The German telecommunications giant Deutsche Telekom announced recently they would introduce a dictate that by 2015 30% of middle and upper management positions must be filled by women.

Quotas supporter: Sex discrimination commissioner Elizabeth Broderick / File

They are thus far the only DAX-listed company to consider such a move, but elsewhere in Europe gender quotas are becoming an increasingly familiar site on the corporate landscape.

Norway introduced legislation in 2002 that required 40% of all board members to be women, with Spain and the Netherlands following suit. Other countries contemplating passing similar laws include Belgium, Britain, Germany, France and Sweden.

Closer to home, Australian Sex Discrimination Commissioner Elizabeth Broderick has said, “We need to kick start this process of gender equality”, espousing the view that quotas are a useful means of forcibly imposing greater equality between men and women in the boardrooms of the nation.

Take a look at the numbers and you can see why legislators are concerned about the lack of ladies in leadership roles. In Australia, of the top 200 companies listed on the ASX, only 8.7% of board directorships are held by women, while women account for only 13% of the bench in the Federal Court of Australia.

In the US, women hold roughly 15% of seats on company boards, while in the UK women make up only 12.2% of directors of FTSE 100 companies.

British Prime Minister Gordon Brown recently threatened: “If we don’t see a dramatic change in the composition of company boards in the future, we will need to consider taking more serious action to ensure companies recruit from the diverse pool of talent we have in the UK.”

Women now represent more than half of university graduates, and account for more than 50% of the workforce (a landmark point passed in the US late last year) so how come how come the upper echelons of the business world remain a largely male preserve?

Consider this. The under-representation of women running companies or chairing boards may not directly reflect the misogynistic ways of the corporate patriarchy and thus can only be materially addressed by the brute force of legislation.

Rather, might the fact that women represent less than 6% of senior line management roles (US figures) be because they are hesitant to commit to the 14- hour days necessary to reach such heights?

The debate thus far about gender quotas is presupposed on assumptions about intent and desire. They are predicated on the idea that women, are willing to make, with equal magnitude to men, the personal sacrifices required to get to the top.

In the past 40 odd years it has become a given that women want to work (to some degree) and that they will crave and seek personal definition and success (not to mention financial independence) in the professional sphere.

Rewind just 20 years and there was a seeming global shoulder-padded charge towards the glass ceiling. Many women in their 20s, 30s, and 40s today have grown up watching their mothers attempt to find the promised land of Having It All and have witnessed the ensuing frustration and exhaustion that the pursuit of this illusory goal brings.

But in 2003 Lisa Belkin penned a piece for the New York Times called “The Opt-Out Revolution”, her thesis being that well-educated women were choosing not to jostle and hustle their way up the corporate ladder, thirsting for professional scalps. Rather these daughters of second-wave feminism were finding that the life they wanted to lead was one that included a much greater balance between the personal and the professional. If that meant not making partner or getting the corner office, so be it.

Belkin wrote, “Women—specifically, educated professional women—were supposed to achieve like men. Once the barriers came down, once the playing field was leveled, they were supposed to march toward the future and take rightful ownership of the universe, or at the very least, ownership of their half.”

But the reality has proved quite different: “It’s not just that the workplace has failed women. It is also that women are rejecting the workplace,” Belkin writes.

Or, as Maureen Rice a UK magazine editor put it, writing in the Daily Mail, “If women aren’t running the country or big business, it’s mainly because we just don’t want to. Any glass ceiling that’s in place these days isn’t an enemy to women, but our alibi”.

This quiet but seismic shift in attitude amongst many tertiary-educated women reflects a growing acknowledgement that women are essentially held hostage by their fertility and the very limited window of opportunity available to them to become a parent.

The lesson of the last few decades has been no matter with what warrior-like, Filofax-toting, multi-tasking mentality women tackle the challenge of combing motherhood and a career, there will come a point at which they must start to make compromises, as difficult and as frustrating as they may be.

The question is fundamentally one of timing and sacrifice. The timetables to which men and women’s reproductive lives are set differ dramatically. Quotas do not reflect the different realities men and women face. These inequalities cannot be mandated, legislated or funded away to create some artificial “level” playing field.

There will never be complete parity when it comes to the politics of gender in the workforce because at the heart of the matter is an alienable, biological inequality.

The Norwegian example demonstrates the questionable success of gender quotas.

In 2009 Oslo’s Centre for Corporate Diversity found that “so far there is little increase in the number of top executive women in quota companies”.

Or as Governor General Quentin Bryce told Kerry O’Brien in an interview with The 7.30 Report: “you can have it all, but not all at the same time”.

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107 comments

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    • Eric says:

      06:45am | 10/05/10

      There are other factors involved as well. For example, men outnumber women at the extremes of intelligence - both high and low, and tend to be more competitive. http://tinyurl.com/36e7c42

      While women may see this as a “glass ceiling” holding them back from the highest positions, it also provides them with a “glass floor”, protecting them from the extremes of poverty, homelessness, imprisonment and death suffered by the men at the bottom of the pile. Interestingly, there’s no demand for quotas to even the imbalance at the lower end of society.

    • TracyS says:

      10:03am | 10/05/10

      There is no “glass floor” - world wide there are more women than men living in poverty

    • Eric says:

      10:12am | 10/05/10

      Do you have any evidence for this claim?

      And it’s not just about poverty. It’s about imprisonment, death, and other areas of disadvantage.

    • Formersnag. says:

      11:59am | 10/05/10

      @ TracyS, Why don’t you tell us the other half of the truth.

      Namely that those, “poor women” you speak of are usually widows, whose husbands either were slaughtered in a war, or were killed/incapacitated equally gruesomely in an industrial “accident”.

      BTW, Eric, you might like this article, about “the masculinity conspiracy”?

      http://onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=10383

    • bella starkey says:

      02:18pm | 10/05/10

      Eric, the bloke who wrote that article also thinks the colour of your skin determines intelligence.

      “In 1991 I extended my work on race differences in intelligence to other races. I concluded that the average IQ of blacks in sub-Saharan Africa is approximately 70. It has long been known that the average IQ of blacks in the United States is approximately 85. The explanation for the higher IQ of American blacks is that they have about 25 per cent of Caucasian genes and a better environment.”

    • Eric says:

      04:32pm | 10/05/10

      Bella, race is not skin colour.

      Try not to be any dumber than you need to be.

    • Peter says:

      03:47pm | 11/05/10

      Tracey S, a lot of men love their woman and kids and sacrifice for them. Let’s not let the gender war get ridiculous. Talk about inequities where you believe they exist, but remember there are also inequities in men’s lives as well.. Maybe you should see how the court’s treat fathers, or perhaps like this friend of mine who got off on drink driving for flirting with an officer.. Men can’t get away with that.. I think we should start being fair…

    • Brando says:

      07:00am | 10/05/10

      Gender imbalance at work? If you want to know why men get promoted faster than woman have a look around the office at 7.30pm one night as people are working to meet a deadline. A woman still at work at that time a rare sight indeed. In fact I’d go as far to say that the most dangerous place on Earth is between a woman and the front door of the office at 5pm.

      In my 30 plus year career working in many offices I see women stream out the door every afternoon as the men stay behind to get the work done. Tell a woman that we need to work late so the projects ready for the client in the morning and you’ll only waste 15 minutes as she comes up with a litany of excuses why she has to leave no later than 5.15.

      So it’s 90% men getting the work done and making the revenue but you want a quota of 50% of women in senior positions.

      Quotas only allow the inept to flourish.

    • Hedda Clark says:

      07:59am | 10/05/10

      Crikey Brando where do you work?  I am in and working before any male hits our doors.

    • Formersnag says:

      08:33am | 10/05/10

      @ Hedda Clark, ah yes the typical feminist debating technique.

      http://exposingfeminism.wordpress.com/shaming-tactics/

      Ignore the facts in sombody elses opinion & throw in a half truth of your own.

      Yes some women do get to work early. I have seen some female, work place, psychopaths ( they out number the males 7 to 1) who make a habit of being first in, so they can keep a log of late arrivals & dob them in to the boss.

      Some working mothers also drop their children off at child care/before school care at very early hours, so they can arrive at work a “little” early & get a “little” extra work done.

      No doubt there are some full time working mums out there doing a 50 hour week.

      But how many working dads are doing a 60 to 100 hour working week, because their stay at home wife wants the extra money.

    • Bill says:

      11:57am | 10/05/10

      Brando, you may be right. I have had similar experiences. But often it is due to these same people buggerising around all day then putting in the late hours to give a completely undeserved impression of diligence.

      Also, some workplaces actively conspire against any worker who actually wants to get the job done within the normal working day, and any person attempting to block out these disruptions risks being accused of “not being a team player”, or worse.

      In any workplace there may be times where an extra effort is required, but if working late is routine then something is not right within the organisation.

    • Reality Check says:

      12:53pm | 10/05/10

      Who’s the sucker Brando? I don’t blame those women wanting to get home on time to their actual life. Work to live not live to work.

    • Fred says:

      01:37pm | 10/05/10

      I think you’re all dangerously over-generalising.  All 3 of you are probably telling the truth from your own experiences, but it’s dangerous and not to mention naive to think that what has happened in your life happens in everyone else’s. Some women work late, some men work late, I’m not going to argue either way and call it ‘factual’ until i see some statistics on this.

    • Kate says:

      03:42pm | 10/05/10

      Facetime does not mean productivity. This notion that people who worked for hours and hours - unpaid - are somehow more efficient that those that stay focused in the allotted hours is so out of date. Hear Daniel Petre on this subject - he says his goal is to get the job done in the minimum of hours possible. For anyone who doesn’t know who Petre is he is a very successful Australian digital media exec who once answered directly to Bill Gates. He also wrote the book Father Time.
      A man hanging around at the office does not mean he is getting the work done - just that he is hanging around the office making sure he gets seen because “facetime” is the biased false measure of success.

    • Brando says:

      03:59pm | 10/05/10

      Well Kate you may well be right. However, these men putting in the extra hours are coincidentally the same people who pull in the biggest revenue and therefore earn the most money and get promoted faster.

      If anyone is capable of generating the same revenue in a shorter time I think most senior executives would be impressed and promote them quickly so they could pass their skills on to others. I have yet to see anyone demonstrate this ability..

      It’s also been my experience that the people who do the least are the ones who complain the most.

    • James Shaw says:

      04:42pm | 10/05/10

      Brando you are 100% correct that too many women in middle level management have excuses why they can not stay back to meet tight deadlines. Like in any team when someone is not their pulling their weight, someone else has to do extra work to cover for them. Surely it is those who deserve promotions and not those who are not as committed?

      Kate wake up to the real world instead of just throwing out cliches. The largest reason that many women have not risen higher in the ranks is not that they don’t want it; it is that they are not willing to commit to the very, very onerous effort to getting there. Kate we are talking about the elite in business here which is very competitive and those who just fluff around and stay later will rarely proceed. The high achievers that do (and rightly so) progress through the ranks are the ones who are productive and willing to work 60 to100 hours per week (whatever it takes) to ensure the business succeeds. Those people sacrifice many things in life to reach these high levels but surely that is their choice. It is unfair to these people and the business if quotas are in place which benefits those who do not deserve it. I am sure if asked whether they would like to be CEO that most men and women would put their hands up and say yes. I doubt that the same amount of people would commit to working 80 hour weeks for 25 years to get there. Like always everyone is keen to put their hands up for the rewards but not many are keen to put in the work to get there.

      If a woman or a man is keen for that life I wish them the best and they deserve the position. The woman or man that leaves at 5:15pm everyday even when there are emergencies at work simply does not deserve the position as someone else is carrying their load.

    • Michael says:

      10:39pm | 10/05/10

      The false premise is that there must be gender discrimination at work, without proof. Setting quotas(for gender or that matter race) would mean that the person who is capable and has a strong work ethic will give up and and the enterprise will suffer. Why should anyone work harder for the same pay, just because they’re male or white?

    • Anthony and Justine says:

      07:34am | 10/05/10

      This message is much more palatable when it’s posted in an articulate and considered article than borderline hysterically repeated in the comments section of The Punch. Thank you for writing this. The idea of quotas is discriminatory to males, patronising and ultimately unhelpful to females, and represents an intrusion of government on private business. Even if there were active discrimination, which as the article states, there may very well not be, the solution is not in applying legislative force.

    • AdamC says:

      10:05am | 10/05/10

      As a relatively young man climbing the career ladder, I have an obvious aversion to quotas. A lot of these issues could be resolved if professional women got into the habit of having children earlier. The real cause of the ‘glass ceiling’ is the penchant for working women to take years off, followed by several more years working only part time, when their male colleagues are angling for management promotions.  One cannot possibly expect to become CEO of the company working three days a week.

      Forcing boards to appoint women directors will benefit only a select community of well-connected women. Middle-and-senior management quotas will be a massive compliance cost on business, and is likely to have to be breached frequently. These are bad ideas.

    • Ajent says:

      08:32pm | 10/05/10

      @ AdamC

      As a relatively young woman climbing the corporate ladder I have a problem with your comment re: having children earlier. The fact of the matter is that it doesn’t really matter when a woman has her children, it will impact on her career, her future earning capacity and her perceived value in the workplace.

      If all women went out and started having children at 20 they would be in much the same position at 30 as they are now. People look at the 30 year old now and think ‘well she’ll be rushing to have kids soon’, and if she already has kids they think ‘she’s at the mercy of her kids,and will want/need time off blah blah blah’. The reality is that the biological fact that women bear children, and the social expectation/norm that women are the major carers means that the 50 hour week and the job with all the extra responsibility is almost impossible.

      Personally I think the argument shouldn’t be about women matching men in the workplace, it should be about workplaces and social perceptions changing so that all workers - men and women, older or younger - have the ability better balance work with life outside it. There are very few people I know who would not rather spend more time on their personal lives, hobbies and with family and friends. Why is it that spending 10-12 hours a day in the office is seen so positively?

      I want to work, I want to have interesting and fulfilling work, but I also want kids and the ability to spend a reasonable amount of time with them. I dont want to have to leave them at a childcare centre, or miss their school sports days etc….. And I want my husband to have the same opportunities. So I will sacrifice the 50 hour a week job, and put up with the snide comments and pitying looks from the career driven men (and women) and I will leave at the end of my 7 1/2 day when there is nothing urgent on.

    • Rob r Charteris says:

      08:00am | 10/05/10

      Take the purgery and heresay and bias against men out of the family court, and we’ll talk about equal pay. You know they even jail Judges for doing the same.

    • KH says:

      08:26am | 10/05/10

      Its ‘perjury’.  And where exactly did the article refer to equal pay? So much for the higher intelligence.

    • Peter Lib says:

      08:13am | 10/05/10

      I, for the life of me, don’t see how a quota system will result in the best people for the job getting positions offered.

      At school we are to told study hard, do you best you can, prove yourself and you can achieve anything with your life. Well that is until you find yourself up against a female with minimal capabilities applying for the same job as you.

      Losing out to some external, unrealistic quota system can be heartbreaking indeed discouraging. Is there little wonder why male suicide rates in this country are so ridiculously high!

    • KH says:

      08:30am | 10/05/10

      Oh poor boo boo - I bet if feels just like losing out to a male of inferior ability and experience because he can talk ‘footy’ for hours every Monday, and all the other managers are male - why change the club rules now?

    • Eric says:

      09:07am | 10/05/10

      KH, if it’s wrong to promote people simply because they are male, then it’s wrong to promote people simply because they are female.

    • Peter Lib says:

      11:04am | 10/05/10

      As far as I am concerned the best person for the job should get the job. Regardless of sex. End of story.

      Gee KH, your rather childish “Poor boo boo” remark on a comment regarding male suicide pretty much proves that no further response is needed. *shaking my head with dismay*

    • KH says:

      11:48am | 10/05/10

      My point is that every time there is an article about women being treated equally in business, there is always someone who comes up with some nonsense about prisons or the family court, and in this case, suicide rates - what that has to do with treating women equally in business, I cannot quite fathom.  I am capable of taking each argument individually - there are various problems with prisons, the family court and suicide rates, often around gender - they are separate issues, and really have no place here. I doubt the suicide rate is significantly affected by men not getting a CEO job because of a quota.

    • Eric says:

      12:04pm | 10/05/10

      KH, you simply compound your offence. Your reaction to male suicide rates: “poor boo boo”. How would you feel if you wrote a comment about rape or domestic violence, and some man sad that in response.

      Now you try to justify your insult by calling men’s issues “some nonsense.” Wow, that really makes me want to sympathise with women’s issues (not).

      Of course, your comment also neglects the fact that only women’s issues are ever raised in Punch articles. Men’s issues just don’t get any airtime.

    • KH says:

      01:29pm | 10/05/10

      Eric - in the context of this discussion, it is “nonsense” to bring in things that are a completely different subject.  And yes, if I had made some spurious inclusions into the argument, I would expect to be mocked. 
      You are the worst offender when it comes to always having to introduce ‘mens issues’ when we are talking about an issue related to women, usually in some specific context to which prisons and the like really have no place.  You want to talk about mens issues (although I would have thought suicide rates are just a ‘human’ issue), why don’t you write an article about it instead of constantly trying to add it into other discussions?  Make it a subject on its own then you can discuss it all you like, and stay on topic.

    • Eric says:

      02:18pm | 10/05/10

      Oh KH, poor boo boo.

      If you don’t like men’s comments, don’t read them.

    • Andrwe says:

      04:18pm | 10/05/10

      KH, quotas that dictate what percentage of positions must be filled by females is not a “woman’s issue” it also has an impact on men because some men who have equal qualifications and work experience will be passed over because they have the wrong genitalia to fulfil a ridiculous quota forced upon workplaces in the name of equality.

      If the only way women can get so called “equality” is by turning the tables and make men the victims of sex discrimination then the feminist movement has failed.

    • James Shaw says:

      04:52pm | 10/05/10

      I think many would agree that we would love to see KH banned from discussion from Punch. She seldom adds anything of substance and is always the first to attack the opinions of other without justification. Peter Lib raised a very sincere and valid point only to be attacked by KH. Come on Punch, we don’t need low content contributors like this.

    • Ben1 says:

      04:57pm | 10/05/10

      KH, I also tire of other, worthwhile debates becoming side-tracked by the issues with the family court. It is in everyone’s interests to see this issue resolved asap. This whole issue is dragging down the whole reputation of the feminist brand. Whenever anyone debates any issue from a feminist sounding perspective, someone will drag out the family court “trump card” to undermine the other person’s argument. Lets take this option away from oponents of feminism.

    • Peter says:

      09:40am | 11/05/10

      @ KH, I love how you interlectualise “gimme gimme gimme I wanny now and I don’t want to earn it” and poo hoo others. Believe me, getting senior positions without earning is doing women no favors. You’ve got to have earnt respect first to be successful in those positions…

    • T.Chong says:

      08:22am | 10/05/10

      We need more women execs, just like the gals from Hardies and Bonds. Didnt they bring a whole new world of inclusiveness, profit sharing, and touchy feely when they were running things?
      Quotas would allow the unprepared / unqualified to gain jobs they cannot gain thru merit.

    • KH says:

      08:54am | 10/05/10

      Its interesting that if a female business leader fails or makes a mistake, it is front page news, and ‘all women’ are tarnished by it, yet every year in this country hundreds of businesses fail, some big businesses lose money or make wrong turns, all led by males, yet we don’t hear so much about it?  Maybe a small article buried in the business pages, but I guess its OK if it’s males making mistakes or failing; it’s only that one guy, not all of them…..........isn’t that right, T?

    • Eric says:

      09:08am | 10/05/10

      I saw plenty of comments about how the GFC was all men’s fault, and wouldn’t have happened if businesses were run by women. I guess the news media are different on your planet.

    • T.Chong says:

      09:16am | 10/05/10

      KH - we are told non sense that all women are some how all so noble and selfless, purely because they are women.
      When feminist flag wavers like you have the intellectual honesty to admit that being female does not automatically equate with saintliness, devine wisdom , or anything else, than your message would be more acceptable.
      Not all men are CEOs, and not all women are down trodden would be CEOs , if only the men would stop oppressing them.
      Women are as good, and as bad as men.

    • bec says:

      10:01am | 10/05/10

      t.chong, feminists DO complain. Women aren’t great saintly creatures. Some of us steal our neighbour’s junk mail, swear around the elderly and occasionally kick little puppies. But you haven’t figured out that because we’re held to such a high standard that it’s impossible to meet it and we’ve got further to fall? We’re expected to be the gatekeepers of social morality and if we fail to stop others from morally transgressing, we are held at fault.

    • C says:

      03:10pm | 10/05/10

      “we are told non sense that all women are some how all so noble and selfless, purely because they are women”

      And these people obviously ignore Gail Kelly, CEO of Westpac….

    • Adam Diver says:

      08:48am | 10/05/10

      I think there are 2 other points that should be considered as well

      1. A lot of these high positions take decades to get too. Considering that the results of todays gender balances are more reflective of 20-30 years ago. Results of todays corportae environment won’t be realised for another decade or so.

      2. Men are more averse to taking risks. Many of the new large companies are started, founded or funded by men so it would be no surprise that the highest positions would be going to these same men.

      To be honest I feel this is an issue that doesn’t exist. The fact that 8% of high positions are taken by women suggest that there is no reason women can’t get high position jobs. The % doesn’t really matter as long as its greater than 0.

    • DirectorMum says:

      10:36am | 10/05/10

      (1.) Is a very good point. There is also a time lag in terms of division of home responsibilities. The Dad’s of today are hardly comparable to the Dad’s of the last generation. Despite being a Division Director at a large investment bank himself, outside of my 3 years of maternity leave my husband and I have split the division of home responsibilities and child care pretty much 50/50. This has allowed me to continue to build my own career, which remains on an upward trajectory. This is something my mother’s generation would never have dreamed of. I think we’ll naturally start to see more women in senior positions as more men play a more active role in the care of their children. I also have the benefit of fit, active, retired parents and in-laws who are far more willing and able to contribute to ‘the village’ than generations past.

    • Jim Smith says:

      05:06pm | 10/05/10

      Director Mum,

      That is a fantastic arrangement that you and your husband have but that does not support a quota system at all. It seems that your priority is to focus more on your career than on your family and that is fine. If you are putting in the same sort of commitment as your colleagues you should certainly be considered for higher promotions. It is however possible that you and your husband who are not 100% committed to the business but share parenting responsibilities could have been overlooked for those who do not have kids or those whose partner takes 100% responsibility for the family. The amount of time each of us has in day is finite so if you are spending it on family it means you are not spending it on work. I am not saying this is a necessarily a desirable way to live but for those who chose it they should reap the rewards. It is a simple equation; those who are the most productive at work should be those who are promoted at work.  This will ultimately exclude those with other commitments however their life’s maybe fulfilled in other areas.

      The problem is that most women don’t want to miss out on the benefits of motherhood yet expect to continue being promoted at the same rate as her peers who work very hard. That is the problem with the quota system.

    • DirectorMum says:

      05:47pm | 10/05/10

      Bulldust Jim Smith. Both my husband and I have been promoted quicker than our peers and continue to advance. You’re projecting your own prejudices upon me, without reading my argument. The old ‘your priority is on your work and not your family’ chestnut gives you away. My list of priorities is something that is absolutely impossible for you to know, but your claim is a reflection upon your limited worldview. My husband and I are exceptional at our jobs, are very loving, committed parents with happy, bright, polite children. We are very adept at juggling the work life balance because there are two of us sharing the responsibility equally (with the help of our parents). If you’ll read what I wrote, my argument is actually against quotas as thankfully society is evolving and notions such as ‘career women put their family second’ and ‘men who don’t participate in family life get promoted quicker’ are thankfully going the way of the dodo.

      No matter how hard you work, you can’t work your way out of your own mediocrity.

    • Greg says:

      08:57am | 10/05/10

      The primary reason so few women make it to the top is when they enter the corporate world, they chose non-line functions such as human resources or legal to build their careers. In most busiensses, the senior management has spent a significant amount of their time in front line operational areas - at the coal face if you like. These positions can be extremely demanding as they tend to be focused on the business’s interface with the uncontolled external environment where competition with the busienss’s competitors is feirce. It is from these ranks that most senior manager are drawn as these are the core fuctions of the business and unless women occupy them in similar numbers as men, the gender imbalance will never be overcome.

    • iansand says:

      09:03am | 10/05/10

      Where talent is equal there may be a place for gender as part of the decision.  Where talent is not equal the most talented person, male or female, should get the job without bias attributed to sex.  It’s pretty simple.

    • KH says:

      09:27am | 10/05/10

      If only it were that simple. There is more to it than just talent.  Part of promotion is being seen as one of the ‘team’ - the problem is the game they are playing - it is tailored to men, and generally excludes women.  Networking is a huge part of getting these jobs, or even hearing about them - especially when you start talking top companies.  “Social events” that mean drinking beer in a coporate box at the football, or playing golf; a fair few of these discussions will take place in places like the Melbourne Club, which of course, women can’t join, or even go to. The people who know about these positions, or are themselves in a position to hire into them are not members of the ladies auxilliary.  There are plenty of issues that are not related to talent, ability or capability - if it really were that simple, there would probably be more women in these types of positions and less of some of the dodo male managers I have had the misery of working for.  I doubt it would ever be 50% though - thanks to the unfortunate biology we have, many women who want children will end up having to do the bulk of the caring whether they want to or not, and thus can’t commit to the time required to run a company, for example.  But certainly more than a single figure percentage.

    • iansand says:

      10:33am | 10/05/10

      KH - I think that was my point.  The assessment of suitability for a role should not involve gender except as a final determinant when all else is equal.

    • Life On Mercury says:

      11:21am | 10/05/10

      I agree with KH.


      Many bosses choose to hire or promote people who they feel they have the most in common with. For example, if you were a boss looking to promote a team member, who would you choose (assuming both were equally talented and dedicated, etc)?


      Would it be Person A who went to your school, who you play sport with, drink with, and perhaps even shower with in the change rooms! Or Person B, who has completely different hobbies to you, doesn’t drink, and whom you have no inclination to socialise with outside of work?


      This is what the quota system seeks to address.

    • Greek Snake says:

      12:13pm | 10/05/10

      It’s strange, KH, that you refer to it as “unfortunate biology”. You are in effect, dismissing your role as the child-baring sex. Why do you hate your role so much?

      It is this “unfortunate biology” that many women embrace and become happy mothers and loving partners, while leaving the bitterness you harbor behind.

      Each sex has their role. Like it or not men are physically more capable and women are more attuned to emotion. While there are exceptions to this rule, the balance of workers in these fields sides with my statement. Tradies = men and Carers/Teachers = women. Why women feel they have the right to dominate in numbers the generally male oriented field of top dog is beyond me.

      I understand there might be women who excel at business and can run a company like no other. But these women are few and far between. In fact, when you take a look at the world’s richest people, women don’t even come into the equation until the 12th man, and if you take out inheritance from the equation I think women wouldn’t come into it until the 30th man.

      Let’s face it, males are the dominant sex. Just because males and females pair up, it doesn’t mean they should be even at everything. After all the rubbish about gender inequality, there still isn’t a family court in the world that would rule in favor of the father. Nor is there a male I know that breastfeeds as well as his female partner. Know your role.

    • Bateman says:

      01:35pm | 10/05/10

      KH and Life on Mercury

      When I’m appointing someone to a management position in my organisation I look at a number of factors. Qualifications. Ability. Output. Dedication. Accuracy. Results. etc

      Another aspect is communication and teamwork. I want the person that is supporting me or next to me to be on the same wavelength as me. I want to be able to understand their communication style and know that they understand mine.

      That is why it appears as if it is “jobs for the boys”. The people I interact with and can trust to have my back get the role.

      The quiet mouse sitting in the corner might be getting her work done but she isn’t the whole package.

      Women need to learn this. They need to become team players and learn to play the game.

      Tokenism will never earn your respect.

    • KH says:

      01:48pm | 10/05/10

      Greeksnake - in answer to your question, I am one of those women who never wanted children, and never will.  I am not the kind of person who would do well in that role - don’t get me wrong - I love kids (my nieces and nephews for starters) but I don’t want one of my own.  Having children is not my damn role.

    • Greek Snake says:

      04:11pm | 10/05/10

      Thats fine KH. Don’t have kids, no one is forcing you to. But don’t for a second assume that it is not your role. You were born with the anatomy to have children, there is no male substitute for it.

      Have you ever played tetris? You are attempting to fit the odd shaped blocks into a long thin gap when clearly only one type of brick will do. The idea is to hold out until that right one comes along, not just to hire because part of it fits in. Both in employment, and in tetris, you will end up with gaps.

    • Helen says:

      09:05am | 10/05/10

      All positions should be allocated on merit, not because of gender.

      However, I have always found men much more pleasant to work with.  During 25 years in the workforce, recently winding down to part-time, I tired of PMT hysterical women, bitching, grasping for promotion that was often undeserved, gender-based privilege seeking, back-stabbing of male colleagues and annoying superiority complexes.

      Many of those women were nothing but conniving trouble.

      And I am a long-term married mother, so please don’t attempt the bias accusation.  This is how things were in various workplaces, and it was not a pleasant sight.

    • Stacey says:

      10:22am | 10/05/10

      That’s not been my experience at all. The opposite is true in fact. Perhaps your assesment might be true of lower management but in senior management (the positions we’re talking about here) in the business’ I’ve worked in, both men and women HAVE to be exceptional.

    • Paul2 says:

      10:46am | 10/05/10

      Should try Nursing Helen, if you want more of the same, with interest.  Real power obviously comes from the end of a fingernail.

    • Helen says:

      06:53pm | 10/05/10

      No Stacey.  I was employed as a political staffer and senior government executive officer.  Not at all “lower management”. 

      Female workplace hatred of male peers was common, and nothing short of despicable. 

      The males were better emotionally equipped to shoulder heavy responsibilities. Their natural competitive tendencies mostly played out amongst their own gender, while the women would walk right over the top of anyone in their way. 

      I’ve seen ambitious women destroy men using psychological tactics that the KGB wouldn’t understand.

    • Bateman says:

      09:13am | 10/05/10

      Legislated tokenism will achieve nothing other and undermining the equality that has been fought for and achieved. All women have equality of opportunity in the Western world. What we should be focusing on is the disparity in other parts of the world and opening up a dialogue with them and encourage them to change (should they want it).

      If you want to make it to the top then you need to put in the work to get there
      - work hours
      - work outcomes
      - results
      - bargain for your opportunity to lead. Show passion. Commitment. Dedication. Teamwork. Reliability.

      The reason so few women are represented in senior roles is not because of some “mysoginistic phallocentric hegemony” but because so few women are talented and dedicated enough to do it for the reasons explained in the article.

    • Chewy says:

      09:52am | 10/05/10

      Why are sex discrimination commissioners always women? Isnt that er discriminatory?

    • Peter says:

      09:56am | 10/05/10

      We recently had one of those “quota” promotions. It demeaned the current staff we had, displayed a complete lack of respect for them, they now do not respect this woman (through no fault of her own), and they will not listen to her. It has created divisions in my work place, and i’d be surprised if we don’t get formal complaints….

      Happy for women to be in senior roles, but for their own sake and the fairness of people working in the same place, there must be some element of “earning it”... This poor woman now has started on the back foot, and she will not recover from this….

    • IMHO says:

      10:13am | 10/05/10

      If I were a woman, I would be offended if I was employed because a quota had to met.

    • IMHO says:

      10:21am | 10/05/10

      If I was a woman….quota had to be met.

      Sorry.

    • Peter says:

      10:42am | 10/05/10

      You wouldn’t think you had to earn it? How do you think people in Senior roles get respect? It’s because of the work they did leading up to such promotions… You don’t get respect by filling quota’s…

    • Bruce says:

      10:59am | 10/05/10

      I have 2 successful daughters, and they know they have to be the best at their job and better than those around them to be promoted. NOT because they are women. Both would be highly offended if they were to get a position just because they are women.

    • Peter says:

      11:26am | 10/05/10

      @ Bruce, i agree with you. I think most women would think that way as well.. But when we have feminists on the war path trying to fill quotas, they are not doing their sisters any favours…. This woman i talk of in my workplace, she seems ok to me, but because of the way things were done in secret, she is now on the back foot and her job has been made difficult by those promoting her. No-one in my workplace even realised there was a job going, that’s how bad it is…

    • tyu says:

      10:25am | 10/05/10

      With all this affirmative action and quota systems, it feels like Australia’s becoming a communist country. Could it be that words like ‘equality’ and ‘diversity’ are code words for eventual authoritarian communism. Starting to wonder….

    • Mr. W says:

      10:31am | 10/05/10

      As a Norwegian I can tell you that this legislation has become under attack as it does not favour equality, but forces it. Here you have people getting work based on their gender, not their merits. That is wrong. If you want a job done, I want it done by an expert; what they have between their legs is at not interest to me.

      The same thing is happening in Sweden in regards to universities. They are scrapping this legislation because it is wrong to accept a student based on gender and not merit.

      A gender equality legislations sounds very good on paper and can create some really beautiful statistics that a company and a country can brag about, but in reality it actually creates more diversity and tension between genders. You can almost call it a form of gender segregation.

    • Adam Diver says:

      11:14am | 10/05/10

      copy paste to any affirmative action - aboriginals, immigrants, refugees, gays etc etc.

      The more we try to help a group of people in a society the more we make a distinction that they are different and below everyone else. As long as everyone has equal opportunity and other factors not human related (geography, financial etc) are considered the better we can al get along.

    • Herr Derp says:

      10:34am | 10/05/10

      If any company hires someone for any reason other than capability, they’re in a world of trouble. ‘Jobs for the boys’ is not best tackled through ‘jobs for the girls’. You’re just ensuring that instead of loser males making up mangement, you also have a bunch of loser females. Who wins?

    • Peter says:

      10:55am | 10/05/10

      Talk about jobs for the girls. I have to get braces, a female orthadontist, with 2 female staff, I was refered by her to a female dentist, with 2 female staff. This week, my next referal from her is to a female surgeon (im guessing she’ll just have female staff)... Talk about jobs for the girls.. But i’ll give them this much, they have been reasonably priced compared to some other quotes i received…

    • stephen says:

      10:41am | 10/05/10

      Germany, me thinks, apologize too much.
      There’s no reason to concoct a guilt over a gender imbalance in the workplace. It is in a Company’s best interest (and I’m sure they know this), to hire the best people, and businesses should be under no pressure to employ a particular person.

    • Ryan says:

      11:25am | 10/05/10

      Ah sexism at its best, so much for the “gender equality” the feminists were screaming for, methinks some are more equal than others perhaps?

    • A Bob says:

      11:35am | 10/05/10

      Back when my kids were young, in one of my previous jobs, I would do all the dropping off at schol and picking up. I negotiated my working hours in the interview to allow for this. At review time, I regularly scored the highest in my team, getting 100% in some KPI’s.

      But, I was denied pay rises due to my ‘negative attitude’, i.e., I wasn’t considered a ‘team player’, despite that fact that I trained and coached others and assisted wherever I was needed. I never did the ‘not in my job description’ routine.

      I don’t see it as gender discrimination as much as role discrimination. It’s just more likely for women to be filling the family oriented roles in most cases.

      However, I wouldn’t want to be the token appointee either. I’d just like to see fairness all round where being devoted to family isn’t regarded as a negative. If they can do the job, they get the opportunities to advance.

    • Eric says:

      12:00pm | 10/05/10

      Relevant to Ms Eisler’s point: http://bit.ly/8Xdn4f

      “Sixty-four percent (64%) of Americans think that being a mother is the most important role for a woman to fill in today’s world, according to a new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey. Eighteen percent (18%) disagree, and another 18% aren’t sure ...

      “Women are more likely than men to think being a mother is their most fulfilling role. There is virtually no difference of opinion on this between those with children in the home and those who don’t have children living with them.”

      I don’t know what the numbers are for Australia.

    • Ray says:

      12:14pm | 10/05/10

      Well Daniela all I can say is I’m appalled the your abuse of your editorial privelege to peddle yet another one of these feminist paranoid articles. The fact that it is accompanied by two other articles on breast feedng etc is an indictment of society’s and the media’s obsession with women’s matters. Same deal every other day.

      There is no doubt that particul;alry Austra;ian women are the most priveleged sector of society that history has ever seen. Yet you continue to peddle the wish for giltedged guarantees for women ad nauseum.

      Do we ever do articles on thew difficulties men face. Do we ask if men have similar choices. Do we ask why education heavily favours women and give an honest answer. Do we ask if the current day stolen generation(s) is that generation(s) stolen from their fathers by the family court. Do we ask why we have a family court where action is initiated to the tune of 80% by females. Do we ask if the outcomes are proportional to the usage rates. Do men stay in unhappy marriages because they will be piloried by the family court. Do men carry the load at work when women take their raft of work absentee entitlements. Do women on their return get promoted straight over the men who’ve done both jobs in the woman’s absence. Do we acknowledge men’s achievements at work in the face of barriers such as affirmative action. Do women have additional training not available to men (ie CEO mentoring for women)etc., etc. Afraid answer to all of the above is NO.

      Why do we have Telstra Business Women’s Awards and none for our equally deserving young (and older) men.

      I am appalled that our women are ‘takers’ and not sharers. You need to dismantle everything male and promote everything female.  You are aided and abetted by pathetic men in power who subjigate to the feminst juggernaught. Youy see nothing wrong with this stacked deck against your sons.

      Comprehensive bloody parasites

    • LCS says:

      12:17pm | 10/05/10

      Consider this. The Ambulance Service of NSW. According to the Web details on the organisation all directors are female. Being female seems a funny criterion to serve as a director.

    • Anne71 says:

      12:57pm | 10/05/10

      Personally, I find the whole idea of “quotas”, regardless of whether they are based on gender or race, utterly offensive. It’s tokenism, pure and simple. The job should go to the most capable and the best qualified, regardless of which restroom they go to or the colour of their skin. Having said that though, even without quotas jobs at the top levels aren’t always decided on merit - too often it comes down to the old boys / old girls network. Do away with that and then you might find there is no need for quotas after all. The problem is how?

    • NEFFA says:

      01:26pm | 10/05/10

      all of these men on here complaining about how hard done by they are, the answer is quite simple. you stay home and look after the kids.
      Women should transfer all household duties to the men. then we can go to work 10hrs a day and take on those CEO roles, go for “corporate weekends” and generally live it up, while you are at home scrubbing the toilets.
      How long do you think you will last before you are begging for help?

    • Bitten says:

      01:38pm | 10/05/10

      NEFFA your comment is ignorant in the extreme. 10 hour days? Try 14-16 hour days with the knowledge that 10s, 100s and 1000s of people are relying on you to do your job right.  And I’m female - I find the ‘woe is me’ BS from other women about how tough it is being female to be grossly misrepresentative. It’s BS, girls. The jig is up. Actually, no, it’s not that hard to be female and to work hard. You just have to work hard. Suck it up princesses, if you don’t want to work, then don’t and stop whinging. If you do want to work, then get on with it and stop whinging.

    • Ray says:

      01:50pm | 10/05/10

      NEFFA; Intelligence Quotient :1 out of 10.

      I think men should actually be levied $100 pw for their whole working life to be provided to women as an on-going God given, birthright, gratuity without obligation, for their poor suffering.

      Failure of men to pay will result in defaulters compulsory one night stand with Elizabeth Broderick. Recalcitrant, serial offenders sentenced to 1 week stand with Eva Cox. Any reulting offspring to be drowned at birth.

      This done on the proviso that all women shout drinks once a week AND MAKE NO MORE VACUOUS CLAIMS. Recalcitrant female defaulters sentenced to same treatment as men in the Family Courts, education, & employment, with special treatment to raise their intelligence and self worth to the same as men. As with everything else women will be given a guarantee regardless of their input.

    • Markus says:

      02:21pm | 10/05/10

      NEFFA I think you’d be surprised how many dads would love nothing more than to be able to stay home with their kids while someone else takes the provider role.
      “YOU try looking after the kids 24/7” seems to be the cliche battlecry of the hardly done by housewife, but when push comes to shove how many women would actually be willing to trade seeing their kids to spend 70+ hours a week working toward the promotion they have been so unfairly overlooked for?

    • NEFFA says:

      02:53pm | 10/05/10

      so you all see my point then?

    • Formersnag The Child Protector. says:

      04:11pm | 10/05/10

      @ NEEFA, No, we don’t dear. I for one think that all middle class welfare, support for the 2 income couples, for child care, etc, should be withdrawn.

      Governments could go back to the tax/welfare systems we had in the 50’s which favoured 1 income couples so that 1 parent can be a full time stay at home, parent.

      Then all women would be able to choose to be childless & aggressively pursue a career.

      Or if they wanted children & a career, they could choose to have the back up system, that comes from supporting a full time stay at home house husband.

      Extensive surveys have been done on, “Alpha females” or high powered career women in America. Roughly 80% of them choose an “Alpha male” partner who is at or above their career/income level.

      Then “get back in the kitchen” where they want to be, only ever working part time at best after that. Multiple best selling books on the subject & men’s, better performance at parenting are available at this web site.

      http://www.warrenfarrell.com/

      What do you ladies suggest, “Work place Conscription”? Jack booted storm troopers enforcing a 50/50 gender divide in all jobs, careers, industries?

      I can assure you that the social work industry, which has been failing spectacularly for 4 or 5 decades now, would be more efficient with less women than its current 90%.

    • NEFFA says:

      07:06pm | 10/05/10

      Formersnag The Child Protector, firstly “dear”, don’t patronise me. Then sweetie you go on to totally contradict yourself darling.
      you say men make better carers, then complain about 50/50 gender divide then say women should be removed from the social work sector and men take over. so which is it? should women be back in the kitchen? why if men do it better? should they be at work? again, why? if men do it better?
      in your world, sugar pie, honey bunch. what exactly do women do?

    • Sam says:

      01:28pm | 10/05/10

      I’ve had 15 years experience in the IT industry and I’m yet to meet a woman in that field who I would have allowed to graduate from university. From what I’ve seen, they can’t perform the junior tasks to save their lives, so they’re fast tracked into middle management positions and end up as my managers. Luckily for them (women) I’m not their boss, otherwise there’d be a lot of unemployed women turning up at Centrelink tomorrow.

      I can learn to live with women who are indeed better than me, but I can’t accept that such a person could possibly exist until I meet at least one.

      Having established that I’m superior to the majority of females in my field, I wonder why they’re being paid more. It must be time for me to shave my legs.

      Hang-on, I’ve just found the answer to my problems. Now that my bosses are predominantly women, I bet I can screw my way to the top. I just need a few paper bags.

    • Margaret Gray says:

      01:34pm | 10/05/10

      If women weren’t such outright bitches to each other there would be more of us in positions of power and influence.

      The level of cattiness in business is appalling and so pathetically trivial.

    • bella starkey says:

      02:01pm | 10/05/10

      I wouldn’t say no to a quota based promotion. Unfortunately 80% of my industry is made up of women.

    • Ben says:

      02:08pm | 10/05/10

      The only quota should be - boards will be made up of 100% people.  No chooks… The right person for the job, regardless of an X or Y in your genes.

    • Peter says:

      07:37pm | 10/05/10

      Try telling that to the feminists. You’ll be howled down and called all sorts of names. These feminists are bullies these days and it will backfire on them…

    • Scott Glennon says:

      02:13pm | 10/05/10

      What a load of BS.. If women want top jobs, you have to work towards them. If you feel your held back from positions based on your sex, then you obligated to report it as discrimination. Stop whinging and get back to work.

    • Peter says:

      02:35pm | 10/05/10

      Can someone tell me if there has ever been a male Minister for the Office of the Status of Women?

      Or come to think of it, if there has ever been a female Minister for the Office of the Status of Men? Oh hang on a minute…..

    • Peter says:

      04:02pm | 10/05/10

      This is another Peter…. Yeah, but the Office for the status of Women…. very dodgy… Talk about Government excesses…

    • Yas says:

      03:02pm | 10/05/10

      The fact is even in this day and age women still, on average, earn less than men. http://tinyurl.com/2a9kbry ; it’s a fact, there is data there that demonstrates it. there are reasons for this; family commitments, societal demands, social insecurity/ discrimination, lack of motivation ect ect.
      In the context of this discussion, i think we are talking about women in the workforce and the stats surrounding the issue http://tinyurl.com/3ytwnl3 , the stats for which are not very good.

      whether or not there is some cattiness/ bitchiness/ attitude issues; as far as i know, there have never been substantial study done to demonstrate that being a bitch means you’ll never get anywhere. Apparently being a blonde gets you more money… hmmm…

      Before my current job, i worked in one of the four major banks. For me, in my own personal experience, the male dominance was unbearable; particularly as i was one of the youngest in the organisation and not the same ethnicity as everyone else (i didn’t find all of their leb/abbo/wog jokes as amusing). it could be said that finance and banking are traditionally male dominated fields and being in management at a bank’s HQ it seems that mentality still survives somewhat. At one point when a colleague was unhappy with his instruction from me he muttered “why do you think we should do this? you seem cranky this week, are you sure you don’t want wait a couple of days before making such a big decision?” i was understandably offended.

      i eventually quit and now work in PR and Publishing. Life has never been better. most management positions are held by females with what seems to be an even ratio of male;female boardroom members. not sure if quotas are in place, but the office culture is certainly pleasant. There is even a flexible arrangement regarding maternity.

      i think, had i been in my early-mid thirties and suffered the work environment of my previous job, it would have significantly affected my motivations. By then, the maternity clock would be ticking, i would perhaps be under spousal/mortgage pressure to stay in a high paying job where i would be counting down the hours until i could leave and switch off, combined with maintaining a certain image and appearance, as well as a well balanced social life outside of work.

      Although i do think men’s issues do need more attention, i think its important to not hijack this topic with them. Yes, men have health issues, social issues, financial issues, event mental issues; yet when it comes to employment, poverty, education and health the stats don’t look great. Things aren’t as bad as Afghanistan in oz, but why set standards so low?

    • Rob says:

      04:24pm | 10/05/10

      Afghanistan? Yeah OK. More men in banking? Yeah OK. But I’ve never seen a male at the face to face.

      Touch of reality please

    • Gibbo says:

      03:36pm | 10/05/10

      Firstly, can somebody please point me to all these Companies that pay Women less than Men for doing the same work?

      Secondly, all you Women out there that think you are being held back by Men just need to start businesses of your own. Then you can employ whoever you want and never be held back again. C’mon… stop whinging and get to it.

    • Richard says:

      03:44pm | 10/05/10

      Gender inequality in the workplace?? Maybe. However, on the most part, this is a two sided coin. Men at work bring home a pay cheque, but this money usually supports a female and children i.e., a family. In this ridiculous debate, females in the family are the forgotten ones! YES THEY ARE FEMALES TOO. On the other hand, ‘most’ females in the work force SUPPLEMENT the houshold income. That is great too. But what is more important? Obviously it is that someone who brings home the money to support a family - male or female. In other words, this has never been about a male/female balance in the work place, but about providing jobs so that families can survive. Last time I checked, females where part of this equation. The glass ceiling should be about families missing out on employment, not male/female ratios. So now I hope you see that women don’t earn less than men if you factor in the women that the pay supports outside the workplace - families.

    • SD says:

      07:22pm | 10/05/10

      Off topic a little bit and on to wages - here are some figures from FAHCSIA (2009)

      Hourly wage ($) 27.71 (males) vs 24.58 (females) 3.13 (difference)

      Time in paid work (years) 19.13 (males) vs 17.09 (females)  2.04 (difference)
      1-34 hours per week (%) 10 (males) 41 (females) -0.31 (difference)

      35-40 hours per week (%) 40 (males) 38 (females) 2 (difference)

      41-49 hours per week (%) 21 (males) 11 (females) 10 (difference)

      50+ hours per week (%) 28 (males) 10 (females) 18 (difference)

      Paints a pretty clear picture.

    • Peter says:

      09:46am | 11/05/10

      What jobs do they do? I think your stats are very misleading.. I work in a place with a lot of women, and no of them are getting paid less than the average. Some women are getting more, Some men are getting more. Would i call what i see in my workplace uneven… no way….

    • SD says:

      12:36pm | 11/05/10

      Whilst your issue of equal pay for equal jobs is a valid one - that is really not what we are discussing. The point at hand is why is it that a) women are under-represented in management positions and b) overall, why is it that there exists a pay discrepancy between the sexes.

      The second point is usually explained in terms of disparate interests. This may be true to an extent. But, after looking at the pay discrepancy, many then question why it is that women are under-represented in higher paying positions, and by extension, management roles.

      In my opinion, if wages were equal on average, then no-one would be questioning/ exploring the under-representation of women in corporate boards. Just as no-one really seems to care about the under-representation of males in the education and nursing sectors.

      The figures above can be interpreted as showing that (and this is on average mind you) males have more work experience and work longer hours. Hence, more pay.

      I would be very interested to see an analysis of incomes which removed the top 2% (or 1 SD) before averaging. These high income earners drastically skew the figures, and everyone knows that an average is useless without a standard deviation or at least a range.

      So really, you are right – the figures are misleading, but in a different way to your issue. I had a look on the ABS website for the raw data, or even a spreadsheet showing SDs and ranges but to no avail. If you can find it – let me know.

    • Peter says:

      03:41pm | 11/05/10

      @ SD, I have no problem with women being in Management roles (i’ve seen some good ones) , but just like men, some are good at it and some are not. Some that might be identified as potential (although not proven) and rushed into roles is not doing anyone any favours. The fact is that some people might put in 5 or 10 years of dedicated work to achieve something and then only to be squashed by a quota system. Why should he have to sacrifice something for your ideology? Also we don’t live in a world of ideology, the senior people need the respect and the hard work of their direct reports and other staff, and if they get a hint that they are there because of a quota system, it builds resentment, doesn’t help loyalty and automatically they have started on the back foot with a big job ahead of them. I would say such a system would make it harder for women..

    • David C says:

      08:49pm | 10/05/10

      Personally I would not hold Europe up as example for anything right now given they are being bailed out to the tune of 1 trillion dollars

    • Chan says:

      09:18am | 11/05/10

      Dress it up any way you like, but any women employed or placed on a board by virtue of a legislative quota will NOT little more than a left wing token.  She will not have earnt her place hence she will not have earnt the respect of her peers.  The point is often made, but never rationalised is WHY we need more women in the workforce?  Maternity leave, harrassment claims, bitchiness, monthly hormonal mood swings, and the constant need for flexibility to look after sick kids.  Model employees??? I think not!  Why not hire a man and avoid the head aches?  If you have two candidates, of equal or at least similar qualifications, experience and skills, why not hire the man and avoid the aforementioned headaches?  What intrinsic value does a woman bring to a job that would automatically make her the better candidate for any given job?  If by the feminists’s own admissions we are all equal then the answer would have to be none at all, therefor why not hire the (male) candidate with whom you will have less productivity related costs (maternity leave, and erratic work hours), not to mention a calmer workplace?  As the old expression goes “if you can’t stand the heat, get out of (or is that get into?) the kitchen” :-

    • TracyS says:

      05:35pm | 19/05/10

      “Maternity leave, harrassment claims, bitchiness, monthly hormonal mood swings, and the constant need for flexibility to look after sick kids. “

      One false assumption being that all women are mums. In a community where female participation in tertiary education is high and a considerable proportion of women graduates chosing not to have children, the assumption that a woman is the poorer candidate for a high level job because she will have child care requirements is blatant ignorance.

      Another false assumption is that bitchiness is a female domain - it is a character trait that is present in both genders.

    • Scoobie Doo says:

      04:50pm | 11/05/10

      Chan. Your comments absolutely reek of common sense. Won’t be long though before the thought police come and get ya.

    • Craig says:

      09:34am | 12/05/10

      White, middle-class feminism rules doesn’t it? Good to see people standing up for true equality - ensuring that more women should be digging roads. Why aren’t people up in arms about the lack of women plumbers? Or should working class men just keep on landscaping your garden, and pulling crap out of your drains, and cleaning your gutters and emptying your garbage so you can get on with your university educated, white, middle class, work- life balance? That ‘s fair.

    • jim morris says:

      06:48pm | 14/05/10

      At a university back-slapping evening I asked Sue Walpole (the anti-descrimination hobnob) how the premise, that all women were advantaged and all men disadvantaged, panned out in the real world example of me with teenage daughter surviving on austudy and her pulling 100+ grand pa. She replied “Just think how soul building it is to suffer”
      The affirmative action based on that big lie continue.

    • Anthony says:

      08:06pm | 14/05/10

      You can easily argue this point both ways.  On one hand, you can say that there aren’t enough women in high-paying jobs, and something should be done.  On the other, you can say that in a company that has mainly men at the top, you are saying that they should remove men from their jobs in favour of women (under the assumption that in order to hire new workers, old ones will be made redundant).  I personally believe that “forcing” employers to have women on their board will eventually create reverse-descrimination, as most employers will seek women instead of men in order to fill their quota.

 

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