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Alas poor bogan I knew him well

Keeva Stratton

by Keeva Stratton

25 Jan 05:42am

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Filed under: Australia Day, Bogans, Flags, Nationalism, Racism

65 comments

As we head towards yet another Australia Day, a lot is being raised and debated about how we see ourselves as a nation, as a people, and as a part of a global community. Tensions have arisen of late regarding topics of border security and the safety of foreigners on our shores.

That Chris Franklin guy who wrote that bogan song, he's not really dead.


But perhaps, most intriguingly, as an aside to these debates, there has been a strong suggestion that the Bogan identity, which has plagued Australians for decades, is no longer being worn as a badge of honour, but rather, and rightfully, as one of shame.

Could we finally be seeing the end to our redneck wonderland? Are Australians favouring intellect over yobbism, manners over crassness, compassion over blind patriotism? When articulated in these straightforward binaries, one can only wonder - why it has taken so long?

The Bogan community has been making some loud rumblings (or bloggings) of late; denying the racism in clearly racist attacks, demanding their flag waving is a display of national pride, not white pride, all while joining Facebook groups espousing ‘eff off we’re full’ - but alas, could these be the final screams of a crumbling empire?

Bogans see themselves as the victims of rising political correctness and leftist ideology - after all, they love their country, they’re protecting their way of life. Those who understand the theoretical underpinnings of hate crime will understand that it often originates from a form of love - a love of a culture or way of life, and inadvertently an often irrational fear that this culture is under threat. Racism stems from protectionism. Children are raised to fear the ‘other’, ensuring racism persists throughout the generations.

In Australia, this is all to often expressed through cries of ‘they’re taking our jobs’, ‘they’re crowding our cities’, ‘they’re draining our resources’, and even recently, ‘they’re out pricing the real estate market’. Who exactly are ‘they’? And, given that the majority of us descended from other lands (read: anyone who has arrived in the past 220 years), are we not they?

The sad byproduct of ousting Bogans has been the reductionist view that all white Australians are Bogans - and nothing could be further from the truth. A Bogan is not defined by liking a genre of music, dressing a certain way, or having a penchant for beer. No, a Bogan, plainly and simply, is a relic of our society who chooses to cling to hooligan type behaviour to express an exclusionist, uneducated opinion, which largely derives from fear - ie. ‘eff off we’re full’. 

For those who feel saddened by an association between flag waving and racism, you have unfortunately been let down by a minority who has established that relationship through acts such as those at Cronulla. But, thankfully, as the figure of the Bogan falters, it provides an opportune time for a new Australian identity to be formed. An identity we can all enjoy.

If Australians are to carry forward and defend our so-called intrinsic values of ‘picking up the fallen’, ‘looking after your mates’, and ‘being a laid back society’, then why aren’t we keen to embrace those who flee their homelands in clear need of our help, and those who are attacked on our shores, and why are we acting so uptight about any suggestion that we are, as all cultures are and accept to some degree, racist?

Though many of us (lefties perhaps) dream of a day when we are a Republic, when we change the date of Australia Day to one that doesn’t evoke memories of an invasion, and a day when we have a flag that is not emblematic of a white Australia, for now I’d be just thrilled if we could agree as a society that we are better than prejudice and fear-mongering about other cultures - and, more importantly, if we could just act like it.

Most commented

414Australia, you have nothing to fear but fear itself
353"Gifting", "journey" and other words we hate
309Thomson didn't answer the question everyone is asking
255Who murdered the Arts degree?
246A big day for Thomson, who thus far is guilty of nothing...
231Craig Thomson speaks. Meanwhile, in Australia...
230South Australia. It's the middle bottom bit.
224The most laughable, err, spoof since Einfeld

65 comments

Show oldest | newest first

    • Eric says:

      05:03am | 25/01/10

      Yawn. More media Aussie-bashing as we approach Australia Day.

      Get over yourselves.

      Reply

    • James says:

      12:28pm | 25/01/10

      Indeed.  How dare anyone object to racism.  The nerve of it.

    • Davo says:

      06:16pm | 25/01/10

      So true. We need to get back on-message about how hard done-by men are in society, and all the terrible sexism we face on a daily basis.

      Of course, I’ve never felt that as a man, but it must be true. Otherwise we’d have to face the fact that some men who can’t provide properly for their children, are deemed unfit parents by the Family court, or have been rejected by a woman they felt superior to, are just whining because of their own personal inadequacies.

    • stephen says:

      05:12am | 25/01/10

      I think you’re getting the ‘expletives’ mixed up.
      A Bogan (capital), is someone like me : a bit rough ‘round the edges, but means well. (Bogans allways mean well, but they never quite make it )
      What you’re talking about in the above article are untidy racists (no capital).
      It’s worth making the distinction, cause Bogans simply have too much energy to think about other kinds of people - this accounts for some of their mistakes - and I reckon 90 per cent couldn’t give a fig about race, cause they’re too busy building stuff, or trimming up their cars or saving for a jet-ski.
      Racists are bad news, and i haven’t got a mate who likes ‘em.

      Reply

    • davo says:

      09:12am | 25/01/10

      too bloody roight maaate! >>>fumbs up<<<

    • Hoola says:

      03:12am | 26/01/10

      And they spend all their time reading about themselves on the internet?

    • Wayne Hutchins says:

      07:25am | 25/01/10

      Same old band wagon! You are talking about a very small part of this country and its people. There is more to this country than Sydney, Melbourne and surrounding suburbs.
      Another bloody expert on who and why we are. Why do minority views have so much say in this country? The majority in this country want to restrict immigration. I’d rather be a bogan than a cafe late drinking hypocrite from the leafy suburbs of Sydney or Melbourne.
      Pass me me stubby!!!

      Reply

    • AT says:

      12:33pm | 25/01/10

      More Wayne Hutchins “dribble”. You must be terribly insecure to believe views contrary to own reside only in Sydney and Melbourne. And Sydney and Melbourne these days share not only a common credo with each other, but every big city and quite few a regional centres — those latte extremists have infiltrated all sorts of places!

      Given Australia is one of earth’s most urbanised countries, you may have to harden up Wayney and apply your own logic equally and accept that it is in fact you that is the minority. Not here on The Punch’s comments of course, but in the broader more representative world.

    • PAT says:

      08:49am | 26/01/10

      Toooo true, living in a city trying to catch time lol, country living fishing camping etc is the best type of life where in the city you run to a time table family forgotten because you need to attend this or that meeting. Life is too short live for today I say. This saying is too true ‘THE PAST HAS BEEN, THE FUTURE IS YET TO BE SEEN AND THE PRESENT IS JUST THAT A “A GIFT” SO USE IT WISELY

    • acker says:

      07:39am | 25/01/10

      What’s the big difference between wearing a flannelette shirt as part of your cultural heritage compared to wearing a hijab ?....I would prefer my kids admire Chris the Yob rather than Osama the sneaky bomber

      Reply

    • Mick D says:

      07:59am | 25/01/10

      I am sure I am not the only one that sees the irony (or hypocracy?) in your little ditty here.  I think that we need to have a good, hard, honest look at what has driven some of the racist attitudes of the last few years.  Perhaps it is fuelled by constantly being told how racist we are that people are now standing up to commentators such as yourself, or worse, a self-fulfilling prophecy?

      Reply

    • acker says:

      08:39am | 25/01/10

      By the way it was a few tall sailing ships that turned up at Botany Bay not the Spanish Amada or Japanese Pacific fleet…..I would hardly call it an invasion.

      Reply

    • Adam says:

      09:42am | 25/01/10

      Try asking those, or decendants of those, who watched them sail into view if it was or was not an invasion. Removal of land and liberty, destruction of societal mores and systems of belief, forced labour. Sounds quite soft and cuddly does’n't it? Ya dill

    • cats says:

      11:51am | 25/01/10

      oh my. What an idiot. Not an invasion? What would you call it then?

    • Tealtrack says:

      03:16am | 26/01/10

      When some one else shows up on your shore and forces you to leave your traditional home, takes your children away from you, and forces you to behave the same way they do, what do you call it?

    • dave says:

      03:12pm | 27/01/10

      Tealtrack,
      ill sit around all day, make them pay me for doing absolutly nothing, without any need to better myself. Throw in some Goon and a few longnecks a day and i got a life. they can work and support me. give me a brand new home so that i got something to destroy.

      Sounds like a pretty good life?

    • Liz says:

      08:55am | 25/01/10

      Too right mate!Every country has it’s share of red-necks and racists let’s just get on with becoming a Republic, jettisoning the irrelevant Royals.

      Reply

    • Dan says:

      08:07am | 27/01/10

      And the Aborigines didn’t invade this country ?

    • Ish says:

      09:00am | 25/01/10

      I consider myself a bogan, and I’m a migrant. I was born in Asia and I’m half Asian, half Australian and I have lived in Australia since I was a toddler. The racists have probably made me the way I am today because they made me feel ashamed of my background so I became as “Aussie” as possible, but that’s another story. For mine I don’t think bogans and racism go hand in hand. I know a few other “ethnic” bogans as well and it’s more just that we have “Aussie” accents and vocabulary and yes we are rough around the edges and have a laid back attitude. I don’t think the bogan is a dying breed, it’s just changing. I also think it’s a good thing that “ethnics” and migrants are embracing their inner bogan, hopefully not to the detriment of their own cultural identity but to show in their own way that they are proud to be Australian no matter what their origins are.

      Reply

    • Pat Mazari says:

      12:18pm | 25/01/10

      Never be ashamed of where your from, I/m Italian and have been here for 48yrs and as much as Australia is my Home my culture is still with me. Aboriginals and many other countries have a culture but Aussies who arre racist seem to lack in that department be happy for who you are not what you think you can be

    • JohnD says:

      09:45am | 25/01/10

      I think you have your cultural groups mixed up - nothing wrong with Bogans, they make for friendly neighbours who do anything to help out an old couple like us and I much prefer them to those noisy, Bass-blaring juveniles who drive their imitation rally cars up and down the street at all hours of the night, arguing, fighting, spewing and destroying street signage and smashing expended alcohol bottles all over the footpath.

      Are you from Adelaide?

      Reply

    • Michael says:

      09:51am | 25/01/10

      I’ll take the bogans over latte sipping inner city blowhards like the author anyday. You and your set (inner city douchebag hipsters) think because you eat exotic food and know your local asian grocer by his name you are not racist unlike the great unwashed. Newsflash your all racist and classist living in the whitest yuppiest suburbs you can find with just enough non white people to make you feel good about how enlightened you are when your actually Australia’s biggest group of bigots.

      Reply

    • David V. says:

      02:22pm | 25/01/10

      Hey look, I love exotic food and shop at Asian grocery stores too. Doesn’t mean I love multiculturalism.

    • acker says:

      10:05am | 25/01/10

      @Adam…....what makes you so sure every indigenous Australian thinks it was an invasion or even a negative ?

      Ya know it all wink

      Reply

    • Adam says:

      10:42am | 25/01/10

      History and their comments on the same, goose. Its easy to find one person but that doesn’t make your point. The vast majority feel rthat way as evidenced by the emotion shown when the Apology was made, when Eddie Mabo had the win when any land rights claim is upheld or denied. Its pretty eveident through things like entrenched disadvantage lower life expectancy marginalisation destruction of language. Tell ya what acker, how bout I turn up at your place, uninvited, force you to leave forever, take your kids away, introduce diseases you’ve no immunity to, destroy your food source, prevent you following your chosen religeous beliefs( or sport as the case may be), and spend 220 years telling you you’ve never had it so good and anyway its all your fault CAUSE OF THE COLOUR OF YOUR SKIN! nah not negative at all really. dill

    • acker says:

      12:18pm | 25/01/10

      @Adam…...you are being an average garden variety peanut just trying to wrap all indigenous into a singular streotype nutshell, so your small minded view on the issue can fit in the small amount of available space :?

    • James says:

      12:32pm | 25/01/10

      Whereas you would never dream of lumping whole groups of people into a singular (sic) stereotype, would you Acker?  No comments such as “I would prefer my kids admire Chris the Yob rather than Osama the sneaky bomber ” from you at all.

    • Grumbles says:

      01:51pm | 25/01/10

      Adam… The Mabo Issue related to TSI a completely different race of people even tho we refer to them as aborigional. It has been used by the mainland Aboriginies to make claims on land where really they had none. The TSI’s had cultural land ownership that was handed down from generation to generation. They stayed put in one place, where as, mainland Aboriginies were transient and had no recognised land ownership.

      Anyone that knows the MABO issue would never bring it up the way you have to reinforce a mute point. There is also lots of evidence that disease was brought down from the islands by the Aborigines themselves, and while they have a lower life expectancy than us, their LE is much higher since white settlement. It would be nice to believe in a noble savage but in reality a savage is a savage, they were a people of war and killed plenty of their own before we arrived.

    • Puki says:

      07:07pm | 25/01/10

      You have a point here acker, its always the “white Australian” who is up for a beasting on Australia Day. What of all the others that make up our country? By singling out the whitey’s - using the racist term “Red-neck”- places those who claim not to be racist into that mold.
      Everyone is racist, whether thay admit it or not - I’m of mixed race descent, but consider myself a white indigenous Australian as I was raised in a white environment - not in some town camp by a drunken welfare dependant mother and an unknown father. As I don’t consider the settlement of this country as an invasion, this now includes me in your assessment in one of those who sees what has become of this country is an absolute positive. All that is served by crying invasion and a minority supported apology is the self-pity driven that justify their inadequacies on something that happened 222 years ago.

      An “invasion” would have eventually happened anyway, just thank Christ it was the English and not the others - look at South America, Africa and some of South East Asia to see an example of Spanish, Portuguese and French colonies. All have had civil wars and corruption on a massive scale - and still do.

      The opportunity exists for all Australians to improve their lives - grab hold of it and don’t let go. The apologists do not realise how good we have it in Australia, look forward not back.

    • nic says:

      10:56am | 25/01/10

      “No, a Bogan, plainly and simply, is a relic of our society who chooses to cling to hooligan type behaviour to express an exclusionist, uneducated opinion, which largely derives from fear - ie. ‘eff off we’re full’”

      It is sneaky and untruthful to paint bogans as primarily being racist Anglo’s.  Your article is simplistic and ignores bogan like activity of say, youths of middle eastern descent such as the ones who attacked Indians in Harris Park last year, telling them ‘we grew here, you flew here’.

      But of course, to show this sort of reality distrupts the inner-city meme of ‘Cronulla’.

      Reply

    • James says:

      12:35pm | 25/01/10

      I think that the “youths of middle eastern descent” fit that definition of bogan perfectly well, nic.  There is no mention of race there, only hooligan type behaviour and an expressed preference for exclusion.  All your post does is make it clear that you consider their ethnicity to be relevant to their hooliganism.  Most non-racists would consider this to be inappropriate, as hooligans and bogans come in all ethnicities and colours.

    • nic says:

      02:34pm | 25/01/10

      Exactly James, which is why i’m questioning the usual ‘bogans as a descriptor solely aimed at anglo-saxon’s’. There is a less than subtle subtext and mindset that needs to change.

    • Darin says:

      03:33pm | 25/01/10

      @ James 1:35pm

      The author refers to bogans as flying the flag as a sign of “white pride”, that we have a flag that is “emblematic of a white Australia”, and makes many other bogan=white=racist insinutations.

    • James says:

      11:46am | 27/01/10

      I was replying to nic, Darin, but thanks for the response anyway.  Admittedly, the white pride types are most likely to be bogans, but to me the whole flag issue is a load of rubbish.  I do not object to the flag, just the behaviour of some of those who wear it like clothes, which I find offensive to begin with - its a flag, not a shirt, treat it with respect. 

      Still, nic is right.  We need to move away from the idea that only white people can be racist bogans.  Plenty of other ethnicities can be racist bogans too.  All this “f*** off we’re full” and “we grew here you flew here” is very worrying to me, whether the perpetrators be of Anglo-Saxon, middle eastern, Jewish, Chinese, Southeast Asian of whatever other extraction.  Ethnicity is irrelevant.  Personal behaviour is not.

    • cats says:

      12:01pm | 25/01/10

      I pretty much agree with this piece. I’m so sick of xenophobic Australians. It’s so ridiculously unfounded. Australians are not white. Australians are white, aboriginal, black, arab, asian, hispanic.. whatever. People from different countries have been migrating to Australia since the Europeans landed here. Australia is a country full of migrants or recent descendants from migrants (recent meaning within past 200 years), and aboriginals. I don’t understand why it should stop all of a sudden? If water and resources on the coasts is an issue, incentives need to be provided to migrants to move into outback towns and more jobs need to be created there. And don’t reply to my post asking “how are they going to create jobs” blah blah well i’m not a politician, so i don’t know.

      Reply

    • acker says:

      12:20pm | 25/01/10

      @cat ...why use migration ? isn’t still invasion the term you used earlier !

      hypocrite

    • cats says:

      12:50pm | 25/01/10

      um excuse me, it was an invasion. The European migration was an invasion. I associate the word “invasion” with trying to stamp out the cultures and values of the people already living there. That’s what they did. Nowdays, migration to Australia does not involve a violent attempt to stamp out the values of the people who already live here. “They” are not trying to take over this country. There is plenty of room for all of us.

      Call me a hypocrit again, and find a reason this time.

    • Robbie says:

      08:37pm | 25/01/10

      Invasions,don’t talk to me about invasions.Vikings,Romans,Normans,the Germans had a couple of cracks,Spaniards,mind you we had time to finish a game of bowls and still see them off.Thats just off the top of my head.Relax.

    • Darin says:

      12:24pm | 25/01/10

      For all of Keeva’s education, with her degree and MA, it’s a pity she was unable to summon any “intellect”, “manners” or “compassion” for this article.

      It’s even more pathetic that someone with a degree in communications and practices it for a living, couldn’t manage to come up with a true definition of a ‘bogan’. It does not equate with a certain level of education, particular political views, or an exclusivist outlook on ‘others’. Instead, it is more likely to be someone who embodies the ‘larrikin’ spirit, and feels no compulsion to conform to self-appointed elitist views, pastimes or indulgences.

      I don’t consider myself a bogan - and I don’t think anyone would confuse me for one either - but even I can see the distinction between a bogan and a racist and that one is not synonymous with the other.  It seems to me that the author and people who think like her are the ones with a problem in not accepting people who don’t conform to their ideal of what makes an Australian.

      Reply

    • westie says:

      01:09pm | 25/01/10

      Gotta make allowances, Darin 13:24, for the sheer depth of inner-city self hatred that produces all this turgid “OMG Isn’t Australia Dreadful” stuff.

      Most Aussies, like most people everywhere, are decent people who usually try to do the right thing.  And most Aussies are quietly glad that we are able to live here in peaceful enjoyment of a fine country and way of life.

      Yes, anything can be improved, but the constant whining from the OMGIAD crowd does not relate to the real world (which is not found in Carlton, Newtown et al).

    • Al says:

      12:58pm | 25/01/10

      As an Englishman, I would like to request that you remove your stars from my flag. Thank You.

      Reply

    • James Mc says:

      04:25pm | 25/01/10

      But as an Englishman - surely you’d want the St Andrew, St Patrick and St David crosses removed from your flag first.

    • Marion Simpson says:

      01:04pm | 25/01/10

      Be yourself, never bow down to others expectations of what you should be and never listen to sad ramblings of journalist who think they know us all.
      You are an Australian, wherever your family came from, if you have those citizenship papers, then your as Aussie as the rest of us. Happy Australia Day

      Reply

    • Wayne Hutchins says:

      01:12pm | 25/01/10

      Oh I am so sorry AT @ 1.33pm. Did I offend thee. When someone calls me “wayney” it generally means they don’t have an argument but they have taken offence so its the old sticks and stones. Pity! I have lived and worked in both Melbourne and Sydney and have seen and experienced first hand the attitudes, thoughts and selfishness of a lot of city dwellers. Half of them don’t even know who their own neighbors are and most don’t believe there is anything more outside their own city limits. I must admit that Brisbane should be in the same category now. It was once just a big country town. It’s now just full of stressed out people struggling to get from one side to the other side. I now live in the Queensland bush and I can assure you attitudes out this way are somewhat different. As far as it being more dribble, tough! I read your crap don’t I. Maybe I have offend you in a previous article. Boo Hoo, get over it.

      Reply

    • AT says:

      02:05pm | 25/01/10

      “in the Queensland bush ... I can assure you attitudes ... are somewhat different”

      You don’t have to assure me, Hutcho, I think it’s common knowledge the “Qld bush” has its own particular attitudes as do “urban centres”. What ‘offends’ is your bloody minded appropriation of the spurious “we’re the majority” notion to spout your same old tedious prejudice.

      By all means, express your opinions, but don’t pretend to speak for anyone other than yourself. And maybe a few of your fellow yokels.

    • David says:

      02:30pm | 25/01/10

      Australia is bogun, I mean on Australia day we think its something to be proud of… thongs and bucket hats? Australia is moving forward Keeva (thankfully), it makes me ill to see ignorant “patriotic” people wearing flags, or having them on their car in an aggresive way. All it means to be an Australian is that you own a piece of paper confirming it (or if like me you don’t have one, but are Australian nontheless), an Indian who recieved their citizenship yesterday is as Australian as I am (born here, with citizens for both parents.). Without all the meaningless random crap (like lamingtons or thongs) we should instead by espousing the values that we consider to be appropriate for anybody who resides in this country.

      By the way Keeva, I think federation is a bad move forward, solely because it will just help everybody forget the modern history of this country that they are already forgetting (by removing the union jack from the flag, the last reminder that we were a colonial backwater of the British empire). As it is there is no mention on Australia day of our history, no lessons for all those historically ignorant multitudes!

      Reply

    • Peter Thornton says:

      02:30pm | 25/01/10

      Well, I once worked in the ‘QLD bush.’ I am from Sydney - in that I was born here - and can confirm that the knowledge, or lack thereof, about me to which my neighbours had access to in both places was entirely contingent on my interaction with them.

      Really, we’re only a product of our surroundings and the influences they have upon us. This doesn’t mean we naturally become stressed or selfish in thoughts or actions by some form of osmosis or channeling simply because we’re in close proximity to those who are. We’re only ever examples of what we do or do not want to become. In short: do I want to become a bogan (although it’s a relative question)? Not bloody likely. Would I or could I only ever become a bogan if I relocated to the QLD bush (or insert the name of any rural backwater)? Same; not bloody likely.

      it’s not hard.

      Reply

    • nic says:

      02:37pm | 25/01/10

      “And maybe a few of your fellow yokels”.

      Couldn’t resist it could you? Why not just comment on what Wayne said?

      Reply

    • AT says:

      05:57pm | 25/01/10

      @nic says:  03:37pm | 25/01/10

      I most assuredly did comment on what he said, but you seem to have missed that in the same way you seem to have missed Wayneys evocative descriptions of us city sophisticates as latte hypocrites and selfish, not knowing our neighbours and stressed out. “Yokel” is a fairly moderate payback, don’t yer reckon?

    • E says:

      03:20pm | 25/01/10

      I dont think to be a bogan is to be racist, im pretty sure its an elitist term for people of lower socioeconomic backgrounds who are unpretentious.

      My thought about racists, hoons, rapists, misogynists, bigots and fools of all orders magnitudes and type is that there are about 60% of the population who abhor such behavior and would only commit it under severe socail pressure, about 39% percent of people who will do it if their mates are doing it (these people can be reached by education) and 1% who just need to be locked up.

      The problem with modern trendy lefty thinking is that we pity the 1%, and talk about how their parents or the govt let them down, when really they are ass hats who should be dealt with sternly for the good of the 99% who abhor their actions.

      Racists need to be held responsible for their racism, but wearing a flag or being a ‘bogan’ is a separate issue being shamelessly conflated by the liberal media to make people feel bad about themselves. It occurs to me that the conflation of bogan and racist might be an attempt to shame middle class racists into changing their behavior to avoid being lumped in with ‘bogans’ that would come straight out of some communication theorists playbook (doomed to fail of course).

      Reply

    • E says:

      03:26pm | 25/01/10

      “never bow down to others expectations of what you should be”

      Isnt it sad that people who espouse this POV generally, truthfully, are happy to bow down, its the rising to meet expectations they generally fail at

      Reply

    • S.L says:

      03:56pm | 25/01/10

      Oh boy where do I start?
      @Al as an Englishman for where are the stars of the Southern Cross that are on the Union Jack or Cross of St George you would like removed?
      @Keeva as I have stated elsewhere I respect all opinions whether I agree with them or not but I can’t tollerate selective memories.
      Your column implies the white Anglo is to blame for Cronulla. Is it? Ask the Cronulla lifeguard who was decked by the young man of middle eastern or mediteranian desent? The incident that started the riots!
      Comedian Chris Franklin has played his Bogan/Yobbo role succesfully for many years but some (dare I say) latte sipping lefties see it as a study of our cutural cringe. Er Paul Hogan played the same role to great effect 20years before Chris but I’ve never seen him as the face of Boganism/Racism and why is it always Anglo’s that are portrayed as the offenders? A non Anglo has a great chance of walking from say one end of King street Newcastle to the other at midnight without incident but I wouldn’t bet on an Anglo trying the same stunt in Chappel street Bankstown! (I grew up in Bankstown so can speak with some authority there).

      Reply

    • Davo says:

      06:09pm | 25/01/10

      Excellent article Keeva, with some well-made points.

      As for the disingenuous bogan who keeps saying the Cronulla riots were all started because a “young man of middle eastern or mediteranian (sic) desent (sic)”  hit a lifeguard - well, how can you reason with them?

      By the same logic whenever an Indian is attacked the Indian community would be justified in rioting, chanting racist slogans, and abusing “white” passers by. The way things are going this would be a weekly event.

      The whiny bleating “Anglos always get blamed! They are racist against us, not the other way around!” reeks of that similar whine; “Men always get blamed! They are sexist against us, not the other way around!”. At first you think they are just inverting the rhetoric to be stirrers, then you realize these poor, insecure fools really believe this crap.

      Reply

    • acker says:

      07:29am | 26/01/10

      @Davo…..none of the heros in a crowd involved in the Cronulla riots or the heros in a convoy of cars involoved in the revenge deserve a post pumping them up like yours.
      About time you started practicing what you preach when you start labelling people disingenuous..

    • Peter Thornton says:

      09:57pm | 25/01/10

      Here’s the thing about the Cronulla riots: a few Australians had their bums kicked by a few Lebanese. It’s highly likely that the Lebanese had experienced violence of a far greater level in their native Lebanon (or had close ties with those who had) than the Australians had ever experienced while living at a beachside suburb of Sydney. However the way either side (and ‘side’ because it was a conflict) behaved was very antisocial and totally unAustralian. However someone had to kick it off, and from there it escalated to matter of sheer frustrated bloody pride. Pride is neither a good excuse for patriotism or nationalism. Gratitude is the best reason for patriotism. And gratitude should come in the form of positive actions that the whole community benefits from not isolated incidents that destroy everything a community tries to develop.

      Reply

    • David V. says:

      12:01am | 26/01/10

      The riots in Oldham happened when a defenceless pensioner was beaten up by Asian (i.e. Pakistani) youths. Like Cronulla it was far from unprovoked, but hey, the white male is always made out to look like the bad guy!

    • David V. says:

      10:08pm | 25/01/10

      Maybe it’s better to admit we just can’t all get along, and separation is a better solution. Even the Nation of Islam with its self-help policy has the right idea- everyone keeps to themselves, runs their own economies, without outside help, and we’ll all be happy.

      Reply

    • Davido says:

      12:47am | 26/01/10

      I guess this article shows cultural elitism is alive and well.

      Unfortunately elitism does not always equate to solid intellectual arguments: as is the case here.

      This rather pathetic attempt at socio-economic character assassination smacks of a ‘cringe’ mentality. It appears the author is embarrassed to be associated with Bogans. I would have thought that these sorts of remarks are the antithesis of a multi-cultural society? To wish the end of an entire socio-economic class is surely the height of intolerance.

      Furthermore, and hypocritically, the author asks society to embrace a prejudice free culture while writing an article primarily aimed at denigrating a section of society. Interesting.

      Perhaps, the author had the good fortune to not grow up a bogan. Perhaps, she has not had the misfortune to experience any problems as a result of the current record immigration levels. Good for her. However, to deny, as she implicitly does, that there are no problems with the current immigration model is the height of ignorance. To blame those who raise legitimate concerns is the height of offensiveness.

      To fail to take action to address those concerns could be seriously damaging to the future harmony of our society. I would suggest that rumours (or in this case the author’s hopes) of the Bogan’s demise are greatly exaggerated.

      Reply

    • S.L says:

      06:08am | 26/01/10

      @ Davo then who or what started Cronulla then? I have experienced both sides of the argument but comments accusing me of being a Bogan seem to come frrom a very narrow view point.
      Besides who invented the expresion “Bogan” anyway? My recollection seems to be the Kylie Mole character in that forgetable TV show “the Comedy Company” back in the 80s. Before then we (tatooed, blue singlet wearing slackos as portrayed in the photo) were just called Yobbos!

      Reply

    • Elizabeth says:

      01:33pm | 26/01/10

      Good article Keeva. I think you’ve prooved your point by the vitriolic, angry, hateful responses. Whether you agree with Keeva or not, the nasty attacks on her, on each other and on people of other races that appear in response make me sad and embarrassed to be an Australian.
      Most people’s comments are simply nasty slings at others and not reasoned or mature arguments.
      As a nation I thought we could do better. But sadly, not.

      Reply

    • H of SA says:

      03:03pm | 27/01/10

      Elizabeth,

      Don’t judge Australia by the blogosphere - we are better than the comments on the punch would lead you to believe

    • westie says:

      02:19pm | 26/01/10

      Everyone knows what a bogan is.

      It’s a river in NSW, so let’s leave it at that and move on.

      Reply

    • Ricky says:

      04:32pm | 26/01/10

      Judging by the amount of flag waving & wearing i saw today i would say Patriotism is growing Keeva.How does that make you feel?I know elitists like yourself would like to pretend the great multicultural experiment is working, and i know you would love to make white Australias ashamed of their culture, but the truth is it was white Australians who built this country. You cant change history Keeva can you?Maybe if you pulled your head out of your A*s & admitted to some of the problems the immigrant minority waves have brought to this nation you might understand why Australia pride & the ‘eff off we are full’ attitude is growing.Happy Australia day.

      Reply

    • Bug Zapper says:

      09:20pm | 26/01/10

      Hey Ricky!! The only post here that has actually made any sense.
      You have summed up the National feeling.
      Well done!!

    • Richie says:

      02:04pm | 27/01/10

      I get so incredibly angry when I read people saying that the ‘eff off we are full’ attitude is growing, and that it’s a good thing. It’s pretty obvious and it’s been said before, but none of us (including me) would be here if the Aborigines had said that to us when those few tall sailing ships landed in the first place.

      I was born here, and so was my dad but my mum and my grandparents weren’t and I love that. I am extremely proud of being Australian and of most of the values that Australian culture is known for.

      I’m not proud of how a fear of the unknown (which is normal when you grow up in a largely white or otherwise society) is embraced. We all struggle with it, and it can be tough to accept others but it’s called being a grown up.

      I love how so many people are accusing Keeva of being some self-indulgent writer who must only drink skim soy decaf lates in some elitist cafe while writing on her mac while telling her that she’s the one doing the stereotyping.

      I know plenty of “bogans” who are just fun-loving larrikins who are a bit rough around the edges. But you can’t deny, there are a group of people here who are rough around hte edges and love to have fun, but they also love to jump on a bandwagon, wave around an Australian flag and insist that it’s their right to tell others who don’t look like them to go back to where they came from.

      We’re all guilty of being unsure of someone we don’t know; who looks different to us; or of being unsure of someone because there’s some stereotype that’s floating around in our head.

      That doesn’t mean that we can insist that we’re the ones who know better.

      Reply
 
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