Defending the right of bikers to bash, kill, steal, deal

Dan Brian says:

06:00pm | 31/05/09

This is classic Rovian (Karl Rove) message control. Your arrogance is overwhelming. You marginalize the critics by implying they are fringe radicals naively defending MC clubs are “grandparents who like to ride on bikes”. You then brand clubs “terrorists within” and imply that states who don’t support your law will be providing safe haven. It’s a pure power grab/PR Stunt just admit it. You have terrorism powers (strong enough to hold Haneef with ZERO evidence) you could apply right now. You have a criminal code, fed, state, and specialised task forces you can employ to deal with any such crime. You law is a direct attack on every Australian’s right to free association and the right to not be tarred as guilty by association. Don’t you dare insult us by claiming it’s anything but.

Peter McFarlane says:

06:34pm | 31/05/09

Spot on Mr Premier - There is no place in civil society for “outlaw” bikie gangs, street gangs, Mafia, Triads or any other manefestation of organised crime.  Our federated political structure means a National approach to this problem is also essential. If people don’t respect the rule of law perhaps they could try living in Somalia!

Simon Kenworthy-Dell says:

06:47pm | 31/05/09

If we implement a law banning groups immersed in criminal activity such as sexual assault and drug offences, where will this leave the NRL? Surely some League clubs won’t be able to train together?

Angus says:

07:54pm | 31/05/09

It is time Australia woke up to the Mafia menace in their midst. Only last year the Calabrian Mafia were responsible for the world’s biggest ecstasy haul, 15 million pills, was imported into Australia from Italy disguised as tinned tomatoes. I read a FBI report which mentioned that Italian-American mafia gangs in the New York had links with mafia groups in Australia. Time to wake up media men and do some work and find out if we really do have the mafia right under our nose.

shifty says:

08:02pm | 31/05/09

I’ve always wondered why this approach hasn’t been taken before.

Sol Granberg says:

09:24pm | 31/05/09

Mr Premier -

What a pointless cowbell-ringing attention-seeking 800 or so words.

Wouldn’t your time be better spent running a state? Oh, no, that’s right. They run themselves these days even though our Dear Leader tells us “the free market has failed”.

Your arrogance, and hypocrisy, within this op-ed piece is breathtaking.

Let us start with the fact that such broad-ranging laws are even being discussed - this demonstrates how badly the State Governments of Australia have failed via politically correct, ineffective policing. By attempting to self-correct this, in a bizarre South Australian-retardation, it is only more obvious. The focus of your Government, NSW’s and any other that thinks a “bikers problem” is going to distract the local media from focusing on the broader problems of the bureaucracy should be on making it easier for police to do their job and not be always looking over their shoulder.

On the matter of civil liberties: you and your party widely criticised the former Federal Liberal Party (and it’s bureaucracy, which now works for Federal Labor and our Dear Leader Kevin Rudd) for the Dr Haneef mishandling, yet expect that to debate a fundamental human right is somehow “defending the right of bikers to bash, kill, steal, deal”. This is unjustifiable.

Being a lawmaker, you should understand the doctrine of precedent. You would then understand the impact of such a law on bikies being applied to other organisations, however loosely associated or not. The implications of this need to be taken seriously, and not treated for short term political gain.

Even if a group of society has a much higher probability of committing certain patterns of crime does not mean we should generalize them all as likely to do so. Imagine I am not talking about bikies, but about crimes by indigenous Australians. Notice how we think about this differently when we switch the interest group? No matter how ugly or popular a minority group we should still extend these basic rights to all. This is one of the founding principles of our society.

Now I must confess that my train of thought has been a bit all over the place. Who can blame me? On a Sunday night I am innocently browsing the internets and I am confronted with this nonsense and try my best to respond with the aid of a half-baked Rove-melted brain.

Really, this whole biker thing is really just one more example of media spin gone mad that we have got used to from Labor, a method to dress it’s leaders up as talking tough on crime and making decisions that will make their communities safer.

To quote Shakira: “Hips don’t lie”.

Regards,

Solomon Granberg

Jay D. Bee says:

10:49pm | 31/05/09

“Pseudo-academics” = True Scotsman argument. No, “real” thinker would contemplate the implications this might have for freedom of association, right?

“Defence lawyers are making buckets of cash” = Who? Where? How much? Quantify the assertion of it is just histrionic polemic.

Pat says:

03:44am | 01/06/09

I’m puzzled- if there is indeed proof that the Finks motorcyle club has committed so many crimes, why are they not all in jail? (as would I hope happen if the local pigeon fanciers had a similar record). If it is felt that those with a criminal past are bound to plot further crime, then act against them, not their club members. Indeed why worry about what clubs they belong to- if the local pigeon fancier is a peadophile would there be any point in regulating the rest of the club in any way?
Punishing people for crimes they have committed is right and good- grandstanding and complicating the law just distracts from the real work, allowing guilt by association enables authorities to arrest and imprison lots of people, but usually the wrong people.

Bill Williams says:

08:25am | 01/06/09

I dont think anyone without a vested interest would argue that the criminal element amongst biker society has gone too far of late and need to be reeled in.

However (as reported at http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,25537990-2682,00.html) last week’s proceedings in South Australia where a control order was applied to a member of an outlaw motorcycle club (which, by it’s very nomenclature begs the attention of law enforcement) without the recipient’s knowledge, during a court hearing held in the recipient’s absence and while the man’s criminal history - or lack of it - has been declared a public secret after a directive by the state’s most senior magistrate surely demand close scrutiny and cannot help but arouse the curiosity of some as to whether these laws are indeed suitable in a 21st century country like Australia which still, as far as I know, considers itself to be “free”.

Ian says:

11:57am | 01/06/09

Behaviour of most bikies I do not agree with or support. However the overall effect of the legislation to police bikie gangs is frightening, not for the bikies who will move underground or morph into other organisations, but for the man on the street who could find this legislation turned against them for presently unintended reasons. Perhaps not by the governments of 2009, but by others in years to come. The capacity to trample on human rights, or rights of citizens, is overwhelming. If the current laws cannot be used to deal with criminal behaviours of the bikies, then the capacities of the police to enforce these laws reflects poorly upon their training and engagement with criminal society. Politicians who created this legislation did it only to garner votes of an electorate swayed by hyped up fears. These laws do not support the rights of individuals in our nation and should be recinded as a gesture of faith in the population and of current laws.

Dan Brian says:

12:05pm | 01/06/09

It makes me wonder how your own party let’s you get away with this in SA? Why don’t you launch your own local Fox News channel, tell Mal Turnbull that far-right Labor is the new black and you’re now the self-anointed poster boy for conservative lunacy in this country.

David Munro says:

12:07pm | 01/06/09

No-one I know diagrees that criminals and criminal acts should be punished. I am not a lawyer but I am pretty sure it is already, and has been for some time, against the law to bash people to death, to make and sell drugs and conduct any other form of criminal activity, please Mike correct me if I am wrong. Peter McFarlane in a previous comment mentions “civil society”, he needs to have another look at what it means. These laws have no place in civil society. I am a third generation South Aussie, all six of my children were born here. I left a six figure salary in Queensland two and a half years ago to come back to my home state and run a tiny country pub and struggle every week. When I came back I could not believe what was happening and the arrogance of this government. How dare they run rough shod over our freedoms that families like mine have fought for. I have never been a member of an outlaw motorcycle club nor do I have a criminal record yet I was attacked in Parliament on February 18th by the Attorney General for my political views. Nearly every comment made by the Attorney General was a lie and done from the protection of parliamentary privilege. The mainstream media has ignored this, only the Yorke Peninsula Country Times and the Independent Weekly have had the courage to publish an article that disagrees with our Premier and his multitude of spin doctors. I have had labor views almost my entire life, I was a union representative for almost seven years including 18 months as a Federal Councillor for the CPSU. I believed in people like Mick Young. I have served my country as a soldier as my oldest son does now, as my wife has done, as our forebears have done. I am angry with the government of my home state and will not just sit back and take it from some arrogant import who still sits on the fence with dual citizenship. The lack of response from the Premier and the Attorney General and their continued stance on crushing free will has given me resolve to accept a nomination from the F.R.E.E. Australia Party to stand as a candidate and if endorsed by the executive committee at the end of this month I will be standing for the seat of Goyder. I like Steve Griffiths, he has always been open and honest with me, but I want to get a message out about what F.R.E.E. stands for. Enough is enough, we need more people like David Winderlich representing us. Government and the law should be transparent and separate from each other. Our elected representatives should be there for their electorates and the will of the people. There is an ever increasing public resistance to these draconian laws, educated, thinking people with IQs well over 40 are asking questions and putting up arguments. This movement is going to get louder and that is when the liberals who have remained silent to date will jump in, people like me will remember their lack of voice at the start.

Regards,

Dave Munro
Publican, Paskeville Hotel, SA.

Jane says:

12:41pm | 01/06/09

I’m not an academic, nor do I support any form of criminal activity.  However, I’m not about to support the new laws introduced in NSW and SA that will assume guilt by association, nor make it possible for police to search and seize on suspicion.  These laws are an attack on democracy.

Damo says:

12:50pm | 01/06/09

I’m not the first to say it, but it’s pretty clear you can be opposed to organised crime and the new laws at the same time. They are not mutually exclusive. Is he trying to sound as though he has not even a basic understanding of logic? Id like to know why laws against assault, drug dealing etc, aren’t enough to stop bikie organised crime. It is against the law after all.

Mark M Aldridge Independent says:

01:06pm | 01/06/09

The premier has forgotten to mention several facts, firstly the legislation he quotes is not “Anti Bikie Laws” and no where does it mention bikers, then he forgot to mention that the first use of the “Anti civil rights legislation” I prefer to call it, was used on a non biker. then the figures he quotes include crimes of members both before and after the fact and are of a period of some 40 years or more.
So even if and when a club evicts a less than desirable member any crimes he committs after being a member still apply, all this is called spin??
If the figures are spun differently, they show a huge reduction in crime by those people who become members. Regardless of ones individual ideals, the Fact remains, these laws are a brutal attack on every citizens freedoms and equality before the law, Innocent until proven guilty should always remain flavour of the day.

Pete says:

02:09pm | 01/06/09

Just imagine how civil liberties would fare if the Bikies Party got voted in to government in SA. If they ran the state the way they run their clubs and other affairs, then there would be cause to complain about breaches of civil liberties.

The freedom they campaign for is the freedom to make everyone else do things their way, or suffer the consequences. Those guys do not even have the freedom to choose what brand of motorcycle they ride, hair style they wear or clothing they dress in. It all must conform to their rules.

That said, these new state laws are dangerous because they use the emotive issue of a popular ‘bogey man” to bring in draconian laws to set a precedent that down the road could be used against other groups, such as religions, political groups etc that do not meet with mainstream establishment approval.

This country badly needs a Bill of Rights to guarantee basic rights of free association, speech and assembly, to stop tin-pot opportunist B-league pollies making laws like this to score cheap political points.

Nevyn says:

02:22pm | 01/06/09

While there is little doubt that many bikies have and do break common laws, it’s not true that all of them do. I have had many interactions with bikies over the years on a personal and business level and have never once felt threatened in any way. I have friends who I have known all their lives who have gone on to join a 1% bike club, one in particular who lives very close I know I would trust the life of any member of my family with. I don’t know if he has ever been involved in the making of drugs, that has no impact on me or my life at all because while it is a criminal offense to make drugs, it’s also a criminal offense to buy and use them. The guilty selling to the guilty. However, if my 86 year old mother, for example, is robbed, it won’t be by a bikie, it will probably be one of the “gang of 49”. Bikies don’t target innocent people, they generally target other bikies and criminals, the gang of 49 are the ones who are more of a threat to every day law abiding citizens of this state. However, the biggest thief in this state I feel is second in command to the writer of the article above, Mister Foley, under his time in power has robbed every one of us, man woman and child, no biker has managed robbery on such a wide and grand scale.

Sam G says:

02:24pm | 01/06/09

I believe that the steps to break up these motor cycle gangs are well over due. for years they have had every excuse for their criminal activities and they have had numerous opportunities to clean the problem up within their clubs. If they arent about criminal activity, then why not expel the members who are behind it. Allowing it to happen within their clubs makes them just as responsible as those that are committing the crimes. They have absolutely no respect for the people around them when they have these cowardly gun fights. Why should we give a crap about their rights, when they can respect ours? the right to safety, and the right to life.

Harold says:

02:50pm | 01/06/09

Media Mike why do you refuse to tell us how much this is costing tax payers . This is just a knee jerk reaction that has gone too far and you have been trying to justify what you have done ever since, using inuendo and heresay not facts . Why should we all lose our rights when there were already adequate laws to to convict these people .The problem was not the existing laws but a lazy police force .

Lachy says:

03:08pm | 01/06/09

I wish Mike Rann would spend more time governing our state rather than penning his thoughts on his own legislation. Yes these laws are stupid and simply will do nothing to curb undesireable behaviour. But I also find selling off vast parts of our state to developers undesireable. Mike Rann please lift your game and do more for our state than persist with this type of governance.

Dave Clark says:

03:39pm | 01/06/09

It sounds to me that Mike Rann may have been subjected to bullying when he was a little lad.
Now intent on doing the bullying.
All this talk about the OUTLAW MOTORCYCLE gangs. What about the Asian gangs the gang of 49 etc, running our streets? Oh sorry that’ll be rasist.
You talk tough Rann, but it’s just that talk! If you want to get hard on crime do it. Include all gangs (from schools to the streets) regardless of their nationality. And save all us law abiding people from all this dribble.

Mike Kiebat says:

03:47pm | 01/06/09

Who the hell do you think you are Mr Rann…??? This is Australia, and it doesn’t matter how much regurgitated rhetoric and spin you continue to spew forth, Australians are NOT going to stand by while you attempt to turn it, or at least our little part of it, into the world’s latest Dictatorship… While we still have a few rights left, dammit, we intend to excercise them… It is only the beginning, however, more and more truth about yours and Atkinson’s lunacy is coming to light daily, with I’m sure, lots more to come as everyone including the media begins to tire of your lies and begin to listen to the likes of those people in the know… Everyday more people are exposed to the truth by leading legal minds from around the country, and everyday more and more people just ponder… How the hell did the lunatics get to run the Asylum…??? My Guess… Donkey votes and apathy… Well, not next time…

Simon Halliwell says:

03:48pm | 01/06/09

A critique of Rann’s hubris:

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/purepoison/2009/06/01/opposing-a-law-is-not-supporting-crime/

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

Alice says:

03:58pm | 01/06/09

These laws are simply grandstanding and fear mongering . It’s ALREADY illegal to “bash, kill, steal, & deal”, and criminals are already being prosecuted for breaking those laws.The very statistics Rann is using to bolster his populist argument show that new laws with a lower standard of proof aren’t needed.

Trevor says:

04:47pm | 01/06/09

Mike refers to “his” laws. That’s code for “polling shows me a winner on this issue”. I think what this reflects is Mike’s view that there is no-one more important in this state than the Premier and, as such, politics should override the law.

skeletons says:

05:11pm | 01/06/09

Will the same laws apply to the convicted child sex offenders who just happen to hand out sentences in a court of law and those who wear a police uniform?

Its obvious their colleagues must have known about their crimes before being caught.  please say it will be so Uncle Rann.

STM says:

06:33pm | 01/06/09

It’s a tough one, because people are really sick of the way the gangs carry on. I’d be one of ‘em.

But the question I’d ask is: are they also sick of the institutions that have guaranteed the freedoms we enjoy as a great liberal democracy through our inherited rule of law, which goes back the best part of 1000 years?

The problem with this legislation isn’t that it’s out to “get” outlaw bikies.

Some of them need to be “got”.

But there were existing laws available in both SA and NSW to combat this menace in our midst (and make no mistake, there are some really nasty buggers among them).

Trading personal freedoms for security is OK up to a point when the risk is very real and in your face, but it can be a very , very slippery slope - as we’ve seen in the US.

Who’s next: illegally parked gangs of criminal soccer mums in 4WDs, the Gularganbone Wednesday Book Club Meeting (having accidentally chosen the latest Jihadi rant for a browse and talk evening) or Uni Students With Nothing Better to do Agitating for Extra Artichoke in the David Jones lunchtime gourmet salad special?

In this case, it’s not quite denial of due-process as we’ve come to understand it, but certainly it’s heading along that track ... especially - and it’s the key part - when it comes to guilt by association.

And definitely regarding the latter, the laws in both states look like an attack on presumption of innocence.

While that’s a well-aimed smack at outlaw criminal motorcycle gangs, a previous poster is right too: it’s also an attack on democracy.

What’s wrong with a bit of old-fashioned police work instead?

Wouldn’t that be enough of a smack?

One Percenter says:

10:31pm | 01/06/09

As a member of a 1% club I have obviously been watching with interest the laws which are attacking our way of life.. I am neither a convicted criminal nor do I engage in criminal activities, am I therefore to be tried as a criminal because of the friends I know across the country despite the fact that I am and have been a man who enjoys a few beers and a ride with my mates??

If the same rules were applied to politicians, no doubt many of them would not be able to associate with each other as was revealed last week with the 523 criminal charges of fraud, child molestation, drug taking, drink driving, theft etc. But obviously if you make the rules you can write yourself out of them when it comes to passing them through parliament, in fact you could probably lie to your constituents some more, pat yourself on the back and give yourself a fat pay rise. I will be interested to see the public comments when the article i refer to sees the light of day, however I believe a media ban on it will be on the cards and some more vote grabbing comments and beat up news stories will follow.

Again if the same rules are to apply to one and all, our football heroes would be painted with the same brush and be labeled a criminal organization, but I guess if you are a public hero it is okay to rape, lie, take and deal drugs, steal, bash your wife etc, as long as when you get out on the field on the weekend you kick a goal or score a try.

Public perception of 1% bike clubs has been vilified by the media and our politicians and their spin doctors. To be sure in all walks of life there are individuals who operate outside what generally would be accepted as normal behaviour, but what if the individual is aboriginal, would the pollies say lock all aboriginals up, what if the individual is a policeman, would all policeman be locked up or be made to prove their innocence for associating with the dodgy copper?? ( and we know there are plenty of them out there.) 

The point is that our way of lives as australians will be affected, regardless of who we are, due to these new laws our basic rights as australian citizens will be stripped away from us, and in time our freedom to be individuals will be gone altogether. NSW and SA are to be the model gestapo states for which they request the rest of australias states and territories to follow like sheep, and I guess they probably will as we know that politicians blindly follow each other when there is a dollar in it for them so hang on to your hats, put on your blinkers and part your arse cheeks because here comes the pineapple.

Daniel says:

11:05pm | 01/06/09

And the last few pins of oppression fall into place, do not be surprised if you wake up one morning and find you and your extended family and friends have been locked up for being domestic terrorists because some government official did not like something you said (North Korean style).

Of course they will have to look no further than your facebook of the future to determine every social contact you willingly gave them because it’s “fun”, all powered by K Rudd’s fibreoptic monster.

Slowly bit by bit they lay the ground work that is desperately needed now so it can be abused in the future.

Goldy says:

11:24pm | 01/06/09

Everyone seems to be missing the point about these laws - they are intended to PREVENT Crime by PREVENTING serious criminals from associating together.  These are people whose reputation for violence prevents victims from coming foward and giving evidence.  Tougher sentences are useless if no-one faces prosecution in the first place.  These laws dont need a victim to come forward - thats why the bikies are squawking so loudly - because this time you cant intimidate the Police Commissioner, Attorney General and the local magistrate - and get away with it.

Craig Hendry says:

12:03am | 02/06/09

Gone is innocent until PROVEN guilty, Gone is freedom of association, Gone is the ability to have a family BBQ without having to prove it was harmless, GONE, GONE, GONE…

Section 9 is unbelievably insane (yes, I am going to use that word to describe this law) in that it says that “For the avoidance of doubt” (can’t have a thing like reasonable doubt getting the way can we) ” it is not necessary for the prosecution to prove that the defendant associated with another person for any particular purpose “. It absolutely floors me that stuff like this can even be printed and held up as a legal document. What do they mean “not neccessary for the prosecution to prove…”? How can anyone be safe from a law like this? It really is time for people to stand up against this madness (yes, I have alluded once again to the “insane” word). I have highlighted the crazy bits (well some of them) for easy viewing. I also have not mentioned that the word “bikie”, “gang”, etc. does not even appear in this act.

A snippet from SOCCA shown below

Part 5—Offences

35—Criminal associations

(1) A person who associates, on not less than 6 occasions during a period of 12 months,
with a person who is—
(a) a member of a declared organisation; or
(b) the subject of a control order,
is guilty of an offence.

Maximum penalty: Imprisonment for 5 years.

(9) For the avoidance of doubt, in proceedings for an offence against this section, it is not necessary for the prosecution to prove that the defendant associated with another person for any particular purpose or that the association would have led to the commission of any offence.

The F.R.E.E. AUSTRALIA PARTY represents the voice of sanity and reason.  For their take on what is occurring visit http://www.freeaustralia.org

Tim of Croydon says:

08:04am | 02/06/09

Mike Rann and our sorry Attorney-General (my local member!) Mick Atkinson have been enemies of democracy for a while now. I won’t be voting for Labor at our next state election due to their draconian views on banning movies available everywhere else (9 Songs was ripped off of the shelves of video stores) and for refusing to classify video games thus banning them (I’m not interested in video games but that is disgusting). Our Labor government also refuse to install an anti-corruption watchdog (sweet property deals for the Catholic church exposed in The Independent Weekly).

Howard learnt the hard way that not only is it not the 1950’s anymore but that being an enemy of democracy leads to defeat. Ifonlyhe Liberal Party were a credibile alternative.

Rob James says:

11:06am | 02/06/09

Although I think that this is a step in the right direction, I do agree that the actually crimes that occur need to be addressed more so than the group that define them.

I am a proud owner of a Harley-Davidson, and guess what, I wear a jacket that says the same. But I don’t belong to a gang, nor do I wear any colours that would indicate that. I’m an IT guy and look like one for God’s sake!! But I still get awkward looks by the law enforcement.

Do we really think that a bikie gang is going to say “Rann’s got his new rules in, we better start behaving!!!”? I doubt it! They will simply go underground, cover criminal activity under a different guise, or just not publicise the gang name.

This is not only an issue isolated to the 1%; what about all the other gangs? Middle Eastern & Asian gangs, Mafia and others. They don’t go around publicising what groups they belong to or wear patches or colours. How do we deal with them?

Mark M Aldridge says:

12:38pm | 02/06/09

Mike Rann’s Popularity a fore gone conclusion.

Good old Adelaide, the one paper town, where open and honest debate on important issues, is sacrificed in favor of our Quasi Dictators own Ideals for our state.

And why not, saves debate, stifles dissent and apparently results in a happy utopia for all its residents. Mike Ranns latest article on “The Punch” is further evidence that he regards himself the end all, when it comes to controlling his state. On line viewers would already have access to educated debate on the issues he has raised in his article” defending the right of Bikers to Bash, kill, steal and deal” yet our mighty advertiser dare not even publish his article in the print media in fear it may spark open and honest public debate.

What we don’t know wont hurt us, is surely an unusual approach in such modern times one would think, but politics is still a numbers game. Being a political wannabee, and speaking regularly to people from all walks of life, a majority are still reliant on their morning paper for their intellectual stimulation. Even those that doubt the medias ability to perform the task of making them informed, will still have their Ideals sculptured by what information they receive.

Media Mikes above story, had more spin on it than any others I have read, he quotes figure’s of crime committed by the finks motorcycle club, with out regards to any sense of reality, the same figures have been found to prove that after becoming a member of the club, crime rates reduce drastically, astounding considering the close scrutiny club members are under by our police services. Did he simply forget to mention those figures were over a 40 year plus time line, or that they included crimes of those both before and after they were members?

I simply love the statement “no one with an IQ over 40” in relation to those opposing the “anti bikie laws” so I decided to have a closer look at who exactly do oppose such “Anti civil rights legislation” as I prefer to all them.

As I committed to a brief search over my notes on the subject, I became astounded at how many had voiced their opposition to the laws, considering the Advertiser had exposed none of the many articles. Civil Libertarians, Defense lawyers and pseudo academics Mr. Rann has labeled them, these less than 40 IQ individuals include;

The famous Steve Cook-Midwest Outlaw Motorcycle Club gang’s investigator
NSW DDP chief-Nicholas Cowdery QC
Terry O’Gorman-President of the Australian council for Civil Liberties
Andreas Schloenhardt-UQ professor of criminal law
Rob Hulls-Victorian Attorney General
Mark Thomas-QUT law academic
Tim Meeham-Crimminal defense specialist
Dr Arlie Loughnan-Institute of Criminology and University of Sydney academic
Greg Walker-solicitor with a specialty in human rights law
Nathan Boucher-Criminal defense lawyer
Simon Overland-Victorian Chief Commissioner
Expert’s like-Paul Wilson-Bond University, Paster Terry Walker, Tim Webster
Journo like-Tim Webster, Chris Nyst
Australian council for civil liberties
And even The Head of Federal Parliamentary committee on organized crime- Paul Maley.

In fact anyone with a conscience, including the democrats, the greens, FREE Australia and various Independents have voice their concern.

And Media Mike Rann has labeled them all Half-wits? The defense of our hard earned civil liberties and basic Freedoms, does not conclude either that one supports criminal activities or that in Mikes words ”cant have an IQ over 40”.

I have endured personal attacks as have several others that have stood up for those rights we should all expect of Australia the lucky country, those rights and freedoms our forefathers sacrificed life and limb to secure.

Secret pipelines, hidden agendas, and such aforementioned attacks on our civil liberties, to date remain unimportant issues in the eyes of some of the South Australian Media, I simply ask WHY?

Mark M Aldridge
Independent Candidate for the Legislative Council
2010 South Australian State Election

Mike Kiebat says:

01:22pm | 02/06/09

Well Mr Aldridge, I always prefer to look on the bright side, so being elevated from “meatheads on motorcycles” (not so long ago) to “academic halfwit” (now) must surely be a step in the right direction… I know who’s company I’d rather be keeping…

I am content to sit back, comforted in the knowledge that as long as the “two Mikes” only open their mouths to change their feet, the general public learn more & more of their “anti-democracy” campaign…

marie says:

02:02pm | 02/06/09

The Australian public should commence investigations into the dealings of Australian politicans - and this is where I stop.

Paul says:

02:15pm | 02/06/09

Mr Rann, Given Labors record in NSW, I think your inflammatory title could have been balanced by adding ” Labors right to look the other way for decades and suddenly pretend that it cares.”

It would be easier to take Labor seriously if you cleaned up some of the trash in your own (Labor) backyard, especially in NSW. Where we don’t trust legislation like this and we don’t trust Premier ‘Forest’ Rees fullstop. 

The fact is draconian laws or Labor alarmism will not beat bikies or terrorists or paedophiles… properly resourced policing and customs will. If you take the time to speak to staff in the frontlines you will probably see my point and their frustrations.

Except this isn’t about good policing is it Mr Rann? This is about you. Take your UnAustralian attitudes and buzz off mate. The country and our liberties and freedoms are too good for a desperate wannabe NeoCon like you.

Cam says:

02:49pm | 02/06/09

If the term “outlaw motorcycle gangs” was specifically mentioned in the legislation, I would at least not be so skeptical but this article reads like it belongs back in Europe in the 1930s. Many people I have spoken to who have returned to Adelaide from overseas claim that people have more liberties overseas and that South Australia has become a nanny state. How sad.

harry says:

03:18pm | 02/06/09

Media Mike has created a police state which I don’t want to live in anymore.
Not just the bikies, but anyone can be stopped and searched. I have seen it happen at Salisbury station where two plain clothed stopped and search a young man based purely on his appearance. The young man was doing nothing wrong and minding his own business. Cars are randomly stopped and searched on main highways.
Goodonya Mike.

Tracy says:

08:30pm | 02/06/09

When a law can tell you who you can talk to or associate with and who you can’t it becomes an invasion of human rights. what if a biker happens to be an Uncle or father,etc what are you telling me I cannot associate with them, that’s just not right. Yes there are good and bad within all clubs BUT there is good and bad in all people in all walks of life ANDI am not in fear of these people hurting my kids or myself BUT I am scared of the street gangs of different races. when my kids walk to their friends or to the local shops, I live in fear of what may happen. when I am at home will one of these street gangs or drug addicts invade my home and do whatever to me and my family. that is what the average person fears NOT bikers who (most of them) try to just live their own lives their own way, they are NOT all hell bent on hell-raising as Mr Rann will lead you to believe. At an average party you CAN get rape, crime, bashings, drugs,etc so is he going to ban the average persons party..NO..yes not all people will experience these things ever..good for them but in average society you will. I do not condone criminal activity but deal with the criminal acts as they happen and to whom is involved with them not bring in a law that attacks human rights!!!

Markus says:

10:14pm | 02/06/09

I’m a bike rider, yes I chose to buy a Harley Davidson, I wear a black leather jacket sometimes (for safety) and have been compelled to join FREE Australia party, in frustration with this damn government.  It’s not a bikie party as often quoted but a party that is against the draconian laws that have been legislated in this state. I feel that this state has become almost a police state, and only tonight on the news a lawyer has come out and stated the same publicly. I missed his name, but my sentiments are the same. Will be interesting if this comments makes the AdelaideNow website. Mike Rann has obviously got a beef with bikies, but I think his political posturing is starting to wear thin with the voting public. It’s time, media Mike to concentrate on real issues, like our water dilema, and the hospitals and schools which are also facing the wrath of Rann and co. Super Schools, what a joke.

regina says:

11:49pm | 02/06/09

oh that’s a provocotive piece from the premier, and a nice coup for the punch.

personally i don’t see the need for more laws. it’s already against the law to do all those things mentioned in the article. to me it seems to be a slight overreaction by the pollies to recent events to appease the populist squarkers who are clueless about the current state of the law and policing.

i also don’t fancy legislating against the right of free association. that’s a terrible, undemocratic and unwarranted thing to be doing.

but i’m curious: did the premier write the headline?

because while i don’t agree with the sentiments expressed i think, appropriately, it had real punch.

Lord Stockton says:

12:43am | 03/06/09

Of course while Mr Rann is busy protecting us from these terrible people by diverting police resources to monitior them, our only growth industry in SA goes from strength to strength- the road toll

Rob says:

02:42pm | 03/06/09

Now hang on mikey your? anti gang laws didnt you state not long ago that you gave the laws THE POLICE WANTED

Johannes says:

08:19pm | 03/06/09

These laws contravene a number of articles contained in the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights and yes Australia is a signatory to them.

You and your parties comments before, during and after the laws enactment is little more than conditioning the publics perception of motorcycle clubs; through the use of the police and media. The police have the authority to investigate, detain, arrest and conduct enquiries through multiple options and including technological intercepts of a myriad of devices when dealing with crime.

Comments relating to terrorism are simply not supported by the facts and using ex club members criminal records over 15 years ago to prop up the figures to the public is a distortion. If terrorism is an issue; which it is in Australia please ask Federal Police how many Australians of Lebanese/Somali/Pakistani descent have returned to their respective countries for Jihad?

Fortification of club houses is another wording to enable public conditioning that motorcycle clubs are inherently criminal. In response, to one of our club houses burgled our local police called clubhouse security improvements ‘crime prevention through environmental design (CPTED), thats right the police did the assessment, made the recommendations due to the valued items in the club house. Yes it was another state.

Police interdictions via traffic stops started as a hindrance and now its nothing more than harrassment. The idea of profiling is an abomination and due to the number of stops we just carry a camera and record the event.

Grim Repears Motorcycle Club

dave says:

10:44pm | 03/06/09

Mike if we are going to ban bikies, can we ban War Criminals like George Bush coming to Sydney for APEC etc? And ban Labor associating with War Crims that make bikies look like apprentice bashers, torturers and ....

rob says:

08:17am | 04/06/09

Lets hope that Mike Rann changes a few laws and pursues the McGee brothers as hard as he had the outlaw bikies

Dave says:

10:05am | 04/06/09

Can’t we be spending public money in a better way e.g lowering the road toll. Speed camera locations are a joke in lowering the road toll. Can someone tell me when the last time we had multiple fatalities on Jeffcott Street, North Adelaide or Trimmer Parade, Seaton.  Get serious with more important issues like the road toll and the Murray River problems that are causing more damage to the community

lorraine of Adelaide says:

01:08pm | 04/06/09

This new law is ridiculas, if this is the way it’s gonna be then it should also apply to football clubs golf clubs netball clubs and so forth, no one can tell me theres no organised crime in these clubs, as you always hear about bad footballers. Doesnt this association law and the rest stand for all people in a club. The way i see it the goverment are just after votes, the public me included have heard more about bikies in and seen them more in the media in the last year then in my 40 year life span. I have never been affraid of these gangs like the goverment the police and media tell us that we are, Ive even had there club rooms in our neighbour hood. Not once was any one intimidated or scared. its just what the goverment and media want you to belive, I see it as the rounding up of the jews. Mr Rann and any of you others out there i will not repeat will not be voting in your barbaric thoughts or laws. Here’s a thought with all this money your making out of this you should have a task force to target all the pedophiles in this state as there are more of them than bikies. Aim for the low lives in this state that prey on the innocent children and clean up Adelaide once and for all.

Tim says:

06:14pm | 04/06/09

Fantastic work Mr Premier. ‘1%er’ motorcycle clubs represent the worst of our society. They are not just motorcycle clubs, they are heinous organised crime associations. Don’t let these thugs run our State. Their criminal activities should not be allowed to go on and their criminal associations should not be allowed to operate.

Carlos says:

06:23pm | 04/06/09

Please… You all have absoluetly no idea what you are talking about. Your civil libertarian approach is flawed.

These criminals make a mockery of our legal system. They can easily avoid prosecution as individuals by banding together as an organisation and intimidating their way out of the legal system. Therefore, the government has taken the correct stance and instead of targeting individuals, they target the group.

The comments relating to organised crime in our football and netball clubs and comparing them to bikie gangs is fanciful nonsense and does nothing but demonstrate the ignorance of the people in this blog. You people are being sold a puppy by the defence solicitors and have taken it hook, line and sinker.

Open your eyes, wake up and realise that we live in a society in which the criminal element is evolving and becoming smarter. Our legislators need to do the same and these laws are doing just that. They are tackling the problem at its source. By ridding society of the groups, then it will allow our police to more effectively tackle the criminal element within the individual.

If any of you feel that I am way off here and that your views still apply, I encourage you to speak with the people who fall victim to bikie gangs, or visit a drug rehabilitation centre and see the flow on effect of crime gangs running rampant in our society. Either that, get out of your offices or off your couches and sign up, don a police unform and take to the streets so as to open your eyes. And to the minority persons in these groups that do not have extensive criminal histories, there is an old saying that you should live by…. “You lie with the dogs, you get fleas.”

Markus says:

06:28pm | 04/06/09

There is that many negative comments in here that I think the Premier is writing under the name of “Tim”

If the comments continue to question Media Mike any longer I feel that this blog may be shut down.

johannes says:

08:13pm | 04/06/09

Carlos, anyone breaks the law they should be punished. Some of us club members are ex police, ex army, ex victims, rehabilitated ex drug users, businessmen, fathers you name we have it.

The discussion here is that this great country was founded on common law. Over the centuries the law has been enlarged and includes new acts, statutes and case law. The ultimate question of guilt in all criminal proceeding is provision of ‘burden of proof’. Now these new laws have changed burden of proof to to ‘balance of probabilities’ . And this without the accused person or his lawyer nor the public knowing the details of the evidence. With that there is a control order not to associate and contraveners get jail time. Were is the criminal act or the evidence for a potential crime or a crime.

Therefore, take out the emotions out of this and look at the laws details for what they are; which is an affront to the legal system.

Grim Reapers Motorcycle Club

http://www.myspace.com/australianmc

harold says:

09:26pm | 04/06/09

Carlos you poor misguided soul you are the one that has been taken hook line and sinker by politicians who are driven by there own self interests.Biker this Biker that, deficit what defecit unemployment what unemployment theres nothing wrong with our public transport system or our public hospitals and we all Know we dont have a problem with mental health .WAKE UP - this government is all smoke and mirrors.

Steve Bilko says:

01:25am | 05/06/09

Mike before you start sprouting facts and figures, lets take a look a the “legal system” Governments, and what that has sanctified in the past and even still today!
Lets look at the millions of people killed in wars caused by the cowardly, greedy polititians who start them, lets look at the rapes that occur, and the theft, the bashing of innocents by police and invading forces, the list goes on and on! Maybe before you put your mouth into gear you should look at the things that the government really supports, for the record of the law makers is far from untarnished with abuse of human rights and civil liberties.

lorraine says:

01:57pm | 05/06/09

For dear miss guided Carlos, I do know what goes on while on the streets as i was a street kid from the age of 12 till i turned 18, and yes there was drugs and it was mostly supplied by wealthy people, eg buisness men and woman, who like to prey on the least fortunate.  You must live in a fantasy world if you think its not rife in football clubs and other sports or its because your a footy head. you really should go out into the real world and realise bikies are not to blame for all the drugs that come into this state. As this state allows so many migrants in im sure you will find they bring it here alot of the time to. People need to stop blaming the bikies for everything as there not all crims.I think theres more crims in pollitics.

Bran Jenkin says:

11:56pm | 19/06/09

It’s amusing to see the states focusing on Bikie gangs and taking a tough stance,  ( laughable ), when for years, decades Actually,  ethnic gang crime and violence has been a major problem in cities all over Australia, and the state governments are too weak gutted to make any attempt to focus on them in fear of the political backlash they would have to endure, including the racist claims. These Groups affect everyone with criminal activities, drugs, indiscriminate violent acts including many rapes and indecent acts., armed robberies carjackings ect ect. In general, we are all at risk of being touched one way or another, The bikies on the other hand fight amongst themselves, and sure they’re involved with drugs and are violent but this all seems to take place from time to not all the time without involving ordinary folk. So why target the bikies. Doesn’t make sense. There is a lot more going on than meets the eye. It’s all about control and undermining our rights little by little. It’s a shame Australia didn’t settle the dispute about rights earlier on in the piece like the yanks did when they had their civil war, but I guess it’s never too late. Apparently Australians are covered by the rights set out by the Royals a couple of hundred years ago, set out by William of Orange or something that states that the people, that’s us, have the right to bare arms in equivalence to those in use by the militia.  You know them stun guns, glocks and Austeyrs? Yep that’s right. These rights were given after people fought for them to ensure the people would be protected and able to defend themselves from tyrants and oppressive governments. Look it up. It may be coming to this.

dave says:

04:21am | 20/06/09

Gawd! Media Mike has followers in NSW Labor? Thats all we need is basketcase Labor leaders with the tough wid-us-or-against-us Dubbya-speak. Please confine the dictator flu to the hillbilly state of South Oz! Now.  The banks are thieving *daily* from families & small business -whose going take them on? Not Mike!

scott morrison says:

08:00am | 02/07/09

after 30yrs in west aust,iwas deported to scotland under the immigrations 201 act.it has all the same characteristics ie,villification,comments regarding associates .all written by police,no right of appeal.bang,tasered,cuffed,on a plane within 5hrs.hi mum,sisters,cousins,nieces+nephews.fight a corrupt system and they have the power.scottmorrison708@btinternet.com

Buckets says:

10:38am | 17/07/09

History will judge you and your ilk very badly Mr Rann. These laws are not “Anti-bikie” laws, no matter how often you tell that lie, for the words bikie do not appear in the legislation at all. So I am calling this a bald faced lie. They are however laws that inhibit the freedom of association. Mr Rann, you disgust me and I am disgusted that the people of this country have become so meek and timid that we allow this to happen… I am ashamed of my country.

As for the ridiculous NSW Government, they are no better… I would be interested to see how many politicians have a criminal record and could be affected by these “laws”...

brian says:

11:49pm | 18/07/09

what has ruined the bike culture in recent years is this the old skool were filthy an were out numbered to let these arabs or lebs in an now the ol skool is paying the price for what the nieve have done ,i hope freedom is not sacrificed here because these arabs have forced the goverment to act this way ,even though they them selves no its not write,we have all been sold out by goverment in the 70s this is what multiculturalism has achieved