You don’t have to oppose uranium mining to oppose exports to nuclear-armed India. All it takes is a strong desire not to have an atomic bomb dropped on your head ... or anyone else’s.

Anyway, who needs nukes when you've got vindaloo?

Thus critics of the plan to sell to India include uranium mining advocates Ron Walker, a former Australian diplomat and former Chair of the International Atomic Energy Agency; Paul Barratt, former Secretary of the Defence Department; and Kelvin Thomson, a member of Labor’s Right faction and Chair of Parliament’s treaties committee.

The main concern is that India has not signed, and will not sign, the Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT). Needless to say, that sets an alarming precedent. If the response to the India’s nuclear weapons program is to reward it with sales of uranium and nuclear technology, then others are sure to follow.

The claim that India can be treated as a ‘special case’ has already gone down the gurgler with China using that precedent to justify the supply of more reactors to Pakistan – another nuclear weapons state outside the NPT.

Some argue that Australia should sell uranium to India because the US and handful of other countries have gone down that path. That’s the drug dealer’s defence. A large majority of the world’s countries oppose nuclear trade with countries that refuse to sign the NPT – it is a long-standing principle and it has undoubtedly helped to curb proliferation.

Of course, it’s a big ask to require India to dismantle its nuclear arsenal as a condition for uranium exports. But disarmament is not without precedent. South Africa gave up its nuclear weapons, as did three ex-Soviet states – Belarus, Ukraine, and Kazakhstan. There are other relevant historical precedents including numerous aborted nuclear arms races; Argentina and Brazil, for example, agreed to abandon their pursuit of nuclear weapons in the late 1980s.

Plan B would be to require India to curb – but not immediately abandon – its nuclear weapons program. The logical conditions would be an end to the production of fissile material for weapons; signing and ratifying the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty; and an end to India’s development and testing of nuclear-capable missiles.

But Julia Gillard and Martin Ferguson want to pursue the third of those two options – uranium sales to India with no conditions whatsoever. They are surrendering to the bullying and belligerence of India’s military and nuclear hawks. Two spineless, gutless politicians who frequently congratulate themselves on taking tough’ decisions.

We like to think of Australia as a responsible middle power punching above our weight on nuclear non-proliferation, but now we’re being asked to endorse uranium sales to a country which is every bit as culpable as its neighbours in fanning the South Asian nuclear arms race. And to do so with no reciprocal conditions on India whatsoever.

We like to think of Australia as a responsible middle power punching above our weight on nuclear non-proliferation, yet we rely on and actively support the nuclear weapons program of the US; we fan proliferation risks and tensions in North-East Asia by allowing Japan to stockpile plutonium; we may soon be fanning the nuclear arms race in South Asia; and, for good measure, plans are already in train to sell uranium to at least one undemocratic Middle Eastern state – the United Arab Emirates – with more to come. We were planning uranium sales to the Shah of Iran months before his overthrow in 1979.

Kevin Rudd has warned repeatedly of the fracturing of the nuclear non-proliferation regime. He should know – he has been fracturing it by supporting all of the above policies either as Prime Minister or Foreign Minister. The day before Gillard’s announcement on India, secret Defence Department documents were released revealing that Rudd privately urged the US to preserve a ‘‘reliable’’ and ‘‘credible’’ nuclear arsenal. No pressure on the US to abide by its disarmament obligations under the NPT. No worries, mate. My name’s Kevin and I’m here to help fracture the non-proliferation regime.

Australia has sometimes been called a White Knight of nuclear non-proliferation; now the term is being used with heavy sarcasm.

How to turn things around? Public opinion is solid – two-thirds of Australians oppose uranium sales to nuclear weapons states, three-quarters believe nuclear disarmament should be a top priority, and most believe (with good reason) that the safeguards system is ineffective.

But that opinion isn’t reflected in parliament and it isn’t reflected in the media. Why is it that the politicians can trot out disingenuous and dishonest arguments without being held to account? Take the argument about the ‘hypocrisy’ of selling to undemocratic China but not to democratic India. Isn’t that an argument to rethink uranium sales to undemocratic China – all the more so since it is flouting its NPT disarmament obligations and jailing nuclear whistle-blowers? Is it too much to ask of the media to at least put those questions to the politicians?

Strict safeguards? Safeguards in China are tokenistic, safeguards in Russia (another customer country) are very nearly non-existent, and safeguards in India will be either tokenistic or non-existent. The International Atomic Energy Agency has neither the resources nor the inclination to seriously apply safeguards in nuclear weapons states.

So why don’t journalists challenge politicicans when they trot out the lie about “strict” safeguards “ensuring” peaceful use of our uranium exports?

Michelle Grattan thought it was a great idea to sell uranium to China because it had signed the relevant agreements; now she thinks it’s a great idea to sell to India though it hasn’t signed the relevant agreements. Go figure. Greg Sheridan can’t see what all the fuss is about since strict safeguards would apply in India as they do in China and Russia. The Murdoch-Fairfax two-paper duopoly is as dangerous and damaging to Australia’s national interest – and to the billions living in the shadow of the South Asian nuclear arms race – as the two-party duopoly.

All the media think we’re going to make $1,700 million annually by selling uranium to India, which means we’re going to supply India with its entire uranium demand 19 times over – fancy that! Try $20 million, a 0.007 percent increase in national export revenue.

So there we have it – government and industry lies repeated ad nauseum with little or no scrutiny, and precious little understanding or explanation of the very serious proliferation issues at stake.

As Ron Walker recently said: “I am horrified that the media have not explained the enormity of this proposal.” And he’s pro-uranium.

Dr Jim Green is the national nuclear campaigner with Friends of the Earth and author of a detailed briefing paper on uranium sales to India (www.choosenuclearfree.net/india).

62 comments

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    • Erick says:

      04:57am | 01/12/11

      Another hysterical anti-nuke rant from the radical greens. Colour me not surprised.

      India is threatened by a nuclear-armed China on one side and a nuclear-armed Pakistan on the other. There is no way it will ever give up its nukes.

      If anything, we should ask India for help in developing our own nuclear weapons and nuclear power industry. The coming global crisis will be a period when a nation rich in resources but poor in population will need a deterrent.

      Rudd’s infantile decision to cancel uranium sales to India was one of the most stupid things he did in government, and cost us dearly both in money and in international standing.

    • Mahhrat says:

      07:41am | 01/12/11

      I noted a little racism in the picture, too.  What the hell does vindaloo have to do with anything?

    • mick says:

      07:59am | 01/12/11

      Another hysterical rant from a liberal party member. 

      Giving radical nations uranium is like giving morons guns.  Its only a matter of time before they use them.

      Nuclear power?  Perhaps those who advocate this the worst of all power options need the waste buried in their own back yards.  With a (radioactive) half life of around 25 000 years this is a never to go away toxic and deadly mess.  Nobody needs it.  Nobody deserves it.

    • MarkS says:

      08:25am | 01/12/11

      The NPT first of all begins with the basis that five states, the USA, Britain, France, China & Russia are allowed nukes & nobody else is. Those five promise that they will get rid of their nukes one day. But they do not mean it & nobody believes them. They also promise not to help other nations gain nukes, but will help nations with civil nuclear programs.

      Everybody else who signed The NPT agrees that they will not try to gain nukes in return for getting help with their civil nuclear programs.

      So is the biggest threat of nuclear weapon proliferation from nations that have not signed the NPT. Noooo! France & China in particular have a nasty history of selling nuclear weapon knowhow. Pakistan who acquired nukes with Chinese help, was for a while a big player in selling nuclear weapon knowhow to anybody. Israel & South Africa cooperated together in relation to making nukes, with French & some USA help. Britain was involved in the fifties in assisting Australia when we wanted nukes, until the Yanks put their foot down.

      Other nations have a history of joining the NPT, then developing or trying to develop nukes anyway, North Korea, Libya & Iran.

      So has India, a nation that has fought wars with both nuclear armed neighbours Pakistan & China been involved in nuclear weapon proliferation, Noooo! In fact India is the only nuclear armed nation that has never helped anybody to gain nuclear weapon knowhow.

      So because they are the only honest player, the Greens wish to punish them. Makes sense I guess, liars always hate truthful people. If we wish to not sell uranium to nuclear weapon states involved in proliferation we should only sell to India.

      The dangerous hypocrisy is those who refuse to sell to India on the grounds of stopping nuclear proliferation.

    • TimB says:

      09:11am | 01/12/11

      India is a ‘radical nation’ now Mick?

      Speaking of morons….

    • AdamC says:

      09:57am | 01/12/11

      MarkS wins comment of the day!

      Seriously, the slogan-dependent ‘Brownouts’ (my pet name for leftties in the Bob Brown mould) act as if India has refused to sign the NPT out of obstinacy alone. The reality, of course, is that the Indians could not come into the NPT club without relinquishing the very reason they would seek to enter it - their nuclear weapons programme. But because the ridiculousness of the NPT detracts from the Brownouts’ position, they deliberately ignore it.

      By the bizarre logic of the Brownouts, Australia could sell uranium to increasingly belligerent known proliferators like China and Russia, simply because they dishonestly put their signature on a document which they have systematically undermined and ignored. See, in Brownout-land, you reward dishonesty and censure and sanction honesty. Go figure.

    • remlap says:

      11:01am | 01/12/11

      India is an “honest player”? Comedy gold!
      Oh wait… You were serious?

    • marley says:

      11:19am | 01/12/11

      @remlap - in the context of passing on nuclear weapons technology to other countries, yes, I’d say India is an honest country.  Better than the Chinese, the North Koreans and the Russians, anyway.

    • n_dude says:

      11:58am | 01/12/11

      Why hasn’t Jim Green mentioned not selling uranium to China? Despite the fact that they have been happy to proliferate knowledge to develop nuclear arms to other nations. The fact is, as India has rightly pointe out, the NPT is not effectively enforced and if they sign it could put them in a vulnerable position given their neghbours.

      BTW india has a stable democracy and their parliament has legislated that they will only use nuclear arms in self defence. I would trust India’s system of government more than I would China’s or Pakistan’s..

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      05:20pm | 01/12/11

      Erick,
      Rudd’s decision to stop sales of Uranium was not ” one of the most stupid things he did”
      Every bloody thing he did was stupid.
      Every bloody thing his Usurper, Julia Gillard, has done has been stupid.
      Neither know how to speak English in the first place for neither can pronounce any words longer that one syllable & when they do try they stuff that up too.
      We may have been sick & tired of Little John but the biggest most stupid mistake was made by us, the voters. We voted this clown & clowness into office so we have only ourselves to blame.
      I always pressed the ” Mute” button whenever Rudd opened his mouth.
      It took about one sentence from Gillard to start doing so every time she opened her mouth.

    • Caroline says:

      07:51am | 02/12/11

      @AdamC - it’s a bit rich you criticising the Greens for inventing slogans, when you yourself seem so proud of your own cute label, the Brownouts. Neither you or @n_dude read this opinion piece properly, missing the part where Jim Green DOES advocate not selling to China and Russia: “Isn’t that an argument to rethink uranium sales to undemocratic China – all the more so since it is flouting its NPT disarmament obligations and jailing nuclear whistle-blowers? Is it too much to ask of the media to at least put those questions to the politicians? Strict safeguards? Safeguards in China are tokenistic, safeguards in Russia (another customer country) are very nearly non-existent, and safeguards in India will be either tokenistic or non-existent.”

    • acotrel says:

      05:14am | 01/12/11

      If you want to see what the rest of the world could look like in a hundred years from now, look at India.  It is one of the last countries that should be involved with a technology with so much potential to destroy our environment.  The way forward must be to control population by educating the current lot.  It seems that is the only way population is stabilised and amortised.  Nuclear energy might be a quick fix for energy needs, but it simply fuels the population time bomb in India.  If the theory behind climate change is correct, the combination of India and China in full industrial swing will kill the planet. To extrapolate the industrial revolution to infinity is stupid, it is unsustainable regardless of nuclear power or anything else.

    • Super D says:

      06:02am | 01/12/11

      But aco, We have a carbon tax to save us from global warminin.  Surely you’re not suggesting that in the face of Chinese and Indian industrialisation our tax won’t save us?  Surely you’re not suggesting that they won’t be moving forward with us into a clean energy future?

    • acotrel says:

      06:53am | 01/12/11

      @SuperD
      Australia is probably the country most affected by global warming. At least by putting a price on carbon we have the moral high ground, and can justify lobbying the World Trade Organisation to have ISO14000 Environmental Management Systems, made part of the Free Trade Agreements.  International Standards should not be barriers to trade, but the playing fied has never really been ‘level’ while Australian companies work under legislation which requires them to be ethical, and the third world behave like GRUBS.
      This globalisation thing is really a lot of bullshit.  There is an Australian Standard for OHS Management Systems.  The yanks opposed development of the similar International Standard at great expense to themselves.  So the Free Market and Globalisation are fundamentally disingenuous, and we will always be disadvantaged while we stick to our standards of human behaviour in our workplaces.
      The ploy of crushing the unioins, bringing down wages and conditions to the lowest common denominator might work well under a communist government, and that’s where the conservatives are heading.  It will be overt authoritarianism in the name of capitalism ! - Nazism !

    • TimB says:

      07:09am | 01/12/11

      Silly Acotrel. If India and China are powered entirely by nuclear power, then their contribution to any potential climate change issue is vastly reduced. It’d be a *good* thing.

      “To extrapolate the industrial revolution to infinity is stupid”

      So what’s your idea? Stop progress? Freeze our civilisation where it is?

      Or perhaps you back the Greens view and think we’re all better off back in caves eating alfalfa sprouts?

    • TimB says:

      07:13am | 01/12/11

      This posted whilst I was writing my other comment:

      “At least by putting a price on carbon we have the moral high ground”

      This is the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard.And unfortunately it seems to be the core argument for carbon pricing.

      Newsflash: The general public is not going to give a shit about the moral highground if the economy gets kneecapped. The moral high ground doesn’t pay the bills.

      And the rest of your comment is just babble.

    • Nick says:

      07:19am | 01/12/11

      actorel,where is the evidence that Australia is most affected by climate change? We have had drought and floods more severe than recent ones since pre settlement so I am not sure what affects you are referring to.And what is it with you and your leftist comrades when it comes to symbolic gestures and posturing the high moral ground.Its all about you and yourselves feeling warm and fuzzy isn’t it?Trouble is reality doesn’t see it your way.Just ask the Aboriginals how much their life changed after Rudd said sorry on your behalf. Keep on dreaming!

    • acotrel says:

      08:27am | 01/12/11

      @Nick
      ‘Just ask the Aboriginals how much their life changed after Rudd said sorry on your behalf. Keep on dreaming! ‘

      Ever since the Wik decision our pollies have been paranoid about the aborigines rights - none more so than John Howard.  Kevin Rudd was right to offer the apology.  It would not be smart to force the issue on the rights of the aborigines, they just might win full title to the whole of Australia.

    • Anubis says:

      08:38am | 01/12/11

      @ Acotrel - “Australia is probably the country most affected by global warming” Please provide peer reviewed references to support this statement of yours. We are probably one of the countries most affected by the La Nina/El Nino cycle but by Global warming? please explain, particularly now that we have the Earth saving, super duper Carbon Tax to protect the world.

    • acotrel says:

      08:47am | 01/12/11

      @TimB and Erick
      Australia should stay away from nuclear power generation.  Our industrial system and our politics run on bullshit - anybody over forty knows that.  We cannot afford to be disingenuous with such a serious technology.  The Japanese have had a disaster at Fukushima, and they would have to be the most seriously self-disciplined people on the planet !

    • marley says:

      09:48am | 01/12/11

      @Acotrel - you don’t know a damn thing about India, do you?  You think India is our future?  Hell no, it’s our past - what life was like pre-industrial revolution.

      You’re sitting here comfortably in first-world Australia, with all the advantages brought to us by two centuries of development and industrialization, and demanding that we deny the Indians and the Chinese the same prospects. Classic case of “I’m all right, Jack.”

      And whether we like it or not, India will industrialize and modernize.  It will be a lot better for the environment if it uses nuclear power and not coal to do that.

      As for the exploding Indian population, India’s fertility rate is around 2.6 these days, down from around 6 a half century ago.  If you want to see it drop further, you support the development of India, because with prosperity comes education and with that, fewer children.

    • Shama says:

      11:59am | 01/12/11

      “It is one of the last countries that should be involved with a technology with so much potential to destroy our environment.”

      @acotrel, India is a country that is like Europe as a country-and still holding it together for several decades now.  Its population (and development statistics) vary from state to state.  It is very much a democracy - with a vocal anti-nuclear lobby. To then call it a country that should not somehow be “trusted” is ignorant. Also I fail to see how nuclear energy can “fuel” a population time bomb.

      It just looks like you are on an anti-industrial revolution rant.

      As for only the right sort of people having access to uranium, this reeks of hyprocricy and a bit of racism, I mean if you are Palestinian would you “trust” Israel with the bomb? It is all relative.

    • Against the Man says:

      12:20pm | 01/12/11

      agree with marley’s comment.


      acotrel is doing a great job for the LNP cause!

    • Don says:

      12:35pm | 01/12/11

      The most effective way to reduce popultion is not through education and government programs I am afraid. In fact lets see if you can join the dots on this one - take a look at all the fertility rates for the various countries. Although I am not a population scientist I think I see a trend there, the more prosperous a country the lower the fertility rate. In fact, the richest countries are actually going backwards in population, I think Japans population is in net decline as of 2005.

    • michael j says:

      12:49pm | 01/12/11

      @acotrel-indeed your comment makes a lot more sense then the authors India has nuclear bombs as do heaps of other countries,with our big brother having the most ,,and i hope they are keeping up with the maintenance program and not shitcanning it because of budget cuts,be all the planet needs ,no-one checking the spark-plugs because of a lack of money,,can India build a better and more powerful nuke than they already have ,probably not ,,besides they are very good friends with us ,,i have no fear of their nuclear weapons and neither should Australia ,,

    • Willie Mac says:

      01:12pm | 01/12/11

      And acotroll breaks Godwin’s Law in just his second comment, setting a new record. I stopped reading his posts right there.

    • Against the Man says:

      05:44am | 01/12/11

      I think PM Bob Brown will sort it all out. Relax Dr Green, Juliar is just doing one of her high horse distraction tactics. Be up in arms about Australian deaths associated with the home insulation debacle and failed ALP health care reform.

    • Against the Man says:

      12:05pm | 01/12/11

      Ok nossy…...you do realise people aren’t going to be happy to see the old bird Gillard get a pay rise after doing a crap job and giving us a carbon tax plus Swany’s budget cuts? You see nossy, you do my job for me. Thanks for highlighting this point smile

      More people becoming anti-Gillard/ALP beacuse of nossy? Sounds good to me!

    • Against the Man says:

      01:45pm | 01/12/11

      Ooops!

      Yahoo poll:
      Q. Do our federal MPs deserve a pay rise?
      95 % say No! (at 14:45)

      http://au.news.yahoo.com/polls/popup/-/poll_id/64077

      And apparently since No is TA’s favourite word, it looks like there are lots of Abbott fans out there! Thanks nossy, you really made my day!

    • nossy says:

      03:03pm | 01/12/11

      @Against the Man   your a delightful old fart ATM and we will all miss you dearly when Labor wins the 2013 election and you depart the blog as you said you would. I myself implore you to stay as we will then have to look to winning the 2016 election and we need all the ammo we can get - and you Sir are worth a thousand rounds at least!  hahahah P.S. I see Dr NO hasnt said BOO about the $71,000 he gets to just keep saying NO - money for jam ATM. cheers my good friend - give em heaps!

    • Flexo says:

      07:04am | 01/12/11

      How bizarre! Julia Gillard goes from one failed policy to the carbon tax to another failed policy to selling uranium to India? Even ALP MPs like Stephen Jones are saying this is not on. Australia deserves a better PM who will not waste our time, money or reputation!

    • Willie Mac says:

      01:15pm | 01/12/11

      After reading your comment, I am convinced that the politicians need to sink several billion dollars extra into adult education programmes.

    • TimB says:

      07:18am | 01/12/11

      “The Murdoch-Fairfax two-paper duopoly is as dangerous and damaging to Australia’s national interest “

      Well I have to give you credit. Usually this sort of comment is restricted to an anti-News Ltd rant. But you brought Fairfax in on this. Interesting.

      Regardless, the solution is still the same: Don’t like it? Start your own media outlet. That why we have a free press after all.

      Also. I hope that the irony of complaing about the Murdoch press as you use a News Ltd owned blog to push your view isn’t lost on you.

    • Adam Diver says:

      09:02am | 01/12/11

      “Also. I hope that the irony of complaing about the Murdoch press as you use a News Ltd owned blog to push your view isn’t lost on you. “

      Judging by the “logic” in the rest of his articles, methinks it might be.

      Although it talk all my effort to get past the first line:

      “You don’t have to oppose uranium mining to oppose exports to nuclear-armed India”

      Unfortunately for the author we don’t have a monopoly on uranium, so any moral grandstanding is realitically pointless, and economically hurtful. But the moral high ground (as acetrol alludes) is the sole objective of the left, if only feeling smug could power the planet.

    • tooltime says:

      09:20am | 01/12/11

      *sigh*
      Timmie doesn’t get it - again

    • TimB says:

      09:33am | 01/12/11

      *sigh*

      Badger is a tool. Again.

    • Mahhrat says:

      07:44am | 01/12/11

      The only hypocrisy in selling uranium in India is that we’re not developing our own nuclear industry.

      The other hypocrisy is that you’re sitting in your white tower dictating to people of lower socio-economic backgrounds as to how to live their lives.

      These people need energy, pure and simple.  With it, they can build better lives.  With better lives comes a balance of conservative and progressive values - most importantly the value of life - and a cultural committment to value not only one’s own life, but the lives of others.

    • Shane says:

      08:36am | 01/12/11

      I agree. The government just want the taxes from selling uranium to anyone who’s willing to fork out for it, regardless of what treaties have or haven’t been signed. They’ve promised a surplus to the stooges that voted them in remember?? *sigh*

      The revenue from this needs to be going into development of nuclear power for Australia to slowly replace coal fired power plants. It would take decades, but would make a bigger impact on emissions than carbon taxing.

      We already have the Open-Pool lightwater reactor for research, surely seeing as that things been running (almost) non stop for 4 years we’ve learnt a few things. Between our local experts and INVAP in Argentina who built it, we could get a reactor running as a trial and have it powering a University somewhere?

      At the end of the day, we have no right to dictate to India how they live their lives. In that region, I’d rather trust India to do the right thing with our uranium than China or Pakistan. India need our uranium for energy even more than China need our steel and I’d rather see Australia partner up with them than a communist regime. Plus, maybe they’d stop ringing us during dinner if we got along better :-p

    • Michael says:

      09:12am | 01/12/11

      Australia should also store nuclear waste if we are profiting from selling Uranium, a conscientious cycle of production and disposal isn’t too much to ask is it?

      We could grow industries to become clean energy experts, not tax the shit out of our dirty selves and hope the pain forces us to clean up our act, and serve as an example to others of what to avoid.

      Positive reinforcement as opposed to negative reinforcement.

    • acotrel says:

      08:35am | 01/12/11

      Mahrat I was once asked to apply for a job in the nuclear industry.  Even though it was very well paid, I chose not to go there.  You never know what you might end up carrying the can for.
      From my experience with managing intractable waste, it is my opinion that the nuclear industry is a quantum leap which considering our old Australian mindset would spell disaster.

    • Anubis says:

      12:35pm | 01/12/11

      @ Acotrel - you say “From my experience with managing intractable waste”

      Would that be managing the bile that spots from your keyboard every day. i could see how that would be difficult

    • Alf says:

      08:41am | 01/12/11

      Forget the ethical debate, Gillard is only interested in the tax revenue that uranium can earn.

    • subotic says:

      08:42am | 01/12/11

      Team Australia - World Police… you will stop NOTHING!!!

      If they don’t get it off us thru the front door, they’ll get it off us thru the back door.

      Bring it all on. India. China. Iran. Pakistan. Give them all the bomb, and let them blow themselves up to kingdom come. I encourage it!

      Maybe then we can all get some peace…

    • Zaf says:

      09:17am | 01/12/11

      If you’re actually worried about proliferation, then perhaps a more honest yardstick about whether to sell uranium to a country or not is whether that country has actually ever been responsible for giving or selling nuclear technology/products to rogue states.

      How did North Korea, for example, get nuclear technology and material?  From India?  Or from a country that had signed the NPT?

      Also, fwiw:

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_Non-Proliferation_Treaty#History

      India is one of the few countries to have a no first use policy, a pledge not to use nuclear weapons unless first attacked by an adversary using nuclear weapons.[31] India’s External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee said during a visit to Tokyo in 2007: “If India did not sign the NPT, it is not because of its lack of commitment for non-proliferation, but because we consider NPT as a flawed treaty and it did not recognise the need for universal, non-discriminatory verification and treatment.”

    • dancan says:

      09:57am | 01/12/11

      If the Non-Proliferation Treaty is so difficult to enforce, and you have the belief that its rules and regulations are more show than substance and that countries who are already signatories flaunt their disregard of these regulations, why does it matter so much that India signs up before we sell to them?

    • Kassandra says:

      11:56am | 01/12/11

      I can’t see any logical connection between selling uranium to India and supposedly increasing the risk of nuclear weapons being used. India already has nuclear weapons. They have to be one of the least likely nations on earth to use them unless attacked first by a more belligerent nuclear-armed neighbour, of which they have two, which is precisely why they developed nukes themselves. Civilian nuclear power reactors don’t produce weapons-grade fissile material so their civilian nuclear power programme will not increase the stockpile of nuclear weapons they have. India does not supply other states, particularly rogue states like Iran and North Korea, with nuclear material or expertise, so how will it contribute to nuclear proliferation? India not being a signatory to the the Non-Proliferation Treaty is not a credible reason - there is no reason whatsoever to regard India as at risk of adding further to proliferation unlike some of the signatories. The whole argument seems to me to be nonsensical and based on an irrational fear of uranium and anything nuclear.

    • marley says:

      01:17pm | 01/12/11

      @Kassandra - one argument I’ve heard against this is that selling uranium to India for their nuclear power program will free up their own limited uranium reserves for their weapons program.  Somehow, the same logic doesn’t appear to apply to sales to China.

    • Adam says:

      01:30pm | 01/12/11

      Kassandra,
      It’s all here, from K. Subrahmanyam, former head of the Indian National Security Advisory Board, himself:

      “Given India’s uranium ore crunch and the need to build up [India’s] nuclear deterrent arsenal as fast as possible, it is to India’s advantage to categorise as many power reactors as possible as civilian ones to be refuelled by imported uranium and conserve our native uranium fuel for weapons grade plutonium production.”

    • Kassandra says:

      02:39pm | 01/12/11

      @ marley and Adam:

      OK that’s reasonable as far as it goes, but why wouldn’t they use their domestic uranium for that purpose anyway if it is so important. In that case the imported supply would mainly affect the activity of the civilian reactor programme. In any event it still doesn’t necessarily influence the likelihood of a nuclear conflict though which is what the author of this article is asserting. I agree about the hypocrisy of the stance regarding China.

    • marley says:

      04:06pm | 01/12/11

      @Kassandra - I don’t think anyone has made a credible argument that uranium sold by us will somehow end up in the Indian weapons program.  Rather, it would just enable them to keep their own, rather scanty, reserves for a “rainy day” so to speak.

      They probably don’t need a lot for that - they just need enough nukes to keep Pakistan and China from thinking twice about invading.  Whether we sell them uranium or not, they have enough nukes now to do some serious damage should anyone be so stupid.

      On the other hand, India needs far more than its own reserves can provide to run its nuclear power program, and hence their desire to buy from us, the Canadians and anyone else who will supply. 

      I see no reason to believe that India will sell nukes or nuke weapons technology to anyone else, and I see no reason to think they’ll be any less reliable than NPT countries when it comes to their own weapons program (not that that’s saying much).  And I don’t particularly see why they’re more likely to start a nuclear war than their immediate neighbours.

    • Adam says:

      12:52pm | 01/12/11

      Well said, Jim.

      Only thing I’d add is that India’s 8 reactors kept exclusively for military use (under the US-India agreement) are not subject to IAEA inspections anyway - even IF they were to happen. Irrefutable evidence of being complicit in a nuclear arms which risks everything we have, and have ever fought to protect.

    • marley says:

      01:32pm | 01/12/11

      @Adam - not sure what your point is.  Everyone knows India has nukes.  So does China.  So do the USA and Russia and France.  So why is India a bigger threat than any of the others, exactly?

    • Adam says:

      01:43pm | 01/12/11

      Marley, to oppose uranium sales to India is not to endorse same to other nuclear nations. This particular issue is that of uranium sales to India. Your question in addressing this debate is what’s known as a logical fallacy.
      But for a direct answer to your question: Kashmir.

    • marley says:

      02:39pm | 01/12/11

      @Adam - which logical fallacy are you accusing me of?  Because I don’t see one.

      Read the first sentence of the article. “You don’t have to oppose uranium mining to oppose exports to nuclear-armed India. ”  The author is arguing that we mustn’t sell to India, and that maybe we need to rethink our other nuclear sales at some point as well.  But why is India to be treated differently from all our other customers?  If we’re going to ban sales to India, ban them to China (which has already flogged weapons technology to other countries) and France (ditto) and the US. 

      If you yourself are going to argue that uranium sales are wrong because they will allow India to keep its own reserves for weapons, how can you justify selling to anyone else either?  The logic applies to all countries.

      As for Kashmir, sure, it’s a flashpoint.  So is Taiwan, the Korean DMZ, the whole of the Middle East,  and one helluva lot of other hotspots on earth.  Pakistan is a lot less likely to start yet another border war with India, knowing it has nukes, than if it only had to deal with conventional weapons.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      05:32pm | 01/12/11

      And just who was it who gave Israel their Nuclear Weapons?
      The F!#$%&g Hypocritical USA, that si who!
      By what possible right does the USA presume to stand in judgement of anyone when it comes to Nuclear Weapons, or anything else for that matter?
      By what possible right does Russia, the UK, France or anyone else presume to think they have the right to object, criticise, impose sanctions on any country because they might have, or are actually producing, Nuclear Weapons?
      They all have them in the 1000s
      If Iran China,, India, Pakistan, North Korea, (South Korea, thanks to the USA probably has had them for years) or anyone else decided they want to have them why shouldn’t they have them?
      We may not like it but we don’t hesitate to sell them the material needed to make them, do we??? Just who are the hypocrites?
      If we think it is OK to sell Uranium to one nation then it is OK for us to sell it to all nations.
      Just what Guarantee do we have that even if we sell out uranium to a signatory to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty that they will not use it to make Nuclear Weapons? There is no such guarantee.

 

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