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How you see le scandal rests beaucoup on your politics

Peter Holmes a Court

by Peter Holmes a Court

19 May 05:45am

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Filed under: Imf, Scandal, Sex, Sex Crime

76 comments

EUROPE: the IMF asks for EU members to share in a 78 billion euro bailout of Portugal. EU Finance Ministers unanimously agree.

Few doubt his guilt, but not everyone thinks he's a villain

NEW YORK: Head of the IMF offers to have his wife post $1million bail to get him out of Harlem police Cell.  Judge refuses.

The most minute details concerning the incident that lead to Dominique Strauss-Kahn missing his flight this weekend will no doubt become common knowledge over the next few weeks.

What happens after that is relatively binary. If the facts are established to be anything like the official charge, then we won’t hear much more about the man formerly known as DSK (what the French call Mr Strauss-Kahn). 

But if it proves to be a set up, he’ll be the next President of the hexagon underneath England. 

On Sunday morning I read blogs suggesting the suspects include a) parties associated with hard-fighting centre-right President Sarkozy, b) the far right National Front who are simultaneous written off as uneducated nutters and conniving fascists (while their popularity continues to climb above Sarkozy’s), c) his own party which has a history of deep disunity, and d) Colonel Mustard in the library with a candlestick.

From inside France, the difference in global media coverage is mostly understandable: New York is focussed on the scandal while France is gripped with the political implications a year out from their version of Presidential elections.

The greatest difference in western media is the constant focus on the fact that he is a socialist.

In the US media, the phrases socialist and communist and witch/warlock are pretty much used interchangeably. In Europe, the phrase socialist is used to describe people from political parties that are on the left, but aren’t so green they care more about trees than people. That leaves a lot of territory for the Socialists to own, and it makes them quite normal over here.

Like shops shutting all day Sunday and 14 year old kids drinking wine: initially it’s jarring, but its not all bad when you understand it.

And very normal they seem to be: apparently they like fast cars, wild parties, flying first class, staying in $3000 suites in the Sofitel in New York. So while US/UK/Australian commentators are quick to jump on the fact that a Socialist is living the good life, I am not sure all European socialists will damn him for this.

Modern Euro-socialism isn’t built on dislike for the finer things in life. Its growing popularity is a reaction to perception that big-money-influenced-democratic-capitalism has failed to improve the life of people in the bulging middle part of the income distribution curve.

This “Working Class” plus “lower Middle Class” section is hard to define precisely (particularly between economies) but there is no doubt people know what it refers to. It might be more accurate but heavier-on-the-tongue to say households with pre-tax income between the 20th and 60th percentile of all households.

This group in the US has quite spectacularly been mere spectators to the wealth generation of the last 20 years. It is a neat quip to say that they now watch this event on much bigger televisions, but even high definition viewing does not negate a growing unease.

So when a socialist is pulled from the pointy end of a jet leaving New York, will socialists see him as betraying the cause?

French/Cuban writer Anais Nin, who I reckon must have been a socialist at some point, said it best: we don’t see things as they are, but as we are.

If you are a right wing capitalist, chances are you see a Porsche loving, champagne drinking French socialist as a sell out and a fake.

If you are a French socialist, you might think that the suites of the Sofitels should be occupied by people working for the IMF not executives of, for example, BP. 

You might think First Class on Air France should be filled with people in public service not just foreign capitalists.

What does anyone think the French socialists are going to do with the champagne from Champagne if they get control? Let their opponents drink it? Of course not. 

Why let your opponents have all the good stuff?

After all this is what it is all about: the opponents of socialism have run the world for a long time, and the top end has taken most of the good stuff.  Or so it would seem from a socialist perspective. Their idea now is that it is better to work within the system, get control and share the weath. Including the better quality champagne.

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76 comments

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    • Erick says:

      06:13am | 19/05/11

      The “growing popularity” of “modern Euro-socialism”? This must be happening in some other Europe than the one on the map.

      Euro-socialism with its wanton spending has several countries facing bankruptcy already - Portugal, Ireland, Greece - and others ready to follow, such as Spain and Great Britain. It’s a discredited movement except among those who live on unsustainable benefits from the public purse.

      Even now the Euro threatens to collapse under the strain, with the wealthier countries such as Germany being asked to prop up the failing socialist states. I doubt that current Euro-socialism will last out the decade. There comes a time when governments run out of other people’s money.

      Reply

    • LeftRightOut says:

      07:01am | 19/05/11

      Absolutely, Erick. I can’t beleive the utter tish served up defending an uber-rich socialist.
      As if we needed a lesson on political positions of various groups (those this dude’s take on it is somewhat “skewed”).
      Left leaning parties across the globe are losing popularity at an alarming (for them) pace. There’s good reason for this, socialism, and its ugly cousin, communism, have utterly failed.

    • TChong says:

      07:58am | 19/05/11

      EcK and LRO - DSK is about as about as “socialist” as Abbott is “liberal” - ie meaningless, specially when viewed from the OZ perspective of Progressive v Conservative.

    • john says:

      09:21am | 19/05/11

      You guys need to blame the marxist international bankers also, with their unregulated loan’s, so that country’s can support their goods and services and we also need to blame the marxist free market. To me it’s seems like the bankers have done it for greed or want a financial collapse to bring in full communism.  Nationalist has always been about self-sufficiency, but since the Marxists took over europe, they have discouraged such idea’s for their own self interests. Was not Saddam bombed for wanting to go EURO, Gaddafi bombed and Adolf Hitler bombed for cutting ties with International Banking money. The International Banking Cartel seem like spider, where they like to paralyze their victim and then bleed them dry.

    • Kevin says:

      09:39am | 19/05/11

      @john
      In your rant you forgot to mention that DSK is a jew.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      10:07am | 19/05/11

      @ john -
      Hitler was bombed for cutting ties with the International Banking Fund (money)?

      Oh lawdy.

      Guess we all learned something new today.

    • TheRealDave says:

      10:37am | 19/05/11

      LOL! Best post ever John. Hitler ‘bombed’ for pulling out of the International bank?!?

      I’m guessing you haven’t heard of the invasion of Poland, Denmark, Norway, France etc then? You could google them if you like…..

    • John says:

      10:38am | 19/05/11

      Geoff - Brisbane

      They are bombing Gaddafi right now, because he wants to introduce a gold currency in Africa, that would cause a finical collapse of the US and UK. This is why they rushed into Libya and started bombing it ASAP. When they found out. Whats funny, they with this expression, they have pretty much showed that the western political machine, bankers and the media work cohesively for foreign policy. There is no democracy in the west, it’s controlled. The people are heared like sheep.  Iraq, Afghanistan came about this way because of this power.  Only Nationalists can give us true freedom.

    • James1 says:

      10:57am | 19/05/11

      Seeing as we have already been Godwined, here goes.

      Nationalists gave us Hitler, Mussolini and Franco.  You can keep that to yourself thanks very much.

      Otherwise,  you have no credibility left John.  Yesterday you defended Hitler’s motives in going to war.  You go on about Christian Nationalism, which we all know is code for anti-Semetism.  We all know that the international Marxists and banking cartel you refer to is code for “the Jews”.  We all know you pull this rubbish straight from the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.  Take your poison elsewhere.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      11:16am | 19/05/11

      John

      I’m pretty sure we went into Lybia because Giddafi was killing his own people. I quickly googled your position, however the only sites which returned hits were tin foil hatters. The “9/11 was an inside job” kind of sites.

    • john says:

      11:56am | 19/05/11

      Geoff - Brisbane says:

      You have too much faith in the Marxist media. It lies!! 9/11 was inside job, Osama Bin Laden was not killed 2 weeks ago, and Marxist NATO is slaughtering Libyans because it doesn’t care about human life but only cares about money!!!! Marxist NATO Is EVILLLLLLLLLLL, Once we Nationalist get in power, NATO leaders will up on WAR crimes! NATO will also be disbanded and a more moral and ethical military will be built to conform to the ideals of European Nationalism.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLJu0X14vmg

      Here is the proof why NATO is slaughtering Libyans and destroying Libya and committing mass crimes because of the $.

    • SydSteve says:

      01:15pm | 19/05/11

      @John

      Can’t tell if Trolling or just really really stupid

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      01:34pm | 19/05/11

      @ SydSteve

      I think hes trolling.

    • John says:

      01:51pm | 19/05/11

      I bet to differ, a lightning attack on Libya, there must been a huge threat. I don’t think it is oil as i don’t consider that a huge reason. It seems like it’s the gold currency, Gaddifi hit a nerve of weakness.

      “I would like to announce that Libya and that these nations no longer except dollars for oil, it must be gold”. Markets would go hay wire, triggering three collapse’s EURO, US dollar and the POUND. This is why all these nations backed the destruction of Gadafi Their economys existence relies on these currency’s. It would of be game over for the Marxist overloads if he successful, i can assure you if he lives through NATO’s onslaughte, and brings in the GOLD currency, i say good by Marxists.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      01:55pm | 19/05/11

      Also john, Marxist media? I didn’t know old Rupet Murdoch (owner of this joint and news ltd) was a marxist. I’d have always though he would be a firm believer in capitalism.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      02:07pm | 19/05/11

      @ John - Or they just open the Alaskan oil fields, use reserves and drill offshore oil wells. I’m also sure Saudi Arabia would take advantage of the lower competition, higher oil price.

      Lybia is only 2% of the worlds oil and who do you think can hold out longer, an oil republic with its only source of income cut off or the USA on 98% of its oil?

    • John says:

      02:38pm | 19/05/11

      Geoff I just see the Western Media, Bankers and Politicians as the same party, and i just call them Marxists. This because they tend push Cultural Marxist policy’s unto Western society(I know you guys think of Marxism and $$$) I think of it in a Cultural Sense. I don’t believe we have Democracy. With the Libyan attacks, Geoff I still can’t find another explanation to why Obama, Sarkozy and Cameron, hit him so fast. It must be something very serious.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      02:57pm | 19/05/11

      However we didn’t hit him too fast. We waited untill he was using his fighter jets to bomb his own people. Just like we didn’t assist in Egypt.

      The move was then backed up by the UN 20-5. Although i agree the absent countries were not absent in error.

      If we wanted their oil, wouldn’t we want to send in ground troops so that we can secure the oil wells?

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      02:57pm | 19/05/11

      However we didn’t hit him too fast. We waited untill he was using his fighter jets to bomb his own people. Just like we didn’t assist in Egypt.

      The move was then backed up by the UN 20-5. Although i agree the absent countries were not absent in error.

      If we wanted their oil, wouldn’t we want to send in ground troops so that we can secure the oil wells?

    • John says:

      03:44pm | 19/05/11

      No Geoff

      It was 10 For 0 Against 5 didn’t want anything do with it(they were the big nations(Russia, China, India, Brazil, GERMANY) 3 out of those nations were 1. US, FRANCE and BRITAIN the 7 other country’s were meaning less country’s which i never knew existed. They must of got their bribe calls from Obama.

    • Geoff - Brisbane says:

      04:09pm | 19/05/11

      John

      It was close enough. The fact is 10 for 5 against. They went in because of giddafi bombing his own people. Not because of marxists or communists.


      You’ve never hear of South Africa, Portugal, Lebanon, Nigeria or Bosnia? How can these countries be bribed by obama, when Germany says no and Portugal agrees? Concidering that Portugal only exists in 2011 because of German bailouts, if there was any form of financial kickbacks, wouldn’t Portugal follow the German lead?

    • John says:

      04:21pm | 19/05/11

      The other 7 country’s are corrupt and evil for voting for the war.
      Germany never supported the war. Germany recognized the evil. I suspect.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      08:27am | 19/05/11

      It is in fact the ultimate hypocrisy. What is true though is that the left is socialist and continue to use the distribution of wealth which follows a Pareto distribution as a means to brew class warfare and hence bootstrap themselves into power.

      As we all know a Pareto distribution is a very steep curve, and has been shown to derive from small differences between products/services amplified in a network of buyers and sellers called a market.

      Socialists use the shape of curve which is vast inequality as a base for support for its politics of envy. But as we can see DSK enjoyed “the good life”. It’s easy to point to the curve and say that its shape is wrong and should be more “equal”. Of course this is complete and utter nonsense. The only way the shape of wealth redistribution could be more equal is every purchasing decision was controlled, for it is the sum of many purchasing decisions, choosing slightly better products that send disproportionate profits to companies with better products and services and the result in vastly disproportionate profits. To further add to wealth inequality the rich reinvest their profits, whilst the middle class and poor do not. This investment drives progress and innovation as evidenced in free societies.

      Other interesting properties of pareto distributions are that the mean of curve is variable, and its height is a function of the total size of the economy. The bigger the economy the more those at the top end can accumulate, whilst the average keeps shifting. This gives the illusion that the rich get richer whilst the poor get poorer, when in fact the shape of the curve doesn’t really change but people move up and down the curve.

      These facts make for an easy sell to a gullible public who can never catch up to the wealthiest. The fact the wealthiest come and go is quietly ignored.

      A final point is that only through authoritarian means, controlling what is produced which is in effect eliminating competition or controlling what people buy can vast inequality be tamed. “Progressive” taxation as we see around the world does not inhibit Pareto distributions but slows them down. An obvious conclusion is that the left is inherently authoritarian, and we see this in every case around the world where inequality has been targeted.

      The clear conclusion is that freedom of choice and material equality are mutually exclusive. Material inequality is the result of vast number of individual choices amplified in a network of buyers and sellers and only by eliminating freedom of trade and freedom to innovate can the left achieve its aims. Socialists thrive on the politics of envy.

      The implication is that the left in a democracy suffer from a collective cognitive dissonance chasing two diametrically opposed aims of material equality and freedom of trade. One can’t have both.

      Reply

    • John says:

      08:30am | 19/05/11

      The time of Nationalist is upon Europe! Not voting Nationalist in europe is like putting a gun to your own head and pulling the trigger. All other parties represent a form of marxism(satanic death cult), which is all a form of self destruction. Europeans, need to wipe out any trace of Marxism from Europe. It’s an evil satanic ideology that wish’s to destroy their European Aryan tribe.  The demise of the radical Marxist Dominique Strauss-Kahn also this Marxist Banker, is like hitting two birds with one stone. Its in the best interest of the Aryan people of europe. How can the french have another radical marxist take over their country. Lets hop the Marxist EU and Marxist Euro collapse’s! It’s in the interest of the Aryan European people. Marxist US collapse and Marxist UK collapse, will finally bring a death blow to the Marxists.

      Reply

    • marley says:

      08:41am | 19/05/11

      I love it.  “Marxist Banker.”  Now there’s an oxymoron for you.

    • TheRealDave says:

      10:38am | 19/05/11

      I thought all bankers were Zionists? Is there a new conspiracy theorists memo I missed??

    • James1 says:

      12:27pm | 19/05/11

      To people such as this, the words “Marxist”, “Zionist”, “banker” and “Jew” are all interchangeable.

    • St. Michael says:

      01:35pm | 19/05/11

      @ marley: “love it.  “Marxist Banker.”  Now there’s an oxymoron for you.”

      John just missed the right consonant.  Should’ve been a ‘w’ rather than a ‘b’.

    • John says:

      08:46am | 19/05/11

      The way i see Europe is like this, it’s politics are based on Marxist ideology. 90% of parties are controlled by an Marxist upper party. The upper marxist party is a hidden party that resides in the controlled media, European banks and project groups as the Marxist EU, and Marxist Euro currency. The lower marxist parties give you the illusion of a free society with their theater plays. The Nationalists which are not controlled by the upper party are attacked heavily by the upper party usually by their Marxist media(called extreme, crazy, out of touch with the marxist party), in order to try and keep them in check. I also think there are some controlled Nationalist parties, fake parties such as UKIP and far-right National party of Holland led by Wilders. These parties are most likely funded by the upper party to keep the Nationalists suppressed. So basically the EU is like the Soviet Union, It’s a Marxist empire, giving you the illusion of a free society which is not the case. This is why Nationalists must take power, and then uproot the Marxist disease from europe. Marxism is disease, a virus, Nationalism is the cure.

      Reply

    • John says:

      09:08am | 19/05/11

      There is no Nationalist political expression in europe, You have the majority of the europe not even represented in the tyrannical marxist politics. It was designed that way, they are even taught in school and that nationalism is form of immorality. They can only discuss and consume what they given by the marxist chef’s. Just look at background of EU chief! (Manuel Barroso) When he was young he was a Radical Marxist, i believe he worshiped mas murders such as lein, Stalin and Mao. Look at Marxist EU flag, see all those Marxist stars! They pained it blue instead of red, to trick you.

    • James1 says:

      12:32pm | 19/05/11

      My god it all makes sense!  The flag has clinched it for me.  Maybe we should start making the “Marxists” (wink wink) wear some identifying mark.  Maybe a blue star of some sort…

    • john says:

      08:57am | 19/05/11

      Marley, Capitalist bankers bank rolled Bolshevism Communism in Russia which resulted in the mass slaughter of 40 000 000 white Russian Christians for believing in Jesus, the Russians were treated as cattle and animals and slaughtered like animals. It’s no surprise, the IMF is parasitical organization, that lends money to third world countrys with the catch of taking control of the water, electricity and other supplies. It’s all driven by self interests. Im sure the IMF want to bring about International Communism through out entire world.

      Reply

    • Adam says:

      10:04am | 19/05/11

      John you forgat to mention the Knights Templar or the Lizard people. Keep quiet about the hole to the centre of the earth at the north pole and readjust your tin foil hat mate.

    • John says:

      10:25am | 19/05/11

      “the far right National Front who are simultaneous written off as uneducated nutters and conniving fascists (while their popularity continues to climb above Sarkozy’s” If the National Front are uneducated nutters, why is that nobody dares to debate them? Name calling is the weakest form of defense. Check this new poll!

      23% uneducated nutters shall make Front National the NEW government of France. Front National is predicted for the WIN in france!! Freedom from the Marxists!!!! is near I hope this cause’s a chain reaction, making a Nationalist revolution in Europe, then American’s also rise up against Marxist Obama the Marxist Republican and Demoncrat parties. Pull all out troops out of the middleast!!!! FREEDOM FOR THE WESTERN PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      GODs of the heavens will be pleased, that we have finally defeated evil.

      http://cofcc.org/2011/03/french-poll-front-national-at-23/

      Reply

    • TheRealDave says:

      10:39am | 19/05/11

      Do you need to get your own Brown Shirt or do you get issued one when you join?

    • John says:

      10:59am | 19/05/11

      TheRealDave

      I think Stalin wants his dinner, get back in the kitchen.

      France a society were Communism was born, is now turning back to the old politics of their ancestors Nationalism. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efyf869OwaI&feature=player_embedded

      Lovely!!

      I’m not even french! but god bless France! You will be our Savior!

    • Adam says:

      11:15am | 19/05/11

      @RealDave

      Bring your own mate the Nationalist issued ones chafe something horrid whilst goose stepping

    • James1 says:

      12:29pm | 19/05/11

      Adam,

      The important question is this: Do these brown shirts have pockets big enough to fit both Mein Kampf and The Protocols of the Elders of Zion?  Or will I still have to carry a small bag?

    • Tezza says:

      10:45am | 19/05/11

      “Very normal they seem to be: apparently they like fast cars, wild parties, flying first class, staying in $3000 suites in the Sofitel in New York” . . . .
      Peter, I can see where you’re coming from.
      Also, who wouldn’t want to drink champagne and own football clubs.
      On the other hand, I suspect that the poor dumbos who vote for DSK have about as much chance of ever being invited to join him sipping champagne up the pointy end of the plane, as your average inhabitant of “The Block” has of scoring an invite to have a beer with Russell and Peter in the Owners’ Box at Redfern Oval.

      Reply

    • Valerie Woodruffe says:

      11:28am | 19/05/11

      Ive been in a sex scandal myself it never did me any long term harm, in fact at the time I had to fight the men off LOL. So at the end of the day this latest sex scandal will be forgotten in a few months time

      Reply

    • St. Michael says:

      01:37pm | 19/05/11

      I’ve had scandalous sex, but I’ve never been in a sex scandal.

    • Rover of North Cooma says:

      11:30am | 19/05/11

      Wow, eight out of 23 comments are from John! My favourite is the one where he’s the only person replying to himself.
      Can’t wait for him to start talking about the termites again.

      Reply

    • Kevin says:

      12:23pm | 19/05/11

      We’re getting “Mien Kampf” in instalments.

    • John says:

      12:49pm | 19/05/11

      ha ha, Thermite.

      I speak from my heart, i am a christian, i admire jesus and i want to seek and speak the truth.

    • Rover of North Cooma says:

      01:04pm | 19/05/11

      Glad you’ve learnt to spell thermite now John - cos you were blathering on and on about termite explosives in the days after Osama’s death, even when it was pointed out to you that you meant thermite.

    • John says:

      01:14pm | 19/05/11

      Yes, WTC 1,2 and 7 Brought down via explosives. Thermite was most likely used in the inner of core of the towers. Evidence are liquid pools of metal, lava type under the towers. I’m still waiting for the guilty parties to be tried for the murderer of the 3000 American people on Sept11. It was not Osama Bin Laden.

      Proof

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uNbKJofv3c

    • St. Michael says:

      01:33pm | 19/05/11

      “I speak from my heart, i am a christian, i admire jesus and i want to seek and speak the truth.”

      Jesus also embraced all people of all races, including the Samaritans, John.  He was also a Jew.  Your periodic rants about the superiority of the Aryan race, given the political leader in recent history who also held that view and murdered six million of Jesus’ fellow believers, not to mention your testimony that Jesus will be back as an Aryan, tend to be a little contradictory in that context.

      I’d call you a troll, but you haven’t sufficient wit for that role.

    • John says:

      02:01pm | 19/05/11

      Well the Aryan Race is simply the White Race, and there is no denying that European is being colonized by Radical Marxism. Massive immigration and Islamization, all these are Marxist ideas which are not in the interest of White Europeans and should be expressed to the political bodies of Europe. These Marxist Policy’s clearly relate to a form of Genocide and ethic cleansing and one must ask if there is Hatred of White Europeans and their religion behind this policy. Lets look at the meaning of Genocide.

      .any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:


      Just read c, and see if doesn’t closely relate to the Marxist policy for Native white Europeans.

        (a) Killing members of the group; (
        (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
        (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
        (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
        (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

      – Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article II

    • St. Michael says:

      03:18pm | 19/05/11

      No.  It does not.

      Idiot.

    • hot tub political machine says:

      11:37am | 19/05/11

      This thread of comments sections will be remembered for a long time on here methinks…....it may be the most unhinged on the Punch yet.

      I reckon reds under the beds was what, 30-40 years ago?

      I’m bringing bizzaro paranoia back (yeah) all the Marxists traitor commie teachers don’t know how to act…..

      Reply

    • St. Michael says:

      11:41am | 19/05/11

      Money, and the making of it, is incentivised.  Get used to it.  No other system we’ve tried on the planet works.  See: Russia, Cuba, South America, the EU.

      The simple fact is, government in our time has no incentive attached to it other than the getting and holding of power.  It attracts those who find that concept attractive - across the board.

      George Orwell was a socialist himself, and he accurately portrayed communism and socialism (inadvertently) in Animal Farm, but also bureaucracy.  Lord Acton, though, who was a member of the British upper class himself, managed to sum it up in six words: “Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely.”

      Reply

    • Kevin says:

      12:25pm | 19/05/11

      China?

    • St. Michael says:

      01:30pm | 19/05/11

      @ Kevin: I’d like them to be an open democracy, stop crushing protesters with their own tanks, and provide some data about their inflation rates before you can call them a success of communism.

      Although what we do know of China is that if anything they’re the reverse of socialism/communism.  They’re communists who’ve opened themselves to wide-scale capitalism - or a quasi-totalitarian regime that calls itself communist in honour of Chairman Mao, but in reality is just an oligarchy with the Party as the said oligarchs.  Mao, Lenin, and Stalin’s corpses are likely (if God is good) doing 300 rpm right now.

    • Number Ten Ox says:

      01:35pm | 19/05/11

      If anything, China is an example of a successful Fascist state.

    • hot tub political machine says:

      11:49am | 19/05/11

      If nothing else, this thread should encourage us that the Punch is pretty pro-free-speech in what it lets through. I haven’t had reading material like this since before spam filters on email

      Reply

    • Sony B Goode says:

      11:59am | 19/05/11

      People should stop confusing national socialists, ie Nazis for a far right ideology.
      These are all anti-capitalist socialists.  Nazis being nationalist and Russians being internationalists.

      Hitler:  “We are socialists, we are enemies of today’s capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.”

      Personally, if we have an axis of freedom with socialism on the opposite side of liberty, as necessitated by the use of authoritarianism to control material equality then there really is nothing on the far right opposite end of the spectrum except maybe anarchy.

      Modern Nationalist parties can be either left or right, the only obvious factor in Europe is their opposition to the Islamic Trojan horse.

      More important than democracry, ie mob rule is the idea of Republic, a constitutionally limited democracy. Something which socialists are, maybe not even consciously aware but constantly trying to undermine in order to redressed the perceived but inevitable imbalance of wealth distribution created by freedom of trade.

      As we can from DSK everybody wants the good life, but many don’t want to either earn it, or risk capital to develop it, which is the lefts target market. That is one of the key dividing factors between modern left and right.

      Reply

    • John says:

      12:42pm | 19/05/11

      “Islamic Trojan horse”

      I think they more concerned about the power that has allowed the Trojan horse in. Think about it. If they let in this Trojan horse, what other horses are they going to let in. (I’m sure they have allowed a lot of Trojan horses) This pretty much states there are traitors with in the EUROPEAN GOVERNMENT, who are allowing other in, because they despise the European People and their Society. I’m good smacked the other political parties can’t see this, they either dumb, naive, believing in some type of utopia at the end of political ideology is crumbling in front of their eyes, and they still support it. I don’t understand how can people look else where! Nationalism is the only political ideology that is sane, the other parties are just self-destruction.

    • hot tub political machine says:

      12:56pm | 19/05/11

      Is Achillees inside the Isalmic Trojan horse or is he still being Greek?

    • Colmac says:

      12:04pm | 19/05/11

      Orwell sums it up nicely

      “four legs good, two legs better”.
      & “All animals are equal
      but some animals are more equal than others”

      Reply

    • Sony B Goode says:

      12:56pm | 19/05/11

      reds under the beds, socialist. Communist, American democrat, labor party, leftist, greeny,  when you look at the meme involved it’s all variation on the same theme. Needy vs greedy. Poor vs rich. Control vs Freedom.

      This meme keeps morphing over time but it is running out of hosts, being sterilised by the light of facts and clarity of understanding.

      Personally I am so over left/right, a new scientific based paradigm is developing that explains the reality of the relationship between freedom /inequality and authoritarianism /egalitarianism.

      However both left and right become virtually indistinguishable in power. Howard handed out more middle class welfare then can boggle the mind and labor panders to vested interests as bad as the liberals, both squander taxpayer money like drunken sailors buy whores.

      We have to accept inequality as a necessary outcome of freedom to trade and reject authoritarianism which stifles progress innovation and prosperity.

      Imo a modern political party should reject the socialist compulsory redistributionist meme and reward voluntary care of the needy not through centrally managed projects that burn billions without any real results, but through individual incentive schemes.

      Aggressive taxation invites aggressive lobbying and avoidance and should also be rejected as it attracts the power hungry politician to manage large unnecessary budgets.

      The role of banking and central banks in particular needs to be carefully re-evaluated given money is created by bank credit and historically underwritten and regularly bailed out by government at taxpayer expense.

      Reply

    • St. Michael says:

      01:37pm | 19/05/11

      I think Atlas just shrugged.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      06:35pm | 19/05/11

      meh. If simply eliminating government was a good idea, then all our problems would be solved.  Clearly there are people in markets that will not do the best for customers, the libertarian thinking that markets are perfect is as ideological as left and right.

      However the constant two faced lies by both side of the left/right political spectrum is tiresome. Politicians chasing power that comes with budgets, the size wealthy industrialists can only dream of, now that is a disaster.

      It’s time for some new ideas. That can only come by looking closely at what works and what doesn’t, not parroting endless reality divorced ideology from left and right.  I am just throwing things out there maybe something might spark some discussion or ideas, maybe not.

    • St. Michael says:

      10:40pm | 19/05/11

      I’m personally in favour of Goldilocks regulation—not too little, not too much, but just right.

      At the moment we have too much.

    • Sony B Goode says:

      12:39am | 20/05/11

      how do you know when regulation is just right?

      I am thinking there should be an objective set of principles to guide this.

      Too many times I have seen industry being asked to write its own regulation, which usually means a subset of players stacking rules in their favour. Or the other extreme non industry “stakeholders” given virtually carte blanch to impose some idelological driven rubish that ultimately hurts customers and the industry.

    • John says:

      01:37pm | 19/05/11

      Central banks need to be torn down. IMF, EU Central Bank Fed and World Bank. They need to be replaced with Bank of America, Bank of Germany, Bank Australia, but they are also not allowed to be foreign owned. The Government should administrate the Bank. Same thing with Water, Electricity, and the Media government owned, all owned by TAX payers, people of the nation. If you allow the system we have now, you allow International Bankers to steal, buy out entire countrys including the media, where only their self interests are pushed. We become slaves to them and at their mercy. This is why Internationalism, is dangerous! Nationalism is the only way for freedom, liberation from oppressive internationalists. Think about all you guys paying your mortgage, i wonder how much you owe to international bankers. I bet you have to work an extra 10 years because of their system of money for your house.

      Reply

    • St. Michael says:

      01:51pm | 19/05/11

      When you’ve actually got a job upon which you can support a mortgage, John, I’ll discuss finance with you.  Until then, enjoy renting on Centrelink’s buck or public housing.

      As to the idea that nationalism = good, internationalism = bad, the Internet and the past hundred years of history disagree with you.  Read up on the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act, which Hoover passed and FDR continued.  Basically it set off and perpetuated the Great Depression because it stopped international trade.

    • John says:

      02:05pm | 19/05/11

      What makes you think i don’t have a job?

      Reply

    • james says:

      03:14pm | 19/05/11

      bahahahaha, because someone with a job would clearly not have time to write a short thesis of insane conspiracy theories on a blog site all day. Seriously dude, you need to start drinking de-cafe and getting more iodine in your diet, something up there just aint working right.

    • John says:

      03:28pm | 19/05/11

      I wonder if Marine Len Pen is the Reincarnation of Joan of Arc.
      Joan of Arc was an Ultra Nationalist!!  This must be blessed by GOD!

      Reply

    • James1 says:

      03:44pm | 19/05/11

      Its probably the only reasonable explanation.

    • loulou says:

      05:47pm | 19/05/11

      This Frog was probably good-looking once.  Like a lot of old men, especially Frogs (and Bob Hawke), Dominique still believes in his irresistible charms.  Foolish, n’est pas?

      Reply

    • wolfie says:

      10:59pm | 19/05/11

      John, there is no point in trying to discuss with people who are the product of some of the most successful brainwashing campaign the world has ever seen.
      These are people who acquire all their knowledge from Hollywood Films and a centrally controlled Mass Media together with an education system where a teacher or professor can be jailed for being able to prove that the status quo or a particular version of history is a lie and fraudulent. They wouldn’t recognize the truth if it was dangled in front of them and they totally fail to understand the mechanism at work.
      The key is in understanding lies in understanding the role and the aims of the World Bank and the people who are in control of it.  It is also important to begin researching and keeping an open mind regarding the last two world wars and the Bolshevik and Chinese Revolutions. It just happens that the Bolshevik seems to have been a Zionist takeover of Russia in which the New York based banker by the name of Jacob Schiff was instrumental- About 75% of the leadership just happened to be of Jewish descent and they had an active program of exterminating around 40 million Christians and starving several million Ukranians by denying them the food that they produced.
      Ultimately the first and the second world wars were financed and directed by Zionist interests for more and more control of European money and power. For those scoffing away, I suggest you begin researching these things independently and then come to an honest and intelligent conclusion. Those of you who have the understanding and ability to look at this subject honestly will be quite astounded.
      I used to believe everything I was told about our modern history until I began noticing that people who challenged the official version of the First and Second World war , for example, were systematically professionally destroyed and in some cases jailed in the name of several Zionist groups who control everything from the mass media to the judiciary and Hollywood that produces almost on a monthly basis hate films in order to discredit anyone who dares to challenge the Hollywood Version of the bad Germans and the poor suffering Jews. This black and white version of history is not only incredibly simplistic but it is horribly dishonest.
      Ignorance is a terrible affliction for which there is , fortunately a cure. The information is at your fingertips, but you have to do the work yourself. BUt it has never been easier than today with the internet- certainly there is a lot of nonsense around but with enough research the researcher will begin noticing a storyline.
      . The only thing is that in order to do this type of research you need time and an open mind.
      It is very comfortable to simply believe everything that is told and those who are happy with this fairy tale will always be subject to being manipulated. But then again the band wagon is the best place for a herd animal.

      Reply

    • St. Michael says:

      12:03am | 20/05/11

      “John, there is no point in trying to discuss with people who are the product of some of the most successful brainwashing campaign the world has ever seen.”

      Yeah, it’s called basic mathematics.

    • james says:

      09:56am | 20/05/11

      Well, here I was thinking that John was the craziest person on the punch but I think we have a new winner, well done Wolfie! Your parents must be so proud.

    • John says:

      03:07am | 20/05/11

      I wonder what will happen if a financial collapse occurs.

      1. Bankers will blamed! The idea of International Bankers and Free trade destroyed over night. Bernanke, Greenspan flee the US in jets.
      2. Marshall Law Military on the streets?
      3. Communists using anti-capitalist propaganda to try to take power?
      4. Civil War
      5. Division with in society, (all groups divide)
      6. The end of the free market
      7. Hunger,
      8. World War III

      It’s amazing what type of damage the international Bankers can do to a country. Also interesting how money is the glue that keeps politics, law and orders in check and enslaves nations to international marxist cause. If this falls, politics change radically. We also must understand that corruption is usually fueled by money, once it drys out, corruption goes along with it. 

      GOD help the US, Europe when this occurs.

      Reply

    • Tata says:

      11:39am | 07/02/12

      Delighted to see that John is so hale and htreay. He produced my first Saturday Night Theatre for Radio 4 back in ’79, and set the bar of professionalism so high that I’ve never forgotten the experience nor the lessons I drew from it. It’s only looking back that I realise how fortuitous my career timing was. With just one spec script it was like I stepped into radio’s National Theatre; today I’d probably be redirected to Holby.

      Reply
 
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