The Paydirt 2011 Uranium Conference was held at the Adelaide Hilton on Monday and Tuesday. Bad timing.

A worker at Beverley Uranium Mine in South Australia. Picture: Supplied

The image of uranium industry executives sipping cocktails at the Hilton as the Fukushima crisis entered its second week could hardly win the public’s hearts and minds.

Likewise, Paladin CEO John Borshoff’s description of the Fukushima crisis as a “sideshow” will do nothing to quell public concern.

Efforts to cool the nuclear reactor cores have met with mixed success; there have been deliberate and uncontrolled radiation releases and several explosions; 200,000 people were evacuated and the exclusion zone was repeatedly widened; a fire led to spent nuclear fuel releasing radiation directly to the environment; radiation monitors detected alarming jumps near the reactors and low levels of radiation have been detected in Tokyo and beyond; and food restrictions are being implemented because of radioactive contamination.

Some sideshow.

Nor will the public be reassured by the claim of Michael Angwin from the Australian Uranium Association that: “The rest of Japan’s nuclear fleet is safe and of course the global nuclear fleet is safe”.

Mr Angwin’s statement would have carried more weight if it was made before the Fukushima crisis began. Before Fukushima, the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission said: 

All nuclear power plants are built to withstand environmental hazards, including earthquakes. Even those plants that are located outside of areas with extensive seismic activity are designed for safety in the event of such a natural disaster.

But is Australia in any way culpable? The uranium mining companies refuse to say whether or not they supply the scandal-plagued nuclear corporation TEPCO, operator of the stricken plant at Fukushima.

However, it is known that Australia exports large volumes of uranium to Japan − nearly 2500 tonnes in 2008 − and TEPCO is certainly one of the customers. One suspects that if any of the three companies operating uranium mines in Australia was not a supplier to TEPCO, they would be shouting that fact from the rooftops.

The uranium industry angrily rejects any suggestion of culpability. According to a March 18 statement from the Australian Uranium Association, the Australian uranium industry “has led the global nuclear industry’s efforts to create a framework of stewardship for the safe and responsible management of uranium throughout the nuclear fuel cycle”.

But ‘efforts to create a framework for stewardship’ is managerial jargon shrouding the inaction of the industry.

To its great shame, the Australian uranium industry sat on its hands and did nothing even as it was revealed that TEPCO had systematically and routinely falsified safety data and breached safety regulations for decades, even as a 2007 report detailed 97 incidents of ‘malpractice’ at Japan’s nuclear power plants, and even as the ability of Japan’s nuclear plants to withstand earthquakes came under criticism from industry insiders.

A big part of the spin surrounding the Fukushima crisis is the claim − or the unstated, implicit assumption − that low level radiation exposures are ‘safe’ or ‘harmless’. However there is no safe level of radiation − the risk of fatal cancer is proportional to the dose, even at the lowest levels of exposure.

The Committee on the Biological Effects of Ionising Radiation of the US National Academy of Sciences comprehensively studied the issue and concluded that “the risk of cancer proceeds in a linear fashion at lower doses without a threshold and ... the smallest dose has the potential to cause a small increase in risk to humans.”

Instead of taking their responsibilities seriously, Australia’s uranium mining companies - as Toro Energy, Uranium One and Heathgate Resources - have been sponsoring visits to Australia by fringe scientists who claim that low level radiation exposure is not only harmless but actually good for you.

If they truly believe that, then let’s see the industry executives and the fringe scientists have a play-fight with yellowcake uranium powder.

For the uranium mining companies to promote such marginal views is self-serving and irresponsible and it may be time for governments to step in to provide that balance.

To estimate the death toll from Fukushima, it will be necessary to estimate the total human radiation exposure as a result of the accidents. The standard risk estimate for low level radiation can then be applied.

It is far too early to be attempting those calculations for Fukushima, but we can apply the logic to Chernobyl. Total radiation exposure from Chernobyl was 600,000 Sieverts according to the International Atomic Energy Agency and thus an estimated 24,000 people will die, nearly all of them because of cancers induced by low level radiation exposure.

Dr Peter Karamoskos is a Nuclear Radiologist, a member of the Medical Association for Prevention of War, and public representative on the Radiation Health Committee of the Australian Radiation Protection and Nuclear Safety Agency. Dr. Jim Green is the national nuclear campaigner with Friends of the Earth, Australia.

149 comments

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    • Alistair says:

      05:30am | 25/03/11

      Interesting. So in regards to the statement “there is no safe level of radiation ? the risk of fatal cancer is proportional to the dose, even at the lowest levels of exposure.”, would you then advocate not having any CT scans[1]? I hope it is not necessary to list all the other sources of radiation a typical person is exposed to in the normal course of their life. Scaremongering is a cheap trick.

      [1] http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1194947420292

    • 7WC says:

      09:09am | 25/03/11

      I don’t believe giving scaremongers any more attention, but it’s important to nip this fear in the bud.

      Have another infographic courtesy of xkcd, a bit easier to read:
      http://xkcd.com/radiation/

    • undertow says:

      09:12am | 25/03/11

      Lucky you are a qualified nuclear radiologist so you can debunk his argument systematically right?

    • alistair says:

      11:35am | 25/03/11

      @undertow

      I’m happy to talk about my scientific qualifications, but it is kind of beside the point. The point I was making is that saying no level of radiation is safe is misleading. While 0 would be nice, it is not possible, you can’t avoid radiation. We are all exposed to it. You are right now. You don’t need to be a radiologist to understand that.

      Explain what I’m missing, I think that would be more interesting that me listing my qualifications.

      Al

    • LeftRightOut says:

      11:46am | 25/03/11

      Don’t catch a plane either, you’ll be exposed to more radiation that currently detected around the Fukushima reactor(s).

      For my mind, for these reactors to withstand an 8.9 magnitude quake, and a 14 meter tsunami and still not kill anyone (2 guys were apparently sent to hospital yesterday with high doses of radiation?) it seems pretty safe to me.
      This focus from [leftist] media on radiation risk and desperately trying to link this with Chernobyl - along with (as in this article) overstating my massive amounts the actual effects of Chernobyl (24,000 deaths? try ~55 for the REAL figure) is the real sham here. I’m happy to not have nuc reactors here in Australia, but you must choose, coal or nuclear… what will it be?

    • mike j says:

      02:27pm | 25/03/11

      Wow, Dr Peter Karamoskos has some impressive qualifications. Can we hear from him next time? Because this unreferenced fluff opinion piece was written by ‘Jim Green’, national nuclear campaigner with Friends of the Earth, Australia. Far less impressive (but significantly funnier) qualification. You’re not lamb, Jim Green. You’re mutton. Less hippies, more science, please, The Punch.

    • mike j says:

      04:46pm | 25/03/11

      I’m sure that link is very interesting, Adam. But ‘just in case you missed it’, no-one said radiation is like Vitamin C. If everyone was all “Hey! Let’s build some radiation!”, I’d be against it. This is a debate about nuclear power, and to be against it because radiation is dangerous is as stupid as saying you shouldn’t watch TV because electricity can kill you.

    • Brian says:

      08:27pm | 25/03/11

      Deaths due to nuclear power since Chernobyl, including Chernobyl, according to the highest regularly used estimate? Around 30,000. Deaths in coal mining in China (primarily used for power) alone - 3,000 per year, officially, and considered to be several times that number in reality.

      In all likelihood, nuclear power over the entire course of its history has probably only killed about as many people as coal power did in China in 2010. Excluding Chernobyl, it has probably killed fewer people than bread-making in the same period - flour explosions at silos kill a handful of people each year, but nuclear power generally doesn’t.

    • acotrel says:

      09:07am | 27/03/11

      Looks like we’ve got a few volunteers for the clean-up at Fukushima?

    • TimB says:

      05:44am | 25/03/11

      What a complete load.

      Here’s just a few of the points:

      “Efforts to cool the nuclear reactor cores have met with mixed success”

      Mixed? Considering we still haven’t had the meltdown that every alarmist was predicting I think they were pretty successful. As I understand power has been restored and they’re bringing everything back under control.

      And now hysterical allegations:

      “But is Australia in any way culpable?....”
      “One suspects that if any of the three companies operating uranium mines in Australia was not a supplier to TEPCO ,they would be shouting that fact from the rooftops”

      Oh please. Why not argue that lead mines are culpable for the shootings that happen around the world daily? I mean they’re not jumping up and down to say they didn’t supply lead used in bullets so that means they’re guilty guilty guilty!

      At whjat point does responsibilty fall on the people involved? Argue about people being derelict in their responsibility to maintain the plants themseleves if you must. You might have a point there. But the most blame goes to the disater that triggered the event. And even then we still avoided the predicted major catastrophe.
      Trying to demonise the Australian unranium mining industry is ridiculous.

      And finally this:

      “However there is no safe level of radiation ? the risk of fatal cancer is proportional to the dose, even at the lowest levels of exposure.”

      Oops. Better not get an X-Ray again. Or go outside in the sun. Or you know, *live*. Do you understand what background radiation is? Because you’re getting a dose every day. Shock. How about you mention all the lives radiation has saved with its various usages in medicine? Doesn’t exactly fit into your nuclear boogeyman narrative though does it?

      What a shameless scaremongering, terrible excuse for an article.

    • Brenda says:

      10:45am | 25/03/11

      OMG
      Those alarmists are warning people in Tokyo not to give their children tap water. I wonder how you translate be alert not alarmed into Japanese?

    • Adam says:

      11:49am | 25/03/11

      Maybe consider that all human-caused sources of radiation are ADDITIONAL to natural background doses, and their effects CUMULATIVE. Or do you always dismiss professional medical advice?

    • Kiyoko says:

      11:54am | 25/03/11

      Perhaps you have heard of the if it’s brown, flush it down,
      If it’s yellow, let it mellow.
      Maybe those in Tokyo could adopt
      If it glows, let it goes.

    • Knemon says:

      12:42pm | 25/03/11

      TimB - I totally agree with your points but Paladin CEO John Borshoff’s should not have described Fukushima crisis as a “sideshow” - bad choice of words.

      How would you feel if you lived near a reactor (in Australia) with similar problems to Fukushima and Julia Gillard came out and said don’t worry, it’s only a sideshow, everything is OK? I certainly would not feel over comfortable myself. So I do feel for the people living close by, those living their have every right to be concerned, whether mislead or not. I wouldn’t call it scaremongering but more an over reaction perhaps.

    • deb says:

      06:17am | 25/03/11

      We dont want Nuclear Power! We dont need nuclear power.We have Solar,we have Wind Power.
      Very soon most oldies and pensioners will need extra blankets and coats anyway because the Power companies are forcing them to freeze this winter.
      So who is the Nuclear going to benefit anyway?

    • watty says:

      08:52am | 25/03/11

      Redirect your question to 65,000,000 French people.

    • L. says:

      09:12am | 25/03/11

      “We dont want Nuclear Power! We dont need nuclear power.We have Solar,we have Wind Power.”

      So Deb, what does industry do on cloudy, windless days?

      “So who is the Nuclear going to benefit anyway? :

      You’re kidding right..?? It will benefit everybody and every industry.

      To paraphrase Homer Simpson “mmmmm…power security” <insert image of drool>.

    • Likes Joining Dots says:

      09:36am | 25/03/11

      Watty, you forgot to add Italy, the Netherlands, Belgium, Britain, and Germany who receive 18% of the electricity generated in French nuclear power plants.

    • Wellborne says:

      10:31am | 25/03/11

      Riiigghht.  So despite nuclear power being cleaner and cheaper, it’s not going to benefit everyone.

      It is very difficult to transmit wind generated power into the national electricity grid due to the high levels of variance in energy production.  As to solar power, have you seen how bloody big the solar panels are on homes?  And that is just to power one piddly little house.  How on earth are you going to industrialise the production of solar power?  I’m in a 25 storey office building, how would solar power, power the whole building?  We’d have to have solar panels covering the span of a footy field just to work the lifts!

    • Gregg says:

      12:43pm | 25/03/11

      @Wellhorne,
      There’s a niche market there for you just waiting to happen - east, west and north facing walls all constructed of solar panels and all on an angle.
      That will provide for natural rain cleaning and also create an updraft for wind turbines and building ventilation.
      Those at windows could be set out so as natural light will not be fully blocked.

      Of course we should have non shading good spacing between high rises and that may engender further societal thinking about what good are CBDs and if they were totally decentralised perhaps we would be using far less energy and causing far less pollution by having them closer to where people live, maybe even close enough for people to cycle or walk.

      Really, when you give it some thought, it seems we have generational or decadal mobs od societal sheep, no wonder we are generating into decadence and decay.

    • acotrel says:

      06:57am | 25/03/11

      She’ll be right mate, if it ain’t broke don’t fix it!  Don’t you worry about that, now!
      The trouble with trhe nuclear debate is that very few people have formal education in chemistry, nuclear physics or health physics.  It is conducted amongst the relatively uninformed with opinions based on optimistic speculation.  The discussion comes down to a yes/no political debate. Starting a nuclear power industry in Australia will involve a major change in culture, mindset - a complete paradigm shift! - Let the debate continue.

    • JulesG says:

      10:54am | 25/03/11

      alcotrel: I couldn’t agree more. This discussion requires some knowledge of the subject matter that goes beyond the merely hopeful and the focus of some environmental wish list.

      The facts are that nuclear fission is neither cheap nor clean. An accident that is a 1 in 10000 year event will have such dire consequences that we would not even be able to comprehend and for that reason alone, nuclear fission is a folly beyond imagining.  The residual radiation and damage to the environment and food chain would last over 200,000 years!

      What right do we have to condemn the next 1000 generations to the management of highly toxic nuclear waste? How can we guarantee its safe storage? 200,000 years will see apocalyptic events come and go such as ice ages, catastrophic climate change and asteroid impact; even the demise of our species. In the light of these realities we can’t guarantee a thing.

      We have the power to stop this lunacy before it gets beyond our control and we owe it to future generations not to go down the nuclear fission path.

      Nuclear fission is just not an option. Fusion maybe but definitely not fission it’s just too dangerous.  What about the 100’s of megawatts that can be generated by wave power in a gentle swell around our 20000 km coastline?

    • L. says:

      11:40am | 25/03/11

      “What about the 100’s of megawatts that can be generated by wave power in a gentle swell around our 20000 km coastline? “

      Hmm…. we need Gigawatts “on demand”. What do you propose for the shortfall.?? Especially on cloudy, windless days..?

    • thatmosis says:

      07:16am | 25/03/11

      Knew it wouldnt take some Green wanker long to put his or her or its two pennth in. No one has ever said that Nuclear is completely safe as no one has ever said that cars are completely safe. The industry does its best and until wankers find a different way of producing the power required on a sustainable basis they should shut up. Solar or wind is a fantasy for peak load power and the only viable alternatives are nuclear, coal or gas powered stations. I run 100% solar for my house and know its limitations and costs so dont tell me its a viable alternative.

    • Warren says:

      10:28am | 25/03/11

      “they should shut up” - Yeah, curse that freedom of speech nonsense ay thatmosis?

    • Green Goblin says:

      01:04pm | 25/03/11

      @ thatmosis - I get the impression you don’t like your Greens, you should, they’re good for you wink

      Why do many people assume that renewable energy ‘must’ instantly provide for a peak load base? In the interim they all work together, feeding, call it what you want -  and overtime with improved technology in renewable’s, we can slowly reduce our consumption /  reliance on coal and gas…is that really such a bad thing?

    • JulesG says:

      03:49pm | 25/03/11

      thatmosis: Stop being abusive toward your fellow punchers. If we could harness the hot air issuing forth from your mouth we’d be set!

    • L. says:

      07:23am | 25/03/11

      “But is Australia in any way culpable? “

      No.. No we are not. Companies legally mined uranium, and then legally sold that uranium to companies who were authorised to use that uranium. That would be like say is Nokia in any way responsible for it’s phone being used to detonate IED’s in Iraq.

      Get your hand off it…

    • mickey says:

      08:56am | 25/03/11

      Australia should be held culpable for the hogwash FOE Australia has been spraying for decades.

    • watty says:

      07:25am | 25/03/11

      To estimate the death toll from Fukushima.(presumably from high doses of radiation?)

      How unusual for FOE to jump the gun.

    • Sun Spotter says:

      07:28am | 25/03/11

      I’m hapy to have Nuclear Power Plants in Australia as long as the waste can be stored under Parliament House in Canberra.  In fact, let’s make the ACT the Nuclear Capital of the World if uranium is so safe and build the first one in Australia on Lake Burley Griffen.

    • TimB says:

      09:15am | 25/03/11

      Careful .You then run the risk of creating super-powered politicians.

      I know how much the Labor crowd love Tony in his budgie smugglers, so he will be Australia’s answer to Superman. His ability to polarise opinion will manifest itself as some sort of magnetic manipulation ability. Whilst finishing triathalons in the blink of an eye, and destroying Labor polling figures with a single glance, he will block and wreck the plans of evil doers everywhere.

      His arch-nemesis will be the supervillain known as the Green Baron aka Bob Brown. With the help of his sidekick, Ranga Girl (Julia Gillard), he seeks to turn the Earth into a lifeless husk, as he purges the planet of all its nasty polluting carbon. Organisms everywhere will disintergrate as a critical component of their biological structures is removed with the Baron’s signature Taxatron beam.

    • rick says:

      02:27pm | 25/03/11

      The first one would be Lucas Heights although not a power plant it is a nuclear reactor.Do we really want any more mutants in cambera I recon most of the Libs would fall into that class.

    • mickey says:

      07:38am | 25/03/11

      From the World Health Organisation in Geneva

      5 September 2005 | Geneva - A total of up to 4000 people (as compared to your 26,000) could eventually die of radiation exposure from the Chernobyl nuclear power plant (NPP) accident nearly 20 years ago, an international team of more than 100 scientists has concluded

      Chernobyl was a technical tragedy which could have been avoided but it’s interesting to note the Ukranian Government negotiated the funding for two new nuclear power plants before agreeing to a final closure of Chernobyl.

      Haven’t seen any protest or call for closure of the energy of choice of the Ukranian Government?

      Of course the WHO doesn’t have the technical knowledge that abounds in the Friends of the Earth

    • Adam says:

      11:57am | 25/03/11

      Actually, the WHO’s data also doesn’t take into account the fact that most (53%) of the radioactive fallout from the Chernobyl disaster landed on Europe and the UK - not the Ukraine.
      Or maybe consider the WHO’s relationship with the IAEA (who have vested interests in nuclear power)?

    • Wistful says:

      07:47am | 25/03/11

      “Fringe scientists”.  Given that you have no qualifications in nuclear anything - and your PhD was on the History of Lucas Heights - I think you are definitely among the group you deride.  Anti-nuclear campaigning does not qualify you as an expert on nuclear energy.  I’ll take my advice from the qualfied and expert nuclear physicists of the world thanks very much.

    • Chris says:

      08:09am | 25/03/11

      Hey Jim,

      You guys love throwing the ‘rich mining bosses’ drinking cocktails in the Hilton line don’t you.
      How were the Margharitas in Cancun???
      I remember a story that they had to import more hookers into Copenhagen to cope with the workload. Of course none of those ladies would have been victims of human trafficking from Eastern Europe would they. Party on!!!!
      If you want to put forward an arguement that is fine, but don’t start with the class warfare rubbish.

    • Diogenes says:

      05:55pm | 25/03/11

      I remember a story that they had to import more hookers into Copenhagen to cope with the workload….

      And IIRC the 600 limousines that were driven up from Spain, and the empty totally 100% wind powered busses that ran empty whilst there was gridlock of limos

    • Elphaba says:

      08:16am | 25/03/11

      *sigh*

      So radiation causes cancer.  So do a lot of other things.

      What about the radiation released from coal plants?  Should they be held responsible?  A carbon tax sure isn’t ging to, as has been demonstrated several times.  Why must nuclear be constantly hit with the newspaper?

      Should I get rid of my microwave?  My mobile phone?  Should I stop flying?  All of those give me minuscule doses of radiation too.  How about I just wrap myself in cotton wool and never leave my house?  After all, it’s a death trap out there!!

      Oh wait, that’s because I could slip in the shower and crack my head open.  Because LIFE is dangerous.

      There’s a demand for the product.  So long as we sell it ethically, and avoid countries who do want it for weapons capabilities, there should be no reason why we don’t make money off it.  There are plenty of nuclear plants running that have never had any problems.  There have been two large scale situations with coal and oil in the last few years, with many people killed, and still, nuclear is the whipping boy.

      F*cking scaremongering, I’m sick of it.

    • Elphaba says:

      10:20am | 25/03/11

      After looking at the chart provided by @mw, it appears I need to stop eating bananas too.

      Now that’s just crazy talk.

    • mw says:

      11:28am | 25/03/11

      Yeah… if the $12 odd dollars a kilo wasn’t enough to deter you it turns out they’re irradiating your gizzards too…

      You should probably sleep alone too…

    • TimB says:

      11:31am | 25/03/11

      Isn’t. Banana’s are disgusting, and should not be consumed under any circumstances.

      Unlike bacon. Delicious crispy bacon.

    • Elphaba says:

      11:40am | 25/03/11

      @mw, yep, looks like if I want to live a radiation free life, I can’t have any fun.

      Jim Green even looks like Bob Brown in his photo.  I’ll be lucky if I can even keep a banana down…

      TimB, noooo!  Bananas are yummy yummy.  Particularly drenched in maple syrup and eaten as part of PANCAKES! Nom nom nom…

    • mw says:

      12:10pm | 25/03/11

      Didn’t the Elvis toilet sandwich thingy contain peanut butter, banana and bacon?

      I might see if I can track one down for lunch…

    • Elphaba says:

      12:29pm | 25/03/11

      @mw, I don’t know about the bacon, but I did hear that he liked fried peanut butter and banana sandwiches.

      Nigella cooked them once on TV.  Mmmmm… so cardiac arrest-inducing…

    • TimB says:

      12:30pm | 25/03/11

      Elphaba, the Queenslanders have brainwashed you into believing bananas are delicious. Possibly with an secret additive derived from cane toads. You really shouldn’t trust them.

    • Elphaba says:

      01:20pm | 25/03/11

      @TimB, I just bought two from the supermarket to have on the weekend and it was $4.52!

      :-(

      I could have bought 2 kilos of grapes - but I haven’t had bananas in ages and I missed them.  I guess I am an easy mark for pesky brainwashing…

    • Tony of Poorakistan says:

      08:20am | 25/03/11

      No-one is saying radiation is safe. 
       
      It is simply a matter of continually improving the technology to make the use of it even more safe than it is now. 
       
      I’d rather have a nuclear power plant than the multi-billion dollar white elephant desalination plant that the Rann Labor Govt just paid a bunch of Spaniards to build. At least we’d get something useful out of it for our money.

    • Warren says:

      10:33am | 25/03/11

      There is the issue of leaving a legacy of waste for generations to come. Nuclear might look cheap now, but becomes expensive when you have to look after the dam stuff for god knows how long. Maybe that doesn’t matter, it will just be someone else’ problem.

    • Jason Todd says:

      08:59pm | 25/03/11

      Warren, What would you rather - I give you one eastern brown snake in a sealed vivarium or I tell you that I have released ten eastern browns in and around your house? I don’t dispute the fact that nuclear waste can be harmful, but we are able to better manage it than the gasses out output from coal, oil and gas plants. Waste from these plants is released to atmosphere in huge quantities where we still don’t really have a grasp on what damage it is doing and to whom. At least with nuclear waste it can be contained, managed and then securely stored. Plus, one persons energy needs for a lifetime, if supplied by nuclear power equates to about enough nuclear waste to fill a coke can. The waste produced via coal and oil for the same demand is thousands of times this and not contained.

      I know which one I would prefer.

    • Adam says:

      05:25pm | 27/03/11

      Jason (“I don’t dispute the fact that nuclear waste can be harmful, but we are able to better manage it than the gasses out output from coal, oil and gas plants”) - maybe tell us that in 500,000 years, when today’s Pu-239 produced as a result of nuclear reactors will be deemed safe.

      As I said elsewhere, there’s not enough money on earth to cover the overtime of just two security staff to safely guard nuclear wastes for the periods of time required.

    • Jason Todd says:

      08:17pm | 28/03/11

      Adam, you make the assumption there that we won’t find a non-destructive use for it between here and there. If we can be optimistic about discovering the technology to make renewables viable, surely some of that optimism can be extended to finding ways to utilise nuclear waste.

      My point remains that we are pumping the harmful emmissions of power plants out into the atmosphere, doing god knows what damage to god knows who. There is no management of the harm that they are causing. At least with rad waste we can seal it up and store it in a stable location. We may develop a use for it, we may be able to eventually get rid of it, or it may sit there until the end of time, but at least it is contained.

      I’m not saying it’s an ideal solution, but neither is sitting on our hands and pissing about with the nuclear vs coal vs renewables debate. If we delay too long, we are going to be left out in the cold. Nuclear is proven, what is the harm in running a reactor or two to give us the time to better develop renewable tech? Noone is talking about using one at the exclusion of all others.

    • michael j says:

      08:25am | 25/03/11

      Carn’t say i ever heard anyone ever say an overdose of uranium is not harmful to people,most people are saying the accidental release of radiation is offset by better technology,,in a Modern nuclear power plant,,
      Whats wrong with the Australian people consenting to having Uranium mined
      by a company that tells lies about what it is doing to increase profit isn’t that how capitalism works , doesn’t the government give guide lines to work under, are not the government voted in by Australian citizens to do our bidding
      You Mr Green want to scare people with the effects of radiation,then do a story on the( birth defects caused?? )by the Depleted Uranium tipped shells that were used by an unnamed superpower in Iraq,,,,,,

    • PJ says:

      08:28am | 25/03/11

      Nuclear Energy isn’t safe.
      Electricty isn’t safe.
      Coal isn’t safe.
      Fire isn’t safe.

      Just what would you have us use Jim?

    • L. says:

      09:04am | 25/03/11

      Wind turbines are not safes (more deaths than nuke power generators over the past 8 years).
      Cars are not safe
      Mobile phones are not safe
      Packaged foods are not safe
      Porn on the Internet isn’t safe (apparently)
      etc
      etc
      etc…

      I wonder what colour the sky is in Jim Greens risk free world..??

    • Super D says:

      08:28am | 25/03/11

      If you don’t support nuclear energy it means you don’t take climate change seriously.

    • John A Neve says:

      08:57am | 25/03/11

      Super D,

      What a silly comment! I take climate change very seriously, but I don’t support nuclear energy.

      There is far more to climate change than CO2 eg deforestation, chemical pollution, over fishing, the list goes on.

      We could keep burning coal and stil improve our climate by taking a number of other actions.

    • Adam Diver says:

      09:38am | 25/03/11

      No Super D, it means you have a limited IQ, a deliberate hyprocrisy, or Labor/Green media training.

      Exhibit A: John A Neve

    • David C says:

      10:06am | 25/03/11

      John just interested but how does overfishing cause climate change? I agree we should stop over fishing but to control climate change I dont get that one

    • John A Neve says:

      10:40am | 25/03/11

      David C,

      I believe every thing on this planet is effected by every thing else. You delete a species it impact on other species. You denude the ground same thing. No one thing in my book causes climate change, it is a combination.

      Adam Driver,

      I did not realize tou had a “limited IQ”. But I’ll take that into account in future. Friends with A the M and Dovif are you?

    • Adam Diver says:

      11:16am | 25/03/11

      Exhibit B: John’s second response.

      Why stop there john, expand your ideas on what causes climate change, although I think you mean AGW, a slight difference but an important one. And if you have enough mental energy left, feel free to explain a course of action to avoid catastrophic AGW.

    • mw says:

      11:31am | 25/03/11

      “I believe every thing on this planet is effected by every thing else.”

      Sounds like somebody has been watching avatar a little too much…

    • Adam says:

      12:05pm | 25/03/11

      Logical fallacy much? To oppose nuclear is not to endorse coal.
      http://www.theskepticsguide.org/resources/logicalfallacies.aspx

      The solution(s) are: energy efficiency measures (which REDUCES both peak and baseload demand), plus solar thermal, solar PV, biomass, the hugely untapped potential in wave and tidal power, wind, including pico wind, and existing hydro. The rest is pure will.

    • John A Neve says:

      12:06pm | 25/03/11

      MV,

      I take it you do not agree. So please explain why not?

    • Adam says:

      12:07pm | 25/03/11

      By the way, according to International Energy Agency figures 66% of global GHG emissions don’t stem from generating electricity. Something to think about.

    • John A Neve says:

      12:16pm | 25/03/11

      Adam Diver,

      I note you failed to answer my question!  No, not surprised really it’s that “limited IQ’ again.

      Unlike you I will endeavour to explain; climate change, global warming and environmental degradation are all related in my view. But feel free to prove me wrong.
      As to the second part of your post, try expanding your “limited IQ” by
      thinking for yourself.

    • TheRealDave says:

      05:30pm | 25/03/11

      John, of course there is no ‘one thing’ that causes ‘Climate Change’. Because every time the Green alarmists say one thing is causing one problem and its proven to be bollocks they move the goalposts! Its chlorofluorocarbon ! OK, we ban those - still a problem….ok, its ‘Global Warming’.....but its not warming and in some cases its cooler…so lets call it ‘Climate Change’ instead - thats ambiguous enough, so if it gets cooler we can still be in the game.

      How deeps the water over Tivalu by now?

    • John A Neve says:

      09:35am | 27/03/11

      TheRealDave,

      I suppose you mean Tuvalu?  If so I don’t know, not having been there.
      As to the rest of your post. I case you don’t know, we live in a claimed democracy, some people choose to vote Green as is their right.
      All parliamentarians are elected and have a right to be heard. There is little difference between the Greens and Independents supporting Labor or the Nationals supporting the Liberals.

      It will be a very sad day for Australian when the people only have two choices.

    • A Dose of Reality says:

      08:36am | 25/03/11

      Whenever the nuclear energy debate comes up - there’s never any mention of Thorium technology (as opposed to uranium technology). 

      Thorium reactors have to be “forced” for the reaction to happen - therefore any problem simply stops the reactor - safely .  In either of the Chernobyl or current Japanese disasters, a thorium reactor would simply have stopped.

      There is also the possibility that a thorium reactor can be used to “burn off” uranium waste (a secondary, value adding, industry?).

      It needs to be added to the debate - not to “justify or validate” the pro-nuclear case - but rather as an alternative technology so the nuclear debate is not hijacked by vested uranium mining interests.

    • L. says:

      09:59am | 25/03/11

      “Whenever the nuclear energy debate comes up - there’s never any mention of Thorium technology (as opposed to uranium technology).”

      I like to see Mr Green will respond to this…

      Mr Green..?? if you will..??

    • Pie in the sky says:

      12:00pm | 25/03/11

      Where are Thorium reactors generating base-load electricity smarty pants?
      Where exactly?

    • L. says:

      12:17pm | 25/03/11

      “Where are Thorium reactors generating base-load electricity smarty pants?”

      So, because there are no active Thorium power plants in use it can’t be a design alternative?

      I’ll ask the same for Green power.. Where is there any green base load power supplied by anything other than hydro (good luck getting another dam built in this country) or geo-thermal..?

    • Adam says:

      12:27pm | 25/03/11

      Neutron bombardment of thorium (indirectly) produces uranium-233, a fissile material that can be used in nuclear weapons.

      “There is just no way to avoid proliferation problems associated with thorium fuel cycles that involve reprocessing. Thorium fuel cycles without reprocessing would offer the same temptation to reprocess as today’s once-through uranium fuel cycles.” - http://www.nuclearfreeplanet.org/thorium-fuel-no-panacea-for-nuclear-power.html

    • Syl says:

      01:48pm | 25/03/11

      Actually, In every thread about Nuclear Energy Ive read on The Punch Thorium Reactors have been mentioned numerous times, it’s just that none of the anti Nuclear posters have ever actually come up with a reason why Thorium reactors are not feasible, they just ignore it and continue with
      “OMG Nuclear, dirty, Chernobyl… save the children!.”

    • Adam says:

      03:27pm | 25/03/11

      Syl, see my comment above (12/27pm)?

      The nuclear industry was built on the back of the WMD industry -  ie, nuclear power is un-insurable byproduct, kept alive by public subsidies and mining interests alone.

      In the USA, the use of clothes lines in place of electric driers would negate the “need” for an equivalent amount of elec generated by nuclear.

    • Syl says:

      03:47pm | 25/03/11

      Adam

      Using WMDs and scare tactics like “materials that CAN be used for nuclear weapons” are not real reasons against Thorium.  Just because something can be used for something, doesn’t mean it has to be.  It is the equivalent of “OMG Nuclear!”

      If everyone stopped watching television and used candles instead of lights it would negate the “need” for this baseline power too.  But it isn’t going to happen and doesn’t help the debate.  With the world population rising our consumption is only going to go up (especially with so many developing countries).  We have to deal with the rising demand, not beat our heads against a wall trying to tell people to stop using electricity.

    • Adam says:

      07:05pm | 25/03/11

      Actually, Syl, such materials HAVE been tested and used in weapons by the USA, with some experts believing India may have gone this route also.

      By the way, the US-India civil nuclear deal allows India to retain 8 rectors exclusively for military use. How does this happen? Because ALL military nuclear facilities lie outside of the international safeguards regime.

    • Syl says:

      08:47am | 28/03/11

      Adam

      We cant control what USA and India do, so I fail to see what that has to do with Australia adopting Thorium reactors.  If it is regulated properly I can’t see why you think we HAVE to use the leftovers for weapons.

    • Sly says:

      05:02pm | 28/03/11

      Syl
      Tell me again where these Thorium reactors are currently producing baseload energy.
      Then tell me how much they cost to build and how long it takes.

      Sure you don’t want to advocate fruit loop reactor technology? I hear General foods is quite close with this technology.

    • Syl says:

      08:26am | 29/03/11

      Sly

      Tell me where I said they should be used…..
      Tell me where I said they have been providing baseline power….

      I just said that many people have mentioned Thorium reactors and so far I have not seen any compelling arguments against the technology, but plenty of compelling arguments for the technology.

      Im not saying it should be installed tomorrow…  Im saying that it is a technology that show great potential and shouldnt be overlooked because of some pointless fear of the word nuclear.

      Assumptions and putting words in people’s mouths is not a good basis to argue from.

    • Sly says:

      09:02pm | 29/03/11

      Syl
      Let me get this straight, you want Australia to adopt something called Thorium reactors that don’t exist, but someone mentioned?
      You have no idea if the technology works or long it will take to build, but we should adopt it to solve our energy problems.
      OK, with such a sound argument for Thorium reactors, you’ve convinced me, now where do you want to put it?

    • Syl says:

      08:26am | 30/03/11

      Sly

      I would recommend reading comprehension classes.  I stated that it is a technology that shows potential and should not be simply discarded because of the word nuclear.

      I NEVER said it should be blindly installed.

      I really cannot make my point any simpler, maybe if you actually read what I said instead of what you think i said you would understand my position.  It really isn’t that hard to comprehend ffs.

    • Tom says:

      08:44am | 25/03/11

      Yes and nature has murdered at least 22,000 people and in some cases there is no record of them ever having existed.

      Millions of people were freezing and have no power, no homes and no prospect of work or normalcy for years to come.

      So who is nastier; nature with its mammoth earthquake and devastating tsunami or the nuclear industry?

      You ongoing attempts to scare the bejeesus out of people are typical of the green movement - without fear campaigns you have nothing.

      Why don’t you start whinging about nature and cursing it - surely it is more evil and deadly?

    • Adam says:

      03:26pm | 26/03/11

      Tom, to re-phrase you: without a logical argument you have nothing. The topic is nuclear power.
      If there were debate about, say, swimming safety, arguing the case of pedestrian road deaths would seem rather ineffectual. Just as the fact that more people are killed by machetes than by guns doesn’t make it safe for everyone to own a gun. Just as the need to help those who are suffering in Japan doesn’t negate the fact that people are still starving in parts of Africa.
      Too many here seem to have major trouble with the fact the topic here is nuclear power. Thus, any logical debate needs to address… nuclear power.

    • ibast says:

      09:08am | 25/03/11

      “However there is no safe level of radiation”

      Oh Christ!  I’ll have to turn off my compu . . . . . .

    • mw says:

      09:10am | 25/03/11

      Fukishima is a sideshow in comparison to the death and devastation of the earthquake and predominantly the tsunami. 

      We are constantly exposed to radiation and claiming that any exposure is going to detriment our health is just plain wrong.

      As for your idea that the uranium industry should have reacted to TEPCO in some way, I think you’ll find there are regulatory bodies for that and the real question is why did those regulatory bodies not act more decisively?

      Thank you for further adding to the misinformation…

      If anyone is interested in getting some perspective on radiation exposure and the actual risks I recommend having a look at this excellent chart: http://xkcd.com/radiation/

    • mw says:

      01:29pm | 25/03/11

      I never claimed any exposure was not additional to natural background radiation?

      You’re a banana industry spy aren’t you?

    • Manic Street Preacher says:

      09:25am | 25/03/11

      A nuclear society…
      consider it a model, rather than a power source.

      Availing oneself to possibility rather than probability requires faith.

      1986… nuclear melt down, US belt up Libya
      2011… nuclear melt down, US belt up Libya
      Happy 25yr anniversary
      China Syndrome and australian rhyming slang…
      all we need now is Godzilla to appear and people may start considering the SIM-city aspects of this reality…
      OH… thankyou BRIDGESTONE (Giant Gecko Ad 2011)
      whose Select Franchises coincidentally were established in 1986.
      who would have figured?

      Oh yeah of little faithless

    • Crowsister says:

      09:50am | 25/03/11

      I grew up on a Uranium Mine.  My sister and I played with a Geiger Counter on the piles of Pitchblende near the Mill, looking for the ‘noisiest’ pieces.  She remember large chunks of Pitchblende on the veranda, kept there to show visitors how radio-active they were - so the lumps that would really send the Geiger ticking off the dial were deliberately put there from the mine for the ‘show’ purpose. 

      We both have a number of health issues which she feels are down to living for 7 years when we were very young, in close proximity to this radiation.

      As far as I remember, the U3O8 (can’t get the numbers to sit down where they should be here) Uranium Oxide (mustard powder - yellow cake came in from the American visitors -) did not cause any reading from the Geiger Counters.  The raw ore did, but not when processed - am I wrong in my memories about that?  Anyone know?

      Who do we ask for help, for financial aid?  Who is responsible?  Our parents are dead.  The mining company has disappeared and reformed and reformed many times under different names though I do believe that some of the people who ‘owned or ran’ it are still alive and very wealthy…

    • JT says:

      10:27am | 25/03/11

      ‘‘Who do we ask for help, for financial aid?  Who is responsible?  Our parents are dead.’‘

      Why should you get financial aid? And you answered your own question, your parents were responsible.

    • neil says:

      10:01am | 25/03/11

      20,000 dead from earthquake and tsunami, zero harmed from power plant. Tens of $billions in damage earthquake and tsunami, zero $ from this very minor nuclear issue.

      just another pair fear mongering oxygen thiefs.

    • Ben81 says:

      10:33am | 25/03/11

      I don’t need the nuclear industry to tell me it’s safe Jim, I just need to look at the facts.  The nuclear power indusry harms and kills much less people than pretty much every other power generation industry (and most in the non power generation business).
      Coal plants release more radiation through their normal operation and kill many more people than a nuclear plant does even after a major quake and tsunami, end of story.

      If you’re genuinely concerned about the environment and peoples health, why are you making it a mission to attack of all things the industry that poses the least threat to them?

    • Adam says:

      03:43pm | 25/03/11

      Well the facts are that the nuclear power industry exists as a byproduct of the weapons industry - with complicit links still true to this day, and with 23,000 nukes, thousands on 24/7 hair-trigger alert, threatening everything we have. Combine this with the legacy of the yet to be solved issue of wastes (from mining tailings to spent fuel) and it’s more than reason enough, I’d say.

      There’s not even enough money on earth to cover the overtime costs of just two security staff to guard nuclear wastes for the periods of time required.

    • Ben81 says:

      04:13pm | 25/03/11

      The cat is well and truly out of the bag when it comes to nuclear weapons Adam, countries aren’t relying on civil nuclear power to keep their weapon stockpiles supplied, and the only real threat from nuclear waste if the wrong person gets their hands on it is psychological, due to the fearmongering surrounding it.

    • Adam says:

      07:23pm | 25/03/11

      Ben81 “the only real threat from nuclear waste if the wrong person gets their hands on it is psychological”. How so?
      Many nuclear experts, including Prof. Frank Barnaby, are simply amazed there hasn’t yet been a radioactive dirty bomb detonated in a major populated city.

    • Adam says:

      07:42pm | 25/03/11

      Ben81 “countries aren’t relying on civil nuclear power to keep their weapon stockpiles supplied,” this flies in the face of the (safeguards immune) military nuclear facilities which enable diversion of domestic uranium deserves for military use as a result of imports. Consider:

      “Any country has the right to master these (nuclear) operations for civilian uses. But in doing so, it also masters the most difficult steps in making a nuclear bomb.” - Head of the International Atomic Energy Agency, Mohamed ElBaradei, in his speech accepting the Nobel peace prize.

      “It is clear that no international safeguards system can physically prevent diversion or the setting up of an undeclared or clandestine nuclear (weapons) program.” - IAEA, 1993.

      “US critics charged that the pact erodes efforts to contain the spread of nuclear know-how, noting that it leaves India’s military nuclear plants outside the safeguards and inspections regime that will cover its civilian plants.” (‘Bush signs controversial nuke deal with India’, SMH, 19 Dec 2006).

      “As China ramps up it’s power capacity it is aiming to double the proportion sourced from nuclear energy to 4% by 2010. While it had enough uranium resources to support its nuclear weapons program, Madame Fu said China would need to import uranium to meet its power demands.” - China’s Australian Ambassador Madame Fu Ying. (The Australian, 2/12/05, “China warning on uranium”).

    • Ben81 says:

      07:56pm | 25/03/11

      Adam, a “dirty bomb” would probably kill people (mainly from the explosion and very few if any from radiation exposure) but no more than a conventional bomb.  It would cause the need for an expensive cleanup, just the same as when any substance potentially harmful to people is dispersed over a large area.  There are a lot more things that will do a hell of a lot more actual harm to people than some nuclear waste someone can scavenge, the real goal of someone using one would be to scare people.
      It would cause mass panic through the irrational stigma attatched to anything ‘nuclear’, that being the psychological impact.

    • Ben81 says:

      08:42pm | 25/03/11

      oh jeez… yes Adam, fuel for nuclear bombs is often sourced from nuclear power.  While some governments of course often make use of the civil industry for military purposes it’s way too late to argue that you can stop the production of nuclear bombs by stopping the civil nuclear power industry, something that isn’t going to happen any time soon anyway vithout actual viable alternatives.  It’s not a desperate reliance.
      A few power plants in Australia will be the least of the worlds worries when it comes to misuse of the waste.

    • Adam says:

      10:30am | 26/03/11

      Or it would simply kill lots of people, what with just 0.001gm of Pu-239 being lethal, and with a radioactive life of some half a million years (half life 24,400 years). But yes the scare and disruption would be enough.

    • Ben81 says:

      11:49am | 26/03/11

      “Or it would simply kill lots of people,”
      Well no, there are plenty of things people do in their everyday lives that would expose all but a handful of them to higher levels of radiation without killing them.  Other chemicals and substances would be far more deadly, again, a ‘dirty bomb’ is different simply because of the stigma attatched to nuclear waste and would cause panic.

      “just 0.001gm of Pu-239 being lethal,”
      Just where do you you pull this stuff from?  Of course it’s carciogenic to humans and inlaling it can cause lung cancer like many substances, but yet again, there’s a lot more things easier to obtain that are far more deadly in both the short and long term but don’t have a stigma attatched to them because of the usual double standard.

    • Craig Mc says:

      10:47am | 25/03/11

      Jim’s a member of Fiends Of The Earth.  Enough said.

    • Adam says:

      12:37pm | 25/03/11

      So Jim’s out of a job if he winds the campaign, and those with mining interests stand to win bucks from pushing their case. Ask yourself: where lies the greater integrity?

    • mw says:

      02:48pm | 25/03/11

      Zealots will say and do anything they can to further their cause.

      The only consideration of what is right is considering what is right for the cause. I fail to see how FOE can be seen to have a claim on greater integrity…

    • Baa Baa says:

      11:48am | 25/03/11

      Reading these blogs, i am amazed how many nuclear experts we have in this country..

    • mw says:

      12:14pm | 25/03/11

      Being well informed doesn’t require one to be an expert.

      I’ll start worrying about risks from nuclear when Ziggy Switkowski (an actual expert) tells me to…

    • Elphaba says:

      12:27pm | 25/03/11

      @mw, exactly.  Just like you listen to an expert on everything before making a decision.

      @Baa Baa, you get used to the disbelief.  Reading these blogs, I am amazed there are still Labor voters out there…

    • john says:

      11:49am | 25/03/11

      In Space the nuclear industry has a bright future. If the nuclear industry is smart it will invest in space technology etc and power the future for space stations, satellites, moon bases, space transport from space stations to the moon and back etc.  To mars even. Its not unfeasible to have a nuke power plant on the moon even.

      There is a a whole new age dawning for the nuclear industry in space and plenty of governments willing to throw billions at those projects. That’s where the money is. Strange watching the nuclear industry wasting its time on power plants here ‘n’ there, in third world or developing countries then waiting for people’s electricity meters to start spinning to start receiving dividends from populations that have little wealth, still loading up their donkeys to go to markets, whilst felafels are being cooked on coal fires.

      How stupid are the CEO’s of the nuclear industry trying to scam a few bucks from poorer countries?

    • mw says:

      12:17pm | 25/03/11

      With the pants wetting that goes on over transporting nuclear material already, I don’t think it’s likely there will be agreement to transport it up through the atmosphere any time soon…

    • Hugh says:

      11:53am | 25/03/11

      Just as a side note, the average 1000mW coal fired plant releases about 5 tonnes of uranium into the atmosphere every year, under normal operations, including 35kg of u235.

    • Glen says:

      12:19pm | 25/03/11

      Nice non-issue. Simple commonsense answer, “Don’t worry, I won’t”.

    • Razor says:

      12:38pm | 25/03/11

      Dear Author,

      Have you given up using all forms of transport and just staye din one spot - because aheap of peopel get killed and maimed daily by bloody transport.

      And, if yo get sick, i hpoe you don’t go to hospital because a shed laod of people die due to going to hospital rather than the condition they presented with.

      Just being alive is a risk.

    • Adam says:

      12:45pm | 25/03/11

      The repeated claims that opposing nuclear = endorsing coal is the height of logical fallacies. Perhaps the greater problem many (and our media) have is that it’s a preventative measure.. so it’s not deemed “newsworthy”.

      Nuclear power is the only energy sector with repeatedly proven direct and indirect links with nuclear WMDs - a fraction of which would induce a global climate change in just hours.

      Consider WW2 - if nuclear power had existed, much of Europe & the UK would have been rendered uninhabitable, essentially forever, via conventional bombing alone.

    • Ben81 says:

      04:34pm | 25/03/11

      “The repeated claims that opposing nuclear = endorsing coal is the height of logical fallacies.”
      The logical fallacies come from the likes of you, with a clear double standard.  The fact is that certain people seem that they couldn’t care less or are at least very silent about tens of thousands of people dying each year as a result of coal power generation but go into hysterics if there’s a chance a handful could die as a result of nuclear power generation.  That’s no exaggeration and I think it’s more than fair to compare the two.
      Also remember with coal people just die and it’s accepted as a matter of course and the waste is spewed into the air where it poses a far greater threat to people than any nuclear waste, with nuclear there’s a miniscule chance of people being harmed after a massive natural disaster.
      Face it, your opposition to nuclear power is irrational and purely ideological.

      “Consider WW2 - if nuclear power had existed, much of Europe & the UK would have been rendered uninhabitable, essentially forever, via conventional bombing alone. “
      Have you forgotten a certain event in WW2 there Adam?  Which parts bombed are now uninhabitable?

    • Adam says:

      07:18pm | 25/03/11

      Ben 81, think about it a little harder. Many more times the radiation of Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs combined was released in the Chernobyl disaster. As would be the case in bombing of nuclear power plants in any conflict. And as there is now a greater concern over the spent fuel rods (sans safety containment vessels) at Fukushima, relative to fuel in the reactor cores or the venting of steam.

      The logical fallacy comes from comparing coal with nuclear, when obviously neither holds a clean or sustainable future.

      Planes sometimes crash, as do cars, and neither has any impact on the needs for harm minimization of the one to the other. It’s like saying “the people of Japan deserve support in this dire time of need therefore people are no longer starving in Africa”.

      The issue here is nuclear power. A debate about nuclear power should address… nuclear power and its many unavoidable “foibles”. Afterall, it’s only had six or more decades to get its act together.

    • Ben81 says:

      08:54pm | 25/03/11

      “The logical fallacy comes from comparing coal with nuclear, when obviously neither holds a clean or sustainable future.”
      Oh come on, that’s as far from a logical fallacy as you can get.
      They’re compared because they both do the same job, produce baseload power.  When it comes to safety and actual harm to people and the environment nuclear leaves coal for dead.  It’s a fair comparison to illustrate the obvious double standard that exists.

    • Adam says:

      03:39pm | 26/03/11

      Ben 81, “When it comes to safety and actual harm to people and the environment nuclear leaves coal for dead. It’s a fair comparison”, Assume then that nuclear is not 14% of global generating capacity and put it on par with coal. Then let’s see the figures, also taking into account the latent periods of cancers (nuclear accidents don’t just start then stop).

      The fact that more people are killed by machetes than by guns doesn’t make it safe for everyone to own a gun.

      You see, the thing is that those who are working to highlight the truths of an industry which exists solely on the back of mining and military interests and public subsidies are actually motivated by *preventative* measures to even greater, unimaginable risks, rather than pure… reaction.

    • Ben81 says:

      11:23am | 27/03/11

      Adam, “Assume then that nuclear is not 14% of global generating capacity and put it on par with coal. Then let’s see the figures, also taking into account the latent periods of cancers (nuclear accidents don’t just start then stop).”
      Of course, it has been measured and compared with other sources of power generation to give us an idea of deaths caused per TWH many times.  This guy puts it better than some others -
      http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/03/deaths-per-twh-by-energy-source.html
      Nuclear is right at the bottom.
      If you’re really worried about industry causing cases of cancer the nuclear power industry is one of the last you should be concerned about.
      And looking at the facts it seems that a better comparison would be machetes and feather dusters rather than guns.

    • Jim says:

      01:44pm | 25/03/11

      Sounds like Dr Green is an example of where ideological conviction has made him blind to his own education.

      Go scoop up some soil from your vege patch - there’ll be uranium in it…it’s a naturally occurring, widespread element.

    • ken says:

      02:06pm | 25/03/11

      1.
      what all these greenies seem to gloss over is that we would all love an answer to power generation that didnt involve,a huge drop in the standard of living or

      Nuclear power…

      But we need a viable alternative and in 20 years according to the greenies or the sea will be washing in….......

      Neither Wind or Solar are capable in that time frame of providing base load power….

      2.The failures in Japan were in the initial engineering and design assumptions..not in the technology itself.The station was built to withstand a lesser earthquake and a lesser Tsunami….

      3.If nuclear is removed as a generation option then we should all buy shares in coal.Thats just the reality of our times….90% of Australians dont vote green…........

    • Adam says:

      03:20pm | 25/03/11

      Ken says “Neither Wind or Solar are capable in that time frame of providing base load power….” and yet, combine the two, along with energy efficiency measures and you get a very different outcome.

      Not to mention the fact it takes around a decade to design and commission a nuclear plant, with another 10+ years for it to recoup its energy costs.

      Australia already generates almost enough elec from biomass to power the state of Tas. Then there are the untapped potentials in wave power and tidal power.

      There are so many hard facts that nuclear proponents would rather turn their backs on. Try this:

      “Expansion of nuclear fuel cycle activities need not be part of a response to climate change.”
      “In our view it is unrealistic to believe that a reactor could be operating in as little as ten years. Similarly, the view that only 20 people a year would need to undergo relevant training and education is an underestimate.” - From the Australian Government’s official peer review of the Ziggy Switkowski draft report, chaired by (pro-nuclear) Australian Chief Scientist Dr Jim Peacock, 9/12/2006.

      I suggest that nuclear advocates disclose their shares and/or super in uranium.

    • Ben81 says:

      04:53pm | 25/03/11

      @Adam “Not to mention the fact it takes around a decade to design and commission a nuclear plant, with another 10+ years for it to recoup its energy costs.”
      Not that that’s a concern in the first place, you’re ignoring actual emissions, and we should just get moving, France for example built 6 plants per year when they were building up the industry.  China has about 11 plants being built right now, they were started in 2007/2008 and are all due for completion by next year.  Need more examples?

      “Australia already generates almost enough elec from biomass to power the state of Tas. Then there are the untapped potentials in wave power and tidal power.”
      Great, come back when they’re a feasible reality.

      “There are so many hard facts that nuclear proponents would rather turn their backs on. Try this: (cherry picked quote)”
      Yes Adam, the political reality in Australia is that it’s moving at a snails pace and it would be unrealistic to assume the major parties will dare to embrace it too readily in the face of the assured politically damaging fear campaigns that would follow.  So Ziggy is a realist, how is that in any way supposed to be some kind of argument against nuclear power?

    • Adam says:

      07:28pm | 25/03/11

      Ben “you’re ignoring actual emissions, and we should just get moving,”
      Of course we should. And renewables + energy efficiency can do it far quicker, and far cheaper. Then perhaps we can also address the remaining two thirds of emissions stemming from deforestation, industry, agriculture and transport (ie, not from electricity).

    • Ben81 says:

      07:42pm | 25/03/11

      Actually Adam renewables are generally far more expensive, and can’t provide baseload power.  Coal is cheaper but more dangerous than nuclear power.

    • Cameron England says:

      02:12pm | 25/03/11

      I was actually at the uranium conference as a reporter and I have a few observations:

      1. John Borshoff from Paladin wasn’t there as this article tends to suggest.
      2. Not a single protester turned up to oppose the conference.
      3. Mark Parnell from the Greens spoke at the conference, and while from the entirely opposite side of the debate, was treated with respect.
      4. To accuse companies such as Toro Energy of importing un-named quacks to spruik pseudo science without backing your claims is pretty poor form. Oh, and it doesn’t actually mine and sell uranium yet, just for the record.
      5. Uranium industry executives overwhelmingly prefer beer or red wine to cocktails.

      Ascribing some sort of moral culpability on the part of Australian uranium miners for the events in Japan is drawing a pretty long bow. And if you’re going to accuse companies of promoting marginal views it would be good to have those claims backed up.

    • LauraBoBaura says:

      02:27pm | 25/03/11

      Well said Cameron +1. This article did seem a bit, hmm shall I say ‘light’ on actual research & scientific facts.

    • Jim Green says:

      03:26pm | 25/03/11

      Cameron - we wouldn’t accuse Toro, Uranium One and Heathgate of importing un-named quacks to spruik pseudo science if we couldn’t back it up. Only too pleased to provide details - it would make for a good story in the Advertiser. My email is jim.green@foe.org.au

      You say that ascribing some sort of moral culpability on the part of Australian uranium miners for the events in Japan is drawing a pretty long bow. But as a journalist you would recognise the industry’s response - ‘efforts to create a framework for stewardship’ - for the spin that it is. Anyway, go ask them - what specifically have they done in response to the endless stream of revelations of safety breaches, data falsification etc in Japan over the past decade? And why do they think it is appropriate for Japan to have open-ended permission to separate and stockpile Australian-obligated plutonium given the obvious regional tensions arising from Japan’s plutonium program?

    • End of Story says:

      02:16pm | 25/03/11

      I won’t be told anything, unless it is presented and affords itself common sense or is factual.  Tell me anything you like, and I’ll tell you I’ll think about it.  End of story

    • Adam says:

      03:50pm | 25/03/11

      Common sense would dictate that there’s not even enough money on earth to cover the overtime costs of just two security staff to safely guard nuclear wastes for the periods of time required.

    • Adam says:

      03:22pm | 25/03/11

      “Expansion of nuclear fuel cycle activities need not be part of a response to climate change.” - from the Australian Government’s official peer review of the Ziggy Switkowski draft report, chaired by (pro-nuclear) Australian Chief Scientist Dr Jim Peacock, 9/12/2006.

    • TheRealDave says:

      05:26pm | 25/03/11

      So their nuclear plants get hit by a massive 8.9 (or 9.0 dpeending on who you quote) and a huge Tsunami…and there is still no meltdowns and bajillions of people with body parts falling off all over the place.

      Lets get the people who built these plants building them here in Oz tomorrow! We don’t get earthquakes very much at all and never ever at anything like that scale nor do we get tsunami’s, especially on the East Coast.

      Come on people! We dig it up and sell it for everyone else to get cheap power! Why the hell aren’t we doing it ourselves? Cause these idiot Greens say so? Lets try siding with science for a change huh?

    • Adam says:

      06:19pm | 25/03/11

      Ok, TheRealDave, side with science and you’ll see that Australia is anything but immune to seismic activity or risk of tsunami. And what can be guaranteed in terms of both geological and political stability for a period of thousands of generations?

    • Ben81 says:

      07:39pm | 25/03/11

      Adam why are you so concerned about the extremely remote possibility of something going wrong that harms someone at a nuclear power plant after an extreme natural disaster when other industries are releasing their far more dangerous waste into the air that is actually harming people as we speak?

      “And what can be guaranteed in terms of both geological and political stability for a period of thousands of generations? “
      Nothing can guarantee that, what’s your point?

    • Adam says:

      10:26am | 26/03/11

      Ben81, quite clearly the point that nuclear opponents are making is that this is all AVOIDABLE.

      Safer, cleaner, more sustainable and non-WMD related solutions exist right here and now, and deserve greater investment (see also my post below, 7.56pm, 25/3).

      You may also be interested in http://www.energyscience.org.au/factsheets.html

    • Ben81 says:

      11:17am | 26/03/11

      “Safer, cleaner, more sustainable and non-WMD related solutions exist right here and now”
      For baseload power that doesn’t pollute, no not really.  The section in that link on that topic was ... interesting to say the least, what an absolute whitewash.  Not unexpected after reading “Renewable Energy Deniers” in the title.

    • WayneT says:

      06:09pm | 25/03/11

      Let’s get a little perspective here.  There are currently 442 reactors in operation around the world.  If anybody had actually bothered to do some research (which seems absent from modern journalism), you would be surprised by how safe, statistically, nuclear power generation has been. 

      From the ‘Database of radiological incidents and related events’, for the period 1896 to 2010 (not including deliberate use in war, like Hiroshima & Nagasaki):

      Total Nuclear related deaths: 278
      Total Nuclear injuries: 979

      Just last year (1 year) here in Australia, we had 1407 traffic related deaths, and approximately 52340 serious traffic injuries.  In the same year in the USA they had 40,000 deaths.

      World wide In aviation we have had a total of 16000 deaths, and just last year there were 1115 deaths and 130 accidents.

      So looking at these figures, shouldn’t we rush in and place a ban motor vehicles and aircraft?  They appear to pose more of an immediate threat to life.

    • Adam says:

      07:56pm | 25/03/11

      And the global generating capacity of nuclear: about 14%.

      While China’s investment in wind power dwarfs its investment in nuclear, the added generating capacity of wind power globally last year exceeded that of nuclear, and in 2009 renewables was worth some $54billion, growing at a greater rate than any other energy sector.

    • Col. of Blackburn says:

      07:39pm | 25/03/11

      So Dr Jim
      How many Banana’s do you put in your Banana Smoothie’s? Do you fly around the world in your activism? When you were a kid did your parents buy you one of those cool watches with the luminous hands and numbers?
      As you know so much about the Japanese Earthquake and Tsunami and its effect on Fukushima, what can you enlighten us about the effects on the many Coal and Gas fired powerstations that were affected?

    • Jason Todd says:

      08:08pm | 25/03/11

      I had a catastrophic car accident on Monday, as a part of it, the fuel tank sprung a leak and threatened to catch fire. It didn’t, but it was dangerous for a while there.

      Surely the mining companies that provided the oil that was refined into the petrol in my car are going to step up and take some responsibility for the accident?

      We are all exposed to low level radiation on a day to day basis. Some of us more, some of us less. It may do us some harm, but for the most part it doesn’t bother us. Your assertion that if people believe that low level radiation is harmless they should have a playfight with yellowcake powder is as stupid as saying anyone who believes using a defibrillator to correct heart rhythm is warranted should take a bath with their toaster. You are comparing two completely different things and their outcomes. Yes, I would go and have an x-ray if I broke my shoulder. No I would not snort some yellowcake just to show you that I have no problem with nuclear power. Someone needs to give you a lecture on risk versus reward. Yes. Radiation is dangerous. So are things such as fire, knives, electricity, cars and air travel. We continue to use these things despite their danger because a) the benefit obtained outweighs the risk of utilising it and b) we put in place strategies to minimise the risk where possible. The same is true of the utilisation of nuclear power. I think the fact that it has taken a catastrophic disaster the likes of which is rarely seen to even get Fukushima to this point is testament to the level of planning and risk management that has been put into the plant’s operation.

      Look, I am not going to stand here and say that the radiation released from the Fukushima plant is going to cause no problems. It clearly is at the moment and may do so into the future. What I am going to say however is that the outcomes of a disaster such as the Japan Earthquake\Tsunami\Power plant incident trifecta do not form a good basis to judge the safety or usefullness of the entire process of nuclear power. Any large power plant (or any industrial process) has the potential to go wrong and hurt or kill people, particularly in cases of natural disasters. The type of risk involved with the production of said power is proportional to the countermeasures in place to mitigate that risk. If you look at all the fatalities caused by the mining of coal or drilling for oil, you clearly see that they are unsafe, but you aren’t advocating for the immediate and complete shutdown of coal fired plants. You would even be hard pressed for wind and solar to get off the ground without having some sort of injury, fatality or environmental impact in the case of a disaster on the scale of the Japan situation.

      People continue to harp on about how we should be utilising solar, wind, geothermal or tidal energy to meet our needs. The fact of the matter is, we are working on it, but the technology is not there yet. It’s getting there slowly, but people tend to act as if we could roll out powerplants tomorrow and be on completely green energy overnight. The tech just isn’t there yet. I’m not saying no to renewable energy, but what is the harm of using clean nuclear energy as a temporary measure until the emerging renewable tech becomes viable? I think sticking our heads in the sand and saying “No way! No Nuclear” is going to hurt us more than help us in the years to come.

    • Adam says:

      05:10pm | 27/03/11

      Update: Radioactivity in water at reactor 2 at the quake-damaged Fukushima nuclear plant has reached 10 million times the usual level, company officials say. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12872707

      “There had been fears the salt in sea water could further corrode machinery.”
      Translation: there ARE fears it WILL corrode.

      “The fresh water is being pumped in so that contaminated radioactive water can be extracted.”
      To where?

      “We seem to be keeping the situation from turning worse. But we still cannot be optimistic.”
      Translation: It ain’t getting better.

      “The US 7th Fleet is sending barges loaded with 500,000 gallons of fresh water.”
      In contrast to the fact the US navy recently got the hell out of there and scrubbed their deck clean to avoid confusion of contamination from their own onboard reactor.

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