Don’t worry if you don’t understand what the ETS is supposed to do or what the letters even stand for. You’re not alone.

This man was scared and confused when we asked him what an ETS was

Peter had no idea what the letters E, T and S stood for when we asked him, but did manage his own summary of the policy:  ‘It’s gonna cost extra. You don’t get anything for free. Soon they will be taxing the air that we breathe.” Well they kinda are actually Pete, at least what we put into it.

With all the debate about Climate Change and the focus very much on the ETS, here at The Punch we decided it would be a good idea to go out and see what people actually knew about it.

Over two beautiful Sydney days, we asked one hundred people for answers to the following in a bid to gauge understanding of the Emmissions Trading Scheme:

1 The Federal Government plans to introduce something called the ETS. Do you know what this stands for? (Correct Answer was: Emissions Trading Scheme)
2. When is it expected to start? (Correct Answer was: 2011)
3. How much is it expected to add to household bills for
a. Gas (Correct Answer was: $2 a week)
b. Electricity (Correct Answer was: $4 a week)

A total of 15 out of 100 people surveyed by the Punch got question one right, with lots coming close and figuring that it had to be an environmental/economic trading/technical strategy/system.

There was, nonetheless, a wide variety of answers including this one from Liam of Mooney who thought it would serve as a useful part of the engine: “Is it the electronic transmission system?”

Four people managed to answer question two correctly, with everyone else guessing somewhere between tomorrow and 2015. (For the record lots of people mentioned the Copenhagen talks and Labor’s eagerness to have something lined up before December but management at The Punch decided we couldn’t give out partial credit…)

Question three, and undoubtedly the hardest, had lots of people guessing anywhere between 0.4% to 40%,  $2 a week to $300 a month.

They more commonly knew that the ETS would impact on food prices, increasing them by 1% to 6%.

One out of a hundred got part of question three right: the amazing Ashwin from Quakers Hill … but he just guessed right.

So what do we learn from all this?

Well, at least from our sample, we can say that most people are completely unaware of the impact one of the most important political debates in years will have on both their wallets and their lives.

It also illustrates one of the flaws in the current polling and political debate generally, which tends to ask people whether or not they support an ETS under the assumption that they actually know what an ETS is and what it will do.

Ignorance of the ETS is not an argument against its introduction but it does beg the question as to how Australians can have an informed debate on the issue the Prime Minister calls “the great challenge of our time”.

Below are the highlights:

1. The Federal Government plans to introduce something called the ETS. Do you know what this stands for?

Ian and Julie, Maitland: “To do with Climate Change it’s the Economic, Economic… something…”

Adam, Sutherland: “Early Tax System”

Liam, Mooney: “Is it the Electronic Transmission System?”

Louise, Redfern: “It’s the Environmental Trading Scheme isn’t it?”

Peter, Wentworthville: “No, I don’t know anything.”

Heath, Dubbo: “It’s something to do with the environment, but no idea what it stands for.”

Duncan, Leichhardt: “No I don’t – if I were to guess Electronic Transfer Scheme…”

Clare, Summer Hill: “No… hang on is this the Global Emissions Trading Scheme?”

Helen, Annandale: “Electronic something something. It’s Kevin Rudd’s new baby.”

Kehani, Surry Hills: “I forget, I know something about it. It’s a scheme. Electrical Tax Scheme?”

Chris, Cremorne: “Never heard of it. Is it that carbon thing?”

Huntley, Double Bay: “Emissions trading system”.

2. When is it expected to start?

Brian, Perth: “When all three major parties agree to terms it will be introduced next year with targets for 2020.”

Sandeep, Homebush: “Don’t know.”

John, Erskineville: “Well I don’t know what the bill is, so how could I know when it starts?”

Helen, Annandale: “Because of lack of money it’s been delayed. It will probably be ready next year just in time for the next election.”

Tom, Glebe: “I don’t know when it’s expected to start so no. Are they advertising it at all?”

Peter, Croydon: “Guess I’d say after the legislation is passed so… 1st January 2010”

Ross, Cheltenham: “Government is trying to get it up before Copenhagen.”

Huntley, Double Bay: “Kevin 07 wants it as soon as possible doesn’t he? So that he can continue his campaign for UN Secretary General”

Joyce, Campsie: “That’s up to the foreign minister isn’t it?”

Judy, Sydney: “When it goes through Parliament”

Susan, Edgecliff: “2007”


3. How much is it expected to add to household bills for a. gas and b. electricity?

Meghan, “Camden: 5%?”

Brian, Perth: “25% annually”

Andrew, Caringbah: “I’d say it would be substantial, because the costs of power generation will go up.”

Shirley, Manly: “I’m very up on things but I don’t know… Put it on the news, then we’ll all know!”

Carmen, Peakhurst: “I’d presume it’s going to cost a lot, everything always does.”

Jedendra, Blacktown: “Quite substantial. I read it in the Telegraph but I forgot.”

Bou, Bankstown: $56

Ben, Miranda: “I know that food prices will rise 1%, or according to the opposition, 6%.”

Macarthur, Ashfield: “$25 a week is it? They’re talking in the range of 40% aren’t they?”

Duncan, Leichardt: “Well it depends on who you listen to. Some say 0.4%, others are saying 4-5%.”

Louise, Redfern: “Don’t know but I heard that food is going up by 6 percent.”

Judy, Sydney: “I don’t know but I’ve heard it’s going to be pretty horrific.”

Ashwin, Quakers Hill: “At a guess I’d say $2 a week”

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36 comments

Show oldest | newest first

    • David says:

      08:00am | 24/08/09

      There are some dumb people out there and they all love our Kevvy ,, you remember his opening political gambit ...  ‘’ I’m Kevin , and I am here to help ! ‘’
      He is helping , helping us into the poor house of socialism !!!!
      Global warming with the ETS IS JUST ANOTHER TAX !!!!!! and will have problems .
      Google up .. Mr Pipik global warming .. laugh and lessen the depression .

    • Shel says:

      08:51am | 24/08/09

      The Australian people are so ignorant. Pick up a newspaper or turn your television on to the news.

      Decisions are made by those who show up. Be informed and be part of the debate. This is one of the biggest policy changes in the history of our country/

    • Bruce says:

      09:00am | 24/08/09

      I certainly do not know how an ETS scheme is going to work and what its benefit is to me firstly, and then Australia. Can we receive a fully detailed document explaining what is involved and what is the benefit? At the moment an “ETS” is just a political buzz acronym.

    • Dude says:

      09:15am | 24/08/09

      Generaly speaking, if we could get most of the rightards out of the media and education and back behind the pulpits of ignorance the public might learn something. Sadly the nongovernment news and current affairs sector is controlled by the interests of money and geared to keep an apathetic people ignorant so that rightardation can spread unabated. ‘Where ignorance abides rightardation multiplies’!

    • John says:

      09:59am | 24/08/09

      I wouldn’t say I’m ignorant however I had no idea about the numbers for gas and electricity. I’ve heard them and read them but didn’t apparently did not find the figures important enough to commit to memory.

      With your gas and electricity numbers, is that based on the average Sydney household. Or the average Australian household?

      Just curious, as a stat student, where did you interview these people?

    • Chris says:

      10:30am | 24/08/09

      I’m so sick of people supporting shit they don’t even understand!

    • Dude says:

      10:42am | 24/08/09

      Yer, it’s called rightardation!

    • Sherlock says:

      10:58am | 24/08/09

      After seeing surveys stating that the majority of Australians are in favour of an ETS I have no doubt that the same majority of Australian have no idea what they approve of.

      An ETS will invade every aspect of your life. It will cost the Australian tax-payer up to $20 billion per year yet it will not do a single thing to mitigate the effects of climate change. It won’t extend the life of the Great Barrier Reef by a single day or lower global temperatures by even a thousandth of a degree.

      Anyone who is in favour of something that cost so much with no benefits is beyond insane.

    • Tom says:

      11:21am | 24/08/09

      I am intrigued was the ‘editorial’ team and writers of this yarn surprised by the findings?

    • phil says:

      11:20am | 24/08/09

      The problem is the cost to the eviroment has never been factored into the cost of doing business. The freeride is coming to an end and some people don’t seem to understand the issues. It’s great to see there’s a majority that understand this even though they haven’t got a full handle on it. It’s those who nonthink that Jesus is coming back to fix the problems that worry me!

    • Susan says:

      11:43am | 24/08/09

      I understand the ETS pretty well, I’ve done work discussing the Australian and US proposals, as well as some alternative ideas. The biggest trouble the debate has is that commentators get bogged down in the details, and so we assume “support” by the average punter means this explicit plan rather than the concept.

      I think the polls suggest that Australians are in favour of the general principle (i.e. some form of charge on carbon that means the least-cost method of production for businesses uses a mix of a carbon tax and using more efficient processes to reduce emissions), rather than a specific scheme.

      It would be interesting to see how the results differed in a two-question poll where people where first asked “Do you support the Government’s plan to introduce a scheme to reduce carbon emissions?” and then asked “Do you support the Government’s proposed CPRS with a guaranteed 5% reduction on 1990 levels in emissions by 2020, rising to 15-25% if an international agreement is reached, with significant early years exemptions or reductions for carbon-intensive industries like coal fired power and agriculture and trade-exposed industries, with a long-term all-inclusive target of a 60% by 2050?”

      I suspect support for question 1 would be much higher than 2, kind of like the polls seen around whether people supported Australia becoming a republic versus whether they supported John Howard’s proposed 2/3 parliament majority presidential system.

    • CA says:

      12:05pm | 24/08/09

      Scarey!

    • Margaret Gray says:

      12:18pm | 24/08/09

      Kevin said it would cost each household ONE DOLLAR.

      When the Prime Minister clearly lies to you about the costs of an ETS, how can you support him or his policy?

    • SS says:

      12:36pm | 24/08/09

      Bruce,

      There is. It’s called the CPRS White Paper.

    • Phil says:

      12:36pm | 24/08/09

      @Chris

      The reason we elect politicians is so they can go through all the details and work it out without the public needing to micromanage every spending decision and bill amendment.

      We elect our members to represent our wishes at a broad level, and then it’s up to them to sort out the details.

      If I had time to do that stuff, I’d be in politics myself.  Actually, if I had time to service my own car, grow my own food, make my own clothes I’d probably do that too.

      This government had a mandate to do three things:
      1. Tear up work choices
      2. Apologise to the stolen generation
      3. Take climate change seriously and do something

      If you were to be completely cynical, it doesn’t even matter WHAT they do - as long as they do something.  Then let the electorate judge them at the next election.

    • joe says:

      01:30pm | 24/08/09

      Thank you for looking into this. It shows how stupid all the polls are that say 80% of people want something done for the environment That’s like saying 80% of people support helping aborigines. No one know what the ETS is so you can’t ask them if they support it.

      If only the Libs had started informing the public over a year ago how bad an ETS was to us all we might be more informed and Turnbill would be more popular. Thank God the Nats are starting to do this. I agree with Barnaby when he said yesterday “The National Party is turning people’s views around on this and we are winning.” Whereas the Libs are trying to be greener, cleverer, or quicker or something. Yeah right that will win votes from Greens.

      This also shows that the public aren’t really listening to Rudd’s verbal diarrhea on this. (Don’t flatter yourself Kevin)

    • joe says:

      01:36pm | 24/08/09

      @Phil I think your line is very alarming and sums it up totally “it doesn’t even matter WHAT they do - as long as they do something.” People don’t care what Rudd is actually doing. That is the big problem. Its all about spinning and appearing to do something. Weren’t the Libs actually bringing in an ETS before the last election? Don’t let that fact get in the way, the media made it appear they weren’t doing anything. I would much rather have a real debate that something that is actually good for Australia is done (and not just good for Rudd’s UN job).

    • Jason says:

      01:58pm | 24/08/09

      Most people think global warming is man made anyway so I wouldn’t expect them to know their arse from their elbow.  People who do their own research usually find that ice core data alone is enough to discredit the global warming hypothesis and understand that ETS is just another stupidity tax.

    • Margaret says:

      02:25pm | 24/08/09

      Australians voted for a change of government and a warm fuzzy feeling because the ALP wanted to help the environmen by signing Kyoto.

      They did not vote for more costs nor more paper work nor disruption to their day to day life.

    • steve says:

      02:37pm | 24/08/09

      Be interesting to go back and look at the amount of election spend/time that was devoted to Work Choices versus the Introduction of an ETS to reduce carbon pollution.  When they say they have a mandate to introduce the ETS (or the CPRS as its now known) I’ve never been convined that it was something to which they had seriously proposed as an option.  We heard warm fuzzies about the environment and the necessity to act on Kyoto, but I can’t recall an ad blitz on this specific topic.  What would some analysis on the relative media spend on the two different subjects show?

    • Shane From Melbourne says:

      03:17pm | 24/08/09

      The free ride ain’t coming to an end. Various industries and sectors will have subsidies, exemptions etc courtesy of the tax payer. I recall Europe has a similar ETS system- criticisms include overallocation of permits, method of distribution of permits, volatility of price controls etc. I personally favor a carbon tax upon domestic industries and imports into Australia rated upon the amount of carbon emissions- light, medium, or heavy required to produce the good or service. A simpler system, less prone to rorting and affecting international competitor products within Australia.

    • Phil says:

      03:18pm | 24/08/09

      @Joe

      To be fair, I was using hyperbole for effect, but my point remains.

      Governments are elected to achieve their mandates, and unless individuals are particularly interested, the minutiae of the implementation of those agendas are mostly irrelevant.

      John Howard’s GST was a classic example.  Nobody knew all the tiny details before the election, and yet he still won government, and got on with the business of implementing it.

      If you want to argue the details of the ETS, then that is fine, but you can hardly oppose them trying to install a scheme they have a clear mandate to implement.

    • Glen says:

      03:35pm | 24/08/09

      Australians voted to change gov’t because we were tired of Howard and Labor conned us into voting for them as they said they would do the things that we wanted.  Unfortunatey we didn’t get what we wanted which is what usualy happens in politics.  From what Ihave observe rudd does 4things well:
      he says a lot of empty words
      he rewrites history
      he forgets his pomises
      he spends our money.
      It is the last point that is most worying as he seems to have no qualms about spending large amounts of money for little if any proven return and shackling us with enormous debt.  He even believes his own spin about us loving him.  He doesn’t represent us, neither party does, however, strangely enough the Nationals seems to have worked out that if you listen to the people there are votes in it.

    • David C says:

      04:26pm | 24/08/09

      I believe the electrorate voted or a change in thinking on the environment, I believe a lot of that has been accomplished with the renewable energy bill. I think people view this as a sensible way to provide the country with energy independence and security. I believe they are becoming fatigued with all the doomsday/ catastrophic climate predictions and are thus tuning out to the ETS/CPRS. If there is no global agreement in Copenhagen it aint happening here. (Plase note this is what I believe the electorate thinks, it is not what I think or what I believe to be right )

    • Stumped says:

      04:37pm | 24/08/09

      I’m hardly surprised. Most people “want to do something about the environment”. Not being experts in ecological science, international trade and national fiscal policy we tend to hope that whoever is in charge (Presumably the Government but many would argue that the Opposition hold them to ransom in the senate so it’s not clear who is actually in charge) will do the right thing.

      I have some vague recollection of a similar survey before the federal election pointing out that most people don’t know which matters are the responsibility of the feds and which are state matters -  the point being that if the electorate don’t even know what they are voting for how can they make the right decision.

      Anyway, I digress, even with the above in mind people will determine their vote on which ever policy area matters most to them whether it be environment, social services, fiscal policy, paid-maternity leave, national security etc etc -  they may not agree with all of the policies of a party but they will vote based on one policy they actually care about and find themselves stuck with the other policies of that party (whether they knew about them or not).

      Then you get to the real mess of it all - party politics - the interests of the more remote electorates will have little in common with the city dwellers - yet their representative will be expected to follow the party line even when it’s against the interests of their electorate. If only ‘crossing the floor’ were an every day occurrence. I mean the fact that a “conscience vote” is a rare things suggests that most of their votes are unconscionable, or at best done free of conscience.

    • cat says:

      07:24pm | 24/08/09

      I find it surprising that people would (like a mob of dumb sheep ,sorry sheep!) willingly pauper a whole country just so it looks like we’re ‘doing something’. Kruddy’s used to throwing around other people’s money without worrying if it’s going in the right direction or not - he was a bureaucrat after all!

    • Andrew says:

      08:38pm | 24/08/09

      0% of the writers of this article know that the government wants to introduce the CPRS not the ETS.

    • KeIThY says:

      09:18pm | 24/08/09

      Honestly, wouldn’t Australia be a better place if we all voted Liberal and smoked crack in between lying through our teeth to our fellow man. Dad can buy us all Tiger Prawns and we can drink the weekend away pretending we have a clue how the world works while Mum crys in the corner about how she’s trapped in a ridiculous joke of a family with no values- just lots of fancy cars!

    • Steve says:

      10:10pm | 24/08/09

      Trying to change the weather by reducing CO2 is like the fleas on a dog’s back trying to direct the dog. CO2 has little effect on the radiant heat retention over 160ppmv. The max retention is 1.5 DegC at 20ppmv then the effect FALLS as the concentration rises due to refractive saturation. it reflects more than it absorbs. 20ppm-1.5 DegC 40ppm-0.8DegC 80ppm-0.4DegC 140 160 ppm under 0.2DegC Then it just stays the same. SO the CO2 could Fall to 200ppm and rise to 800ppm and not alter the greenhouse effect at one jot.
      Anyway the bottom line is the only figure that cuts the greenhouse effect of CO2 is ZERO which is impossible. Sorry kiddies that is the science and the rest is just pollitical spinand opinion. A cynical excuse to introduce an tax bigger than the GST. You want to see how these work look at Spain.

    • Shelley says:

      04:44pm | 25/08/09

      85% of Australians do not know what an ETS is.

      Rudd has a problem that his spin doctors are doing a fantastic job of papering over.

      They have moved from ‘the science is settled on global warming’ to ‘show us the money or the opera house gets it’ without any shame at all.

      Shysters, scamers and thieves

      Extortionists extraordinarus!

    • Old Clive says:

      06:03pm | 25/08/09

      I think it stands for everyone talks shit, when the polluters of the northern hemisphere get fair dinkum, we can think about it. When someone explains to me why we have a magnetic north and a wobbly earth that is moving on its wobbly axis and what part that plays on our climate change as well as all our man made pollutants, then and only then will I start to believe all this drivel that Rudd and Co are coming out with, and when he stops polluting the sky with his 747 will I think he might be fair dinkum

    • Eat The Rich says:

      07:33pm | 25/08/09

      Love the responses, particularly “Quite substantial. I read it in the Telegraph but I forgot.”
      That’s Gold.

    • AKoiLus says:

      03:46pm | 26/08/09

      Why should Australia be the first (again) to reverse something the rest of the developed world mostly causes? Australia has 0.32 per cent of the world’s population, and only produces 1.43 per cent of the carbon dioxide. (smh May 22, 2007) Yet to keep an election promise Rudd want’s to give corporate Australia an opportunity to mark up prices, create a new false economy in carbon trading, which lets face it… Allows the worst corp. offenders to keep on keeping on. Provided they pay a little more for it, whilst the real ones handing over the hard cash are the hoipolloi.
      When the U.S, China, India, and the E.U. Get serious then I’ll be willing to pay. Until then stop getting new laws created to steal more of my money.

      BTW. I’ve been for and against the reality of global warming since 1987, but from what I now understand about the Sun and our wobbly world. We would have better luck asking the Sun to pull back on a few megawatts.
      See this site if you need the science: http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/sun_output_030320.html

      Q. why do politicians keep the bad promises and dump the good ones? Jeez!

    • Shmemley says:

      12:20am | 28/08/09

      Wake up people! The ETS is a political solution to a non-existant problem. It’s just another ‘cleverly’ disguised tax grab by the federal government - just like the alcopops tax

    • STuart says:

      03:09am | 28/08/09

      I explained the ETS and the Carbon Con and it took about 2 hours to go through so I am fairly up to speed with it
      It is a foundation blok of the New WOrld Order Global Enslavement Grid
      Stuart Edwards

 

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