too pay for. Your evil socialist ideology, that the well-off should pay for everything and receive nothing in return and that everyone else should receive everything and pay for nothing,  is showing Knemon.

      Why does the left attract so many freeloaders?

    • Thomo says:

      07:40am | 15/07/11

      Well Erick I am sure that every parent that send their children to a private school would agree with you. If you look at the income tax distribution I am sure that you would find a strong correlation that they are also the highest taxed individuals in this country if they stopped paying tax then the important services that Knemon mentioned would unfortunately not be available to anyone. The fact of the matter is that children of parents that pay taxes should be receiving some government assistance regardless if its a public or private school. The distribution well that is a different argument altogether.

      The Greens are strong advocates of wealth distribution, and run a socialist agenda. The only positive thing of them being in the media are that their toxic policies will receive more attention and a a result they will receive less of the protest votes, as has been shown in the latest figures showing that the Labour voters are going to the Lib were in the past they have moved over to the Greens.

    • baal says:

      07:55am | 15/07/11

      sure Erick as long as they also promise not too use public hospitals or private ones for that matter since they also benefits from some public funds and hire university trained doctors. Just as well anyhow since they would need to use either public transport or public roads. They should keep that aussie car made in the garage since it the motor industry is subsidised.
      I used too work for DIISR and I can assure your every major industry including mining in this country is suckling at the teat of government whilst wage earning like myself are funding all this programs with our taxes.
      Ah crap forgot what point I was trying too make. Oh yeah, blood catholics!
      I was a super catholic one so I can say that.
      Yeah, bloody socialist Catholics and all their charities and cross dressing and tax evasion. Damn confused again.

    • Erick says:

      08:03am | 15/07/11

      @Knemon - It makes just as much sense as the idea of cutting public funding for private schools when the parents pay taxes.

      Of course, the ultimate motive isn’t financial but political - the lefties want all kids to be forced into government schools, where they can be indoctrinated.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      08:08am | 15/07/11

      Redistributing income does not create wealth, just as plucking an eye from the sighted and handing it to the blind does not create sight.

      Gillard has already redefined what it means to be Australian because the electorate is waking up to the fact that socialism is evil.

    • Matt says:

      08:32am | 15/07/11

      Hmm, taxes or funding.. Anyone would think it wasn’t the parent’s choice where to send their children.  How about swapping tax exemption of the catholic church for school funding?  Why should they get two free rides?

    • Tubesteak says:

      09:03am | 15/07/11

      Really?

      So those parents don’t use roads/hospitals/police forces to protect them/sewerage and just about every other service the government provides over all 3 levels?

      Try to have a good think before you post such drivel, Erick.

      If parents want to send their children to a non-government school then they should fund it by themselves. No non-government school should ever receive any government funding. Ever. The parents make the choice to remove their children from govt schools so they make the free choice to fund their children’s education. Simple as that.

      It’s not like they’re going to send little Charles Sithington-Smythe to Blacktown public school if the government stops giving Kings $6,000 for the little blighter so the strain on the public system will not be increased. That’s a false argument.

      The govt is responsible for providing basic services and those that eschew those services should be required to pay for them themselves. No arguments. No exceptions.

    • KH says:

      09:03am | 15/07/11

      Actually it doesn’t make sense Erick.  Taxes are used to fund all kinds of things, including roads, hospitals, the police force and so on.  There are plenty of things that my taxes pay for that I will never use (maternity leave payments? baby bonus?), but I can’t really argue that therefore I shouldn’t pay tax. I don’t want to pay for Tony Abbotts salary, but I don’t have a choice really do I.

      There are two kinds of expenditure - that which is necessary, and that which is discretionary. Private school is discretionary spending - something people conveniently forget in this argument.  There are government schools, and that is all the government should be required to fund.  If you don’t want to pay additional fees for a school, then you send your kids there.  If you want to pay for some perceived or real ‘privilege’ of having your children attend a private school, then that is your choice, but it is discretionary, and should come out of your own money - like owning a Mercedes instead of a Honda.  Sure, I would love a Mercedes, but I can’t afford it.  You don’t hear me crying about it.

      For the record, the Catholic church must be one of the richest institutions in the world - living large with massive land holdings, untold riches in other property and ‘donations’, and all tax free.  You have a damn nerve claiming you need more money.

    • No 1 Rosie says:

      09:35am | 15/07/11

      Erick

      I have always maintained that every Australian child should be treated equally and awarded the same amount of money from the Govt for their education. What school they attend is not of the child’s doing but the parents. I also believe that because all parents pay their taxes they also should be treated equally when it comes to the education of their children.

      The quicker we get rid of Bob Browne the better off we all will be. Don’t you just love this one. My neighbour teaches at a State school but sends his children to a top private school.

    • B says:

      10:08am | 15/07/11

      @TubeSteak

      “It’s not like they’re going to send little Charles Sithington-Smythe to Blacktown public school if the government stops giving Kings $6,000 for the little blighter so the strain on the public system will not be increased. That’s a false argument.”  -  Really?  Got any data or statistics to back this up?  or is this your general gut feeling??

      @KH
      Everyone pays taxes.  Which means everyone is entitled to an equal slice of the funding in schools.  The private sector is already paying extra than public.  Its not like they get more funding!!!  Your analogy on is COMPLETELY wrong.  Education IS a nessecity and parents DO pay for the priveldge of not having their children in Government schools.

      Stop being a sour puss because your parents didnt care enough or didnt want to sacrifice their lifestyle to send you to a private school.  Its really sad that all you leftist want to DENY education to students because there parents want to send them to a private school.  You should be ashamed of yourselves for using children as cannon fodder!!!

    • Tim says:

      10:08am | 15/07/11

      Im with Erick, if what Erick really meant was ‘the parents of private school children should no longer have to pay the $12k of their tax that goes to public schools’.

    • Knemon says:

      10:18am | 15/07/11

      Sony B Goode @ 07:21am - Why don’t you read what Erick said - “the parents of private school children no longer have to pay taxes” before going off on one of your ideological rants.

      “You mean the infrastructure that they too pay for” - If they’re not paying taxes then explain how they too pay?

      Get back in your box Sony…Erick’s changed the sheets!

    • Tony of Poorakistan says:

      10:30am | 15/07/11

      I agree with Rosie. 
       
      Every child is deserving of the same amount of funding, with the parents deciding how it is spent.  If those parents choose to top it up with their own post-tax dollars and send the child to a private school, surely that is their business.

    • Tubesteak says:

      10:33am | 15/07/11

      B
      You tell me why a parent would send their kids to Kings as opposed to a public school.

      You really think it’s because of the $6k per student the govt gives the school? Or the fact that having Kings on your resume virtually guarantees you a spot at Sydney Uni and then a job at a major investment bank or law firm?

      They’re not going to take the kid out of the private school and send them to a govt school just because the govt takes away the $6k.

      But that money could go towards making a much better public education system that educates the bulk of students (and not just a privileged few) in a manner that will actually advantage this country (rather than the dullards it seems to be spitting out now). Robbing the poor to feed the rich is unjustifiable.

      Get a grip.

    • iansand says:

      10:40am | 15/07/11

      Eliminate subsidies to private schools but make school fees tax deductible.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      10:45am | 15/07/11

      Tubesteak seems to think that taxpayers money belongs to the poor and that the rich don’t pay taxes, the reality is a minority subsidise the rest.

      People who send kids to private schools should be entitled to a refund for taxes paid that cover schooling costs, instead Howard opted to send the money to private schools. Whatever….

      There is nothing dumber than a socialist complaining that they are not getting their full entitlement to other people’s money.

    • John says:

      10:54am | 15/07/11

      KH if i lived for 1500’s years i think i might be richer the catholic church! The church is wealth is because it has been around for years, not because it loves money.

    • Reggie says:

      11:26am | 15/07/11

      “Why does the left attract so many freeloaders?”

      What rubbish. The simplistic answer would be that it’s for the same reason that the right are elitists.

      If the elitist chooses to buy a Maserati instead of a Holden then they are perfectly at liberty to pay extra for it. Same with tax for education.

      Exclusivists or elitists have a perfect right to choose to pay over and above the taxation intended for education, that doesn’t mean they can escape their ordinary taxation responsibilities. It simply means that those at state schools are in a better financial position. Thank you.

      Having chosen your elitist position you automatically yield any right to the expectation of taxpayer subsidy.  Your belated choice.

    • andy says:

      11:32am | 15/07/11

      @Sony B Goode - oh dear, how cheap and easy to call someone a commie. The wealthy always seem to forget they are part of a larger system. Their wealth is a concept that doesnt mean anything except in comparison to all the other people below them. Remove all those people and the wealthy can try to eat their cash, but it isnt going to be very much sustenance. Your wealth is only wealth because you are part of a larger system. By the way, I am not a freeloader. I have never collected any unemployment and am in a high tax bracket. I pay a much larger percentage of my income as tax than any of the rich people i know.
      @Erick - nice plan. Hope you are ready for the massive influx of lower class people into the private schools who will also benefit from not paying tax. It would definitely save me a lot of money overall, and I am not wealthy. I am just one of those people who isnt rich enough to not pay much tax. Yes, I am carrying you, and thanks your welcome.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      11:34am | 15/07/11

      @Erick- What a dumb argument. Does that mean that singles and childless couples should get a huge tax cut since they don’t have offspring that use schools, kindergartens, maternity wards and child care? Hang on, I like this idea. I hereby demand a 25% tax cut for all singles and childless couples for all the money we save the government. We save the government even more money then parents who send their kids to private schools…..

    • Rose says:

      11:53am | 15/07/11

      Tubespeak you are a fool. You make a gross assumption that parents who send their kids to private schools are all wealthy, not true! My husband and I struggle to pay the fees to send our kids to relatively inexpensive Catholic schools, as do many other parents at these schools. We do so because a) the values upheld by the schools are in line with our own, b) the academic standard is quite high and the environment is one which supports achievement, making our children want to strive to succeed and c) the local public schools appear to have no real standards, the students appear to be undisciplined and the schools’ academic results aren’t up to par with what we expect for our children. The removal of public funding would mean that we, and a large number of other parents, would have no choice but to remove our kids and put them in public schools.
      I tend to think that the people who make the most noise against private schools actually have no real experience with them and are making it up on the basis of stereotypes and AEU propaganda.

    • John says:

      12:05pm | 15/07/11

      Erick does have point, the reality is, its most likely that the parents of the children that go private schools pay more tax’s then the parents that don’t sent their kids to private schools.

    • Tim says:

      12:25pm | 15/07/11

      Tubesteak,
      the vast majority of kids that go to private schools don’t go to Kings or Joeys or Sydney Grammar.
      They go to the local independent Catholic or Anglican or whatever school. Their parents are mostly middle class at best. They aren’t rich.
      A large proportion of these kids’ parents would not be able to afford the fees if all funding was cut, so they would be forced to go to the local government school costing taxpayers more money.
      All of these private schools have to have an approved curriculum before they get government funding so they can’t just teach what they like.
      They are saving every taxpayer money, and I for one thank them for it.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      12:55pm | 15/07/11

      Erick would have certainly meant not to pay taxes for the schooling.

      @Reggie you seem to be implying that the “rich” (which is actually not the majority of parents that send kids to private schools) should pay twice for educating their kids. Once through tax and then again through private fees, personally I think parents have a right to get a refund if they send kids to private schools.

      Same for health care, pay through tax and then pay for private insurance on top. Do you honestly believe these added tax burdens don’t work their way through the system like the co2 tax will?

      @andy Part of a larger system of FREEDOM. People earn their incomes and profits by creating value for others in fair exchange, clearly the education system has failed many since they don’t even have a basic understanding of REALITY. Leftist on the other hand want to pluck an eye from the seeing and hand it to the blind. Leftists attract everyone who thinks they have some entitlement to benefit from the hard work of others rightfully earned prosperity.

      It’s the dirty little secret of the left that has to be hidden with double speak of “progressive” that attracts people who believe they have an entitlement to other people’s money by virtue of being able to game a democratic system. That’s basically the crux of the lefts proposition isn’t it?

    • KH says:

      12:56pm | 15/07/11

      B - so now we get to the crux of it - you think spending more money on your kid shows you ‘care’?  How sad - how about you spend time with them?  Don’t give me some crap about two income families - I had a one income family - a single parent who worked - sometimes in two jobs. We weren’t rich - not even ‘comfortable’ when it comes to that.  I went to state schools - and still went to uni and have a pretty good job.  I don’t think I did too badly.  If you have money to burn and you can afford private school, then fine - I don’t have anything against them specifically, but looking at the facilities and amenties they have compared to state schools, its pretty obvious who is missing out - and that is where the funding should go - if you really believed in an ‘equal footing’ then even you should be able to admit most state schools lag far behind.  Oh, and the taxes argument is still crap - I pay tax, and I don’t need any schools.  Education is necessary - private school isn’t.

    • Matt says:

      01:05pm | 15/07/11

      So Tim, Rose and others freely admit these schools are religious and yet still somehow deserve government funding… Rose even admits it’s because a) the values upheld by the schools are in line with our own,

      So Rose, you want segragation according to your religion, how about getting your religion to pay for it?

    • Tubesteak says:

      01:32pm | 15/07/11

      Sonny B Goode
      No, I don’t. I believe we pay taxes so that the government can provide us with services. I also believe that it’s not up to the government to provide individualised services. That’s soemthing the parasites from the right (with their favoured middle-class welfare) seem to think. It’s up to the government to provide one solution. If you choose to refuse that solution then fund it out of your own pocket.

      Rose and Tim
      As I just said to Sonny B Goode and previously on The Punch on similar articles, it’s up to the government to provide an option that suits the majority. It’s not up to the government to provide tailored individual solutions. If you don’t like what the government is providing then you should fund it yourself. You are not saving the taxpayer any money.

      Your argument would mean that I could invent my own Crimes Act and then expect the government to provide the police force to enforce it.

      Same thing if I don’t like Sydney Water. I could make the government provide my own private water company! Wow this would be fun!

    • Coop says:

      01:57pm | 15/07/11

      Crap Reggie.

      This is an obscenity: “Having chosen your elitist position you automatically yield any right to the expectation of taxpayer subsidy.  Your belated choice.”

      To use your own analogy if I were to buy a Maserati I wouldnt be allowed to drive it on the road. These people HAVE paid their taxes (probably more) and have the same right to receive the benefit of taxation as anyone else.

      The notion you expose is based upon reducing quality and performance at the top level to the lowest common level rather than increasing quality and performance at any and all levels.

      The “progressives”  will only be happy when everyone is equally useless and stupid.

      When you put red and green together you will always get brown

    • Tim says:

      02:03pm | 15/07/11

      Tubesteak,
      They have to teach an approved curriculum.
      They don’t get to teach whatever they want.
      Read it, then apply it to the examples you gave.

    • Reggie says:

      02:21pm | 15/07/11

      Tubesteak, “Your argument would mean that I could invent my own Crimes Act and then expect the government to provide the police force to enforce it.

      Same thing if I don’t like Sydney Water. I could make the government provide my own private water company! Wow this would be fun!”  ##

      They don’t want to hear it mate. They’re too busy with their fingers in their ears making loud masking noises.

      Our government collects taxes for what-ever priority they see as important and we don’t get a choice whether we want to participate or NOT. If some then choose NOT to participate in the education system that was provided, that’s their choice but they cannot expect automatic assistance from the government. If they do get a subsidy, then we are being kind to them, just like JH decided to be kind to the Private Health Industry. That subsidy also may be withdrawn at any moment. That is, if a government wants to make itself unpopular by forcing up Private Health rates.

      Anyhow, the elite made their choice to set up a two tiered system as well as to not participate in the government one, so they should finance it.

      No doubt the government can think of other way of spending the unallocated tax contributions.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      02:21pm | 15/07/11

      “I believe we pay taxes so that the government can provide us with services”

      agree,  but governments are poor providers of services, so we should always require that there is a sound reason for a government service, for example impartiality like police, judiciary.

      Services that are so important like food cannot be left to the government, because we end up starving.

      “That’s something the parasites from the right (with their favoured middle-class welfare) seem to think.”

      I actually don’t really care much for the right or middle class handouts. A far better solution would be to cut taxes and not collect them in the first place. I suspect Johnny introduced FTB rather than cut taxes to make it difficult for the socialists to repeal.

      Taxes are so regressive in the first place that I don’t begrudge anyone that tries to claw back taxes. I mean really who in their right mind thinks giving around half of a dollar to the tax man is fair, other than the prosperity destroying nutjobs of the left.

    • andy says:

      02:34pm | 15/07/11

      @Sony B Goode - “Part of a larger system of FREEDOM” Haha, why dont we go to a flat tax structure, and remove all tax breaks then? No negative gearing, for example. No tax deductions. Lets see how much better off the rich and companies will be then. Our system is complex and confusing and lots of very wealthy people pay almost no tax. FREEDOM would be to remove all that. You arent arguing for FREEDOM - you are arguing for the status quo.

    • Erick says:

      02:37pm | 15/07/11

      Okay then, how about this: If private schools receive no government funding, then parents who send their children to a private school shall receive a rebate equal to that portion of their total taxes which goes to fund education.

      What could be fairer than that?

    • Reggie says:

      02:39pm | 15/07/11

      SBG, .  “but governments are poor providers of services,”...

      That’s a value judgement you are entitled to make SBG and if you feel strongly enough about it you are also entitled set up your own institutions, do a Jim Jones or start you own civil war, but don’t expect government backing.

    • andy says:

      03:06pm | 15/07/11

      @Erick @Tim - ok, thats also fine then. just let me know how you propose the govt should pay my share of negative gearing. i mean, i dont own a property but i do pay taxes so its only fair i get my “share”. actually, also feel free to pick any of the top ten richest people in australia and i will be happy to pay exactly the same percentage of my income as tax that they do.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      03:30pm | 15/07/11

      @Reggie its a fact not an opinion. Show me one country where socialised food production has not resulted in starvation?

      andy @“why dont we go to a flat tax structure, and remove all tax breaks then? No negative gearing, for example. No tax deductions”

      If you read what I have posted for quite a while you will find that a single tax level is exactly what I advocate. However I don’t begrudge anyone trying to claw back some the regressive marginal taxes people pay.

    • c.conserv. says:

      03:47pm | 15/07/11

      @Reggie mentions the elite.  This is so silly.  You know that parents from all walks of life send their children to private schools.  Who, in his/her right mind, would choose public over private?  It’s the same with health insurance.  We sacrifice a good part of our earnings - to get something better.
      Elite has nothing to do with it, Reggie

    • Tim says:

      04:17pm | 15/07/11

      Andy,
      I’d get rid of negative gearing.

    • Reggie says:

      04:32pm | 15/07/11

      Sony ???? “@Reggie its a fact not an opinion. Show me one country where socialised food production has not resulted in starvation?”

      How about India then, under the green revolution where grain production was multiplied by THREE times.  Sorry for mentioning that colour, I know what it does to conservatives. smile  Go on, ask for another one.

    • Reggie says:

      04:49pm | 15/07/11

      coop “Who, in his/her right mind, would choose public over private?”

      Ohhh I get the sense coop is female. First you judge those who choose state schools as “inferior”  or even “sub-normal” and regard yourself as one of the “elite.” 

      You’re falling off a bit though when you get to health insurance, I don’t understand what you mean. Perhaps it’s a bit close to home, suggesting your family involvement. For private organisations, made so under the auspice of JH, Health Funds have an unhealthy association with taxpayer subsidies. I’d have thought conservatives may have choked on these details but not if it is the source of your family income coop.

    • B says:

      05:04pm | 15/07/11

      @TubeSteak & KH

      I still see no valid argument from either of you.

      Both of you are saying that because I went to a private school Im not entitled to the same support money as the public system children?  Do you even LISTEN to yourselves when you talk or read your own comments?

      Public schools are the way they are because they are managed by the Government.  Nothing to do with the funding arangements.  This has been shown before.

      I dont think I need to add to the argument as all my points have already been made by most people here.

      You talk of equality?  But your proposal is far from it.  You want me to fund YOUR childs education through Taxes.  Which I will gladly do as it is the right thing to do.  But I also have to fund MY OWN child in private school even though I have paid a premium already for private?  How is this equality?

    • c.conserv. says:

      05:17pm | 15/07/11

      @Coop,  sorry -  the redoubtable Reggie senses you’re a girl.
      He might’ve meant me.
      Apology should soon follow from same intuitive commenter.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      06:54pm | 15/07/11

      Reggie am still waiting for the first example of collectivised food production not causing famine or starvation.

      India? wrong:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Famine#India
      india
      “in In 1966…Three years of drought in India resulted in an estimated 1.5 million deaths from starvation and disease”

      Cuba still cant feed its own people because of government incompetence
      http://www.economist.com/node/15769891


      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Famines_in_Russia_and_USSR#Post_1900_Droughts_and_Famines
      “The first famine in the USSR happened in 1921-1923 and garnered wide international attention. It was mostly due to forceful confiscation of grain and other policies of the Soviet government “
      “where by various estimates from 5 to 10 million may have starved to death “

      “The last major famine in the USSR happened in 1947 due to the severe drought and the mismanagement of grain reserves by the Soviet government”


      china:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward#Deaths_by_starvation

      “a long-time communist party member and a reporter for the official Chinese news agency Xinhua, puts the number of deaths from the Great Chinese Famine at 36 million”

      north korea mass starvation.
      http://www.economist.com/node/15769891

      and on it goes….

      as I said it is a fact that food production is too important to leave to the hands of governments, especially leftists governments that turn everything they touch to shit. PInk bats, BER, health reform, the list is endless even in Australia…

    • andy says:

      06:54pm | 15/07/11

      @erick - Hey, Erick I thought of something else. I don’t own a car. Ill need most of my road taxes back as well. After all its only fair. And families… why are they freeloading off me? Definitely want a refund for those costs. Really impressed with this brand new world of fairness you have opened up. I just keep on thinking of things that other people get that I dont get and which I am paying for. Sure you can have your tax refund for private schooling, but unless you are a massive hypocrite I am sure you will agree that this sets a huge precedent!

    • Sony B Goode says:

      09:13pm | 15/07/11

      andy it could be structured fully as a user pays system, rather than a refund system, but then why bother have the government do it? Why not just let private enterprise provide the solutions.

      I don’t begrudge anyone trying to get some of their taxes back when rates are absurd, but it would be far better simply not to take the money in the first place.

    • Bruce says:

      03:47am | 16/07/11

      Eric. The communists are now in control ! Next it will be black cars only.

    • Reggie says:

      02:06pm | 16/07/11

      Andy, “Really impressed with this brand new world of fairness you have opened up. I just keep on thinking of things that other people get that I dont get and which I am paying for.”

      Andy your astute observation deserves more that a glib dismissal from the blinkered SBG.

      Under his plan to leave all infrastructure to private investors, we would have the same degradation that threatens the United States where no-one wants to pay for anything, not the least roads, or safe bridges.
      The same bridges you find displaced US citizens living under in the cardboard boxes SBD advocates.  The thought of having building standards, particularly in domestic housing, is regarded as interference in the consumers’ right to screw-up.  SBG loves that.

      Rules and supervision grow up out of failure and judging from SBG’s failure to update his AH observation, he is working on a grossly outdated set of observations that were imprinted on his inflexible psyche by some conservative geek back in year dot and is in need of a reset.

      The idea that guns, drugs, alcohol, cars and copious quantities of flag-waving will distract the ordinary citizen from politics, is a very clever ruse to keep the US voters from noticing how they are being manipulated by the Conservative factions. This is also welcomed by by our soap-box orator on the principle of faux-liberalism, which is the opposite of conservatism. Once again we encounter the two faces of Australian Right-Wing Politics, the two faces that Robert Gorgon Menzies adopted to confuse the voters.

      Conservative always whinge about infrastructure because, once again, the want to have it, and use it, and benefit from it, but they don’t want to pay for it. They regard state school as an impost on their income for the bottom end of society, while simultaneously ignoring the fact that they need the workers the system produces and that if this large portion of society is left to squalor, the may rise up and savage the conservatives.

      All of which is labeled as socialist evil by the purveyor of Japanese imports while his stream of conservative rancor seeks actively to bring an ever deepening chasms of division. Why do I get the impression that SBG is an abrasive POM? Note the distinction.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      06:33pm | 16/07/11

      Reggie has gone off on a tangent because I rarely advocate much beyond single tiered tax so he is just presuming to stereotype me and would in fact be wrong. It’s the false dichotomy of assuming that if someone attacks a position they must support the opposite.

      However Reggie you got pwned hard core. I am still waiting for a single instance of socialised food production that has not resulted in famines and starvation.

      Socialism is however, clearly an evil that must be excised like the cancer it is.

    • Reggie says:

      08:30pm | 16/07/11

      SBG ” Socialism is however, clearly an evil that must be excised like the cancer it is.”

      Then as socialism is only another shade of democracy, you do indeed label Democracy an evil and seek to dismantle it for the strictures it creates for authoritarian conservatism?  I call THAT an own goal.

      So it appears also that you are labeling private schools as seats of authoritarian conservatism. That makes them anti-democratic and treasonable organizations. But fear not, we real Democrats can find humour in your idiosyncrasies.

    • James says:

      02:36pm | 19/07/11

      Ok Erick but you can’t use the roads, public hospitals, police, firebrigade, public parks, footpaths, medicare, railway lines etc

    • CJ Morgan says:

      06:36am | 15/07/11

      What a confused piece.  Our government schools are starved of funds while taxpayers’ money subsidises the playing fields of Kings and Ascham.  The Greens’ policy to redress this ridiculous misallocation of funds to the “wealthiest schools” is shamelessly morphed into an attack on Catholic education, which then morphs into Donnelly’s real agenda - the protection of the right of private schools , not only to taxpayer funding,  but also to discriminate against non-heterosexual pupils and staff.

      The Greens may be vulnerable in some policy areas, but I suspect that defending public education is not one of them.  Currently, taxpayers are subsidising the wealthy to further increase their advantage over their own children in many cases, and I think I’m one of many voters who think that’s wrong.

      Also, Donnelly seems to think that students and staff of private schools are entitled to less rights than those in the real world.  How on earth he justifies that in the 21st century is beyond me, nor how any unindoctrinated parent could subject their impressionable kids to religious brainwashing at these bastions of entrenched privilege.

      If parents want to subject their kids to such treatment, be it on their own heads - but I don’t want any of my tax money going anywhere near a private school, particularly “faith-based” ones.

    • Peter says:

      07:24am | 15/07/11

      “Donnelly’s real agenda - the protection of the right of private schools , not only to taxpayer funding,  but also to discriminate against non-heterosexual pupils and staff.”
      So what?
      Private schools have every right to discriminate against anyone who does not fit in with their beliefs and parents who share those beliefs should feel safe that their child is not being subjected to views with which they disagree.

    • Adam says:

      07:27am | 15/07/11

      Talk about confused writing, those in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. This is the dumbest response to any argument I’ve ever seen. It’s just ad hominem gibberish. You say the writer is wrong, where is your contradiction of the figures? It’s just slur and gibberish rolled into rant. The writer writes that independent schools school get half the government funding of a state school student, and you write that’s too much. Fair enough, you based your argument on what evidence? Oh, because King’s builds fields using state money. And of course you have proof of this!?!?

      You wrote:
      ‘If parents want to subject their kids to such treatment, be it on their own heads - but I don’t want any of my tax money going anywhere near a private school, particularly “faith-based” ones.’

      This is absolute nonsense. Based on your argument, every parent who places their child in independent schools should be allowed to stop their taxes from going to state schools. Of course you don’t believe this, which demonstrates just what a hypocrite you are!

      When you are able to contribute to a debate in a sensible fashion, instead of with cheap emotionalism, then your argument may get traction. But whilst you continue to ignore rational argument and simply put forth irrational gibberish, I will never listen to you.

    • Tator says:

      07:40am | 15/07/11

      CJ Morgan,
      Public Schools are funded mainly by the States, who up until 2008, have been mainly ALP Governments.  These ALP Governments have bloated their bureaucracies to the detriment of both public education and health.  These same states received between 2000/01 and 07/08 more than $167 billion more than they budgeted for in taxation revenue and increased their administrative staffing by 63%(98600 to 160900)  compared to education sector employees increasing by 16% (442300 up to 513500) and health and community services increased by 14% (318700 up to 365200).  In fact the people working in Government Administration grew from 9% of the total of the public service to 12%.  So basically the ALP governments have blown this extra revenue on paper shufflers and not front line services.  Data is from the ABS, Wage and Salary Earners, Public Sector, Australia, cat. no. 6248.0.55.001

    • B says:

      08:00am | 15/07/11

      I have not met a person who was wealthy and went to a private school.  My dad owned a Auto Electrician Business and paid my way through private school because he wanted me to be at the school he went to.

      He paid $20,000 plus over my schooling.  He could barley afford it but he did it to get me a better education.  Dont you DARE tell me that taxpayers are subsidising the wealthy.  It has always been the other way around.

      Dont be a sour puss because you wont fork out or sacrifice for your children.  You just want the government to pay for it for you.  Typical leftist drivel CJ.  VERY typical.

    • J says:

      08:04am | 15/07/11

      What a confused comment

    • L. says:

      09:26am | 15/07/11

      I agree with CJMorgan..

      The article started off about private Vs public funding, then morphed into a rant about private schools being able to hire and fire based upon one’s sexual or religious preference.

      I think CJ nailed it.

    • Dean says:

      09:55am | 15/07/11

      @ C J Morgan
      ” Our government schools are starved of funds “
      no their not, public schools receive more government money than anyone else, as the BER showed ,they just don’t spend it very well.

    • L. says:

      10:18am | 15/07/11

      “as the BER showed ,they just don’t spend it very well.”

      My understanding is that were not allowed to spend it very weel, and were dictated to in terms of BER project overheads, all in the name of expediency.

    • c.conserv. says:

      04:33pm | 15/07/11

      CJMorgan:  “bastions of entrenched privilege”?  You didn’t get to go private - and you’re proud of it
      Overwrought

    • Tator says:

      06:03pm | 15/07/11

      CJ Morgan,
      Taxpayers do not subsidise the green playing fields or infrastructure of any private school.  The funds provided by the Federal Government are for recurrent costs only ie tuition.  The infrastructure costs are born by parents via an infrastructure/building levy, alumni donations and bequests and borrowings -  which in the end is paid for by parents.  Mainly, the only infrastructure paid for by the government were the BER projects provided by the ALP Rudd government.

    • Zaf says:

      10:06pm | 15/07/11

      [He paid $20,000 plus over my schooling.  He could barley afford it but he did it to get me a better education.  Dont you DARE tell me that taxpayers are subsidising the wealthy.  It has always been the other way around.]

      The wealthy have always subsidised the taxpayers?

      20K well spent, I see.

    • Reggie the Monster. says:

      09:18pm | 16/07/11

      Zaf.  ” He could barley afford .....”

      “20K well spent, I see.”  Yes we see.

    • Fiddler says:

      06:39am | 15/07/11

      After reading about these things going on in Canberra (and many other Western countries) am I the only one who has this sense of being in Rome just before it fell and the dark ages came??

    • Erick says:

      07:57am | 15/07/11

      I very often get the same sort of feeling. I hope it’s just paranoia.

    • Mark G says:

      08:52am | 15/07/11

      Yes, the barbarian tribes are going to roll in from the north to overthrow our empire. Wait no, they are just trying to sell Ikea products to us these days. thats ok. Yes thats right. we are not the romans. we are not a single empire that has advanced ahead of the rest of the world. We are not a fragile empire centrally governed and ripe to fall. If one country falls these days another will just pick up where it left off. So no I dont feel we are on the verge of the dark ages.

    • Fiona says:

      09:16am | 15/07/11

      I got a book called “the down side of up” which talks about this very thing. Makes interesting reading. You’re not alone….......

    • fml says:

      10:47am | 15/07/11

      With you there Mark G,

      The antediluvian ideology by these fear mongers is a result of nothing more than the fear of their insulated little world falling to bits. The Roman empire is a microcosm of their lives. Living in excess with continual conquest with a fear of the ‘mob’. Anybody who disagrees with them will be their Hannibal. Remember Carthage.

    • Reggie says:

      12:30pm | 15/07/11

      Erick, ” I very often get the same sort of feeling. I hope it’s just paranoia.”

      How to respond to THAT?

      Welcoming paranoia does seen a bit paranoid. But from observations of the past it’s not paranoia, ‘cos one day the big green asteroid will appear and calm your hopes and fears.

      I’ll have to check, but I thought the Dark Ages were the result of Black Death and religious fear, (encouraged by the church)  that it was a punishment from God.  We had some woman roaming the halls of Punch the other day expounding this theory. I remember, “when will God lose patience?”

      What DO they teach at these private schools? Is myth taught or inveigled?

    • Fiddler says:

      03:33pm | 15/07/11

      Reggie, the dark ages were brought on by the fall of the Roman Empire and loss of organisation. The black death was somewhat later., in the 14th century. I make this somewhat hyperbolic claim because I think Western society has become so soft and navel-gazing (read inner-city greens) like the Roman Empire that it will collapse. Question is with a bang or a whisper?

    • Sony B Goode says:

      04:12pm | 15/07/11

      peak government is coming, socialists have spent all the other people’s money and baby boomers will soon be expecting their retirement entitlements…

    • Reggie says:

      05:21pm | 15/07/11

      Sony B,  This is just SO silly.  ” peak government is coming, socialists have spent all the other people’s money and baby boomers will soon be expecting their retirement entitlements…”

      In 1940/41, the US raked in all the gold in the Western World before it was forced to put some up to stand against an aggressor. In other words, It capitalized on suffering.

      Say again after me ... THE United States CAPITALIZED ON SUFFERING.

      They didn’t spend other people’s money. They SUCKED it in. Ever since they have been spending the assets of the UK, Australia and the world on a gay old time for the upper 1% and regenerating their wealth by investment in arms and war and by asset stripping the infrastructure of the US.  Fortunately we in Australia have NOT been so cavalier, with the lives of our citizens, we have tried to keep a balance and from that balance has come a concern for all levels of society.

      Your extremist soap-boxing about the evils of socialism have the death rattle of a sinking conservative determined to drag as many as possible down with him.  You make it quite obvious that you’d prefer to have whole families living in cardboard boxes so that you life-style would not come under threat. Well hopefully you WILL have to suffer some loss, not too much, just enough to ensure that those who have served the nation are supported in their latter years.

      That’s what Australian Democracy is about and why Conservatives absolutely HATE the fact that our democracy moderates their demands. .

    • Reggie says:

      10:24pm | 15/07/11

      Thanks for that explanation Fiddler.

      “Question is with a bang or a whisper?”  Tell me you meant to write whimper

      Sorry. smile

    • Peter says:

      07:01am | 15/07/11

      This is yet another example of the Greens’ hidden agenda.
      It is difficult for the Greens to comprehend that there are normal people in society who do not smoke marijuana, who are not homosexual, who do believe in a Higher Being.
      To them, the Catholic and private schools are a breeding ground for everything they oppose and would prefer that our children be indoctrinated with their beliefs in the public system.
      Irrespective of where I choose to send my children, they are entitled to the same amount of government funding and the amount of fees I choose to pay for my children’s education should have no bearing on the level of funding allocated to their school.

    • Coop says:

      02:04pm | 15/07/11

      You get an A+ for this

    • JohnB says:

      07:08am | 15/07/11

      If there were no private schools the cost to the tax payer would be much, much higher. This issue is simply the Greens wanting to take from people who achieve and hand the money to those that don’t. It’s socialism. And NO, my kids are not in private schools, but I know the facts and I know the Greens.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      07:13am | 15/07/11

      Socialists are always looking to destroy prosperity where even they find it. Even if that means kids become collateral damage.

      The public is waking up to the fact that Socialism is evil.

    • sam says:

      01:06pm | 15/07/11

      I love how people who on the right bandy that word “socialism”
      When your pal Johnny howard handed out cash galore to the private schools, you were happy as a pig in mud.
      Tell me what is NOT socialist about that?

    • B says:

      04:49pm | 15/07/11

      @Sam

      Actually since your the one calling it.  What IS socialist about it?  I spend my time pointing out socialist policy for Liberal AND Labor governments.  But I must have missed that little gem.

      Pray, tell me what IS socialist about it?  Also back up your claims!!!

    • Reggie says:

      05:47pm | 15/07/11

      Come off it B.

      Private schools represent themselves as INDEPENDENT…. of WHAT?

      Not SO independent that they refuse to taint themselves with tax-payer subsidy. In fact they scream their dependance with bated breath at every opportunity. Just another display of conservative indecision.

      They WANT the subsidy but they don’t want to be beholden to anyone.

    • Reggie says:

      05:32pm | 16/07/11

      Sam SBG slams socialism because he is too gutless to slam democracy.

      I’ve said it before but apparently I need to point it out again. Democracy has many shades and socialism is only one variant. Conservatives despise democracy for the fact that it limits their aspirations to authoritarianism.

      Australian Democracy is NOT the one SDB prefer, he prefers the extremism of the US Republican Party with it’s secret admiration of racial segregation and other views that parallel National Socialism.

    • John says:

      09:36pm | 16/07/11

      Reggie says:

      What does Conservatism have to do with authoritarianism?
      Controlling a border, wanting to maintain a culture, wanting to maintain christianity only, wanting to maintain a race? Where is the authoritarianism in that? For last 2000 years western nations have been like this, but only after WWII marxist radicals who don’t give two stuff’s what anyone else thinks, all they care about is their way or the highway! These authoritarian marxist liberal leftists have enforced third world immigration to every western nation, enforced multicultural policy’s onto westerners who do not want it! opened the borders between Mexico and the US, flooded europe with third world immigration. But we are the authoritarians!!! Subjected to utter treason by these leftist liberal Marxist traitors who have flooded our nations with aliens who are a burden on social system, police forces, religious system,  legal system, medical system and our cultural progression!! We could of been on mars by now, if they didn’t flood the third world into the west! Now we are heading back to the stone age, because of these leftists! The west is not a refuge for failed cultures, religions and tribes. Let them fix their own problems instead of running from them.

    • JohnB says:

      07:14am | 15/07/11

      As custodians of the environmental vote, the environment couldn’t have a bigger enemy than the Greens. They dither with all these ridiculous peripheral issues while Australia’s population explodes to four times sustainability. They are a joke.

    • Mark G says:

      08:58am | 15/07/11

      Careful JohnB. When you are talking about environmentalism you are not suppose to mention population control. Thats a “No, No”. Your only supposed to talk about renewable energy, shorter showers, recycling, electric cars ect.
      You’ll get yourself branded a nazi. Dick Smith did that and look what happened

    • fml says:

      11:03am | 15/07/11

      Thats because population control has nothing to do with environmentalism, Its reducing the population so you can keep using the same amount of resources and keep the same life style at the expense of some one elses life. Less people means you can maintain your lifestyle and not feel guilty about it.

    • JohnB says:

      11:39am | 15/07/11

      Well, yeah fml.

      The alternative is too many people with no one enjoying their lifestyle. And don’t forget the term used SUSTAINABLE. Nothing is sustainable with too many people. Anyone not seeing population as the biggest problem to the environment is not thinking, or rather there thoughts are clouded by the ridiculous nonsense of idealism.

      So true Mark G…We can’t get any dumber…..Saving plastic bags and the whales just won’t do it.

    • fml says:

      12:06pm | 15/07/11

      JohnB,

      Just seems to me people are too lazy to live smarter, just cull the population and she’ll be right. Of course they are never the ones to be culled, are they?

    • Mark G says:

      12:07pm | 15/07/11

      FML,

      Environmentalism has nothing to do with population?

      Let me add some simple maths to it. You have a couple who normally have 20 min showers. That is 40mins of showers for the household. Being good environmentalists they decide to have timed showers. They now only have 10 min showers. This means water consumption is halved to 20 mins for the household. Now they decide to have four kids. Each is raised as a good environmental citizen. They have 10 min showers each. The household now has 60 mins worth of showers. Any reduction in the environmental strain is removed, irrelevant of how environmental the family is. Apply this to the entire population and you have a problem. Even if you live a perfect green lifestyle. Even the most efficient green households still use resources (even if its only to build them) just significantly less of them. Over populate and you end up back where you started. It just delays the inevitable end of resources. Population being an exponential function will mean that this delay will be very minimal.

      Environmentalism has everything to do with population. It’s just another defunct ‘head in the sand’ socialist idea that it doesn’t. Pollution occurs for a reason and thats demand for good and services. The most effective way to reduce pollution is to reduce demand. The best way to reduce demand is to keep your population under control. Therefore the quickest and most effective way to prevent global warming is to control population. I know this is a hard fact of life. I hate it as much as i am sure you do. By anyone who so much as suggests this is automatically branded a Nazi and dismissed. Environmentalism without population control becames nothing more than a mechanism to illeviate the guilt the we are felling for destroying the Earth but has no long term effect on the prevention of this destruction.

    • fml says:

      12:41pm | 15/07/11

      MArk,

      My point is the people who use population control as an environmental issue do so because they refuse to change their lifestyle to benefit the environment, they say lower the population so they dont have to change their lifestyle.

    • JohnB says:

      01:09pm | 15/07/11

      I went to comment on fml….. Mark G has done a fine job…

      The “environmentalists” have absolutely no idea.

      The world population is increasing by eighty million a year, Australia is about double it’s sustainable population. My kids come home from school and tell me “dad we need a worm farm so we can save the planet”...

      I’ve never seen in my 46 years more head in the sand stuff than what we do re population vs. environment.

      The most important environmental problem by a bazillion gillion miles fml is over population. You carry on having shorter showers and in the 10 minutes of energy and water you’ve saved there’ll be 1500 extra people on the planet that need showers.

    • JohnB says:

      01:16pm | 15/07/11

      @fml…...“they say lower the population so they dont have to change their lifestyle”

      If you don’t lower the population you can’t carry on living anything like what we all think we can. We are already way, way, way on the wrong side of sustainable. It is simple maths, it is simple concepts, it is simple logic. The planet is horrendously overpopulated and the best the clowns in government can come up with is a carbon tax and save the whales and now an attack on private schools.

      Come on use your intellect fml, take off the socialist tainted glasses and see what is so blindingly obvious.

    • Wilma J Craig says:

      07:21am | 15/07/11

      Given their policies, their tacit support for the anti-Israel stance by some of the Green’s senators the Greens pose the greatest threat to Australia’s economy & I would go so far as to say the Environment that Australia has ever faced. Freedom? Under the Greens you can forget that concept altogether. They pay lip service to the fringe groups because they see votes in it.
      They are no longer the least bit interested in the environment. They are power-mad. They will stop at nothing to get their own way. Australians neither like nor tolerate extremists. The Greens are an ultra-left wing bunch of extremists. They will, if we let them, end up destroying this country.

    • Peter says:

      07:31am | 15/07/11

      “Those who fail to learn from history are bound to repeat the same mistakes.”
      Or words to that effect.
      Western society has descended to the level of debauchery of the Roman Empire prior to it collapsing.

    • James1 says:

      08:55am | 15/07/11

      So, if we cut funding to private schools, Vandals will destroy Canberra?

      Seriously though, I wouldn’t worry too much.  Its all part of the political cycle - swings and roundabouts.

    • jackie says:

      07:57am | 15/07/11

      This is one of the many reasons that stopped before voting green in the last election, it is reverse snobbery. Don’t they realise if all the families at private schools moved into the public the system couldn’t cope with the influx.
      Greens really need to change their name to RED.

    • Coop says:

      02:26pm | 15/07/11

      try it with paint. Mix green and red and it always comes out brown

    • Reggie says:

      03:06pm | 15/07/11

      Coop “Mix green and red and it always comes out brown ‘

      Trust a conservative to use -subtractive- colours. ROFL. Oh the misery!

    • Daniel says:

      08:08am | 15/07/11

      Go Greens. This is a good policy. My kids are at schools with no heating and its not fair. I vote Greens and will continue to vote Greens.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      08:26am | 15/07/11

      Maybe if labor didn’t squander so much money on BER. Public schools could have got what they need, rather than what they didn’t.

      Socialists are so preoccupied trying to destroy prosperity, akin to plucking an eye from the sighted and handing it to the blind that everything they touch turns to shit.

    • Anthony of WA says:

      09:03am | 15/07/11

      Good on you Daniel, with the Greens wishes your kids will still have no heating at school.

    • James1 says:

      09:05am | 15/07/11

      But heating your kids’ school will kill polar bears, Daniel.  Don’t look to the Greens to fix that.

      My daughter’s school has a P&C controlled by a doctors’ wives Green faction.  They had $4000 to spend two years ago.  The choices were install air conditioning so that the kids didn’t have to go home when it got up to 35 degrees, or spend the money on making the school carbon neutral, effectively doing nothing at all.  Instead of making sure our kids weren’t overheating in summer, they decided to make a 250 kid school carbon neutral, thus saving mankind from certain death at the hand of climate change, at the expense of some sweaty children.

    • Rose says:

      09:24am | 15/07/11

      Your kids’ school is not missing out on heating because private schools are funded, that’s absolute crap. The heating is missing because the school/education department has elected not to install it. If the parents started a concerted campaign to pressure the powers that be you would get your heating. That is why wealthier public schools are better resourced, because the student/parent body demands it!
      Remember, when private schools require these types of improvements there is often a massive fundraising effort to get them. Private school parents not only pay fees but we regularly contribute through fundraising. Try putting an effort into your school,  you’d be surprised what the school could afford then!

    • Dave says:

      09:26am | 15/07/11

      I think you only read parts of of this article that make the Greens sound good. You missed the facts about going against all international & local human rights agreements. Private schools get far less funding than government schools so you should ask your school what it is doing with the funding!! All the Greens want to do is take away freedom of choice and parental rights to educate their children in the best manner. My children have been in both systems and private schools provide the best discipline and learning environment by far. I suggest you go ask the Green MPs which system they were educated in

    • Tom says:

      10:30am | 15/07/11

      Thanks for the good story @James1. ... I bet the doctors wives sat at home in their air conditioned houses and drove their air-conditioned 4 wheel drives while their kids were there sweating and earning mummies’ brownie points in heaven.

    • iansand says:

      11:12am | 15/07/11

      I haven’t checked the fee statements, but I think that, every year, I pay enough in semi-compulsory building fund contributions to buy a heater or three.  Get off your arse and do something if the issue is that important.

    • fml says:

      11:41am | 15/07/11

      Kids nowadays have it so easy!

      I used to walk 20 miles to school in 50 degree heat!

      Not really, but the kids nowadays could do with a bit toughen up.

    • Reggie the Monster. says:

      12:38pm | 15/07/11

      fml ” I used to walk 20 miles to school in 50 degree heat!

      Rubbish. Five hours each way every day and it’s highly unlikely that morning and afternoon temperatures were regularly 50C. I remember a cyclone pushing me backwards on my bike too. About twice. smile

      I think it’s the parents who need to toughen up.

    • AdamC says:

      01:27pm | 15/07/11

      James1, that sounds like the kind of story you would make up as a joke. It’s amazing how political reality can be even loonier than political rhetoric.

      I think the Daniels of this world are stupefyingly naive. The Greens seem to think they can do everything for everyone. It’s totally ridiculous.

    • Kate says:

      06:54pm | 15/07/11

      So would you prefer that nobody could afford to attend private schools, so not only are your kids at schools with no heating, they also have 40+ people in their classes? Then they won’t need heating, it’ll be stuffy in the classrooms with so many kids in there.
      I come from a decidedly working-class family, yet my sister and I still went to private schools. We could afford this because my parents made a hell of a lot of sacrifices, plus we both worked hard enough to earn scholarships. Private schools are not evil.

    • Economist says:

      08:24am | 15/07/11

      We get a piece that doesn’t have the words Gillard and tax and the contributions so far have he same innuendoes and generalisations. I’ll provide sources later but lets understand the situation.

      I have no problem with the subsidisation of private schools where there is financial and curriculum accountability. The MySchool website is currently looking to change this. Surveys find that people choose to educate their children privately largely because of the schools values followed by accountability to parents (particularly bullying policies) and possibly then quality of education and curriculum, Dr Donnelly can correct me if I’m wrong. These are perfectly valid choices and morally subsidising this through taxes that they pay is fine. It’s no different to private health, but at least with education your funding people to deliver it locally rather than whacking up the profits of insurance companies, many overseas multinationals,

      ‘The private schools save the tax payer argument is bogus, I’ve previously demonstrated this and at this stage won’t do it again.

      Dr Donnelly is right, the Greens policy is unreasonable. Nor though should we go too far the other way and privatise education (seriously @Sony B Goode, public education is the essential). The recent move of private school teachers to move away is perfectly legitimate.

      Clearly though improvement need to be made in public education through greater school autonomy and accountability for local public schools. And yes less bureaucracy, particularly where it inhibits rather than aids.

      Lets not forget Australia remains in the top 10 despite spending significantly less than many other countries overseas, partly because parents do a lot of heavy lifting and partly because teachers aren’t so bad. Theirs certainly room for improvements but can we stop making it an ideological battleground.

    • commonsense says:

      09:56am | 15/07/11

      @Economist

      ‘The private schools save the tax payer argument is bogus, I’ve previously demonstrated this and at this stage won’t do it again. ’ - Why?  because the case is bogus???

      SIMPLE commonsense dictates that if I have a two bowls, one private education and one public.  Then I mix the private education contents with the public education bowl and I get what?  AN OVERFLOWED BOWL.

      If ALL students were in the public system the tax’s would need to be raised by at least 40% to cover the shortfall.

      You certainly dont seem to be showing any ecomonic credentials nor sense.  Which is quite disturbing when you name yourself “economist”

    • AdamC says:

      12:42pm | 15/07/11

      Good points, Economist. But aren’t they boradly in line with Donnelly’s own?

      I suppose, for selfish reasons, I would agree with the Greens up to a point on not giving religious schools carte blanche to discriminate against my people. Aside from that, as usual, their policy is a barking dog.

    • Reggie says:

      01:24pm | 17/07/11

      commonsense “Then I mix the private education contents with the public education bowl and I get what?”

      The same number of teachers seeking jobs.
      The same number of students to be educated.
      The same number of classrooms available for use.

      What’s this screwy logic about eliminating all private school teachers from seeking employment and burning down the private classrooms. Your commonsense is letting you down vaunted one.

    • Jeremy says:

      08:24am | 15/07/11

      Ah, “class envy”.

      Let me guess - a defence of privilege? Why shouldn’t some kids have a much better education they’ve done nothing to deserve than others with whom they’ll then compete for university places and jobs?

      BECAUSE IT’S PROFOUNDLY UNJUST IS WHY KEVIN.

      As for “why can’t we send our kids to schools that will teach them our groundless prejudices against minority groups” - because it’s not fair to them or the future society in which they’ll live.

    • Mark G says:

      09:13am | 15/07/11

      So because its unjust that some kinds have a better education (those that pay for the majority of it anyway) you force every kid into a public school at a massive direct cost to public resources so that everyone is worse off and disadvantaged. The flaw in the socialist model. Want an example, look a the fall of the soviet union. Control wages and pricing in a desperate attempt to prevent disadvatage. You destroy the economy, limit business confidence and untimately bankrupt your country (monetarily, socially and educationally). China has only gotten wealthy because they have eased their socialist state and allowed Capitalistic western economic measures. The idea of taking money of the rich doesn’t make the poor better off. It makes everyone worse off. This is why socialism is something that works better on paper.

    • B says:

      10:14am | 15/07/11

      So a “Bring everyone down to my level” mentality?  Grow up mate.  You sound like a kid in the playground upset because someone else has a chocolate and you dont.

    • Matt says:

      08:29am | 15/07/11

      And yet you haven’t supplied one good reason that the government - seperate from church and state - should fund non-government schools.  In fact, when you’re talking about one of the wealthiest institutions on earth, why the hell should the government be funding them?  They already get tax exemption, why throw funding at them - especially when they’re free to discriminate, not only against teachers but the students as well? 

      Good on Bob, I’ll fully support this.  Especially when some of the government school go without..

    • L. says:

      09:36am | 15/07/11

      “And yet you haven’t supplied one good reason that the government - seperate from church and state - should fund non-government schools.”

      Because the parents of the kids in private schools pay their taxes as well..?? How’s that for starters?

    • Matt says:

      10:52am | 15/07/11

      Pretty poor actually L…  I don’t ride a bicycle to work yet my taxes pay for cycle lanes.  I’m not in hospital 24/7 but my taxes pay for hospitals.  I don’t have kids but my taxes pay for schools.  I probably don’t use a lot of things my taxes pay for..  Do you use every single thing your taxes pay for?

      Private in name should be private in funding too.  Especially if they don’t have to comply to government standards eg. discrimination.. I’d support a small tax cut for parents sending their kids to private school, but fund it privately and leave government funds for government schools that are lacking.

    • Matt says:

      11:12am | 15/07/11

      Not really surprising at all,

      ‘Kevin is Director of Melbourne-based Education Standards Institute. http://www.edstandards.com.au  ESI is a conservative think-tank committed to an education system based on standards, equity, diversity and choice and the values and institutions that promote liberty, democracy, an open and free society and a commitment to Christian beliefs and values.’

      ‘An open an free society and a commitment to Christian beliefs and values’ -  I guess it’s open and free unless you’re homosexual hey Kevin?  no wonder the attack on Bob Brown.  Typical christian fanatic. God forbid children should be taught equality, or should that be Kevin forbid…

    • fml says:

      11:47am | 15/07/11

      Fully Agree Matt,

      The government shouldnt pay schools to discriminate. This is fully acceptable just wait till the article comes out on the exact same subject, just replace christian with muslim. Watch the people come out of the wood work then and complain that the government shouldnt spend their taxes!

    • Tator says:

      05:44pm | 15/07/11

      Matt,
      considering a lot of Catholic schools actually teach non catholic children.  An example, my son’s school, a Domincan boys school, had the boys do their first confession, when I turned up for a meeting regarding this rite, only half the parents from his class were there and when I asked the head of primary about where they were, he stated that they were not catholic, in fact there were as many muslims, buddhists and hindu children in this one catholic school class as there were catholics, go figure.

    • James In Footscray says:

      08:29am | 15/07/11

      Weren’t we discussing this stuff in 1984? The left-wingers are going to bring the whole private school system crashing down any moment. Just like then.

    • John says:

      11:39am | 15/07/11

      Marxists tend want to control the educational system, maybe this might explain why they want to stop funding of private schools. If they can stop the funding, the cost of school will rise and the family’s might not be able to afford to have them in private schools. This push’s the people back to public schools, where the Marxists have more influence to brainwash the youth to the marxist cause.

    • James In Footscray says:

      12:50pm | 15/07/11

      ‘Marxists’! Wow, more eighties nostalgia! smile

    • Reggie says:

      03:02pm | 15/07/11

      Bullshit JIF. The elitists built the private school edifice to the worship of their own grandeur.

      As you seem to admit they ARE right-wing conservatives, that’s what they DO. Build monuments of stone and permanence, so of COURSE they are going to be upset and disappointed if they put their trust in sand and it comes crumbling down. Don’t blame the lefties, blame the stupid conservative attitudes that cause them to resent CHANGE.

      Perhaps we should consider financing carbon reform by withdrawing private school subsidies on the grounds that elitists have been abusing the environment for far too long already.

    • c.conserv. says:

      06:30pm | 15/07/11

      @Reggie

      So jealous.
      So bitter.

      Not too late to take up those veterinarian studies you were dreaming of?

    • James In Footscray says:

      10:44pm | 15/07/11

      Oh dear, I have to work on my satire! That’s twice now left-wingers think I’m being right-wing ...

    • Reggie says:

      04:21pm | 16/07/11

      FFS   CC ...    “So jealous.  So bitter.”

      If that’s your considered opinion CC, then I hope you’re still at school and that you will one one day escape the strictures of your narrow upbringing.

      It’s a bit sad to see John and James and the rest having to resort to terms like brainwashing and Marxist and others that suggest a narrow point of view when by using them they reveal their own total inability to perceive it in their own words. 

      But at least CC, they have stepped a little bit away from the childish name-calling the righteous have been vomiting for so long. Not you. You’re stuck right back there in the same old childish crap we have come to expect from that lowest common denominator, NicoleG.  smile

    • c.conservative says:

      08:07pm | 16/07/11

      @Reggie. 

      You’ve got your left mixed up with your right,  little monster.
      The bitter, the waspish, the agitated -  they’re the Left!  Always been that way.

      What a cute, coy smile you have

    • c.conservative says:

      08:39pm | 16/07/11

      @Reggie.  Horrible thought!  Your reprimand had the tone of a certain S . . no   - dare not elaaborate.  I may be hunted down and ticked off by the master himself.


      No lcd going on here, R
      Very high perch

    • Reggie says:

      09:29pm | 16/07/11

      C Conservative…Speak up, you’re stammering boy. smile And watch your f****** spelling too. Reprimand? What f****** reprimand? This is sport!

    • confidently conservative says:

      12:16am | 17/07/11

      So coarse
      So unsurprising

    • Annie says:

      08:30am | 15/07/11

      What a joke. Walking around the grounds of MLC and Scotch I wonder if you could see a difference between them and some of the poorest public schools with no heating, poor facilities and huge class sizes. I wonder who needs tax dollars more?
      Aussie kids should be able to get a quality education no matter what their parents do for a living! If that means diverting some tax dollars away from schools that already have a couple of heated swimming pools then so be it.

    • Tom says:

      11:00am | 15/07/11

      Funny that, people who earn more money are able to give more to their children. Whooodathunkit?

      “Aussie kids should be able to get a quality education no matter what their parents do for a living!” Tell that to the fatuous socialist dipsticks running our public system.

    • Mark says:

      11:41am | 15/07/11

      That people see a lush green sports oval and a heated swimming pool, and automatically assume that place offers a better educational experience, is pretty funny in itself.

      Plenty of kids who leave private schools are bloody useless, just like public schools.

      It’s about the teachers, and expanding your brain, even if the seat you’re sitting in isn’t quite as comfortable.  The best teachers are usually the best because they’re passionate, which frequently coincides with them working it the public system.

      Have some stomach for the experience and recognise what’s really important – try passing that value onto your kids, rather than bringing them up to be inverse snobs who become hyper-jealous at the sight of some superficiality that someone else may have access to.

      Get over your petty jealousies and try teaching your kids not to judge based on appearances, and not to sook because somebody else may be fortunate enough to have access something that you may not.  If it really means that much to you, maybe when having kids you should have recognised that and budgeted accordingly.  It’s a free country - don’t blame others for your own choices.

    • CH says:

      08:31am | 15/07/11

      “..the policy argues that governments have the right to legislate to enforce what is described as, “acceptance and celebration of diversity” “

      “When it comes to the curriculum, the policy states that the Australian Greens, “want the education system to provide age-appropriate information about the diversity of sexuality””

      You treat these things as though they are evil “left-wing ideology”.. and have the nerve to say that these things somehow “fly in the face of international and local human rights agreements”. Are you mad?

      ..and as I read to the end of the article, I realised it’s true agenda. In relation to the issue of these schools receiving tax dollars, I don’t agree with the Greens policy. But not for the same reasons as you. Any school that teaches inequality between fellow humans, and refuses to teach honestly informed sexual education, in my mind is not deserving of public dollars.

      But to address the true nature of this article, does anyone still wonder why the Christian lobbyists in this country are seen as mad hatters by the rest of society, including many of the same faith? The things you argue against are the basic tenants of a modern western society. You can’t possibly argue for support from the government of this country while denigrating the most basic of values for which this country stands for.

    • Tax exempt paedophile says:

      08:48am | 15/07/11

      This article brought to you by someone who went through the school system when it was fully funded by government all the way through the tertiary level.

      How many of our right-wing parliamentarians and “commentators” took advantage of the system they now decry?

      Cry me a river, you partisan shill.

    • James In Footscray says:

      02:24pm | 15/07/11

      What’s a ‘shill’?

    • c.conserv. says:

      07:22pm | 15/07/11

      I think a “shill”  is a decoy.  Maybe a lure.

      Reggie and The Badger could be shills.  Roughly speaking

    • Reggie says:

      02:13pm | 16/07/11

      CC “Roughly speaking”  You speak like a girl. smile

    • Coop says:

      04:02pm | 16/07/11

      Got something against girls Reg?
      The second time Ive seen you try to win a point that way.

      You speak like a 10 year old

    • Reggie says:

      02:22pm | 17/07/11

      Oh the pain of interfacing with humourless conservatives coop.

      CC “roughly speaking” is not close enough, if you’re going to settle for near enough, them leave it to someone else.

      You’re right TEP every one of them sucked on the teat of taxpayer support which they now seek to deny others in case they have to compete. Perhaps that’s the aim of private schools, to restrict the competitive advantage to the chosen ones. They must be running out of secret handshakes by now. smile

    • c.conserv. says:

      11:27pm | 17/07/11

      @Reggie.  So….you’ve been having fun?

      All this pretending -  and all the time you went to Brisbane Grammar

    • Reggie says:

      01:12pm | 18/07/11

      Sorry CC, not ALL Queenslanders come from Brisbane. Try again. smile

      Besides I live in Sydney.

    • c.conserv. says:

      04:22pm | 18/07/11

      All Souls Charters Towers

      (No cyclones in Sydney)

      Tell me you’re ugly - and I won’t have any more guesses

    • Steve says:

      08:48am | 15/07/11

      Just like all you whingers who say you don’t want your tax dollars to pay for the NBN, I don’t want my tax dollars going towards private schools and chaplains in schools. Same principle no?

    • Brendo says:

      08:51am | 15/07/11

      My spider senses are tingling. I sense a paid shill writing an article at the behest of his pay masters

    • James1 says:

      08:58am | 15/07/11

      I agree with Mr Donnelly mostly.  However, there is another issue at play with the independent and Catholic school seem to want to avoid - accountability.  Given they are receiving public money, they should in some way be accountable for that money.  As such, they should open their books to public scrutiny as state departments of education must.  Any school which refuses to be accountable for the way it uses public funding should not be allowed to receive public funding.  If they need the money, as is the case in most Catholic schools, their books will reflect the fact that the money is well spent.

    • Dean says:

      09:50am | 15/07/11

      @James1
      I can’t comment on Independent schools because I don’t teach in one,but Catholic schools are fully accountable down to the last cent and dot point on the syllabus. Further more as the BER and computer for schools programs show not only well spent it is better spent.
      I also spend hours filling out paper to account for this, that friends of mine who work in DET schools, jaws hit the ground at when they hear what we have to do. As one commented “we’re suppose to do that, nobody does, because they won’t stop funding to a public school.”

    • Rick says:

      09:10am | 15/07/11

      Just because you’ve got wealth dose not make you classy.Ever heard “As classy as a rat with a gold tooth” Its like love you can buy a hooker but she will only ‘love’ you for the time you pay for.

    • Dave says:

      09:20am | 15/07/11

      How many of the Greens pollies went to private schools? Same way they cry about the environment but drive around Canberra in petrol powered cars and do not car pool to get to Parliament House

    • Angus says:

      09:20am | 15/07/11

      This is actually one of the more saner of the greens policies. Happy for the punters that opt for private education to opt out of paying the tax for public education. They can put there money where their mouth is then and stop complaining about how they subsidise the public school system. But I think also public schools should be just teaching maths, english, history and the like and not all special programs, community courses etc. etc. That type of learning should be given to children by other parts of society.

    • P. Darvio says:

      09:23am | 15/07/11

      Maybe it’s because the Greens don’t believe that humans once fed dinosaurs on a BIG wooden boot several thousand years ago in a BIG Flood and believe that children shouldn’t be taught such rubbish at tax payer’s expense.

    • Brendan says:

      09:38am | 15/07/11

      I have a daughter that’s incredibly bright. She’s in year 4. We are forced to move her to a private school because the public system doesn’t meet her needs. I’m happy to pay the extra even though we are by no means wealthy. But i think we should still be subsidised because its not our fault the public system cant deal with it.
      We have friends with a kid with a disability. They too had to seek out a private school because the public system cant help them. I dont see whats wrong with the money they would have had spent on the public education going to a private education. It makes sense.
      So far most of the schools that we are contemplating are Christian Schools. All of them teach on acceptance, none of them have anti-gay policies. All of them teach on grace, none of them teach to hate. I’m not sure the greens really know what they are talking about. I think Bob Brown is just another politician fear-mongering to drive a personal agenda.
      At one of the schools I met some parents that recently moved their son there and after 7 years of being told their son had a learning disability in the public system their son is actually thriving at a private school.
      The notion that the public schools fail because the
      funding is going to private schools is no more sensical then saying that all schools should be privatised.
      It should be about choice. Let’s be honest, governments are NOT known for their ability to manage. More kids in public schools and more public schools will not fix the problem. Bob Brrown knows this so he trying to force private schools to become public schools by legislating what can be taught. I know there are some things I don’t like about Catholicism and some that make me think the “happy clappers” are weird but they have a genuine interest in doing right by people and certainly do avoid job when it comes to education.

    • Kate says:

      06:56pm | 15/07/11

      @Brendan, I would suggest you get your child to apply for scholarships when she’s going into year seven, which would hopefully make the costs of school more manageable. My sister and I were on scholarships and that’s how my parents could afford to send us to private school, and it worked out pretty well for us!

    • Anubis says:

      09:51am | 15/07/11

      Private schools are a business and are a personal choice by the parents who choose to send their children there. Government funding should not be used on private schools. If their business model is reliant on Government funding then it is not a good business model. As for those who say that the parents of Private School children also pay taxes and therefore the schools should receive Government support - what utter baloney. The Government provides and funds an alternate service, it is called Government Schools and you will find them in most towns and suburbs. That option is open to ALL parents. If they choose to go with the business that is a Private School, then that is their choice. Taxes are collected by the Government in order to provide Government services, not to subsidise private enterprise. I also object to the Private Health Fund subsidy. What a crock of shit that is - Government providing financial support to an entire industry that is solely motivated by profit. Private Health funds very quickly increased their premiums when Government subsidy became available and negated the whole purpose of the subsidy, which was to make Private Health insurance more affordable for a wider range of Australians.

    • Reggie says:

      11:48am | 15/07/11

      I totally agree. Even with the objection to the Private Health Subsidy, the one that MBF always list separately so they can raise their fees when the subsidy is removed. That was a JH vote buying ploy and a taxpayer subsidy to a failing not-for profit organisation. A cost+ organisation rotten to the core.

    • Beck of Kenso says:

      10:09am | 15/07/11

      We live in a secular society where receiving an education is an entitlement, which is why all children are welcomed into public schools. Parents of children attending private schools CHOOSE to send their children to private schools, and that choice involves a great deal of cost. That cost, should not, however, be subsidised by the government or the taxpayer. The issue here is do we, as taxpayers, want to help widen the gap between rich and poor? Do we want to give money to schools such as Kings and SCEGGS so that they can have pools and tennis courts, when kids in Western Sydney struggle to keep teachers and have second rate facilities?

      If, as Mr Donnelly states, government schools receive $12,639 per student, then I would be happy for private schools to receive the gap between school fees and this figure, but if school fees are already above $12,639 per student per year, then I don’t believe any government funding should be provided.

      I also recognise that parents paying expensive school fees reduce the amount of government funds required, so we shouldn’t be creating a massive disincentive to parents who want to send their children to private schools, but the superior education received in these institutions and the contacts made that will subsequently help the children once they are working give them a much greater advantage than they could ever get in public education, and as such, those advantages should not be highly subsidised by the government.

    • Steve says:

      11:36am | 15/07/11

      Surely parents can choose to work hard to give their children an advantage. What is wrong with a country that rewards hard work?

      I gues you also support the greens policy of death duties. We can’t have the children of hardworking parents receiving the advantage of an inheritance can we?

      When will socialists realise that you can’t keep milking the cow without feeding the cow and keeping it happy and healthy?

      You are doing your best to install an Australian version of class warfare.

    • Beck of Kenso says:

      12:41pm | 15/07/11

      You know what they say - hard work is it’s own reward.

      People that can afford to send their kids to private schools are already at an advantage to the general public, so the taxpayer shouldn’t be subsidising further advantages.

      And what’s the problem with death duties? I have no idea of what the % of death duties is that’s to be paid, but I’m betting it’s not 100%, so you still get an inheritence if your folks die with assets. Most poor people will never get any inheritence - and that’s not necessarily because their folks were bludgers, it’s because accumulating assets when you start with nothing is hard work - so anybody that has to pay death duties should be grateful that they had parents that worked hard and managed to get somewhere, rather than focussing on being angry at the govt for taking a slice of the pie.

      We should all just chill out and be grateful for how good we’ve got it. Life could be much worse - we could live in a country where no taxes are paid and the economy is shot, and riots are happening… or, even worse than that, we could have tribal warfare, no clean water, and no freedom of speech. I’ll take paying taxes on everything known to man if it means keeping the political and economic stability that we have.

    • Steve says:

      02:33pm | 15/07/11

      Beck. By your logic everyone should shut up and be grateful unless you happen to live in the worst country in the world. Even if you live in the second worse country in the world you have no right to complain because there is someone worse off.

      At what point on the list is it Ok to be aspirational and try to improve things? Half way down? two thirds of the way down?

      Hard work is it’s own reward may motivate some but not all. Peple are motivated for many reasons and some are motivated by trying to provide a better future for their children.

      If you don’t provide an incentive for hard work people don’t work hard.

      If you have never worked hard to accumulate assets then there is no problem with death duties.

      I visited Russia during the communist days. I went to an experimental rural area wher the farmers were allowed 10% of the land to produce what they wanted and sell it at a local market that was established. They were responsible for the costs of inputs but were able to keep all the profits. Local officials didn’t know whether to be alrmed or pleased when they discovered that that 10% of the land was producing about 3 times the food that the 90% state owned was. Hard work was not sufficient reward for those farmers. Communism collapsed a few years after I visited that district.

      “Chill out and be grateful for what we have”  I agree as long as that gratitude is directed to the hardworking enterprising people who pay the highest taxes that pay for those good things. have you considered what would be the consequences of taking the motivation away from those people?

    • Outraged 5th Generation Australian says:

      10:12am | 15/07/11

      Here we have a self confessed homosexual dictating to a no family, no marriage atheist attempting to manage a country that has to deal with this type of issue.  God help us.  If the PM was dealt with by Islamic Law of some countries she would be stoned to death for adultery.  How do you think people of these countries see Australia - GODLESS Infidels.  No wonder we have difficulty dealing with them and expend huge amounts on security, money that could be spent on education of all the children of Australia, regardless of their circumstances.

    • Brendan says:

      10:28am | 15/07/11

      Awesome comment. 

      Its not every day we get to witness such vitriol, anger and abuse squeezed into so few sentences.  It was just poetry to read.

      However, could I recommend the use of more CAPS, less punctuation and maybe just a few overtly racist comments?  That would be just gold.

      The “5th generation Aussie” tag line was inspired though.  Beautiful to reflect on the subtle meaning implict in that name.

    • fml says:

      11:57am | 15/07/11

      @outraged,

      You just made baby jesus cry.

    • Reggie says:

      01:48pm | 15/07/11

      Methinks this is ZSRenn incognito. He left out his reference to being a convict descendent this time.  I thought you’d gone to China mate.

      Although I am very disappointed to hear you overtly condoning stoning.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      10:04pm | 15/07/11

      Ummm…how could the PM be stoned to death for adultery when she is not married? Honestly some of these posts don’t make sense…..

    • Bilby says:

      10:14am | 15/07/11

      From my experience parents don’t want their local public school to be well funded. The parents of private school kids donate thousands of dollars every year, but the parents of public school kids don’t seem to donate a cent. If the people don’t want it, I can’t see any justification for the government doing it, but then we are talking about the greens who have no real connection with the populace anyway.

    • Punching on Today says:

      10:39am | 15/07/11

      I think what disturbs me is this homogenisation that the Greens are trying to promote through their political correctness. Eradicate anything out of the way that doesn’t agree with them and promote agenda that everyone else is forced to fit in with; whether it’s through cutting funding to non-public schools or policy.

    • superb says:

      11:28am | 15/07/11

      Known as “balance” when the right-wing does it.

    • Punching on Today says:

      12:32pm | 15/07/11

      Superb - the right is not be trusted either with their suppression either.

    • Malleeringneck says:

      10:51am | 15/07/11

      The Greens, since they have been taken over by the socialists, are just spruiking regurgitated communist theories.

    • stephen says:

      11:36am | 15/07/11

      It’s the Euro Greens they and us should be wary of.
      And that Wikileaks chap who’s going to the US to defend his ‘freedom’.

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      11:03am | 15/07/11

      What a confused piece of drivel from Kevin Donnelly. First he blasts the Greens for threatening to withdraw funds from the private system and then he blasts the Greens for threatening to attach conditions to government funding. If the government picks up at least part of the tab they can attach any conditions they like. After all, there is no obligation for private schools to accept the money. The State only has the obligation to provide a kid with a place in the public system. Nothing else.

    • John says:

      11:33am | 15/07/11

      So i guess the green’s want to cut funding to private schools because of it’s hate for christianity,since christianity doesn’t support their idea’s. The green’s seem more like a communist party, rather then an environmental party. Maybe they should call themselves the “reds”.

      I was reading something interesting last, night about Karl Marx. It was an article which stated he might of been a Satanist, he made pack with the Lucifer who was hell bent on revenge with the god almighty. Maybe this is why communism has a red colour? Maybe this is why communists, marxists seem to have deep hatred for christianity, morals and the church. Communism could be a diabolical ideology, history shows it has slaughtered people in most wicked way, up to 100 million in last 100 years? Does Lucifer wants his communist new world order?

    • Mark G says:

      12:27pm | 15/07/11

      Ummm, I’m not a socialist and even I can safely say that that is ridiculous counter productive dribble. Marx (extreme left wing) was not a satanist any more that Adolf Hiltler (extreme right wing) was. These men were as much christians as you and I. That doesnt however make the right or good men. I sure the vast majority would agree particularly with the Hitler case. Normally these are attempts by the extremes of both sides to demonize their opponents. SATAN is bad man and (insert Leader here) is a Satanist. That makes him BAD man. This whole line of arguement is juvenile.

    • John says:

      12:46pm | 15/07/11

      Well the article i read seemed to be in-depth in this subject. Marx might of been a christian, but converted to atheism then suspected of becoming a satanist. When the communists took Berlin in 1945, they took a satanist alter which links with events in Revelations. International Communism could be an anti-christ ideology. It’s possible that in the near future we might have Anti-Christ Marxist Empire, were millions christian will be prosecuted for not kneeling to Satan’s empire

      Here is the article
      http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1121228/posts

    • Sony B Goode says:

      01:47pm | 15/07/11

      “Adolf Hiltler (extreme right wing)”

      OMG. The education system has truly failed us!

      “We are socialists, we are enemies of today’s capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.”
      Adolf Hitler May 1, 1927

      The Nazi party is short for national socialist, as opposed to the Russian international socialists. What metrosexual crap do they teach in school these days????????

    • Reggie says:

      03:28pm | 15/07/11

      Sony ??? ;; “The Nazi party is short for national socialist, as opposed to the Russian international socialists. What metrosexual crap do they teach in school these days???????? “

      Oh bullshit you syntheticJap you. smile  AH was anti-communist (see Munich) but in his delinquent efforts to unify Nationalists, Catholics, and Communists to his cause, he adopted the name that he hoped would appeal to most. And YOU f****** fell for it. Slowwwwwwwww.I mean it has been 80+ years. 

      Here,... “We have one aim and we will follow it fanatically and ruthlessly to the grave.”  That was six months before he became chancellor, appointed my the conservative bankers of Germany, ONLY because they viewed him as anti-communist and would therefore protect their assets. 

      Get it? Right-wing!

    • Mark G says:

      05:04pm | 15/07/11

      For an apparent socialist party (as you claim) they were remarkably elitist with all those social and racial policies. Reggie’s points are right. Sony B Goode there was one thing in you statement that was accurate. The school system has truly failed. The whole reason Adolf Hitler attacked Russia was his paranoid fear of the socialist Bolsheviks rising up in the east. You need to read Hitler’s book Mein Kampf to see how truely right wing he was. He knew that the ideologies of him and Stalin were too far apart and they would eventually come to blows. The reason why the war on the eastern from was far move brutal than the struggle between Germany and the western allies was because of the class struggle between communist and Fascist invaded. Russian POWs were treated far worse than allied POWs for this reason. Fascism is an extreme right wing policy. Just because they use the word socialist doesn’t mean that they have a socialist agenda. You need to read your history books a little closer I think. Maybe thats what you needed to do back in school.

    • Mark G says:

      05:18pm | 15/07/11

      When Hitler was talking about unfair wages he was talking about the fact that Jews were getting rich while aryans were poor not a far wages for all people. You have to put his line “responsibility and performance” in the context of his racist views that aryans were superior in all traits particularly responsibility and performance.

    • james says:

      05:26pm | 15/07/11

      Sony

      If can find me one historian of any note that does not classify Hitler as belonging to the far right of politics I will eat my hat. I suppose that the Democratic Republic of North Korea is also a democracy. You should try substituting some commonsense into your rants in place of rabid vitriol.

    • Reggie says:

      09:04pm | 16/07/11

      A little more for the edification of SBG. 1919 and 1923 are two milestones in the rise of AH. The others are 1928/1929 and 1932/33.

      The members of the communist uprising in Munich in 1919 were beaten to a pulp by the right-wing members of the Government backed Workers’ Party and largely by Ernst Rhom’s SA group who later aspired to be Hitlers bodyguard. It was unfortunate that most of the leaders of the communist rising were also Jewish. (Note careful this unfortunate combination) Jew’s and communists were now represented as the ruination of Germany.

      In 1923 the now, National Socialist Workers’ Party (The Nazis) achieved some notoriety when fired upon by the military. This was also the stage where the NAZIS, lead by AH robbed, a bank. (Later concealed by the NAZIS) For this AH received a very sympathetic hearing and a light goal sentence.

      At the election of1928, 97% of the German population voted AGAINST the NAZIS.

      The came the financial collapse of 1929. Having borrowed extensively from the US to pay reparations and to support its wild spending, the country was driven into gigantic inflation when the US withdrew its loans.

      In 1930 25.8% of the German people voted for the NAZIS sight-unseen.

      The prospect of appointing a minority party with a reputation for violence and racial selectivity was odious to the establishment until the surviving bankers pointed out that his violence was useful in keeping the communists in check and protecting their assets. So you see the right-leaning US and the right-wing bankers of Germany approved of the political philosophy of AH and appointed him chancellor. Von Papen’s expectation of controlling AH’s extremes came to naught when AH simply changed the law removing VP from the scene and making himself the sole head of government. The FUHRER, or right-wing authoritarian leader.

      Certainly more in line with SBG’s philosophy that with Democracy.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      10:35pm | 16/07/11

      You guys clearly have no idea what right wing is do you???? Further you seem to have no idea what conservatives are on about either!!!!

      You are stuck in some do-gooder, bleeding heart view that the noble aims of material equality of Marxism, which underlies all leftist positions is some sort of utopian non-violent peace movement.

      All socialists are against market based wealth creation, that is the unifying theme of the left. The more to the left the more anti-market, the more to the right the more pro-market. The right is individualistic, the left is collectivist and pro central planning.

      If anything libertarians then anarchists fall to the far right.

      How can being increasingly being pro-market and pro-freedom make one fascist????

      To place fascism to the far right is meaningless as an opposite to socialism. All modern Nationalist parties are socialist and Fascists may or may not tolerate free markets.

      Nazis national socialists where right of international socialists, they were still socialists, they nationalised industry, abolished wartime profits ie where anti-capitalistic, ie socialists.

      Of course Hitler was against Russians, Nazis where racists nationalists and didn’t give a shit about Russia’s international socialist aims. Further the US also sided with Russia , did that suddenly make Russians right wing? Who funded them or allied with them does not define their politics.

      It’s a left wing fabrication to label Nazis as right wing.

    • Reggie says:

      07:58am | 17/07/11

      One final serve for the refugee, Sony B Goode.

      “OMG. The education system has truly failed us!”

      Before you came here to spread your anti-Democratic filth, you might have given some casual consideration to the involvement of the Nazis in the Spanish Civil War.  The one where the “Nationalists,” (more persuasively called the “Conservatives,”) opposed the result of a democratic election that left them out in the cold.

      In their indignation they engaged in a bloody war against the elected faction, a war that attracted the “International Brigade” of freedom fighters which were of course labeled “communists” by the conservative press.

      SBG ... which side did the Nazis take? Come on, you know this, even your slanted education system could not blind you to the fact that the NAZIS took the ANTI-COMMUNIST side.  If you didn’t know that then yes… your education system failed you miserably else you stagger about with your head up your fundamental orifice.

      Next question. ...  Which right-wing continental government incited the devastation of every country in Europe and led to the destruction of most of its cities with the deaths of sixty seven million people?

      If you don’t know the answer to that, then your refugee status will be rescinded on the grounds that you are a disciple of Goebbels and bent on treachery. Be-gone.  wink

    • Sony B Goode says:

      10:38am | 17/07/11

      Reggie you are beyond deluded. Once more for the dummies, Nazis where National socialists and Russians where International socialists. NO amount of rewriting history by left wing press will change the facts.

      Be man enough to admit you are just pissed because you got pwned hard core by your claim that socialised food production has not caused famine everywhere its been tried.

    • richard says:

      12:28pm | 17/07/11

      Nazi’s were right wing conservatives
      there is no dispute about it.
      If you think otherwise, you are a tool.

    • Reggie says:

      02:00pm | 17/07/11

      WTF are you talking about Sony..” ... by your claim that socialised food production has not caused famine everywhere its been tried.”

      I never claimed anything of the sort, this is only another example of your intransigence. I simply ignored your obvious attempt at diversion. The point is that as a shade of democracy, socialism has often failed as have many democratic governments. YOUR screwy aim is to prevent failures by applying the same methods as AH chose. Let’s face it you missed your opportunity and just as well or you may have found yourself at Nuremberg with a hemp necktie.

    • RyaN says:

      12:39am | 19/07/11

      @richard: the Nazis were FASCISTS, not right wing. These fascists were born and bred from the left but ended as fascists, nothing to do with the rigth wing. Just about every single despot the world has ever seen was born out of the left, Pol Pot, Mugabe, Stalin etc.. etc..

    • Demoman says:

      12:11pm | 15/07/11

      Parents send their kids to private schools to keep them away from the kids of proles and government indoctrination.

      Education isn’t just about the quality of curriculum, but also the environment in which it takes place. A public school full of degenerate kids that disrupt the class and have no discipline (due to bad parenting) is a bad learning environment and will likely result in your child being influenced by bad behaviors. This is undesirable.

      Hardly a surprise then that the best performing public schools are full of Asian kids who haven’t forgotten the value of hard work for success in life.

      So while you leftie losers are complaining about the rich I will be out there getting rich so I don’t have to wait for crumbs from the government

      /que Emotionally charged comments from plebs complaining about my snobbery.

    • Gabby says:

      05:02pm | 15/07/11

      Au contrare Demoman !  In Aussie tall poppies are routinely chopped so I wish you well.  I have a tall poppy family member who is always copping the p….s because others are too lazy to aspire.  He went through public school and made it work for him by sheer hard work.  Now there’s an idea !!!
      Asian families encourage and expect their children to excell but not Aussies.  “Don’t get above yourself”  is still a long sung mantra in the ‘burbs !  Can’t have the kids too posh to talk to the family now…...can we ?
      How I wish it was different !

    • Gabby says:

      05:08pm | 15/07/11

      BTW Demoman, it’s “CUE Emotionally charged comments….”

    • Dean says:

      01:16pm | 15/07/11

      Some christian you are Kevin Donnelly.  Your article is beyond pathetic and hypocritical to say the least.

      You say ‘Also ignored is the right parents have not to be discriminated against or penalised because they choose one type of school over another.’

      Yet further on you also say ‘Point 63 of its policy states that non-government schools must not be allowed to “discriminate in hiring of staff or selection of students”. Such a policy not only flies in the face of international and local human rights agreements and conventions protecting religious freedom’

      Oh I see, it’s only descrimination when it’s happening to you?  What about the fact catholic schools and christian schools teach hate and descrimination regarding their views on homosexuals and the non religions?  Someone tries to remove that ‘right’ from you not only attack him but you stupidly scream descrimination on religous grounds in return.

      What a joke.  Starting your article out with a few facts about funding then launching into your inteded purpose which is just nothing but a sick gay-bash at Bob Browne is cowardly and pathetic.  Your last 6 paragraphs are basically just a rant about homosexuals…  You’re a hypocrite Donnelly.

    • Steve says:

      03:33pm | 15/07/11

      Dean you are a hypocite. Your post is nothing but a sick catholic and christian bash.

    • Matt says:

      04:14pm | 15/07/11

      Is it Steve?  Did you read the article?  And where did I christian or catholic bash?

      Perhaps you can explain why an article about school funding has a 6 paragraph rant about homosexuals written by a christian author?  Also explain how I’m a hypocrite as that doesn’t really make sense..

    • Steve says:

      04:48pm | 15/07/11

      Yes it is Matt. I used your own words except inserted catholic/christian where you had used gay. Hence the hypocricy.

      You stated that catholic and christian schools teach hate and descrimination. That is not true hence the bash/rant comment.

    • Matt says:

      06:53pm | 15/07/11

      I’m not sure where my first name went.. Dean is my surname, sorry about any confusion..

      Anyway, you’re saying I’m a hypocrite because you replaced a few of my original words with words that suited you better?  Well, that makes a lot of sense..

    • Dean the Catholic says:

      10:34am | 16/07/11

      @Dean
      I read somewhere that we criticise the faults in others that we see reflected in ourselves. We do this because it’s easy to point out the splinter of wood in someone else’s eye than the plank of wood in our own. That is criticism is easy, changing ourselves is hard.

      Dean it is also easy to see that you have never set foot in a Catholic school, because we do not teach hatred of anyone, including homosexuals or other religions, that is because we are commanded by Christ to love one another, not to judge one other.

    • Reggie says:

      01:36pm | 18/07/11

      Dean the Catholic; “I read somewhere that we criticise the faults in others that we see reflected in ourselves.”

      Dean it does not necessarily follow that we do NOT recognise the faults in ourselves. In fact most often it is the recognition of such weakness that motivates a person to seek solutions. In doing so such weaknesses become strengths.

      Knowing a great deal about the stresses of wartime Germany I oft wonder what I would have done, would I have become one of those Nazis or would I have resisted or sought shelter somewhere else? If I’d had a young family at the time the pressures would have been different to one not so burdened. In such a situation self-preservation usually takes a much lower importance. Self-analysis is often the obsession of the young.

    • John says:

      02:21pm | 15/07/11

      I don’t what it is, but left is taking beating like no tomorrow. Tea party in the US, the rise of nationalists in Europe, UK and they are also taking it hard here. It’s seems they have ordered a retreat! and changing their fighting tactic’s using anti-leftist tactics in order to try to survive!

      Merkel, Sarkozy, Cameron have ordered a political retreat, Leftist Obama’s is most likely thinking how he can take on the tea party! It’s seems like the left is going to be game over very soon!

    • wow says:

      03:06pm | 15/07/11

      Why is it then that the best education, teachers etc. happens to be in socialist Nordic countries ? They must be real evil and unfair on the rich. lol

    • John says:

      04:14pm | 15/07/11

      Nordic country’s are so to the left that crime is out of control, the population is all turning homosexual, lesbian and atheist. Their multicultural dreams are also falling apart as the national crime ratio is increasing by year because of joys of multiculturalism. Give them 10 years and the Nordic city’s will be burning in smoke because of the enforcement of the marxist left. They will also most likely go broke also, for being part of international banking system.

    • iansand says:

      04:28pm | 15/07/11

      Friday afternoon poll

      Is John
      a) Serious
      b) Demented
      c) A brilliant deadpan satirist
      d) Something else (please specify)

    • Nickoladen says:

      04:44pm | 15/07/11

      John I think you’re speaking from your rear end again. The Nordic countries true are largely socialist as compared to Australia. Again and again, year in year out they are top of the class in just about any comparison you can make and they will remain so for a long time to come.

    • AdamC says:

      04:55pm | 15/07/11

      Well, it is the Finns in particular who are often cited as the highest educational achievers. Some aspects of their system should be adopted in Australia, in my view. I don’t know how the actual Scandinavians (the Danes, Norwegians and Swedes) fare. You’re right, though, they are a bunch of socialists!

      Ian Sand, I’m stumping for c).

    • John says:

      06:01pm | 15/07/11

      Sweden ranked third of the countries surveyed. The risk of getting mugged. Increase in the rate of reports of violent crime in Sweden from 1976 to 2006. In three decades, reported violent crime have increased by about 200 %.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Sweden

      Lovely Leftist Liberal Marxist Socialist policy’s, are turning europe into a crime continent.

    • Nickoladen says:

      06:56pm | 15/07/11

      What do you know john? You quoted a figure from wikpedia which ranks sweden 3 worst out of 11 countries of reported rapes and what was the other countries: nordic and other european countries. Well we should maybe ask Julian assange about the reportededly high rape charges in sweden. Many of the cases would not be considered rape here in Australia,. I’d walk downtown stockholm, malmø, copenhagen, oslo or helsinki in the middle of the night before I’d walk through any australian city thank you very much. John I’m from scandinavia, I know a thing or 2 about it.

    • Gabby says:

      04:19pm | 15/07/11

      The encouragement of children into private schools, like private hospitals came about with John Howard changing over to the idea that users pay which we continue to suffer.
      Public health and public schools have been bled dry ever since as we hav moved to a service economy, not a benevolent one.
      The idea was all part of getting the public to aspire to higher income and look after themselves in an individualist culture.  It’s just that people would play, wouldn’t pay so the social engineering exercise hasn’t exactly paid off.

    • Cat says:

      04:43pm | 15/07/11

      NO NO NO NO NO - I refuse to be lumped in with close minded religious people or the elitist super rich, I am choosing a private highschool for my child because it offers an alternative form of schooling which meets his needs, he cannot and will not cope in a mainstream state highschool by virtue of his disability and how it impacts on his learning needs - the state system can only offer us distance education as an alternative and that is an even worse fit. Not one state highschool in this state offers the same pedagogy as the school we’ve applied for and I personally find great fault with the way our state system functions in a number of ways. The benefits of independant schools are not confined to “faith based education”, there is an inherant autonomy that removes much of the inflexible structure found in the state system and it makes for a vibrant educational landscape. Please remember that “independant school” is not interchangable for “ivory tower” - the school we will be joining next year was started by parents, parents who wanted a different style of education and who have been able to watch their school grow over time, from very humble begiings in one old building to a vibrant community which now encompasses all years of schooling. The fees are set to cover the costs of running the school not to make a proffit or to fund a host of extra “frills”.  Until such time as state education can truly say it meets the needs of all students ANY move to remove choices from parents should be vehemently faught against, and removing funding does equal removing choices - the vast majority of parents at the school are nowhere near high earners, many are low income families scraping together to pay full or reduced fees as it is - WHY would you want those families and mine to have to go into the state school system thanks to no longer being able to afford fees? It would cost the government more money, a brilliant (non-religious) school would have to close its doors, the parents/kids/teachers/staff would be devestated and to WHAT benefit to everyone else? - NONE!  Also, I may have zero desire to give any child of mine a faith based education, in fact the very thought revolts me, BUT I live in a community where others do want that and I don’t think we should make it beyond their reach just because it isn’t our cup of tea - and we can let them have that choice and save the government money at the same time!  By all means there should be an ellement of needs based funding,
      (and I don’t for one second think that needs based funding equals punishing those who do well, I find that argument to be utterly odious) but I think it is best served by reviewing the current funding levels and how they are arrived at NOT by removing all funding to private schools.

    • Gabby says:

      05:15pm | 15/07/11

      When I was growing up state schools got the values of the government of the day, private schools got the business values of the day.  They did not necessarily coincide.  This, at that time,  included the church schools who were often dependent on the good auspices of business for extra funding.

      It was encouraging to see different points of view come out in Steiner and Montessori educaiton systems evolving, offering parents who wanted neither of the above a place where the wellbeing of the child and not future voters was focused.

    • Don Draper says:

      05:04pm | 15/07/11

      I had an argument with a teacher ex-girlfriend once.
       
      She was outraged that her state school class sizes were so high, and found the idea of public funding for private schools abhorrent.
      I tried to point out that a family who sends 3 sons to, say Kings, for example, would be a very high income family, and therefore would be paying considerable tax.

      The amount of tax would be ‘so’ great that it probably would fund 4 or 5 unrelated students in the public system – into which that family is unarguably lightening the load from the public system by the removal of their 3 kids. 

      So the net relief to the public system from one family is a conservative 7 spaces.  It therefore beggars belief that anyone would have a problem with minimal funding of private schools when the public school system is actually the overall beneficiary by a long shot.]

      Nah, ‘why should my tax dollars go to a snooty private school’…....

    • Charlie says:

      07:03pm | 15/07/11

      My presumption from reading the majority of comments from those opposed to private school is that they are the types who either couldn’t afford private education or didn’t value education enough to make the sacrifice of funds.

      My Grandmother, mother and siblings all were privately educated and I would never send my own children to public schools simply because I wouldn’t entrust an education to the Government.

      Can’t you people see that any fault in the public education system is a direct consequence of government ineptitude? Even if 100% of private school funding was redirected to the public education system, nothing would improve.

      Am I the only one very alarmed everytime Bob Brown opens that smug mouth of his to criticise everyday Australians about which school they choose, what car they drive and so on. Maybe I’ll start to listen to this radical leftist hypocrite when he starts taking the bus to work.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      05:41am | 16/07/11

      Dear Dr Kevin Donnelly, thank you for your article and I agree with you Sir, the Greens focus is not just about funding but to bring in their own ungodly agenda in relation to “Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Intersex (LGBTI) people”

      As you pointed out Sir the policy titled ‘Sexuality and Gender Identity’ it is also clear that the Greens Party, in addition to forcing Schools to employ staff whose way of life and beliefs contradict the Church’s teachings, is keen to use the School curriculum to promulgate its policies…

      I believe this statement has a lot of merit and we need to be warned and on guard to not accept this type of discrimination,  Schools and Parents have the right to choose what they want their Children to lean and also who they want to teach them. 

      So what about discrimination to “Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Intersex (LGBTI) people” don’t they have rights… yes to do what their Creator asks of them, which is not just something that they can dismiss as irrelevant, yes they can choose not to obey God’s guidelines and even deny He exists,  but they will be accountable and suffer the consequences for doing so, as all those who reject Him will, not God’s choice but theirs.

      Although I do agree passionately with the need to be Loving and tolerant of others I can not water down God’s warning that people who practice Homosexuality are in grave error and danger. I believe in light of the Scriptures that God is not accepting of this type of behaviour the same as with all sin, but I do not in any way agree that He does not have compassion and Love for those who do wrong, God’s Truth is very clear about this but He longs for us to repent and turn from evil and do good.

      In warning us that we will be punished for the wrong we do, God is in fact seeking to protect us in the same way the Law in our Country is, for example what would happen if we all chose our own agenda when it came to the traffic lights such as ... you and I decided from now on red was go and green meant stop, we would be placing not only ourselves but others in danger and this would still be so even if we found some others who would agree with us . God’s Laws are not to deprive us or cause us pain and they are not based on intolerance as most people understand it. Yes God is indeed intolerant of wrong doing, the same as the Law of the Land is, but it is for our good not bad.

      Thank you again Dr Kevin Donnelly, may God bless you greatly for your stand against all that pollutes - Christian Love Anne.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      06:16am | 16/07/11

      Peter says:07:31am | 15/07/11 “Those who fail to learn from history are bound to repeat the same mistakes.”Or words to that effect. Western society has descended to the level of debauchery of the Roman Empire prior to it collapsing.

      What you say is very True Peter and I also appreciated John’s statements in this regard, as we know it was prophesied in the Bible that this would be so and it will worsen as we come to the last days,  the Scriptures tell us it will be like in the time of Noah,  a warning that we need not to take lightly.

      As we contend with the Lord against the abominations in our world,  we may be abused, insulted, belittled, cursed and as it is happing in some Countries today, also martyred for our faith,  but God will be Victorious and us with Him.

      One thing many people fail to understand is that our time on earth is but a Neo second in Eternity and yet what we choose to believe and do on this earth will count for Eternity.

      God bless you both greatly for your stand for Him - Christian Love Anne.

    • Pope Pious Debacle says:

      06:29pm | 16/07/11

      Mescaline - the cure for christianity

    • Auntie Fabian says:

      02:55pm | 16/07/11

      1.  I am completely convinced that the Green controversy is 100% politically motivated and not based on good science. The promoters of either view are either extreme socialists or extreme communists. Their sole primary purpose in promoting either view is to destroy Christian capitalism and replace it with extreme socialism/communism based upon the religion of Secular Humanism. Those who advance this agenda want to force us into bigger government, higher taxes, and loss of all personal freedoms, liberties and property rights.

    • John says:

      08:01pm | 16/07/11

      Thats pretty much it. There is an international oligarchy pulling the string of every western nation. Telling them what their foreign and national policy’s should be. Multiculturalism, mass immigration, they push leftist brainwashing of western children, wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, western carbon tax, european Union, african union, north american union. Euro currency’s, Amero Currencys. It’s all engineered, they influence all the media cooperation’s, influence western politicians. They rule the world, and give us the illusion of democracy. The west is occupied by an oligarchy, the western people are enslaved, they are our slave masters.

    • Reggie says:

      09:54pm | 16/07/11

      Aunty Fabian,  “1.  I am completely convinced that the Green controversy is 100% politically motivated and not based on good science.’

      Well that settles it.  No evidence needed, just a feeling.

      “The promoters of either view are either extreme socialists or extreme communists.”

      WTF… either view?.  What? For AND against? You obviously have NO idea what either extreme represents, they’re just some vapid notion you toss around at Bingo or the CWA..

      “Their sole primary purpose in promoting either view is to destroy Christian capitalism and replace it with extreme socialism/communism based upon the religion of Secular Humanism.”

      Listen, either it’s sole or it’s primary, which means more than one. There’s nothing Christian about Capitalism which aspires to the philosophy of never giving a sucker an even break.

        . “Those who advance this agenda want to force us into bigger government, higher taxes, and loss of all personal freedoms, liberties and property rights.”

      What agenda? So far from what you’ve said, anything goes. You’re a conservative and work to exclude all those who may aspire to be your equal.  What-ever it is your said there is little doubt the same was said by the French Court as the peasants hammered at the door in 1789.

    • Auntie Fabian says:

      12:05pm | 17/07/11

      The new World Order as laid out in the Protocols of the learned Elders of Zion - it’s all out there to be read. Just don’t read other peoples commentaries on it - read the actual protocols yourself.

    • Reggie says:

      08:07am | 17/07/11

      Thank you Reverend Sister. Much obliged.

    • Elizabeth says:

      07:16pm | 16/07/11

      It appears that Anne hit her head on something and now lives in a fantasy world.

    • Robert Smissen of country SA says:

      01:15am | 17/07/11

      What the Greens would like to do is force all kids to go to the substandard Goverment schools, just like Hawke wanted all patients to go to public hospital, look how well that worked out

    • Anne Stocks says:

      06:18am | 17/07/11

      Good to see you are quoting from The Bible Reggie,  I hope you enjoyed the Links,  it seems Elizabeth was mind boggled,  amazing Children understand what so called mature Adults don’t,  perhaps walking in their shoes would help .

      Reggie says: they are going to be upset and disappointed if they put their trust in sand and it comes crumbling down.

      The Scriptures say ...

      Luke 6:47-49 Whosoever comes to me, and hears my sayings, and does them, I will show you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock. But he that heareth, and does not do them, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the sand; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

      For you Reggie ...

      To enjoy Click Links .....  http://youtu.be/wS0j3SBBvgs
      http://youtu.be/wDhaAWHjVRM

      Kind regards Anne.

    • Bowave says:

      04:39pm | 17/07/11

      This topic, like so many other topics that evoke envy bitterness and spite in this country, is always looked at from the wrong angle - from the mentality of scarcity instead of the mindset of plenty.
      So-called “private” schools are merely schools where parents have agreed to pay more of the total cost, thus leaving less of the total cost to be funded by government allocation.
      Unless a school is 100% commercial, it is not “private”.
      The non-government schools are therefore merely non-fully-government-funded schools. That is the difference, and the key issue.
      The reasons these independent schools are better equipped and maintained, and often attract more motivated staff, is because parent bodies, and students, take more interest instead of adopting the entitlement mentality of expecting the school to do all the hard yards - as is the default position in the fully funded schools.
      Since the entire school system is a closed system, and all students require educating at one or another school, and that the entire system requires funding, it is therefore obvious that parents of students at independent schools do in fact carry some of the funding burden that would otherwise be required from government allocations. The only way to negate this reality would be to abolish all independent schools, so that their students were forced back into the fully-funded schools. This of course is contrary to people’s rights to choose how to educate their children. But the politics of envy will never countenance such a position, preferring instead to rant rabidly against what it prefers to describe as elitism. If it wasn’t for the so-called “elites”, and the efforts of the so-called “wealthy”, we would all be up shits creek. Life has hierarchies. Everyone is entitled to enter the race. No-one has an entitlement to winning. No-one has the right to deny anyone the right to strive to win. No-one has the right to force all the runners to finish together at the slowest speed. Leave the system alone – it works well.

    • Anne Stocks says:

      06:13am | 18/07/11

      Dear Bowave I agree very much with what you shared,  one of my friends is the Principle of a Christian Collage which started off with 30 Students but now has over 500 both Christian and non Christian, their Parents wanted the qualities in schooling that you outlined and realised to have it they needed to send their Children to a Private School, but we can all fall on hard times and this also happens with Parents whose Children are going to private Schools, now I can’t talk for others but at my friends School they carry the cost until the Parents are back up on their feet so the Students don’t have to leave the School and there has even been Students whose Parents couldn’t afford the full fees and in genuine cases they have subsidised them. I also have friends who are Teachers in Public Schools, who are fully committed and give their best with the limited resources they have and they have even given of their own funds to pay for things not provided ...they are in the race.

      I also agree with you Bowave 100%  that .... No-one has the right to deny anyone the right to strive to win, as a Christian I aim to win the prize but it is different then what the world offers for sure. I hope you don’t mind Bowave but I would like to share a story someone sent me.
      Some time ago, at the Seattle Olympics, nine Athletes, all Mentally or Physically challenged contestants, were standing on the starting line for the 100 m race… The gun fired and the race began. Not everyone was running, but everyone wanted to participate and win. They ran in threes, a boy tripped and fell, did a few somersaults and started crying. The other eight heard him crying. They slowed down and looked behind them. They stopped and came back… All of them… A girl with Down Syndrome sat down next to him, hugged him and asked, “Feeling better now? ”Then, all nine walked shoulder to shoulder to the finish line. The whole crowd stood up and applauded. The applause lasted a very long time…People who witnessed this still talk about it. Why?

      Because deep down inside us, we all know that one of the most important things in life is much more than winning for ourselves. One of the most important things in this life is to help others to find the Truth and the real values in life. Even if that means slowing down and changing our own race.

      I believe in the Truth that if you take the time to share with others those things that are True, uplifting and encouraging and even if at times you need to warn them of danger or correct them in Love you will have contributed to lighting a Candle of Hope in their heart that will one day burn brightly… And a Candle loses nothing if it is used to light another one.” So when we light someone ease’s candle our flame will also burn brightly and we will win the race together.

      Kind regards Anne.

    • James says:

      10:12am | 20/07/11

      What should we do to GLBTIs, make them wear a yellow star?

    • Anne Stocks says:

      01:50pm | 24/07/11

      No James, a yellow star was to many a symbol of hatred, as Christians we are told to Love GLBTIs as God does even if their actions make them His and our enemy. It’s not God’s will they will suffer eternally, yes He hates the evil that they do because evil has it’s own wages and God does not want them to perish…..... it’s their choice.

      Luke 6:26-28 Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets. But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.

      Kind regards Anne.

 

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