Is it right that foreign employees of an Australian company get paid Third World wages while foreign managers of the same company get paid first-world salaries?

Another Qantas job outsourced to cheap Third World Hollywood labour. Pic: AFP

Do we still believe in the principle of equal pay for equal work? Or is it a case of George Orwell’s famous line in his novel Animal Farm to the effect that we are all equal but some are more equal than others?

All good questions as Australian companies are increasingly shifting operations offshore. We are told that Australian wages and salaries are too high and that moving offshore will “save” the company money by cutting labour costs.

That sounds simple doesn’t it? Yes, it does if you are a CEO of an Australian company that is under constant pressure to continually show record profits year after year. The pressure to show a strong increase on the previous year’s profit is relentless. Record profits drive increases in a company’s share price and increases in share prices drive increases in a CEO’s salary and performance bonuses.

A failure to show record profits means that the share price takes a hit and that leads to lower performance bonuses being received by management. So the pressure to show record profits becomes a personal challenge for any CEO wanting to collect higher performance bonuses.

The only problem is that showing record profits year after year is a very real business challenge. It is especially challenging in a marketplace full of efficient and hungry competitors where the ability to raise prices to consumers is constrained.

Real and aggressive competition between a diversity of efficient competitors makes it hard to raise prices to consumers and that makes it hard to show record profits and even harder to secure those much sought after performance bonuses. That’s why company CEOs have an irresistible urge to pursue mergers or acquisitions and that’s why we need effective competition laws to stop mergers and acquisitions that undermine the competitive fabric of a particular market.

Mergers and acquisitions are a very simple way for company CEOs to knock out efficient competitors so as to secure higher consumer prices, record profits and increased performance bonuses. Fewer competitors mean fewer competitive pressures to innovate or deliver lower prices across the full product range.

Let’s not forget that the ultimate purpose of real and aggressive competition is to push down prices and deliver wider product choices to consumers. Mergers and acquisitions reduce product choice and reduce diversity in the market. More dangerously, they lead to higher consumer prices and allow the remaining players to act as a cosy club for their general mutual benefit.

Yes, there is an appearance of competition in the cosy club, but not in a way that seriously jeopardises the mutual interest of their CEOs to show record profits to keep pushing up share prices so as to secure those performance bonuses.

Now, there is nothing wrong with rewarding CEOs with performance bonuses. There‘s only a problem when those performance bonuses skew the behaviour of the CEO towards short term goals or undermine the company brand.

That’s where it’s important that the benchmarks for a performance bonus primarily reflect customer satisfaction. In fact, customer satisfaction should be the number one criteria. After all, a company is in business to satisfy customers and if the CEO isn’t fully satisfying customers then there’s something fundamentally wrong with the company’s business model.

Customer satisfaction needs to be front and centre, and should be closely followed by employee satisfaction. Inevitably, customer satisfaction is closely linked to employee satisfaction for the very simple reason that it’s those employees that are at the coal face dealing with customers.

Unhappy employees can lead to unhappy customers. That’s why it’s important to have a close look at the way employees are treated in terms of wages and salaries and whether there is equal pay for equal work. This is especially important with Australian based companies having overseas operations.

Take Qantas, for example. Here we have a company with substantial Australian operations, but with a growing overseas-based operation especially in Asia. Qantas is an iconic Australian brand that has always received considerable benefits from being the dominant domestic carrier.

Long the beneficiary of a local duopoly, first with Ansett and now Virgin Australia, Qantas consistently enjoys healthy domestic profits. Obviously, the more concentrated the particular market the healthier the profits of the dominant players tend to be and the higher the prices generally faced by consumers.

Qantas also enjoys considerable benefits such as high level political access and access to premium terminal facilities at Australian airports. And Qantas has always been good at the political game something that’s helped by the invitation it extends to all Members of Parliament to its very exclusive Chairman’s lounge.

Despite all these advantages, Qantas’ healthy domestic profits are not matched on its overseas operations. Why? Quite simply because on international routes Qantas faces real and aggressive competition which means that on those routes consumers get much better access to lower prices and wider product choices.

Clearly, Qantas is struggling financially on those international operations. So what is Qantas doing about it? Well, by cutting the pay and working conditions of foreign based pilots and crews. This means that different workers employed by Qantas and its related airlines such as Jetstar will get different rates of pay for the same work depending on where they are employed. So much for the principle of equal pay for equal work!

So much also for employee satisfaction. How do you think different classes of employees would feel? What happens to customer service when pay is reduced or staff levels cut? Low morale and staff cuts lead to reduced customer service which then leads to low customer satisfaction. What do you think that does to the brand?

Employee morale is not helped when the CEO and managers get significant increases in their remuneration package. And what about the salaries of overseas managers employed by Qantas to run the company here? Well, it appears that while Qantas wants to pay overseas workers less for the same job performed in Australia, Qantas is happy to pay its imported management the substantial salaries and performance bonuses that are paid in developed countries.

Apologists for substantial executive salaries will say that you need to pay the higher salaries to management to attract the best talent. Well, on that logic don’t you need to pay higher salaries to attract the best and most experienced pilots, cabin crew and engineering staff?

So maybe at Qantas all staff members are equal, but some are more equal than others. Just remember that when you next get on a Qantas plane that you want the best and most experienced pilots, cabin crew and engineers and that Qantas management and the rest of us should always be nice to the pilots and crew because when that plane takes off we are in the pilots’ and crew’s hands with management nowhere to be seen.

48 comments

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    • Brando says:

      05:46am | 14/09/11

      You could apply this to salaries just about everywhere. For example, is it right for an employee in Sydney to be paid more than an employee in say Adelaide?

      Why shuold one be paid more if they are doing the same job?

    • Michael N says:

      08:37am | 14/09/11

      Quite correct Brando - one needs to compare the Market in question. Provided the foreign pilots, engineers and cabin crews are being paid more than their peers (from Malaysia, Indonesia etc) then you would still be attracting the best employees from that particular Market. Of course, as far as QANTAS goes, it’s reputation is one of safety so if they ever suffer a fatal crash then their brand will be damaged beyond repair and all of this will be academic anyway.

    • PTom says:

      11:14am | 14/09/11

      So why should Regional Australia be income taxed less then people in Sydney, even if they earn more then Sydney workers?

      This is not so much about wage being paid differently in different markets,  It is about companies using the theory that they need to pay more to get the best imported CEO but then turn around and say to workers you are not worth the pay and we will use cheap labour elsewhere instead.

      So why bring in expensive Managers and CEO from overseas when they can get cheaper ones?  they are employees too

    • marley says:

      06:53am | 14/09/11

      Sorry, but if a Qantas crew based in Malaysia or Indonesia is getting the same wage as a Malaysian or Garuda crew, I don’t see an issue.  The Australian wage system is, after all, and for better or worse, based on the Harvester decision - a living wage for a man and his family - and that’s a lower amount in KL or Jakarta than in Sydney. 

      And I suspect a crew of Malaysians or Indonesians will be as happy (or happier) to work for Qantas at local wage rates as a crew of Australians are to work for Aussie wage rates - and I also suspect the service they provide will be at least as good.  Qantas isn’t exactly top of the ladder in that regard, you know. 

      So, crew satisfied, customers satisfied, shareholders satisfied.  Works for me.

    • acotrel says:

      07:26am | 14/09/11

      The salaries are rising around Asia.  What will the corporations do when they match those in Australia, and their product quality is inferior ?

    • marley says:

      07:55am | 14/09/11

      @acotrel - so, you assume that Asians can’t make things as well as us white folk do? Maybe you should check your racism at the door,

      Oh, and if you’ve ever flown Singapore or Cathay Pacific, you’d know their product is in fact superior.  I’ve flown a lot of airlines in my time, and very few can match the top Asian airlines,.  Qantas certainly doesn’t.  And frankly, I’d take a Japanese built car over an Aussie one any day of the week.

    • ShamWow says:

      09:19am | 14/09/11

      @marley - acotrel’s comment is not a racist one, it’s too early in the morning for out of control political correctness.

    • Kika says:

      10:16am | 14/09/11

      I agree with Marley.  Who buys, for an example, an Australian made TV these days?  Yeah, for certain there’s a few poxy airlines in Asia that do cut corners. But brandishing them all rubbish just because they are asian is racist as. Singapore Airlines is the best airline in the world and will fly with them at the drop of a hat, anytime.

    • FINK says:

      10:33am | 14/09/11

      Marley,
      But the Malaysian / Indonesian / Indian employees would be much happier working for Qantas as an Australian for an Aussie wage and having the same working conditions that Aussie’s enjoy! Having paid 9% compulsory super / union support / OHS policies and practices enforced and all the other entitlements that Aussie workers enjoy but are not part of their working conditions in their own country. We condemn the setup and practice of clothing sweat shops in Cabramatta and chastise and fine those companies that use them because their work conditions are appalling, yet we will take a job from an Aussie and give it to a worker in another Country working in conditions not suitable for Aussie workers but that is Okay?
      The Qantas / Westpacs etc should be enforced to contribute the same conditions / super etc that they are enforced by law to pay to Australian workers.

    • PTom says:

      11:01am | 14/09/11

      Marley,
      To be fair acotrel I think he is talking about safety and training requirements/laws. Like the Chinese company Cherry makes ok cars for China but they need to raise their safety standard to sell in Australia.

      BTW Jetstar pays better then Thai wages but still less then Australian, however the condition of the Thai workers is worse and the crews and customers are not satisfied.

      But this is not about quality of staff it is about pay and condition. CEO’s, Industray Groups, and Right Whinge Think tanks have been out complaining that Australian are un-productivity yet the it is the CEO’s with huge salary and bonus that get paid are neither linked to increase productivity nor company performance.

    • Dave says:

      03:43pm | 14/09/11

      Ptom, Chery is a good example of why that comment is racist and wrong. Three factors make Chery poor quality at the moment. Thee are: It has just started up so has not that many highly experienced staff; China is at the moment producing a mass of new designers through their universities and education system, but these guys have not yet hit the market and, in any case, those that have are inexperienced; China doesnt have a history of complex manufacturing - in fact they mostly make parts that are shipped to other places - such as Japan - for assembly. The result of this is the poor quality you see today. But Im old enough to remember when a Honda or Toyota was derided in the same way that Chery is now. In 20 years Chery will probably be up to the same general standard. And in 20 years that host of Chinese university educated designers will be highly experienced and China’s organised approach to these issues will have made us the white trash of asia. Based on current indications by then this country will be a large hole in the ground with some beaches and every one with talent will be gone - for the high salaries in Asia.

    • PTom says:

      05:17pm | 14/09/11

      Dave,
      You said I was wrong and racist but you did not prove anything just how much of a fool you are.

      Look at what I wrote about Chery.
      I was talking about how high the Australia safety requirements are to import. When Chery first tired they failed because they did not meet safety standards and yet the where already making the cars in China.
      I did not talk about design nor quality

      That is not racist neither is it wrong.

      If anything I would think that you where be a tad Hypocritical ffor it was you who was talking about whitetrash Australians and china taking 20 years to build up the skill.
      You do realize that China now make luxury cars for a number of companies.

    • marley says:

      07:17pm | 14/09/11

      @FINK - of course the Asian employees would be happier working at Australian wages while living in Malaysia or Indonesia. But they’ll be damn happy working for a foreign employer in conditions better than what local employers can offer, for slightly better wages.  That’s the reality.  And I’ve been in enough developing countries to know just how valuable a job with a reputable foreign-owned company is.

    • Tim says:

      08:58pm | 14/09/11

      Good points. Can’t agree more.

      I’ve flown Cathay, Malaysian, Thai, Emirates. They are far better than Qantas and are cheaper. I see happy flight attendants working on board, providing exceptional service. This notion that Qantas has good service is rubbish.

      These days there’s absolutely no point in flying Qantas on international flights. They are much more expensive, service is poor and worst of all, the unions pretty much threaten to have one of (or more) engineers, pilots, ground crew, maintenance groups on strike. Who needs that when they paid good money and booked leave for a holiday only to be stranded by union strike action?

      I agree: crew satisfied, customers satisfied, shareholders satisfied.  Works for me too.

    • adam says:

      06:58am | 14/09/11

      In fact, customer satisfaction should be the number one criteria. After all, a company is in business to satisfy customers and if the CEO isn’t fully satisfying customers then there’s something fundamentally wrong with the company’s business model.

      Ah no actually. Companies are in business to make as mch money for their owners/investors as possible. If that alsoleads to satisfied customers all the better

    • malohi says:

      07:50am | 14/09/11

      I agree the job of the CEO is not to make their customers and employees happy, it is to make $$$$.
      This may necessitate doing things to satisfy the customer and perhaps employees to some degree, but that is incidental to the main priority.

    • acotrel says:

      07:23am | 14/09/11

      Australia can compete on quality, however we’ll never get the chance.  The desire for short term gain is too strong.  We see Australian manufacturing facilities worked to death with minimal maintenance or improvement.  It is difficult to believe that Bluescope Steel is not still in some way associated with BHP.  Here we have our steel industry providing adequate product which is not shown preference by the mining industry.  It appears that Big Blue has just cut Australian workers off, and left them for dead ! I don’t mind corporate executives getting huge salaries, however I expect them to be able to lead, motivate, and cultivate creativity within their organisations.  They must realise by now that a stolid coercive management culture must change and adapt to our new globalised economy ?

    • MarkS says:

      09:15am | 14/09/11

      The drive for short term gain can cause much long term damage. The GFC is a good case in point, the guys who designed the toxic debt must have known that the house of cards would fall one day. But they made hay while the sun shone & hoped they where sitting down when the music stopped.

      It is part of the underlying problem with modern corporations, seperating managment & ownership, giving ownership limited liability, these are the basis of our modern economy. But every silver cloud has a dark lining & this is one of them.

    • Johno says:

      09:03pm | 14/09/11

      A lot of locally made Australian steel products cost double or more the price of imported ones. The question then becomes: whether the government (ultimately taxpayers) or companies (ultimately shareholders) are willing to pay for new bridges or buildings with double the material cost for steel, or use import products. Or you wind back the clock and start putting tariffs.

    • Phil says:

      08:41am | 14/09/11

      If there were more accountability for their actions given the high salaries that would be fine, but there is no accountability.

      Joyce pocketed a $2 million dollar pay rise while they are looking to get rid of 170-200 pilots or transfer some to jetstar with lower pay.

      Greed will be the downfall of this company, it already kinda is.

    • Tubesteak says:

      08:54am | 14/09/11

      A company is in business to make money. Customer satisfaction is a side issue or sometimes a fortunate spin-off.

      Ever heard the line “you can’t please all of the people all of the time; you can only please some of the people some of the time”?

      This applies to tying bonuses to customer satisfaction. It is pointless.

      All we can expect is that companies will serve themselves. The ACCC is meant to foster competition by upholding the TPA.

      Employees are guaranteed working conditions through legislation. This sometimes includes awards. Ultimately, I will always go for the job that pays me the most and has the best future prospects for my career. I know at my company we are shifting roles to Malaysia to pay them 20% of the same role here. My role won’t go because it requires specific local knowledge that no Malaysian has or could acquire.

    • acotrel says:

      09:21pm | 14/09/11

      I once had a production manager say to me ‘we only make the practice items here,  If they want the real stuff they import it’ !  He should have got good kick up the clacker !

    • Steve says:

      09:15am | 14/09/11

      I’m not sure what argument Frank is making here. 

      Something about its good for customers to have more choices and pay the lowest prices, but its not good for companies to have a choice about what they pay - i.e every pilot should be on the highest rates irrespective of the local market for thier skills.

      However, no-one puts a gun to the head of a New Zealand or Malaysaian pilot and forces them to work for Qantas at a lower rate than that extorted by the Australian pilot union.   

      I think Frank is pro-competition between companies for consumers, but not pro-competition between workers for jobs.  Stop the world, Frank wants to get off.

      Unfortunately, the automaticly higher wages expected by Australian workers simply for being in Australia (and lets face it - mostly it’s an expectation for being white) doesn’t hold up in a globalised world.

    • Direct says:

      10:29am | 14/09/11

      The argument is obvious, Steve. Frank is pro competition and pro innovation. How innovative is cutting wages?

    • Steve says:

      11:34am | 14/09/11

      @Direct
      Cutting wages is not so much innovative as it is necessary.

      Labour costs are a huge part of the cost of any business.  Frank can’t have cheaper flights at the same time as giving higher wages to Qantas staff.  Where Qantas has to compete, it is losing customers because of its higher fares.

      Or being really pro-innovation, Frank would have to support job losses as fewer staff are kept on at the high wage rates, but use machines to replace labour.  Where I couldn’t suggest as there are a lot of safety rules to be met in terms of flight crew numbers and rest periods.

    • Bruce says:

      12:52pm | 14/09/11

      Steve: Well said: Unfortunately, I think Franks Animal Farm comment about sums it up. I think we just have face up to the fact that ‘we are all equal, just that some are more equal than others’. Thats the way the world is.

    • RyaN says:

      09:49am | 14/09/11

      Wow, just wow, this fool quoted a book that is specifically pointing out the ills of socialism and communism in an attempt to justify his communist/socialist ideals!

    • Anna C says:

      10:10am | 14/09/11

      Life isn’t fair Frank. Don’t you know that by now? Companies like Qantas get away with paying their foreign staff low wages because they can and apart from shaming them in the press and boycotting them there probably isn’t much we can do about it.

    • marley says:

      08:28am | 15/09/11

      Why on earth should Qantas be ashamed of paying people well by local standards? If you go overseas to, say, Bali or Malaysia, do you pay Aussie prices for your meals, or do you pay Balinese or Malaysian prices?

    • A Dose of Reality says:

      10:16am | 14/09/11

      I’m tired of the simplistic assertion that companies go offshore “because wages are too high in Australia” - what absolute crap.

      Companies go offshore because then they can ditch their core function. 

      For example, ‘Bonds’ decision to go offshore not too long ago.  They were a manufacturer (meaning they needed to have factories), now they are simply a distributor for goods they ‘design’ and someone else manufactures.

      Bonds are simply using massive chinese factories, who can devote part of a production line to bonds goods as specified.  Their massive capacity gives an economy of scale advantage to production - simple. 

      Per square metre the Chinese factory costs next to nothing (compared to Australia).  There are also vastly inferior OH&S regulations, reducing ongoing expenses.

      This means that the whole manufacturing department can be dropped, with the sale of capital asset giving a short term boost to the share price - and the executive can help themselves to the wages formerly paid to the employees.

      You might reflect on the ‘drop in prices’ of their goods since to determine if the whole process was to ‘remain/become competitive’ or a more cynical exercise (of continuing the ‘shareholder profits’ after the initial sale of assets).

      Of course, the shareholders no longer have a manufacturing company - nor do they have much in the way of capital assets.  They simply have a designer/distributor.

      I’s nothing to do with ‘wages’ (apart from who they go to), they are the smaller component to the equation.

    • Huey says:

      11:26am | 14/09/11

      @ Dose…Exactly right! Pacific Brands (the Bonds People) celebrated offshoring with exec bonuses and price rises. $ 12:00 for a pair of jocks.

    • mick says:

      12:09pm | 14/09/11

      Corporate Australia has been out of control for at least the last 2 decades. 

      We are currently seeing the NSW state government limiting pay rises for wage and salary earners.  And John Howard tried to turn Australia into a US style labour market where average people have little value.  At the same time corporate Australia has no limits to its ongoing high wage increases.  Year in, year out, whether a company does well or poorly they continue to plunder shareholder money as if it were their own, with no intervention from governments or the institutions which own the majority of shares, whose own executives then get a flow on with their remuneration.

      It is a dog’s breakfast.  Indeed “all pigs are equal.  But some are more equal then others”.  George Orwell got it right.  This is what we are seeing and given the evaporation of a fair tax system for the wealthy ordinary people are the ones who are and will continue to suffer.  Well we do get the government we deserve.

    • Zopo says:

      12:29pm | 14/09/11

      A doco I saw the other day showed how in the US a lot of businesses had shifted to China to reduce their labour costs. A decade later the minimum wages sin the US are on Par or slightly higher than tey are in some of the countries they moved to. So do these businesses move back to their homeland and employ their own?

      The thing about Asia is you can get away with more, but what people forget is that it doensn’t make it right. If a company moves its business to China or India, how much are they paying there employees, do they treat them well, do they get annual leave, do they get sick leave? These are the fundamentals that businesses are trying to avoid and at the same time pay them as low as possible as well.

    • Utopia Boy says:

      12:59pm | 14/09/11

      QANTAS is a sinking ship. Unfortunately the company keeps loading that ship with rats.
      QANTAS does not treat customers as if they’d like them to use it’s service again.
      These are the problems.
      Bye bye QANTAS.

    • Luke says:

      01:30pm | 14/09/11

      Frank, I realise you’re just using QANTAS as an example but think it’s simply a symptom of the way capitalism works.

      Corporations are the ultimate evil. There is not a single thing that isn’t a resource to them. Labour, environment, raw materials, customers, even the shareholders are just another way to get money for a corporation. It has devolved into a steaming pile of “us vs them”, where every dollar spent by them is one less dollar for their coffers. There is no impetus for a corporation to care about levelling the entire Amazon basin, buying all the arable land from the woefully poor in Africa, and if it wasn’t for some pesky laws I’m sure those at the top of the chain wouldn’t have any compunction with just killing people if it meant making a bit more profit (though this last point is easily refuted by looking into the USA’s private armies such as those run by Haliburton).

      Every decision made by a corporation is based around financial risk, nothing more. Car makers, upon finding a potential fault in a vehicle will have their bean counters work out the cost of a recall against the cost of paying out lawsuits. Who gives a toss if people are killed in accidents? Not the corporation – it’s worth the law suits if it means they save money by not recalling the dud vehicles.

      The adage of “money is the root of all evil” sums up a corporation. It is their one and only goal. The laws of every country that supports private enterprise ensures that there will never be any responsibility outside the letter of the law, that a corporation must adhere to.

      Defenders of true capitalism seem to overlook the vast amounts of laws that are in place to control the economic theory that they love so much. Anti-trust, anti-collusion, gifting, the list goes on. This is done because unbridled capitalism is broken from the outset. The first company that creates a monopoly, wins. They can undercut any competitors due to huge profits reaped from previous years, forcing the market to revert to a single entity only. Suppliers of raw materials will be forced to sell to the monopoly at the thinnest of margins, as that is effectively the only way they can earn money.

      Capitalism can’t and won’t fix this. No matter what a competitor may try to do to get some of that market share, the monopoly can destroy them (through acquisitions or force-outs). The consumer pays in the end. When there’s no choice but to pay top dollar for essential items, the monopoly becomes stronger.

      The western world is looking down the barrel of its hubris. The 80s saw the surge in the mantra “privatisation is best” and critical services were lost from the public. Power generation, water, rail systems, hospitals and schools. We’re paying more now that things aren’t about fair share, but about profit. Why sell 1kWh of electricity for $1 (when stations were government owned) when you can sell it for $5 (courtesy of private enterprise)? Everyone needs electricity. Companies are only motivated by the pursuit of the mighty dollar so will of course charge the most they can. There would be some soulless accountant who would work out the break even point between losses from defaults and the aboslute ceiling that the majority can pay.

      I will readily admit that governments have terrible records of wasting money in running services. In no way will I say that they’re more efficient than a private entity. But they are motivated by a different cause: they are nominally for the public, not the shareholders.

      I’m not saying that socialism or communism is any better, but arguing that capitalism is the shining beacon of good and right is simply false. Sure one might become a multi-millionaire, and good on them, but why are the people who clean their toilets are worth almost nothing? Those millionaires would be the first people to complain if they had to clean your own shit up, yet they expect some underpaid and overworked lackey to put their hands down their dunny just so they can see their reflection in the porcelain.

      The proponents of capitalism then argue that those cleaners are able to go out and educate themselves so they can ‘better themselves’. But they can’t, and the system ensures that it stays this way. The cost of education is exorbitant, even with government assistance. The fact that they work 10 hours a day cleaning other people’s piss and shit, means that they have virtually no time to work on assignments. They can’t quit and study full time because they still need to eat and live somewhere (ironically the government “wealth distribution” that is so despised tries to fix this problem; another aspect of how capitalism fails).

      Capitalism simply doesn’t work in the real world. Neither does socialism or communism. There always needs to be a mix.

      Sorry for the rant.

    • St. Michael says:

      10:27pm | 14/09/11

      “I’m not saying that socialism or communism is any better, but arguing that capitalism is the shining beacon of good and right is simply false. Sure one might become a multi-millionaire, and good on them, but why are the people who clean their toilets are worth almost nothing?”

      The short answer is: capitalism is the worst economic system imaginable, except for all the others.  Even China’s figured this out.

      Every other economic system leads to stagnation of the country that chooses it, and places politicians in positions of considerable wealth and influence.  Capitalism, by contrast, allows for different routes to prosperity.  It at least allows a chance to make an honest dollar.  It does not force you to pay an impost to support those who have simply chosen to be lazy.  Wealthy people in socialist or communist societies, almost by definition, have not been honest in getting there.  Simple fact is the guy who became a multi-millionaire in many cases sat down, thought up a good idea, and harnessed economies of scale to, in effect, replicate himself many times over.  The toilet cleaner has not figured this out as yet.  And in a more capitalist model, with the right amount of regulation—“Goldilocks regulation”, not too little, not too much—the toilet cleaner has as much a chance as anyone else to better himself, or, as is often a priority, his children.

      “The proponents of capitalism then argue that those cleaners are able to go out and educate themselves so they can ‘better themselves’. But they can’t, and the system ensures that it stays this way. The cost of education is exorbitant, even with government assistance.”

      But there’s the rub: if you look at the American system of public schools, invariably the model is one of tenured incompetents taking up space and wages, union intimidation at the expense of students, bad food due to poor government planning (Jamie Oliver’s Food Revolution in the USA touches on this), poverty, and a gutterbound destiny.  It (along with the US Army) is a remarkable bottled world which contains the last elements of socialist central planning in a country that otherwise has embraced capitalism, and the results are simple to see.

      The private schools (i.e. Catholic) are invariably a cut better.  I can’t remember the name, but Milton Friedman looked into this in a multiple-part video series, it’s on youtube somewhere.  “The system” you’re complaining about when it comes to education is not capitalism, it’s government bureaucracy, which is to say socialism as it is experienced anywhere other than Karl Marx’s masturbation sessions.

      In a more capitalist system of education, there’d be less of this since educators would have to shift to meet their market or go out of business.  They also wouldn’t be enclaves for the rich since literally everyone would go to a private school.

      In Australia, we actually operated without Departments of Education or state-funded and state-operated education until the 1880s or so.  All “public” schools were, in fact, private schools run by the church, or, in rural districts, basic schoolhouses where the parents had a whip round to pay a teacher to come out and teach.  I’m not suggesting the Australian public education system is quite as fucked up as the American one, but it’s a profound lesson since Australia’s culture and modes of operation seem to mirror the United States, albeit ten years after the fact.

    • St. Michael says:

      10:36pm | 14/09/11

      Also, P.S.:

      “I will readily admit that governments have terrible records of wasting money in running services. In no way will I say that they’re more efficient than a private entity. But they are motivated by a different cause: they are nominally for the public, not the shareholders.”

      Actually, I can give you a simple answer for why government-run facilities suck: because they are not at all motivated for the public, and have no rational incentive to do more than the absolute minimum.  Consider the average bit of “communal property” which isn’t the communal bong in a uni dorm.  When you say that something is communal property, that is, the property of everybody, the statistical response of people on a psychological and economic basis is to treat it as nobody’s property.  The public service, by and large, is a simple case of diminished responsibility at the institutional scale.

      Politicians, who are the top of the tree of the government system and should probably exemplify being motivated for the public, are in fact motivated by nothing but electoral results and self-interest.  Name me one politician who willingly and knowingly committed electoral suicide because it was “the right thing to do”.  (Julia Gillard does not count, nor any other politician who’s self-deluded, nor any decision of an MP who was retiring anyway and whose motivations therefore are not the normal kind.)  In the American model, it’s endemic; in the Australian model, visible and growing.

      And that’s the best the government system has to offer.  It only gets worse the deeper into the public system you dive.  No incentivisation directed towards the public interest; no improvement in public facilities.  I’d challenge any public works department to consider piece rate bonuses for every good government job done.  Guaranteed not one union would let it through, because whether consciously or unconsciously matching performance to pay is the death of a union and the death of the slacker public servant.

    • Luke says:

      07:53am | 15/09/11

      Wow, thanks for those reasoned responses St Michael. It certainly gives me food for thought. Rather than blindly argue my opinion here, I shall look into your points and try and find out where I may be wrong.

      Your comment about politicians is spot on too. Liberal or Labor, they’re all the same. There is no “for the greater good” going on in those parties (the Greens may have it, but they’re seriously deluded about how effective their policies would be) and the loathing I have for the self-serving power-junkies in parliament of all levels makes me think Very Bad Things.

    • St. Michael says:

      11:09am | 15/09/11

      @ Luke:

      Cheers.  In terms of a brief bibliography, I’d cite “The Ascent of Money”, “The Logic of Life”, Milton Friedman’s documentary as indicated, and, on the American public school system, the recent documentary “Waiting for Superman”.  Details on Australia’s public school history are from education department websites; it’s pretty straightfoward to google.

    • Luke says:

      12:54pm | 15/09/11

      Thanks mate. I will be looking into it.

    • Kate says:

      02:11pm | 14/09/11

      Interesting piece Frank about the pressures on CEOs to pursue cost cutting to collect their bonuses.

      It reminds me of a time in Australia when companies were happy to make “healthy profits” but invest in their businesses. I recall watching Business Sunday (I was a kid) and seeing a reporter (I think it was Janine Perrett)  interview Al Chainsaw Dunlop. She asked him: “How much profit is enough?”  He looked shocked and grunted in reply: “No amount of profit is ever enough.” That question now sounds naive now but it was a sign of a changing time.

    • Kate again says:

      02:30pm | 14/09/11

      Just a bit more history, for those who have not heard of Al Chainsaw Dunlap, he got the nicknames “Chainsaw” and “Rambo in pinstripes” by turning businesses around by firing loads of employees. He wrote the book “Mean Business”, loved his one liners such as: “If you want a friend, buy a dog.” He made the hefty workforce cuts to increase profits strategy the go and said the only real stakeholders in a public corporation were its investors. He became the “poster boy” for shareholder wealth. He is said to have mentored James Packer.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      02:48pm | 14/09/11

      Why should a priest employed & paid by by the Catholic Church be allowed to take a job for which there are 100’s of 1000s of other better qualified people available be employed by the SA State Government & paid a reported $115,000 a year?
      Oh! I get it! He’s got an Italian-sounding name & the current Premier of SA thinks nothing of handing over untold millions to an Italian town of which no-one, other than those who have family & property there, has ever heard of. Then he, quite unneccessarily as the Feds provide one already, employs another man with an Italian-sounding name to be “Envoy to Italy”.
      Now, not tobe out-done, Julia Gillard has also agreed to employ this priest in a Mental Health Job - again a job for which there are, if not 100s then certainly 10s of 1000s of very highly qualified Mental Health Professionals who are better qualified for this highly-paid position - if he’s getting $115k in SA he’s probably getting 2 or 3 times that in Canberra.
      This man would be better employed in ensuring that his fellow-priests were keeping their pants & undies on thereby ensuring they were not raping & having sex with young boys & girls & forcing his bosses to report all sex abuse to the police rather than allowing them to cover it all up.

    • left turn only says:

      04:49pm | 14/09/11

      Capitalism likes to avoid christian and muslim values.
      Ethics, morals and values are history. Capitalism is dying!
      Not even Captain Catholic and the Mad Monks have ethics ,morals and values now!Ask Nick Xenathon under parliamentary priviledge!

    • Dodge says:

      06:26pm | 14/09/11

      Evolved Capitalism is the shot. One that takes in the working elements of the various Political Systems.

      Surely the success of China’s growing capitalism fused with Socialism has shown what CAN work. I certainly do not endorse that form of government mind you.

      America is dying a slow death due to the destruction of the middle class and rampant Capitalism - just as China will be realising problems with attempting to sate their expanding middle class. All of the most successful economies have a thriving middle class. When I was growing up, it was things like ‘the average wage’ that had people in awe of the States, watching CEO salaries skyrocket while all other sectors stagnate is a disaster.

      Luke above is mostly correct. There HAS to be losers in a Capitalist system (just as ALL people are losers with Communism), so there must be a fine balance in not allowing the divide become too large. For there to be safety nets. It’s just reality. Or you accept massive social issues - sadly I think many neo conservatives are perfectly happy with that as long as they can sit perched in their ivory towers observing their domain.

    • St. Michael says:

      10:38pm | 14/09/11

      Only quibble I have here is with the categorisation of China as a “success”.  Until they open their economic books, so to speak, they can and should be cautiously categorised as “possible Ponzi scheme”.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      09:36am | 15/09/11

      Until China allows the people to decide, by popular, free votes then it cannot be called a “Success” We are reliably told that it is not possible to do business in China without the permission of the Communist Government & that to succeed requres considerable amounts of money being paid to officials. In other words Bribery. I don’t doubt for one second that the same things go on in our capitalist society but China has what can only be regarded as a “Super Elite” to be part of it you have to be a Member of the Communist Party, you have tobe prepared to deny, by force if necessary, fellow-citizens the right to demonstrate, oppose, set up alternate political parties. In the old USSR = indeed all Communist Regimes = they had special shops stocked with all the luxuries, from designer clothes, the very best alcohol, foods - everything all at rock-bottom, government subsidised prices which were only open to Senior Communist Party aparatchiks. They, unlike all the rest, were allowed to own their homes & holiday homes.
      When Chian abandons it’s dictatorship, opens it’s books, floats it’s currency & starts playing on the same playing field the rest of us are expected - inculding hypocritically by the Chinese Government - to do then & only then will the world be able to judge China & declare it to be a success.

 

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