A surprisingly honest tarot reader at ‘Psychic Tarot Insights’ has tried to locate Jill Meagher.

Here’s the surprisingly honest (if understated) bit:

“Tarot is not considered 100 per cent accurate by law and I cannot claim to solve issues only show what I have in the cards.”


They go on to say that something must have happened quickly; that there was a male person, stronger than her; there MIGHT be a car… something something rural area something something eight weeks something something sex and weapons and south east and someone tall and strong. And a horse. Maybe a church. A dog. “Other possible links are deserts, woods, obscure valleys, caves, dens, holes, mountains, churchyards, ruined buildings, coalmines, muddy places, wells, houses, offices.”

“Perhaps some of this information will help I can’t be sure until information comes in to verify it.”

It won’t help. It’s just random information that could only befuddle a believer, impart false hope, or infuriate someone trying their best to see through the storm of information and misinformation surrounding Ms Meagher’s disappearance.

The Australian reports that a vagueness of psychics (is that the collective noun? Other suggestions include a ‘fraud’, or a ‘divination’…) have claimed to “have insight” into the case.

When people go missing or are murdered, psychic detectives move in. They approach police or families to offer their ‘help’. Sometimes for money.

Some are probably deluded, some are outright frauds, all of them are wrong. If something matches, it’s a fluke.

Some people are very skilled ‘mentalists’, they may be good at reading tiny facial twitches or cues, they may have good intuition. That’s as good as it gets, unfortunately.

In an excellent example of trickery, a Belgian ‘mind reader’ (above) has revealed his secrets, to gasps of disbelief. He hauled in unsuspecting marks, revealed all sorts of information about them – down to what should be very personal private information.

“Scary,” says one of his victims. And it is scary, especially when the mind reader dramatically pulls back curtains to show that a group of researchers (hackers?) on computers are responsible for gathering the information.

“Your entire life is online,” the ad warns. “Be vigilant”.

Well that’s one cat out of the bag; psychics use the internet. Most probably aren’t smart enough to work out your bank account number but most of them would be able to Google the hell out of you and find out the name of your beloved hamster.

Plenty of stage psychics have been busted doing ‘hot readings’, sneakily gathering information before the session. Most of them do ‘cold readings’, a scattergun approach where they rapid-fire guesses and a hopeful audience clings to the strikes.

“M, I’m getting an M, do you know someone who’s passed over who has an M in their name?”

“No, maybe it’s my hearing, maybe it’s an N….”

It’s a performance; it’s entertaining; I Call Bullshit. It’s bullshit. Psychics may well think they have something to contribute.

But if they think they have the right to approach a family that is bewildered, traumatised, or mourning, it’s clear they don’t have some extraordinary brain thing going on. It’s clear they don’t even have the basics of understanding.

Most commented


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    • Gregg says:

      06:30am | 27/09/12

      I doubt you’ll have too many if any at all doubters on this one Tory.
      People close to Jill, as in her family and closest of friends will be going out of their mind over concern and you’d think there ought to be a law against harassment by people making it worse for them.

    • Tedd says:

      06:46am | 27/09/12

      Anyone claiming to know or be immersed in “the supernatural” are deluded.

      There are many aspects to epistemology, but speculation is not one of them.

    • Richard says:

      09:51am | 27/09/12

      That is a shallow view Tedd, and so is Tory’s. I use the I Ching, and I find it can give valuable insights. Much greater thinkers than either you or Tory, Tedd, have used the I Ching and found it valuable too.

      Take Carl Jung for example, perhaps the greatest psychologist of the 20th century. He wrote the foreward to Wilhelm Reich’s translation of the I Ching: http://www.iging.com/intro/foreword.htm

      “In other words, ... The hexagram was understood to be an indicator of the essential situation prevailing in the moment of its origin.

      This assumption involves a certain curious principle that I have termed synchronicity,[2] a concept that formulates a point of view diametrically opposed to that of causality. Since the latter is a merely statistical truth and not absolute, it is a sort of working hypothesis of how events evolve one out of another, whereas synchronicity takes the coincidence of events in space and time as meaning something more than mere chance, namely, a peculiar interdependence of objective events among themselves as well as with the subjective (psychic) states of the observer or observers.”

      Synchronicity is truly a fascinating phenomenon: you can read a little more about it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronicity
      “just as events may be grouped by cause, they may also be grouped by meaning. A grouping of events by meaning need not have an explanation in terms of cause and effect.”

      My point is, Carl Jung, the greatest mind Doctor in history, was certainly not “deluded”, and if you or Tory think he was, then YOU are the two who are deluded.

      If divination was good enough for Jung, its pompous and small/narrow-minded for you two to dismiss it.

    • Al says:

      10:28am | 27/09/12

      Richard - the only problem with your statement is this.

      It can’t perform under laboratory conditions. It relies on the user to interpret what the I-ching says. As such 2 people using it can get 2 different (and contradictory) messages from the same result. You could also simply use dice with pre assigned outcomes for the different results (hey, I have a table for that in one of my Role Playing Games, “catastrophic failure, you explode, mess everywhere”).

      While using it to get inspiration to look at something from a different angle won’t hurt, providing this to another as a truth is simple fraud as you are not able to interpret the message for them acurately.
      And also make sure you don’t base your decisions solely on what the I Ching says, that would be very silly.

    • Shane says:

      10:48am | 27/09/12

      Richard, Your appeal to authority not withstanding, Jung maybe wasn’t deluded just gullible. Jung was so taken by coincidence he coined the word synchronicity. Jung is a perfect example of how smart people can believe really dumb things. The I Ching is no better than tarot or astrology.

    • Lisa Meredith says:

      11:42am | 27/09/12

      Dear Richard,

      Are you sure you’re not just seeing what you already believe? What steps would one take to rule this out?

    • warren says:

      12:40pm | 27/09/12


      “I use the I Ching, and I find it can give valuable insights.”

      Which is the same thing said by EVERY practitioner of magic, whether they’re an astrologer, tea-leaf reader or psychic.

      Yet none of these people can provide “valuable insights” that are actually useful, testable and reproducible.

      Out of all the millions of people who engage in this stuff, NOT ONE has been able to reproduce anything statistically interesting in a controlled test or environment. NOT ONE. EVER. 

      And because they can’t reproduce their results, they instead attack the unbelievers.  They dispute the science, make up their own rules, play the man and generally avoid accountability.

      A great prophet once said “a man believes what he wants to believe, and disregards the rest”.  If you want to believe in magic, thats entirely up to you, but just don’t expect to convince anyone else. Unless they’re a fool.

    • neo says:

      02:25pm | 27/09/12

      To date, not a single “psychic” has proven the truth of their abilities. There was a $1 mil reward to anyone who could prove any supernatural ability, none has been. Not a single case of using “psychics” to solve a criminal matter has been successful. Charlatans.

      As for the girl, we must face up to the fact that she is likely dead by now. Thoughts and prayers to their family.

    • Ben says:

      05:25pm | 27/09/12

      >>That is a shallow view Tedd, and so is Tory’s. I use the I Ching, and I find it can give valuable insights.

      Certainly does, Richard. Ching-ching! Ching-ching!

    • Felice says:

      06:50am | 27/09/12

      This is just such rubbish
      Could be a church…country….car. Of course there’s a car ....even if it’s one driving past Jill.
      I can’t stand people who prey on those in vulnerable situations !!!!

    • the cynic says:

      02:10pm | 27/09/12

      You are wrong Felice. It’s not rubbish . I can forsee the future and have proved it many times. Only yesterday I said to the missus that she will be at the vets later on . And guess what? She was. When she got home later after that she asked how I knew . Told her that as soon as I saw Sruffy the mongrel that humps anything he sees scooting along the grass on his arse when I got up in the morning that she better take him to the vets to get his worm shots. Now,  am I Psychic or what? I am still hungry,  she refused to cook dinner last night!

    • Onlooker says:

      07:37am | 27/09/12

      I think is all mumbo jumbo and I hope these kooks are not giving the family false hope. It is a traumatic time for the family, I can’t understand how they are still allowed to ply their shonky trade. They prey on the vunerable

    • Rossco says:

      07:41am | 27/09/12

      Great article Tory, it’s about time these frauds, fakes and phoneys were exposed for what they are. Problem is people are all too ready to believe the bullshit without taking a pause of rational skepticism.

    • Tubesteak says:

      07:53am | 27/09/12

      People that believe in psychics or astrology or any of that other hippy new-age (which isn’t as old as they like to claim) drivel are as stupid as the ones that believe in sky-fairies, imaginary friends and zombies.

    • Craig says:

      08:42am | 27/09/12

      Agreed. I pray to god the physics lay off they say. LOL.

    • Phil says:

      08:52am | 27/09/12

      How dare anyone believe something you don’t.
      I mean the nerve of them!

      How intolerant.

      Let people believe whatever crap they want to but in situations like this don’t let them turn up and spout what powers they have to get media attention, it does more harm than good and is nothing more about taking advantage of people in a situation which many will accept false hope given by these people.

      If the family wanted a physic they would find one.

    • Chris L says:

      08:56am | 27/09/12

      Yeah! But vampires are real, I saw a documentary about it.

    • Tubesteak says:

      12:15pm | 27/09/12

      I have no respect, time or tolerance for people that don’t believe in science. Never have. Never will.

      Chris L
      Now that Lilith has taken over Bill we all better watch out. The revelation is over. Who knows what will happen next.

    • Anne71 says:

      12:34pm | 27/09/12

      Tubesteak -  “I have no respect, time or tolerance for people that don’t believe in science. Never have. Never will”

      And I have no respect for those who cannot accept that people are entitled to believe whatever they like - as long as they don’t try to force their beliefs onto others.

    • egg says:

      12:43pm | 27/09/12

      @Tubesteak, I believe you’re referring to Billith.

    • warren says:

      12:45pm | 27/09/12


      I’m a skeptic by nature, and have a strong interest in science, but I don’t have a “belief” in science.

      It’s not something that requires a belief system.

      You don’t have to believe in science in order to do science, nor do you need belief to accept the results of the scientific method.

      And that’s the great difference between science and other ways of thinking.  The observations come before the belief, and inform a belief, rather than the other way around.

      Having said that, I respect many people who have supernatural beliefs.  That’s entirely up to them.  Respect is earned by what people do, not merely by how they think about things.

      To my mind, a dangerous zealot is a dangerous zealot, whether it’s an atheistic marxist with grand scientific plans, or some mother-earth-humans-are-bad-goddess-botherer.

    • Lukew says:

      01:12pm | 27/09/12

      That’s right Tubesteak, I ‘believed’ in science then I found out that the earth was actually round.

    • Rowdy says:

      01:40pm | 27/09/12

      The earth is not round…..I sense that it is an oblate spheroid.

    • Willie says:

      02:45pm | 27/09/12

      I really do have an imaginary friend. Although I’m not sure if her imaginary friend is real or if she just made it up.
      And there are scientific explanations for zombies. Certain viruses can change the behaviour of mammals. We just need to wait for Umbrella corp or Monsanto, depending on your personal paranoia, to modify them.

    • Chris L says:

      03:42pm | 27/09/12

      If it were Billith, and assuming we’re talking about Adam’s first wife, there might be a good argument for gay marriage. Might as well have been Adam and Steve after all!

    • Amy says:

      04:24pm | 27/09/12

      I don’t think the issue here is what people believe, but the fact that some people (whether they call themselves psychics, tarot readers, mind readers, whatever) push themselves into situations they don’t belong in, at best creating a nuisance and false hope, at worse, deliberately exploiting a horrible situation and the misery of others for their own gain. 

      If some believe in the abilities of these people, fine.  People can believe what they want, but if it can’t be proven, then they shouldn’t expect the rest of us to believe it too.

      “People have a right to their own opinions, but not to their own facts. Evidence must be located, not created, and opinions not backed by evidence cannot be given much weight” - James W. Loewen

    • Phil says:

      08:01am | 27/09/12

      These sort of people should be taken away and given no attention from anyone, ESPECIALLY the media circus of speculation that goes on, their delusion that they might be able to help both the family who have someone missing and themselves by the attention or financially is just offensive.
      Given what the family of this lady are going through I could think of few other things that would be more unwelcome at this time.

    • Al says:

      08:26am | 27/09/12

      Are you telling me their are seriously still people who believe this crap?
      There are only a few that are even close to convincing, but even those it is down to presentation and psychological tricks.
      No supernatural ability, no spirits, no evidence that supports their claims and no proof that ‘psychic detectives’ have ever provided any usefull information to an investigation where the ‘psychic detective’  was not actualy involved in the original crime (I will admit I may be wrong on the never statement, it is possible a few got something right by pure chance).
      The sad part is that some of them actualy fall for their own act and believe it themselves.
      It still doesn’t make it real.

    • subotic the placard kid says:

      09:31am | 27/09/12

      Behead all those who insult the psychic detective witch….

    • Carolyn says:

      01:56pm | 27/09/12

      @ Al

      In 1998 I worked for a state police force during the time when several people went missing or simply disappeared in unusual circumstances.

      We had various people phone in giving tips, etc. There was one lady who phoned in on the strength of a ‘vision’ she had. She had never had any before, worked in finance, had kids, etc. A very ‘normal’ life.

      The are she told us she ‘saw’ was the area where we had several breakthroughs in the case - including finding items belonging to two of the missing people.

      We did get an arrest out of it. The person who phoned in was put under strict interviews, background checks, history checks, whereabouts at the time, family connections, social connections, mental health & psychological evaluations. Nobody could explain it. In her words, it was just a “flash” of an image. No ghosts, no scary stuff. It freaked her out completely.

      but it was right.

    • Carolyn says:

      01:59pm | 27/09/12

      @ Al

      In 1998 I worked for a state police force during the time when several people went missing or simply disappeared in unusual circumstances.

      We had various people phone in giving tips, etc. There was one lady who phoned in on the strength of a ‘vision’ she had. She had never had any before, worked in finance, had kids, etc. A very ‘normal’ life.

      The are she told us she ‘saw’ was the area where we had several breakthroughs in the case - including finding items belonging to two of the missing people.

      We did get an arrest out of it. The person who phoned in was put under strict interviews, background checks, history checks, whereabouts at the time, family connections, social connections, mental health & psychological evaluations. Nobody could explain it. In her words, it was just a “flash” of an image. No ghosts, no scary stuff. It freaked her out completely.

      but it was right.

    • iansand says:

      02:21pm | 27/09/12

      Carolybn - Betcha she wasn’t put in the witness box as part of the evidence chain.

    • Al says:

      02:55pm | 27/09/12

      Carolyn - you wouldn’t mind providing the case number etc so I can look it up and confirm it would you?
      I still suspect that it was fraud (if it did occur) and simply was not identified by the investigators. After all they are only human.
      Perhaps a friend of a friend or something overheard in a supermarket. Either (and more) could provide the clue.
      Or even a statement from the police that she actualy helped would be appreciated (you know, an offical statement).

    • Admiral Ackbar says:

      03:35pm | 27/09/12

      So you made an arrest based purely on someone claiming they had a vision? Now that’s spooky.

    • Steel says:

      08:48am | 27/09/12

      A proper police investigation needs to follow every serial (piece of information) to it’s conclusion.  Everything provided to police by witnesses, friends, family, experts, public and psychics must be investigated.  Information provided by psychics consumes valuable time and resources but they must be considered because of the possibility they have done more than simply injected themselves into an investigation.  Consider a psychic wishes to gain notoriety so he/she commits a crime then goes to the police to help solve it.  That is why police listen to psychics.

    • Chris L says:

      08:54am | 27/09/12

      I’d be curious to know how many of the people who scoff at the idea of psychics, astrology and tarrot readers choose to endorse a religion equally bereft of evidence.

    • Michael says:

      10:52am | 27/09/12

      Or sciences that can’t prove that what they predict is true.

      Seems that believing is seeing, as opposed to the way that saying is usually said.

    • Lisa Meredith says:

      12:05pm | 27/09/12

      Dear Michael,

      “Or sciences that can’t prove that what they predict is true.” Where do the predictions come from? Are they arbitrary?

      Because, to some extent, we do see what we believe, scientific conclusions must be rigorously scrutinised. Other lines of inquiry/evidence and independent verification must be sought, and all predictions tested thoroughly.

      Over time, a growing body of evidence can suggest that the conclusion is not a statistical fluke, but there is never such a thing as 100% proof.

      Science cannot arrive at a conclusion arbitrarily, and it cannot change its mind seemingly on a whim. Science does, however, reserve the right to change its mind as new evidence comes to light. This helps make it self-correcting in nature.

    • Michael says:

      12:44pm | 27/09/12

      Lisa, my comment was less an observation of any science than it was of people and their belief systems. I do appreciate the effort that you put into clearing up misunderstandings of your particular branches of science and the complexity of the mechanisms involved.

    • warren says:

      12:59pm | 27/09/12


      “Or sciences that can’t prove that what they predict is true.”

      That’s not science. I’m not even sure it’s a valid sentence.

      The idea of science is actually extremely simple. You can wiki it if you like.

      You can think what you like of science. It’s a free country.  But you don’t get to redefine science.

      If an inquiry does not follow the scientific method (i.e. making observations, and then drawing testable conclusions, not the other way around) then it’s not science.

      Science is attacked because it is part of a competing world view. It is a clear-cut method of disposing of silly ideas, and ideas that do not stand up to scrutiny.  Thus, to many close-minded theists, religionists and supernaturals, the scientific method is a very dangerous tool. Science exposes these people, and exposes their intellectual games and silliness.

      Which is why “psychics” hate the idea of controlled testing. Most will do anything they can to attack the process, to blame negative results on “unwilling” or “negative” energies and participants, and to bring science in to disrepute.

      Or they’ll say “but science doesn’t answer everything”, as if science is supposed to.  Which is a supernaturalist’s attempt to shift the burden of proof.

      But the burden of proof remains with the claimant.  And if you’re a psychic, it’s up to YOU to provide evidence of your claims.

    • Michael says:

      02:16pm | 27/09/12

      Warren, That’s great, now if you can just match your observations with my comments you could show me how scientific your particular method is. Perhaps you missed the point, Lisa Meredith seems to have understood it, as evidenced in Lisa’s other comments on the Punch today.

    • Nigel says:

      09:00am | 27/09/12

      The FBI in the US once tried to use Psychics and Mediums but to no avail - they caught them all out “retrofitting” facts to events so looking back it “seemed” they had actually predicted the event. Total frauds and only good at extracting money from gullible and distraught people.

    • psychic free says:

      09:23am | 27/09/12

      I’ve got a friend who claims she’s psychic.  I’ve let her use tarot cards and my jewellery, in order to come up with a prediction.  Not a single time, has anything she said come true, or has she been able to predict something coming.

      Sadly, testing her time and time again shows that she’s convinced herself that a few coincidences equal a sixth sense. 

      These numpties who prey on people looking for answers to horrible events in life, they’re the real problem.  What my friend does is harmless fun, but these people exploit those at their most vulnerable.  They’re nothing but emotional vampires.

    • Kika says:

      10:24am | 27/09/12

      I’ve got an aunty who does Tarot and often she has been entirely correct. She found our cat when she went missing. That was very freaky. She asked whether there was construction around our house - there was - a neighbour down the back was working on their roof. My sister and I ran to their house and asked whether they’ve seen our cat. The girl who answered the door said “Yeah there’s been meowing in the roof for days now - the builders closed the roof up the other day”. And bingo - there she was. She must have been exploring and the roof closed in on her. We would never have known if it wasn’t for the tarot. That was very strange.

    • Al says:

      11:18am | 27/09/12

      Kika - hmmmm, lost cat.
      Most likely locations:
      Trapped in an area, most likely due to a recent change, i.e. construction.
      Trapped in an area due to accident (like getting trapped in a small pipe).
      Already adopted by another family.
      Gone feral.
      Not realy a big revelation, something anyone could work out really.

    • psychic free says:

      11:43am | 27/09/12

      Sorry, but people’s stories don’t convince me.  If something was to happen to me, then maybe I’d be more open to it, but I just think that in between coincidences and stuff just happening for no rhyme or reason, that there’s a rich area for people who believe they are psychic, to plough.

      So long as they don’t prey on the truly vulnerable and instead limit it to party trickery, it’s fine.

    • Rossco says:

      12:37pm | 27/09/12

      Kika…or maybe she put the cat there….

    • Admiral Ackbar says:

      01:01pm | 27/09/12

      Classic cold reading technique, say something vague that is likely to be the case and bamn! Psychic 101.

      I’m always losing my keys and then subsequently finding them again after predicting that they will be in the last place I left them, psychic!

      Happenstance isn’t proof and never will be, which is why psychics will always be bullshit at best, and harmful nutjobs at the worst, as is the case in the search for missing peoples.

    • AdamC says:

      09:25am | 27/09/12

      Isn’t this a bit too easy a target for an ICB?

      What’s next, “ICB on those crystal healing shonks”?

    • subotic says:

      01:26pm | 27/09/12

      Like shooting fish in a barrel…

    • subotic Torquemada 71 says:

      09:30am | 27/09/12

      Burn the witch, burn her, buuuuuuuurn herrrrrrrr!

    • SimpleSimon says:

      09:36am | 27/09/12

      There are a few people out there who publicly, and with quite a high profile, perform cold reading tricks and make it perfectly clear that what they are doing is now supernatural - they are just tricks. They do this to demonstrate that there is in fact no such thing as psychics.

      When I saw Penn & Teller in Las Vegas (brilliant show, btw), they did a fantastic cold reading trick. It involved joke books (all different) passed randomly through the audience, and 1 joke each selected from the book from whomever the book ended up with, and Penn would guess which joke they had selected. One which was particularly impressive was when Penn guessed the joke a woman had selected when she had only said 1 or 2 words. Very impressive. But, it’s just a trick. It’s not magic, it’s not supernatural, which they make very VERY clear.

      I think Derren Brown does that sort of thing as well.

    • Sym says:

      09:34am | 27/09/12

      Once upon a time the world was flat, and earth was the centre of the universe. Anyone who said otherwise was either deluded, heretical, or outright wrong.
      Then someone sailed around the world and proved it was a sphere. Who woulda thought?

      There are frauds and phoneys everywhere - even scientists have at times fraudulently fudged their results. The above statements are generalisations that could be applied to any group. I could say that the entire media are just vampiric drama queens preying on peoples lives to make money and all of what they say is Bullshit. 
      The sad part is that some of them actually believe the load of crap they write and think that its quality reading material.

    • Shane says:

      10:37am | 27/09/12

      The Greeks show the world was a sphere two and half thousand years ago. The first people to circumnavigate were looking for an alternate route to China. They knew the world was round. It was the church who hung on to the belief that the earth was the centre of the universe not the scientists/philosophers.

      Now until one psychic, tarot reader, tea leaf diviner, astrologer comes forward and proves they can do what they say they can do (yes, their claims can be tested and why won’t they allow themselves to be tested? Funny that.) all they have are baseless assertions.

    • Sym says:

      11:57am | 27/09/12

      Yep. So it may take some time - as you say it took a couple of thousand years to “prove” the earth was Spherical…

      Im sure itll happen sometime, its a possible progression of human evolution. Then again, we will probably destroy ourselves and our planet long before then - all for what, money?

      Interestingly, scientists have shown that their expectations on results of certain tests actually influence the outcome. Now if we can just get someone that can achieve true impartiality to conduct the tests…

      My specific point above was that this article was the pot calling the kettle black. Media are just as much of a fraud that prey on anything that “sells”. Why noit use their power to move the world in positive ways? because that would go against the very foundation of the institution and what we have made our cultural priority. We are sad excuses for “intelligent beings”.

    • egg says:

      12:39pm | 27/09/12

      @Sym, there really ARE frauds and phonies everywhere. It’s just that scientists have only a small percentage of them (like the majority of the population), whereas woo-peddlers (as I prefer to call them) are all - every last one of them - liars and cheats. There are no psychic powers, there is no table tipping, there is no mind reading, there is no aura reading, there is no telekinesis. Anyone who claims to have these “powers” is a fraud and should be charged as such.

    • SAm says:

      12:49pm | 27/09/12

      no Sym, what you refer to is quantum physics related, in that merely observing something at a quantum level affects the outcome. its bizarre and frankly inexplicable, but has nothing to do with psychic bullshit

    • egg says:

      12:58pm | 27/09/12

      @Sym, no - Shane never stated “it took a couple of thousand years to prove the earth was spherical”. It didn’t, at all. I don’t know where you get your information.

      James Randi has had an offer of $1m for anyone who can prove psychic powers in controlled settings - nor repressive, not rigidly set (he will change controls depending on what is being tested). The reason nobody has collected this money is because nobody has the powers they are claiming. Every single person who has tried has been proven to be cheating. The big names - the ones who make millions off of other peoples suffering on TV - won’t go near him. Gee, I wonder why?

      Yes, based on some of your arguments, I absolutely agree that we’re very generous when calling ourselves “intelligent” beings.

    • Shane says:

      12:57pm | 27/09/12

      No Sym, it didn’t take a couple of thousand years to prove the earth was round. It took a couple of thousand years for someone to eventually sail around. The Greeks knew the world was round. Just go down to the seaside and watch ships disappear below the horizon. Proof number one. There are many many more.

      To prove something, even over time, you have to have some measurable effect. A psychic claiming a body is buried somewhere is a testable claim. So far no one has ever shown where the bodies are buried. For science to “prove” something you need something to test. Astrologers, psychics, tarot readers et al have never ever shown anything that can be tested or measured. Nothing.
      You said “Interestingly, scientists have shown that their expectations on results of certain tests actually influence the outcome. Now if we can just get someone that can achieve true impartiality to conduct the tests…”
      It is interesting and science does indeed have a procedure to achieve true impartiality. It is called the scientific method and specifically double blind trials. There is no other method that has ever come close to achieving this sort of impartiality and using this method no psychic has ever shown any ability at all. Ever.

      To push the spherical earth analogy further. The earth was and is round. It took some time to discover and prove this. But the earth exists.  In the case of psychics you are trying to prove the earth is round but the earth doesn’t exist.

    • sunny says:

      09:36am | 27/09/12

      BTW where is M? Has he passed over? M are you out there, give us a sign.

    • N says:

      10:20am | 27/09/12

      M is over there———-
      Right next to L

    • PsychoHyena says:

      10:57am | 27/09/12

      @sunny I believe he went the same way as Erick…. M was starting to get quite vocal on “the issues that must not be named”.

    • sunny says:

      12:37pm | 27/09/12

      Actually there but for the grace of Punch go I. Move towards the light M.

    • Alfie says:

      02:33pm | 27/09/12

      Where is Acotrel?  (BTW: not worried, just askin)

    • Chris L says:

      04:04pm | 27/09/12

      I sense he has been inside a structure of some sort today, but I’m also seeing sky so he may have been outside at some point, walking to the car of having a cigarette perhaps.

    • Admiral Ackbar says:

      05:17pm | 27/09/12

      Good question, I liked having someone that would agree with my bullshit on here. He can’t have been banned surely, people don’t just get banned for no reas..

      Anyways I would’ve sensed a disturbance in the force or somethin’. And if he has gone missing then at least Chris L has narrowed his location down to pretty much everywhere that isn’t space, keep up the fine psychicing Chris.

    • Scotchfinger says:

      05:37pm | 27/09/12

      I was with M during his final moments. He held on just long enough to tell me to pass on the following message to you all -

      Is that a puppy outside? Come here, cute little thing! *runs outside, giggling*

    • neil says:

      09:59am | 27/09/12

      And now we have that attention seeking twat Catherine Deveny trying to get some extra publicity out of others misfortune. I hope the police can charge her with interfering in a investigation.

    • CJ says:

      10:26am | 27/09/12

      What strikes me as off with regards to Ms Deveny is not that she contacted the police with a story about being apparently attacked by a man in a blue hoodie - there’s nothing wrong with that, and good on her for trying to assist. What strikes me as off is that she then felt it necessary to Tweet about how she went to the cops and declared her apparent attacker to be “the same guy”. How does publicly writing herself into the investigation help anyone? Who benefits from it? The police? Jill Meagre or her family? I can’t see how. But it sure brings Catherine Deveny to the center of the biggest story in town.

    • Bear says:

      10:25am | 27/09/12

      Nup, of course the lib lovers couldn’t put their politics aside. Blind hatred conquers all. What if she has vital info? what then? you would dismiss it. Useless cop you would be.

    • jaki says:

      11:12am | 27/09/12

      @ Bear
      “Nup, of course the lib lovers couldn’t put their politics aside.”

      What the f*** are you on about ?  “Lib lovers”? What the hell has this got to do with the Liberals ? No-one brought politics into this but you.
      Catherine Deveny is just an attention seeking idiot. No wonder she attracts other idiots such as yourself. A woman is missing and CD tries to make the story all about her and you use it to have a go at the Libs.
      Just grow up, you idiot child.

    • Bear says:

      11:35am | 27/09/12

      Struck a nerve there obviously what I said is true. Was listening to a “shock jock” interview a cop about it and the cop raised CD as a witness and you could almost see the maniacal Lib straining on his leash. Politics is everything with you carnts.

    • Max Redlands says:

      12:03pm | 27/09/12

      Agree with jaki Deveney is an attention seeker of the worst kind.

      What gets me is she often described as a “comedian”. I have seen and read a bit of her (you’ll pardon the expression) “work” and for mine she’s about as funny as a tooth-ache and just as annoying.

    • jaki says:

      12:05pm | 27/09/12

      Hey ! Bear’s a psychic ! He/she/it Saw what was happening in a RADIO interview !!! Maybe you could get together with Deveny and any other parasites who want to take advantage of Jill Meagher’s disappearance ?
      Wow…you’re sad. In a laughable way. And I’m no “lib lover”, whatever the f**that means.
      But don’t let me stop you from using the disappearance of a woman to push your little barrow of hate. This has got nothing to do with politics except in your sick little mind.

    • Bear says:

      01:38pm | 27/09/12

      It’s got nothing to do with politic for me either, but it did for the radio man who’s mere mention of CD had him straining and thats my point about these ppl.  The copper could easily be interpreted “easy tiger, I know a mere mention of a lefty has u almost in a fit but seriously she’s a real witness and important to us , please try and believe me”. And he just barely accepted it. Not trying to use this girl for any political point. I feel as bad as anyone who doesn’t know her.  Been to Ireland and met many ghat look similar. Who are u? You know nothing about my mind but I reckon there’s every chance it works better than yours.

    • jaki says:

      02:43pm | 27/09/12

      @ Bear
      Thanks for that indecipherable, unhinged rant.  Literacy not your strong point, eh ?
      Go play with your x-box or something.

    • Ben C says:

      02:50pm | 27/09/12

      If the man in question is proved to have had no involvement in either incidence, will Deveny be up for libel?

    • Bear says:

      10:13am | 27/09/12

      As a last resort yes, but not while real evidence is being sought. Heck if the police turn up nothing (which is looking less likely) and there’s no hope and you thought running naked down Bourne street would help find your loved one you’d do it! Well I hope you would.

    • Rowdy says:

      10:27am | 27/09/12

      I am sensing some bad feeling here towards psychics…..

    • nihonin says:

      10:53am | 27/09/12

      I wouldn’t have predicted that.

    • Kika says:

      10:30am | 27/09/12

      I don’t know. There’s a whol heap of pretenders out there but I do believe some people have a 6th sense about things. My aunty has been freakishly accurate with many of her readings. She reckons we descend from witches. I have no idea, but that would be pretty cool. Haha. 

      I think there’s a lot to the world - and life - which we don’t quite understand yet. Things aren’t black and white. There’s a lot of grey in between and I think those who have the knack can tap into these grey areas.

      AS for psychics trying to find Jill - I think they should only get involved if they are asked.

    • Bear says:

      11:07am | 27/09/12

      We live on the future dark ages. I wonder if righties will think about what that means or just go off half cocked like they always do?

    • Lisa Meredith says:

      11:09am | 27/09/12

      Dear Kika,

      Is it true that we believe what we see?

      Or could it be that we see what we believe?

    • Tim the Toolman says:

      12:08pm | 27/09/12

      “Things aren’t black and white. “

      The bits in between are shrinking every day, not because of people believing they can do something that has never, ever, ever been demonstrated under controlled conditions to work, but because they’re using science to slowly, patiently and rationally chip away at how things work.

    • Bruceter says:

      10:44am | 27/09/12

      “Other possible links are deserts, woods, obscure valleys, caves, dens, holes, mountains, churchyards, ruined buildings, coalmines, muddy places, wells, houses, offices.”

      In other words, places that don’t have buildings and places that are buildings.

    • David says:

      10:42am | 27/09/12

      This is offensive beyond the extreme. Another non entity after their 15 minutes of fame.

    • Joan says:

      10:56am | 27/09/12

      Patrick Jane seems to get it right week after week. Does that count.?

    • Al says:

      11:08am | 27/09/12

      Heres my psychic reading about Jill Meagher:
      “I can see dirt, she is near dirt.”

      There we go, I am accurate.

    • MsDel says:

      11:17am | 27/09/12

      I think there are definitely people who have a gift - whether that is being able to see spirits, talk to the dead, predict outcomes. I have personal experience with a couple of true psychics - who police use in certain situations. I had a well known “ghost whisperer” at my home not so long ago to do a cleansing of my house. Of course there is scepticism & mind over matter but IF a genuine person who truly has a talent like this can help to bring comfort & assistance in a case like this, what is the harm? I don’t agree that money should change hands but the energies of the universe are not something we have enough info on to truly doubt that something psychic could happen.

    • Shane says:

      11:34am | 27/09/12

      Many of these so called psychics do step forward and do this for free. It is called publicity. Next you see them advertise as having helped out in such and such case. All you have to do MsDel is show one case, just one, where a psychic absolutely unambiguously supplied info that solved a case or found a body.
      Otherwise they are all publicity seeking ghouls preying on the heartbreak of emotionally vulnerable people.

    • TChong says:

      11:39am | 27/09/12

      can you give one example of these “psychics” abilities. ?
      Did the police force , of your state, actually aproach your friends first, ?and ask them to help? or did your friends offer to help?
      Was their help useful - did the courts convict? ( otherwise the info was useless, and nothing more than conjecture)
      If so, job well done, and this is definitive proof of their “psychic “abilities.
      So, the matter and the psychics help should be on public record.
      What was the case?

    • Al says:

      11:47am | 27/09/12

      What we doubt is the fact that no psychic, anywhere or when has actualy proved their claims in a controled enviroment, despite there being a $1 million payout up for grabs.
      Those who say they don’t need the money never have an answer for “Do you know a charity that could use $1mil?”
      So, not proven where the chance of being a fraud is removed. Ever.

    • sir ronald bradnam says:

      11:21am | 27/09/12

      We all know how I feel about any crackpot wack job who claims to recieve devine messages from an imaginary friend who lives in a cloud and sends out obtuse messages that can be deciphered and twisted to suit that particular conduits beliefs and teachings.
      See it even sounds insane.

    • Daylight Robbery says:

      11:31am | 27/09/12

      Heres my reading about the situation Skinny Bitch

      Nah, people are on crack.  I have one bloke whos wife went to a psychic after a psychologist friend had told of her experience. Yes, they are all witch doctors. 
      The psychic had told her that her husband had been with another woman.  Automatically she went home hammering him, someone shed been married with since they were 16.  Their marriage had been tentative to say the least mainly her being a hypersensitive prude.  His only moment of adrift was two visits to a strip club in 24 years of marriage.
      Kicked from his home, locks changed, denied access to his children.
      The social destruction begins.

      Then another closer to me another friends wife went to psychic has told his mrs he has another bank account. The furor begins. He gives his now wife $800 a week with step children one 21 at home, not a serious attempt at a job. Lazy mother ....  She has a nerve.

      Destructive crystal balls…

      People are on crack..

    • subotic sees signs everywhere says:

      11:48am | 27/09/12

      Smoke crack. Worship Satan.

    • jaki says:

      12:41pm | 27/09/12

      A “professional” psychic once told my mum that I was a lesbian, and I’m not.
      Why can’t these charlatans just get a job and stop peddling bullshit to people ?

    • subotic the tattooed bearded lady says:

      02:21pm | 27/09/12

      A “professional” psychic once told my mum that I was a lesbian, and I’m a guy….

    • nihonin says:

      06:20pm | 27/09/12

      subotic the tattooed bearded lady, guess they were half right then, I take it you do like women.

    • david says:

      11:55am | 27/09/12

      Hopefully these psychics will stop hovering around like the media do.

    • Robert S McCormick says:

      11:59am | 27/09/12

      It had to happen & it always does, doesn’t it?
      People in dire straits have these people crawling out from under every rock & pile of shit making claims they have no way of backing up. Raising people’s hopes only to bring them crashing down & causing ever more distress.
      The vast majority are charlatans. OK, let them operate at fairs etc. for everyone knows it is only just a bit of fun and no-one takes them seriously.
      However when they start playing with vulnerable people it is time to say:
      Enough is Enough.
      In SA one of those glossy, very expensive magazines, beloved of snotty-nosed yuppies they did an article on clairvoyants, psychics & other rat-baggery. One actually, without a blush in sight, actually claimed she had foretold the events of 9/11 some time before they took place!! Why didn’t she take out an ad in the media? Why didn’t she contact the US’ FBI, CIA?
      Simple! She was bullshitting and that is the problem with this psychic business isn’t it? For some, indeed most, it is just a money-making racket exploiting other people’s misery. One of them here in SA even claimed that their readings, prognostications etc. were Free but then asks for a $25 “Donation”!!!
      “Psychic Readings”, “Aura Readings” if you visit SA make sure to take a run up to the Adelaide Hills for though at times they are full of music they are also full of Psychics, Readers, Fortune tellers, Aura Interpreters just waiting to take your money. OK, pay them but remember what they say is sheer, utter, complete garbage & treat them & their pontificating as just a bit of absurd fun.

    • Jay says:

      12:14pm | 27/09/12

      My wife and daughter bore me adnausem with their psychic dreams and how they can see the future etc etc. My challenge is tel me the correct eight winning numbers in the next lott and I will be convinced. Alas still waiting.

    • SAm says:

      12:31pm | 27/09/12

      I always have to agree to disagree with my wife on these issues. She will believe absolutely anything that a ‘pyschic’, or ‘medium’, or other similarly bullshit profession has to say, yet complains about the money science wastes on things like the LHC or the Space Program.
      She even played me a recording of a radio station call her friend made to a psychic over her dead husband. Shes there in tears and im like ‘this idiots not even a GOOD cold reader?? 20 misses and one (largely predictable) hit and you think this is real? He liked BEER?

    • AdamC says:

      12:47pm | 27/09/12

      Can anyone remember the Channel 7 show The One - The Search for Australia’s Most Gifted Psychic?

      Crikey that show was utter drivel. What a bunch of charlatans. Not to mention the hosts and judges straining themselves to see some supposedly paranormal insight in the gibbering nonsense peddled by the ‘psychic life coaches’ and the rest ...

    • Michael says:

      01:28pm | 27/09/12

      I don’t want to use the word psychic, but how can I explain the following?

      When I was nine - now forty years ago - mum, dad, grandparents and my four year old sister heading to a festival in a nearby town to our property. Dad was a judge at a gardening show.

      We were on our way home, and it was about thirty seconds before we drove into the driveway of our property,when my four year old sister pipes up with “I had a dream last night that we were in a white car and just as we drove through the white gate we got a flat tyre”. Ten seconds after that, we (in our white car), drove through the white fence-gate, and got a flat tyre. It was forty years ago but I can still see the look that went between the adults in the car.

      Ten years later, my sister was on a school bus coming back from rehearsing a dance concert with the rest of her school. A girl who was also in the concert decided to not get the bus back to school - she got off the bus and into a car that a friend of hers had driven. According to my sister’s teacher, my sister got a bit panicky and whimpering, and told a teacher that the girl “should not have got off the bus. she should stay on the bus”.  That night the girl and her friend were involved in a car accident when another car side-ended them by running a red light. Nobody was hurt, but it was all around school that my sister was worried and certain that something was going to happen.

      In 2001, same sister woke up from an afternoon nap shaking, whimpering, and her heart racing. When we got her calmed down, her husband asked what had upset her so much. She had a dream that she was in an elevator with other people, very high up in a tall building, when the building shook and the elevator crashed to the ground. The door opened and she said that there were “white people, ghost people” walking about everywhere.

      Two days later the planes hit the World Trade Centre. My sister got very upset when she saw all the people on the ground covered in the ash and dust - she said that was similar to what she dreamed.

      So how can this be explained? My sister doesn’t use the world psychic. But what word is applicable?

    • Shane says:

      02:58pm | 27/09/12

      Michael, in two words it sounds like confirmation bias. People only remember when something “happens” and forget the million other times our spidey sense tingled and nothing happened or we had a dream that didn’t come true or you thought of someone and the phone didn’t ring.
      A million to one shot happens every day. Coincidences happen. Every body at some point will have an experience similar to what your sister describes. It would be stranger if it didn’t happen.

    • Semi Concerned Citizen says:

      03:35pm | 27/09/12

      When i was punching heaps of XTC as a youth, one fine summers morning i was walking into the city centre to conduct some business.

      I suffered a hallucination that a motorbike crashed in front of me. I got no further than 10 metres when i heard the roar of said motorcycle, he flew past me changed lanes gunned it harder, just as a white van changed lanes. Bike hit side diverted into a brick fence. Motor cyclist screams in pain, many onlookers mill about. A few attempted to help.

      I proceeded to the pub to drink away the two crashes i just experienced.

    • Your name:Michael T says:

      04:03pm | 27/09/12

      Your comment:]
      @ Shane & Semi Concerned

      neither of you were there. I have no idea how to prove it to you - but there were four other people in the car back in 1972.

      Contact Ross Allen of Burnside State High School regarding the bus accident in 1986, and ask him about it.

      Also, go onto Facebook and contact Philip T Higgins. He’ll confirm what happened in 2001 regarding my sister’s dream.

      I don’t know how else to prove it except to say that I WAS THERE. I remember it as clear as yesterday because it was so weird.

      You may say “it was probably this”, or “it was probably that”, or “it would have most likely been such and such”. But it happened the exactly as stated. I used to be an military pilot. I’ve no reason to bs.

      With it being a million to one shot - how do you explain a four year old girl, verbalising exactly what happened - detail by detail - prior to it happening? She wasn’t drinking or taking drugs. There were four adults in the car (who continued to tell the story for years after).

      And the dream?

      Since posting my previous post, my wife reminded me that my sister had a dream about Gene Kelly one night - nothing in particular - she just woke with his name in her head and she said she kept thinking about him. The following day (about 30 hours late), Gene Kelly had just passed away (some 30 hours after my sister woke up with his name in her head).

      Dismiss it if you want. But I was there. I heard what she said. How she said it. Other people were there too.

    • Shane says:

      05:05pm | 27/09/12

      Michael, I didn’t say at any point that the experience didn’t happen to your sister. I will use the word probably here for the first time too. The incidents as you describe probably happened. There is no way I could disprove this. And why should I? I have no reason to doubt your story.
      You missed the point of my million to one shot thing. No matter how unlikely or improbable something is it happens millions of times a day. It always happens. Nothing you describe is impossible. Little girls can dream of bus accidents or someone drowning or unexpected phone calls every day. Sometimes the next day somewhere something will happen that will match the dream. With 7 billion people dreaming every night one of those people will dream of something like what happens the next day. It is an almost statistical certainty. I be surprised if it didn’t. When it happens to you or someone close to you it seems spooky but it just fits into the law of big numbers.

      Just to repeat, I haven’t said that the incidents as you described didn’t happen.

    • Al says:

      05:06pm | 27/09/12

      Michael T - it is called co-incidence.

    • Ben says:

      05:31pm | 27/09/12

      Michael, I watched ‘Xanadu’ over 30 years ago and subsequently had a dream that I was doing the wild thing with Olivia Newton-John.

      Over 30 years I’m still waiting.

    • Swamp Thing says:

      01:39pm | 27/09/12

      Yeah - still waiting on lottery tickets here too.
      Nevertheless - there is actually some mystery left in this world & i would imagine the girl’s family are willing to give anything a go round about now.
      I always do enjoy as well, the glass-jaw shock of the eternally smug when something that cannot be measured or weighed shatters their fragile world view.
      Them buggers tend to be the loudest, most fanatical converts: funny that.

    • MsDel says:

      02:26pm | 27/09/12

      My understanding was she led police to bones found in sandunes near Cronulla somewhere. Maybe Kurnell? The psychic was walking with her husband & told him there were bodies buried there. I think a healthy dose of scepticism is normal. I was sceptical myself - the woman that came to me was amazing. I didn’t speak to her at all during her clearing of my house - she came to me with questions. I didn’t know the answers & dug around for some info on my home. From what I discovered, she was spot on with her sense of what had happened in my home & who had lived here previously, those passed on. I had no idea. As for the Kurnell thing I’m sure it’s a matter of public record. I guess you could look it up.

    • Shane says:

      03:03pm | 27/09/12

      “I guess you could look it up” is a cop out. Somebody somewhere said they told the police they could find a body somewhere sometime.

    • Blind Freddy says:

      02:50pm | 27/09/12

      Clair Voyant: A person with the ability to observe things before they happen.

      Barry Voyant: A person with the ability to observe things just after they happen.

      There are way more Barrys than Clairs.

    • PW says:

      03:05pm | 27/09/12

      From looking at that video and the state of the woman depicted, the only spirit relative to this matter is the one you drink.

      I know this won’t pass muster, but if this poor soul is where it appears she is, she’ll have a good buddy in that footballer who jumped off a building in Vegas.

    • Alfie says:

      03:07pm | 27/09/12

      I had a mate who they said was a bit psycho. Funny thing, he could always tell when people were looking at him - he’d walk in the pub and say to someone “WTF are you looking at”.

    • yogo says:

      03:14pm | 27/09/12

      cant believe this guy is trying to cash in on someones disappearance .  He basically listed every possible kind of environment in the area, then what? Claim you nailed the location when they eventually find her?

      .  And then tried to look good by mentioning a car and a man… which has already been released by media prior to this story.

      people who claim to be psychic’s should be ashamed… someone is in great danger and families are in pain.. but you are still just trying to cash in with your nonsense

    • J.Christian says:

      03:49pm | 27/09/12

      The Tarot Dvination done for Jill Meagher as ‘reported’ above has been taken out of context. The person involved has NOT approached the Meagher family NOR police. I would suggest your ‘reporting’ spread further than googling ‘Jill Maegher Psychic’ and hitting the first link you see…
      Most of the police and authorities use psychics around the world. Inside your little fishbowl awareness of this might be very limited and hard to believe.
      If you have read this and feel angry, or your ego a little bruised, then that’s your problem - I cannot see, feel, touch or have any faith that you might have such an emotion.  Thus, I cannot possibly accept it exists.

    • Al says:

      04:40pm | 27/09/12

      J. Christian - If you believe that ‘Most of the police and authorities use psychics around the world.’ then I hate to inform you that you are delusional.
      The majority will only deal with psychics when:
      1) They come in with very accurate information that has not been released to the public but they know, they are then a prime suspect of involvement.
      2) It is at the request of those who are victims/family of victims.
      3) Show me one case (just 1) where a person claiming to be psychic was actualy called as a witness in a case that led to a guilty finding based on their ‘vision’ (or whatever) rather than all the other evidence presented.

    • Shane says:

      05:12pm | 27/09/12

      “Most of the police and authorities use psychics around the world. Inside your little fishbowl awareness of this might be very limited and hard to believe.”

      I’m sure you have a citation for that little factoid?

    • stephen says:

      04:00pm | 27/09/12

      Psychic ?
      Hawthorn by 17 points.

    • Shane says:

      05:10pm | 27/09/12

      That’s absurd. My chicken entrails definitely say the Swans by 3.

    • LJ Dots says:

      06:06pm | 27/09/12

      Preposterous Shane, my chicken entrails clearly indicated 7 points. Are you sure you used organic chicken?

    • stephen says:

      06:15pm | 27/09/12

      More CCTV footage of this girl has been discovered, and I cannot see what is wrong, if every girl in a city is to be protected, for many more cameras to be placed, as they are in London.
      If people want more privacy, though, perhaps they should go to the country and stay there.

    • Gypsy nihonin says:

      06:25pm | 27/09/12

      I predict, around the hour of 8 bells past midday, comments will not be posted on this article anymore.


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