The death of Al-Qaeda’s leader has sparked a fierce response that lacks an understanding of the real world. The world is not perfect and nobody should pretend that it is.

Watching Geronimo. Photo: AFP

Nor is foreign policy black and white. It is a cocktail of aspirational idealism and hard fought realism but too often we forget this. The last few weeks have seen an army of armchair commentators purporting their often narrow and moralist interpretations of events as the only courses of action that would have been permissible. So let’s set the record straight on ten fundamental questions with some real world answers:

1. Could Bin Laden have been captured rather than killed?

No.

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/19/news/19iht-t4_30.htmlWhile the United States did in fact prepare for the eventuality of his capture, and others have hypothesised what this would have looked like, there was no way this would have been possible.
Detaining Bin Laden would have likely become the biggest security exercise ever undertaken. No country would have wanted him to be imprisoned on their soil leaving either Guantanamo Bay, a US military base, a purpose built facility or a maximum security prison as the solution. Any location would have become a prime target for future terrorist attacks and risked being a massive public relations disaster for the Obama Administration who might have just wished they had killed him and worn that criticism than the ensuing problem.

Comparisons to fallen Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein’s imprisonment do not hold weight either. Not only was Hussein widely hated within Iraq, any pockets of support were also largely contained within one country and not across a global network. Hussein was also able to be handed over to a domestic judicial process that ultimately was able to at least perceivably provide a fair trial but ended up with his execution – as botched as it was – being recorded and released on the internet.

But had Bin Laden been captured he could not have stood trial in the International Criminal Court given it only deals with acts committed after 2002. A war crimes tribunal in The Hague could not have handed down the death penalty, which to most people on the weight of evidence would seem unreasonable. Presumably this would have left a geographically painful hearing in a New York Federal Court with Bin Laden no doubt using the trial as an opportunity to spread his messages of hatred.

Ultimately, the only reason to have taken Bin Laden alive would have been for the interrogation value but even this would not have been without complication.

2. Was it legal?

Yes.

While Executive Order 11905 (later 12333) signed by President Ford in the wake of the Church Committee states that “no employee of the United States Government shall engage in, or conspire to engage in, political assassination”, there exists no definition of ‘assassination’.

Following September 11th, President Bush issued a directive that excluded what it termed “targeted killing” missions from the Executive Order. The Bush Administration also termed members of Al-Qaeda “enemy combatants” removing them from civilian due process.

What many people overlook in arguing that this provides the United States a ‘licence to kill’ anyone is that state-sponsored killings have long been a part of international affairs. From Israel’s attack on a Hamas commander in Dubai last year, to arguably the Russian’s attempt to poison an ex-KGB operative in London in 2006, there are countless examples that may not sound perfect but have been free from legal repercussions.

The issue with these and Bin Laden’s killing is not so much the legal framework, but the perceived brutality of the attacks being seen not as a more easily explainable act of self-defence. In this case, shooting an old man in the head, who it has now emerged was not armed (though was ‘resisting’ arrest) – is always going to be harder to defend than shooting someone who was either armed, fitter or if it was done in a more ‘hands off’ manner such as through a drone strike or bombing attack that Secretary of Defence Robert Gates advocated.

3. Has justice been done?

No.

Justice implies a judicial process and this was not present (but alas not necessary for it to be legal as mentioned above).

Labelling it as such was President Obama’s biggest mistake in this exercise (that and his obligatory mention of “God bless America” at the end of his speech). Most critics are far from pacifists and in-principle would not take issue with the concept of the leader of the world’s largest terrorist organisation being killed, but would take issue with the concept that such an act represents a just process.

This was a case of President Obama playing to his audience – nothing was gained broadly by the statement – in the same way President Bush did when he declared to Congress in 2001 that: “Whether we bring our enemies to justice, or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done.”

4. Should Pakistan have been told and was this a breach of their sovereignty?

No and perhaps, but who cares.

To any external analyst there is no doubt that the United States (and others, including Australia) do not trust the Pakistani intelligence services with good reason. The Obama Administration was clearly not prepared to risk Bin Laden getting away again and had that happened as a result of the Pakistanis, the relations may well be worse than they are now. This was a ‘Black Ops’ mission and President Obama’s wife would not have even known; the West Wing was shut down on Sunday to avoid anyone becoming suspicious at the buzz of activity. 

President Obama was quick to point out that “Over the years, I’ve repeatedly made clear that we would take action within Pakistan if we knew where bin Laden was.  That is what we’ve done.” Albeit with fears that Pakistan would think it was an Indian attack and would scramble fighter jets to intercept the American forces.

But in a world that has outgrown Westphalian building blocks of sovereign borders in the rise of new global threats, it was a calculated and necessary risk to keep Pakistan in the dark.

At the end of the day, Pakistan needs the United States for aid dollars and the United States needs Pakistan in their continuing fight against extremism. Both sides should temper their rhetoric with this in mind.

5. If some of the intelligence came from Guantanamo Bay detainees does this justify torture?

No.

After initial speculation that the intelligence scoop that led to Bin Laden’s capture came from detainees in Guantanamo Bay this has since been refuted (or at least that it was not divulged as a result of torture).

Nevertheless, some elements on the hard right will no doubt use this as an opportunity to justify the continued operation of the military prison and controversial interrogation techniques such as water boarding. Republican Senator John McCain has sensibly attacked such justifications as a victim of torture techniques himself during the Vietnam War.

6. Should the White House have released a photo of Bin Laden?

No.

This was a no-brainer for the President; there was quite simply no need.

Not only had Bin Laden’s wife identified the body but facial recognition tests were reported as being 95 per cent accurate and a subsequent DNA test as being 99.99 per cent accurate.

There will always be conspiracy theorists arguing that Bin Laden is still alive but they are a small minority and a decision as influential as this should not be designed to appease a largely unpersuadable group. Al-Qaeda has now confirmed the death and should this not be the case you would expect to see a release from Bin Laden soon.

Aside from this, a photo of a man shot above the eye through the skull would no doubt be gruesome, and certainly act as a source for inflammatory responses.

I, along with former CIA Director James Woolsey, would even argue the releasing of video footage seized in the compound was unnecessary. A winner perceivably basking in their triumph by appealing to an underlying public curiosity is not good security policy and risks divulging the extent of intelligence data ascertained. It too was quite simply unnecessary.

7. Will this guarantee President Obama’s re-election?

No.

Predictably, Bin Laden’s death sparked a wave of presumptive calculations that this would seal President Obama’s fate next year for another term. But such predictions are amateurish.

A Gallup poll released the other week showed that the President experienced a six point bump from the events. President Bush experienced a seven point bump after the capture of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein in 2003.

As Gallup explains: “Most often, a president’s approval rating begins to decline fairly soon after the rally event occurs, with the increases in approval often disappearing in as little as one to four weeks.”

Criticism of the Obama Administration’s handling of the aftermath and a return to more constant issues such as the economy upset any hypothesis of a certain re-election. However, it should be noted that after the President’s performance at the White House Correspondent’s Dinner the evening before it was widely regarded that he had seen off his stronger competitor yet in Donald Trump.

8. Can our troops now come home from Afghanistan?

No.

While the war in Afghanistan may have begun as an attempt to remove the Taliban from power and destroy Al-Qaeda, or “smoke ‘em out”, it has become much larger than that.

To use Bin Laden’s death as a turning point through which immediate troop removals can be justified would be not only naive but dangerous. Al-Qaeda would want nothing more than this.

However, this does have the potential to impact the broader debate on a strategic withdrawal timeline. Some, such as President Obama, have long advocated a staged withdrawal based on a desire to not get “bogged down in a strategic quagmire”, while others such as General David Petraeus (soon to be the new CIA Director) and Prime Minister Gillard, advocate a “stay the course” position which will see troops on the ground for at least another decade.

9. Should Americans be rejoicing in Bin Laden’s death?

Most are not.

The media have naturally gravitated towards the public spectacle of jubilant crowds gathering outside the White House and at Ground Zero. For most Americans the death of Bin Laden, while welcomed, is not a cause for celebration but rather closure. Anyone with friends in the United States will know this anecdotally through their Facebook or Twitter feeds.

Others have highlighted the youthful makeup of the crowds likening them to a fraternity group with the smell of marijuana wafting through the air as they sing Miley Cyrus’ ‘Party in the USA’. Without underestimating the intense impact the events of 2001 had on the American people it is important to remember that the average freshman student would have been only nine years old at the time and whether this reaction is more representative of their age today than exposure to the tragedy then is debatable.

10. What will Al-Qaeda’s reaction be?

Deadly.

While President Obama’s speech methodically covered off all the major points of contention from his perspective what was missing was any hint of either the United States’ or Al-Qaeda’s reaction to the events.

Somewhat strangely and probably after a passionate debate, the United States has neither raised their homeland security threat level nor placed troops on alert at military installations across the world. This coupled with the President’s silence is no doubt an exercise designed to inducing any public panic.

What is clearer is that Al-Qaeda was no doubt prepared for Bin Laden’s death, evident through the quick ascension of Ayman al-Zawahiri to command. While Bin Laden was a strategic mastermind, al-Zawahiri was called “the real brains” of Al-Qaeda by Bin Laden’s biographer Hamid Mar.

Furthermore, the Secretary of Homeland Security, Janet Napolitano, has refused to speak on the presence of Al-Qaeda ‘sleeper cells’, individuals at the ready to launch attacks within different countries when activated by a ‘go’ command or event such as this. 

And it these events we should remain ever vigilant of; being cautious not to get bogged down in debates about various commentaries on events without first establishing the facts.

It is time we had an informed debate about Bin Laden.

Thom Woodroofe is a foreign affairs analyst and an Associate Fellow of the Asia Society who can be followed on Twitter @thomwoodroofe

44 comments

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    • acotrel says:

      07:47am | 28/05/11

      ‘Detaining Bin Laden would have likely become the biggest security exercise ever undertaken.’

      And high security prisons are not defensible?  Osama could have been used as the bait in a trap, and brought terrorists out into the open.  As it is his warped ideology will never be known to the world, and exposed for what it is. And terrorist attacks continue to be random without focus, and unpredictable except in their randomness.  There were considerable benefits from the Nuremberg Trials, and it would have been similar if Osama had been tried. - A missed opportunity?

    • Ironside says:

      10:38am | 28/05/11

      Actorel, high security prisons are not actually very defensible at all, they are designed to keep people in, not out. It is astoundingly easy for a group of determined men with access to weapons and explosives to break into a prison, in order to facilitate an escape, the reason it doesnt tend to happen is because the actual break out isnt the hard part its the escape from that point. Brendon Abbott not withstanding most criminals are recaught within a few days at most, they then have extensive additions to their sentance length, not really worth the risk for most.

    • St. Michael says:

      12:21pm | 28/05/11

      You don’t have to attempt to free OBL by armed assault, acotrel.  Indeed Al-Qaeda would never have the manpower or the materiel to do that. 

      But then, they wouldn’t have to.

      A couple of aircraft passenger loads of hostages under their guns would potentially do it for them if the price of their freedom is Osama’s release.  Or blowing up a few buildings in the country that’s holding him.

      I’d say OBL’s warped ideology is already known to the world, since it’s already on youtube.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      12:24pm | 28/05/11

      hardly, nazism was a spent force by the time the trials started. AQ would have take a few hundred children hostage and then what do you do?

    • K Brown says:

      08:02pm | 29/05/11

      And how many civilian hostages would you have been prepared to see held by al-Queda and its affiliates or beheaded on al-Jazeera for your this high and mighty principle?

    • Paulb says:

      09:11am | 28/05/11

      The most dishonest, intellectually bankrupt chunk of media disinfo I’ve yet seen on a site that rates pretty high on the disinfo scale already.  Nice job of laying out the paradigm within which we are all to place our beliefs Thom.  Worth every cent they pay you.

    • Seano says:

      10:19am | 28/05/11

      This is a pet hate of mine that happens all the time on this site.

      Look disagree with the bloke and lay out your reasons why. You don’t even have to back up what you say that heavily, it’s an opinion site after all.

      But calling names and storming off in a huff hasn’t convinced me that what I just read was anything other than a well written, thoughtful and interesting analysis of the situation.

    • TChong says:

      10:47am | 28/05/11

      Young Thom seems to be a very proud member of all things US, Israel , and their vested interests in Australia.
      Political neutral he aint, but someone who is paid to sell a message -
      we will only have the neo cons acceptable version of peace, as long as we allow the US and its puppets to go about their business, unrestrained, and only polite questions asked.

    • Ben81 says:

      04:07pm | 28/05/11

      He’s just another turd who has been flushed Paul.  If you want to read opinion pieces about how the great satan illegally murdered a naughty boy go to the ABC.

    • Seano says:

      04:25pm | 28/05/11

      I’m not saying he’s neutral TChong, and I’d be the last person to defend a neocon. I just think someone who wants to shoot down his analysis should do better than screaming “dishonest, intellectually bankrupt chunk of media disinfo” before disappearing in a huff.

      It may well be “dishonest, intellectually bankrupt chunk of media disinfo” (although that seems a bit extreme from what I read) but why is it that?

    • Sony B Goode says:

      07:28pm | 28/05/11

      Seano, please don’t ask people to think beyond superficial they may realise all things socialist are counterproductive.

    • Seano says:

      10:54pm | 28/05/11

      @Sony

      “Seano, please don’t ask people to think beyond superficial they may realise all things socialist are counterproductive.”

      I’m impressed that were able to both criticise and display superficial thinking in one sentence.

    • Reg Whiteman says:

      09:11am | 28/05/11

      Killing Bin Laden was the best thing the Americans have done since they dropped the A-bombs on Japan in 1945.

      Despite a number of commentators predicting an outbreak of retaliative attacks in the west, there haven’t been any. Rather, the only reprisals have taken place in Pakistan. One can draw a number of conclusions from this lack of activity:

      1.  that Al Quaeda doesn’t have enough adherents in the west to do anything and are, now, a spent force capable only of killing other Muslim civilians; or
      2. that the beefed up security in the advanced world has worked and worked well; or
      3. the pupeteers of Islamic fanaticism have got the message that, even if it does take 10 years, they will get a free ticket to paradise a la OBL and Saddam Hussein and Chemical Ali et al and they have simply chickened out to save their own hides.

      I think #3 is the more likely. There is a recurrent theme throughout history where those who urge others to kill and die for whatever crazy ideology are themselves very unwilling to die for their own cause. One need only think of Saddam Hussein hiding in a hole in the ground like the cowardly rat he was; or Mussolini masquerading as a wounded German to escape Italy; or Hitler swallowing cyanide and then having his adjutant put a bullet through his head. None of them had the strength of their own convictions to take up arms and lead one last futile and suicidal charge - as they had ordered so many of their followers to do. They were all gutless cowards.

      The other great lesson to would-be martyrs and all others in the “Islamic World” is that fact that, despite all those prayers, Allah did not step in and stop the American bullets. Neither OBL nor Saddam nor any of their henchmen have ascended into heaven to escape the infidel. It would also seem that God failed to make his devout followers impervious to the pain of a bit of water-boarding and, hopefully, an decent electrical discharge through the gonads.

      Maybe these developments have a lot to do with the uprisings across the middle east. Maybe the power of the Muftis and Imams is starting to crumble and people are starting to realise that every word preached in the mosques is utter bullshit.

      I am very pleased that OBL is dead and I’ll be even more pleased when every last one of the Al Quaeda terrorists is hunted down and shot like the mongrel dogs they are.

    • AAAdam says:

      10:40am | 28/05/11

      Well said Reg. I agree with totally. Nothing was more annoying than listening to lefties scream that every terrorist we kill, 10 more will rise up in their place. What rubbish; they have limited resources and the death of their leaders and followers does nothing for their recruitment activities.

      It was also good to see OBL hunted down and shot like a dog. Sure, some people will bleat that he should have gotten a trial, but these are the same people that would have claimed his trial wasn’t fair even if he had received one. Furthermore, if a trial is supposed to just be a mechanism of delivering justice, what’s it matter if the government skipped the trial part and got straight to the justice? The end result is still the same. Or can people not recognise justice unless a trial judge tells them what it is? The way I see it, we just skipped the self serving wankers (lawyers and judges) and got to the justice part because the delivery of this justice was too important to put in their grubby little hands, especially given their track record for (not) delivering justice and letting people off on a technicality.

    • TChong says:

      10:58am | 28/05/11

      Reg,  # 3- just remind us, how many tours of the ‘Nam GW, Rumsfeld , Cheney did.
      Yet they had no trouble sending others to their deaths, and ordering death rained down upon others.
      But, I guess that makes your description of “cowardly rats"quite apt, and universal to all leaders , including Obama , Gillard,Howard, Cameron Sarkosy Gaddaffi , the next AlQueda leader etc who are currently ordering others to their (potential) death.

    • mikk says:

      10:06am | 28/05/11

      So what you are saying is that America has decided to reintroduce the concept of the outlaw. Someone who is so evil/dangerous that the law does not apply to them. Osama bin laden was outside the law and anyone killing (what about torturing?) him is immune from any sanction since no law applies to outlaws.
      Who else do they consider “outlaws”?
      Who gets to decide?
      Can any country declare their enemies “outlaws”?

      Im not sure this is such a good idea.

    • Ironside says:

      10:39am | 28/05/11

      you have no idea what an outlaw is do you?

    • St. Michael says:

      12:17pm | 28/05/11

      Then I guess you don’t like the Geneva Convention.

      Insofar as the Geneva Convention is concerned Osama was what the Convention calls an unlawful combatant - one who does not wear a military uniform and engages in armed attacks on uniformed armed forces.  Such individuals are not subject to the Convention’s protections.  The Convention indicates you aren’t to shoot a civilian or someone who has surrendered, but Osama was neither.  He had posted videos stating plainly that he would not be taken alive by US armed forces and that he had declared war on the United States.  He was not a conventional criminal subject to trial.  Under those terms the US was entitled to take him out.

    • Simon says:

      10:10am | 28/05/11

      the world would be a better place if foreign policy was black and white.

    • John says:

      10:50am | 28/05/11

      I have more faith that Santa Claus gives the west presents then Osama Bin Laden gives the West terror. I believe more in the existence of Santa Claus then that of Al-Qaeda. Seriously why don’t you guy just give up, and stop with all your lies! We the people are not buying into your bullshit.
      We are not dumb animals like you seem to think.

    • Jeff Koons says:

      06:54pm | 28/05/11

      please move to pakistan

    • Daniel says:

      04:31am | 29/05/11

      @John what is your real name?

    • Max Redlands says:

      01:55pm | 28/05/11

      @John

      Dude!! like John the Revelator you’re working some wild and crazy riffs there.

      We the People - (Wow!!) - Santa Clause - OBL - dumb animals - man, you’ve got it all going on and with such a ferocious energy to boot.

      Love your work.

    • bananabender says:

      07:09pm | 28/05/11

      The whole story is totally bogus from beginning to end. Basically it was nothing but a very amateurish psy-op completely swallowed by a gullible press and public.

      For start the photo shown in the story is a totally unrelated file shot. The operation wasn’t watched live by the POTUS or Hilary Clinton.

      Why wasn’t there one person in dirt poor and totally corrupt Pakistan willing to sell out Osama for US$10 million?  Probably because he died in late 2001 according to US Secretary of State Madeline Albright.

      No filming inside the compound? Probably because they were shooting some minor criminals rather than OBL.

      No body. See above.

      What has it achieved?
      - Hilary Clinton has just been forced to go groveling to Pakistan to beg forgiveness for invading their sovereign territory.
      - Pakistan is now best mates with China. They just had a joint air power exercise.

    • Daniel says:

      04:33am | 29/05/11

      WTF!?

    • Macon Paine says:

      11:46am | 29/05/11

      Daniel says:04:33am | 29/05/11

      WTF!?

      This ^

      @Bananabender

      You’ve been bending too many bananas buddy.

    • bananabender says:

      01:39pm | 29/05/11

      The following have previously stated that Osama probably died in late 2001.

      Madeline Albright - US Secretary of State
      Pervez Musharef- former President of Pakistan
      Benizir Bhutto - former Pakistani opposition leader
      Hamid Karzai - President of Afghanistan
      Dale Watson - FBI Head Of Counter-Terrorism
      Iranian Intelligence
      Israeli Intelligence
      Are they all lying? I don’t think so.

      The raid exactly coincided with the release of absolutely appalling economic and unemployment data and the very belated release of Obama’s badly photoshopped birth certificate.

    • Septimus says:

      04:21pm | 29/05/11

      Hi Tinfoil John!

      You can change the name, but not the alfoil.

    • wakeuppls says:

      12:07pm | 30/05/11

      I find it amusing that the moderators let Septimus blatantly troll someone without actually arguing a point. How about you rebut the argument, or can’t you?

    • The Vivid Writer says:

      07:16pm | 28/05/11

      @

      “6. Should the White House have released a photo of Bin Laden? No.
      This was a no-brainer for the President; there was quite simply no need. “

      Let the Global population decide that.

    • Daniel says:

      04:40am | 29/05/11

      What would releasing the photo/video acheive?
      Answer nothing… Nothing at all, those who don’t believe he is dead won’t be convinced and those who do don’t need to see it.
      Why do you want to see it? Do you like seeing photos if people who have been shot in the head?.... Sicko.

    • The Vivid Writer says:

      01:38pm | 29/05/11

      “Why do you want to see it?”
      Evidence.

      “What would releasing the photo/video acheive?
      Answer nothing… Nothing at all, those who don’t believe he is dead won’t be convinced and those who do don’t need to see it.”
      Let the World be the judge of that.

    • K Brown says:

      09:13pm | 29/05/11

      Releasing photos of OBL will never open the closed minds of conspiracy theorists who believe OBL has been dead since 2001 or claim OBL’s killing is a US lie.  They have discredited past post 2001 OBL photos even though they have been photometricly verified.  Conspiracy nutcases still discount video of Apollo 11 astronauts walking in the moon’s lack of gravity and today we have Photoshop!

      The release of the photos would have been in bad taste.  It would not only have been ghoulish and triumphalist but there was also a good case that it would encourage reprisals against US Forces.  Any responsible person who was Commander-in-Chief would have taken the same decision as Barack Obama.

    • The Vivid Writer says:

      01:12am | 31/05/11

      Let The World Be The Judge Of That.. wink

    • Marilyn Shepherd says:

      01:19am | 29/05/11

      Well they managed to catch the very much more dangerous Mladic without a shot fired didn’t they?  Honest to goodness those who support extra judicial murder have zero moral compass.

      I wonder ho those slaughtered in the revenge attacks families feel though?

      It’s amazing - hundreds of thousands of dead Afghans, kill squads all over the country committing wholesale slaughter, over 1 million dead Iraqis, two countries utterly destroyed, 5-8 million refugees, millions of orphans and millions of widows and all to get one man.

    • Septimus says:

      09:12am | 29/05/11

      Put me down for ‘zero moral compass’ and happy about it.

      It isn’t about one man, it’s about taking out a terrorist organisation that kills innocent people.  You don’t think Saddam and the Taliban killed thousands of innocent people in their own country as well as abroad?

    • John says:

      10:59am | 29/05/11

      It’s a world of hypocrites! War criminals calling others war criminals, Terrorists calling others terrorists. I just wonder how much longer this immoral travesty can go on. Demon’s calling others demons! We should of left the Catholic church be the leader of the Western world, it would of done a better job. I can’t see the pope making up lies and invading country’s on the basis of oil, predicated mass killings and lies, The way i see it, the west currently holds the moral low ground for their wars in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya. Its sanctions, which is also a form of terrorism, mass killings and starvation. The west has allowed it’s self be taken over by bankers who have their own interests, you have media cooperation’s in bed with the bankers and then you have their puppets, the western politicians who just bend over. Create Lies and live by the lie, terrorism, theft, trillions spend on bogus wars and bogus enemys all for bankers and their interest groups. The US has 14 Trillion dollars in debt! If that is not a sign how corrupt the US is, i don’t know what is. The country has been hijacked by parasitical pirates that are eating out uncle SAM from the inside out. It’s just a matter of time when the body will soon crumble. The spirit will also go into cardiac arrest for all the immorality. GOD help uncle sam!

    • Kieran says:

      11:14am | 29/05/11

      Firstly, while your comparison to Mladic falls flat for practical reasons - Mladic was posing under a pseudonym as a civilian, everyone wants him captured and his capture incurs no danger of ideological backlash - it’s easier for me to just point out the logical inconsistency here. You assume that capturing Mladic is the standard for war criminals and not a special situation. Hopefully that makes you reconsider the fact that these are two completely separate cases. Oh, and if I may be presumptuous here, let me assure you I’m not advocating any absolute rule on extra judicial murder. Platitudes are dangerous when innocent lives depend on it.

      You can not support the capturing theoretically, if your premise is that the war to get him was unjust, but once you accept the inevitability of it (since it’s already happened) then surely killing him was good and moral.

      As for the war itself. Obviously, it’s been botched big-time, although killing OBL was never the biggest motivator (overthrowing the Taliban was at first, and then disabling the more widespread Al Qaeda network after)

      Also, that has all been mentioned in this article. Did you even read it?

    • marley says:

      12:53pm | 29/05/11

      @Marilyn - Mladic was no longer a combatant by anyone’s definition.  Bin Laden was.  That makes not only a moral but a legal difference.

    • K Brown says:

      09:32pm | 29/05/11

      If Mladic had still been actively engaged in directing paramiltary operations killing muslim civilian men and boys in Bosnia while being protected by Serbian authorities would it then have been immoral for the Bosnian Armed Forces to kill him in a tactical military operation in Serbia?  Where is your moral compass now pointing?

    • Harquebus says:

      11:27am | 29/05/11

      Only when we fight religion will we have any chance of peace. The U.S. has become the world’s vigilante and demonstrates just how far we have fallen.
      How many kiddies has B.O. killed with his drones?

    • marley says:

      12:51pm | 29/05/11

      Okay - so your method to achieve peace involves fighting.  Great.

    • Harquebus says:

      10:32am | 30/05/11

      Not with guns stupid.

    • K Brown says:

      10:18pm | 29/05/11

      It definitely is “time we had an informed debate about Bin Laden”, particularly when your argument contains the non-sequitur; was it legal “yes”; was it justice “no”.  OBL was the leader/commander of a paramilitary terrorist organisation that had declared war on and was engaged in ongoing hostilities with the US.  He was therefore deemed to be an “unlawful enemy combatant” under international law and a legal military target for US Forces.  He was killed in a tactical military assault no different to those conducted by our own Special Forces in Afghanistan. 

      When OBL was killed his status under internatrional law was no different to what it was in 2001 when he was in Afghanistan.  Had Seal Team 6 killed OBL in an assault on a compound in Tora Bora in 2001 would his death have been an injustice?  Because he had crossed a 19th century British colonial international border that is to this day disputed between Afghanistan and Pakistan, did or should this alter his status in terms of international law or natural justice?

 

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Protecting the Barrier Reef is the Fin end of the wedge

Protecting the Barrier Reef is the Fin end of the wedge

When you take on a job like being Environment Minister there’s some hits you can see coming. …

ICB: Is white bread the worst thing since sliced bread?

ICB: Is white bread the worst thing since sliced bread?

Welcome to this week’s I Call Bullshit column. It’s a regular column that looks at skulduggery…

Sometimes, you’ve just got to stick it to the bloody ref

Sometimes, you’ve just got to stick it to the bloody ref

We are taught early in life that we should not question authority. We must listen to our parents, our…

Nosebleed Section

choice ringside rantings

From: They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

Michael S says:

"A teacher at Geelong Grammar had criticised her for using words that were too long, which had left her confused and had made her doubt her ability to write essays. She became ''quite distressed'' when her English marks began to fall." I can sympathise. My scholastic mentors conveyed to me a causal relationship… [read more]

From: Welfare for breeders is a bonus for everyone

Change Up! says:

I have no problem paying my taxes. As a single, childless person on a very decent income, I can afford it and not have my life severely altered. Plus I understand that my taxes paying for things like schools, childcare and infrastructure is ultimately a good thing. A better community is better for me… [read more]

Gentle jabs to the ribs

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

They must pay for one’s bitter disappointments

A private school girl’s family is sueing her elite, extremely expensive private school for not… Read more

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